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Religion is determined by your environment.

rogue
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9/15/2012 12:30:27 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I saw this in the opinions section and I was appalled at the amount of people that are in denial of this fact and the weak supporting evidence they give against it. One's personality and decisions are determined by a combination of one's experiences and their genetics. Why would one's religion be different?
Lordknukle
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9/15/2012 12:34:29 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
It's been proven that religion is at least partly genetic, which negates the whole premise of people becoming religious because they are "touched by the spirit," or some other BS like that.

Then again, those that claim to have been "touched" might actually have had their religious genes playing tricks on them to make them religious.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
rogue
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9/15/2012 12:54:10 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 12:34:29 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
It's been proven that religion is at least partly genetic, which negates the whole premise of people becoming religious because they are "touched by the spirit," or some other BS like that.

Woah what? Are you saying your genes determine your religion or that your susceptibility to joining religion is in your genes? If you claim the first, I'd like to see some seriously good sources.

Then again, those that claim to have been "touched" might actually have had their religious genes playing tricks on them to make them religious.
Lordknukle
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9/15/2012 12:58:36 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 12:54:10 PM, rogue wrote:
At 9/15/2012 12:34:29 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
It's been proven that religion is at least partly genetic, which negates the whole premise of people becoming religious because they are "touched by the spirit," or some other BS like that.

Woah what? Are you saying your genes determine your religion or that your susceptibility to joining religion is in your genes? If you claim the first, I'd like to see some seriously good sources.

The latter, and the reason is that all religions are based on the same principles of believing in the divine to alleviate your suffering on Earth- or some crap like that.

http://www.scilogs.eu...

Then again, those that claim to have been "touched" might actually have had their religious genes playing tricks on them to make them religious.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
Zetsubou
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9/15/2012 12:59:26 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
You think there's a hereditary element to religiousness? Are you people stupid?

Do you understand that the test for this is getting pools of religious and irreligious people and finding microsatellite markers common to the religious set absent in the other. I'd be more understanding if you were insinuating that some people are more genetically disposed to ignorance and ergo religion.

Knuckle it's not proven, that's stupid.

/This should be in the science forum.
'sup DDO -- july 2013
Lordknukle
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9/15/2012 1:00:17 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
The God Gene:

http://en.wikipedia.org...
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
Lordknukle
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9/15/2012 1:01:14 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 12:59:26 PM, Zetsubou wrote:
You think there's a hereditary element to religiousness? Are you people stupid?

Do you understand that the test for this is getting pools of religious and irreligious people and finding microsatellite markers common to the religious set absent in the other. I'd be more understanding if you were insinuating that some people are more genetically disposed to ignorance and ergo religion.

Knuckle it's not proven, that's stupid.

/This should be in the science forum.

No... It's about using twin studies and examining the human genome.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
Zetsubou
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9/15/2012 1:34:58 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Wikipedia: God Gene

Dean Hamer is a discredited scientist, since the failure that was the Xq28 project he has never worked as a geneticist since. I hate the guy for the lying, BS biologist he is.

At 9/15/2012 1:01:14 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 9/15/2012 12:59:26 PM, Zetsubou wrote:
You think there's a hereditary element to religiousness? Are you people stupid?

Do you understand that the test for this is getting pools of religious and irreligious people and finding microsatellite markers common to the religious set absent in the other. I'd be more understanding if you were insinuating that some people are more genetically disposed to ignorance and ergo religion.

Knuckle it's not proven, that's stupid.

/This should be in the science forum.

No... It's about using twin studies and examining the human genome.
Twin studies are an elementary level of genetic testing, they test for the presence of correlations in genetically identical individuals they do not isolate genes that encode for the subject phenotype. They are fundamentally weaker in that they may show a correlations but cannot attribute it to gene. The ability to attribute to a gene gives a far more certain confirmation of a genetic source for the phenotype. The reason for this is that gene marker frequency can be tested in anyone, not just twins which a likely to share more than just their genetic polymorphisms.
'sup DDO -- july 2013
baggins
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9/15/2012 1:44:23 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 12:30:27 PM, rogue wrote:
I saw this in the opinions section and I was appalled at the amount of people that are in denial of this fact and the weak supporting evidence they give against it. One's personality and decisions are determined by a combination of one's experiences and their genetics. Why would one's religion be different?

