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Roman Catholicism

AlwaysMoreThanYou
Posts: 2,900
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6/21/2012 1:20:27 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
You know what to do, Scotty.
'When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.' - John 16:13
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/21/2012 1:22:51 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Thanks man. That's cool. Understand it will be rigorous and many will post. But all honesty I mean no bad intentions for yourself or anyone. Lets the games begin!
TheAsylum
AnalyticArizonan
Posts: 5
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6/21/2012 1:32:06 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
"Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much." -James 5:16
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/21/2012 1:40:03 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/21/2012 1:32:06 AM, AnalyticArizonan wrote:
"Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much." -James 5:16

Yes I agree it says pray for one another but it is a stretch to interpret that as saying go to Roman Catholic and confess your sins to popes and priest.

I pray for many. I have had many that prayed for me. How it that different and not the way that is interpreted here? This scripture is not saying confess your sins to popes or to each other but prayer for each other. I alsoio agree that a holy man's prayer is strong but that scripture says nothing of confessing sins.
TheAsylum
AnalyticArizonan
Posts: 5
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6/21/2012 1:52:18 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Catholics believe that the popes, bishops, and priests are the successors of the Apostles and retain all the gifts Christ gave them.

"Then said Jesus to them again, Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you. And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost: Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained." - John 20:21-23
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/21/2012 2:02:51 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/21/2012 1:52:18 AM, AnalyticArizonan wrote:
Catholics believe that the popes, bishops, and priests are the successors of the Apostles and retain all the gifts Christ gave them.

Again who says that the Pope and the saints today are of the apostles?

Are you saying that only Popes and saints are from the apostles blood?

So you are saying that only Roman Catholic can be blessed by the Holy Ghost?

Ultimately what I am saying is that I am saved and experience the Holy Ghost daily and I confess my sins to God. I do not have to he knows them and I know he knows and therefore I ask forgiveness as soon as I commit them are you saying I don't and do not receive forgiveness because I have never entered a Roman Catholic church. I think true is there are those who have that relationship with God and had direct experience and that is the way it should be. I agree that we should be confessing our errors in public and praying for all but this coming to a personnel MAN and Priest is nonsense. People can confess directly to God and directly experience him. Ultimately that's what your saying you can not have or experience God without Popes and Church.
TheAsylum
tBoonePickens
Posts: 3,266
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6/26/2012 10:19:33 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/26/2012 2:02:21 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
Considering that Jesus calls his flock 'His Bride'. Who is the Whore of Babylon? Who fornicates with the whole world?
Probably the Roman Empire. Why?
WOS
: At 10/3/2012 4:28:52 AM, Wallstreetatheist wrote:
: Without nothing existing, you couldn't have something.
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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6/26/2012 10:44:04 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/26/2012 2:02:21 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
Considering that Jesus calls his flock 'His Bride'. Who is the Whore of Babylon? Who fornicates with the whole world?

Jerusalem, from the time that was written.
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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6/26/2012 10:52:45 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/21/2012 1:52:18 AM, AnalyticArizonan wrote:
Catholics believe that the popes, bishops, and priests are the successors of the Apostles and retain all the gifts Christ gave them.


"Then said Jesus to them again, Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you. And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost: Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained." - John 20:21-23

When Jesus breathed on them He says receive the Holy Spirit, He gives them the power to retain and remitt. That has been passed down, not a blood line.

And the Catholic Church teaches that denominations that Baptize in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit are in fact Christian. They are just missing out on the fullness of the Faith as long as each individual truly believes they are living out Faith in Jesus Christ. Since no one but God can truly know what you believe it is up to each individual, and it is on their heads. Your pastor will not be beside you when you stand before God, there will be no one to blame.

Im replying to Scotty in this message because my phone sucks and I can't scroll down in the quote is much bigger then this one.
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
Dogknox
Posts: 5,049
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6/26/2012 12:23:59 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/21/2012 1:24:03 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I want to know why You should and must be Roman Catholic and confess sins to preist?
ScottyDouglas When Jesus gave the AUTHORITY of God to his Church to forgive or retain sins there was JUST ONE CHURCH!
Jesus Gave the authority to his "One, Holy, Catholic, Apostolic Church".. NONE OTHERS! IN...

