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resolutionsmasher
Posts: 579
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8/18/2009 11:37:35 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
I've just about had it with all the crap getting thrown around concerning God. Those christians on this site who spend 24 hours a day here trying to force religion down the throats of those who don't want it need to realize this: You are getting no where. This is true for several reasons. 1. The people here are just as obstinate as you. You will not convince them and they will not convince you. 2. No one is willing to listen to someone who attacks them concerning their beliefs at every opportunity. 3. Evengelism is not the purpose of this site. While I do believe in taking every opportunity you can get I also believe that attempting to change the purpose of this site to do so is insanely austentatios.

I am a Christian. I believe in leading people to Christ. I also believe in keeping a Christian attitude while doing it. Rage and anger is not a christian attitude. If a person on this site is willing I will share my religion with them. But I will not waste my time in a fruitless endevors such as this. I encourage you to do the same. Try evangelism in your own community, face to face with those you know. Then move outward from there.

To non-christian debaters. Please excuse the behavior of our colleages. This is, and I must insist, not the approved behavior of a bible believing christian. I must also ask you to not entertain them in an effort to lead them to more.... fruitfull time usages.

Thank you.

P.S. - see my sig for my personal beliefs.
In the relationship between Obama and the rest of the U.S..... I think the U.S. is getting the short end of the hockey stick.
resolutionsmasher
Posts: 579
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8/18/2009 12:02:26 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
I'm not. You guys don't shove throats. You just defend yourselves and your convictions.
In the relationship between Obama and the rest of the U.S..... I think the U.S. is getting the short end of the hockey stick.
ToastOfDestiny
Posts: 990
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8/18/2009 1:22:19 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
I respect you guys + InquireTruth. You present novel arguments that aren't so logically flawed that my younger brother could dispose of them.
At 10/11/2009 8:28:18 PM, banker wrote:
Our demise and industrial destruction
At 10/11/2009 10:00:21 PM, regebro wrote:
Only exists in your head, as already shown.

At 10/11/2009 8:28:18 PM, banker wrote:
reveal why you answer with a question mark
At 10/11/2009 10:00:21 PM, regebro wrote:
Because it was a question.

RFDs Pl0x:
http://www.debate.org...
Kleptin
Posts: 5,095
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8/18/2009 1:24:28 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
If possible, could you *real* Christians try to recruit more intelligent people such as yourselves so we can repopulate this forum with people who actually know what they are talking about? That might be the best way to drown out the evangelical noise. Everyone's looking for a nice exchange but as of now, most disagreement is provided by these two trolls. People want disagreement, but it doesn't help if the majority of theist posts are grammatical nightmares or bible quotes.
: At 5/2/2010 2:43:54 PM, innomen wrote:
It isn't about finding a theory, philosophy or doctrine and thinking it's the answer, but a practical application of one's experiences that is the answer.

: At 10/28/2010 2:40:07 PM, jharry wrote: I have already been given the greatest Gift that anyone could ever hope for [Life], I would consider myself selfish if I expected anything more.
tkubok
Posts: 5,044
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8/18/2009 1:47:45 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/18/2009 1:24:28 PM, Kleptin wrote:
If possible, could you *real* Christians try to recruit more intelligent people such as yourselves so we can repopulate this forum with people who actually know what they are talking about? That might be the best way to drown out the evangelical noise. Everyone's looking for a nice exchange but as of now, most disagreement is provided by these two trolls. People want disagreement, but it doesn't help if the majority of theist posts are grammatical nightmares or bible quotes.

Wont help. It isnt the number of people, but rather, the number of posts that are ruining this for the rest of the christians. And, as we all know, it only takes one christian to postbomb the forums.
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
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8/18/2009 1:52:10 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
I don't know too many rationalist monotheists.

I know a few good agnostics that I could recruit for DDO, but no other theists.
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
Tin_Man
Posts: 45
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8/20/2009 7:43:45 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
Let me get this straight...