Environment definitely affects religious choices. On other hand it is wrong to say that religious choices are completely decided by our environment. There is always scope for choice.

IMO Allah will judge people about choices they made while considering the environmental inputs they had. However this my personal opinion and I can't say for sure what is Islam's position on this issue.
The Holy Quran 29:19-20

See they not how Allah originates creation, then repeats it: truly that is easy for Allah.

Say: "Travel through the earth and see how Allah did originate creation; so will Allah produce a later creation: for Allah has power over all things.
OberHerr
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9/15/2012 1:45:55 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Very little is not affected by your environment.
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Official Enforcer for the DDO Elite(if they existed).

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Lordknukle
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9/15/2012 1:58:33 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 1:34:58 PM, Zetsubou wrote:
Wikipedia: God Gene

Dean Hamer is a discredited scientist, since the failure that was the Xq28 project he has never worked as a geneticist since. I hate the guy for the lying, BS biologist he is.

It was not at all a failure- although the results were mixed.

"In the 1990s Hamer began studies of the role of genes in human behavior. In 1993 he published a paper suggesting the existence of genes that influence homosexuality in males, and presented evidence that one of these genes is associated with the Xq28 marker on the X chromosome.[1] This finding was replicated in two studies in the United States but not in a third in Canada; meta-analysis indicated Xq28 has a significant but not exclusive effect.[2][3][4] Subsequently, several additional linked regions on other chromosomes have been described.[5]"

If anything, he discovered that the Xq28 gene is one part of other regions which influence homosexuality.

At 9/15/2012 1:01:14 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 9/15/2012 12:59:26 PM, Zetsubou wrote:
You think there's a hereditary element to religiousness? Are you people stupid?

Do you understand that the test for this is getting pools of religious and irreligious people and finding microsatellite markers common to the religious set absent in the other. I'd be more understanding if you were insinuating that some people are more genetically disposed to ignorance and ergo religion.

Knuckle it's not proven, that's stupid.

/This should be in the science forum.

No... It's about using twin studies and examining the human genome.
Twin studies are an elementary level of genetic testing, they test for the presence of correlations in genetically identical individuals they do not isolate genes that encode for the subject phenotype. They are fundamentally weaker in that they may show a correlations but cannot attribute it to gene. The ability to attribute to a gene gives a far more certain confirmation of a genetic source for the phenotype. The reason for this is that gene marker frequency can be tested in anyone, not just twins which a likely to share more than just their genetic polymorphisms.

Twins, especially mono-zygotic twins, share almost all of their DNA with each other. On the other hand, dizygotic twins share a lot, but not all, of their DNA with each other. In these studies, it has been constantly shown that dizygotic twins have a consistently lower correlation rate than monozygotic. The only variables that change in these two experiments are the genetic relationship. When this is repeated hundreds of times, it is pretty clear that the correlation implies causation- especially when there is only one manipulated variable.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
baggins
Posts: 855
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9/15/2012 2:19:01 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 1:58:33 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 9/15/2012 1:34:58 PM, Zetsubou wrote:
Wikipedia: God Gene

Dean Hamer is a discredited scientist, since the failure that was the Xq28 project he has never worked as a geneticist since. I hate the guy for the lying, BS biologist he is.

It was not at all a failure- although the results were mixed.

