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Why Was Jesus' Sacrifice Necessary?

jat93
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7/23/2012 6:17:12 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Consider the following:

- There is a being which created the universe.
- This being is all powerful, wise, and loving.
- This being cares about humanity.
- This being wants to forgive the sins of humanity.

Why would such a being send his only son to suffer and die for the sins of humanity? Why would he not want to just forgive humanity for its sins straightaway, rather than demanding the suffering and death of his own son? (Also note the utter immorality of scapegoating, which completely negates the moral principle of personal responsibility.)

I don't understand how, if God is both all powerful and wise, he couldn't find a better/more efficient way to save humanity than to send Jesus to be crucified on the cross. And if he is all loving, I don't understand how he wouldn't want to find a way of saving humanity that didn't involve making his son undergo a human sacrifice because of humanity's sins.

The whole idea that a perfect God impregnated a human woman so that his son could come to earth in humanly form in order to be tortured and killed for the sins of humanity seems to me both bizarre and reprehensible.
The_Fool_on_the_hill
Posts: 6,071
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7/23/2012 6:18:31 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
The Fool: No sh!t.
"The bud disappears when the blossom breaks through, and we might say that the former is refuted by the latter; in the same way when the fruit comes, the blossom may be explained to be a false form of the plant's existence, for the fruit appears as its true nature in place of the blossom. These stages are not merely differentiated; they supplant one another as being incompatible with one another." G. W. F. HEGEL
Paradox_7
Posts: 1,870
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7/23/2012 6:20:04 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/23/2012 6:17:12 PM, jat93 wrote:
Consider the following:

- There is a being which created the universe.
- This being is all powerful, wise, and loving.
- This being cares about humanity.
- This being wants to forgive the sins of humanity.

Why would such a being send his only son to suffer and die for the sins of humanity? Why would he not want to just forgive humanity for its sins straightaway, rather than demanding the suffering and death of his own son? (Also note the utter immorality of scapegoating, which completely negates the moral principle of personal responsibility.)

I don't understand how, if God is both all powerful and wise, he couldn't find a better/more efficient way to save humanity than to send Jesus to be crucified on the cross. And if he is all loving, I don't understand how he wouldn't want to find a way of saving humanity that didn't involve making his son undergo a human sacrifice because of humanity's sins.

The whole idea that a perfect God impregnated a human woman so that his son could come to earth in humanly form in order to be tortured and killed for the sins of humanity seems to me both bizarre and reprehensible.


Doesn't matter.

God deemed it was necessary, therefore, it was necessary.
: At 10/23/2012 8:06:03 PM, tvellalott wrote:
: Don't be. The Catholic Church is ran by Darth Sidius for fvck sake. As far as I'm concerned, you're a bona fide member of the Sith.
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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7/23/2012 6:32:39 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/23/2012 6:20:04 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
Doesn't matter.

God deemed it was necessary, therefore, it was necessary.

Presenting: The synopsis of Christian ethics.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Maikuru
Posts: 9,112
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7/23/2012 6:55:28 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/23/2012 6:17:12 PM, jat93 wrote:
Consider the following:

- There is a being which created the universe.
- This being is all powerful, wise, and loving.
- This being cares about humanity.
- This being wants to forgive the sins of humanity.

Why would such a being send his only son to suffer and die for the sins of humanity? Why would he not want to just forgive humanity for its sins straightaway, rather than demanding the suffering and death of his own son? (Also note the utter immorality of scapegoating, which completely negates the moral principle of personal responsibility.)

I don't understand how, if God is both all powerful and wise, he couldn't find a better/more efficient way to save humanity than to send Jesus to be crucified on the cross. And if he is all loving, I don't understand how he wouldn't want to find a way of saving humanity that didn't involve making his son undergo a human sacrifice because of humanity's sins.

The whole idea that a perfect God impregnated a human woman so that his son could come to earth in humanly form in order to be tortured and killed for the sins of humanity seems to me both bizarre and reprehensible.