You're having a difficult time with the fact that, while you're on a religious section of this forum, and the forum's sole purpose being to facilitate the argumentation of religion, that there will be people here who feel strongly enough about their personal beliefs to argue about it?

I've always found the concept of "forcing religion down someone's throat" on a message board to be humorous. Honestly, the very metaphor implies that you have no ability to stop something being forced down your throat, considering that it's being forced. Here, you can stop the "forcing" at any time with a single mouse click, or even take the drastic measure of a preventative "non-click" (as we say in the agency) which prevents any unfortunate "forcing" of information to you.

In other words, if you want to play in the sandbox, grow a thicker skin...
DATCMOTO
Posts: 6,160
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8/21/2009 8:01:50 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/18/2009 11:37:35 AM, resolutionsmasher wrote:
I've just about had it with all the crap getting thrown around concerning God. Those christians on this site who spend 24 hours a day here trying to force religion down the throats of those who don't want it need to realize this: You are getting no where. This is true for several reasons. 1. The people here are just as obstinate as you. You will not convince them and they will not convince you. 2. No one is willing to listen to someone who attacks them concerning their beliefs at every opportunity. 3. Evengelism is not the purpose of this site. While I do believe in taking every opportunity you can get I also believe that attempting to change the purpose of this site to do so is insanely austentatios.

I am a Christian. I believe in leading people to Christ. I also believe in keeping a Christian attitude while doing it. Rage and anger is not a christian attitude. If a person on this site is willing I will share my religion with them. But I will not waste my time in a fruitless endevors such as this. I encourage you to do the same. Try evangelism in your own community, face to face with those you know. Then move outward from there.

To non-christian debaters. Please excuse the behavior of our colleages. This is, and I must insist, not the approved behavior of a bible believing christian. I must also ask you to not entertain them in an effort to lead them to more.... fruitfull time usages.

Thank you.

P.S. - see my sig for my personal beliefs.

We might take advice from you IF

(1) you could control your mouth: James3:2/Ephesians5:3-4/Matt12:36/psalm19:14 etc etc
(2) you were'nt JUST as worldly as the atheists on this site: 1peter1:15/james4:4/psalm101:3
(3) YOU were being persecuted for the faith: 2tim3:12

Matthew10:34
Do NOT think I came to bring peace on Earth. I came not to bring peace BUT A SWORD.

1Corinthians5:12
For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside?


You stick to your violent movies and fantasy video games etc and we'll stick to the nasty old task of defending the Gospel.

Toodle pip.
The Cross.. the Cross.
resolutionsmasher
Posts: 579
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8/21/2009 2:46:32 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/21/2009 8:01:50 AM, DATCMOTO wrote:
We might take advice from you IF
(1) you could control your mouth: James3:2/Ephesians5:3-4/Matt12:36/psalm19:14 etc etc
(2) you were'nt JUST as worldly as the atheists on this site: 1peter1:15/james4:4/psalm101:3
(3) YOU were being persecuted for the faith: 2tim3:12
Matthew10:34
Do NOT think I came to bring peace on Earth. I came not to bring peace BUT A SWORD.
1Corinthians5:12
For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside?

You stick to your violent movies and fantasy video games etc and we'll stick to the nasty old task of defending the Gospel.

First of all, it is of the general opinion that YOU, not I, have mouth control problems. I exercise a decent amount of control by continually fighting for the Christian convictions that I believe in without losing my cool and without attacking others personally. This is something you have failed to uphold.
Second, you have no right to declare me worldly or not, because you have not met me personally nor are you stocking me (if you are that immediately dissolves you of all previously earned respect).
Third, well..., any intelligent person can refute that statement with ease.

I do not make peace with evil. I simply make war in a very respectable manner.

