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Morally acceptable for theist-atheist friend?

famer
Posts: 679
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5/29/2012 5:27:13 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Opinions only. Please give a reason with it. Would it be morally acceptable for an athiest to be friends with a theist? This is like talking about people being "extremely athiest" and "extremely theist" if you get what I'm trying to say...
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royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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5/29/2012 6:00:30 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Why wouldn't it be? I am Atheist, and a lot of my friends are theists. I was even in a relationship with a theist at some point . . .
Meatros
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5/29/2012 7:11:46 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 5:27:13 AM, famer wrote:
Opinions only. Please give a reason with it. Would it be morally acceptable for an athiest to be friends with a theist? This is like talking about people being "extremely athiest" and "extremely theist" if you get what I'm trying to say...

Yes, I don't see why not. Even if you take the positions as extremely antagonistic, there is more to people than just their belief on the God question.
SarcasticIndeed
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5/29/2012 7:13:23 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 5:27:13 AM, famer wrote:
Opinions only. Please give a reason with it. Would it be morally acceptable for an athiest to be friends with a theist? This is like talking about people being "extremely athiest" and "extremely theist" if you get what I'm trying to say...

Why not?
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Stephen_Hawkins
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5/29/2012 7:16:43 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 5:27:13 AM, famer wrote:
Opinions only. Please give a reason with it. Would it be morally acceptable for an athiest to be friends with a theist? This is like talking about people being "extremely athiest" and "extremely theist" if you get what I'm trying to say...

THEY CANNOT BE FRIENDS BURN THE HEATHEN DEATH TO ALL UNBELIEVERS AND MOHAMMAD SHALL KONKER THE WORLD I AM NOT TROLLING IN ANY WAY WHY ARE THE MEN IN WHITE COMING I AM NOT CRAZY ---
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Reason_Alliance
Posts: 1,283
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5/29/2012 7:44:29 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 5:27:13 AM, famer wrote:
Opinions only. Please give a reason with it. Would it be morally acceptable for an athiest to be friends with a theist? This is like talking about people being "extremely athiest" and "extremely theist" if you get what I'm trying to say...

A Christian, anyways, is morally obligated to love all persons regardless of belief content. Christ even called for us to love those who may persucute us (he certainly did). Plus the bible says that a Christian should always be prepared to give a defense for the hope that is in them, but in gentleness & respect.

So it seems to me the Christian theist is amply justified in be-friending an atheist or non-Christian.

I don't know if a muslim would be living consistently with their worldview if they befriended a non-muslim. Mormons I'm sure are consistent when they be-friend a non-mormon... etc.

An atheist can certainly be-friend a theist! I've lost count over how many atheist friends I have (good friends, some who are even morally supurior to me). So tolerance here isn't,

"we disagree with each others view so let's not talk about it"

Rather it's,

"though we disagree, I'll defend to the death your right to voice your view"

^the latter is the true definition of tolerance... not this flimsy post-modern baloney you hear all too often.
Gileandos
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5/29/2012 8:17:10 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 7:44:29 AM, Reason_Alliance wrote:
At 5/29/2012 5:27:13 AM, famer wrote:
Opinions only. Please give a reason with it. Would it be morally acceptable for an athiest to be friends with a theist? This is like talking about people being "extremely athiest" and "extremely theist" if you get what I'm trying to say...

A Christian, anyways, is morally obligated to love all persons regardless of belief content. Christ even called for us to love those who may persucute us (he certainly did). Plus the bible says that a Christian should always be prepared to give a defense for the hope that is in them, but in gentleness & respect.

So it seems to me the Christian theist is amply justified in be-friending an atheist or non-Christian.

I don't know if a muslim would be living consistently with their worldview if they befriended a non-muslim. Mormons I'm sure are consistent when they be-friend a non-mormon... etc.

An atheist can certainly be-friend a theist! I've lost count over how many atheist friends I have (good friends, some who are even morally supurior to me). So tolerance here isn't,

"we disagree with each others view so let's not talk about it"

Rather it's,

"though we disagree, I'll defend to the death your right to voice your view"

^the latter is the true definition of tolerance... not this flimsy post-modern baloney you hear all too often.

