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‘Giving Jesus to society'

peacethroughunity
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9/1/2012 7:28:27 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Today's society puts a big challenge on our faith. We might feel that our faith is threatened.

This is the challenge we are to face on a daily basis. If built on a solid rock our relationship with Jesus will not break by any threat. Our faith depends on our relationship with Jesus.

We are to be responsible to increase our relationship with Jesus so to strengthen our faith. We are to find the ways and means to nurture our faith. Deep in our heart, we know what we should do to nurture our faith, we know whom to seek, and where to go. Jesus has told us what to do. The question is, are we doing it? Are we letting society influencing our faith? Or, we are letting our faith influencing society?

Nurturing our faith is each person responsibility and is possible when one seeks Jesus in a personal way. The love and peace that you receive from Jesus is a gift for you to give to others. Giving Jesus to others, is giving Jesus to society, is changing society.

You are part of society, and have the responsibility to change society by giving Jesus!

In Peace to all,

George Calleja – Malta
My website 'Peace and unity in our lives' with the address as

https://sites.google.com...

has the aim to provide inspiration and encouragement for life, and hope for people including youths and children around the globe to find courage in their life, by trusting God to be more present in their life.

Follow me on TWITTER https://twitter.com...
AlwaysMoreThanYou
Posts: 2,900
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9/1/2012 7:30:16 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Good post!
'When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.' - John 16:13
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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9/1/2012 8:16:25 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 7:28:27 AM, peacethroughunity wrote:
Today's society puts a big challenge on our faith. We might feel that our faith is threatened.

This is the challenge we are to face on a daily basis. If built on a solid rock our relationship with Jesus will not break by any threat. Our faith depends on our relationship with Jesus.

We are to be responsible to increase our relationship with Jesus so to strengthen our faith. We are to find the ways and means to nurture our faith. Deep in our heart, we know what we should do to nurture our faith, we know whom to seek, and where to go. Jesus has told us what to do. The question is, are we doing it? Are we letting society influencing our faith? Or, we are letting our faith influencing society?

Nurturing our faith is each person responsibility and is possible when one seeks Jesus in a personal way. The love and peace that you receive from Jesus is a gift for you to give to others. Giving Jesus to others, is giving Jesus to society, is changing society.

You are part of society, and have the responsibility to change society by giving Jesus!

In Peace to all,

George Calleja – Malta

AMEN!
TheAsylum
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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9/1/2012 8:19:42 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 8:01:17 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
Keep your "Jesus" belief to yourself. Why should anybody give two craps about Jesus?

On the contrary. Who are you? You are the non-religious in a religious forum. Just admit your every bit as religious as anyone else and stop fronting or otherwise just go to your science forum and stay out the religious one. If you wish to continue, then tuck up your lip and allow others to freely post as they like. This isnt RationalThinker debate.org is it?
TheAsylum
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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9/1/2012 8:25:18 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 8:19:42 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 9/1/2012 8:01:17 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
Keep your "Jesus" belief to yourself. Why should anybody give two craps about Jesus?

On the contrary. Who are you? You are the non-religious in a religious forum.

This is a debate forum. If everyone just agreed with each other and were theists, it couldn't be a very good debate website now would it?

Just admit your every bit as religious as anyone else and stop fronting or otherwise just go to your science forum and stay out the religious one.

Once more, this is a debate forum. If you want to go to a site where people just suck each others nob all day without confrontation, then don't go to a debate website.

If you wish to continue, then tuck up your lip and allow others to freely post as they like. This isnt RationalThinker debate.org is it?

This is debate. org genius. I'm here to debate issues. If you aren't, then you are on the wrong website!
AlwaysMoreThanYou
Posts: 2,900
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9/1/2012 8:25:38 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 8:01:17 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
Keep your "Jesus" belief to yourself. Why should anybody give two craps about Jesus?

"The love and peace that you receive from Jesus is a gift for you to give to others."

You have a problem with love and peace?
'When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.' - John 16:13
Rational_Thinker9119
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9/1/2012 8:30:25 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 8:25:38 AM, AlwaysMoreThanYou wrote:
At 9/1/2012 8:01:17 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
Keep your "Jesus" belief to yourself. Why should anybody give two craps about Jesus?