I do not play violent video games or watch movies. I go to a Bible College, and am not given such opportunities.
In the relationship between Obama and the rest of the U.S..... I think the U.S. is getting the short end of the hockey stick.
DATCMOTO
Posts: 6,160
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8/24/2009 8:49:06 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/21/2009 2:46:32 PM, resolutionsmasher wrote:
At 8/21/2009 8:01:50 AM, DATCMOTO wrote:
We might take advice from you IF
(1) you could control your mouth: James3:2/Ephesians5:3-4/Matt12:36/psalm19:14 etc etc
(2) you were'nt JUST as worldly as the atheists on this site: 1peter1:15/james4:4/psalm101:3
(3) YOU were being persecuted for the faith: 2tim3:12
Matthew10:34
Do NOT think I came to bring peace on Earth. I came not to bring peace BUT A SWORD.
1Corinthians5:12
For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside?

You stick to your violent movies and fantasy video games etc and we'll stick to the nasty old task of defending the Gospel.

First of all, it is of the general opinion that YOU, not I, have mouth control problems. I exercise a decent amount of control by continually fighting for the Christian convictions that I believe in without losing my cool and without attacking others personally. This is something you have failed to uphold.
Second, you have no right to declare me worldly or not, because you have not met me personally nor are you stocking me (if you are that immediately dissolves you of all previously earned respect).
Third, well..., any intelligent person can refute that statement with ease.

Then do not curse or swear.
I do not lose my cool, perhaps you are 'reading' what isn't there?

I do not make peace with evil. I simply make war in a very respectable manner.

Mmm.. I bet satan's REAL scared..

I do not play violent video games or watch movies. I go to a Bible College, and am not given such opportunities.

Your profile STATES your favorite movies and video games: you, like the VAST majority of Christians are worldly: this is why you are impotent.
The Cross.. the Cross.
JSmith
Posts: 3
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8/25/2009 6:51:51 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
I joined this site because someone gave me a link to this topic, thus I feel like I should respond.

DATCMoto, you seem to have taken up something that a lot of christians do, and that is vastly misquoting a scripture out of context to format it around the message you want it to say. You did that with the Matthew and 1 Corinthians reference.

The Matthew reference talks about how Jesus and his impact would upset everything. People would be turned against each other because of one following him and another not. Sounds a lot like the persecuted early church. Furthermore, when did Jesus, outside of overthrowing the temple, come with a sword? The message of his ministry, the life of his ministry, and the core of who he was is love. To take any sort of message and saying it without love is without Christ and not any sort of example you should set.

The 1 Corinthians reference is also as ludicrously misquoted as the Matthew reference. It talks about how you shouldn't judge anyone that is not a Christian but if you are a Christian you have every right to take a brother aside and say hey, this isn't right. Isn't that what the original poster was trying to do?

Also, I want to state that I'm a Christian at a Christian University and I play Call of Duty. In addition, I watch violent movies. As a student of communication, I take things I can learn from both and analyze them far more than the average person would do because that's what I've been trained to do. These things only effect you as much as you let them effect you.
Bible8910
Posts: 17
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8/25/2009 7:28:43 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/18/2009 11:37:35 AM, resolutionsmasher wrote:
I've just about had it with all the crap getting thrown around concerning God. Those Christian's on this site who spend 24 hours a day here trying to force religion down the throats of those who don't want it need to realize this: You are getting no where. This is true for several reasons. 1. The people here are just as obstinate as you. You will not convince them and they will not convince you. 2. No one is willing to listen to someone who attacks them concerning their beliefs at every opportunity. 3. Evengelism is not the purpose of this site. While I do believe in taking every opportunity you can get I also believe that attempting to change the purpose of this site to do so is insanely austentatios.

I am a Christian. I believe in leading people to Christ. I also believe in keeping a Christian attitude while doing it. Rage and anger is not a christian attitude. If a person on this site is willing I will share my religion with them. But I will not waste my time in a fruitless endevors such as this. I encourage you to do the same. Try evangelism in your own community, face to face with those you know. Then move outward from there.

To non-christian debaters. Please excuse the behavior of our colleages. This is, and I must insist, not the approved behavior of a bible believing christian. I must also ask you to not entertain them in an effort to lead them to more.... fruitfull time usages.

Thank you.

P.S. - see my sig for my personal beliefs.

