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THEBOMB
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9/22/2012 9:25:50 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Let's assume for a second that a limitless, infinite god exists (as an extension we get omnipotence, and omniscience, etc.) As people, we can know nothing but the fact that this god is limitless. Let's now say that we bow down and worship this god, for no other reason then the fact the god is limitless. The question is, are we really worshiping god, or the false image of god that we have in our head. By thinking about god, we limit god in our minds, simply because our minds can not comprehend something without limits. It is impossible. When we think about reality, are we really thinking about reality, or are we thinking about something that is close to reality but is in fact an approximation? The problem with logical proofs, and proofs by faith is simple. You are doing one of two things, binding god to logic. By "proving" god utilizing logic are you proving an infinite god exists? Or are you proving that a god which is logical exists? A logical god is not a limitless god. Or you bind god to the limits of your mind. You cannot comprehend an infinite being, so one really has a belief in the shadow of that infinite being. In my humble opinion, this is the problem with asserting a limitless god exists, because in order to assert the existence of something, you must be able to comprehend that something. Or at least it's purpose. If you bind god to your belief of existence, you limit god to that existence, at least in your mind. Thus, any belief you have about god does not reflect what god actually is and could be, but rather what you believe god to be. If a limitless god truly exists, it transcends existence, thus we can have no knowledge of that god and we cannot even go as far as asserting the existence of that god.
Chicken
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9/22/2012 9:44:25 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/22/2012 9:25:50 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
Let's assume for a second that a limitless, infinite god exists (as an extension we get omnipotence, and omniscience, etc.) As people, we can know nothing but the fact that this god is limitless. Let's now say that we bow down and worship this god, for no other reason then the fact the god is limitless. The question is, are we really worshiping god, or the false image of god that we have in our head. By thinking about god, we limit god in our minds, simply because our minds can not comprehend something without limits. It is impossible. When we think about reality, are we really thinking about reality, or are we thinking about something that is close to reality but is in fact an approximation? The problem with logical proofs, and proofs by faith is simple. You are doing one of two things, binding god to logic. By "proving" god utilizing logic are you proving an infinite god exists? Or are you proving that a god which is logical exists? A logical god is not a limitless god. Or you bind god to the limits of your mind. You cannot comprehend an infinite being, so one really has a belief in the shadow of that infinite being. In my humble opinion, this is the problem with asserting a limitless god exists, because in order to assert the existence of something, you must be able to comprehend that something. Or at least it's purpose. If you bind god to your belief of existence, you limit god to that existence, at least in your mind. Thus, any belief you have about god does not reflect what god actually is and could be, but rather what you believe god to be. If a limitless god truly exists, it transcends existence, thus we can have no knowledge of that god and we cannot even go as far as asserting the existence of that god.

Why can't this limitless god be real to those who don't believe? Is it the fact that I as an Atheist believe in no such monotheistic god (Or any god for that matter) that it does not exist? So basically, an Atheist is correct in saying there is no god, because it doesn't exist unless he/she believes. There is no plane of reality that exists past that of what we believe, in the end a belief (not faith) is reality. "I think therefore I am?" Fvck that, it's more of "I believe, therefore it must be real" As you stated, we cannot possibly comprehend the existence of a god but logic is solvency, it limits this god into a natural being, and yet, all who worship this god believe that a supernatural being exists. An atheist believes the opposite, and an agnostic drinks Dr. Pepper. That's just my insight on it.
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THEBOMB
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9/22/2012 9:51:12 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/22/2012 9:44:25 PM, Chicken wrote:
At 9/22/2012 9:25:50 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
Let's assume for a second that a limitless, infinite god exists (as an extension we get omnipotence, and omniscience, etc.) As people, we can know nothing but the fact that this god is limitless. Let's now say that we bow down and worship this god, for no other reason then the fact the god is limitless. The question is, are we really worshiping god, or the false image of god that we have in our head. By thinking about god, we limit god in our minds, simply because our minds can not comprehend something without limits. It is impossible. When we think about reality, are we really thinking about reality, or are we thinking about something that is close to reality but is in fact an approximation? The problem with logical proofs, and proofs by faith is simple. You are doing one of two things, binding god to logic. By "proving" god utilizing logic are you proving an infinite god exists? Or are you proving that a god which is logical exists? A logical god is not a limitless god. Or you bind god to the limits of your mind. You cannot comprehend an infinite being, so one really has a belief in the shadow of that infinite being. In my humble opinion, this is the problem with asserting a limitless god exists, because in order to assert the existence of something, you must be able to comprehend that something. Or at least it's purpose. If you bind god to your belief of existence, you limit god to that existence, at least in your mind. Thus, any belief you have about god does not reflect what god actually is and could be, but rather what you believe god to be. If a limitless god truly exists, it transcends existence, thus we can have no knowledge of that god and we cannot even go as far as asserting the existence of that god.

