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what if your wrong

Ruckmanite
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9/26/2012 2:25:54 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
So, atheists and agnostics, what if you are wrong about what you believe? If Christianity is true, then you will all wind up in Hell. Even if I'm wrong and christianity is false, nothing would happen to me. Seems to me, that you guys have taken a very, risky bet concerning your eternity.
Let your words be the genuine picture of your heart- John Wesley
Money is a horrid thing to follow, but a charming thing to meet-Henry James
AlwaysMoreThanYou
Posts: 2,900
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9/26/2012 2:26:41 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
There's always the "Atheist's Wager"
'When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.' - John 16:13
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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9/26/2012 2:27:37 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
what if God exists, but Christians have been doing it wrong the whole time, and you all rot in hell along with us atheists?

....I hope you see the problem with asking fear-based hypotheticals.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
stubs
Posts: 1,887
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9/26/2012 2:28:26 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:25:54 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
So, atheists and agnostics, what if you are wrong about what you believe? If Christianity is true, then you will all wind up in Hell. Even if I'm wrong and christianity is false, nothing would happen to me. Seems to me, that you guys have taken a very, risky bet concerning your eternity.

If anyone actually uses that as their reasoning for being a "Christian", I would question whether they really are a Christian.
Ruckmanite
Posts: 289
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9/26/2012 2:30:59 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:27:37 PM, 000ike wrote:
what if God exists, but Christians have been doing it wrong the whole time, and you all rot in hell along with us atheists?

....I hope you see the problem with asking fear-based hypotheticals.

Except the bible tells christians in the New Testament how to live.
Let your words be the genuine picture of your heart- John Wesley
Money is a horrid thing to follow, but a charming thing to meet-Henry James
Ruckmanite
Posts: 289
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9/26/2012 2:31:55 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:28:26 PM, stubs wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:25:54 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
So, atheists and agnostics, what if you are wrong about what you believe? If Christianity is true, then you will all wind up in Hell. Even if I'm wrong and christianity is false, nothing would happen to me. Seems to me, that you guys have taken a very, risky bet concerning your eternity.

If anyone actually uses that as their reasoning for being a "Christian", I would question whether they really are a Christian.

Correct stubs, and thats not why i am a christian. Its just amazing how few people think about their eternity.
Let your words be the genuine picture of your heart- John Wesley
Money is a horrid thing to follow, but a charming thing to meet-Henry James
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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9/26/2012 2:35:16 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:30:59 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:27:37 PM, 000ike wrote:
what if God exists, but Christians have been doing it wrong the whole time, and you all rot in hell along with us atheists?

....I hope you see the problem with asking fear-based hypotheticals.

Except the bible tells christians in the New Testament how to live.

What if the New Testament is bullsh!t some human beings concocted through time, god exists, he is wrathful, and he sends all you christians to hell for not worshiping correctly?

or...or, what if there is no god, there's just a devil, and when you die, that's where you go no matter what you do!

or....or.or, what if God doesn't exist and you cease to exist while your mortal remains disintegrate in the Earth's soil? there's an idea!
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Ruckmanite
Posts: 289
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9/26/2012 2:38:23 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:35:16 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:30:59 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:27:37 PM, 000ike wrote:
what if God exists, but Christians have been doing it wrong the whole time, and you all rot in hell along with us atheists?

....I hope you see the problem with asking fear-based hypotheticals.

Except the bible tells christians in the New Testament how to live.

What if the New Testament is bullsh!t some human beings concocted through time, god exists, he is wrathful, and he sends all you christians to hell for not worshiping correctly?

or...or, what if there is no god, there's just a devil, and when you die, that's where you go no matter what you do!

or....or.or, what if God doesn't exist and you cease to exist while your mortal remains disintegrate in the Earth's soil? there's an idea!

show me proof the Bible was not written by God. That would settle a lot.
Let your words be the genuine picture of your heart- John Wesley
Money is a horrid thing to follow, but a charming thing to meet-Henry James
AlwaysMoreThanYou
Posts: 2,900
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9/26/2012 2:39:33 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:38:23 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:35:16 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:30:59 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:27:37 PM, 000ike wrote:
what if God exists, but Christians have been doing it wrong the whole time, and you all rot in hell along with us atheists?

....I hope you see the problem with asking fear-based hypotheticals.

Except the bible tells christians in the New Testament how to live.