"In the 1990s Hamer began studies of the role of genes in human behavior. In 1993 he published a paper suggesting the existence of genes that influence homosexuality in males, and presented evidence that one of these genes is associated with the Xq28 marker on the X chromosome.[1] This finding was replicated in two studies in the United States but not in a third in Canada; meta-analysis indicated Xq28 has a significant but not exclusive effect.[2][3][4] Subsequently, several additional linked regions on other chromosomes have been described.[5]"

If anything, he discovered that the Xq28 gene is one part of other regions which influence homosexuality.


At 9/15/2012 1:01:14 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 9/15/2012 12:59:26 PM, Zetsubou wrote:
You think there's a hereditary element to religiousness? Are you people stupid?

Do you understand that the test for this is getting pools of religious and irreligious people and finding microsatellite markers common to the religious set absent in the other. I'd be more understanding if you were insinuating that some people are more genetically disposed to ignorance and ergo religion.

Knuckle it's not proven, that's stupid.

/This should be in the science forum.

No... It's about using twin studies and examining the human genome.
Twin studies are an elementary level of genetic testing, they test for the presence of correlations in genetically identical individuals they do not isolate genes that encode for the subject phenotype. They are fundamentally weaker in that they may show a correlations but cannot attribute it to gene. The ability to attribute to a gene gives a far more certain confirmation of a genetic source for the phenotype. The reason for this is that gene marker frequency can be tested in anyone, not just twins which a likely to share more than just their genetic polymorphisms.

Twins, especially mono-zygotic twins, share almost all of their DNA with each other. On the other hand, dizygotic twins share a lot, but not all, of their DNA with each other. In these studies, it has been constantly shown that dizygotic twins have a consistently lower correlation rate than monozygotic. The only variables that change in these two experiments are the genetic relationship. When this is repeated hundreds of times, it is pretty clear that the correlation implies causation- especially when there is only one manipulated variable.

There are practical problems with such studies. The biggest one is small sample size.
The Holy Quran 29:19-20

See they not how Allah originates creation, then repeats it: truly that is easy for Allah.

Say: "Travel through the earth and see how Allah did originate creation; so will Allah produce a later creation: for Allah has power over all things.
stubs
Posts: 1,887
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9/15/2012 2:26:03 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 12:30:27 PM, rogue wrote:
I saw this in the opinions section and I was appalled at the amount of people that are in denial of this fact and the weak supporting evidence they give against it. One's personality and decisions are determined by a combination of one's experiences and their genetics. Why would one's religion be different?

Just because you know why someone believes something does not mean it is false.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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9/15/2012 2:31:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 1:49:12 PM, TheAsylum wrote:
Maybe it is genetic, I have always believed and felt God. Though, I can not prove that.

It's worth mentioning that some of the genes involved in determining religion are those for IQ.....and religion ties in with the lowest. So don't feel too proud.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
popculturepooka
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9/15/2012 2:36:10 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 2:31:22 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/15/2012 1:49:12 PM, TheAsylum wrote:
Maybe it is genetic, I have always believed and felt God. Though, I can not prove that.

It's worth mentioning that some of the genes involved in determining religion are those for IQ.....and religion ties in with the lowest. So don't feel too proud.

I bet my IQ is higher than yours. :P
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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9/15/2012 2:44:12 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 2:36:10 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 9/15/2012 2:31:22 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/15/2012 1:49:12 PM, TheAsylum wrote:
Maybe it is genetic, I have always believed and felt God. Though, I can not prove that.

It's worth mentioning that some of the genes involved in determining religion are those for IQ.....and religion ties in with the lowest. So don't feel too proud.

I bet my IQ is higher than yours. :P

You're in college, I'm in highschool, so you obviously know a lot more, and you know me only through the internet, your assessment must be so accurate. But anyway, that could be true, but it does nothing against the fact I mentioned. So, what was the point of this again?
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
popculturepooka
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9/15/2012 2:51:21 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 2:44:12 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/15/2012 2:36:10 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 9/15/2012 2:31:22 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/15/2012 1:49:12 PM, TheAsylum wrote:
Maybe it is genetic, I have always believed and felt God. Though, I can not prove that.