What's he supposed to do? Just wave his hand and absolve us of our sins? You don't get many converts that way. Also, The Quiet Forgiveness of the Christ sounds like a terrible movie.
"You assume I wouldn't want to burn this whole place to the ground."
- lamerde

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Paradox_7
Posts: 1,870
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7/23/2012 7:11:04 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/23/2012 6:32:39 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 7/23/2012 6:20:04 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
Doesn't matter.

God deemed it was necessary, therefore, it was necessary.

Presenting: The synopsis of Christian ethics.


Amen.
: At 10/23/2012 8:06:03 PM, tvellalott wrote:
: Don't be. The Catholic Church is ran by Darth Sidius for fvck sake. As far as I'm concerned, you're a bona fide member of the Sith.
DATCMOTO
Posts: 6,160
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7/24/2012 9:50:15 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/23/2012 6:17:12 PM, jat93 wrote:
Consider the following:

- There is a being which created the universe.
- This being is all powerful, wise, and loving.
- This being cares about humanity.
- This being wants to forgive the sins of humanity.

Why would such a being send his only son to suffer and die for the sins of humanity? Why would he not want to just forgive humanity for its sins straightaway, rather than demanding the suffering and death of his own son? (Also note the utter immorality of scapegoating, which completely negates the moral principle of personal responsibility.)

I don't understand how, if God is both all powerful and wise, he couldn't find a better/more efficient way to save humanity than to send Jesus to be crucified on the cross. And if he is all loving, I don't understand how he wouldn't want to find a way of saving humanity that didn't involve making his son undergo a human sacrifice because of humanity's sins.

The whole idea that a perfect God impregnated a human woman so that his son could come to earth in humanly form in order to be tortured and killed for the sins of humanity seems to me both bizarre and reprehensible.

It is kinda crazy UNTIL He puts faith into your heart..

The cross is a physical representation of an (invisible) spiritual reality:

*When God created humanity He willingly put Himself at OUR mercy: Jesus CHOSE to go to the cross..

*Gods chosen people have betrayed Him countless times: (see O.T) The Jews reject Jesus and hand Him over to the godless Romans..

*Even the Jews relationship to the Law and sacrifices is a mockery to God: Jesus is mocked and crowned with thorns etc..

*God thirsts for humanity to love one another: Jesus crys out " I thirst! "

*God willingly drinks down our iniquity until the time is right: Jesus is given vinegar (wine, which is 'fruit that lasts', thats gone bad) to drink on the cross.

Through the cross of Christ we can come into relationship with God the Father, we can begin to understand His UTTER goodness, justness and holiness.

Hope this helps.
The Cross.. the Cross.
caveat
Posts: 2,137
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7/24/2012 10:55:07 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/23/2012 6:20:04 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
At 7/23/2012 6:17:12 PM, jat93 wrote:
Consider the following:

- There is a being which created the universe.
- This being is all powerful, wise, and loving.
- This being cares about humanity.
- This being wants to forgive the sins of humanity.

Why would such a being send his only son to suffer and die for the sins of humanity? Why would he not want to just forgive humanity for its sins straightaway, rather than demanding the suffering and death of his own son? (Also note the utter immorality of scapegoating, which completely negates the moral principle of personal responsibility.)

I don't understand how, if God is both all powerful and wise, he couldn't find a better/more efficient way to save humanity than to send Jesus to be crucified on the cross. And if he is all loving, I don't understand how he wouldn't want to find a way of saving humanity that didn't involve making his son undergo a human sacrifice because of humanity's sins.

The whole idea that a perfect God impregnated a human woman so that his son could come to earth in humanly form in order to be tortured and killed for the sins of humanity seems to me both bizarre and reprehensible.


Doesn't matter.

God deemed it was necessary, therefore, it was necessary.