What if the New Testament is bullsh!t some human beings concocted through time, god exists, he is wrathful, and he sends all you christians to hell for not worshiping correctly?

or...or, what if there is no god, there's just a devil, and when you die, that's where you go no matter what you do!

or....or.or, what if God doesn't exist and you cease to exist while your mortal remains disintegrate in the Earth's soil? there's an idea!

show me proof the Bible was not written by God. That would settle a lot.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

Wikipedia claims that the Bible was written by a variety of Christian authors.
'When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.' - John 16:13
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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9/26/2012 2:42:28 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:38:23 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:35:16 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:30:59 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:27:37 PM, 000ike wrote:
what if God exists, but Christians have been doing it wrong the whole time, and you all rot in hell along with us atheists?

....I hope you see the problem with asking fear-based hypotheticals.

Except the bible tells christians in the New Testament how to live.

What if the New Testament is bullsh!t some human beings concocted through time, god exists, he is wrathful, and he sends all you christians to hell for not worshiping correctly?

or...or, what if there is no god, there's just a devil, and when you die, that's where you go no matter what you do!

or....or.or, what if God doesn't exist and you cease to exist while your mortal remains disintegrate in the Earth's soil? there's an idea!

show me proof the Bible was not written by God. That would settle a lot.

right after you show me proof that God exists and atheists are wrong.

I think you may have missed the point I was making. Your initial question, what if we're wrong, is baseless....You want us come up with with some fail-safe without giving us any logical reason to. So I countered by asking you similar questions which required you to question your beliefs without any reason except the sheer probability that they may be false,...and look what you did, you asked me to give you proof!
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Ruckmanite
Posts: 289
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9/26/2012 2:43:00 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:39:33 PM, AlwaysMoreThanYou wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:38:23 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:35:16 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:30:59 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:27:37 PM, 000ike wrote:
what if God exists, but Christians have been doing it wrong the whole time, and you all rot in hell along with us atheists?

....I hope you see the problem with asking fear-based hypotheticals.

Except the bible tells christians in the New Testament how to live.

What if the New Testament is bullsh!t some human beings concocted through time, god exists, he is wrathful, and he sends all you christians to hell for not worshiping correctly?

or...or, what if there is no god, there's just a devil, and when you die, that's where you go no matter what you do!

or....or.or, what if God doesn't exist and you cease to exist while your mortal remains disintegrate in the Earth's soil? there's an idea!

show me proof the Bible was not written by God. That would settle a lot.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

Wikipedia claims that the Bible was written by a variety of Christian authors.

who were all inspired by God. Arent you a Catholic, Alwaysmorethanyou? Strange that you would be arguing with me? I take this as proof that Protestants are better christians than Catholics.
Let your words be the genuine picture of your heart- John Wesley
Money is a horrid thing to follow, but a charming thing to meet-Henry James
AlwaysMoreThanYou
Posts: 2,900
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9/26/2012 2:43:51 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:43:00 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
who were all inspired by God. Arent you a Catholic, Alwaysmorethanyou? Strange that you would be arguing with me? I take this as proof that Protestants are better christians than Catholics.

I just thought it was funny how you shifted the burden of proof so drastically.

No need to make stupid generalizations from a small sampling of poor data.
'When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.' - John 16:13
Ruckmanite
Posts: 289
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9/26/2012 2:46:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:42:28 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:38:23 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:35:16 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:30:59 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:27:37 PM, 000ike wrote:
what if God exists, but Christians have been doing it wrong the whole time, and you all rot in hell along with us atheists?

....I hope you see the problem with asking fear-based hypotheticals.

Except the bible tells christians in the New Testament how to live.

What if the New Testament is bullsh!t some human beings concocted through time, god exists, he is wrathful, and he sends all you christians to hell for not worshiping correctly?

or...or, what if there is no god, there's just a devil, and when you die, that's where you go no matter what you do!

or....or.or, what if God doesn't exist and you cease to exist while your mortal remains disintegrate in the Earth's soil? there's an idea!

show me proof the Bible was not written by God. That would settle a lot.

right after you show me proof that God exists and atheists are wrong.

I think you may have missed the point I was making. Your initial question, what if we're wrong, is baseless....You want us come up with with some fail-safe without giving us any logical reason to. So I countered by asking you similar questions which required you to question your beliefs without any reason except the sheer probability that they may be false,...and look what you did, you asked me to give you proof!

