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LDS a Cult?

logicrules
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2/18/2012 7:16:03 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
The study of cults did not begin in earnest until the 1930's. Since then a number of characteristics have been established which, if not universal, are certainly common to most cults. Mormonism fits the classification on all levels, and should be re-classified.

Cults attract members who are vulnerable and, predominantly young. A cursory look at LDS shows these are the folk they solicit.

Cults control thoughts by spinning facts or outright denial. Mormonism has long been a cult of denial. Its founder was a convicted con artist. He revealed his mission of polygamy only after he was exposed. Smith, by today's standards, was an abuser. His successor condoned murder calling it ‘blood atonement".

Leaving a cult is blocked by the cult. Leaving LDS is difficult at best, and many are hounded and forced to stay.

Mormonism is a Cult devoted to control and power. No member of a believing community should give support to LDS as Christian, for it is not. No individual who supports liberty should condone LDS for it is opposed to freedom.
Volkov
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2/18/2012 7:26:01 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Mormons are not a modern-day cult, they no longer fit the profile. They're much too moderated. At the beggining is different.
Stephen_Hawkins
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2/18/2012 8:41:13 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 8:35:36 AM, logicrules wrote:
At 2/18/2012 8:14:18 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
Who cares if they are a cult?

Obviously any who comment.

RoyalPaladin commented.
Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. Teach him how to be Gay, he'll positively influence the GDP.

Social Contract Theory debate: http://www.debate.org...
JaxsonRaine
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2/18/2012 10:20:58 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 7:16:03 AM, logicrules wrote:
The study of cults did not begin in earnest until the 1930's. Since then a number of characteristics have been established which, if not universal, are certainly common to most cults. Mormonism fits the classification on all levels, and should be re-classified.

Cults attract members who are vulnerable and, predominantly young. A cursory look at LDS shows these are the folk they solicit.

I would like to see some support for this claim. LDS missionary work doesn't focus on any age group, nor will they baptize anyone under 18 without parental consent.

You might say they prey on the vulnerable because a lot of people who listen to the missionaries' message are those who are struggling with life or have become disillusioned with their traditional teachings. For instance, a parent who loses a child shortly after birth, and is told that child will go to hell for not being baptized, has very good reason to start thinking there is something wrong with their religion.

Cults control thoughts by spinning facts or outright denial. Mormonism has long been a cult of denial. Its founder was a convicted con artist. He revealed his mission of polygamy only after he was exposed. Smith, by today's standards, was an abuser. His successor condoned murder calling it ‘blood atonement".

Being convicted doesn't mean someone is guilty, as the law isn't always correct. Heck, there was an extermination order signed against the Mormons in Missouri, was that right too?

You won't be able to find a single instance of blood atonement actually occurring.

As for polygamy... First, it wasn't something Smith or Young were eager to do, but was commanded for a variety of reasons. Second, polygamy existed in the Bible... there were men who God gave more than one wife to. Can God do evil?

Leaving a cult is blocked by the cult. Leaving LDS is difficult at best, and many are hounded and forced to stay.

How so? What is this leverage the LDS use against people who try to leave?

Mormonism is a Cult devoted to control and power. No member of a believing community should give support to LDS as Christian, for it is not. No individual who supports liberty should condone LDS for it is opposed to freedom.

Control and power? Control over what? What power?

Come on, nobody in the LDS church receives a salary, nor are they considered to have power. All you have presented are a lot of unfounded claims.

What do you have against Mormons?
twocupcakes: 15 = 13
logicrules
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2/18/2012 10:47:24 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 10:20:58 AM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 7:16:03 AM, logicrules wrote:
The study of cults did not begin in earnest until the 1930's. Since then a number of characteristics have been established which, if not universal, are certainly common to most cults. Mormonism fits the classification on all levels, and should be re-classified.

Cults attract members who are vulnerable and, predominantly young. A cursory look at LDS shows these are the folk they solicit.

I would like to see some support for this claim. LDS missionary work doesn't focus on any age group, nor will they baptize anyone under 18 without parental consent.

You might say they prey on the vulnerable because a lot of people who listen to the missionaries' message are those who are struggling with life or have become disillusioned with their traditional teachings. For instance, a parent who loses a child shortly after birth, and is told that child will go to hell for not being baptized, has very good reason to start thinking there is something wrong with their religion.