I'm a Christian also,and I believe that we should give out Gods word to those who are not,then let God do the work in the heart of the person. One thing let's not forget that all those that say they are Christian are not. Bible study is great for Christians.
I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
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8/25/2009 7:48:58 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/25/2009 7:28:43 AM, Bible8910 wrote:
At 8/18/2009 11:37:35 AM, resolutionsmasher wrote:
I've just about had it with all the crap getting thrown around concerning God. Those Christian's on this site who spend 24 hours a day here trying to force religion down the throats of those who don't want it need to realize this: You are getting no where. This is true for several reasons. 1. The people here are just as obstinate as you. You will not convince them and they will not convince you. 2. No one is willing to listen to someone who attacks them concerning their beliefs at every opportunity. 3. Evengelism is not the purpose of this site. While I do believe in taking every opportunity you can get I also believe that attempting to change the purpose of this site to do so is insanely austentatios.

I am a Christian. I believe in leading people to Christ. I also believe in keeping a Christian attitude while doing it. Rage and anger is not a christian attitude. If a person on this site is willing I will share my religion with them. But I will not waste my time in a fruitless endevors such as this. I encourage you to do the same. Try evangelism in your own community, face to face with those you know. Then move outward from there.

To non-christian debaters. Please excuse the behavior of our colleages. This is, and I must insist, not the approved behavior of a bible believing christian. I must also ask you to not entertain them in an effort to lead them to more.... fruitfull time usages.

Thank you.

P.S. - see my sig for my personal beliefs.

I'm a Christian also,and I believe that we should give out Gods word to those who are not,then let God do the work in the heart of the person. One thing let's not forget that all those that say they are Christian are not. Bible study is great for Christians.

But don't shove it down our throats. We're not interested and don't care.
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.
regebro
Posts: 1,152
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8/25/2009 8:43:42 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/25/2009 7:28:43 AM, Bible8910 wrote:
One thing let's not forget that all those that say they are Christian are not.

You probably meant to write something else, but you are correct. Not even those who say they are Christian are actually Christian. For one, why both pray that your relatives get cured from cancer *and* take medicines? Truly God decides anyway? No? If God wants your dad to die of cancer no medicine in the world will help, right? And if he DOESN'T want your dad to die, then he doesn't need medicines, right?

A truly Christian would not take medicines, just pray and do Gods bidding. In fact, the Medicines is a direct sign to God that you don't trust him, and therefore direct proof that you have NOT accepted Jesus as your savior. Nobody who takes medicines can reasonably expect to get into heaven.

And if you believe that all you need to do is accept Jesus as your savior, and you will go to heaven when you die, why do you still avoid lethal risks? Anybody who is *truly* Christian would not fear death in the least, but rather welcome it. Obviously suicide is a sin, so you can't go seeking death (although reasonably, accepting Jesus as your savior should mean suicide is OK too, but lets not stretch it), but you have no reason to avoid it or minimize risks. Yet, Christians still get flu-shots, and still avoid going to Mexico because of the Swine-flu, and still look left and right when crossing a street, etc, etc.

Why minimize the risk of dying, when you are going to heaven anyway?

So the vast majority of supposedly Christian people behave in a extremely non-Christian way.
So prove me wrong, then.
regebro
Posts: 1,152
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8/25/2009 8:45:27 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/18/2009 11:37:35 AM, resolutionsmasher wrote:
P.S. - see my sig for my personal beliefs.

OK.

In the end we must believe something.

Yes. I believe that the world exists outside of me, existed before me and will exist after me. In other words, I believe in an objective world.

There are many paths thought to lead to heaven.

Yes. They are called "airports".
So prove me wrong, then.
regebro
Posts: 1,152
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8/25/2009 8:46:31 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/25/2009 8:45:27 AM, regebro wrote:
There are many paths thought to lead to heaven.

Yes. They are called "airports".

I just realized this only makes sense in Swedish. :-)
So prove me wrong, then.
Rezzealaux
Posts: 2,251
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8/25/2009 9:47:44 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/25/2009 8:46:31 AM, regebro wrote:
At 8/25/2009 8:45:27 AM, regebro wrote:
There are many paths thought to lead to heaven.