48 PROPHECIES IN THE OLD TESTAMENT were fulfilled in one man Jesus Christ. The prophecies were fulfilled hundreds of years apart from when they were written.
Let your words be the genuine picture of your heart- John Wesley
Money is a horrid thing to follow, but a charming thing to meet-Henry James
Blind-Faith
Posts: 65
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9/26/2012 2:52:34 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:25:54 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
So, atheists and agnostics, what if you are wrong about what you believe? If Christianity is true, then you will all wind up in Hell. Even if I'm wrong and christianity is false, nothing would happen to me. Seems to me, that you guys have taken a very, risky bet concerning your eternity.

Pascal's wager eh!
But what if you are wrong and the muslims are right ?

Koran.5.The table spread...

{5:72 They surely disbelieve who say: Lo! Allah is the Messiah, son of Mary. The Messiah (himself) said: O Children of Israel, worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord. Lo! whoso ascribeth partners unto Allah, for him Allah hath forbidden paradise. His abode is the Fire. For evil-doers there will be no helpers.
5:73 They surely disbelieve who say: Lo! Allah is the third of three; when there is no God save the One God. If they desist not from so saying a painful doom will fall on those of them who disbelieve.}

Looks like your doomed my friend...
Welcome to the hellfire club.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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9/26/2012 2:55:39 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:46:06 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:42:28 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:38:23 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:35:16 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:30:59 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:27:37 PM, 000ike wrote:
what if God exists, but Christians have been doing it wrong the whole time, and you all rot in hell along with us atheists?

....I hope you see the problem with asking fear-based hypotheticals.

Except the bible tells christians in the New Testament how to live.

What if the New Testament is bullsh!t some human beings concocted through time, god exists, he is wrathful, and he sends all you christians to hell for not worshiping correctly?

or...or, what if there is no god, there's just a devil, and when you die, that's where you go no matter what you do!

or....or.or, what if God doesn't exist and you cease to exist while your mortal remains disintegrate in the Earth's soil? there's an idea!

show me proof the Bible was not written by God. That would settle a lot.

right after you show me proof that God exists and atheists are wrong.

I think you may have missed the point I was making. Your initial question, what if we're wrong, is baseless....You want us come up with with some fail-safe without giving us any logical reason to. So I countered by asking you similar questions which required you to question your beliefs without any reason except the sheer probability that they may be false,...and look what you did, you asked me to give you proof!

48 PROPHECIES IN THE OLD TESTAMENT were fulfilled in one man Jesus Christ. The prophecies were fulfilled hundreds of years apart from when they were written.

...you're not getting the point are you? Regardless of how much evidence exists and how much reasoning I have, there is still a chance that I am false, therefore I should consider the question, what if I, as an atheist, am wrong about my beliefs? I redirected the question back at you, and now you're trying to "proof" why you think you're right....in doing so, you've refuted yourself, meaning that the basis of belief must be proof, and asking people to doubt themselves on mere baseless probability is ludicrous...the only valid way to challenge an atheists beliefs would be to challenge his evidence and provide your own. Ergo your question is meaningless.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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9/26/2012 3:09:45 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:25:54 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
So, atheists and agnostics, what if you are wrong about what you believe? If Christianity is true, then you will all wind up in Hell. Even if I'm wrong and christianity is false, nothing would happen to me. Seems to me, that you guys have taken a very, risky bet concerning your eternity.

You don't believe there is an Indiana Jones type boulder rolling in the direction of your house, do you? What if you are wrong, and the boulder crushes you and your family? Why are you still on the computer? Why aren't you getting your family to safety? Oh ya, because there is no evidence of a threat to your house from a rolling boulder...Just like there is no evidence of hell, so I'm not worried at all.
Ruckmanite
Posts: 289
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9/26/2012 3:14:50 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:55:39 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:46:06 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:42:28 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:38:23 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:35:16 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:30:59 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:27:37 PM, 000ike wrote:
what if God exists, but Christians have been doing it wrong the whole time, and you all rot in hell along with us atheists?

....I hope you see the problem with asking fear-based hypotheticals.

Except the bible tells christians in the New Testament how to live.