I second this opinion, but would add one element. When Christians separate it is due to the teaching by Paul that there is one person we are called NOT to associate with...

1st Cor ch 5
11 But now I write to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of [Christian] brother if he is known to be guilty of immorality or greed, or is an idolater [whose soul is devoted to any object that usurps the place of God], or is a person with a foul tongue [railing, abusing, reviling, slandering], or is a drunkard or a swindler or a robber. [No] you must not so much as eat with such a person.
drafterman
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5/29/2012 8:37:37 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
It certainly depends on which verse of the Bible you're reading:

Romans 16:17 - Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

2 Corinthians 6:14 - Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

2 Thessalonians 3:6 - Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.

2 Thessalonians 3:14 - And if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed.

2 Timothy 2:16 - But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.

There is also Gil's verse, which certainly identifies more than 1 person or class of people.

Now, those are verses (especially 2 Corinthians) that are explicit in not associating or befriending non-Christians. There are plenty more which merely portray us in a negative light (foolish, vain, liars, unlcean, condemned, etc.). So, even if you ignore the verses that explicitly tell Christians to shun us, you have to wonder what kind of friendship could form based upon the foundation that we are, basically, scum deserving of eternal hellfire. Only by ignoring vast sections of the Bible can Christians knowingly be friends with atheists.
OberHerr
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5/29/2012 8:42:09 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 8:37:37 AM, drafterman wrote:
It certainly depends on which verse of the Bible you're reading:

Romans 16:17 - Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

2 Corinthians 6:14 - Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?


I think it means don't get married to them. Which mainly applied to that fact that in the past, when the Jews married with people like the Canaanites, they turned away from God. Same basic concept.

2 Thessalonians 3:6 - Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.

2 Thessalonians 3:14 - And if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed.

2 Timothy 2:16 - But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.

There is also Gil's verse, which certainly identifies more than 1 person or class of people.

Now, those are verses (especially 2 Corinthians) that are explicit in not associating or befriending non-Christians. There are plenty more which merely portray us in a negative light (foolish, vain, liars, unclean, condemned, etc.). So, even if you ignore the verses that explicitly tell Christians to shun us, you have to wonder what kind of friendship could form based upon the foundation that we are, basically, scum deserving of eternal hellfire. Only by ignoring vast sections of the Bible can Christians knowingly be friends with atheists.

I believe Jesus also said that the greatest commandment was to love your neighbor, and the lord your God with all your heart soul and mind......or something along those lines.

So......I think your misinterpreting those verses.
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drafterman
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5/29/2012 8:44:00 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 8:42:09 AM, OberHerr wrote:
At 5/29/2012 8:37:37 AM, drafterman wrote:
It certainly depends on which verse of the Bible you're reading:

Romans 16:17 - Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

2 Corinthians 6:14 - Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?


I think it means don't get married to them. Which mainly applied to that fact that in the past, when the Jews married with people like the Canaanites, they turned away from God. Same basic concept.

2 Thessalonians 3:6 - Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.

2 Thessalonians 3:14 - And if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed.

2 Timothy 2:16 - But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.

There is also Gil's verse, which certainly identifies more than 1 person or class of people.

Now, those are verses (especially 2 Corinthians) that are explicit in not associating or befriending non-Christians. There are plenty more which merely portray us in a negative light (foolish, vain, liars, unclean, condemned, etc.). So, even if you ignore the verses that explicitly tell Christians to shun us, you have to wonder what kind of friendship could form based upon the foundation that we are, basically, scum deserving of eternal hellfire. Only by ignoring vast sections of the Bible can Christians knowingly be friends with atheists.

I believe Jesus also said that the greatest commandment was to love your neighbor, and the lord your God with all your heart soul and mind......or something along those lines.

So......I think your misinterpreting those verses.

Then, please provide the appropriate interpretations.
OberHerr
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5/29/2012 8:47:34 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
@DM

I think a lot of your verses talk about how we shouldn't allow people to lead us astray and stuff like that.