It's worth mentioning that some of the genes involved in determining religion are those for IQ.....and religion ties in with the lowest. So don't feel too proud.

I bet my IQ is higher than yours. :P

You're in college, I'm in highschool, so you obviously know a lot more, and you know me only through the internet, your assessment must be so accurate. But anyway, that could be true, but it does nothing against the fact I mentioned. So, what was the point of this again?

IQ doesn't necessarily have to do with knowledge accrued.

Anyways that's not a fact. Genes don't "determine" your religion, they may influence one's religiosity, sure, but that's a far cry from determining it.

P.S. I'm not in college.
P.P.S. It was a joke; lighten up.
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
TheAsylum
Posts: 772
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9/15/2012 3:37:45 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 2:31:22 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/15/2012 1:49:12 PM, TheAsylum wrote:
Maybe it is genetic, I have always believed and felt God. Though, I can not prove that.

It's worth mentioning that some of the genes involved in determining religion are those for IQ.....and religion ties in with the lowest. So don't feel too proud.

LOL. Say's who Ike, you? The self proclaimed theist annihilator? Athiest are no more smarter than theist.
000ike
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9/15/2012 3:50:14 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 3:37:45 PM, TheAsylum wrote:
At 9/15/2012 2:31:22 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/15/2012 1:49:12 PM, TheAsylum wrote:
Maybe it is genetic, I have always believed and felt God. Though, I can not prove that.

It's worth mentioning that some of the genes involved in determining religion are those for IQ.....and religion ties in with the lowest. So don't feel too proud.

LOL. Say's who Ike, you? The self proclaimed theist annihilator? Athiest are no more smarter than theist.

No....says every scientific and statistical study on the subject.

"The present study examined whether IQ relates systematically to denomination and income within the framework of the g nexus, using representative data from the National Longitudinal Study of Youth (NLSY97). Atheists score 1.95 IQ points higher than Agnostics, 3.82 points higher than Liberal persuasions, and 5.89 IQ points higher than Dogmatic persuasions. Denominations differ significantly in IQ and income. Religiosity declines between ages 12 to 17. It is suggested that IQ makes an individual likely to gravitate toward a denomination and level of achievement that best fit his or hers particular level of cognitive complexity." (http://blogs.discovermagazine.com... )

"in only 17% of the countries (23 out of 137) does the proportion of the population who disbelieve in God rise above 20%. These are virtually all the higher IQ countries". Sociologists have found that in general, as a country gets more intelligence, the rate of belief in God begins to drop."
(http://www.humanreligions.info...)

"Nyborg also co-authored a study with Richard Lynn, emeritus professor of psychology at the University of Ulster, which compared religious belief and average national IQs in 137 countries. [5] The study analysed the issue from several viewpoints. Firstly, using data from a U.S. study of 6,825 adolescents, the authors found that atheists scored 6 IQ points higher than those adhering to a religion." (http://www.enotes.com...)

and a very interesting graph here: http://www.blameitonthevoices.com...
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Logic_on_rails
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9/15/2012 4:24:28 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Of course religion can be at least partially caused by environmental influences. That's one of the primary reasons I support an inclusivist model of Hell. To say 'determined' though is a bit forceful, and would depend on the force of thoughts conveyed in an environment. Ie. You're taught Christianity but in a very relaxed way; your leanings due to your environment may not be strong. If you're taught something in a poorer country in a fundamentalist way then your leanings are likely stronger.

On the 'atheists are smarter than theists' thing, PCP nails it when he says that IQ is not necessarily the same as knowledge accrued. The infinitely wise fellow with absolutely no knowledge of God would be an agnostic, not an atheist - it's the logical presumption.