Cults control thoughts by spinning facts or outright denial. Mormonism has long been a cult of denial. Its founder was a convicted con artist. He revealed his mission of polygamy only after he was exposed. Smith, by today's standards, was an abuser. His successor condoned murder calling it ‘blood atonement".

Being convicted doesn't mean someone is guilty, as the law isn't always correct. Heck, there was an extermination order signed against the Mormons in Missouri, was that right too?

You won't be able to find a single instance of blood atonement actually occurring.

As for polygamy... First, it wasn't something Smith or Young were eager to do, but was commanded for a variety of reasons. Second, polygamy existed in the Bible... there were men who God gave more than one wife to. Can God do evil?

Leaving a cult is blocked by the cult. Leaving LDS is difficult at best, and many are hounded and forced to stay.

How so? What is this leverage the LDS use against people who try to leave?

Mormonism is a Cult devoted to control and power. No member of a believing community should give support to LDS as Christian, for it is not. No individual who supports liberty should condone LDS for it is opposed to freedom.

Control and power? Control over what? What power?

Come on, nobody in the LDS church receives a salary, nor are they considered to have power. All you have presented are a lot of unfounded claims.

What do you have against Mormons?

LOL support for what, recruiting tactics of LDS or the standardization of cult practices?

I have nothing against mormons, anymore than I have something against anyone who joins a cult. I oppose the Cult itself and those who prey on the weak. The LDS has talking points to hide its reality. o one gets paid but LDS is filthy rich. As to claims.....you think Smith wasn't convicted? You deny Blood Attonment? You deny that you believe Jesus, Satan and yourself are brothers? What is unsupported?
JaxsonRaine
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2/18/2012 10:54:14 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 10:47:24 AM, logicrules wrote:

What do you have against Mormons?

LOL support for what, recruiting tactics of LDS or the standardization of cult practices?

Recruiting tactics.

I have nothing against mormons, anymore than I have something against anyone who joins a cult. I oppose the Cult itself and those who prey on the weak.

How do LDS prey on the weak?

The LDS has talking points to hide its reality.

What reality is that? Where is your evidence for your claims?

No one gets paid but LDS is filthy rich.

LDS is filthy rich? You mean the church? Who is benefiting from the money the church has? Do you know what the money is used for?

As to claims.....you think Smith wasn't convicted?

Convicted of what? Just show some evidence of what you are talking about, instead of unsubstantiated, general claims.

You deny Blood Attonment?

Show me an instance of blood atonement being practiced.

You deny that you believe Jesus, Satan and yourself are brothers? What is unsupported?

We're not talking about my beliefs. LDS believe that all of God's children are spiritual children of God, and therefore spiritual siblings. I don't see any problem with that.
twocupcakes: 15 = 13
logicrules
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2/18/2012 11:51:35 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 10:54:14 AM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 10:47:24 AM, logicrules wrote:

What do you have against Mormons?

LOL support for what, recruiting tactics of LDS or the standardization of cult practices?

Recruiting tactics.

I have nothing against mormons, anymore than I have something against anyone who joins a cult. I oppose the Cult itself and those who prey on the weak.

How do LDS prey on the weak?

The LDS has talking points to hide its reality.

What reality is that? Where is your evidence for your claims?

No one gets paid but LDS is filthy rich.

LDS is filthy rich? You mean the church? Who is benefiting from the money the church has? Do you know what the money is used for?

As to claims.....you think Smith wasn't convicted?

Convicted of what? Just show some evidence of what you are talking about, instead of unsubstantiated, general claims.

You deny Blood Attonment?

Show me an instance of blood atonement being practiced.

You deny that you believe Jesus, Satan and yourself are brothers? What is unsupported?

We're not talking about my beliefs. LDS believe that all of God's children are spiritual children of God, and therefore spiritual siblings. I don't see any problem with that.

Yes, I have support. Doctrine and covenants. I have support for everything I post.
JaxsonRaine
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2/18/2012 12:02:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 11:51:35 AM, logicrules wrote:
At 2/18/2012 10:54:14 AM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 10:47:24 AM, logicrules wrote:

What do you have against Mormons?