What if the New Testament is bullsh!t some human beings concocted through time, god exists, he is wrathful, and he sends all you christians to hell for not worshiping correctly?

or...or, what if there is no god, there's just a devil, and when you die, that's where you go no matter what you do!

or....or.or, what if God doesn't exist and you cease to exist while your mortal remains disintegrate in the Earth's soil? there's an idea!

show me proof the Bible was not written by God. That would settle a lot.

right after you show me proof that God exists and atheists are wrong.

I think you may have missed the point I was making. Your initial question, what if we're wrong, is baseless....You want us come up with with some fail-safe without giving us any logical reason to. So I countered by asking you similar questions which required you to question your beliefs without any reason except the sheer probability that they may be false,...and look what you did, you asked me to give you proof!

48 PROPHECIES IN THE OLD TESTAMENT were fulfilled in one man Jesus Christ. The prophecies were fulfilled hundreds of years apart from when they were written.

...you're not getting the point are you? Regardless of how much evidence exists and how much reasoning I have, there is still a chance that I am false, therefore I should consider the question, what if I, as an atheist, am wrong about my beliefs? I redirected the question back at you, and now you're trying to "proof" why you think you're right....in doing so, you've refuted yourself, meaning that the basis of belief must be proof, and asking people to doubt themselves on mere baseless probability is ludicrous...the only valid way to challenge an atheists beliefs would be to challenge his evidence and provide your own. Ergo your question is meaningless.

the purpose of my original thread was to make you think about your eternity and reexamine your beliefs.
Let your words be the genuine picture of your heart- John Wesley
Money is a horrid thing to follow, but a charming thing to meet-Henry James
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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9/26/2012 3:15:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Basically, anybody can make up something to be scared of...Thus, this wager of yours is meaningless without evidence of an actual threat.
Ruckmanite
Posts: 289
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9/26/2012 3:16:07 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 3:09:45 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:25:54 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
So, atheists and agnostics, what if you are wrong about what you believe? If Christianity is true, then you will all wind up in Hell. Even if I'm wrong and christianity is false, nothing would happen to me. Seems to me, that you guys have taken a very, risky bet concerning your eternity.

You don't believe there is an Indiana Jones type boulder rolling in the direction of your house, do you? What if you are wrong, and the boulder crushes you and your family? Why are you still on the computer? Why aren't you getting your family to safety? Oh ya, because there is no evidence of a threat to your house from a rolling boulder...Just like there is no evidence of hell, so I'm not worried at all.

to deny God's existence means you believe there is substantial reason to. What is your evidence?
Let your words be the genuine picture of your heart- John Wesley
Money is a horrid thing to follow, but a charming thing to meet-Henry James
Ruckmanite
Posts: 289
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9/26/2012 3:17:43 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:52:34 PM, Blind-Faith wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:25:54 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
So, atheists and agnostics, what if you are wrong about what you believe? If Christianity is true, then you will all wind up in Hell. Even if I'm wrong and christianity is false, nothing would happen to me. Seems to me, that you guys have taken a very, risky bet concerning your eternity.

Pascal's wager eh!
But what if you are wrong and the muslims are right ?

Koran.5.The table spread...

{5:72 They surely disbelieve who say: Lo! Allah is the Messiah, son of Mary. The Messiah (himself) said: O Children of Israel, worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord. Lo! whoso ascribeth partners unto Allah, for him Allah hath forbidden paradise. His abode is the Fire. For evil-doers there will be no helpers.
5:73 They surely disbelieve who say: Lo! Allah is the third of three; when there is no God save the One God. If they desist not from so saying a painful doom will fall on those of them who disbelieve.}

Looks like your doomed my friend...
Welcome to the hellfire club.

Muhammed was an illiterate, epileptic, fornicating pedophile. If you actually read the Quran, you would know that he copies and plagiarizes from the Old Testament. There is no originality to his religion.
Let your words be the genuine picture of your heart- John Wesley
Money is a horrid thing to follow, but a charming thing to meet-Henry James
Chaos88
Posts: 247
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9/26/2012 3:27:13 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:25:54 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
So, atheists and agnostics, what if you are wrong about what you believe? If Christianity is true, then you will all wind up in Hell. Even if I'm wrong and christianity is false, nothing would happen to me. Seems to me, that you guys have taken a very, risky bet concerning your eternity.

Didn't Pascal use this mathematical argument?
Infinite benefit for little discomfort vs. Pleasurable life and infinite suffering.