In terms of my own observations, there is an increase in atheism with increase in education, yes. However, this I find is due to learning 'arguments' at a very basic level against God (people equivocating between Christianity and a general theistic God occurs all the time) . In fact, this exploration tends to completely avoid any theistic arguments for God that run along philosophical lines. I find that if people keep learning till they reach a basic philosophical and theological competence (along with good scientific knowledge) then there's actually a slight lean to theism. This is just my own observation though.
"Tis not in mortals to command success
But we"ll do more, Sempronius, we"ll deserve it
medic0506
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9/15/2012 5:11:59 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 12:30:27 PM, rogue wrote:
I saw this in the opinions section and I was appalled at the amount of people that are in denial of this fact and the weak supporting evidence they give against it. One's personality and decisions are determined by a combination of one's experiences and their genetics. Why would one's religion be different?

What about people who are born into countries that are multi-cultural, and are influenced as they grow by many different belief systems?? I do agree with the OP to a degree, a person's religion as a youth will be influenced by his/her parents, as will all other aspects of life. But I don't find that a particularly compelling argument because as adults, if we don't agree with it, we're free to move away from it, unless you're in an extremist country like Iran. Even there though, I'm sure there are many who claim it to save their behinds, but deep down really question it, or don't believe it at all.
MattDescopa
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9/15/2012 6:39:37 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 12:30:27 PM, rogue wrote:
I saw this in the opinions section and I was appalled at the amount of people that are in denial of this fact and the weak supporting evidence they give against it. One's personality and decisions are determined by a combination of one's experiences and their genetics. Why would one's religion be different?

environment is part of it without a doubt. Genetics? Yeah right.
Lordknukle
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9/15/2012 6:49:30 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 2:19:01 PM, baggins wrote:
At 9/15/2012 1:58:33 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 9/15/2012 1:34:58 PM, Zetsubou wrote:
Wikipedia: God Gene

Dean Hamer is a discredited scientist, since the failure that was the Xq28 project he has never worked as a geneticist since. I hate the guy for the lying, BS biologist he is.

It was not at all a failure- although the results were mixed.

"In the 1990s Hamer began studies of the role of genes in human behavior. In 1993 he published a paper suggesting the existence of genes that influence homosexuality in males, and presented evidence that one of these genes is associated with the Xq28 marker on the X chromosome.[1] This finding was replicated in two studies in the United States but not in a third in Canada; meta-analysis indicated Xq28 has a significant but not exclusive effect.[2][3][4] Subsequently, several additional linked regions on other chromosomes have been described.[5]"

If anything, he discovered that the Xq28 gene is one part of other regions which influence homosexuality.


At 9/15/2012 1:01:14 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 9/15/2012 12:59:26 PM, Zetsubou wrote:
You think there's a hereditary element to religiousness? Are you people stupid?

Do you understand that the test for this is getting pools of religious and irreligious people and finding microsatellite markers common to the religious set absent in the other. I'd be more understanding if you were insinuating that some people are more genetically disposed to ignorance and ergo religion.

Knuckle it's not proven, that's stupid.

/This should be in the science forum.

No... It's about using twin studies and examining the human genome.
Twin studies are an elementary level of genetic testing, they test for the presence of correlations in genetically identical individuals they do not isolate genes that encode for the subject phenotype. They are fundamentally weaker in that they may show a correlations but cannot attribute it to gene. The ability to attribute to a gene gives a far more certain confirmation of a genetic source for the phenotype. The reason for this is that gene marker frequency can be tested in anyone, not just twins which a likely to share more than just their genetic polymorphisms.

Twins, especially mono-zygotic twins, share almost all of their DNA with each other. On the other hand, dizygotic twins share a lot, but not all, of their DNA with each other. In these studies, it has been constantly shown that dizygotic twins have a consistently lower correlation rate than monozygotic. The only variables that change in these two experiments are the genetic relationship. When this is repeated hundreds of times, it is pretty clear that the correlation implies causation- especially when there is only one manipulated variable.

There are practical problems with such studies. The biggest one is small sample size.

