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Reasons why you are/aren't an atheist?

Dan4reason
Posts: 1,168
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12/29/2011 2:47:16 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
This question is to all non-atheists and atheists alike. So what reasons do people have for finding atheism to be a position not worth believing? This can include arguments against atheism or arguments for some contradicting belief system.

Note: I want arguments. So saying "I am not an atheist because God exists," doesn't count. You need some sort of argument to say so.

The same goes for people who are atheists. Give arguments not just statements of belief supporting atheism.

You do not need to provide every argument for or against atheism there is in one post. You can provide one reason that makes atheism more or less likely to be true in your mind.
Physik
Posts: 686
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12/29/2011 2:51:01 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I value truth.

I don't need to be religious to have morals.

I don't like bigots.
"Just don't let them dissuade you. Stick to your beliefs no matter what and you'll be fine." - ConservativePolitico, the guy that accused me of being close-minded.

"We didn't start slavery, they themselves started it. When the white man first got to Africa they had already enslaved themselves, they just capitalized on an opportunity." - ConservativePolitico

"The Bible to me is a history book and requires very little faith to believe in." - ConservativePolitico
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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12/29/2011 2:54:18 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 2:51:01 PM, Physik wrote:
I value truth.
And a Christian has Truth! Go figure.

I don't need to be religious to have morals.
Correct, but to have objective morality you have to be religious.


I don't like bigots.
So you are intolerant of bigots? So you like hypocrites then?
Dan4reason
Posts: 1,168
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12/29/2011 2:56:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 2:51:01 PM, Physik wrote:
I value truth.

I don't need to be religious to have morals.

I don't like bigots.

Could you be a little more detailed? How do you know that atheism is true?

And whether morals can exist with or without religion has no bearing on the truth of religion.

I don't really know who you are calling bigots.
DetectableNinja
Posts: 6,043
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12/29/2011 2:58:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I'd rather not get into the entire story, but, to put it shortly, my Catholic faith (I was actually VERY devout) eroded for many reasons, and thus far there hasn't been any other religions or arguments for God that have convinced me.
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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12/29/2011 3:01:18 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 2:58:49 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
I'd rather not get into the entire story, but, to put it shortly, my Catholic faith (I was actually VERY devout) eroded for many reasons, and thus far there hasn't been any other religions or arguments for God that have convinced me.

That is kind of sad. I went the other way.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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12/29/2011 3:05:27 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 2:51:01 PM, Physik wrote:
I value truth.

I don't need to be religious to have morals.

I don't like bigots.

This, and to add.

1. I will not sacrifice my intellectual freedom and submit to the fear and unfounded assertions postulated by an ancient book.

2. I will not pretend to accept something that is on its face logically unsound.

3. I refuse to believe that there is a heaven or a hell, that souls [exist] can be so immortal as to ascend or descend to both places respectively.

Most Christians are not Christians out of pure belief, but rather because they need some kind of guidance to hold onto to make sense of life,....not everyone is willing to become philosophers and actually think logically to achieve such a feat. This is why I am not, and cannot ever be a Christian, or respect Christianity for that matter.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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12/29/2011 3:39:16 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 3:05:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 12/29/2011 2:51:01 PM, Physik wrote:
I value truth.

I don't need to be religious to have morals.

I don't like bigots.

This, and to add.

1. I will not sacrifice my intellectual freedom and submit to the fear and unfounded assertions postulated by an ancient book.

2. I will not pretend to accept something that is on its face logically unsound.

3. I refuse to believe that there is a heaven or a hell, that souls [exist] can be so immortal as to ascend or descend to both places respectively.

Most Christians are not Christians out of pure belief, but rather because they need some kind of guidance to hold onto to make sense of life,....not everyone is willing to become philosophers and actually think logically to achieve such a feat. This is why I am not, and cannot ever be a Christian, or respect Christianity for that matter.

Any Christian would make the same assertions lol. We do not follow all ancient books lol.

Every theologian in the Christian realm is also a philosopher and thinker.

I will pit any Christian theologian against any advocate for atheism and pound for pound their intelligence will outweigh the greatest of atheism with meager effort in the doing.

In fact, a single Christian knight (Craig) has deconstructed every argument and advocation of atheism and outjousted three of the four horsemen of atheism.