"The love and peace that you receive from Jesus is a gift for you to give to others."

You have a problem with love and peace?

Love and peace exist independently of the idea of Jesus.
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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9/1/2012 8:31:55 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 8:25:18 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/1/2012 8:19:42 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 9/1/2012 8:01:17 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
Keep your "Jesus" belief to yourself. Why should anybody give two craps about Jesus?

On the contrary. Who are you? You are the non-religious in a religious forum.

This is a debate forum. If everyone just agreed with each other and were theists, it couldn't be a very good debate website now would it?

Just admit your every bit as religious as anyone else and stop fronting or otherwise just go to your science forum and stay out the religious one.

Once more, this is a debate forum. If you want to go to a site where people just suck each others nob all day without confrontation, then don't go to a debate website.

If you wish to continue, then tuck up your lip and allow others to freely post as they like. This isnt RationalThinker debate.org is it?

This is debate. org genius. I'm here to debate issues. If you aren't, then you are on the wrong website!

Be honest with yourself, you are not here to debate and learn nothing. You are here to degrade people and thier belief for your own pleasures. You post quite clearly states that. You didnt intend any debate from the post you blatantly disrespected the new member for believing in Jesus because you dont. Indeed, great tatics.
TheAsylum
ScottyDouglas
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9/1/2012 8:34:06 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
I'd rather offend someone pushing them into someone who will lead them to Jesus with leads to heaven. Rather than flatter someone to ignore being witnessed to by someone which will result into leading them into hell.
TheAsylum
Rational_Thinker9119
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9/1/2012 8:35:43 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 8:31:55 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 9/1/2012 8:25:18 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/1/2012 8:19:42 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 9/1/2012 8:01:17 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
Keep your "Jesus" belief to yourself. Why should anybody give two craps about Jesus?

On the contrary. Who are you? You are the non-religious in a religious forum.

This is a debate forum. If everyone just agreed with each other and were theists, it couldn't be a very good debate website now would it?

Just admit your every bit as religious as anyone else and stop fronting or otherwise just go to your science forum and stay out the religious one.

Once more, this is a debate forum. If you want to go to a site where people just suck each others nob all day without confrontation, then don't go to a debate website.

If you wish to continue, then tuck up your lip and allow others to freely post as they like. This isnt RationalThinker debate.org is it?

This is debate. org genius. I'm here to debate issues. If you aren't, then you are on the wrong website!

Be honest with yourself, you are not here to debate and learn nothing.

Yes, I am.

You are here to degrade people and thier belief for your own pleasures.

No, I'm trying to learn why anyone should take this belief seriously. Did I say this belief was stupid, or did I ask a question about it? Exactly, you have no clue what you are talking about.

You post quite clearly states that.

Really? Asking a question states that I'm not here to learn something? What universe are you from dude?

You didnt intend any debate from the post you blatantly disrespected the new member for believing in Jesus because you dont. Indeed, great tatics.

How did I disrespect him? I asked a simple question: Why should anyone care about Jesus Christ, or believe he is my savior? It seems you need to dip out of your fantasy land you are living in, because it's an honest question.
Rational_Thinker9119
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9/1/2012 8:36:55 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 8:34:06 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I'd rather offend someone pushing them into someone who will lead them to Jesus with leads to heaven. Rather than flatter someone to ignore being witnessed to by someone which will result into leading them into hell.

You cannot demonstrate heaven or hell exist. These are just empty words.
ScottyDouglas
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9/1/2012 8:41:24 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
.

Really? Asking a question states that I'm not here to learn something? What universe are you from dude?

You didnt intend any debate from the post you blatantly disrespected the new member for believing in Jesus because you dont. Indeed, great tatics.

How did I disrespect him? I asked a simple question: Why should anyone care about Jesus Christ, or believe he is my savior? It seems you need to dip out of your fantasy land you are living in, because it's an honest question.

Ok, Since time is on our side(thousands of years compared to your, what, couple hundreds of years of modern science), Why not? Why not believe in Jesus? What reason do you have not to? You want all the reasons, scientific evidence, aercheology, Historical, and clear documented evidence that you obviously have not done one Ioda of search for? Clearly leaving you in the realm of not using reason, thought and logic, on a matter you know little about.
TheAsylum
ScottyDouglas
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9/1/2012 8:42:05 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 8:36:55 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/1/2012 8:34:06 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I'd rather offend someone pushing them into someone who will lead them to Jesus with leads to heaven. Rather than flatter someone to ignore being witnessed to by someone which will result into leading them into hell.