Why can't this limitless god be real to those who don't believe? Is it the fact that I as an Atheist believe in no such monotheistic god (Or any god for that matter) that it does not exist? So basically, an Atheist is correct in saying there is no god, because it doesn't exist unless he/she believes. There is no plane of reality that exists past that of what we believe, in the end a belief (not faith) is reality. "I think therefore I am?" Fvck that, it's more of "I believe, therefore it must be real" As you stated, we cannot possibly comprehend the existence of a god but logic is solvency, it limits this god into a natural being, and yet, all who worship this god believe that a supernatural being exists. An atheist believes the opposite, and an agnostic drinks Dr. Pepper. That's just my insight on it.

You strawmanned my argument. The god would exist whether or not you believed in it. In a nut shell, I was saying that when we assert a limitless god exists, we limit that god. Thus, what you believe in is not god, but a shadow of god, and that is what you worship. What you believe is irrelevant. Because if you believe in god, you do not believe in what god actually is but rather what your mind can comprehend, which is not god. You do not worship the actual god, but rather the picture you painted in your head. If we assume the limitless god which transcends existence, exists then we cannot know whether that god exists or have any knowledge of that god.
THEBOMB
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9/22/2012 9:52:15 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/22/2012 9:50:52 PM, s-anthony wrote:
At 9/22/2012 9:25:50 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
Only that which is real exists.

I believe you missed the first three words. "LET US ASSUME..." We are assuming god exists for this discussion. If you don't like that, then leave.
s-anthony
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9/22/2012 10:03:44 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/22/2012 9:52:15 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
I believe you missed the first three words. "LET US ASSUME..." We are assuming god exists for this discussion. If you don't like that, then leave.

I think you missed my point; my argument is not with the existence of God yet with the assumption, that, we can have knowledge of something that doesn't exist.
Chicken
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9/22/2012 10:05:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/22/2012 9:51:12 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
At 9/22/2012 9:44:25 PM, Chicken wrote:
At 9/22/2012 9:25:50 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
Let's assume for a second that a limitless, infinite god exists (as an extension we get omnipotence, and omniscience, etc.) As people, we can know nothing but the fact that this god is limitless. Let's now say that we bow down and worship this god, for no other reason then the fact the god is limitless. The question is, are we really worshiping god, or the false image of god that we have in our head. By thinking about god, we limit god in our minds, simply because our minds can not comprehend something without limits. It is impossible. When we think about reality, are we really thinking about reality, or are we thinking about something that is close to reality but is in fact an approximation? The problem with logical proofs, and proofs by faith is simple. You are doing one of two things, binding god to logic. By "proving" god utilizing logic are you proving an infinite god exists? Or are you proving that a god which is logical exists? A logical god is not a limitless god. Or you bind god to the limits of your mind. You cannot comprehend an infinite being, so one really has a belief in the shadow of that infinite being. In my humble opinion, this is the problem with asserting a limitless god exists, because in order to assert the existence of something, you must be able to comprehend that something. Or at least it's purpose. If you bind god to your belief of existence, you limit god to that existence, at least in your mind. Thus, any belief you have about god does not reflect what god actually is and could be, but rather what you believe god to be. If a limitless god truly exists, it transcends existence, thus we can have no knowledge of that god and we cannot even go as far as asserting the existence of that god.