They don't say we can't be friends, just that we shouldn't allow them to influence us in a bad way.

Sorta like how you don't hang out with people that could be a bad influence on you.
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drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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5/29/2012 8:53:16 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 8:47:34 AM, OberHerr wrote:
@DM

I think a lot of your verses talk about how we shouldn't allow people to lead us astray and stuff like that.

They don't say we can't be friends, just that we shouldn't allow them to influence us in a bad way.

Sorta like how you don't hang out with people that could be a bad influence on you.

Yeah, exactly. I don't hang out with, and am not friends with, people that could be a bad influence on me.

So... I'm failing to see where I went wrong with the interpretation here.
OberHerr
Posts: 13,062
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5/29/2012 8:54:41 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 8:53:16 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 5/29/2012 8:47:34 AM, OberHerr wrote:
@DM

I think a lot of your verses talk about how we shouldn't allow people to lead us astray and stuff like that.

They don't say we can't be friends, just that we shouldn't allow them to influence us in a bad way.

Sorta like how you don't hang out with people that could be a bad influence on you.

Yeah, exactly. I don't hang out with, and am not friends with, people that could be a bad influence on me.

So... I'm failing to see where I went wrong with the interpretation here.

It's saying that you can hang out with them, but don't let them be a influence in your life. Don't let them lead you astray.
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drafterman
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5/29/2012 8:56:44 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 8:54:41 AM, OberHerr wrote:
At 5/29/2012 8:53:16 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 5/29/2012 8:47:34 AM, OberHerr wrote:
@DM

I think a lot of your verses talk about how we shouldn't allow people to lead us astray and stuff like that.

They don't say we can't be friends, just that we shouldn't allow them to influence us in a bad way.

Sorta like how you don't hang out with people that could be a bad influence on you.

Yeah, exactly. I don't hang out with, and am not friends with, people that could be a bad influence on me.

So... I'm failing to see where I went wrong with the interpretation here.

It's saying that you can hang out with them, but don't let them be a influence in your life. Don't let them lead you astray.

Your friends don't influence your life?
OberHerr
Posts: 13,062
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5/29/2012 8:57:31 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 8:56:44 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 5/29/2012 8:54:41 AM, OberHerr wrote:
At 5/29/2012 8:53:16 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 5/29/2012 8:47:34 AM, OberHerr wrote:
@DM

I think a lot of your verses talk about how we shouldn't allow people to lead us astray and stuff like that.

They don't say we can't be friends, just that we shouldn't allow them to influence us in a bad way.

Sorta like how you don't hang out with people that could be a bad influence on you.

Yeah, exactly. I don't hang out with, and am not friends with, people that could be a bad influence on me.

So... I'm failing to see where I went wrong with the interpretation here.

It's saying that you can hang out with them, but don't let them be a influence in your life. Don't let them lead you astray.

Your friends don't influence your life?

Not always. Depends on how good friends they are.

And, the real question is, do they influence my life in a good way, or a bad way?
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drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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5/29/2012 9:01:22 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 8:57:31 AM, OberHerr wrote:
At 5/29/2012 8:56:44 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 5/29/2012 8:54:41 AM, OberHerr wrote:
At 5/29/2012 8:53:16 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 5/29/2012 8:47:34 AM, OberHerr wrote:
@DM

I think a lot of your verses talk about how we shouldn't allow people to lead us astray and stuff like that.

They don't say we can't be friends, just that we shouldn't allow them to influence us in a bad way.

Sorta like how you don't hang out with people that could be a bad influence on you.

Yeah, exactly. I don't hang out with, and am not friends with, people that could be a bad influence on me.

So... I'm failing to see where I went wrong with the interpretation here.

It's saying that you can hang out with them, but don't let them be a influence in your life. Don't let them lead you astray.

Your friends don't influence your life?

Not always. Depends on how good friends they are.

And, the real question is, do they influence my life in a good way, or a bad way?

No, the real question is where all this extra stuff comes from. The verses are simple and explicit: avoid us, shun us, withdraw from us.

