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Sincere question from a christian to atheists

imabench
Posts: 21,219
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8/23/2012 8:58:00 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Have you ever tried to convert someone from anything to atheism?

I ask because a weird cousin of mine from Kansas (the part of kansas where fried butter on a stick is an acceptable meal) says that he doesnt trust any Atheists because they always try to convert him, and it got me thinking about how many Atheists out there actually try converting people.

So again, Have you ever tried converting someone or have you always just kept to yourself?
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"
Geogeer: "Nobody is dumb enough to become my protege."

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000ike
Posts: 11,196
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8/23/2012 9:04:27 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
The thing is that whatever people believe strongly about they try to spread it. In the same fashion that you have Christians knocking on your door to give you some pamphlet you don't want, or your friends arguing with you over who's better Obama or Romney, Atheists too voice their opinions. But since atheists are so unwelcome, their voice of dissent feels like constant attempted conversion instead of a regular conversation.

I don't go out of my way to have religious conversations irl, but God help whoever insults atheism in front of me (in a nonthreatening argumentative,...and ironic way).
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
imabench
Posts: 21,219
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8/23/2012 9:10:10 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/23/2012 9:07:32 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:04:27 AM, 000ike wrote:

God help

Your coming around....You mentioned Him.

guys i swear of either of you derail this thread i'll add you to my wall of fail (I dont have one but Ill create it just for the first person who messes this up)
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"
Geogeer: "Nobody is dumb enough to become my protege."

7/14/16 = The Presidency Dies

DDO: THE MOVIE = http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...

VP of DDO from Dec 14th 2014 to Jan 1st 2015
imabench
Posts: 21,219
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8/23/2012 9:11:23 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/23/2012 9:04:27 AM, 000ike wrote:
The thing is that whatever people believe strongly about they try to spread it. In the same fashion that you have Christians knocking on your door to give you some pamphlet you don't want, or your friends arguing with you over who's better Obama or Romney, Atheists too voice their opinions. But since atheists are so unwelcome, their voice of dissent feels like constant attempted conversion instead of a regular conversation.

I don't go out of my way to have religious conversations irl, but God help whoever insults atheism in front of me (in a nonthreatening argumentative,...and ironic way).

Ok so you dont convert people because of the unwelcome attitude towards atheists.

Score is 1-0 in favor of athiests who havent tried converting anyone
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"
Geogeer: "Nobody is dumb enough to become my protege."

7/14/16 = The Presidency Dies

DDO: THE MOVIE = http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...

VP of DDO from Dec 14th 2014 to Jan 1st 2015
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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8/23/2012 9:21:59 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/23/2012 9:11:23 AM, imabench wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:04:27 AM, 000ike wrote:
The thing is that whatever people believe strongly about they try to spread it. In the same fashion that you have Christians knocking on your door to give you some pamphlet you don't want, or your friends arguing with you over who's better Obama or Romney, Atheists too voice their opinions. But since atheists are so unwelcome, their voice of dissent feels like constant attempted conversion instead of a regular conversation.

I don't go out of my way to have religious conversations irl, but God help whoever insults atheism in front of me (in a nonthreatening argumentative,...and ironic way).

Ok so you dont convert people because of the unwelcome attitude towards atheists.

Score is 1-0 in favor of athiests who havent tried converting anyone

I said that everyone tries to convert everyone else to everything they believe and atheists are not exempt. It's not that your cousin is wrong, it's that s/he is selectively judging. Keeping a score chart of who says what won't really do much for you
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
imabench
Posts: 21,219
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8/23/2012 9:26:00 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/23/2012 9:21:59 AM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:11:23 AM, imabench wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:04:27 AM, 000ike wrote:
The thing is that whatever people believe strongly about they try to spread it. In the same fashion that you have Christians knocking on your door to give you some pamphlet you don't want, or your friends arguing with you over who's better Obama or Romney, Atheists too voice their opinions. But since atheists are so unwelcome, their voice of dissent feels like constant attempted conversion instead of a regular conversation.

I don't go out of my way to have religious conversations irl, but God help whoever insults atheism in front of me (in a nonthreatening argumentative,...and ironic way).

Ok so you dont convert people because of the unwelcome attitude towards atheists.

Score is 1-0 in favor of athiests who havent tried converting anyone

I said that everyone tries to convert everyone else to everything they believe and atheists are not exempt.

Just answer the question Ike, have you ever tried to convert someone from religion to atheism or not?
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"
Geogeer: "Nobody is dumb enough to become my protege."

7/14/16 = The Presidency Dies

DDO: THE MOVIE = http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...