Why can't this limitless god be real to those who don't believe? Is it the fact that I as an Atheist believe in no such monotheistic god (Or any god for that matter) that it does not exist? So basically, an Atheist is correct in saying there is no god, because it doesn't exist unless he/she believes. There is no plane of reality that exists past that of what we believe, in the end a belief (not faith) is reality. "I think therefore I am?" Fvck that, it's more of "I believe, therefore it must be real" As you stated, we cannot possibly comprehend the existence of a god but logic is solvency, it limits this god into a natural being, and yet, all who worship this god believe that a supernatural being exists. An atheist believes the opposite, and an agnostic drinks Dr. Pepper. That's just my insight on it.

You strawmanned my argument. The god would exist whether or not you believed in it. In a nut shell, I was saying that when we assert a limitless god exists, we limit that god. Thus, what you believe in is not god, but a shadow of god, and that is what you worship. What you believe is irrelevant. Because if you believe in god, you do not believe in what god actually is but rather what your mind can comprehend, which is not god. You do not worship the actual god, but rather the picture you painted in your head. If we assume the limitless god which transcends existence, exists then we cannot know whether that god exists or have any knowledge of that god.

I didn't strawman your argument good sir. I insist that you re-read what you wrote. Explain the transcending existence vs existence then? I'm assuming that god exists, yet he transcends existence, as in your first sentence. You asked the question of whether or not the god would exist if we believed or didn't believe, and then brought up the topic of beliefs vs existence and limits vs existence, which tie in together into a simple clause

A belief is limited

Existence is unlimited? (Correct me if I'm wrong)

Thus if you believe in a god, the god cannot exist (Or else it is limited)

Then you said again that- "The god would exist whether or not you believed in it" yet at the beginning you said " In my humble opinion, this is the problem with asserting a limitless god exists, because in order to assert the existence of something, you must be able to comprehend that something."

Are you arguing now that the god exists but it is limited? WHY DO YOU STATE GOD IS LIMITLESS AND EXISTS THEN? There seems to be some confusion going on, maybe a break off from your original assumption?
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THEBOMB
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9/22/2012 10:08:24 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/22/2012 10:03:44 PM, s-anthony wrote:
At 9/22/2012 9:52:15 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
I believe you missed the first three words. "LET US ASSUME..." We are assuming god exists for this discussion. If you don't like that, then leave.

I think you missed my point; my argument is not with the existence of God yet with the assumption, that, we can have knowledge of something that doesn't exist.

I never assumed we can have knowledge of anything. Please point out where I did? If you recall my conclusion: "If a limitless god truly exists, it transcends existence, thus we can have no knowledge of that god and we cannot even go as far as asserting the existence of that god." My main point is we cannot have knowledge of that which transcends our reasoning. Thus, we cannot assert the existence of that which transcends our reasoning, nor can we say with 100% conviction the opposite.

Since you are making the baseless assertion "there is no possibility for the existence of a god" prove it. Back up your claim. :)
THEBOMB
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9/22/2012 10:15:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/22/2012 10:05:06 PM, Chicken wrote:
At 9/22/2012 9:51:12 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
At 9/22/2012 9:44:25 PM, Chicken wrote:
At 9/22/2012 9:25:50 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
Let's assume for a second that a limitless, infinite god exists (as an extension we get omnipotence, and omniscience, etc.) As people, we can know nothing but the fact that this god is limitless. Let's now say that we bow down and worship this god, for no other reason then the fact the god is limitless. The question is, are we really worshiping god, or the false image of god that we have in our head. By thinking about god, we limit god in our minds, simply because our minds can not comprehend something without limits. It is impossible. When we think about reality, are we really thinking about reality, or are we thinking about something that is close to reality but is in fact an approximation? The problem with logical proofs, and proofs by faith is simple. You are doing one of two things, binding god to logic. By "proving" god utilizing logic are you proving an infinite god exists? Or are you proving that a god which is logical exists? A logical god is not a limitless god. Or you bind god to the limits of your mind. You cannot comprehend an infinite being, so one really has a belief in the shadow of that infinite being. In my humble opinion, this is the problem with asserting a limitless god exists, because in order to assert the existence of something, you must be able to comprehend that something. Or at least it's purpose. If you bind god to your belief of existence, you limit god to that existence, at least in your mind. Thus, any belief you have about god does not reflect what god actually is and could be, but rather what you believe god to be. If a limitless god truly exists, it transcends existence, thus we can have no knowledge of that god and we cannot even go as far as asserting the existence of that god.