In the Old Testament Moses was the "Hands and the Voice" of God!
ScottyDouglas It was NOT Moses that parted the sea, it was God working through Moses!

In the New Testament it is the Pope and the Bishops that are the "Hands and the Voice" of Jesus! ONLY GOD can forgive sins!!

Jesus is working through the Priest.. I hear the voice of the priest, I see the Priest but when I hear the Priest say "Go Dogknox, your sins are forgiven" I KNOW..
I know they are forgiven by Jesus!

ScottyDouglas There was NO protestant churches for sixteen hundred years! Clearly when Jesus gave the authority to forgive sins, there was NO protestants or protestant churches! Just the Catholic Church none other! ALL...

All the Early Church Father's were Catholic's!!! MOST..
Most were Bishops all accepted the AUTHORITY of the Pope!

The Didache IS CATHOLIC!!
"Confess your sins in church, and do not go up to your prayer with an evil conscience. This is the way of life. . . . On the Lord's Day gather together, break bread, and give thanks, after confessing your transgressions so that your sacrifice may be pure" (Didache 4:14, 14:1 [A.D. 70]).

Ignatius of Antioch is CATHOLIC not protestant!!
He said..
"For as many as are of God and of Jesus Christ are also with the bishop. And as many as shall, in the exercise of penance, return into the unity of the Church, these, too, shall belong to God, that they may live according to Jesus Christ" (Letter to the Philadelphians 3 [A.D. 110]).

ScottyDouglas this should have answered your question: why You should and must be Roman Catholic???!

Dogknox
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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6/26/2012 12:53:32 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
DogKnox, do you simply use the same, stale old posts over and over, and insert a new person's name so as to make it seem more personal? I've seen the same posts five times with different people's names "bolded."

"When Jesus gave the AUTHORITY of God to his Church to forgive or retain sins there was JUST ONE CHURCH!"

And it wasn't the Roman Catholic church, either. If so, the Bible fails to record this fact.

"In the New Testament it is the Pope and the Bishops that are the "Hands and the Voice" of Jesus!"

LOL @ that one. There WAS no pope in the New Testament. Where'd you get that?

"Jesus is working through the Priest.. I hear the voice of the priest, I see the Priest but when I hear the Priest say "Go Dogknox, your sins are forgiven" I KNOW"

In the New Testament, every Christian was a priest.

"There was NO protestant churches for sixteen hundred years!"

And there was no world-wide papa until about 600 AD, and he was not considered infallible until 1870. Many, many, MANY Roman Catholics didn't even believe in papal infallibility until 1870.

"all accepted the AUTHORITY of the Pope!"

Huh?

(1) "It would be a monstrous anachronism were we to attribute a belief in papal infallability to the Anti-Nicene (pre-325 AD) fathers." (Cath Dic., XII, p. 414"

(2) "Appeals were lodged before the bishop of Rome, though he was not believed to be infallible. Neither is he now. No enlightened Catholic holds the pope's infallibility to be an article of faith, I do not; and none of my brethren that I know of, do." (Archbishop Purcell, Campbell-Purcell Debate, pp. 26-27)

(3) "The churches of the three principle cities of the world were looked upon as chief ... the bishop of Rome was considered as first; yet they did not believe him to be infallible." (DuPin, p. 500)

Why do these Catholics - an Archbishop and an eminent historian - declare that Catholics did NOT believe infallibility resided in the pope?

"Didache: Confess your sins in church."

Well, the Didache is interesting, but not inspired. At any rate, confession was public - not in the ear of a priest in private.

I have previously asked you why in the world you assert that Roman Catholics have always believed in the infallibility of papa. They haven't. I can prove it. But since you do, I've also asked for an infallibly complete listing of papa's recorded infallible utterances and rulings and stuff so that we may all make sure we - and you - are following them. Why can't you do that? How do you know you are following the teachings of papa to the letter when you don't even know what all he's said and written infallibly. You owe it to everyone to atleast tell us - whether we believe it or not.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Dogknox
Posts: 5,049
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6/26/2012 2:32:36 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
annanicole Your words..
And there was no world-wide papa until about 600 AD, and he was not considered infallible until 1870. Many, many, MANY Roman Catholics didn't even believe in papal infallibility until 1870.

The words of CHRISTIANS!!!
Ignatius of Antioch
"Let no one do anything of concern to the Church without the bishop. Let that be considered a valid Eucharist which is celebrated by the bishop or by one whom he ordains [i.e., a presbyter]. Wherever the bishop appears, let the people be there; just as wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church" (Letter to the Smyrneans 8:2 [A.D. 110]). 

Just as wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church
The early Church Father's were CATHOLICS not a protestant in the bunch!
ONLY Catholic's all accepting the authority of the pope!

NOTE the date..A.D. 110 NOT 600 A.D.!

The Martyrdom of Polycarp
And of the elect, he was one indeed, the wonderful martyr Polycarp, who in our days was an apostolic and prophetic teacher, bishop of the Catholic Church in Smyrna. For every word that came forth from his mouth was fulfilled and will be fulfilled (Martyrdom of Polycarp 16:2 [A.D. 155]).

NOT an ANGLICAN but a Catholic>>> An apostolic and prophetic teacher, bishop of the Catholic Church!!
NOTE the early date.. well before 600 A.D.!!!

Tertullian
Christians believe the scriptures they are NOT Anglican!! !
Where was [the heretic] Marcion, that shipmaster of Pontus, the zealous student of Stoicism? Where was Valentinus, the disciple of Platonism? For it is evident that those men lived not so long ago—in the reign of Antonius for the most part—and that they at first were believers in the doctrine of the Catholic Church, in the church of Rome under the episcopate of the blessed Eleutherius, until on account of their ever restless curiosity, with which they even infected the brethren, they were more than once expelled (Demurrer against the Heretics 30 [A.D. 200]).

Note the early Date.. well before 600 A.D.!

Council of Nicaea I
This is a Catholic Council held by more then one hundred BISHOPS and the Pope!!
It said..
But those who say: "There was [a time] when he [the Son] was not," and "before he was born, he was not," and "because he was made from non-existing matter, he is either of another substance or essence," and those who call "God the Son of God changeable and mutable," these the Catholic Church anathematizes (Appendix to the Creed of Nicaea [A.D. 325]).

Spoken well before 600 A.D.!
annanicole It looks like all the Early Church Fathers would call you "Anathema"!!

You are outside of Jesus' holy Body simple because you reject the words of Jesus!
All who reject the words of God reject God!

There was NO Anglicans until King Henry rejected the scriptures!
There was NO protestant whats so ever until sixteen hundred years AFTER Jesus!

Dogknox
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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6/26/2012 3:18:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
"Council of Nicaea I
This is a Catholic Council held by more then one hundred BISHOPS and the Pope!!"

Really? What papa was there? Give us the name please. Do you think your silly assertions are gonna fly?

I said, "And there was no world-wide papa until about 600 AD, and he was not considered infallible until 1870. Many, many, MANY Roman Catholics didn't even believe in papal infallibility until 1870." That stands. You didn't say a word of off-set it.

Your quote from Ignatius = not a word about the primacy of the bishop of Rome nor the infallibility of the pope. In fact, the pope is unmentioned.

The Martyrdom of Polycarp? I see not one word about any "pope" or "bishop of Rome" or infallibility. Why not?

Tertullian? The quote mentions the bishop of Rome. It does not mention infallibility nor supremacy.

Why don't you furnish us some quotes that are relative to the subject?

Why oh, why does the Catholic Dictionary state, ""It would be a monstrous anachronism were we to attribute a belief in papal infallability to the Anti-Nicene (pre-325 AD) fathers." (Cath Dic., XII, p. 414). Why does it state that, huh? Yet a peon like you turns around and says, "Oh, the Catholic Dictionary is all wrong."

Why did a Roman Catholic archbishop not know as much as you do. Had he not read your irrelevent quotes from the "fathers"? Did he not know as much about the Bible?

""Appeals were lodged before the bishop of Rome, though he was not believed to be infallible. Neither is he now. No enlightened Catholic holds the pope's infallibility to be an article of faith, I do not; and none of my brethren that I know of, do." (Archbishop Purcell, 1837). Hell, he didn't even KNOW of anyone less than 200 years ago who believed that the pope was infallible as an article of faith. Many didn't believe it at all. Why is that?
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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6/26/2012 3:22:34 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Catholics themselves believe that many of their rotten papas were "infallible vicars of Christ" on the one hand, yet upon death wound right up in the penal fires of hell or purgatory. Imagine that. Even Innocent III supposedly was tormented in hell for centuries - heck, he may still be there, even according to Catholics. Tis indeed strange that the popish church has "sainted" 49 outta the first 50 popes - a 98% "sainting" rate. Amazing! Also, ridiculous.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/26/2012 3:31:21 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/26/2012 10:19:33 AM, tBoonePickens wrote:
At 6/26/2012 2:02:21 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
Considering that Jesus calls his flock 'His Bride'. Who is the Whore of Babylon? Who fornicates with the whole world?
Probably the Roman Empire. Why?

That does not mean anything to you?
TheAsylum
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/26/2012 3:35:52 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/26/2012 2:32:36 PM, Dogknox wrote:
annanicole Your words..
And there was no world-wide papa until about 600 AD, and he was not considered infallible until 1870. Many, many, MANY Roman Catholics didn't even believe in papal infallibility until 1870.

The words of CHRISTIANS!!!
Ignatius of Antioch
"Let no one do anything of concern to the Church without the bishop. Let that be considered a valid Eucharist which is celebrated by the bishop or by one whom he ordains [i.e., a presbyter]. Wherever the bishop appears, let the people be there; just as wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church" (Letter to the Smyrneans 8:2 [A.D. 110]). 

Just as wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church
The early Church Father's were CATHOLICS not a protestant in the bunch!
ONLY Catholic's all accepting the authority of the pope!

NOTE the date..A.D. 110 NOT 600 A.D.!

The Martyrdom of Polycarp
And of the elect, he was one indeed, the wonderful martyr Polycarp, who in our days was an apostolic and prophetic teacher, bishop of the Catholic Church in Smyrna. For every word that came forth from his mouth was fulfilled and will be fulfilled (Martyrdom of Polycarp 16:2 [A.D. 155]).

NOT an ANGLICAN but a Catholic>>> An apostolic and prophetic teacher, bishop of the Catholic Church!!
NOTE the early date.. well before 600 A.D.!!!

Tertullian
Christians believe the scriptures they are NOT Anglican!! !
Where was [the heretic] Marcion, that shipmaster of Pontus, the zealous student of Stoicism? Where was Valentinus, the disciple of Platonism? For it is evident that those men lived not so long ago—in the reign of Antonius for the most part—and that they at first were believers in the doctrine of the Catholic Church, in the church of Rome under the episcopate of the blessed Eleutherius, until on account of their ever restless curiosity, with which they even infected the brethren, they were more than once expelled (Demurrer against the Heretics 30 [A.D. 200]).

Note the early Date.. well before 600 A.D.!

Council of Nicaea I
This is a Catholic Council held by more then one hundred BISHOPS and the Pope!!
It said..
But those who say: "There was [a time] when he [the Son] was not," and "before he was born, he was not," and "because he was made from non-existing matter, he is either of another substance or essence," and those who call "God the Son of God changeable and mutable," these the Catholic Church anathematizes (Appendix to the Creed of Nicaea [A.D. 325]).

Spoken well before 600 A.D.!
annanicole It looks like all the Early Church Fathers would call you "Anathema"!!

You are outside of Jesus' holy Body simple because you reject the words of Jesus!
All who reject the words of God reject God!

There was NO Anglicans until King Henry rejected the scriptures!
There was NO protestant whats so ever until sixteen hundred years AFTER Jesus!

Dogknox

^ Dogknox you are not posting from the Bible but a man's words. Wonder why?
TheAsylum