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Science shouldn't really be believed. . .

gr33k_fr33k5
Posts: 321
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6/3/2012 1:23:34 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
I say this because science is simply the refining of incorrect ideas in the attempt at reaching the truth.

As an example I will use spontaneous generation, a scientific law believed for hundreds of years. Only to be proven entirely wrong.

To believe science is to ignore the fact that it is only our "best" guess, is this any better to place faith in than the flying spaghetti monster?
I am free, free indeed!

ignorance is bliss
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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6/3/2012 12:40:54 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 1:23:34 AM, gr33k_fr33k5 wrote:
I say this because science is simply the refining of incorrect ideas in the attempt at reaching the truth.

As an example I will use spontaneous generation, a scientific law believed for hundreds of years. Only to be proven entirely wrong.

To believe science is to ignore the fact that it is only our "best" guess, is this any better to place faith in than the flying spaghetti monster?

I believe science precisely because it is our best guess. By virtue of it bung the best, there is no better alternative.

I dare you to refute me without relying on science in any way shape or form. I look forward to your hand delivered stone tablet containing your rebuttal.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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6/3/2012 12:41:38 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 12:40:54 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/3/2012 1:23:34 AM, gr33k_fr33k5 wrote:
I say this because science is simply the refining of incorrect ideas in the attempt at reaching the truth.

As an example I will use spontaneous generation, a scientific law believed for hundreds of years. Only to be proven entirely wrong.

To believe science is to ignore the fact that it is only our "best" guess, is this any better to place faith in than the flying spaghetti monster?

I believe science precisely because it is our best guess. By virtue of being the best, there is no better alternative.

I dare you to refute me without relying on science in any way shape or form. I look forward to your hand delivered stone tablet containing your rebuttal.
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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6/3/2012 12:55:39 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 1:23:34 AM, gr33k_fr33k5 wrote:
I say this because science is simply the refining of incorrect ideas in the attempt at reaching the truth.

As an example I will use spontaneous generation, a scientific law believed for hundreds of years. Only to be proven entirely wrong.

To believe science is to ignore the fact that it is only our "best" guess, is this any better to place faith in than the flying spaghetti monster?

I believe you are spot on here.
I will draw the entire distinction of the definition of science as you will have every atheist pointing to computers to yell at you.

The science of atheisms is - Science being interpretive and speculative 'educational' guesses. This is called qualitative assessments in philosophy of science. Can be valid but is by no means dogmatic.

This is different than the quantitative science. That is science that is computational. For example, the exact oxygen PPM range of a pond to determine if fish live or die due to asphyxiation. Such science is dogmatic and variables may interact, change and expand the PPM of Oxygen is computational and static.
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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6/3/2012 12:57:59 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 12:41:38 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/3/2012 12:40:54 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/3/2012 1:23:34 AM, gr33k_fr33k5 wrote:
I say this because science is simply the refining of incorrect ideas in the attempt at reaching the truth.

As an example I will use spontaneous generation, a scientific law believed for hundreds of years. Only to be proven entirely wrong.

To believe science is to ignore the fact that it is only our "best" guess, is this any better to place faith in than the flying spaghetti monster?

I believe science precisely because it is our best guess. By virtue of being the best, there is no better alternative.

I dare you to refute me without relying on science in any way shape or form. I look forward to your hand delivered stone tablet containing your rebuttal.

I just clarified what you did in my response to Greek. Qualitative vs. quantitative.

We deny the qualitative assessment of scholarship concerning global warming's cause and level of concern we should have due to limited data range.
We do not argue about the computational assessment of temperature change, on short scale.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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6/3/2012 12:59:11 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 12:57:59 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 6/3/2012 12:41:38 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/3/2012 12:40:54 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/3/2012 1:23:34 AM, gr33k_fr33k5 wrote:
I say this because science is simply the refining of incorrect ideas in the attempt at reaching the truth.

As an example I will use spontaneous generation, a scientific law believed for hundreds of years. Only to be proven entirely wrong.

To believe science is to ignore the fact that it is only our "best" guess, is this any better to place faith in than the flying spaghetti monster?

I believe science precisely because it is our best guess. By virtue of being the best, there is no better alternative.

I dare you to refute me without relying on science in any way shape or form. I look forward to your hand delivered stone tablet containing your rebuttal.

I just clarified what you did in my response to Greek. Qualitative vs. quantitative.

We deny the qualitative assessment of scholarship concerning global warming's cause and level of concern we should have due to limited data range.
We do not argue about the computational assessment of temperature change, on short scale.