Of course Ike makes a valid point regarding you need to still choose correctly (which faith and by what means).
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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9/26/2012 3:27:38 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 3:16:07 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 3:09:45 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:25:54 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
So, atheists and agnostics, what if you are wrong about what you believe? If Christianity is true, then you will all wind up in Hell. Even if I'm wrong and christianity is false, nothing would happen to me. Seems to me, that you guys have taken a very, risky bet concerning your eternity.

You don't believe there is an Indiana Jones type boulder rolling in the direction of your house, do you? What if you are wrong, and the boulder crushes you and your family? Why are you still on the computer? Why aren't you getting your family to safety? Oh ya, because there is no evidence of a threat to your house from a rolling boulder...Just like there is no evidence of hell, so I'm not worried at all.

to deny God's existence means you believe there is substantial reason to. What is your evidence?

When did I deny God's existence? You completely dodged the implications of my post lol Either way, you have no evidence that there isn't a monster living on the icy moon of Europa, yet, you still don't believe the monster is there. The burden of proof is on you big guy, you are making the positive claim of existence.
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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9/26/2012 3:29:31 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 3:16:07 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 3:09:45 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:25:54 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
So, atheists and agnostics, what if you are wrong about what you believe? If Christianity is true, then you will all wind up in Hell. Even if I'm wrong and christianity is false, nothing would happen to me. Seems to me, that you guys have taken a very, risky bet concerning your eternity.

You don't believe there is an Indiana Jones type boulder rolling in the direction of your house, do you? What if you are wrong, and the boulder crushes you and your family? Why are you still on the computer? Why aren't you getting your family to safety? Oh ya, because there is no evidence of a threat to your house from a rolling boulder...Just like there is no evidence of hell, so I'm not worried at all.

to deny God's existence means you believe there is substantial reason to. What is your evidence?

Also, I do have a very good reason to not believe in God: I've encountered no good reasons to believe in God. Simple.
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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9/26/2012 3:31:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 3:16:07 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 3:09:45 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:25:54 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
So, atheists and agnostics, what if you are wrong about what you believe? If Christianity is true, then you will all wind up in Hell. Even if I'm wrong and christianity is false, nothing would happen to me. Seems to me, that you guys have taken a very, risky bet concerning your eternity.

You don't believe there is an Indiana Jones type boulder rolling in the direction of your house, do you? What if you are wrong, and the boulder crushes you and your family? Why are you still on the computer? Why aren't you getting your family to safety? Oh ya, because there is no evidence of a threat to your house from a rolling boulder...Just like there is no evidence of hell, so I'm not worried at all.

to deny God's existence means you believe there is substantial reason to. What is your evidence?

Give me one valid argument, which involves premises one would have to be irrational not to accept as true, which logically concludes God's existence and I'm a theist. Just like that. Unfortunately, I've encountered no such argument.
Ruckmanite
Posts: 289
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9/26/2012 3:42:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 3:31:49 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/26/2012 3:16:07 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 3:09:45 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:25:54 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
So, atheists and agnostics, what if you are wrong about what you believe? If Christianity is true, then you will all wind up in Hell. Even if I'm wrong and christianity is false, nothing would happen to me. Seems to me, that you guys have taken a very, risky bet concerning your eternity.

You don't believe there is an Indiana Jones type boulder rolling in the direction of your house, do you? What if you are wrong, and the boulder crushes you and your family? Why are you still on the computer? Why aren't you getting your family to safety? Oh ya, because there is no evidence of a threat to your house from a rolling boulder...Just like there is no evidence of hell, so I'm not worried at all.

to deny God's existence means you believe there is substantial reason to. What is your evidence?

Give me one valid argument, which involves premises one would have to be irrational not to accept as true, which logically concludes God's existence and I'm a theist. Just like that. Unfortunately, I've encountered no such argument.

Here is one:
http://carm.org...

Here is another:
Why do people do good things when there is no benefit for them unless there was a Creator that gave them a conscience. For example, why would someone give up there seat on a bus for an old lady? Or why would someone donate blood, assuming its not for a relative and they arent promised free ice cream or something? or why would a man jump into a river to save a little girl and he knows he will drown in the process.
Let your words be the genuine picture of your heart- John Wesley
Money is a horrid thing to follow, but a charming thing to meet-Henry James
The_Fool_on_the_hill
Posts: 6,071
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9/26/2012 3:51:45 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 2:25:54 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
So, atheists and agnostics, what if you are wrong about what you believe? If Christianity is true, then you will all wind up in Hell. Even if I'm wrong and christianity is false, nothing would happen to me. Seems to me, that you guys have taken a very, risky bet concerning your eternity.