Yes. They are called "airports".

I just realized this only makes sense in Swedish. :-)

Sounds like a fun language joke we're missing out on D:
: If you weren't new here, you'd know not to feed me such attention. This is like an orgasm in my brain right now. *hehe, my name is in a title, hehe* (http://www.debate.org...)

Just in case I get into some BS with FREEDO again about how he's NOT a narcissist.

"The law is there to destroy evil under the constitutional government."
So... what's there to destroy evil inside of and above the constitutional government?
regebro
Posts: 1,152
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8/25/2009 11:16:49 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/25/2009 9:47:44 AM, Rezzealaux wrote:
At 8/25/2009 8:46:31 AM, regebro wrote:
At 8/25/2009 8:45:27 AM, regebro wrote:
There are many paths thought to lead to heaven.

Yes. They are called "airports".

I just realized this only makes sense in Swedish. :-)

Sounds like a fun language joke we're missing out on D:

Well, "Heaven" and "Sky" is the same word in Swedish. "Himmel". I thought I was hilarious, now I have to wait until somebody says "There is may ways to heaven" in Swedish. I may have to wait my whole life, I'll be annoyed if I never get to use that joke. :-)
So prove me wrong, then.
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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8/25/2009 11:44:30 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/25/2009 8:43:42 AM, regebro wrote:
At 8/25/2009 7:28:43 AM, Bible8910 wrote:
One thing let's not forget that all those that say they are Christian are not.

You probably meant to write something else, but you are correct. Not even those who say they are Christian are actually Christian. For one, why both pray that your relatives get cured from cancer *and* take medicines? Truly God decides anyway? No? If God wants your dad to die of cancer no medicine in the world will help, right? And if he DOESN'T want your dad to die, then he doesn't need medicines, right?

A truly Christian would not take medicines, just pray and do Gods bidding. In fact, the Medicines is a direct sign to God that you don't trust him, and therefore direct proof that you have NOT accepted Jesus as your savior. Nobody who takes medicines can reasonably expect to get into heaven.


That is such a strawman, by that logic a Christian should not even eat, because its up to God if they will starve to death or not!
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
regebro
Posts: 1,152
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8/25/2009 12:38:17 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/25/2009 11:44:30 AM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 8/25/2009 8:43:42 AM, regebro wrote:
At 8/25/2009 7:28:43 AM, Bible8910 wrote:
One thing let's not forget that all those that say they are Christian are not.

You probably meant to write something else, but you are correct. Not even those who say they are Christian are actually Christian. For one, why both pray that your relatives get cured from cancer *and* take medicines? Truly God decides anyway? No? If God wants your dad to die of cancer no medicine in the world will help, right? And if he DOESN'T want your dad to die, then he doesn't need medicines, right?

A truly Christian would not take medicines, just pray and do Gods bidding. In fact, the Medicines is a direct sign to God that you don't trust him, and therefore direct proof that you have NOT accepted Jesus as your savior. Nobody who takes medicines can reasonably expect to get into heaven.

That is such a strawman, by that logic a Christian should not even eat, because its up to God if they will starve to death or not!

How is that the same logic? Willfully starving yourself has reasonably to be seen as suicide. God may provide food, but you have to collect/hunt and eat it yourself. God does not decide if you eat or not. We have after all, free will, right? I haven't heard any Christian pray to God that they don't have to eat food and still survive. Because that's something we ourselves control, so why pray? It's like Praying to God that you are going to wash the dishes. it's up to you, not God.

But we do not decide if we should survive cancer or not. God decides that. Or are you saying that God doesn't make people sick and also do not cure them and doesn't decide if somebody struggling with cancer should live or not? Then why pray?
So prove me wrong, then.
DATCMOTO
Posts: 6,160
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8/26/2009 4:05:25 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/25/2009 6:51:51 AM, JSmith wrote:
I joined this site because someone gave me a link to this topic, thus I feel like I should respond.