He made no such distinction.
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/3/2012 1:06:08 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
We rely on the law. We rely in the court systems in our land, do we not? If we did not innocent are not safe and recieve justice. I f not then the gulity roam free and not recieve justice. By the law the land which is determined in a court of law by jurors. With all the evidence that theist can provide. A JURY WOULD DETERMINE THAT GOD-YHWH-JESUS CHRIST EXIST.
TheAsylum
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/3/2012 1:12:08 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
The court of Law of logical! We see there is awlays something higher in the food-power chain, makes logical sense that would be for humans too.
TheAsylum
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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6/3/2012 1:13:46 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
science isn't a belief...
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
MouthWash
Posts: 2,607
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6/3/2012 1:15:19 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Creationists...
"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/3/2012 1:17:07 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 1:13:46 PM, 000ike wrote:
science isn't a belief
It most certainly is. Science takes beliefs and proves or disporves them. It start as a belief.
TheAsylum
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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6/3/2012 1:17:59 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 1:23:34 AM, gr33k_fr33k5 wrote:
I say this because science is simply the refining of incorrect ideas in the attempt at reaching the truth.

As an example I will use spontaneous generation, a scientific law believed for hundreds of years. Only to be proven entirely wrong.

To believe science is to ignore the fact that it is only our "best" guess, is this any better to place faith in than the flying spaghetti monster?

This is ridiculous. Who do you think disproved spontaneous generation? Scientists not ministers.

Science is objective. It will correct and amend its own theories. Science is not a belief,...it is a compilation of empirical facts built upon mathematical foundations (math, being objective).

If science is your enemy, then truth is your enemy.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
twocupcakes
Posts: 2,749
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6/3/2012 1:18:01 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 1:23:34 AM, gr33k_fr33k5 wrote:

To believe science is to ignore the fact that it is only our "best" guess

Yes, nailed it! Science is the "best" guess. That is why it should be believed. Any other guess/belief would not be the best. Science it the best guess, that is why it is the best to believe. Science provides a better "guess" than religion because science is the best "guess".
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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6/3/2012 1:20:20 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
While you're waging war against science, you might as well wage war with math too! (they're one and the same, ultimately)...maybe to you 1+1 is not 2.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/3/2012 1:21:08 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 1:18:01 PM, twocupcakes wrote:
At 6/3/2012 1:23:34 AM, gr33k_fr33k5 wrote:

To believe science is to ignore the fact that it is only our "best" guess

Yes, nailed it! Science is the "best" guess. That is why it should be believed. Any other guess/belief would not be the best. Science it the best guess, that is why it is the best to believe. Science provides a better "guess" than religion because science is the best "guess".

Who says science is the best guess? Scientist? Science mite not be the best guess.
TheAsylum
MouthWash
Posts: 2,607
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6/3/2012 1:22:41 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 1:17:07 PM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 6/3/2012 1:13:46 PM, 000ike wrote:
science isn't a belief
It most certainly is. Science takes beliefs and proves or disporves them. It start as a belief.

Science is a systematic enterprise that builds and organizes knowledge in the form of testable explanations and predictions about the universe. [http://en.wikipedia.org...]
"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/3/2012 1:22:50 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 1:20:20 PM, 000ike wrote:
While you're waging war against science, you might as well wage war with math too! (they're one and the same, ultimately)...maybe to you 1+1 is not 2.

No you are mistaken. Math is beyond science. Math is never wrong. It starts out correct and ends correct. Science does not.
TheAsylum
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/3/2012 1:24:08 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 1:22:41 PM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/3/2012 1:17:07 PM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 6/3/2012 1:13:46 PM, 000ike wrote:
science isn't a belief
It most certainly is. Science takes beliefs and proves or disporves them. It start as a belief.

Science is a systematic enterprise that builds and organizes knowledge in the form of testable explanations and predictions about the universe. [http://en.wikipedia.org...]

^That differs from what I said, How?
TheAsylum
MouthWash
Posts: 2,607
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6/3/2012 1:24:45 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 1:22:50 PM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 6/3/2012 1:20:20 PM, 000ike wrote:
While you're waging war against science, you might as well wage war with math too! (they're one and the same, ultimately)...maybe to you 1+1 is not 2.

No you are mistaken. Math is beyond science. Math is never wrong. It starts out correct and ends correct. Science does not.

Science is about finding and testing conclusions. If it's wrong, it's only because of the people utilizing it. Math is the same way.
"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/3/2012 1:28:11 PM
Posted: 4 years ago

Science is about finding and testing conclusions. If it's wrong, it's only because of the people utilizing it. Math is the same way.

No math is right regardless if you are or not. It never changes. Science relies on man to determine and label it. Math does not. Science is a man made product. Math is universal. Math does not need science but science nneds math. Science can determine things wrong and it never be proven but math can be calculated and never be wrong. Your logic is missing here.
TheAsylum
twocupcakes
Posts: 2,749
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6/3/2012 1:34:30 PM
Posted: 4 years ago

Who says science is the best guess? Scientist? Science mite not be the best guess.

OP says science is the best guess. So, does almost everyone else, even very religious people. What is a better guess than science?
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/3/2012 1:38:15 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 1:34:30 PM, twocupcakes wrote:

Who says science is the best guess? Scientist? Science mite not be the best guess.

OP says science is the best guess. So, does almost everyone else, even very religious people. What is a better guess than science?