Aaaand this is where most discussions end and I realize time and time again there was no point in engaging in the first place.
There is an art, it says, or rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss. " Clearly, it is this second part, the missing, which presents the difficulties.
acvavra
Posts: 318
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7/24/2012 11:27:34 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
I find this sad that no Christian so far has answered jat93's question. The answer is the basis of Christian theology. According to the Bible blood is required to pay for sins(Hebrews 9:22). In the Old Testament, Jews used the blood of animals to pay for their sins. Why? Because there blood is innocent, so Jesus is called the Lamb of God because His blood is innocent, but also eternal, so it can pay for your sins.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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7/24/2012 11:30:30 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/24/2012 11:27:34 AM, acvavra wrote:
I find this sad that no Christian so far has answered jat93's question. The answer is the basis of Christian theology. According to the Bible blood is required to pay for sins(Hebrews 9:22). In the Old Testament, Jews used the blood of animals to pay for their sins. Why? Because there blood is innocent, so Jesus is called the Lamb of God because His blood is innocent, but also eternal, so it can pay for your sins.

Who set the price there? Archangel Bernanke?
Paradox_7
Posts: 1,870
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7/24/2012 12:25:53 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/24/2012 11:27:34 AM, acvavra wrote:
I find this sad that no Christian so far has answered jat93's question. The answer is the basis of Christian theology. According to the Bible blood is required to pay for sins(Hebrews 9:22). In the Old Testament, Jews used the blood of animals to pay for their sins. Why? Because there blood is innocent, so Jesus is called the Lamb of God because His blood is innocent, but also eternal, so it can pay for your sins.


lol, oh yeah.. there gonna hear that and just surrender..

"ohhhh, no way? i never realized it was because blood was needed! I think I'll be a Christian now!"

There asking "why" was blood needed.. you just decorated what I said.
: At 10/23/2012 8:06:03 PM, tvellalott wrote:
: Don't be. The Catholic Church is ran by Darth Sidius for fvck sake. As far as I'm concerned, you're a bona fide member of the Sith.
Paradox_7
Posts: 1,870
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7/24/2012 12:38:32 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/24/2012 10:55:07 AM, caveat wrote:
At 7/23/2012 6:20:04 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
At 7/23/2012 6:17:12 PM, jat93 wrote:
Consider the following:

- There is a being which created the universe.
- This being is all powerful, wise, and loving.
- This being cares about humanity.
- This being wants to forgive the sins of humanity.

Why would such a being send his only son to suffer and die for the sins of humanity? Why would he not want to just forgive humanity for its sins straightaway, rather than demanding the suffering and death of his own son? (Also note the utter immorality of scapegoating, which completely negates the moral principle of personal responsibility.)

I don't understand how, if God is both all powerful and wise, he couldn't find a better/more efficient way to save humanity than to send Jesus to be crucified on the cross. And if he is all loving, I don't understand how he wouldn't want to find a way of saving humanity that didn't involve making his son undergo a human sacrifice because of humanity's sins.

The whole idea that a perfect God impregnated a human woman so that his son could come to earth in humanly form in order to be tortured and killed for the sins of humanity seems to me both bizarre and reprehensible.


Doesn't matter.

God deemed it was necessary, therefore, it was necessary.

Aaaand this is where most discussions end and I realize time and time again there was no point in engaging in the first place.


With some, there really isn't when someone seeks minutiae.
: At 10/23/2012 8:06:03 PM, tvellalott wrote:
: Don't be. The Catholic Church is ran by Darth Sidius for fvck sake. As far as I'm concerned, you're a bona fide member of the Sith.
DATCMOTO
Posts: 6,160
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7/24/2012 12:53:24 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/24/2012 11:27:34 AM, acvavra wrote:
I find this sad that no Christian so far has answered jat93's question. The answer is the basis of Christian theology. According to the Bible blood is required to pay for sins(Hebrews 9:22). In the Old Testament, Jews used the blood of animals to pay for their sins. Why? Because there blood is innocent, so Jesus is called the Lamb of God because His blood is innocent, but also eternal, so it can pay for your sins.

We call blood the 'lifeblood' as we cannot live without it, the life is in the blood..

Luke 22:20
In the same way, after the supper he took the cup, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in my blood, which is poured out for you.


Wine is 'fruit that lasts'.

Fruit is the external manifestation, or end result, of growth and life and also how a tree propagates itself.

Galatians 5:22
But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,


So, the pouring out of His blood simply demonstrates His innate Love that DOES NOT change or fade or fail..

We all, naturally, have a little fruit.. but unless it is matured in Christ it will turn to vinegar, we literally become bitter..
The Cross.. the Cross.
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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7/24/2012 6:52:43 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/23/2012 7:11:04 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
At 7/23/2012 6:32:39 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 7/23/2012 6:20:04 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
Doesn't matter.

God deemed it was necessary, therefore, it was necessary.

Presenting: The synopsis of Christian ethics.


Amen.

Why are you proud of your capacity to negate critical thinking?
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Paradox_7
Posts: 1,870
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7/24/2012 7:01:24 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/24/2012 6:52:43 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 7/23/2012 7:11:04 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
At 7/23/2012 6:32:39 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 7/23/2012 6:20:04 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
Doesn't matter.

God deemed it was necessary, therefore, it was necessary.

Presenting: The synopsis of Christian ethics.


Amen.

Why are you proud of your capacity to negate critical thinking?

I do not negate critical thinking, I negate critical thinking, about useless information.

We will never know, why God required blood, or why God didn't make us like Goku..

like i said before -- minutiae.
: At 10/23/2012 8:06:03 PM, tvellalott wrote:
: Don't be. The Catholic Church is ran by Darth Sidius for fvck sake. As far as I'm concerned, you're a bona fide member of the Sith.
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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7/24/2012 7:11:15 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/24/2012 7:01:24 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
I do not negate critical thinking, I negate critical thinking, about useless information.

We will never know, why God required blood, or why God didn't make us like Goku..

like i said before -- minutiae.

No. Bad dog. That is not why you believe that statement. If you are actually willing to admit that you don't know God's intentions for intellectual reasons then you are similarly able to admit you don't know if God exists. Don't hide blatantly emotional convictions behind shallow rationalization.

Don't throw your hands up in the air and say "I dunno" when it's convenient to to protect your boring idea of truth.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
tvellalott
Posts: 10,864
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7/24/2012 7:34:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I think the more important question is...

Did Jesus/God really sacrifice anything?
"Caitlyn Jenner is an incredibly brave and stunningly beautiful woman."

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tvellalott
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7/24/2012 7:36:35 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/24/2012 7:11:15 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 7/24/2012 7:01:24 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
I do not negate critical thinking, I negate critical thinking, about useless information.

We will never know, why God required blood, or why God didn't make us like Goku..

like i said before -- minutiae.

No. Bad dog. That is not why you believe that statement. If you are actually willing to admit that you don't know God's intentions for intellectual reasons then you are similarly able to admit you don't know if God exists. Don't hide blatantly emotional convictions behind shallow rationalization.

Don't throw your hands up in the air and say "I dunno" when it's convenient to to protect your boring idea of truth.

Great post FREEDO.
"Caitlyn Jenner is an incredibly brave and stunningly beautiful woman."

Muh threads
Using mafia tactics in real-life: http://www.debate.org...
6 years of DDO: http://www.debate.org...
Paradox_7
Posts: 1,870
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7/24/2012 7:39:59 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/24/2012 7:11:15 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 7/24/2012 7:01:24 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
I do not negate critical thinking, I negate critical thinking, about useless information.

We will never know, why God required blood, or why God didn't make us like Goku..

like i said before -- minutiae.

No. Bad dog. That is not why you believe that statement. If you are actually willing to admit that you don't know God's intentions for intellectual reasons then you are similarly able to admit you don't know if God exists. Don't hide blatantly emotional convictions behind shallow rationalization.

Don't throw your hands up in the air and say "I dunno" when it's convenient to to protect your boring idea of truth.


ZzZzZ... -_-

Interesting as it may be, useful-- it is not.

Why would you suggest my idea of truth was boring?.. It's pretty damn interesting to me!..lol
: At 10/23/2012 8:06:03 PM, tvellalott wrote:
: Don't be. The Catholic Church is ran by Darth Sidius for fvck sake. As far as I'm concerned, you're a bona fide member of the Sith.
Jessalyn
Posts: 125
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7/24/2012 7:43:43 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/23/2012 6:17:12 PM, jat93 wrote:
Consider the following:

- There is a being which created the universe.
- This being is all powerful, wise, and loving.
- This being cares about humanity.
- This being wants to forgive the sins of humanity.

Why would such a being send his only son to suffer and die for the sins of humanity? Why would he not want to just forgive humanity for its sins straightaway, rather than demanding the suffering and death of his own son? (Also note the utter immorality of scapegoating, which completely negates the moral principle of personal responsibility.)

I don't understand how, if God is both all powerful and wise, he couldn't find a better/more efficient way to save humanity than to send Jesus to be crucified on the cross. And if he is all loving, I don't understand how he wouldn't want to find a way of saving humanity that didn't involve making his son undergo a human sacrifice because of humanity's sins.

The whole idea that a perfect God impregnated a human woman so that his son could come to earth in humanly form in order to be tortured and killed for the sins of humanity seems to me both bizarre and reprehensible.

It is bizarre and reprehensible, as is the rest of the Christian religion. As are all monotheistic religions, for that matter.
...As is the human race in general, for that matter...
WARNING: Hitchslaps may become inflamed when accompanied by unceasing stupidity.
The_Fool_on_the_hill
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7/24/2012 7:50:10 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/24/2012 6:52:43 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 7/23/2012 7:11:04 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
At 7/23/2012 6:32:39 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 7/23/2012 6:20:04 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
Doesn't matter.

God deemed it was necessary, therefore, it was necessary.

Presenting: The synopsis of Christian ethics.


Amen.

Why are you proud of your capacity to negate critical thinking?

The Fool: Oh yeah well
"The bud disappears when the blossom breaks through, and we might say that the former is refuted by the latter; in the same way when the fruit comes, the blossom may be explained to be a false form of the plant's existence, for the fruit appears as its true nature in place of the blossom. These stages are not merely differentiated; they supplant one another as being incompatible with one another." G. W. F. HEGEL
Paradox_7
Posts: 1,870
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7/24/2012 8:02:42 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/24/2012 7:43:43 PM, Jessalyn wrote:
At 7/23/2012 6:17:12 PM, jat93 wrote:
Consider the following:

- There is a being which created the universe.
- This being is all powerful, wise, and loving.
- This being cares about humanity.
- This being wants to forgive the sins of humanity.

Why would such a being send his only son to suffer and die for the sins of humanity? Why would he not want to just forgive humanity for its sins straightaway, rather than demanding the suffering and death of his own son? (Also note the utter immorality of scapegoating, which completely negates the moral principle of personal responsibility.)

I don't understand how, if God is both all powerful and wise, he couldn't find a better/more efficient way to save humanity than to send Jesus to be crucified on the cross. And if he is all loving, I don't understand how he wouldn't want to find a way of saving humanity that didn't involve making his son undergo a human sacrifice because of humanity's sins.

The whole idea that a perfect God impregnated a human woman so that his son could come to earth in humanly form in order to be tortured and killed for the sins of humanity seems to me both bizarre and reprehensible.

It is bizarre and reprehensible, as is the rest of the Christian religion. As are all monotheistic religions, for that matter.
...As is the human race in general, for that matter...


Lmao, the majority of people in the world believe in a God... i think it's you who is bizarre.

I've actually decided to reserve my serious discussions, for Theists..

Atheists only get clown'd on.. I'm sorry, I just can't take you guys seriously!.. lol
: At 10/23/2012 8:06:03 PM, tvellalott wrote:
: Don't be. The Catholic Church is ran by Darth Sidius for fvck sake. As far as I'm concerned, you're a bona fide member of the Sith.
tvellalott
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7/24/2012 8:10:23 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/24/2012 8:02:42 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
Lmao, the majority of people in the world believe in a God... i think it's you who is bizarre.

I've actually decided to reserve my serious discussions, for Theists..

Atheists only get clown'd on.. I'm sorry, I just can't take you guys seriously!.. lol

This post makes baby Jesus cry in embarrassment.
"Caitlyn Jenner is an incredibly brave and stunningly beautiful woman."

Muh threads
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Paradox_7
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7/24/2012 8:33:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/24/2012 8:10:23 PM, tvellalott wrote:
At 7/24/2012 8:02:42 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
Lmao, the majority of people in the world believe in a God... i think it's you who is bizarre.

I've actually decided to reserve my serious discussions, for Theists..

Atheists only get clown'd on.. I'm sorry, I just can't take you guys seriously!.. lol

This post makes baby Jesus cry in embarrassment.


Luckily, Christ doesn't feel embarassed, he feels compassion for his sheep.

baaah.. lol
: At 10/23/2012 8:06:03 PM, tvellalott wrote:
: Don't be. The Catholic Church is ran by Darth Sidius for fvck sake. As far as I'm concerned, you're a bona fide member of the Sith.
tvellalott
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7/24/2012 8:42:11 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/24/2012 8:33:22 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
At 7/24/2012 8:10:23 PM, tvellalott wrote:
At 7/24/2012 8:02:42 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
Lmao, the majority of people in the world believe in a God... i think it's you who is bizarre.

I've actually decided to reserve my serious discussions, for Theists..

Atheists only get clown'd on.. I'm sorry, I just can't take you guys seriously!.. lol

This post makes baby Jesus cry in embarrassment.


Luckily, Christ doesn't feel embarassed, he feels compassion for his sheep.

baaah.. lol

How do you know? If I founded a religion based on charity and good will and two thousand years later a bunch of preachy cvnts were using my name to advocate ignorance and intolerance, I'd be pretty fvcking embarrassed.
"Caitlyn Jenner is an incredibly brave and stunningly beautiful woman."

Muh threads
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Paradox_7
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7/24/2012 8:50:41 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/24/2012 8:42:11 PM, tvellalott wrote:
At 7/24/2012 8:33:22 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
At 7/24/2012 8:10:23 PM, tvellalott wrote:
At 7/24/2012 8:02:42 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
Lmao, the majority of people in the world believe in a God... i think it's you who is bizarre.

I've actually decided to reserve my serious discussions, for Theists..

Atheists only get clown'd on.. I'm sorry, I just can't take you guys seriously!.. lol

This post makes baby Jesus cry in embarrassment.


Luckily, Christ doesn't feel embarassed, he feels compassion for his sheep.

baaah.. lol

How do you know? If I founded a religion based on charity and good will and two thousand years later a bunch of preachy cvnts were using my name to advocate ignorance and intolerance, I'd be pretty fvcking embarrassed.


Hmm, maybe the books written by the people he chose to be his apostles?

advocate ignorance and intolerance.. judgin by you use of words to describe those preachy cvnts, i'd say it is you, who is intolerant.

But, seriously.. do you think the majority of Christians on this site are just horrible people or what?

do you think, given that we all generally have the same resources as you, that we are just incompetent? That we hate knowledge or growth?

I know its a bit hard to see past your anus (maybe a bit clogged), but do try.. do try.
: At 10/23/2012 8:06:03 PM, tvellalott wrote:
: Don't be. The Catholic Church is ran by Darth Sidius for fvck sake. As far as I'm concerned, you're a bona fide member of the Sith.
tvellalott
Posts: 10,864
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7/24/2012 9:01:59 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/24/2012 8:50:41 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
At 7/24/2012 8:42:11 PM, tvellalott wrote:
At 7/24/2012 8:33:22 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
At 7/24/2012 8:10:23 PM, tvellalott wrote:
At 7/24/2012 8:02:42 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
Lmao, the majority of people in the world believe in a God... i think it's you who is bizarre.

I've actually decided to reserve my serious discussions, for Theists..

Atheists only get clown'd on.. I'm sorry, I just can't take you guys seriously!.. lol

This post makes baby Jesus cry in embarrassment.


Luckily, Christ doesn't feel embarassed, he feels compassion for his sheep.

baaah.. lol

How do you know? If I founded a religion based on charity and good will and two thousand years later a bunch of preachy cvnts were using my name to advocate ignorance and intolerance, I'd be pretty fvcking embarrassed.


Hmm, maybe the books written by the people he chose to be his apostles?

Wut?

advocate ignorance and intolerance.. judgin by you use of words to describe those preachy cvnts, i'd say it is you, who is intolerant.

Guilty as charged. I'm definitely a major hypocrite. However, I would never say "Oh, I'm saving my serious discussions exclusively for Theists because you Atheists are just a joke" as you did. That's so stupid it makes my brain hurt.

But, seriously.. do you think the majority of Christians on this site are just horrible people or what?

Didn't say that, nor would I.

do you think, given that we all generally have the same resources as you, that we are just incompetent? That we hate knowledge or growth?

So of you... definitely.

I know its a bit hard to see past your anus (maybe a bit clogged), but do try.. do try.

Right. It's hard being an arsehole but someone has deal with sh!t.
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EvanK
Posts: 599
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7/24/2012 10:00:18 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/23/2012 6:20:04 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
At 7/23/2012 6:17:12 PM, jat93 wrote:
Consider the following:

- There is a being which created the universe.
- This being is all powerful, wise, and loving.
- This being cares about humanity.
- This being wants to forgive the sins of humanity.

Why would such a being send his only son to suffer and die for the sins of humanity? Why would he not want to just forgive humanity for its sins straightaway, rather than demanding the suffering and death of his own son? (Also note the utter immorality of scapegoating, which completely negates the moral principle of personal responsibility.)

I don't understand how, if God is both all powerful and wise, he couldn't find a better/more efficient way to save humanity than to send Jesus to be crucified on the cross. And if he is all loving, I don't understand how he wouldn't want to find a way of saving humanity that didn't involve making his son undergo a human sacrifice because of humanity's sins.

The whole idea that a perfect God impregnated a human woman so that his son could come to earth in humanly form in order to be tortured and killed for the sins of humanity seems to me both bizarre and reprehensible.


Doesn't matter.

God deemed it was necessary, therefore, it was necessary.

Can't argue that logic! :P

If Jesus was the son of God and died for our sins, why did he yell out "Father, Father, why have you foresaken me" while dying on the cross? If God is all knowing, and Jesus is supposedly God, he would know that God the Father didn't foresake him. Right?

And of course, like the OP said, isn't it possible that God could have found another way to save us? I thought God was against murder, and yet he sent his son to earth to be murdered. And he made the Roman soldiers specifically to kill Jesus, condemning them to eternal hell. Doesn't make sense to me, anyway...
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Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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7/24/2012 11:31:01 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
If God is omnipotent, it wasn't necessary. God could have gotten exactly what he wanted without this human sacrifice. Maybe if God exists, he is a sadist. Who knows?
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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7/24/2012 11:31:58 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/23/2012 6:32:39 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 7/23/2012 6:20:04 PM, Paradox_7 wrote:
Doesn't matter.

God deemed it was necessary, therefore, it was necessary.

Presenting: The synopsis of Christian ethics.

Pretty much. God could rape 50 crying children and it would be good to Christians, because God did it. It's an absolutely absurd moral standard to say the least.