DATCMoto, you seem to have taken up something that a lot of christians do, and that is vastly misquoting a scripture out of context to format it around the message you want it to say. You did that with the Matthew and 1 Corinthians reference.

The Matthew reference talks about how Jesus and his impact would upset everything. People would be turned against each other because of one following him and another not. Sounds a lot like the persecuted early church. Furthermore, when did Jesus, outside of overthrowing the temple, come with a sword? The message of his ministry, the life of his ministry, and the core of who he was is love. To take any sort of message and saying it without love is without Christ and not any sort of example you should set.

It is YOU who does not understand: the Sword is His Words (see how similar the words even are!) and His Words always bring trouble because they convict people of SIN.
I will NOT make love into a false god.. God IS love.. NOT love is god.

The 1 Corinthians reference is also as ludicrously misquoted as the Matthew reference. It talks about how you shouldn't judge anyone that is not a Christian but if you are a Christian you have every right to take a brother aside and say hey, this isn't right. Isn't that what the original poster was trying to do?

It's what I was doing! one rule for them another for me right?

Also, I want to state that I'm a Christian at a Christian University and I play Call of Duty. In addition, I watch violent movies. As a student of communication, I take things I can learn from both and analyze them far more than the average person would do because that's what I've been trained to do. These things only effect you as much as you let them effect you.

I will set NO vile thing before my eyes.. I HATE the work of those that fall away, it shall NOT cling to me!

Are you a mormon?
The Cross.. the Cross.
resolutionsmasher
Posts: 579
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8/27/2009 6:17:01 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
DATCMOTO....
While I think you have better things to do than evangelize people you can't see, I agree that you have the right to use your membership as you wish. I will respect that. I really don't even mind you having a God oriented mind that brings God into every conversation. That's not wrong. I simply wish you would stop attacking individuals for their speech and actions. Yes, some of them claim actions that are evil by our standards, but monitoring them all the time and blaring your sin siren every time will not make them stop and repent (which is what I assume is your goal here). I challenge you to implore people to do the right thing without personally attacking them. You can still say the this or that is wrong and sinful but just don't make people reject you by rejecting them. Jesus forgave sinners even when they didn't accept him. The Pharisees, on the other hand, took every opportunity to abase others and uplift themselves. So for your sake, please, consider my humbly offered advise.
In the relationship between Obama and the rest of the U.S..... I think the U.S. is getting the short end of the hockey stick.
I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
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8/27/2009 6:33:34 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/27/2009 6:17:01 AM, resolutionsmasher wrote:
Yes, some of them claim actions that are evil by our standards, but monitoring them all the time and blaring your sin siren every time will not make them stop and repent (which is what I assume is your goal here).

On the contrary, he has made 3 Atheists.
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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8/27/2009 9:07:34 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/25/2009 12:38:17 PM, regebro wrote:
At 8/25/2009 11:44:30 AM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 8/25/2009 8:43:42 AM, regebro wrote:
At 8/25/2009 7:28:43 AM, Bible8910 wrote:
One thing let's not forget that all those that say they are Christian are not.

You probably meant to write something else, but you are correct. Not even those who say they are Christian are actually Christian. For one, why both pray that your relatives get cured from cancer *and* take medicines? Truly God decides anyway? No? If God wants your dad to die of cancer no medicine in the world will help, right? And if he DOESN'T want your dad to die, then he doesn't need medicines, right?

A truly Christian would not take medicines, just pray and do Gods bidding. In fact, the Medicines is a direct sign to God that you don't trust him, and therefore direct proof that you have NOT accepted Jesus as your savior. Nobody who takes medicines can reasonably expect to get into heaven.

That is such a strawman, by that logic a Christian should not even eat, because its up to God if they will starve to death or not!

How is that the same logic? Willfully starving yourself has reasonably to be seen as suicide. God may provide food, but you have to collect/hunt and eat it yourself. God does not decide if you eat or not. We have after all, free will, right? I haven't heard any Christian pray to God that they don't have to eat food and still survive. Because that's something we ourselves control, so why pray? It's like Praying to God that you are going to wash the dishes. it's up to you, not God.