The Fool: Well first, things first, Stop trying to define into existence that we believe in something or the other. The very lack of the ability to recognize the differene between "Term"s and reality is a good reason to think something is wrong about your understanding of the world. Its as easy as this. If the Bible is true. Then a Good God doesn't exist. Because a good God would not produce something to hurt us that bad. If there really is such a God its more likely he is evil and so you don't know what will happen, because you can't trust. God works in mysterious ways right? So I am counting on a Just God or none, or The only difference is that I know the limites of my knowledge to be able to account for such things. It is a humbleness about such claim which a Good and Just God will merit much better, then mere faith in pure ignorance just incase its true. Such chances are possiblities out of infinity which Equals 0 probability. I don't think A Good and Just God, thought his creations that STUPID!.
"The bud disappears when the blossom breaks through, and we might say that the former is refuted by the latter; in the same way when the fruit comes, the blossom may be explained to be a false form of the plant's existence, for the fruit appears as its true nature in place of the blossom. These stages are not merely differentiated; they supplant one another as being incompatible with one another." G. W. F. HEGEL
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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9/26/2012 3:52:18 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
What if youre wrong and the Jews are right. Jesus is a false messiah and Jehovah sends you to sheol.

What if youre wrong and the Nords are right. Thor will smash you to pieces with his hammer and you don't get into Valhalla.

What if youre wrong and the Greeks were right. Zeus will blast you with a dozen lightning rods and sends your burnt body to Hades.

What if youre wrong and the Atheists were right. You will have surpressed and limited your desires and experiences and will die never having experienced pleasure, happiness, only fear, guilt, and judgment.

What if youre wrong and the Hindus are right. You failed to live according to the Dharma and you reincarnate as a piece of mud under someones shoe.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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9/26/2012 3:58:37 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/26/2012 3:42:22 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 3:31:49 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/26/2012 3:16:07 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
At 9/26/2012 3:09:45 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 9/26/2012 2:25:54 PM, Ruckmanite wrote:
So, atheists and agnostics, what if you are wrong about what you believe? If Christianity is true, then you will all wind up in Hell. Even if I'm wrong and christianity is false, nothing would happen to me. Seems to me, that you guys have taken a very, risky bet concerning your eternity.

You don't believe there is an Indiana Jones type boulder rolling in the direction of your house, do you? What if you are wrong, and the boulder crushes you and your family? Why are you still on the computer? Why aren't you getting your family to safety? Oh ya, because there is no evidence of a threat to your house from a rolling boulder...Just like there is no evidence of hell, so I'm not worried at all.

to deny God's existence means you believe there is substantial reason to. What is your evidence?

Give me one valid argument, which involves premises one would have to be irrational not to accept as true, which logically concludes God's existence and I'm a theist. Just like that. Unfortunately, I've encountered no such argument.

Here is one:
http://carm.org...

Lol No, Tag is not a good argument at all.


Here is another:
Why do people do good things when there is no benefit for them unless there was a Creator that gave them a conscience.

A question isn't an argument.

For example, why would someone give up there seat on a bus for an old lady?

Once more, a question is not an argument. Also, doing things like that feels good, it's called the "helpers high". Your brain releases "feel good" chemicals when these situations happen. Also, our brains allow us to engage in sympathy and empathy, so we feel for other people who are in a rut sometimes. I do not see how any God is required for this lol

Or why would someone donate blood, assuming its not for a relative and they arent promised free ice cream or something?

Because of the "helpers high", they feel like they are doing something they don't have to, but they do it anyway, it's absolute freedom. Also, once more, sympathy and empathy. There are plenty of reasons why this would occur, none of which have anything to do with a God. If this is what you call an argument for God's existence, you should be embarrassed.

or why would a man jump into a river to save a little girl and he knows he will drown in the process.

I can ask questions to, why did Ted Bundy rape people? Why do people just stand around sometimes when one person is getting jumped by a gang? Why are there other situations, where people would jump in to help the person is that one person was getting jumped by a gang? People react differently, and none of this has to do with God, I thought you were arguing your God's existence?