Why can't this limitless god be real to those who don't believe? Is it the fact that I as an Atheist believe in no such monotheistic god (Or any god for that matter) that it does not exist? So basically, an Atheist is correct in saying there is no god, because it doesn't exist unless he/she believes. There is no plane of reality that exists past that of what we believe, in the end a belief (not faith) is reality. "I think therefore I am?" Fvck that, it's more of "I believe, therefore it must be real" As you stated, we cannot possibly comprehend the existence of a god but logic is solvency, it limits this god into a natural being, and yet, all who worship this god believe that a supernatural being exists. An atheist believes the opposite, and an agnostic drinks Dr. Pepper. That's just my insight on it.

You strawmanned my argument. The god would exist whether or not you believed in it. In a nut shell, I was saying that when we assert a limitless god exists, we limit that god. Thus, what you believe in is not god, but a shadow of god, and that is what you worship. What you believe is irrelevant. Because if you believe in god, you do not believe in what god actually is but rather what your mind can comprehend, which is not god. You do not worship the actual god, but rather the picture you painted in your head. If we assume the limitless god which transcends existence, exists then we cannot know whether that god exists or have any knowledge of that god.

I didn't strawman your argument good sir. I insist that you re-read what you wrote. Explain the transcending existence vs existence then?

Transcendence of existence goes beyond existence. Should god exist, we could not positively affirm that statement.

I'm assuming that god exists, yet he transcends existence, as in your first sentence. You asked the question of whether or not the god would exist if we believed or didn't believe, and then brought up the topic of beliefs vs existence and limits vs existence, which tie in together into a simple clause

A belief is limited

Your mind is limited, so yes.


Existence is unlimited? (Correct me if I'm wrong)

A limitless is god is unlimited.


Thus if you believe in a god, the god cannot exist (Or else it is limited)

Thus if you make the positive assertion that god exists, then you limit that god in your mind and you do not truly believe in god because what you believe in is what is in your mind. Not what is in actuality.


Then you said again that- "The god would exist whether or not you believed in it"

Simply because we cannot have knowledge of existence does not mean that existence is false. If x exists, then x exists regardless of belief. We simply cannot have knowledge of that existence.

yet at the beginning you said " In my humble opinion, this is the problem with asserting a limitless god exists, because in order to assert the existence of something, you must be able to comprehend that something."

I did. If you assert the existence of x, you should be able to comprehend x. If you assert the existence of a limitless god, you should be able to comprehend that limitless god. Which by definition is impossible.


Are you arguing now that the god exists but it is limited?

No. I am arguing you cannot have positive belief in a limitless god.

WHY DO YOU STATE GOD IS LIMITLESS AND EXISTS THEN?

Never said god exists...I simply said that if x exists then x exists regardless of belief.

There seems to be some confusion going on, maybe a break off from your original assumption?
s-anthony
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9/22/2012 10:18:32 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/22/2012 10:08:24 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
I never assumed we can have knowledge of anything. Please point out where I did? If you recall my conclusion: "If a limitless god truly exists, it transcends existence, thus we can have no knowledge of that god and we cannot even go as far as asserting the existence of that god." My main point is we cannot have knowledge of that which transcends our reasoning. Thus, we cannot assert the existence of that which transcends our reasoning, nor can we say with 100% conviction the opposite.

How can God transcend existence yet exist?