You cannot demonstrate heaven or hell exist. These are just empty words.

And yours are solid?
TheAsylum
Rational_Thinker9119
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9/1/2012 8:56:21 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 8:41:24 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
.

Really? Asking a question states that I'm not here to learn something? What universe are you from dude?

You didnt intend any debate from the post you blatantly disrespected the new member for believing in Jesus because you dont. Indeed, great tatics.

How did I disrespect him? I asked a simple question: Why should anyone care about Jesus Christ, or believe he is my savior? It seems you need to dip out of your fantasy land you are living in, because it's an honest question.

Ok, Since time is on our side(thousands of years compared to your, what, couple hundreds of years of modern science), Why not?

Why not? That's called the switching the burden of proof fallacy. It would be like if I said it was reasonable to believe that I had a time machine in my basement, because, why not? Come on man. Either way, the more time spent without science, is more time spent in deeper states of ignorance.

Why not believe in Jesus? What reason do you have not to?

The same reason you don't believe there is an giant abominable snowman on the icy moon of Europa. There is no evidence of this claim, and no good reasons to believe this claim. Just like, I see no reason to believe Jesus Christ is any savior, or any son of any God. Supnernatural raisings from the dead by magical beings are far-fetched. Until good arguments for these arise, there is no reason to think it's true.

You want all the reasons, scientific evidence, aercheology, Historical, and clear documented evidence that you obviously have not done one Ioda of search for?

I'm not saying there was never a man named Jesus, just that there is no good reason to believe he was supernatural and was my savior. Julius Ceaser had supernatural myths floating around about him too, but we don't actually believe the history that complies with the reality we actually live in. Even Kim Il-sung had supernatural myths about him, and he didn't exist all that long ago (people believed that he could throw a pinecone and turn it into a grenade), but do any of us take this grenade/ pinecone scenario as history just because it is written down in North Korean books? No, there have always been supernatural myths associated with huge influential people in history. It's all psychological, to bulk the person up to be more than human so more people buy into it. Some peopel even think Obama was the anti-Christ..So, even in modern days, humans are still deluding themselves and making supernatural crap up.

Clearly leaving you in the realm of not using reason, thought and logic, on a matter you know little about.

Clearly, I am using reason, thought, and logic because I don't believe in things that have no foundation for them, and you are gullible and believe what you want to hear.
ScottyDouglas
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9/1/2012 8:58:07 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Simon Greenleaf was Royal Professor of Law at Harvard and a main founder of the Harvard Law School. He wrote the famous legal volume A Treatise on the Law of Evidence, which many consider to be the greatest legal volume ever written.

Greenleaf was a skeptic firmly set against Christianity, and taught his students Christianity was false. When one of his students challenged him to investigate evidence for Christianity for himself, he set out to disprove the Biblical testimony concerning the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

"The foundation of our religion is a basis of fact - the fact of the birth, ministry, miracles, death, resurrection by the Evangelists as having actually occurred, within their own personal knowledge ... it was therefore impossible that they could have persisted in affirming the truths they have narrated, had not Jesus actually rose from the dead, and had they not known this fact as certainly as they knew any other fact."

"the great character they have portrayed is perfect. It is the character of a sinless Being ; of one supremely wise and supremely good. It exhibits no error, no sinister intention, no imprudence, no ignorance, no evil passion, no impatience; in a word, no fault; but all is perfect uprightness, innocence, wisdom, goodness and truth."

Simon Greenleaf, LL.D., Examination of the Testimony of the Four Evangelists, by the Rules of Evidence Administered in Courts of Justice, with an Account of the Trial of Jesus, Boston: Charles C. Little and James Brown 1846, p. 67.