That is just a plain lie. In the study that I presented, there were 1100 monozygotic and 1500 dizygotic twins.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
Lordknukle
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9/15/2012 6:49:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 6:39:37 PM, MattDescopa wrote:
At 9/15/2012 12:30:27 PM, rogue wrote:
I saw this in the opinions section and I was appalled at the amount of people that are in denial of this fact and the weak supporting evidence they give against it. One's personality and decisions are determined by a combination of one's experiences and their genetics. Why would one's religion be different?

environment is part of it without a doubt. Genetics? Yeah right.

Facts really suck.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
000ike
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9/15/2012 6:49:56 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 6:39:37 PM, MattDescopa wrote:
At 9/15/2012 12:30:27 PM, rogue wrote:
I saw this in the opinions section and I was appalled at the amount of people that are in denial of this fact and the weak supporting evidence they give against it. One's personality and decisions are determined by a combination of one's experiences and their genetics. Why would one's religion be different?

environment is part of it without a doubt. Genetics? Yeah right.

No. Genetics -->low IQ---> Religion

"The present study examined whether IQ relates systematically to denomination and income within the framework of the g nexus, using representative data from the National Longitudinal Study of Youth (NLSY97). Atheists score 1.95 IQ points higher than Agnostics, 3.82 points higher than Liberal persuasions, and 5.89 IQ points higher than Dogmatic persuasions. Denominations differ significantly in IQ and income. Religiosity declines between ages 12 to 17. It is suggested that IQ makes an individual likely to gravitate toward a denomination and level of achievement that best fit his or hers particular level of cognitive complexity." (http://blogs.discovermagazine.com... )

"in only 17% of the countries (23 out of 137) does the proportion of the population who disbelieve in God rise above 20%. These are virtually all the higher IQ countries". Sociologists have found that in general, as a country gets more intelligence, the rate of belief in God begins to drop."
(http://www.humanreligions.info...)

"Nyborg also co-authored a study with Richard Lynn, emeritus professor of psychology at the University of Ulster, which compared religious belief and average national IQs in 137 countries. [5] The study analysed the issue from several viewpoints. Firstly, using data from a U.S. study of 6,825 adolescents, the authors found that atheists scored 6 IQ points higher than those adhering to a religion." (http://www.enotes.com...)

and a very interesting graph here: http://www.blameitonthevoices.com...
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Lordknukle
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9/15/2012 6:52:16 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 6:49:56 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/15/2012 6:39:37 PM, MattDescopa wrote:
At 9/15/2012 12:30:27 PM, rogue wrote:
I saw this in the opinions section and I was appalled at the amount of people that are in denial of this fact and the weak supporting evidence they give against it. One's personality and decisions are determined by a combination of one's experiences and their genetics. Why would one's religion be different?

environment is part of it without a doubt. Genetics? Yeah right.

No. Genetics -->low IQ---> Religion

That's one factor, but they've also hypothesized and found a set of genes which can be partially responsible for religious or mystical experiences. See: The God Gene
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
popculturepooka
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9/15/2012 7:37:14 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 1:00:17 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
The God Gene:

http://en.wikipedia.org...

Haha, yeah, about that....

" Strictly speaking, therefore, to speak of a gene as the `gene for x' is always incorrect. Many gene products, the proteins, must act together to generate biological functions at a high level."

http://books.google.com...

http://jp.physoc.org...
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Sidewalker
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9/15/2012 9:56:41 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 6:49:56 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/15/2012 6:39:37 PM, MattDescopa wrote:
At 9/15/2012 12:30:27 PM, rogue wrote:
I saw this in the opinions section and I was appalled at the amount of people that are in denial of this fact and the weak supporting evidence they give against it. One's personality and decisions are determined by a combination of one's experiences and their genetics. Why would one's religion be different?

environment is part of it without a doubt. Genetics? Yeah right.

