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The Holy Quran study group: Verses 99:6-8

baggins
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9/27/2012 12:03:30 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
99:6 On that Day will men proceed in companies sorted out, to be shown the deeds that they (had done).
99:7 Then shall anyone who has done an atom's weight of good, see it!
99:8 And anyone who has done an atom's weight of evil, shall see it.
The Holy Quran 29:19-20

See they not how Allah originates creation, then repeats it: truly that is easy for Allah.

Say: "Travel through the earth and see how Allah did originate creation; so will Allah produce a later creation: for Allah has power over all things.
joneszj
Posts: 1,202
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9/27/2012 12:24:34 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 12:03:30 PM, baggins wrote:
99:6 On that Day will men proceed in companies sorted out, to be shown the deeds that they (had done).
99:7 Then shall anyone who has done an atom's weight of good, see it!
99:8 And anyone who has done an atom's weight of evil, shall see it.

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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9/27/2012 12:26:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 12:24:34 PM, joneszj wrote:
Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.
Did you read the cover of the book you're citing? I believe it says Bible. Now, hit the road.
joneszj
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9/27/2012 12:30:56 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 12:26:48 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 9/27/2012 12:24:34 PM, joneszj wrote:
Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.
Did you read the cover of the book you're citing? I believe it says Bible. Now, hit the road.

No, I think I will stay. Thanks for your hospitality.
Blind-Faith
Posts: 65
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9/27/2012 12:32:01 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Baggins Quoted.

99:6 On that Day will men proceed in companies sorted out, to be shown the deeds that they (had done).
99:7 Then shall anyone who has done an atom's weight of good, see it!
99:8 And anyone who has done an atom's weight of evil, shall see it.

Hello Baggins.
The version I have is...

{99: The Earthquake
99:1 When Earth is shaken with her (final) earthquake (99:1)
"When Earth is shaken with her (final) earthquake"
At the end of the world, Allah will cause a massive earthquake and then send everyone to heaven or hell.
99:2 And Earth yieldeth up her burdens,
99:3 And man saith: What aileth her ?
99:4 That day she will relate her chronicles,
99:5 Because thy Lord inspireth her.
99:6 That day mankind will issue forth in scattered groups to be shown their deeds.
99:7 And whoso doeth good an atom's weight will see it then,
99:8 And whoso doeth ill an atom's weight will see it then. }

Are we on the same page?
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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9/27/2012 12:33:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 12:32:01 PM, Blind-Faith wrote:
Baggins Quoted.

99:6 On that Day will men proceed in companies sorted out, to be shown the deeds that they (had done).
99:7 Then shall anyone who has done an atom's weight of good, see it!
99:8 And anyone who has done an atom's weight of evil, shall see it.

Hello Baggins.
The version I have is...

{99: The Earthquake
99:1 When Earth is shaken with her (final) earthquake (99:1)
"When Earth is shaken with her (final) earthquake"
At the end of the world, Allah will cause a massive earthquake and then send everyone to heaven or hell.
99:2 And Earth yieldeth up her burdens,
99:3 And man saith: What aileth her ?
99:4 That day she will relate her chronicles,
99:5 Because thy Lord inspireth her.
99:6 That day mankind will issue forth in scattered groups to be shown their deeds.
99:7 And whoso doeth good an atom's weight will see it then,
99:8 And whoso doeth ill an atom's weight will see it then. }

Are we on the same page?
Yes, if you delete everything before verse 6, Ma'am.
Blind-Faith
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9/27/2012 12:36:33 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
And this comes just before the stars fall from the sky?
Very poetic, and I am a big Jim Morrison fan.
Blind-Faith
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9/27/2012 12:43:23 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
If I confused anybody with my last post....

The Doors-Touch me..

"Now, I'm gonna love you Till the heavens stop the rain
I'm gonna love you Till the stars fall from the sky
for you and I"

Lyrics by, Jim Morrison
joneszj
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9/27/2012 12:50:56 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 12:50:09 PM, Blind-Faith wrote:
Mirza wrote.

We obviously need user moderation on threads.

Your point being?

*The elephant in the room*
socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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9/27/2012 12:53:19 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 12:43:23 PM, Blind-Faith wrote:
If I confused anybody with my last post....

The Doors-Touch me..

"Now, I'm gonna love you Till the heavens stop the rain
I'm gonna love you Till the stars fall from the sky
for you and I"

Lyrics by, Jim Morrison

Touch Me was a terrible song. When The Music's Over and Crystal Ship are near perfect.