VP of DDO from Dec 14th 2014 to Jan 1st 2015
medic0506
Posts: 13,450
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8/23/2012 9:36:16 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/23/2012 9:10:10 AM, imabench wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:07:32 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:04:27 AM, 000ike wrote:

God help

Your coming around....You mentioned Him.

guys i swear of either of you derail this thread i'll add you to my wall of fail (I dont have one but Ill create it just for the first person who messes this up)

Do you like key lime pie?? If not, what kind of pie do you like?? Or are you not a pie person?? Prefer cake?? I like german chocolate.

Do you guys prefer pie or cake?? And what kind??
Koopin
Posts: 12,090
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8/23/2012 9:37:58 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Convert: "A person who has been persuaded to change their beliefs."

If you are talking about this, than he is correct.
kfc
SarcasticIndeed
Posts: 2,215
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8/23/2012 9:39:15 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/23/2012 8:58:00 AM, imabench wrote:
Have you ever tried to convert someone from anything to atheism?

I ask because a weird cousin of mine from Kansas (the part of kansas where fried butter on a stick is an acceptable meal) says that he doesnt trust any Atheists because they always try to convert him, and it got me thinking about how many Atheists out there actually try converting people.

So again, Have you ever tried converting someone or have you always just kept to yourself?

I guess I have tried to convert one guy online, I don't know if it's going to be successful, though. In real life I haven't tried. I did try to reason with a few blind believers, but they don't see reason.
<SIGNATURE CENSORED> nac
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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8/23/2012 9:39:32 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/23/2012 9:26:00 AM, imabench wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:21:59 AM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:11:23 AM, imabench wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:04:27 AM, 000ike wrote:
The thing is that whatever people believe strongly about they try to spread it. In the same fashion that you have Christians knocking on your door to give you some pamphlet you don't want, or your friends arguing with you over who's better Obama or Romney, Atheists too voice their opinions. But since atheists are so unwelcome, their voice of dissent feels like constant attempted conversion instead of a regular conversation.

I don't go out of my way to have religious conversations irl, but God help whoever insults atheism in front of me (in a nonthreatening argumentative,...and ironic way).

Ok so you dont convert people because of the unwelcome attitude towards atheists.

Score is 1-0 in favor of athiests who havent tried converting anyone

I said that everyone tries to convert everyone else to everything they believe and atheists are not exempt.

Just answer the question Ike, have you ever tried to convert someone from religion to atheism or not?

Yes, and you've seen it yourself when I argue with people in this forum section. but the necessary addition to that is that EVERYONE has, but people often spotlight and selectively judge when atheists do it. Keeping in tally of all the atheists that said will do nothing except paint a very incomplete and bias story. That's my point.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
imabench
Posts: 21,219
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8/23/2012 9:48:19 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/23/2012 9:39:32 AM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:26:00 AM, imabench wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:21:59 AM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:11:23 AM, imabench wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:04:27 AM, 000ike wrote:
The thing is that whatever people believe strongly about they try to spread it. In the same fashion that you have Christians knocking on your door to give you some pamphlet you don't want, or your friends arguing with you over who's better Obama or Romney, Atheists too voice their opinions. But since atheists are so unwelcome, their voice of dissent feels like constant attempted conversion instead of a regular conversation.

I don't go out of my way to have religious conversations irl, but God help whoever insults atheism in front of me (in a nonthreatening argumentative,...and ironic way).

Ok so you dont convert people because of the unwelcome attitude towards atheists.

Score is 1-0 in favor of athiests who havent tried converting anyone

I said that everyone tries to convert everyone else to everything they believe and atheists are not exempt.

Just answer the question Ike, have you ever tried to convert someone from religion to atheism or not?

Yes, and you've seen it yourself when I argue with people in this forum section. but the necessary addition to that is that EVERYONE has, but people often spotlight and selectively judge when atheists do it. Keeping in tally of all the atheists that said will do nothing except paint a very incomplete and bias story. That's my point.

Ok I understand. What I was looking for though is if someone has tried converting people to atheism in real life, face to face, but apparently it goes WAAAAY deeper then that
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"
Geogeer: "Nobody is dumb enough to become my protege."

7/14/16 = The Presidency Dies

DDO: THE MOVIE = http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...

VP of DDO from Dec 14th 2014 to Jan 1st 2015
Zaradi
Posts: 14,125
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8/23/2012 10:15:12 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/23/2012 9:36:16 AM, medic0506 wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:10:10 AM, imabench wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:07:32 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:04:27 AM, 000ike wrote:

God help

Your coming around....You mentioned Him.

guys i swear of either of you derail this thread i'll add you to my wall of fail (I dont have one but Ill create it just for the first person who messes this up)

Do you like key lime pie?? If not, what kind of pie do you like?? Or are you not a pie person?? Prefer cake?? I like german chocolate.