No. Genetics -->low IQ---> Religion

"The present study examined whether IQ relates systematically to denomination and income within the framework of the g nexus, using representative data from the National Longitudinal Study of Youth (NLSY97). Atheists score 1.95 IQ points higher than Agnostics, 3.82 points higher than Liberal persuasions, and 5.89 IQ points higher than Dogmatic persuasions. Denominations differ significantly in IQ and income. Religiosity declines between ages 12 to 17. It is suggested that IQ makes an individual likely to gravitate toward a denomination and level of achievement that best fit his or hers particular level of cognitive complexity." (http://blogs.discovermagazine.com... )

"in only 17% of the countries (23 out of 137) does the proportion of the population who disbelieve in God rise above 20%. These are virtually all the higher IQ countries". Sociologists have found that in general, as a country gets more intelligence, the rate of belief in God begins to drop."
(http://www.humanreligions.info...)

"Nyborg also co-authored a study with Richard Lynn, emeritus professor of psychology at the University of Ulster, which compared religious belief and average national IQs in 137 countries. [5] The study analysed the issue from several viewpoints. Firstly, using data from a U.S. study of 6,825 adolescents, the authors found that atheists scored 6 IQ points higher than those adhering to a religion." (http://www.enotes.com...)

and a very interesting graph here: http://www.blameitonthevoices.com...

The same exact methodological approach establishes even greater IQ differences among races. Does your bigotry therefore extend to race too Ike, are you also a white supremacist?
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater
000ike
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9/15/2012 10:04:57 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/15/2012 9:56:41 PM, Sidewalker wrote:
At 9/15/2012 6:49:56 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/15/2012 6:39:37 PM, MattDescopa wrote:
At 9/15/2012 12:30:27 PM, rogue wrote:
I saw this in the opinions section and I was appalled at the amount of people that are in denial of this fact and the weak supporting evidence they give against it. One's personality and decisions are determined by a combination of one's experiences and their genetics. Why would one's religion be different?

environment is part of it without a doubt. Genetics? Yeah right.

No. Genetics -->low IQ---> Religion

"The present study examined whether IQ relates systematically to denomination and income within the framework of the g nexus, using representative data from the National Longitudinal Study of Youth (NLSY97). Atheists score 1.95 IQ points higher than Agnostics, 3.82 points higher than Liberal persuasions, and 5.89 IQ points higher than Dogmatic persuasions. Denominations differ significantly in IQ and income. Religiosity declines between ages 12 to 17. It is suggested that IQ makes an individual likely to gravitate toward a denomination and level of achievement that best fit his or hers particular level of cognitive complexity." (http://blogs.discovermagazine.com... )

"in only 17% of the countries (23 out of 137) does the proportion of the population who disbelieve in God rise above 20%. These are virtually all the higher IQ countries". Sociologists have found that in general, as a country gets more intelligence, the rate of belief in God begins to drop."
(http://www.humanreligions.info...)

"Nyborg also co-authored a study with Richard Lynn, emeritus professor of psychology at the University of Ulster, which compared religious belief and average national IQs in 137 countries. [5] The study analysed the issue from several viewpoints. Firstly, using data from a U.S. study of 6,825 adolescents, the authors found that atheists scored 6 IQ points higher than those adhering to a religion." (http://www.enotes.com...)

and a very interesting graph here: http://www.blameitonthevoices.com...

The same exact methodological approach establishes even greater IQ differences among races. Does your bigotry therefore extend to race too Ike, are you also a white supremacist?

lmao I am the farthest thing from a bigot, I actually laughed when I read that. Why are you giving me insults when I gave you facts, evidence, and sources? There's no reciprocity here. It is an objective FACT that religious people have lower IQs and also people seem not to need God when they're fed and educated. It's a very unfortunate fact for your side, but a fact nonetheless, and you must come to terms with it.

I have never denied that there is an IQ gap between African Americans and Caucasians. What I denied was that the gap was intrinsic to the African American race, rather than imposed through starvation, lack of education, and inborn poverty set in motion from the time of Jim Crow.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault