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Islam and Israel

Wandile
Posts: 97
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12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...

In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.
"Possibly deluded.... no way to confirm the veracity. That is an extraordinary claim to suggest billions the world over and throughout history are deluded. Proof?
Also if you actually believe these Billions of historical Christians are deluded, what gives you a warrant to special plead you are not equally self deluded within your own views? Sounds like self contradictory belief system you are under." - Gileandos

The way of a fool seems right to him, but a wise man listens to advice - Proverb
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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12/24/2011 8:58:12 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
@RoyalPaladin,
You are a fabulist, a prevaricator. At most I would place several people on this site as feckless with the truth. You are an outright attutidinizer.

I told you finagle the numbers anyway you want. Butcher them for all I care. You simply cannot butcher them to less than 1/3 of the mulsim's polled.

The question was quite clear. The poll's sample size was incredibly large for the depth of the poll. The Poll was just 2 years ago.

It asked simply do the polled muslims, muslims only were asked, if they believed killing innocents to defend islam was justifiable.

In most of the Muslim countries the numbers were well above 50%. The moderated muslims in Eurpoean countries were around 10-20%. That is still 1-2 muslims on the street have no problem killing my family to defend islam.

Everything you spew is obviously vitriol. You only have a capacity to be a casuist.

You are the type of person who deserves to be treated as you have treated. I pray to the God Almighty that you will learn a valuable lesson about the violence inherent to islamic practice.
DetectableNinja
Posts: 6,043
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12/24/2011 8:59:46 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 8:59:14 AM, Gileandos wrote:
I have no idea why this posted here....... I was on the Islam peace forum....sorry.

Okay. lol. I was gonna say "Did I miss something?"
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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12/24/2011 9:03:53 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

The land belongs to the Caananites, who the ancestors of the Palestinians. Ergo, it belongs to the Palestinians.
-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.
royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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12/24/2011 9:06:11 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 8:58:12 AM, Gileandos wrote:
@RoyalPaladin,
You are a fabulist, a prevaricator. At most I would place several people on this site as feckless with the truth. You are an outright attutidinizer.

I told you finagle the numbers anyway you want. Butcher them for all I care. You simply cannot butcher them to less than 1/3 of the mulsim's polled.

The question was quite clear. The poll's sample size was incredibly large for the depth of the poll. The Poll was just 2 years ago.

It asked simply do the polled muslims, muslims only were asked, if they believed killing innocents to defend islam was justifiable.

In most of the Muslim countries the numbers were well above 50%. The moderated muslims in Eurpoean countries were around 10-20%. That is still 1-2 muslims on the street have no problem killing my family to defend islam.

Everything you spew is obviously vitriol. You only have a capacity to be a casuist.

You are the type of person who deserves to be treated as you have treated. I pray to the God Almighty that you will learn a valuable lesson about the violence inherent to islamic practice.

WOW, really? I finagled with the numbers? YOU REMOVED NUMBERS TO SUIT YOUR OWN AGENDA; EVERYONE CAN SEE THAT YOU ELIMINATED STATISTICS IN ORDER TO BOLSTER YOUR CLAIM. THAT MEANS THAT YOU ARE THE ONE WHO IS TWISTING STATISTICS TO SUIT YOUR OWN POLITICAL NEEDS. HOW DARE YOU ACCUSE ME OF LYING? WHAT HAVE I DONE WRONG, JUST PROVE THAT YOU WERE CHEATING WITH THE STATISTICS?
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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12/24/2011 9:13:20 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 9:06:11 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 8:58:12 AM, Gileandos wrote:
@RoyalPaladin,
You are a fabulist, a prevaricator. At most I would place several people on this site as feckless with the truth. You are an outright attutidinizer.

I told you finagle the numbers anyway you want. Butcher them for all I care. You simply cannot butcher them to less than 1/3 of the mulsim's polled.

The question was quite clear. The poll's sample size was incredibly large for the depth of the poll. The Poll was just 2 years ago.

It asked simply do the polled muslims, muslims only were asked, if they believed killing innocents to defend islam was justifiable.

In most of the Muslim countries the numbers were well above 50%. The moderated muslims in Eurpoean countries were around 10-20%. That is still 1-2 muslims on the street have no problem killing my family to defend islam.

Everything you spew is obviously vitriol. You only have a capacity to be a casuist.

You are the type of person who deserves to be treated as you have treated. I pray to the God Almighty that you will learn a valuable lesson about the violence inherent to islamic practice.

WOW, really? I finagled with the numbers? YOU REMOVED NUMBERS TO SUIT YOUR OWN AGENDA; EVERYONE CAN SEE THAT YOU ELIMINATED STATISTICS IN ORDER TO BOLSTER YOUR CLAIM. THAT MEANS THAT YOU ARE THE ONE WHO IS TWISTING STATISTICS TO SUIT YOUR OWN POLITICAL NEEDS. HOW DARE YOU ACCUSE ME OF LYING? WHAT HAVE I DONE WRONG, JUST PROVE THAT YOU WERE CHEATING WITH THE STATISTICS?

I resposted on the proper forum.
I already stated that I left off moderate countries, to counter balance the unpolled zealot controlled countries.
I claimed 33.3% adhered to terrorism. The numbers I posted from the poll showed a non weighted average over 50%.

I was very clear. You vehemence and vitriol show what kind of person you are. Anyone can read the poll, see the numbers and read my post showing I was undershooting the polling data to 1/3 believed in terrorism.

You are outright dissimulating the content of the posts.
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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12/24/2011 9:20:44 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

The modernistic claim of the Temple mount being the third most holy site in Islam is very interesting.

It does appear that they were concerned to "give way" to the Jews in the public arena as they have lost so many battles against the Jews.

I find that part of your above post to be the most striking.
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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12/24/2011 9:25:32 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 9:03:53 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

The land belongs to the Caananites, who the ancestors of the Palestinians. Ergo, it belongs to the Palestinians.

Actually, the land belonged to the King of Salem, Malchizedek, or Shem. So the Abraham as a descendent of Shem has first claim. It was even after the Caananits stole it from Shem, that Abraham bought it back.

He descendents came back to reclaim their land and they were attacked. They won.

As I see it they own it. And I am not a Jew or Israelite.

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.
wierdman
Posts: 721
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12/24/2011 9:27:42 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

As a cousin of the Jews, I have to take there side because the land did belong to them (based on what the bible preaches), but I have heard that the land also serves as a holy ground for Islam as well. To me, taking the land from either side is wrong, it should be a land owned by no one (we all know this would never work, but a boy can dream) I think Islam and Judaism are two religions closer than they think.
royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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12/24/2011 9:59:07 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 9:25:32 AM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:03:53 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

The land belongs to the Caananites, who the ancestors of the Palestinians. Ergo, it belongs to the Palestinians.

Actually, the land belonged to the King of Salem, Malchizedek, or Shem. So the Abraham as a descendent of Shem has first claim. It was even after the Caananits stole it from Shem, that Abraham bought it back.

He descendents came back to reclaim their land and they were attacked. They won.

As I see it they own it. And I am not a Jew or Israelite.

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

Shem's descendants stole the land from the Caananites. Read the Book of Genesis; God explicitly tells Abraham to go to the LAND OF THE CAANANITES. So it actually belonged to the Caananites FIRST.

Shem's brother, the original owner of the land according to the Book of Gensis, was the progenitor of the Caananites. Noah had multiple sons; Shem was not his only child.
royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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12/24/2011 9:59:46 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 9:27:42 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

As a cousin of the Jews, I have to take there side because the land did belong to them (based on what the bible preaches), but I have heard that the land also serves as a holy ground for Islam as well. To me, taking the land from either side is wrong, it should be a land owned by no one (we all know this would never work, but a boy can dream) I think Islam and Judaism are two religions closer than they think.

I can also write a book saying that I am a member of the chosen master race and that the world belongs to me.
wierdman
Posts: 721
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12/24/2011 10:04:41 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 9:59:46 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:27:42 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

As a cousin of the Jews, I have to take there side because the land did belong to them (based on what the bible preaches), but I have heard that the land also serves as a holy ground for Islam as well. To me, taking the land from either side is wrong, it should be a land owned by no one (we all know this would never work, but a boy can dream) I think Islam and Judaism are two religions closer than they think.

I can also write a book saying that I am a member of the chosen master race and that the world belongs to me
This is completely different from what I am saying. Going back to history, we all know that the land was originally given to the Canaanites who were ancestors of both the Palestine and the Jews.
logicrules
Posts: 1,721
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12/24/2011 10:12:11 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 10:04:41 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:59:46 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:27:42 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

As a cousin of the Jews, I have to take there side because the land did belong to them (based on what the bible preaches), but I have heard that the land also serves as a holy ground for Islam as well. To me, taking the land from either side is wrong, it should be a land owned by no one (we all know this would never work, but a boy can dream) I think Islam and Judaism are two religions closer than they think.

I can also write a book saying that I am a member of the chosen master race and that the world belongs to me
This is completely different from what I am saying. Going back to history, we all know that the land was originally given to the Canaanites who were ancestors of both the Palestine and the Jews.

Who gives Land?
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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12/24/2011 10:17:11 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 9:59:07 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:25:32 AM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:03:53 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

The land belongs to the Caananites, who the ancestors of the Palestinians. Ergo, it belongs to the Palestinians.

Actually, the land belonged to the King of Salem, Malchizedek, or Shem. So the Abraham as a descendent of Shem has first claim. It was even after the Caananits stole it from Shem, that Abraham bought it back.

He descendents came back to reclaim their land and they were attacked. They won.

As I see it they own it. And I am not a Jew or Israelite.

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

Shem's descendants stole the land from the Caananites. Read the Book of Genesis; God explicitly tells Abraham to go to the LAND OF THE CAANANITES. So it actually belonged to the Caananites FIRST.

Shem's brother, the original owner of the land according to the Book of Gensis, was the progenitor of the Caananites. Noah had multiple sons; Shem was not his only child.

Please read the book of Genesis.
God was assenting to the occupation of the Caananites of Abraham's land. God never said go "steal" the land from the Caananites.

Shem was King of Jerusalem and the entire land belonged to him. His descendents the Israelites have a rightful claim to the land.
Abraham even bought the land and left for a time due to famine. The Israelites were trapped by the Egyptians into slavery.
The Caananites knews this and stole the land in the Jews absence.
They could have easily turned it over upon the return of the Jews but instead choose to fight them.

Did you read the Bible?
Wandile
Posts: 97
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12/24/2011 10:24:50 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 10:17:11 AM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:59:07 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:25:32 AM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:03:53 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

The land belongs to the Caananites, who the ancestors of the Palestinians. Ergo, it belongs to the Palestinians.

Actually, the land belonged to the King of Salem, Malchizedek, or Shem. So the Abraham as a descendent of Shem has first claim. It was even after the Caananits stole it from Shem, that Abraham bought it back.

He descendents came back to reclaim their land and they were attacked. They won.

As I see it they own it. And I am not a Jew or Israelite.

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

Shem's descendants stole the land from the Caananites. Read the Book of Genesis; God explicitly tells Abraham to go to the LAND OF THE CAANANITES. So it actually belonged to the Caananites FIRST.

Shem's brother, the original owner of the land according to the Book of Gensis, was the progenitor of the Caananites. Noah had multiple sons; Shem was not his only child.

Please read the book of Genesis.
God was assenting to the occupation of the Caananites of Abraham's land. God never said go "steal" the land from the Caananites.

Shem was King of Jerusalem and the entire land belonged to him. His descendents the Israelites have a rightful claim to the land.
Abraham even bought the land and left for a time due to famine. The Israelites were trapped by the Egyptians into slavery.
The Caananites knews this and stole the land in the Jews absence.
They could have easily turned it over upon the return of the Jews but instead choose to fight them.

Did you read the Bible?

True story
"Possibly deluded.... no way to confirm the veracity. That is an extraordinary claim to suggest billions the world over and throughout history are deluded. Proof?
Also if you actually believe these Billions of historical Christians are deluded, what gives you a warrant to special plead you are not equally self deluded within your own views? Sounds like self contradictory belief system you are under." - Gileandos

The way of a fool seems right to him, but a wise man listens to advice - Proverb
royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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12/24/2011 11:10:25 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 10:04:41 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:59:46 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:27:42 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

As a cousin of the Jews, I have to take there side because the land did belong to them (based on what the bible preaches), but I have heard that the land also serves as a holy ground for Islam as well. To me, taking the land from either side is wrong, it should be a land owned by no one (we all know this would never work, but a boy can dream) I think Islam and Judaism are two religions closer than they think.

I can also write a book saying that I am a member of the chosen master race and that the world belongs to me
This is completely different from what I am saying. Going back to history, we all know that the land was originally given to the Canaanites who were ancestors of both the Palestine and the Jews.

No, the Caananites were distant cousins of the Jews but are not the ancestors of the Jews. "The sons of Noah who went forth from the ark were Shem, Ham, and Japeth. Ham was the father of Canaan. These three were the sons of Noah; and from these the whole earth was peopled" (Genesis 9:18). The Caananites were distinct people, and Shem WAS NOT the King of Jerusalem. He was a wholly separate individual who was granted different territory. I cannot believe that you would just fabricate a lie to justify your position.
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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12/24/2011 11:35:44 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 11:10:25 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 10:04:41 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:59:46 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:27:42 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

As a cousin of the Jews, I have to take there side because the land did belong to them (based on what the bible preaches), but I have heard that the land also serves as a holy ground for Islam as well. To me, taking the land from either side is wrong, it should be a land owned by no one (we all know this would never work, but a boy can dream) I think Islam and Judaism are two religions closer than they think.

I can also write a book saying that I am a member of the chosen master race and that the world belongs to me
This is completely different from what I am saying. Going back to history, we all know that the land was originally given to the Canaanites who were ancestors of both the Palestine and the Jews.

No, the Caananites were distant cousins of the Jews but are not the ancestors of the Jews. "The sons of Noah who went forth from the ark were Shem, Ham, and Japeth. Ham was the father of Canaan. These three were the sons of Noah; and from these the whole earth was peopled" (Genesis 9:18). The Caananites were distinct people, and Shem WAS NOT the King of Jerusalem. He was a wholly separate individual who was granted different territory. I cannot believe that you would just fabricate a lie to justify your position.

This is the Biblical and Historical Jewish position.

Them being 135th cousins by the Biblical account gives them the right to steal land from the enslaved Jews? I do not see that run of logic.

Shem was the King of Jerusalem cite evidence that shows otherwise. This is the traditional Jewish understanding handed down and God has confirmed it for me as Jesus came out of the line of Shem not Ham.

Do you know anything about these matters or do you just "rage like a rat trapped in a cage?"
royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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12/24/2011 11:40:56 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 11:35:44 AM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:10:25 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 10:04:41 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:59:46 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:27:42 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

As a cousin of the Jews, I have to take there side because the land did belong to them (based on what the bible preaches), but I have heard that the land also serves as a holy ground for Islam as well. To me, taking the land from either side is wrong, it should be a land owned by no one (we all know this would never work, but a boy can dream) I think Islam and Judaism are two religions closer than they think.

I can also write a book saying that I am a member of the chosen master race and that the world belongs to me
This is completely different from what I am saying. Going back to history, we all know that the land was originally given to the Canaanites who were ancestors of both the Palestine and the Jews.

No, the Caananites were distant cousins of the Jews but are not the ancestors of the Jews. "The sons of Noah who went forth from the ark were Shem, Ham, and Japeth. Ham was the father of Canaan. These three were the sons of Noah; and from these the whole earth was peopled" (Genesis 9:18). The Caananites were distinct people, and Shem WAS NOT the King of Jerusalem. He was a wholly separate individual who was granted different territory. I cannot believe that you would just fabricate a lie to justify your position.

This is the Biblical and Historical Jewish position.

Them being 135th cousins by the Biblical account gives them the right to steal land from the enslaved Jews? I do not see that run of logic.

Shem was the King of Jerusalem cite evidence that shows otherwise. This is the traditional Jewish understanding handed down and God has confirmed it for me as Jesus came out of the line of Shem not Ham.

Do you know anything about these matters or do you just "rage like a rat trapped in a cage?"

I agree that Shem was the ancestor of the Jews, but Caanan was not Shem's son. In the Book of Genesis, Caanan, the descendant of Ham, is given control of the land that is now Israel. You are deliberately misinterpreting my position.
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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12/24/2011 11:46:31 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 11:40:56 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:35:44 AM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:10:25 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 10:04:41 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:59:46 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:27:42 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

As a cousin of the Jews, I have to take there side because the land did belong to them (based on what the bible preaches), but I have heard that the land also serves as a holy ground for Islam as well. To me, taking the land from either side is wrong, it should be a land owned by no one (we all know this would never work, but a boy can dream) I think Islam and Judaism are two religions closer than they think.

I can also write a book saying that I am a member of the chosen master race and that the world belongs to me
This is completely different from what I am saying. Going back to history, we all know that the land was originally given to the Canaanites who were ancestors of both the Palestine and the Jews.

No, the Caananites were distant cousins of the Jews but are not the ancestors of the Jews. "The sons of Noah who went forth from the ark were Shem, Ham, and Japeth. Ham was the father of Canaan. These three were the sons of Noah; and from these the whole earth was peopled" (Genesis 9:18). The Caananites were distinct people, and Shem WAS NOT the King of Jerusalem. He was a wholly separate individual who was granted different territory. I cannot believe that you would just fabricate a lie to justify your position.

This is the Biblical and Historical Jewish position.

Them being 135th cousins by the Biblical account gives them the right to steal land from the enslaved Jews? I do not see that run of logic.

Shem was the King of Jerusalem cite evidence that shows otherwise. This is the traditional Jewish understanding handed down and God has confirmed it for me as Jesus came out of the line of Shem not Ham.

Do you know anything about these matters or do you just "rage like a rat trapped in a cage?"

I agree that Shem was the ancestor of the Jews, but Caanan was not Shem's son. In the Book of Genesis, Caanan, the descendant of Ham, is given control of the land that is now Israel. You are deliberately misinterpreting my position.

Again so you are aware.
Noah's father took away all of Canaan's inheritence due to Canaan raping Noah while in his drunken sleep.
The land was divided between Shem and Japheth.
Canaan was to be the servants and not the land owners.

Genesis 9:
24 When Noah awoke from his wine and found out what his youngest son had done to him, 25 he said,

"Cursed be Canaan!
The lowest of slaves
will he be to his brothers."

26 He also said,

"Praise be to the LORD, the God of Shem!
May Canaan be the slave of Shem.
27 May God extend Japheth's[b] territory;
may Japheth live in the tents of Shem,
and may Canaan be the slave of Japheth."

Please stop asserting knowledge where you do not posess any. You are making the Muslims look bad.
royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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12/24/2011 11:54:47 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 11:46:31 AM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:40:56 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:35:44 AM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:10:25 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 10:04:41 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:59:46 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:27:42 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

As a cousin of the Jews, I have to take there side because the land did belong to them (based on what the bible preaches), but I have heard that the land also serves as a holy ground for Islam as well. To me, taking the land from either side is wrong, it should be a land owned by no one (we all know this would never work, but a boy can dream) I think Islam and Judaism are two religions closer than they think.

I can also write a book saying that I am a member of the chosen master race and that the world belongs to me
This is completely different from what I am saying. Going back to history, we all know that the land was originally given to the Canaanites who were ancestors of both the Palestine and the Jews.

No, the Caananites were distant cousins of the Jews but are not the ancestors of the Jews. "The sons of Noah who went forth from the ark were Shem, Ham, and Japeth. Ham was the father of Canaan. These three were the sons of Noah; and from these the whole earth was peopled" (Genesis 9:18). The Caananites were distinct people, and Shem WAS NOT the King of Jerusalem. He was a wholly separate individual who was granted different territory. I cannot believe that you would just fabricate a lie to justify your position.

This is the Biblical and Historical Jewish position.

Them being 135th cousins by the Biblical account gives them the right to steal land from the enslaved Jews? I do not see that run of logic.

Shem was the King of Jerusalem cite evidence that shows otherwise. This is the traditional Jewish understanding handed down and God has confirmed it for me as Jesus came out of the line of Shem not Ham.

Do you know anything about these matters or do you just "rage like a rat trapped in a cage?"

I agree that Shem was the ancestor of the Jews, but Caanan was not Shem's son. In the Book of Genesis, Caanan, the descendant of Ham, is given control of the land that is now Israel. You are deliberately misinterpreting my position.

Again so you are aware.
Noah's father took away all of Canaan's inheritence due to Canaan raping Noah while in his drunken sleep.
The land was divided between Shem and Japheth.
Canaan was to be the servants and not the land owners.


Genesis 9:
24 When Noah awoke from his wine and found out what his youngest son had done to him, 25 he said,

"Cursed be Canaan!
The lowest of slaves
will he be to his brothers."

26 He also said,

"Praise be to the LORD, the God of Shem!
May Canaan be the slave of Shem.
27 May God extend Japheth's[b] territory;
may Japheth live in the tents of Shem,
and may Canaan be the slave of Japheth."


Please stop asserting knowledge where you do not posess any. You are making the Muslims look bad.

1. I am not a Muslim, so I could never make them look bad.

2. Yes, he says this, but here is what actually happened.

"Caanan become the father of Sidon . . . Afterward the families of the Caananites spread abroad. And the territory of the Caanaonites extended from Sidon, in the directon of Gerar, as far as Gaza, and in the direction of Sodom, GOmorrah, Admah, and Zeboiom, as far as Lasha. These are the sons of Ham, by their families, their languages, their lands, and their nations" (Genesis 10:15-20). Noah can say whatever he wants, but the Bible actually notes that the land was given to the Caananites first. The Book of Genesis even further notes that this was Caanan's territory by contending, "Now the Lord Said to Abram, 'Go from your contry and your kindred . . . to the land that I will show you.' So Abram went, as the Lord had told him . . . and they set forth to go to the land of Caanan. When they had ocme to the land of Caanan, Abram passed through the land to the place at Shechem, to the ok of Moreh. At that time the Caananites were in the land" (Genesis 12:1-12:6).

Shem was not the King of Jerusalem because the land belonged to Caanan's descendants while Shem had seized different territory. Jerusalem did not even exist during the time of Shem. Please post evidence that Shem was the King of Jerusalem.
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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12/24/2011 12:56:50 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 11:54:47 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:46:31 AM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:40:56 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:35:44 AM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:10:25 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 10:04:41 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:59:46 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:27:42 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

As a cousin of the Jews, I have to take there side because the land did belong to them (based on what the bible preaches), but I have heard that the land also serves as a holy ground for Islam as well. To me, taking the land from either side is wrong, it should be a land owned by no one (we all know this would never work, but a boy can dream) I think Islam and Judaism are two religions closer than they think.

I can also write a book saying that I am a member of the chosen master race and that the world belongs to me
This is completely different from what I am saying. Going back to history, we all know that the land was originally given to the Canaanites who were ancestors of both the Palestine and the Jews.

No, the Caananites were distant cousins of the Jews but are not the ancestors of the Jews. "The sons of Noah who went forth from the ark were Shem, Ham, and Japeth. Ham was the father of Canaan. These three were the sons of Noah; and from these the whole earth was peopled" (Genesis 9:18). The Caananites were distinct people, and Shem WAS NOT the King of Jerusalem. He was a wholly separate individual who was granted different territory. I cannot believe that you would just fabricate a lie to justify your position.

This is the Biblical and Historical Jewish position.

Them being 135th cousins by the Biblical account gives them the right to steal land from the enslaved Jews? I do not see that run of logic.

Shem was the King of Jerusalem cite evidence that shows otherwise. This is the traditional Jewish understanding handed down and God has confirmed it for me as Jesus came out of the line of Shem not Ham.

Do you know anything about these matters or do you just "rage like a rat trapped in a cage?"

I agree that Shem was the ancestor of the Jews, but Caanan was not Shem's son. In the Book of Genesis, Caanan, the descendant of Ham, is given control of the land that is now Israel. You are deliberately misinterpreting my position.

Again so you are aware.
Noah's father took away all of Canaan's inheritence due to Canaan raping Noah while in his drunken sleep.
The land was divided between Shem and Japheth.
Canaan was to be the servants and not the land owners.


Genesis 9:
24 When Noah awoke from his wine and found out what his youngest son had done to him, 25 he said,

"Cursed be Canaan!
The lowest of slaves
will he be to his brothers."

26 He also said,

"Praise be to the LORD, the God of Shem!
May Canaan be the slave of Shem.
27 May God extend Japheth's[b] territory;
may Japheth live in the tents of Shem,
and may Canaan be the slave of Japheth."


Please stop asserting knowledge where you do not posess any. You are making the Muslims look bad.

1. I am not a Muslim, so I could never make them look bad.

2. Yes, he says this, but here is what actually happened.

"Caanan become the father of Sidon . . . Afterward the families of the Caananites spread abroad. And the territory of the Caanaonites extended from Sidon, in the directon of Gerar, as far as Gaza, and in the direction of Sodom, GOmorrah, Admah, and Zeboiom, as far as Lasha. These are the sons of Ham, by their families, their languages, their lands, and their nations" (Genesis 10:15-20). Noah can say whatever he wants, but the Bible actually notes that the land was given to the Caananites first. The Book of Genesis even further notes that this was Caanan's territory by contending, "Now the Lord Said to Abram, 'Go from your contry and your kindred . . . to the land that I will show you.' So Abram went, as the Lord had told him . . . and they set forth to go to the land of Caanan. When they had ocme to the land of Caanan, Abram passed through the land to the place at Shechem, to the ok of Moreh. At that time the Caananites were in the land" (Genesis 12:1-12:6).

The Canaanites are recognized to have rebelled. Noah already laid down they had not inheritance in the land.
God did not "give" them the land.
They were supposed to serve Shem and Jephath's descendents.

Nothing in your post says God gave it to them.
Abraham even bought the land, that was a part of his inheritance later and expanded throughout Canaan as people attacked him. Saddam and Gomora bordered his territories and when God gave him a kingdom it expanded into the area that God leveled all the way north after the war with the northern Kingdom that attacked Lot and his family.

Abraham even tithed to Shem as priest of God and recognized Shem's ownership of the Land around Jerusalem.
That is when Shem blessed Abraham's progress and approved of him.


Shem was not the King of Jerusalem because the land belonged to Caanan's descendants while Shem had seized different territory. Jerusalem did not even exist during the time of Shem. Please post evidence that Shem was the King of Jerusalem.

All you have to do is google it. A thousand websites come up. You will have to trace geneologies and theological interpretation to understand it all. Good luck.

I should not have to cite 1st year theology to every loud mouth that comes along? Start studying why the Jews believe what they believe first then get on a debate website and espouse terristic viewpoints.
http://en.wikipedia.org...
wierdman
Posts: 721
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12/24/2011 1:17:11 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 12:56:50 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:54:47 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:46:31 AM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:40:56 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:35:44 AM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:10:25 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 10:04:41 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:59:46 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:27:42 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

As a cousin of the Jews, I have to take there side because the land did belong to them (based on what the bible preaches), but I have heard that the land also serves as a holy ground for Islam as well. To me, taking the land from either side is wrong, it should be a land owned by no one (we all know this would never work, but a boy can dream) I think Islam and Judaism are two religions closer than they think.

I can also write a book saying that I am a member of the chosen master race and that the world belongs to me
This is completely different from what I am saying. Going back to history, we all know that the land was originally given to the Canaanites who were ancestors of both the Palestine and the Jews.

No, the Caananites were distant cousins of the Jews but are not the ancestors of the Jews. "The sons of Noah who went forth from the ark were Shem, Ham, and Japeth. Ham was the father of Canaan. These three were the sons of Noah; and from these the whole earth was peopled" (Genesis 9:18). The Caananites were distinct people, and Shem WAS NOT the King of Jerusalem. He was a wholly separate individual who was granted different territory. I cannot believe that you would just fabricate a lie to justify your position.

No according to Ezekiel 16:3 the Canaanites were the ancestors of the Jews.
http://bible.cc...
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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12/26/2011 4:19:43 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/24/2011 1:17:11 PM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 12:56:50 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:54:47 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:46:31 AM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:40:56 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:35:44 AM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/24/2011 11:10:25 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 10:04:41 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:59:46 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 12/24/2011 9:27:42 AM, wierdman wrote:
At 12/24/2011 4:26:59 AM, Wandile wrote:
I have a problem with the claim to Israel that Islam makes. Islam forcefully took Israel and more specifically Jerusalem away from the Jews and now today when the Jews come back to their Holy land, THEY CAN'T EVEN PRAY on the temple mount even though the site was historically Jewish. There is even a conspiracy amongst some top officials and average muslim folk claiming that the temple mount has nothing and has never had anything to do with Judaism :

"The Zionist movement has invented that this was the site of Solomon's temple. But this is all a lie.
"

-Sheikh Raed Salah, leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel
.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



In fact I don't even know why muslims value Jerusalem so highly since historically Islam has had no ties to Israel. The claim to "the third most holy site'" in Islam is very recent! http://www.eretzyisroel.org...

History of Jerusalem : http://www.en.m.wikipedia.org...

The temple mount and Jerusalem should be rightfully handed back to the Jews.

As a cousin of the Jews, I have to take there side because the land did belong to them (based on what the bible preaches), but I have heard that the land also serves as a holy ground for Islam as well. To me, taking the land from either side is wrong, it should be a land owned by no one (we all know this would never work, but a boy can dream) I think Islam and Judaism are two religions closer than they think.

I can also write a book saying that I am a member of the chosen master race and that the world belongs to me
This is completely different from what I am saying. Going back to history, we all know that the land was originally given to the Canaanites who were ancestors of both the Palestine and the Jews.

No, the Caananites were distant cousins of the Jews but are not the ancestors of the Jews. "The sons of Noah who went forth from the ark were Shem, Ham, and Japeth. Ham was the father of Canaan. These three were the sons of Noah; and from these the whole earth was peopled" (Genesis 9:18). The Caananites were distinct people, and Shem WAS NOT the King of Jerusalem. He was a wholly separate individual who was granted different territory. I cannot believe that you would just fabricate a lie to justify your position.

No according to Ezekiel 16:3 the Canaanites were the ancestors of the Jews.
http://bible.cc...

You are incorrect to quote Ezekiel as a source of the Jewish people. Ezekiel is discussing a particular generations sins.

Abraham was from Ur of the chaldees, which is Babylon.
Genesis 11:31

The backdrop for Ezekiel is:
Judges chapter 3:
1 These are the nations the LORD left to test all those Israelites who had not experienced any of the wars in Canaan 2 (he did this only to teach warfare to the descendants of the Israelites who had not had previous battle experience): 3 the five rulers of the Philistines, all the Canaanites, the Sidonians, and the Hivites living in the Lebanon mountains from Mount Baal Hermon to Lebo Hamath. 4 They were left to test the Israelites to see whether they would obey the LORD 's commands, which he had given their forefathers through Moses.
5 The Israelites lived among the Canaanites, Hittites, Amorites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites. 6 They took their daughters in marriage and gave their own daughters to their sons, and served their gods.

In Ezekiel 16:3 God has stated he restored Israel and gave them David and made them a nation after he found them in their 'bloodied state'.

This next generation found themselves intermingled with the bloodline.

This was corrected in the book Nehemiah after Ezekiel.