Peter Hitchens demolished Christopher and Peter is not even a recognized theologian but a coherent layman.
16kadams
Posts: 10,497
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12/29/2011 3:49:17 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I am a Christian atheist if that makes sense, believe in evolution but god as well. I believe in god because how did the big bang start and how did everything come from nothing. Also I was in a church once and was forced to pray and every time I said god I chilled. I do not know if that is a good enough answer :P
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DetectableNinja
Posts: 6,043
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12/29/2011 3:54:21 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 3:49:17 PM, 16kadams wrote:
I am a Christian atheist if that makes sense, believe in evolution but god as well. I believe in god because how did the big bang start and how did everything come from nothing. Also I was in a church once and was forced to pray and every time I said god I chilled. I do not know if that is a good enough answer :P

Then you're just a Christian.
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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12/29/2011 4:07:39 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 3:54:21 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 12/29/2011 3:49:17 PM, 16kadams wrote:
I am a Christian atheist if that makes sense, believe in evolution but god as well. I believe in god because how did the big bang start and how did everything come from nothing. Also I was in a church once and was forced to pray and every time I said god I chilled. I do not know if that is a good enough answer :P

Then you're just a Christian.

No, he's seems like a deist or pantheist. You cannot be Christian and accept evolution and the big bang. People always want to take both, but their contradictory is several ways.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
fever1996
Posts: 7
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12/29/2011 4:08:30 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At the beginning I was very devout in following the Christian Road, then school took over and for a while i didn't really think about it, then some people came into my life and then I took the road of being a logical, scientific Christian, discovering by myself what Christianity meant.
fever1996
Posts: 7
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12/29/2011 4:10:50 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 4:07:39 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 12/29/2011 3:54:21 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 12/29/2011 3:49:17 PM, 16kadams wrote:
I am a Christian atheist if that makes sense, believe in evolution but god as well. I believe in god because how did the big bang start and how did everything come from nothing. Also I was in a church once and was forced to pray and every time I said god I chilled. I do not know if that is a good enough answer :P

Then you're just a Christian.

No, he's seems like a deist or pantheist. You cannot be Christian and accept evolution and the big bang. People always want to take both, but their contradictory is several ways.

I would like to commend you for being one of the theists that follow a logical road. I am the same here, but I define myself as completly Christian.
nonentity
Posts: 5,008
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12/29/2011 4:11:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I grew up in a Christian family and my entire family (immediate and extended) is extremely religious.

I am an atheist because Christianity doesn't make sense to me. I know religious people disagree but I view atheism as the default position and would have to be convinced otherwise to believe in a God of another religion. However, I do not feel that I need religion in my life and feel that I am better off without it. I have no desire to search for a God. I know if I search I will find it lol If that makes any sense.

Basically, there is no possible way my rational brain will believe in God. I'm sure I could believe in God emotionally, and I've tried. But it requires a lot of dissonance from me.
fever1996
Posts: 7
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12/29/2011 4:13:42 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 4:11:49 PM, nonentity wrote:
I grew up in a Christian family and my entire family (immediate and extended) is extremely religious.

I am an atheist because Christianity doesn't make sense to me. I know religious people disagree but I view atheism as the default position and would have to be convinced otherwise to believe in a God of another religion. However, I do not feel that I need religion in my life and feel that I am better off without it. I have no desire to search for a God. I know if I search I will find it lol If that makes any sense.

I see where you are coming from, but if not search for god at least find the facts on both sides of the argument, then decide... Rationally.

Basically, there is no possible way my rational brain will believe in God. I'm sure I could believe in God emotionally, and I've tried. But it requires a lot of dissonance from me.
nonentity
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12/29/2011 4:20:36 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 4:13:42 PM, fever1996 wrote:

I see where you are coming from, but if not search for god at least find the facts on both sides of the argument, then decide... Rationally.


Christianity is a no-go for me. In my brain there is just no possible way the Bible, in its entirety, makes sense. I have not yet learned enough about other religions to decide whether or not to follow them. As I said, I have a multitude of reasons for not wanting religion in my life.

And, as I said, I view atheism as the "default" position and don't see a reason to look to disprove it, much like nobody in their right might looks for reasons to disprove flying pink elephants without believing in them. I know geolaureate and a number of theists would disagree, but that's what I think.
nonentity
Posts: 5,008
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12/29/2011 4:21:30 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 4:20:36 PM, nonentity wrote:
At 12/29/2011 4:13:42 PM, fever1996 wrote:

I see where you are coming from, but if not search for god at least find the facts on both sides of the argument, then decide... Rationally.