Since you are making the baseless assertion "there is no possibility for the existence of a god" prove it. Back up your claim. :)

I never said God doesn't exist. I said how can you have knowledge of that which doesn't exist.
Chicken
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9/22/2012 10:19:25 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
You contradicted yourself a few times, but i understand what you are saying now.
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THEBOMB
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9/22/2012 10:23:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/22/2012 10:18:32 PM, s-anthony wrote:
At 9/22/2012 10:08:24 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
I never assumed we can have knowledge of anything. Please point out where I did? If you recall my conclusion: "If a limitless god truly exists, it transcends existence, thus we can have no knowledge of that god and we cannot even go as far as asserting the existence of that god." My main point is we cannot have knowledge of that which transcends our reasoning. Thus, we cannot assert the existence of that which transcends our reasoning, nor can we say with 100% conviction the opposite.

How can God transcend existence yet exist?

If god is limitless, how can we bind god (in our minds) to our conception of existence without contradicting the definition of existence? But, to answer your question, we cannot have that knowledge....we cannot have any knowledge of that which is limitless. AKA we cannot have the knowledge that it exists.


Since you are making the baseless assertion "there is no possibility for the existence of a god" prove it. Back up your claim. :)

I never said God doesn't exist.

"Only that which is real exists." In a thread dealing with god, that pretty much says "God does not exist."

I said how can you have knowledge of that which doesn't exist.

You can't have knowledge of something which does not exist. Where did I assert god does not exist...?
THEBOMB
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9/22/2012 10:24:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/22/2012 10:19:25 PM, Chicken wrote:
You contradicted yourself a few times, but i understand what you are saying now.

Yea...sorry xD you should see what I wrote at three in the morning. You'd have a field day with that :P
s-anthony
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9/22/2012 10:31:47 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/22/2012 10:23:49 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
"Only that which is real exists." In a thread dealing with god, that pretty much says "God does not exist."

When did I say God wasn't real?
THEBOMB
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9/22/2012 10:33:29 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/22/2012 10:31:47 PM, s-anthony wrote:
At 9/22/2012 10:23:49 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
"Only that which is real exists." In a thread dealing with god, that pretty much says "God does not exist."

When did I say God wasn't real?

Good point. You never did say god wasn't real.
Archistrategos
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9/23/2012 7:38:20 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/22/2012 10:08:24 PM, THEBOMB wrote:

How can God transcend existence yet exist?

Perhaps because God is an Over-Unity and pours into creation like a cascading water fountain?

Is the water fountain the oceanic reservoir of under ground water? Yes and no....
THEBOMB
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9/23/2012 10:38:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/23/2012 7:38:20 PM, Archistrategos wrote:
At 9/22/2012 10:08:24 PM, THEBOMB wrote:

How can God transcend existence yet exist?

Perhaps because God is an Over-Unity and pours into creation like a cascading water fountain?

Could you explain this further? :)


Is the water fountain the oceanic reservoir of under ground water? Yes and no....

ermm...? idk
OberHerr
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9/23/2012 10:38:45 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Well, this has degraded into a big semantics argument....
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THEBOMB
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9/23/2012 10:40:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/23/2012 10:38:45 PM, OberHerr wrote:
Well, this has degraded into a big semantics argument....

It was a semantics argument....well kinda sort of. Does not make it any less valid.
OberHerr
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9/23/2012 10:46:53 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/23/2012 10:40:48 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
At 9/23/2012 10:38:45 PM, OberHerr wrote:
Well, this has degraded into a big semantics argument....

It was a semantics argument....well kinda sort of. Does not make it any less valid.

It all went over my head, I not even sure what your arguing, I just hate semantics based arguing.
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THEBOMB
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9/23/2012 10:56:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/23/2012 10:46:53 PM, OberHerr wrote:
At 9/23/2012 10:40:48 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
At 9/23/2012 10:38:45 PM, OberHerr wrote:
Well, this has degraded into a big semantics argument....

It was a semantics argument....well kinda sort of. Does not make it any less valid.

It all went over my head, I not even sure what your arguing, I just hate semantics based arguing.

I basically argued that the nature of a limitless god is that of having no limits. Thus, by asserting that this limitless god exists, you limit god (at least in your mind) to existence. So worship of the limitless god is not actually worship of the god but rather the picture you have of god in your mind. Since your mind cannot comprehend the limitless, you are not worshiping god, but rather a shadow of god. It is better to not assert that a limitless god exists, otherwise all you do is limit god to yourself. The argument basically dealt with the nature of what it means to be limitless.
Archistrategos
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9/24/2012 12:46:22 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/23/2012 10:38:06 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
At 9/23/2012 7:38:20 PM, Archistrategos wrote:
At 9/22/2012 10:08:24 PM, THEBOMB wrote:

How can God transcend existence yet exist?

Perhaps because God is an Over-Unity and pours into creation like a cascading water fountain?

Could you explain this further? :)

In theological or scientific language?


Is the water fountain the oceanic reservoir of under ground water? Yes and no....

ermm...? idk
The metaphor translates as God is actually underneath everything pushing it from the bottom not pulling it up from the top. It's all of the same substance in different forms according to order and living function....that God (of His own qualities) unfolded for material creation so that the creation would have a lattice to unfold upon.
Stephen_Hawkins
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9/24/2012 1:46:11 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/22/2012 9:25:50 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
Let's assume for a second that a limitless, infinite god exists (as an extension we get omnipotence, and omniscience, etc.) As people, we can know nothing but the fact that this god is limitless. Let's now say that we bow down and worship this god, for no other reason then the fact the god is limitless. The question is, are we really worshiping god, or the false image of god that we have in our head. By thinking about god, we limit god in our minds, simply because our minds can not comprehend something without limits. It is impossible. When we think about reality, are we really thinking about reality, or are we thinking about something that is close to reality but is in fact an approximation? The problem with logical proofs, and proofs by faith is simple. You are doing one of two things, binding god to logic. By "proving" god utilizing logic are you proving an infinite god exists? Or are you proving that a god which is logical exists? A logical god is not a limitless god. Or you bind god to the limits of your mind. You cannot comprehend an infinite being, so one really has a belief in the shadow of that infinite being. In my humble opinion, this is the problem with asserting a limitless god exists, because in order to assert the existence of something, you must be able to comprehend that something. Or at least it's purpose. If you bind god to your belief of existence, you limit god to that existence, at least in your mind. Thus, any belief you have about god does not reflect what god actually is and could be, but rather what you believe god to be. If a limitless god truly exists, it transcends existence, thus we can have no knowledge of that god and we cannot even go as far as asserting the existence of that god.

Plato: pissing off God without even knowing it. +1
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Archistrategos
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9/24/2012 1:51:44 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/24/2012 1:46:11 AM, Stephen_Hawkins wrote:
At 9/22/2012 9:25:50 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
Let's assume for a second that a limitless, infinite god exists (as an extension we get omnipotence, and omniscience, etc.) As people, we can know nothing but the fact that this god is limitless. Let's now say that we bow down and worship this god, for no other reason then the fact the god is limitless. The question is, are we really worshiping god, or the false image of god that we have in our head. By thinking about god, we limit god in our minds, simply because our minds can not comprehend something without limits. It is impossible. When we think about reality, are we really thinking about reality, or are we thinking about something that is close to reality but is in fact an approximation? The problem with logical proofs, and proofs by faith is simple. You are doing one of two things, binding god to logic. By "proving" god utilizing logic are you proving an infinite god exists? Or are you proving that a god which is logical exists? A logical god is not a limitless god. Or you bind god to the limits of your mind. You cannot comprehend an infinite being, so one really has a belief in the shadow of that infinite being. In my humble opinion, this is the problem with asserting a limitless god exists, because in order to assert the existence of something, you must be able to comprehend that something. Or at least it's purpose. If you bind god to your belief of existence, you limit god to that existence, at least in your mind. Thus, any belief you have about god does not reflect what god actually is and could be, but rather what you believe god to be. If a limitless god truly exists, it transcends existence, thus we can have no knowledge of that god and we cannot even go as far as asserting the existence of that god.

Plato: pissing off God without even knowing it. +1

Lol!

God is so God that to think of God is ungodly! So whatever you do, don't God God! Goddit?
THEBOMB
Posts: 2,872
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9/24/2012 10:35:10 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/24/2012 12:46:22 AM, Archistrategos wrote:
At 9/23/2012 10:38:06 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
At 9/23/2012 7:38:20 PM, Archistrategos wrote:
At 9/22/2012 10:08:24 PM, THEBOMB wrote:

How can God transcend existence yet exist?

Perhaps because God is an Over-Unity and pours into creation like a cascading water fountain?

Could you explain this further? :)

In theological or scientific language?

Hmm...which ever you feel comfortable with. Although, I'd probably understand the theological language more.



Is the water fountain the oceanic reservoir of under ground water? Yes and no....

ermm...? idk
The metaphor translates as God is actually underneath everything pushing it from the bottom not pulling it up from the top. It's all of the same substance in different forms according to order and living function....that God (of His own qualities) unfolded for material creation so that the creation would have a lattice to unfold upon.

oh...I think I get it now...let me think about this a bit more :P
Polaris
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9/24/2012 12:09:09 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/22/2012 9:25:50 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
If a limitless god truly exists, it transcends existence

This is a self-defeating statement.
Archistrategos
Posts: 602
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9/24/2012 12:31:30 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/24/2012 10:35:10 AM, THEBOMB wrote:
At 9/24/2012 12:46:22 AM, Archistrategos wrote:
At 9/23/2012 10:38:06 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
At 9/23/2012 7:38:20 PM, Archistrategos wrote:
At 9/22/2012 10:08:24 PM, THEBOMB wrote:

How can God transcend existence yet exist?

Perhaps because God is an Over-Unity and pours into creation like a cascading water fountain?

Could you explain this further? :)

In theological or scientific language?

Hmm...which ever you feel comfortable with. Although, I'd probably understand the theological language more.



Is the water fountain the oceanic reservoir of under ground water? Yes and no....

ermm...? idk
The metaphor translates as God is actually underneath everything pushing it from the bottom not pulling it up from the top. It's all of the same substance in different forms according to order and living function....that God (of His own qualities) unfolded for material creation so that the creation would have a lattice to unfold upon.

oh...I think I get it now...let me think about this a bit more :P

Okay, Theological: The God the has been and always will be, exists apart from and before any universe is created. Before the beginning is God. Infinite and eternal. Divine Life upon the highest concentration of information stretching forever in all directions. I call that information the Omnipresent Light Field (OLF). It is to God as the quantum Planck field is to us.

Creation of any "thing" cannot happen in the OLF it would be annihilated by the speed and power of that light. So God "hides" his own light in 3 directions, outwards, inwards and to the very bottom smallest scale and "freezes" it there...making within the OLF a spherical ceiling of light (God the Father), a point of light at it's center (God the Son) and micro lattice of vibration (God the Mother or Holy Spirit). This micro lattice is our Planck field and it is a star-tetrahedral lattice. It is the 3d shape of a snowflake....the "waters" A Uni-Verse is born...One-Word
God speaks God's name and God happens.

This is Gen 1:1 and 2

The concentration of light to a single point at the center is God as a single being, God the Son and it is a virginal birth. This is the first "earth" (point of actual manifestation)

Now there is the space to create within and the pattern to create upon, and a Logos to create through...and the Infinity beyond the ceiling of the universe is not diminished. God sees all within the universe because He is all around it above and below, at the very center of it (before and after other creations), and connected via the Holy Spirit to everything created therein (throughout all things and know-er of all things) We worship God the Father beyond the universe because He is the origin of it all and no image can be made of Thou (commandment 1 and 2) We obey God the Son, the King of the Universe because He is God manifest as a man of faceted light who is perfect and there is no darkness within Him. Perfect worthy Authority. One whom we can actually walk and talk with.

Makes sense?