Do you guys prefer pie or cake?? And what kind??

I mean, there's nothing like a good apple pie or pumpkin pie, but I've never really been that much of a pie person. But cake is cake. Ice cream cake, cookie cake, all of it is just delicious. Generally can't go wrong with cake (unless, y'know, you do go wrong, but that's very slim-to-none chance)

I'm also a big fan of ice cream, just for it's flexability. There's just SO MANY DIFFERENT FLAVORS it's mind-blowing!
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Stephen_Hawkins
Posts: 5,316
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8/23/2012 10:29:20 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/23/2012 8:58:00 AM, imabench wrote:
Have you ever tried to convert someone from anything to atheism?

I ask because a weird cousin of mine from Kansas (the part of kansas where fried butter on a stick is an acceptable meal) says that he doesnt trust any Atheists because they always try to convert him, and it got me thinking about how many Atheists out there actually try converting people.

So again, Have you ever tried converting someone or have you always just kept to yourself?

I'd put it this way. Christianity has dozens of major evangelical schools specifically created to proselytise and convince people to be Christians. Major philosophers of the field such as W.L.Craig run these.

By comparison, A.C.Grayling recently set up his own university, the New University of the Humanities. It focuses on politics, and just nicked the philosophy course from UCL, because it wasn't that big a thing.

Those who think of atheism on a "higher level", i.e. those who teach it and similar, don't even try to convert people, as there's no reason to. If your religion is there, who cares, as long as it stays out of politics is the general idea. On the other hand, with Christianity, converting someone to your belief is saving someone for eternity for a fundamentalist. Lives are dedicated to this with no view for other pursuits because of this goal.

To put it simply, no, I never tried to convert someone to atheism. I try to stop them using silly arguments (argument from providence is still silly), and I try to help them learn of the consequences of certain beliefs, and be able to substantiate beliefs, but converting them is a cherry on top, not the goal. I'd rather have intelligent Christians than idiotic atheists.
Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. Teach him how to be Gay, he'll positively influence the GDP.

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yoda878
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8/23/2012 10:30:47 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/23/2012 10:15:12 AM, Zaradi wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:36:16 AM, medic0506 wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:10:10 AM, imabench wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:07:32 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 8/23/2012 9:04:27 AM, 000ike wrote:

God help

Your coming around....You mentioned Him.

guys i swear of either of you derail this thread i'll add you to my wall of fail (I dont have one but Ill create it just for the first person who messes this up)

Do you like key lime pie?? If not, what kind of pie do you like?? Or are you not a pie person?? Prefer cake?? I like german chocolate.

Do you guys prefer pie or cake?? And what kind??

I mean, there's nothing like a good apple pie or pumpkin pie, but I've never really been that much of a pie person. But cake is cake. Ice cream cake, cookie cake, all of it is just delicious. Generally can't go wrong with cake (unless, y'know, you do go wrong, but that's very slim-to-none chance)

I'm also a big fan of ice cream, just for it's flexability. There's just SO MANY DIFFERENT FLAVORS it's mind-blowing!

For Halloween I'm going to make this pumpkin chocolate cake you are all invited to wish you had some! :)
Me
Wnope
Posts: 6,924
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8/23/2012 10:31:54 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Eh, if someone brings it up I'll argue my point, but I've never actively tried to convert someone to atheism. At most, I've tried to puncture their beliefs in ID/creationism.
Maikuru
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8/24/2012 12:45:35 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
My friends are atheists and believe I am atheist. My family is Christian and believe I am Christian. I find overt attempts at conversion aversive, so I try not to put myself or others in that position.
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TheJackel
Posts: 508
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8/24/2012 1:45:38 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/23/2012 8:58:00 AM, imabench wrote:
Have you ever tried to convert someone from anything to atheism?

I ask because a weird cousin of mine from Kansas (the part of kansas where fried butter on a stick is an acceptable meal) says that he doesnt trust any Atheists because they always try to convert him, and it got me thinking about how many Atheists out there actually try converting people.

So again, Have you ever tried converting someone or have you always just kept to yourself?

No.. I do get into debates on subjects, but never with the intention of convert a theist. And I know from experience that it doesn't usually work as theists , if they are to convert, will usually involve some personal changes to which cause them to evaluate their beliefs.. No Atheist ever converted me to Atheism, that was a path I went down on my own.. My defining moment was when I was doing research on brainwashing and how to better advertise for the churches I did advertising for.. That process alone destroyed any faith I had in the religion giving I then learned what I was actually doing..
twocupcakes
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8/24/2012 2:11:13 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I have never tried to convert anyone to atheism. No one converted me to atheism, I just figured it out on my own. I suppose I would enjoy getting people to question there beliefs, but I usually try to avoid religious discussion.
Aaronroy
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8/24/2012 2:44:23 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Atheism does not come by way of conversion. Conversion does not exist in atheism.

Atheism comes by way of reading, it comes by introspection, it comes by discussion and intellectual enlightenment.

I've had a few agnostic friends ask me about atheism, and I could only redirect them to atheist philosophers, free-thinking authors and their literary work and other of the sort; all worth of their name, I assure you.
turn down for h'what
PARADIGM_L0ST
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8/24/2012 2:55:39 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I don't think atheists so much try to convert people as they do to de-convert people. They don't seem to necessarily want people to be atheists, but to become critical thinkers and stop blindly accepting things that aren't well thought out.

There are, however, a few militant atheists who subscribe to anti-theistic philosophies. But they're an extreme minority.
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Cody_Franklin
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8/24/2012 3:33:51 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Well, I'm agnostic, so I dunno whether the question is directed at people like me. But I do try to "convert" theists and atheists like away from gnosticism. I try to [discursively] force them into a spot where they have to roll a nihilism check on ontological commitments for or against the existence of God. I don't think we could really have a rigid conception of God in our ontologies, because I'm very skeptical about individuals' capacities to get a handle on what God's properties or nature are like (even if the Bible was produced by people who were "divinely inspired", or whatever, there's not even a way of discerning whether God's deceptive or not, whether translation errors produce serious interpretive problems, etc.).

tl;dr Yes, I try to convert theists, but I also try to convert atheists.
The_Fool_on_the_hill
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8/24/2012 3:44:32 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/23/2012 8:58:00 AM, imabench wrote:
Have you ever tried to convert someone from anything to atheism?

I ask because a weird cousin of mine from Kansas (the part of kansas where fried butter on a stick is an acceptable meal) says that he doesnt trust any Atheists because they always try to convert him, and it got me thinking about how many Atheists out there actually try converting people.

So again, Have you ever tried converting someone or have you always just kept to yourself?

The Fool: That is ignorant, it a deconversion if anything. Its asking people to come to thier senses and use thier rational capacity. Athiesm is not a Religion. Stop trying to define it into existence as one. We don't say people who don't believe in Elmo, are part of the Religion of AElmo. Nor would say people convert us to A-santa Clause-ism. So please stop that it rude and it make you all look very dihonest.
"The bud disappears when the blossom breaks through, and we might say that the former is refuted by the latter; in the same way when the fruit comes, the blossom may be explained to be a false form of the plant's existence, for the fruit appears as its true nature in place of the blossom. These stages are not merely differentiated; they supplant one another as being incompatible with one another." G. W. F. HEGEL
Jellyfish
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8/25/2012 2:46:44 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
": At 8/23/2012 8:58:00 AM, imabench wrote:
Have you ever tried to convert someone from anything to atheism?

I ask because a weird cousin of mine from Kansas (the part of kansas where fried butter on a stick is an acceptable meal) says that he doesnt trust any Atheists because they always try to convert him, and it got me thinking about how many Atheists out there actually try converting people.

So again, Have you ever tried converting someone or have you always just kept to yourself?"

Unless I'm asked about my beliefs I keep to myself. If I'm asked, I'm happy to tell people about what I do and don't believe in and why, and I'm happy to debate. My goal, however, is never to alienate someone from their beliefs or to have them believe what I believe, it's to come to a common understanding and to share ideas. People have the right to believe what they want and I won't try to change that. If they convert as a result of a debate that's their decision.
All I got is nothing but a little bit of love
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tvellalott
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8/25/2012 6:16:24 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I have honestly never tried to convert any Theists... Ever.
The one time I had a passionate debate about religion, we had to agree to disagree because I was upsetting her.
I have some family and friends who are believers and i simply avoid the subject. Having said that, the overwhelming number of people I associate with are Atheists and I often discuss religion with them...
I don't want to come across as someone seeking only a circle jerk of agreement though... Religion is not nearly as revered in Australia as in America. I'm waiting for the opportunity to invite some door-to-door Christians in for tea, biscuits and a religious discussion.
It hasn't happened yet though.
I even wear a militant atheist t-shirt in the hope someone will comment on it...
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