Christianity is a no-go for me. In my brain there is just no possible way the Bible, in its entirety, makes sense. I have not yet learned enough about other religions to decide whether or not to follow them. As I said, I have a multitude of reasons for not wanting religion in my life.

And, as I said, I view atheism as the "default" position and don't see a reason to look to disprove it, much like nobody in their right mind looks for reasons to disprove flying pink elephants without believing in them. I know geolaureate and a number of theists would disagree, but that's what I think.

Fix'd. Sorry about typos. I'm at work so only half paying attention.
popculturepooka
Posts: 7,924
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12/29/2011 4:34:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Given other beliefs i have on things like morality, consciousness, the human condition, teleology, knowledge, and other structures of reality i find them absolutely impossible to reconcile with atheism and seems a far better fit in a religious worldview. I haven't found strong reason(s) yet to otherthrow those beliefs and i've been looking for years.
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Ren
Posts: 7,102
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12/29/2011 4:41:42 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 4:34:48 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
Given other beliefs i have on things like morality, consciousness, the human condition, teleology, knowledge, and other structures of reality i find them absolutely impossible to reconcile with atheism and seems a far better fit in a religious worldview. I haven't found strong reason(s) yet to otherthrow those beliefs and i've been looking for years.

.
Ren
Posts: 7,102
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12/29/2011 4:43:18 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
That said, I'd also like to add that atheism is not a belief, it's a lack thereof.

I respect the position of agnostics the most, although I remain a Christian. Isn't that something?
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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12/29/2011 4:51:42 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
In fact, a single Christian knight (Craig) has deconstructed every argument and advocation of atheism and outjousted three of the four horsemen of atheism.:

1. Debates are often dictated by personal bias. I'm sure many atheists would disagree.

2. Even supposing Craig won his debates, winning a debate =/= truth. Debate is the art of persuasion, not the deliverance of truth.
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
unitedandy
Posts: 1,173
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12/29/2011 4:59:05 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
There's a whole load of small issues which I think fit better with atheism (biblical morality, evolution, and so on), but the I think it would be pretty easy to resolve these difficulties if a) I were to have some sort of personal experience of God and b) I could find some way to erode my confidence in the potency of the PoE, with respect to the traditionally defined God.
unitedandy
Posts: 1,173
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12/29/2011 5:10:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I will pit any Christian theologian against any advocate for atheism and pound for pound their intelligence will outweigh the greatest of atheism with meager effort in the doing.

In fact, a single Christian knight (Craig) has deconstructed every argument and advocation of atheism and outjousted three of the four horsemen of atheism.

Ironically, the strength of Craig as a debater, far from deconstructing my own atheism, actually supports it. With 99% of atheist arguments, Craig is a wrecking ball, but with things like the problem of evil and the argument from non-belief, his responses go from convincing and academic to contrived and preachy.

I was one of those God delusion atheists about 5 or 6 years ago, and reading Craig dismantled this approach completely very quickly, but at the same time, I came across the version of the PoE I use now, and it's always struck me as almost impenetrable, to Craig or anyone else.
Physik
Posts: 686
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12/29/2011 5:26:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 2:54:18 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/29/2011 2:51:01 PM, Physik wrote:
I value truth.
And a Christian has Truth! Go figure.

I don't need to be religious to have morals.
Correct, but to have objective morality you have to be religious.


I don't like bigots.
So you are intolerant of bigots? So you like hypocrites then?

1 - Don't even.

2 - According to the bible rape, eternal torture and genocide are right according to objective morality. I'm an atheist, and I know it's wrong till kill entire races because they don't have the same beliefs as me. Religion is not a requirement to know right from wrong.

3 - To be intolerant of bigots is to be a decent human being.
"Just don't let them dissuade you. Stick to your beliefs no matter what and you'll be fine." - ConservativePolitico, the guy that accused me of being close-minded.

"We didn't start slavery, they themselves started it. When the white man first got to Africa they had already enslaved themselves, they just capitalized on an opportunity." - ConservativePolitico

"The Bible to me is a history book and requires very little faith to believe in." - ConservativePolitico
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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12/29/2011 5:29:40 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 5:10:22 PM, unitedandy wrote:
I will pit any Christian theologian against any advocate for atheism and pound for pound their intelligence will outweigh the greatest of atheism with meager effort in the doing.

In fact, a single Christian knight (Craig) has deconstructed every argument and advocation of atheism and outjousted three of the four horsemen of atheism.

Ironically, the strength of Craig as a debater, far from deconstructing my own atheism, actually supports it. With 99% of atheist arguments, Craig is a wrecking ball, but with things like the problem of evil and the argument from non-belief, his responses go from convincing and academic to contrived and preachy.

I was one of those God delusion atheists about 5 or 6 years ago, and reading Craig dismantled this approach completely very quickly, but at the same time, I came across the version of the PoE I use now, and it's always struck me as almost impenetrable, to Craig or anyone else.

Craig's response to PoE seems completely valid to me.

The example:
God is ridiculed by the PoE because Nazi's slaughtered countless innocents.
Why did not act?

If God eliminated Hitler as a baby he is pegged with the PoE and called a baby killer.

The point seems obvious to me. A greater good could easily be the end result of any evil act should God choose to allow it.

An omniscient God would certainly know more than I do. I simply am not in a good position to judge a kalidescope of events when I can barely take care of 1 year into my own future with any assurance.

What about the PoE seems good to you?
Deathbeforedishonour
Posts: 1,058
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12/29/2011 5:31:34 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I am not an atheist because there is no logical reason to be one. If there was a big bang then where did it come from? If there was a parallel universe that collided then where did that come from? andnid aleins did it who made the aliens? I'm a christian because there is nmore evedence to back it.
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." ~ John 1:1

Matthew 10:22- "And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved."
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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12/29/2011 5:34:55 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 5:31:34 PM, Deathbeforedishonour wrote:
I am not an atheist because there is no logical reason to be one. If there was a big bang then where did it come from? If there was a parallel universe that collided then where did that come from? andnid aleins did it who made the aliens? I'm a christian because there is nmore evedence to back it.:

You still have the same problem when it comes to God. Who created God? You say, God is eternal, having no beginning or end. But why is it okay for you to believe that, but not for others? Is that a provable proposition, or just a way to philosophically avoid an infinite regression?
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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12/29/2011 5:36:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 5:26:02 PM, Physik wrote:
At 12/29/2011 2:54:18 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 12/29/2011 2:51:01 PM, Physik wrote:
I value truth.
And a Christian has Truth! Go figure.

I don't need to be religious to have morals.
Correct, but to have objective morality you have to be religious.


I don't like bigots.
So you are intolerant of bigots? So you like hypocrites then?

1 - Don't even.
Lol, you do not know all of the tenets of the Christian Faith to be in a good place to make such an assertion.

2 - According to the bible rape, eternal torture and genocide are right according to objective morality. I'm an atheist, and I know it's wrong till kill entire races because they don't have the same beliefs as me. Religion is not a requirement to know right from wrong.

This is just a claim on your part. You are just repeating garbage you read on the internet. If these claims were true then indeed Christianity would have fallen apart in the first century with the first accusations.

It is not wrong to kill evil races if they are out to kill you.

We as Americans have made similiar decisions, we killed countless men women and children at the firebombings of Dresden, Berlin, Tokyo and the nukes over Hiroshima and Nagsaki.

The innocents will pay for the crimes of guilty when they are evil. That will always happen.

We are not to blame for the death of those innocents, the evil parents and rulers are.


3 - To be intolerant of bigots is to be a decent human being.
and a hypocrite :) Do you know what a bigot is?
Deathbeforedishonour
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12/29/2011 5:39:20 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/29/2011 5:34:55 PM, PARADIGM_L0ST wrote:
At 12/29/2011 5:31:34 PM, Deathbeforedishonour wrote:
I am not an atheist because there is no logical reason to be one. If there was a big bang then where did it come from? If there was a parallel universe that collided then where did that come from? andnid aleins did it who made the aliens? I'm a christian because there is nmore evedence to back it.:

You still have the same problem when it comes to God. Who created God? You say, God is eternal, having no beginning or end. But why is it okay for you to believe that, but not for others? Is that a provable proposition, or just a way to philosophically avoid an infinite regression?

God is the essence of pure power imbodied in three beings, He doesn't need a beginning because He Himself made time. The problem with your question is it still doesn't deny the existence of God.
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." ~ John 1:1

Matthew 10:22- "And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved."
PARADIGM_L0ST
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12/29/2011 5:43:05 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
God is the essence of pure power imbodied in three beings, He doesn't need a beginning because He Himself made time.:

Circular argument... You use God to prove the bible true, and the bible to prove God true. You're basing your entire argument on an unprovable assertion.

The problem with your question is it still doesn't deny the existence of God.:

What question?
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)