Sir William Ramsey, an eminent British scholar and archaeologist, was a Professor at both Oxford and Cambridge. He was raised as an atheist and skeptic and was convinced the Bible was fraudulent. He believed Luke's writings were not historically sound, and that travels of the Apostle Paul recorded in the book of Acts were the weakest part of the New Testament. Therefore, he set out to dispove the book of Acts by personally tracing the Apostle Paul's journeys, spade in hand. However, his own extensive 15-year field investigation of Near East archaeology in Bible lands forced him to completely reverse his position.
He stated:
"I set out to look for truth on the borderland where Greece and Asia meet, and found it there. You may press the words of Luke in a degree beyond any other historian's and they stand the keenest scrutiny and the hardest treatment." "Luke is a historian of the first rank; not merely are his statements of facts trustworthy; he is possessed of the true historic sense ... In short this author should be placed along with the very greatest of historians."

Sir William Ramsey, The Bearing of Recent Discovery on the Trustworthiness of the New Testament, 1915, pp. 81, 222.
Of Ramsay's book, Josh McDowell, Christian author and former skeptic, writes:
"The book caused a furor of dismay among the skeptics of the world. Its attitude was utterly unexpected because it was contrary to the announced intention of the author years before ... for twenty years more, book after book from the same author came from the press, each filled with additional evidence of the exact, minute truthfulness of the whole New Testament as tested by the spade on the spot. The evidence was so overwhelming that many infidels announced their repudiation of their former unbelief and accepted Christianity. And these books have stood the test of time, not one having been refuted, nor have I found even any attempt to refute them."

William Albright was a Biblical and archeological scholar who mastered more than 26 ancient and modern languages. He stated:
"The excessive skepticism shown toward the Bible by important historical schools of the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries, certain phrases of which still appear periodically, has been progressively discredited. Discovery after discovery has established the accuracy of innumerable details, and has brought increased recognition to the value of the Bible as a source of history."
Albright, William F., The Archaeology of Palestine and the Bible, Ada, MI: Revell 1935, p. 127.

Millar Burrows, renowned Professor of Archaeology at Yale University, exposed the cause of persistent unbelief:
"The excessive skepticism of many liberal theologians stems not from a careful evaluation of the available data, but from an enormous predisposition against the supernatural."
Burrows, Millar, What Mean These Stones? New York, NY: Meridian Books 1956, p. 176.

William F. Albright, one of the world's foremost biblical archaeologists, wrote:
"We can already say emphatically that there is no longer any solid basis for dating any book of the New Testament after about A.D. 80."
Albright, William F., Recent Discoveries in Biblical Lands, New York, New York: Funk and Wagnalls 1955, p. 136

http://www.miraclesormagic.com...
http://www.100prophecies.org...
http://www.creatingfutures.net...
http://www.bible.ca...
http://carm.org...
http://www.godandscience.org...

Deny it all you want but thats all you are doing is denying.
TheAsylum
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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9/1/2012 8:59:06 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 8:57:40 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
*but we don't actually believe the history that doesn't comply with the reality we actually live in.

Now, thats empty words from someone who has done little if no study on the matter at hand.
TheAsylum
ScottyDouglas
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9/1/2012 9:01:17 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Clearly leaving you in the realm of not using reason, thought and logic, on a matter you know little about.

Clearly, I am using reason, thought, and logic because I don't believe in things that have no foundation for them, and you are gullible and believe what you want to hear.

Not only hallow but shallow. There is so much foundation you are the one in fantasy land, your own fantasy.
TheAsylum
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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9/1/2012 9:10:22 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 8:58:07 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
Simon Greenleaf was Royal Professor of Law at Harvard and a main founder of the Harvard Law School. He wrote the famous legal volume A Treatise on the Law of Evidence, which many consider to be the greatest legal volume ever written.

Greenleaf was a skeptic firmly set against Christianity, and taught his students Christianity was false. When one of his students challenged him to investigate evidence for Christianity for himself, he set out to disprove the Biblical testimony concerning the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

"The foundation of our religion is a basis of fact - the fact of the birth, ministry, miracles, death, resurrection by the Evangelists as having actually occurred, within their own personal knowledge ... it was therefore impossible that they could have persisted in affirming the truths they have narrated, had not Jesus actually rose from the dead, and had they not known this fact as certainly as they knew any other fact."

The quote above is one big bare assertion, supported by nothing.


"the great character they have portrayed is perfect. It is the character of a sinless Being ; of one supremely wise and supremely good. It exhibits no error, no sinister intention, no imprudence, no ignorance, no evil passion, no impatience; in a word, no fault; but all is perfect uprightness, innocence, wisdom, goodness and truth."