LOL support for what, recruiting tactics of LDS or the standardization of cult practices?

Recruiting tactics.

I have nothing against mormons, anymore than I have something against anyone who joins a cult. I oppose the Cult itself and those who prey on the weak.

How do LDS prey on the weak?

The LDS has talking points to hide its reality.

What reality is that? Where is your evidence for your claims?

No one gets paid but LDS is filthy rich.

LDS is filthy rich? You mean the church? Who is benefiting from the money the church has? Do you know what the money is used for?

As to claims.....you think Smith wasn't convicted?

Convicted of what? Just show some evidence of what you are talking about, instead of unsubstantiated, general claims.

You deny Blood Attonment?

Show me an instance of blood atonement being practiced.

You deny that you believe Jesus, Satan and yourself are brothers? What is unsupported?

We're not talking about my beliefs. LDS believe that all of God's children are spiritual children of God, and therefore spiritual siblings. I don't see any problem with that.

Yes, I have support. Doctrine and covenants. I have support for everything I post.

Ok... can you post your support for all those points?

So far, you haven't addressed anything I've actually said.
twocupcakes: 15 = 13
logicrules
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2/18/2012 12:47:24 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Ok... can you post your support for all those points?

So far, you haven't addressed anything I've actually said.

Say something substantive. If you have no knowledge of LDS Doctrine you speak from ignorance and there is not enough space here to post an entire idiology. If you are familiar with LDS cite, with specificity anything I have posted in error and I shall address. Everything I post comes right from LDS Doctrine and/or their "prophets".
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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2/18/2012 12:52:30 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
All religions start out as cults. Some stick, some don't.. LDS is no exception to that rule.
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
JaxsonRaine
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2/18/2012 1:05:18 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 12:47:24 PM, logicrules wrote:
Ok... can you post your support for all those points?

So far, you haven't addressed anything I've actually said.

Say something substantive. If you have no knowledge of LDS Doctrine you speak from ignorance and there is not enough space here to post an entire idiology. If you are familiar with LDS cite, with specificity anything I have posted in error and I shall address. Everything I post comes right from LDS Doctrine and/or their "prophets".

YOU are the one making unsubstantiated claims. I know LDS doctrine better than you do.
twocupcakes: 15 = 13
MyVoiceInYourHead
Posts: 260
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2/18/2012 4:54:01 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 7:16:03 AM, logicrules wrote:
The study of cults did not begin in earnest until the 1930's. Since then a number of characteristics have been established which, if not universal, are certainly common to most cults. Mormonism fits the classification on all levels, and should be re-classified.

Cults attract members who are vulnerable and, predominantly young. A cursory look at LDS shows these are the folk they solicit.

Cults control thoughts by spinning facts or outright denial. Mormonism has long been a cult of denial. Its founder was a convicted con artist. He revealed his mission of polygamy only after he was exposed. Smith, by today's standards, was an abuser. His successor condoned murder calling it ‘blood atonement".

Leaving a cult is blocked by the cult. Leaving LDS is difficult at best, and many are hounded and forced to stay.

Mormonism is a Cult devoted to control and power. No member of a believing community should give support to LDS as Christian, for it is not. No individual who supports liberty should condone LDS for it is opposed to freedom.

The Cult Information Centre defines a cult as having the following characteristics:

a. A small but fanatically loyal folllowing.
b. The leader is Messianic, charismatic and unaccountable.
c. The cult uses psychological manipulation to recruit and retain members.
d. The members are idealistic and disillusioned with life.
e. The cult asks members to give money to the cult
f. Finger-pointing "them and us" is encouraged.
g. It has a confusing doctrine.
h. It has an end of the world prophecy

In it's early stages Christianity probably satisfied (a)
Now it satisfies the rest.
Composer
Posts: 5,858
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2/18/2012 8:46:03 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I had a couple of LDS missionaries at my place a while back and after we discussed their beliefs and what the bible actually states their faith dissipated in religions and the LDS but they both said their Scholarships were paid by the LDS as long as they were missionaries and members so they would continue to pretend to believe in the LDS at least until their school/college education was finished!
johnnyboy54
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2/18/2012 9:04:10 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 12:52:30 PM, PARADIGM_L0ST wrote:
All religions start out as cults. Some stick, some don't.. LDS is no exception to that rule.

What separates a cult from a religion?
I didn't order assholes with my whiskey.
JaxsonRaine
Posts: 3,606
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2/18/2012 9:16:56 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 8:46:03 PM, Composer wrote:
I had a couple of LDS missionaries at my place a while back and after we discussed their beliefs and what the bible actually states their faith dissipated in religions and the LDS but they both said their Scholarships were paid by the LDS as long as they were missionaries and members so they would continue to pretend to believe in the LDS at least until their school/college education was finished!

That's not true. Missionaries have to pay for their missions, $400/month. They don't get any form of financial compensation for being missionaries.
twocupcakes: 15 = 13
Composer
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2/18/2012 9:39:33 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 9:16:56 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 8:46:03 PM, Composer wrote:
I had a couple of LDS missionaries at my place a while back and after we discussed their beliefs and what the bible actually states their faith dissipated in religions and the LDS but they both said their Scholarships were paid by the LDS as long as they were missionaries and members so they would continue to pretend to believe in the LDS at least until their school/college education was finished!

That's not true. Missionaries have to pay for their missions, $400/month. They don't get any form of financial compensation for being missionaries.
Are you therefore insinuating they lied to me and that their College Scholarship wasn't paid by the LDS at all providing they remained members & studying the LDS faith?
JaxsonRaine
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2/18/2012 9:44:36 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 9:39:33 PM, Composer wrote:
At 2/18/2012 9:16:56 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 8:46:03 PM, Composer wrote:
I had a couple of LDS missionaries at my place a while back and after we discussed their beliefs and what the bible actually states their faith dissipated in religions and the LDS but they both said their Scholarships were paid by the LDS as long as they were missionaries and members so they would continue to pretend to believe in the LDS at least until their school/college education was finished!

That's not true. Missionaries have to pay for their missions, $400/month. They don't get any form of financial compensation for being missionaries.
Are you therefore insinuating they lied to me and that their College Scholarship wasn't paid by the LDS at all providing they remained members & studying the LDS faith?

That, or you're making it up, or you're remembering wrong. There is a special consideration for missionaries that allows them to defer a scholarship while they server their mission, and maybe that is what they were referring to. The LDS church doesn't pay for scholarships.
twocupcakes: 15 = 13
Composer
Posts: 5,858
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2/18/2012 10:07:15 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 9:44:36 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 9:39:33 PM, Composer wrote:
At 2/18/2012 9:16:56 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 8:46:03 PM, Composer wrote:
I had a couple of LDS missionaries at my place a while back and after we discussed their beliefs and what the bible actually states their faith dissipated in religions and the LDS but they both said their Scholarships were paid by the LDS as long as they were missionaries and members so they would continue to pretend to believe in the LDS at least until their school/college education was finished!

That's not true. Missionaries have to pay for their missions, $400/month. They don't get any form of financial compensation for being missionaries.
Are you therefore insinuating they lied to me and that their College Scholarship wasn't paid by the LDS at all providing they remained members & studying the LDS faith?

That, or you're making it up, or you're remembering wrong. There is a special consideration for missionaries that allows them to defer a scholarship while they server their mission, and maybe that is what they were referring to. The LDS church doesn't pay for scholarships.
There are several scholarships offered through these Mormon schools. In general, these scholarships are only given to Mormon students of the schools, even though the schools accept students of all religions. The scholarships are given on basis of financial need and academic excellence; some of the scholarships require the student to pursue specific majors, while others are offered to Mormon students of any academic program.

There are also several missionaries that were founded by the Mormon Church, as well as a Seminary school for potential Mormon preachers. These programs sometimes offer students scholarship monies but require the student to continue their studies at the granting institution or within the program of study. (Source: http://oedb.org...) (Composer's emphasis!) They both required financial assistance and signed up to complete their course of studies strictly with the LDS Cult!

Proving you a liar and me unambiguously vindicated!
JaxsonRaine
Posts: 3,606
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2/18/2012 10:15:21 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 10:07:15 PM, Composer wrote:
At 2/18/2012 9:44:36 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 9:39:33 PM, Composer wrote:
At 2/18/2012 9:16:56 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 8:46:03 PM, Composer wrote:
I had a couple of LDS missionaries at my place a while back and after we discussed their beliefs and what the bible actually states their faith dissipated in religions and the LDS but they both said their Scholarships were paid by the LDS as long as they were missionaries and members so they would continue to pretend to believe in the LDS at least until their school/college education was finished!

That's not true. Missionaries have to pay for their missions, $400/month. They don't get any form of financial compensation for being missionaries.
Are you therefore insinuating they lied to me and that their College Scholarship wasn't paid by the LDS at all providing they remained members & studying the LDS faith?

That, or you're making it up, or you're remembering wrong. There is a special consideration for missionaries that allows them to defer a scholarship while they server their mission, and maybe that is what they were referring to. The LDS church doesn't pay for scholarships.
There are several scholarships offered through these Mormon schools. In general, these scholarships are only given to Mormon students of the schools, even though the schools accept students of all religions. The scholarships are given on basis of financial need and academic excellence; some of the scholarships require the student to pursue specific majors, while others are offered to Mormon students of any academic program.

There are also several missionaries that were founded by the Mormon Church, as well as a Seminary school for potential Mormon preachers. These programs sometimes offer students scholarship monies but require the student to continue their studies at the granting institution or within the program of study. (Source: http://oedb.org...) (Composer's emphasis!) They both required financial assistance and signed up to complete their course of studies strictly with the LDS Cult!

Proving you a liar and me unambiguously vindicated!

Those aren't scholarships from the LDS church. Anybody can set up a scholarship if they have money. Scholarships from schools like BYU aren't offered only to mormons.

'Seminary School' is no different from college for English teachers. If someone wants to teach seminary they study in a program for it. These aren't preachers though, they are teachers.
twocupcakes: 15 = 13
Composer
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2/18/2012 11:56:36 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 10:15:21 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 10:07:15 PM, Composer wrote:
At 2/18/2012 9:44:36 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 9:39:33 PM, Composer wrote:
At 2/18/2012 9:16:56 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 8:46:03 PM, Composer wrote:
I had a couple of LDS missionaries at my place a while back and after we discussed their beliefs and what the bible actually states their faith dissipated in religions and the LDS but they both said their Scholarships were paid by the LDS as long as they were missionaries and members so they would continue to pretend to believe in the LDS at least until their school/college education was finished!

That's not true. Missionaries have to pay for their missions, $400/month. They don't get any form of financial compensation for being missionaries.
Are you therefore insinuating they lied to me and that their College Scholarship wasn't paid by the LDS at all providing they remained members & studying the LDS faith?

That, or you're making it up, or you're remembering wrong. There is a special consideration for missionaries that allows them to defer a scholarship while they server their mission, and maybe that is what they were referring to. The LDS church doesn't pay for scholarships.
There are several scholarships offered through these Mormon schools. In general, these scholarships are only given to Mormon students of the schools, even though the schools accept students of all religions. The scholarships are given on basis of financial need and academic excellence; some of the scholarships require the student to pursue specific majors, while others are offered to Mormon students of any academic program.

There are also several missionaries that were founded by the Mormon Church, as well as a Seminary school for potential Mormon preachers. These programs sometimes offer students scholarship monies but require the student to continue their studies at the granting institution or within the program of study. (Source: http://oedb.org...) (Composer's emphasis!) They both required financial assistance and signed up to complete their course of studies strictly with the LDS Cult!

Proving you a liar and me unambiguously vindicated!

Those aren't scholarships from the LDS church. Anybody can set up a scholarship if they have money. Scholarships from schools like BYU aren't offered only to mormons.

'Seminary School' is no different from college for English teachers. If someone wants to teach seminary they study in a program for it. These aren't preachers though, they are teachers.
Read the OEDb Link I gave that refutes you!
JaxsonRaine
Posts: 3,606
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2/19/2012 8:03:34 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 11:56:36 PM, Composer wrote:
At 2/18/2012 10:15:21 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 10:07:15 PM, Composer wrote:
At 2/18/2012 9:44:36 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 9:39:33 PM, Composer wrote:
At 2/18/2012 9:16:56 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 8:46:03 PM, Composer wrote:
I had a couple of LDS missionaries at my place a while back and after we discussed their beliefs and what the bible actually states their faith dissipated in religions and the LDS but they both said their Scholarships were paid by the LDS as long as they were missionaries and members so they would continue to pretend to believe in the LDS at least until their school/college education was finished!

That's not true. Missionaries have to pay for their missions, $400/month. They don't get any form of financial compensation for being missionaries.
Are you therefore insinuating they lied to me and that their College Scholarship wasn't paid by the LDS at all providing they remained members & studying the LDS faith?

That, or you're making it up, or you're remembering wrong. There is a special consideration for missionaries that allows them to defer a scholarship while they server their mission, and maybe that is what they were referring to. The LDS church doesn't pay for scholarships.
There are several scholarships offered through these Mormon schools. In general, these scholarships are only given to Mormon students of the schools, even though the schools accept students of all religions. The scholarships are given on basis of financial need and academic excellence; some of the scholarships require the student to pursue specific majors, while others are offered to Mormon students of any academic program.

There are also several missionaries that were founded by the Mormon Church, as well as a Seminary school for potential Mormon preachers. These programs sometimes offer students scholarship monies but require the student to continue their studies at the granting institution or within the program of study. (Source: http://oedb.org...) (Composer's emphasis!) They both required financial assistance and signed up to complete their course of studies strictly with the LDS Cult!

Proving you a liar and me unambiguously vindicated!

Those aren't scholarships from the LDS church. Anybody can set up a scholarship if they have money. Scholarships from schools like BYU aren't offered only to mormons.

'Seminary School' is no different from college for English teachers. If someone wants to teach seminary they study in a program for it. These aren't preachers though, they are teachers.
Read the OEDb Link I gave that refutes you!

I read the link. Some of it is misleading, and some of it you misunderstand.

For instance, a scholarship from BYU isn't the same as a scholarship from the LDS church. BYU doesn't factor in religion when giving scholarships.

There are always scholarships for specific programs no matter where you go. Yes, if you earn a scholarship for a program such as Seminary/Institute teacher, you are going to have problems if you don't believe what you are going to be teaching, but those scholarships don't come from the church.
twocupcakes: 15 = 13
logicrules
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2/19/2012 8:29:39 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 12:52:30 PM, PARADIGM_L0ST wrote:
All religions start out as cults. Some stick, some don't.. LDS is no exception to that rule.

ALL...mmm so we find one that didnt and you are incorrect. zoroastrianism
logicrules
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2/19/2012 8:31:13 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 1:05:18 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 12:47:24 PM, logicrules wrote:
Ok... can you post your support for all those points?

So far, you haven't addressed anything I've actually said.

Say something substantive. If you have no knowledge of LDS Doctrine you speak from ignorance and there is not enough space here to post an entire idiology. If you are familiar with LDS cite, with specificity anything I have posted in error and I shall address. Everything I post comes right from LDS Doctrine and/or their "prophets".


YOU are the one making unsubstantiated claims. I know LDS doctrine better than you do.

LOL so that was substance? LDS was founded by a convicted criminal. LDS named a University after a known murderer. Care to comment?
logicrules
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2/19/2012 8:33:06 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 4:54:01 PM, MyVoiceInYourHead wrote:
At 2/18/2012 7:16:03 AM, logicrules wrote:
The study of cults did not begin in earnest until the 1930's. Since then a number of characteristics have been established which, if not universal, are certainly common to most cults. Mormonism fits the classification on all levels, and should be re-classified.

Cults attract members who are vulnerable and, predominantly young. A cursory look at LDS shows these are the folk they solicit.

Cults control thoughts by spinning facts or outright denial. Mormonism has long been a cult of denial. Its founder was a convicted con artist. He revealed his mission of polygamy only after he was exposed. Smith, by today's standards, was an abuser. His successor condoned murder calling it ‘blood atonement".

Leaving a cult is blocked by the cult. Leaving LDS is difficult at best, and many are hounded and forced to stay.

Mormonism is a Cult devoted to control and power. No member of a believing community should give support to LDS as Christian, for it is not. No individual who supports liberty should condone LDS for it is opposed to freedom.

The Cult Information Centre defines a cult as having the following characteristics:

a. A small but fanatically loyal folllowing.
b. The leader is Messianic, charismatic and unaccountable.
c. The cult uses psychological manipulation to recruit and retain members.
d. The members are idealistic and disillusioned with life.
e. The cult asks members to give money to the cult
f. Finger-pointing "them and us" is encouraged.
g. It has a confusing doctrine.
h. It has an end of the world prophecy

In it's early stages Christianity probably satisfied (a)
Now it satisfies the rest.

Christianity is not a religion it is a classification of both religions and denominations. US patriotism fits the religion paradigm.
logicrules
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2/19/2012 8:35:03 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/18/2012 8:46:03 PM, Composer wrote:
I had a couple of LDS missionaries at my place a while back and after we discussed their beliefs and what the bible actually states their faith dissipated in religions and the LDS but they both said their Scholarships were paid by the LDS as long as they were missionaries and members so they would continue to pretend to believe in the LDS at least until their school/college education was finished!

That makes no sense as LDS missionaries have to save up and pay themselves. Also, LDS preaches, and holds as Doctrine, that Heavenly Father rewards the Good with money, Gospel of Wealth.
JaxsonRaine
Posts: 3,606
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2/19/2012 8:48:17 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/19/2012 8:31:13 AM, logicrules wrote:
At 2/18/2012 1:05:18 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/18/2012 12:47:24 PM, logicrules wrote:
Ok... can you post your support for all those points?

So far, you haven't addressed anything I've actually said.

Say something substantive. If you have no knowledge of LDS Doctrine you speak from ignorance and there is not enough space here to post an entire idiology. If you are familiar with LDS cite, with specificity anything I have posted in error and I shall address. Everything I post comes right from LDS Doctrine and/or their "prophets".


YOU are the one making unsubstantiated claims. I know LDS doctrine better than you do.

LOL so that was substance? LDS was founded by a convicted criminal. LDS named a University after a known murderer. Care to comment?

It's difficult to provide proof that something didn't happen. You are the one saying things happened, but unwilling to provide the proof.

What was Joseph Smith convicted of, where, and when? Please, provide proof. You are the one who keeps making these claims.

When did Brigham Young murder anyone?
twocupcakes: 15 = 13
JaxsonRaine
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2/19/2012 8:49:31 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/19/2012 8:35:03 AM, logicrules wrote:
At 2/18/2012 8:46:03 PM, Composer wrote:
I had a couple of LDS missionaries at my place a while back and after we discussed their beliefs and what the bible actually states their faith dissipated in religions and the LDS but they both said their Scholarships were paid by the LDS as long as they were missionaries and members so they would continue to pretend to believe in the LDS at least until their school/college education was finished!

That makes no sense as LDS missionaries have to save up and pay themselves. Also, LDS preaches, and holds as Doctrine, that Heavenly Father rewards the Good with money, Gospel of Wealth.

I think you are twisting that slightly. LDS teach that if members are faithful, they will always have their needs met, but there is no doctrine about getting rich through righteousness.
twocupcakes: 15 = 13
logicrules
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2/19/2012 8:54:20 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/19/2012 8:49:31 AM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 2/19/2012 8:35:03 AM, logicrules wrote:
At 2/18/2012 8:46:03 PM, Composer wrote:
I had a couple of LDS missionaries at my place a while back and after we discussed their beliefs and what the bible actually states their faith dissipated in religions and the LDS but they both said their Scholarships were paid by the LDS as long as they were missionaries and members so they would continue to pretend to believe in the LDS at least until their school/college education was finished!

That makes no sense as LDS missionaries have to save up and pay themselves. Also, LDS preaches, and holds as Doctrine, that Heavenly Father rewards the Good with money, Gospel of Wealth.

I think you are twisting that slightly. LDS teach that if members are faithful, they will always have their needs met, but there is no doctrine about getting rich through righteousness.

not twisted, just absent the excuses. The Doctrine of LDS is that Heavenly Fatheer will reward you, and that one of the ways to determine your "righteousness" (not used by LDS till recently) is by your wealth as that is an indicator of above.