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Noncontradictory scriptures in the bible?

IFLYHIGH
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3/15/2012 7:50:56 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Different Christian organizations or churches explain these contradictory scriptures by each giving their own translation of the scriptures that are contradictory. But giving multiple translations doesn't solve the contradiction, it just makes it too confusing to answer. And since all the translations are different, then they are in themselves a contradiction with each other over explaining the right answer. So can anybody(Christians and Atheist alike) give me one scripture in the bible that contradicts itself but has ONE UNIVERSAL interpretation to explain how the scripture is not a contradiction. One scripture. One contradiction. One universal interpretation.

Side note- If two scriptures show how one scripture is contradictory, then please show both
Universal- If 97% of all Christians accept that interpretation, then that is good enough for me.

This is a question, not a attack or even an argument. No need for any Christians to get upset, just please answer the question.
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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3/15/2012 8:10:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Does God punish the progeny for the sins of the father?

"You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, on the third and the fourth generations of those who hate Me." -- Exodus 20:5

YES!!!

Wait...??? NO!!!

"The person who sins will die. The son will not bear the punishment for the father's iniquity, nor will the father bear the punishment for the son's iniquity; the righteousness of the righteous will be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked will be upon himself." -- Ezekiel 18:20

DERP.

Did Paul's companion hear the voice or see the light???

"Now as he was going along and approaching Damascus, suddenly a light from heaven flashed around him. He fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to him, ‘Saul, Saul, why do you persecute me?' He asked, ‘Who are you, Lord?' The reply came, ‘I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting. But get up and enter the city, and you will be told what to do.' The men who were travelling with him stood speechless because they heard the voice but saw no one. Saul got up from the ground, and though his eyes were open, he could see nothing; so they led him by the hand and brought him into Damascus." -- Acts 9:3-8

"While I was on my way and approaching Damascus, about noon a great light from heaven suddenly shone about me. I fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to me, "Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting me?" I answered, "Who are you, Lord?" Then he said to me, "I am Jesus of Nazareth whom you are persecuting." Now those who were with me saw the light but did not hear the voice of the one who was speaking to me. I asked, "What am I to do, Lord?" The Lord said to me, "Get up and go to Damascus; there you will be told everything that has been assigned to you to do." Since I could not see because of the brightness of that light, those who were with me took my hand and led me to Damascus." -- Acts 22:6-11

DERP.

There's goes the notion that the bible is infallible...
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
IFLYHIGH
Posts: 5,223
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3/15/2012 8:19:37 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
"Although the first passage describes Paul's conversion, the second describes Paul describing his conversion, it's reported speech. For the second passage to be true, it just has to accurately report what Paul said; it doesn't matter whether or not what Paul said is true.
It is therefore possible that the first account is true (Paul's companions heard the voice but saw no one), and that the second account is also true (Paul incorrectly said that his companions saw the light but heard no one). There is therefore no contradiction between the two passages."

Just some explanation I copy and pasted. As you can see, given enough effort, explanations will be made. This is not the only explanation, adding to the confusion of what is the right explanation. I'm not looking for contradictions in the bible(theres plenty of that), I'm looking for one accepted universal explanation to explain just one contradiction in the bible.
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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3/15/2012 8:28:13 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I'm not looking for contradictions in the bible(theres plenty of that), I'm looking for one accepted universal explanation to explain just one contradiction in the bible.:

I'm afraid you won't find universal consensus, because there is none. Many denominations claim authority over the scriptures as if their group holds the REAL truth, and all the others are merely apostates and imposters. (See: 'No True Scotsman fallacy' for details).

As for that weak explanation for CLEARLY the same exact experience, how utterly pathetic of the author(s). And, yes, I totally agree... it simply adds to the confusion. But they aren't in it to clear up confusion, they're in it to rescue their worldview which is falling apart at the seams. The goal of the authors in that passage is to desperately find a way to maintain the bible's infallibility. Let it be a lesson in futility for them.
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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3/15/2012 10:49:34 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/15/2012 8:10:02 PM, PARADIGM_L0ST wrote:
Does God punish the progeny for the sins of the father?