Jesus has sinned though, according to The Bible. He broke Sabbath and uttered the name of other Gods.


Simon Greenleaf, LL.D., Examination of the Testimony of the Four Evangelists, by the Rules of Evidence Administered in Courts of Justice, with an Account of the Trial of Jesus, Boston: Charles C. Little and James Brown 1846, p. 67.

Sir William Ramsey, an eminent British scholar and archaeologist, was a Professor at both Oxford and Cambridge. He was raised as an atheist and skeptic and was convinced the Bible was fraudulent. He believed Luke's writings were not historically sound, and that travels of the Apostle Paul recorded in the book of Acts were the weakest part of the New Testament. Therefore, he set out to dispove the book of Acts by personally tracing the Apostle Paul's journeys, spade in hand. However, his own extensive 15-year field investigation of Near East archaeology in Bible lands forced him to completely reverse his position.
He stated:
"I set out to look for truth on the borderland where Greece and Asia meet, and found it there. You may press the words of Luke in a degree beyond any other historian's and they stand the keenest scrutiny and the hardest treatment." "Luke is a historian of the first rank; not merely are his statements of facts trustworthy; he is possessed of the true historic sense ... In short this author should be placed along with the very greatest of historians."

And?....You do know that more Christians have switched to Atheism, and than vice versa, right? I'm not really seeing your point with this post here lol

Sir William Ramsey, The Bearing of Recent Discovery on the Trustworthiness of the New Testament, 1915, pp. 81, 222.
Of Ramsay's book, Josh McDowell, Christian author and former skeptic, writes:
"The book caused a furor of dismay among the skeptics of the world. Its attitude was utterly unexpected because it was contrary to the announced intention of the author years before ... for twenty years more, book after book from the same author came from the press, each filled with additional evidence of the exact, minute truthfulness of the whole New Testament as tested by the spade on the spot. The evidence was so overwhelming that many infidels announced their repudiation of their former unbelief and accepted Christianity. And these books have stood the test of time, not one having been refuted, nor have I found even any attempt to refute them."

Once more, what is your point with this? I can site many famous people too like Dan Barker who was once a preacher, researched the evidence, and found out. there was no no foundation for Christianity. This is much more common. I'm still failing to see the point you are trying to make here, you aren't really presenting any good reasons to believe in Christianity here, you are just quoting former Atheists who converted to Christianity...And?


William Albright was a Biblical and archeological scholar who mastered more than 26 ancient and modern languages. He stated:
"The excessive skepticism shown toward the Bible by important historical schools of the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries, certain phrases of which still appear periodically, has been progressively discredited. Discovery after discovery has established the accuracy of innumerable details, and has brought increased recognition to the value of the Bible as a source of history."
Albright, William F., The Archaeology of Palestine and the Bible, Ada, MI: Revell 1935, p. 127.

People bare asserted the accuracy of something, doesn't make it so. So please, what is the point of these quotes? I fail to see valid point for your position here.


Millar Burrows, renowned Professor of Archaeology at Yale University, exposed the cause of persistent unbelief:
"The excessive skepticism of many liberal theologians stems not from a careful evaluation of the available data, but from an enormous predisposition against the supernatural."
Burrows, Millar, What Mean These Stones? New York, NY: Meridian Books 1956, p. 176.

Bare Assertion. Once more, mentioning people who converted from Atheism to Christianity is supposed to prove what exactly? Look the numbers up, theism is slowly on the decline and Atheism on the rise. Of course, this does absolutely nothing to demonstrate which one is true and which one isn't. Thus, this entire post is a waste of time.


William F. Albright, one of the world's foremost biblical archaeologists, wrote:
"We can already say emphatically that there is no longer any solid basis for dating any book of the New Testament after about A.D. 80."
Albright, William F., Recent Discoveries in Biblical Lands, New York, New York: Funk and Wagnalls 1955, p. 136

So he claims there is no basis to debate it, and that makes it so? Like I said, you just believe what you want to here. You obviously don't care about real evidence.


http://www.miraclesormagic.com...
http://www.100prophecies.org...
http://www.creatingfutures.net...
http://www.bible.ca...
http://carm.org...
http://www.godandscience.org...

Deny it all you want but thats all you are doing is denying.

Denying what? You haven't presented anything to deny lol Quoting people making bare assertions is not reasoning, logic, or evidence. Epic fail.
000ike
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9/1/2012 9:10:34 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 8:25:38 AM, AlwaysMoreThanYou wrote:
At 9/1/2012 8:01:17 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
Keep your "Jesus" belief to yourself. Why should anybody give two craps about Jesus?

"The love and peace that you receive from Jesus is a gift for you to give to others."

You have a problem with love and peace?

Peace, freedom, and happiness are brought about in letting other people be themselves and respecting their beliefs.

Your message of peace and love from Jesus is disingenuous and dishonest,...because you use it to disrespect atheism while feeling sacrosanct by virtue of the "kindness" of your words.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Rational_Thinker9119
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9/1/2012 9:14:03 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 8:59:06 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 9/1/2012 8:57:40 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
*but we don't actually believe the history that doesn't comply with the reality we actually live in.

Now, thats empty words from someone who has done little if no study on the matter at hand.

Like you have? Everything you typed there was copied and other websites pretty much word for word lol
Rational_Thinker9119
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9/1/2012 9:15:19 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 9:01:17 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
Clearly leaving you in the realm of not using reason, thought and logic, on a matter you know little about.

Clearly, I am using reason, thought, and logic because I don't believe in things that have no foundation for them, and you are gullible and believe what you want to hear.

Not only hallow but shallow. There is so much foundation you are the one in fantasy land, your own fantasy.

Bare assertion. What foundation? You keep on saying there is all this foundation, but present none. You quote all these people who say there is foundation, but present none. Where is the evidence? I have researched this subject, and there is 0 evidence to support a supernatural Jesus Christ.
ScottyDouglas
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9/1/2012 9:27:33 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 9:15:19 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/1/2012 9:01:17 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
Clearly leaving you in the realm of not using reason, thought and logic, on a matter you know little about.

Clearly, I am using reason, thought, and logic because I don't believe in things that have no foundation for them, and you are gullible and believe what you want to hear.

Not only hallow but shallow. There is so much foundation you are the one in fantasy land, your own fantasy.

Bare assertion. What foundation? You keep on saying there is all this foundation, but present none. You quote all these people who say there is foundation, but present none. Where is the evidence? I have researched this subject, and there is 0 evidence to support a supernatural Jesus Christ.

The evidence has been shown regardless where it came from, BTW, from scholars of the highest order and you still deny it, lol. My point, you dont care about the overwhelming evidence, all you care about is what you want to believe. The foundation remains regardless if you deny it. Preach on brother.
TheAsylum
ScottyDouglas
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9/1/2012 9:28:53 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 9:14:03 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/1/2012 8:59:06 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 9/1/2012 8:57:40 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
*but we don't actually believe the history that doesn't comply with the reality we actually live in.

Now, thats empty words from someone who has done little if no study on the matter at hand.

Like you have? Everything you typed there was copied and other websites pretty much word for word lol

Thier words speak louder than I ever could. You deny scholars who have done many years of research and you still deny it. No, you deny logic and fact.
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ScottyDouglas
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9/1/2012 9:34:15 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 9:10:22 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/1/2012 8:58:07 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
Simon Greenleaf was Royal Professor of Law at Harvard and a main founder of the Harvard Law School. He wrote the famous legal volume A Treatise on the Law of Evidence, which many consider to be the greatest legal volume ever written.

Greenleaf was a skeptic firmly set against Christianity, and taught his students Christianity was false. When one of his students challenged him to investigate evidence for Christianity for himself, he set out to disprove the Biblical testimony concerning the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

"The foundation of our religion is a basis of fact - the fact of the birth, ministry, miracles, death, resurrection by the Evangelists as having actually occurred, within their own personal knowledge ... it was therefore impossible that they could have persisted in affirming the truths they have narrated, had not Jesus actually rose from the dead, and had they not known this fact as certainly as they knew any other fact."

The quote above is one big bare assertion, supported by nothing.

Yeah right, who says, YOU?Lol

"the great character they have portrayed is perfect. It is the character of a sinless Being ; of one supremely wise and supremely good. It exhibits no error, no sinister intention, no imprudence, no ignorance, no evil passion, no impatience; in a word, no fault; but all is perfect uprightness, innocence, wisdom, goodness and truth."

Jesus has sinned though, according to The Bible. He broke Sabbath and uttered the name of other Gods.

Now thats a assertion there.

Simon Greenleaf, LL.D., Examination of the Testimony of the Four Evangelists, by the Rules of Evidence Administered in Courts of Justice, with an Account of the Trial of Jesus, Boston: Charles C. Little and James Brown 1846, p. 67.

Sir William Ramsey, an eminent British scholar and archaeologist, was a Professor at both Oxford and Cambridge. He was raised as an atheist and skeptic and was convinced the Bible was fraudulent. He believed Luke's writings were not historically sound, and that travels of the Apostle Paul recorded in the book of Acts were the weakest part of the New Testament. Therefore, he set out to dispove the book of Acts by personally tracing the Apostle Paul's journeys, spade in hand. However, his own extensive 15-year field investigation of Near East archaeology in Bible lands forced him to completely reverse his position.
He stated:
"I set out to look for truth on the borderland where Greece and Asia meet, and found it there. You may press the words of Luke in a degree beyond any other historian's and they stand the keenest scrutiny and the hardest treatment." "Luke is a historian of the first rank; not merely are his statements of facts trustworthy; he is possessed of the true historic sense ... In short this author should be placed along with the very greatest of historians."

And?....You do know that more Christians have switched to Atheism, and than vice versa, right? I'm not really seeing your point with this post here lol

Your statistics are where?
Sir William Ramsey, The Bearing of Recent Discovery on the Trustworthiness of the New Testament, 1915, pp. 81, 222.
Of Ramsay's book, Josh McDowell, Christian author and former skeptic, writes:
"The book caused a furor of dismay among the skeptics of the world. Its attitude was utterly unexpected because it was contrary to the announced intention of the author years before ... for twenty years more, book after book from the same author came from the press, each filled with additional evidence of the exact, minute truthfulness of the whole New Testament as tested by the spade on the spot. The evidence was so overwhelming that many infidels announced their repudiation of their former unbelief and accepted Christianity. And these books have stood the test of time, not one having been refuted, nor have I found even any attempt to refute them."

Once more, what is your point with this? I can site many famous people too like Dan Barker who was once a preacher, researched the evidence, and found out. there was no no foundation for Christianity. This is much more common. I'm still failing to see the point you are trying to make here, you aren't really presenting any good reasons to believe in Christianity here, you are just quoting former Atheists who converted to Christianity...And?


William Albright was a Biblical and archeological scholar who mastered more than 26 ancient and modern languages. He stated:
"The excessive skepticism shown toward the Bible by important historical schools of the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries, certain phrases of which still appear periodically, has been progressively discredited. Discovery after discovery has established the accuracy of innumerable details, and has brought increased recognition to the value of the Bible as a source of history."
Albright, William F., The Archaeology of Palestine and the Bible, Ada, MI: Revell 1935, p. 127.

People bare asserted the accuracy of something, doesn't make it so. So please, what is the point of these quotes? I fail to see valid point for your position here.

They assert? They did massive study and that still isnt good enough for you. You dont care about about the truth through study. You only about what you want to believe.


Millar Burrows, renowned Professor of Archaeology at Yale University, exposed the cause of persistent unbelief:
"The excessive skepticism of many liberal theologians stems not from a careful evaluation of the available data, but from an enormous predisposition against the supernatural."
Burrows, Millar, What Mean These Stones? New York, NY: Meridian Books 1956, p. 176.

Bare Assertion. Once more, mentioning people who converted from Atheism to Christianity is supposed to prove what exactly? Look the numbers up, theism is slowly on the decline and Atheism on the rise. Of course, this does absolutely nothing to demonstrate which one is true and which one isn't. Thus, this entire post is a waste of time.

Of course atheism is growing, the Bible claimed this itself. The reason is because people like you who rather listen to fairy tales then the actual trth.


William F. Albright, one of the world's foremost biblical archaeologists, wrote:
"We can already say emphatically that there is no longer any solid basis for dating any book of the New Testament after about A.D. 80."
Albright, William F., Recent Discoveries in Biblical Lands, New York, New York: Funk and Wagnalls 1955, p. 136

So he claims there is no basis to debate it, and that makes it so? Like I said, you just believe what you want to here. You obviously don't care about real evidence.

LOL, OK, If you say so.

http://www.miraclesormagic.com...
http://www.100prophecies.org...
http://www.creatingfutures.net...
http://www.bible.ca...
http://carm.org...
http://www.godandscience.org...

Deny it all you want but thats all you are doing is denying.

Denying what? You haven't presented anything to deny lol Quoting people making bare assertions is not reasoning, logic, or evidence. Epic fail.

SMH....See you dont care about any evidence.
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Rational_Thinker9119
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9/1/2012 9:35:44 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 9:27:33 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 9/1/2012 9:15:19 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/1/2012 9:01:17 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
Clearly leaving you in the realm of not using reason, thought and logic, on a matter you know little about.

Clearly, I am using reason, thought, and logic because I don't believe in things that have no foundation for them, and you are gullible and believe what you want to hear.

Not only hallow but shallow. There is so much foundation you are the one in fantasy land, your own fantasy.

Bare assertion. What foundation? You keep on saying there is all this foundation, but present none. You quote all these people who say there is foundation, but present none. Where is the evidence? I have researched this subject, and there is 0 evidence to support a supernatural Jesus Christ.

The evidence has been shown regardless where it came from, BTW, from scholars of the highest order and you still deny it, lol.

You presented scholars who you quoted asserting something is true, you didn't present any logic, reasoning, or evidence that the something was true. Anybody can quote people who agree with their position. That means nothing. Where is the argumentation and evidence?

My point, you dont care about the overwhelming evidence, all you care about is what you want to believe.

There is no overwhelming evidence. Saying there is over and over again isn't going to make it come true lol You are just embarrassing yourself. I believe what there is evidence for. There is no evidence for a supernatural Jesus Christ or good argument for his existence, so I don't believe. It's that simple. You are the one believing whatever he wants to hear, obviously, because there is 0 evidence for your beliefs, and you still believe it!

The foundation remains regardless if you deny it. Preach on brother.
ScottyDouglas
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9/1/2012 9:38:32 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
You have a problem with love and peace?

Peace, freedom, and happiness are brought about in letting other people be themselves and respecting their beliefs.

Your message of peace and love from Jesus is disingenuous and dishonest,...because you use it to disrespect atheism while feeling sacrosanct by virtue of the "kindness" of your words.:

Your message of dishonesty and disingenuous is just that. You crave to disrespect Christianity while feeling like you use logic and reason while doing so. Bravo- OOOIKE
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Rational_Thinker9119
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9/1/2012 9:38:41 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/1/2012 9:28:53 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 9/1/2012 9:14:03 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/1/2012 8:59:06 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 9/1/2012 8:57:40 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
*but we don't actually believe the history that doesn't comply with the reality we actually live in.

Now, thats empty words from someone who has done little if no study on the matter at hand.

Like you have? Everything you typed there was copied and other websites pretty much word for word lol

Thier words speak louder than I ever could. You deny scholars who have done many years of research and you still deny it. No, you deny logic and fact.

What logic and fact is there with regards to a supernatural Jesus being true? Oh ya, none. Also do you believe in Evolution by Natural Selection instead of intelligent design? If not, then you reject countless years of research and biology....The point is, there is evidence for the claim that Evolution by Natural Selection is true, while there is none that supernatural Jesus exists. So, you can quote people all day, but without the logic, reasoning and evidence behind you. You are left with nothing.
ScottyDouglas
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9/1/2012 9:41:39 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
There is no overwhelming evidence. Saying there is over and over again isn't going to make it come true lol You are just embarrassing yourself. I believe what there is evidence for. There is no evidence for a supernatural Jesus Christ or good argument for his existence, so I don't believe. It's that simple. You are the one believing whatever he wants to hear, obviously, because there is 0 evidence for your beliefs, and you still believe it!

You obviously didnt look at any links i posted which has all the quotes I posted and many more but that doesnt concern you because like I said in your heart you want to deny it, evidence doesnt matter. You said you believed Jesus existed and now you dont, make up your mind, atleast be consistent. 0 evidence, LMAO.
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