But we do not decide if we should survive cancer or not. God decides that. Or are you saying that God doesn't make people sick and also do not cure them and doesn't decide if somebody struggling with cancer should live or not? Then why pray?

No it is a pretty good analogy, lets try a variation though.

You have claimed that a Christian should not seek out medical help for their cancer, because if they live or die is up to God right?

By the same token why go and buy food? If God wants you to eat he will fill your fridge your food as you sleep, or play on the PS2, or attempt to convert people on a message board etc.

I think the answer is that most Christians believe that God has set the world up to function along certain lines. You may get cancer, the treatment may or may not work.

However prayer can arguably be an attempt to ask God to intervene. You don't know if he will or not, and you thank him for the life he has already given you and aks him perhaps to help you see the wisdom of his decision, or mitigate your pain, or the pain of your loved ones etc etc.

In the mean time you continue with your course of treatment.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
JSmith
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8/27/2009 12:37:44 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/26/2009 4:05:25 AM, DATCMOTO wrote:
At 8/25/2009 6:51:51 AM, JSmith wrote:
I joined this site because someone gave me a link to this topic, thus I feel like I should respond.

DATCMoto, you seem to have taken up something that a lot of christians do, and that is vastly misquoting a scripture out of context to format it around the message you want it to say. You did that with the Matthew and 1 Corinthians reference.

The Matthew reference talks about how Jesus and his impact would upset everything. People would be turned against each other because of one following him and another not. Sounds a lot like the persecuted early church. Furthermore, when did Jesus, outside of overthrowing the temple, come with a sword? The message of his ministry, the life of his ministry, and the core of who he was is love. To take any sort of message and saying it without love is without Christ and not any sort of example you should set.

It is YOU who does not understand: the Sword is His Words (see how similar the words even are!) and His Words always bring trouble because they convict people of SIN.
I will NOT make love into a false god.. God IS love.. NOT love is god.


The 1 Corinthians reference is also as ludicrously misquoted as the Matthew reference. It talks about how you shouldn't judge anyone that is not a Christian but if you are a Christian you have every right to take a brother aside and say hey, this isn't right. Isn't that what the original poster was trying to do?

It's what I was doing! one rule for them another for me right?

Also, I want to state that I'm a Christian at a Christian University and I play Call of Duty. In addition, I watch violent movies. As a student of communication, I take things I can learn from both and analyze them far more than the average person would do because that's what I've been trained to do. These things only effect you as much as you let them effect you.

I will set NO vile thing before my eyes.. I HATE the work of those that fall away, it shall NOT cling to me!

Are you a mormon?

Where did I say love is God. I said God is love. His nature is love. He is love. I feel that its a concept you're not getting.

Dude, you're missing the point. You're not the person pulling someone aside saying you're wrong. You're the one thats wrong.

Have you read the bible? Its full of stories about rape, murder, incest, adultery and many violent wars. How are those not vile? What do you mean the work of those that fall away? Who talks like that vaguely?

Did I say that Jesus and Satan are brothers and that I'm going to get my own planet? Nope. So clearly I'm not a mormon.
regebro
Posts: 1,152
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8/27/2009 2:35:02 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/27/2009 9:07:34 AM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
No it is a pretty good analogy, lets try a variation though.

You have claimed that a Christian should not seek out medical help for their cancer, because if they live or die is up to God right?

No, I claimed that is makes no sense to both pray for God to heal you *and* take medicines.

By the same token why go and buy food? If God wants you to eat he will fill your fridge your food as you sleep, or play on the PS2, or attempt to convert people on a message board etc.

It is true that it makes just as little sense to both buy food and pray for God to put food in your fridge, yes. :-)

In the mean time you continue with your course of treatment.

Because apparently, God needs the help.
So prove me wrong, then.
DATCMOTO
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8/28/2009 2:44:09 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/27/2009 6:17:01 AM, resolutionsmasher wrote:
DATCMOTO....
While I think you have better things to do than evangelize people you can't see, I agree that you have the right to use your membership as you wish. I will respect that. I really don't even mind you having a God oriented mind that brings God into every conversation. That's not wrong. I simply wish you would stop attacking individuals for their speech and actions. Yes, some of them claim actions that are evil by our standards, but monitoring them all the time and blaring your sin siren every time will not make them stop and repent (which is what I assume is your goal here). I challenge you to implore people to do the right thing without personally attacking them. You can still say the this or that is wrong and sinful but just don't make people reject you by rejecting them. Jesus forgave sinners even when they didn't accept him. The Pharisees, on the other hand, took every opportunity to abase others and uplift themselves. So for your sake, please, consider my humbly offered advise.

please state exactly (with examples) what you mean by attacking individuals..
The Cross.. the Cross.
DATCMOTO
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8/28/2009 2:45:53 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/27/2009 6:33:34 AM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 8/27/2009 6:17:01 AM, resolutionsmasher wrote:
Yes, some of them claim actions that are evil by our standards, but monitoring them all the time and blaring your sin siren every time will not make them stop and repent (which is what I assume is your goal here).

On the contrary, he has made 3 Atheists.

You were NEVER a Christian, or you still would be.. ticktockticktock..
The Cross.. the Cross.
DATCMOTO
Posts: 6,160
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8/28/2009 2:55:07 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 8/27/2009 12:37:44 PM, JSmith wrote:
At 8/26/2009 4:05:25 AM, DATCMOTO wrote:
At 8/25/2009 6:51:51 AM, JSmith wrote:
I joined this site because someone gave me a link to this topic, thus I feel like I should respond.

DATCMoto, you seem to have taken up something that a lot of christians do, and that is vastly misquoting a scripture out of context to format it around the message you want it to say. You did that with the Matthew and 1 Corinthians reference.

The Matthew reference talks about how Jesus and his impact would upset everything. People would be turned against each other because of one following him and another not. Sounds a lot like the persecuted early church. Furthermore, when did Jesus, outside of overthrowing the temple, come with a sword? The message of his ministry, the life of his ministry, and the core of who he was is love. To take any sort of message and saying it without love is without Christ and not any sort of example you should set.

It is YOU who does not understand: the Sword is His Words (see how similar the words even are!) and His Words always bring trouble because they convict people of SIN.
I will NOT make love into a false god.. God IS love.. NOT love is god.


The 1 Corinthians reference is also as ludicrously misquoted as the Matthew reference. It talks about how you shouldn't judge anyone that is not a Christian but if you are a Christian you have every right to take a brother aside and say hey, this isn't right. Isn't that what the original poster was trying to do?

It's what I was doing! one rule for them another for me right?

Also, I want to state that I'm a Christian at a Christian University and I play Call of Duty. In addition, I watch violent movies. As a student of communication, I take things I can learn from both and analyze them far more than the average person would do because that's what I've been trained to do. These things only effect you as much as you let them effect you.

I will set NO vile thing before my eyes.. I HATE the work of those that fall away, it shall NOT cling to me!

Are you a mormon?

Where did I say love is God. I said God is love. His nature is love. He is love. I feel that its a concept you're not getting.

It what your DOING (what you say without saying) and it is making the WHOLE of Christiandom IMPOTENT.. loving everything means loving nothing.
If we love we must hate:
If we love babies we must hate abortion..
If we love Gods will and Word we must hate sin..

Dude, you're missing the point. You're not the person pulling someone aside saying you're wrong. You're the one thats wrong.

I believe not. And I will (as we ALL will) stand before Christ to answer for EVERY idle word.. and these words are NOT idle!

Have you read the bible? Its full of stories about rape, murder, incest, adultery and many violent wars. How are those not vile? What do you mean the work of those that fall away? Who talks like that vaguely?

I was QUOTING the Bible.. perhaps you should have noticed that?

Did I say that Jesus and Satan are brothers and that I'm going to get my own planet? Nope. So clearly I'm not a mormon.

I wasn't assuming, I was asking.. (jsmith..)
The Cross.. the Cross.