"You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, on the third and the fourth generations of those who hate Me." -- Exodus 20:5

YES!!!

Wait...??? NO!!!

"The person who sins will die. The son will not bear the punishment for the father's iniquity, nor will the father bear the punishment for the son's iniquity; the righteousness of the righteous will be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked will be upon himself." -- Ezekiel 18:20

DERP.

Wow. I am stunned. The two verses are a national vs. personal context. I cannot believe you would post this.


Did Paul's companion hear the voice or see the light???

"Now as he was going along and approaching Damascus, suddenly a light from heaven flashed around him. He fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to him, ‘Saul, Saul, why do you persecute me?' He asked, ‘Who are you, Lord?' The reply came, ‘I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting. But get up and enter the city, and you will be told what to do.' The men who were travelling with him stood speechless because they heard the voice but saw no one. Saul got up from the ground, and though his eyes were open, he could see nothing; so they led him by the hand and brought him into Damascus." -- Acts 9:3-8

"While I was on my way and approaching Damascus, about noon a great light from heaven suddenly shone about me. I fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to me, "Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting me?" I answered, "Who are you, Lord?" Then he said to me, "I am Jesus of Nazareth whom you are persecuting." Now those who were with me saw the light but did not hear the voice of the one who was speaking to me. I asked, "What am I to do, Lord?" The Lord said to me, "Get up and go to Damascus; there you will be told everything that has been assigned to you to do." Since I could not see because of the brightness of that light, those who were with me took my hand and led me to Damascus." -- Acts 22:6-11

DERP.

There's goes the notion that the bible is infallible...

This one at least you would not know if you did not know the Greek. The first one all you had to do was read the surrounding paragraphs.

The greek akouo is mistranslated. This is also not a real contradiction.

I would stick with a couple of better ones than these which would take two seconds on google to resolve.
IFLYHIGH
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3/15/2012 11:08:23 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
This one at least you would not know if you did not know the Greek. The first one all you had to do was read the surrounding paragraphs.

The greek akouo is mistranslated. This is also not a real contradiction.

I would stick with a couple of better ones than these which would take two seconds on google to resolve.

The scripture is a seemingly contradictory scripture. You have given your interpretation of why the above paradox is not a paradox. I have shown in my answer a different reason why it is not a paradox. Moreover, there is many interpretations to why the above is not a paradox. Which interpretation do we trust? Can you show how all the interpretaions do not have any conflicting viewpoints in their interpretations? If you can't, then it is not a universal interpretation and your answer adds no value to this forum. If you can, then I would love to hear why.
logicrules
Posts: 1,721
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3/16/2012 8:22:42 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/15/2012 7:50:56 PM, IFLYHIGH wrote:
Different Christian organizations or churches explain these contradictory scriptures by each giving their own translation of the scriptures that are contradictory. But giving multiple translations doesn't solve the contradiction, it just makes it too confusing to answer. And since all the translations are different, then they are in themselves a contradiction with each other over explaining the right answer. So can anybody(Christians and Atheist alike) give me one scripture in the bible that contradicts itself but has ONE UNIVERSAL interpretation to explain how the scripture is not a contradiction. One scripture. One contradiction. One universal interpretation.

Side note- If two scriptures show how one scripture is contradictory, then please show both
Universal- If 97% of all Christians accept that interpretation, then that is good enough for me.

This is a question, not a attack or even an argument. No need for any Christians to get upset, just please answer the question.

You start with translations and the ask for interpretations. There is no such scripture.
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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3/16/2012 8:33:40 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Wow. I am stunned. The two verses are a national vs. personal context. I cannot believe you would post this.:

National versus personal is irrelevant, but nice shifting of the goalposts. It clearly states in one verse that the sins of the father will be repaid up to the 3rd and 4th generation, and in the next verse it states that the person who sins will pay and not their progeny.