There is no better guess. You right there. But The Bible and Jesus Christ is the truth and therefore the best reason.
TheAsylum
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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6/3/2012 1:42:23 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 12:59:11 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/3/2012 12:57:59 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 6/3/2012 12:41:38 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/3/2012 12:40:54 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/3/2012 1:23:34 AM, gr33k_fr33k5 wrote:
I say this because science is simply the refining of incorrect ideas in the attempt at reaching the truth.

As an example I will use spontaneous generation, a scientific law believed for hundreds of years. Only to be proven entirely wrong.

To believe science is to ignore the fact that it is only our "best" guess, is this any better to place faith in than the flying spaghetti monster?

I believe science precisely because it is our best guess. By virtue of being the best, there is no better alternative.

I dare you to refute me without relying on science in any way shape or form. I look forward to your hand delivered stone tablet containing your rebuttal.

I just clarified what you did in my response to Greek. Qualitative vs. quantitative.

We deny the qualitative assessment of scholarship concerning global warming's cause and level of concern we should have due to limited data range.
We do not argue about the computational assessment of temperature change, on short scale.

He made no such distinction.

I was making the distinction in the post he intended. Atheist on this website do not read for author's intent. His intent is obvious and he is not denying quantitative science based upon 2+2=4.

I was preempting the ranting atheists for him.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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6/3/2012 1:43:51 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 1:42:23 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 6/3/2012 12:59:11 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/3/2012 12:57:59 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 6/3/2012 12:41:38 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/3/2012 12:40:54 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/3/2012 1:23:34 AM, gr33k_fr33k5 wrote:
I say this because science is simply the refining of incorrect ideas in the attempt at reaching the truth.

As an example I will use spontaneous generation, a scientific law believed for hundreds of years. Only to be proven entirely wrong.

To believe science is to ignore the fact that it is only our "best" guess, is this any better to place faith in than the flying spaghetti monster?

I believe science precisely because it is our best guess. By virtue of being the best, there is no better alternative.

I dare you to refute me without relying on science in any way shape or form. I look forward to your hand delivered stone tablet containing your rebuttal.

I just clarified what you did in my response to Greek. Qualitative vs. quantitative.

We deny the qualitative assessment of scholarship concerning global warming's cause and level of concern we should have due to limited data range.
We do not argue about the computational assessment of temperature change, on short scale.

He made no such distinction.

I was making the distinction in the post he intended. Atheist on this website do not read for author's intent. His intent is obvious and he is not denying quantitative science based upon 2+2=4.

I was preempting the ranting atheists for him.

Until such a time he makes his intentions explicit such that my response no longer applies, it stands.
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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6/3/2012 1:48:11 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 1:23:34 AM, gr33k_fr33k5 wrote:
I say this because science is simply the refining of incorrect ideas in the attempt at reaching the truth.

As an example I will use spontaneous generation, a scientific law believed for hundreds of years. Only to be proven entirely wrong.

To believe science is to ignore the fact that it is only our "best" guess, is this any better to place faith in than the flying spaghetti monster?

Ya science just "guessed" how to make my TV work, wow, they must have really gotten lucky! Some people...
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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6/3/2012 1:55:18 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 1:22:50 PM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 6/3/2012 1:20:20 PM, 000ike wrote:
While you're waging war against science, you might as well wage war with math too! (they're one and the same, ultimately)...maybe to you 1+1 is not 2.

No you are mistaken. Math is beyond science. Math is never wrong. It starts out correct and ends correct. Science does not.

are you serious? What's physics? Tell me how we just happen to guess how to make computers work? Are we really just that lucky that we stumbled upon an airplane one day and can replicate it. Maybe all I learned in Chemistry are lucky guesses, and acids and bases form a salt and water because God said so.

MATH is where science derive ALL of this. Pure MATH. Physics IS math. Your comment is a false dichotomy if I've ever seen one.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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6/3/2012 2:01:09 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 1:13:46 PM, 000ike wrote:
science isn't a belief...

We're emotional creatures aren't we? Why should we believe in science anyways?
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: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
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000ike
Posts: 11,196
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6/3/2012 2:03:43 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/3/2012 2:01:09 PM, socialpinko wrote:
At 6/3/2012 1:13:46 PM, 000ike wrote:
science isn't a belief...

We're emotional creatures aren't we? Why should we believe in science anyways?

Well, the presupposition here is that we value truth. If you don't value the truth about life, then you have no reason to agree with science. I really don't think there's such a thing as should or ought without a desired outcome.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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6/3/2012 2:10:07 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
@Drafterman,

See
At 6/3/2012 1:48:11 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 6/3/2012 1:23:34 AM, gr33k_fr33k5 wrote:
I say this because science is simply the refining of incorrect ideas in the attempt at reaching the truth.

As an example I will use spontaneous generation, a scientific law believed for hundreds of years. Only to be proven entirely wrong.

To believe science is to ignore the fact that it is only our "best" guess, is this any better to place faith in than the flying spaghetti monster?

Ya science just "guessed" how to make my TV work, wow, they must have really gotten lucky! Some people...

Get my point? Do you actually think this was the implicit intention of Greek? I was preempting yours and rational thinkers dissonant responses.

Please read for author's intent.