Not, have company with us, but don't let us influence you.

What is the justification for your interpretation?
Reason_Alliance
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5/29/2012 1:30:56 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Giliandos & drafterman have a point. But it more or less involves an ongoing sort of hanging out & being apart of eachother's life sort of adventure together rather than being kind towards people of opposite beliefs.

Yes the Christian is called to not associate with people who are living immoral lives, why? Obviously to avoid unecessary temptation.

Now I'm living perfectly consistent as a Christian by befriending my atheist friends, since the bulk of our discussions is centered around our open beliefs. Not how we should live immorally, etc.
twocupcakes
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5/29/2012 5:08:04 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
If "belief" is required to get into heaven, and you best friend or family member is an atheist, is it not unfair that you won't get to see your best friend in heaven? This seems unfair to the person with "belief" also. They won't get to ever get to see their friend/family again. Heaven can't be perfect for someone if their best friend family cannot get in, can it? Also, knowing your best friend/family is in hell would be hell for some people, right?
1dustpelt
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5/29/2012 5:35:21 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Of course! Why not?
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DetectableNinja
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5/29/2012 5:36:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 6:00:30 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
Why wouldn't it be? I am Atheist, and a lot of my friends are theists. I was even in a relationship with a theist at some point . . .

I can't believe you fraternized with the enemy! Traitor!

No, but seriously. RP is correct.
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

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johnnyboy54
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5/29/2012 6:26:57 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 5:36:49 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 5/29/2012 6:00:30 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
Why wouldn't it be? I am Atheist, and a lot of my friends are theists. I was even in a relationship with a theist at some point . . .

I can't believe you fraternized with the enemy! Traitor!

I didn't realize we were enemies :(

No, but seriously. RP is correct.
I didn't order assholes with my whiskey.
Paradox_7
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5/29/2012 7:36:26 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 8:37:37 AM, drafterman wrote:
It certainly depends on which verse of the Bible you're reading:

Romans 16:17 - Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

Do not listen to anything but sound doctorine- he's warning them of the false teachers.

2 Corinthians 6:14 - Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

Marriage, not friendship.

2 Thessalonians 3:6 - Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.

the term "brother" lets us know that he is talking about Christians, and not to follow the weaker brother, but shun him so that they will realize that they are wrong and repent.

2 Thessalonians 3:14 - And if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed.

Above^^

2 Timothy 2:16 - But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.

?? this is saying not to quarrel with anyone, and to refrain from trying to teach with corse words. (i should take this advice..)

There is also Gil's verse, which certainly identifies more than 1 person or class of people.

Now, those are verses (especially 2 Corinthians) that are explicit in not associating or befriending non-Christians. There are plenty more which merely portray us in a negative light (foolish, vain, liars, unlcean, condemned, etc.). So, even if you ignore the verses that explicitly tell Christians to shun us, you have to wonder what kind of friendship could form based upon the foundation that we are, basically, scum deserving of eternal hellfire. Only by ignoring vast sections of the Bible can Christians knowingly be friends with atheists.


They said shun the "brother". If you are not in Christ, you are not our brother.. so we don't expect you to understand or agree, we expect you to be- well you! lol
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: Don't be. The Catholic Church is ran by Darth Sidius for fvck sake. As far as I'm concerned, you're a bona fide member of the Sith.
popculturepooka
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5/29/2012 7:40:36 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I think my friends are probably evenly split between Christians/theists and atheists/agnostics.
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Oryus
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5/29/2012 7:41:32 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
One of my best friends is the most Christian person I know. I don't get what the OP is getting at.
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ScottyDouglas
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5/29/2012 7:41:40 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 5:27:13 AM, famer wrote:
Opinions only. Please give a reason with it. Would it be morally acceptable for an athiest to be friends with a theist? This is like talking about people being "extremely athiest" and "extremely theist" if you get what I'm trying to say...

I love my brothers and sisters in Christ. But I prefer the lost to be around. How can I lead a already christain to the Lord, which my goal, you can not. How can you winess for God without being amoungst the lost?
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