This one at least you would not know if you did not know the Greek. The first one all you had to do was read the surrounding paragraphs.:

LOL, yeah, because hearing and seeing are easily mistranslated. Even supposing it was mistranslated, it's still undeniable evidence that the bible is therefore fallible. God clearly has not preserved his word, and that's the only thing I'm contending with.
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
IFLYHIGH
Posts: 5,223
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3/16/2012 10:51:08 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
yeah, I used the terms translation and interpretation interchangeably. Nice to know that no such scripture exist though. So how do you choose which interpretation is correct? If nobody can agree on a right interpretation of the bible, than why should anybody have faith in it? A book that has every paradox explained in exchange for confusion because of so many interpretation is not a much better book. But I'm not looking to argue, I'm looking for a scripture paradox with one universal explanation.
MyVoiceInYourHead
Posts: 260
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3/16/2012 11:34:34 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/15/2012 7:50:56 PM, IFLYHIGH wrote:
Different Christian organizations or churches explain these contradictory scriptures by each giving their own translation of the scriptures that are contradictory. But giving multiple translations doesn't solve the contradiction, it just makes it too confusing to answer. And since all the translations are different, then they are in themselves a contradiction with each other over explaining the right answer. So can anybody(Christians and Atheist alike) give me one scripture in the bible that contradicts itself but has ONE UNIVERSAL interpretation to explain how the scripture is not a contradiction. One scripture. One contradiction. One universal interpretation.

Side note- If two scriptures show how one scripture is contradictory, then please show both
Universal- If 97% of all Christians accept that interpretation, then that is good enough for me.

This is a question, not a attack or even an argument. No need for any Christians to get upset, just please answer the question.

The worst contradiction of the lot has to be the accounts of the death of Judas.
One of the gospels (Matthew?) effectively says that Judas was overcome with remorse, threw his blood money in to the temple and hanged himself in a nearby field. The priests bought the field with the money calling it Field of Blood.

Acts of the Apostles 1 says that Judas bought the field with the blood money then fell headlong down it whereupon his guts spilled open!

It's been fun listening to Christians' disingenuous arguments trying to explain that one. They are really quite clever at self-deceit and cognitive dissonance.
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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3/16/2012 4:31:55 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/16/2012 8:33:40 AM, PARADIGM_L0ST wrote:
Wow. I am stunned. The two verses are a national vs. personal context. I cannot believe you would post this.:

National versus personal is irrelevant, but nice shifting of the goalposts. It clearly states in one verse that the sins of the father will be repaid up to the 3rd and 4th generation, and in the next verse it states that the person who sins will pay and not their progeny.

So you choose not to read it in context and hold to your beliefs, despite obvious evidence like a hardcore fundamentalist. Nice.


This one at least you would not know if you did not know the Greek. The first one all you had to do was read the surrounding paragraphs.:

LOL, yeah, because hearing and seeing are easily mistranslated. Even supposing it was mistranslated, it's still undeniable evidence that the bible is therefore fallible. God clearly has not preserved his word, and that's the only thing I'm contending with.

Do you know more than one language by chance? Anyone that speaks two languages and works in translating understands words convey different meanings by the author to the translator.
It is why there are distinct processes of translation vs. transliteration.
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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3/16/2012 5:24:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
National versus personal is irrelevant, but nice shifting of the goalposts. It clearly states in one verse that the sins of the father will be repaid up to the 3rd and 4th generation, and in the next verse it states that the person who sins will pay and not their progeny.

So you choose not to read it in context and hold to your beliefs, despite obvious evidence like a hardcore fundamentalist. Nice.:

Substantiate your assertion and clarify your assertion. You've merely made the decalartion without offering any corroborating details.

Do you know more than one language by chance? Anyone that speaks two languages and works in translating understands words convey different meanings by the author to the translator.
It is why there are distinct processes of translation vs. transliteration.:

So then prove that sight and sound are mistranslations. And, again, even supposing they were, it's proof, of your own admission, that the bible is capable of being fallible. If that's the case, what are you even arguing when the debate is already over?
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)