At 9/27/2012 12:03:30 PM, baggins wrote:
99:6 On that Day will men proceed in companies sorted out, to be shown the deeds that they (had done).
99:7 Then shall anyone who has done an atom's weight of good, see it!
99:8 And anyone who has done an atom's weight of evil, shall see it.

I'm not really sure what there's to discuss. Whether there's a hell? On that matter I suppose I agree with the liberal Christians that eternal hell is not compatible with omnibenevolence. That being said I don't think it disproves the idea of God entirely, just the idea of either eternal hell or omnibenevolence.
: At 9/29/2014 10:55:59 AM, imabench wrote:
: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
: :
: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
:
: I disagree.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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9/27/2012 12:54:41 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 12:53:19 PM, socialpinko wrote:
I'm not really sure what there's to discuss. Whether there's a hell? On that matter I suppose I agree with the liberal Christians that eternal hell is not compatible with omnibenevolence. That being said I don't think it disproves the idea of God entirely, just the idea of either eternal hell or omnibenevolence.
Omnibenevolence is not the only attribute of God. He has many characteristics, and when combined, it is not hard to argue for an eternal Hell.
Blind-Faith
Posts: 65
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9/27/2012 12:54:47 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 12:50:56 PM, joneszj wrote:
At 9/27/2012 12:50:09 PM, Blind-Faith wrote:
Mirza wrote.

We obviously need user moderation on threads.

Your point being?

*The elephant in the room*

Off to the waterhole. Back soon.....
Mirza
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9/27/2012 12:55:29 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 12:54:47 PM, Blind-Faith wrote:
Off to the waterhole. Back soon.....
Please, take your time. Unlimited is appreciated.
socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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9/27/2012 12:58:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 12:54:41 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 9/27/2012 12:53:19 PM, socialpinko wrote:
I'm not really sure what there's to discuss. Whether there's a hell? On that matter I suppose I agree with the liberal Christians that eternal hell is not compatible with omnibenevolence. That being said I don't think it disproves the idea of God entirely, just the idea of either eternal hell or omnibenevolence.
Omnibenevolence is not the only attribute of God. He has many characteristics, and when combined, it is not hard to argue for an eternal Hell.

I realize there are other attributes. But I don't see how they justify hell. Care to expand?
: At 9/29/2014 10:55:59 AM, imabench wrote:
: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
: :
: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
:
: I disagree.
joneszj
Posts: 1,202
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9/27/2012 1:12:29 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 12:58:22 PM, socialpinko wrote:
At 9/27/2012 12:54:41 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 9/27/2012 12:53:19 PM, socialpinko wrote:
I'm not really sure what there's to discuss. Whether there's a hell? On that matter I suppose I agree with the liberal Christians that eternal hell is not compatible with omnibenevolence. That being said I don't think it disproves the idea of God entirely, just the idea of either eternal hell or omnibenevolence.
Omnibenevolence is not the only attribute of God. He has many characteristics, and when combined, it is not hard to argue for an eternal Hell.

I realize there are other attributes. But I don't see how they justify hell. Care to expand?

I don't think omni-benevolence is an attribute we can understand God having without first giving it a contextual definition.
Blind-Faith
Posts: 65
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9/27/2012 2:49:57 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
The great Pachyderm enters the room trumpeting greetings and salutations to one and all.

Mirza, I did not realise that this was thread only for people who believe in the Abrahamic faith.
Maybe a sub heading should be added explaining this?
Otherwise, I have absolutely no idea why you believe a mod should be needed???
I simply called a Quranic verse poetic and mentioned that Jim Morrison used it in a song.
Jeez! I don"t know why you are all so touchy?

Socialpinko wrote.
Touch Me was a terrible song. When The Music's Over and Crystal Ship are near perfect.
I agree with Socialpinko it was not 'The Doors' at their best.

I asked a valid question. The Quran is not written in chronological order.

Baggins quoted.

99:6 On that Day will men proceed in companies sorted out, to be shown the deeds that they (had done).
99:7 Then shall anyone who has done an atom's weight of good, see it!
99:8 And anyone who has done an atom's weight of evil, shall see it.

Is this after....?

{The Quran.

81: The Overthrowing

81:1 When the sun is overthrown,
81:2 And when the stars fall,
81:3 And when the hills are moved,
81:4 And when the camels big with young are abandoned,
81:5 And when the wild beasts are herded together,
81:6 And when the seas rise,
81:7 And when souls are reunited, }
socialpinko
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9/27/2012 2:59:08 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 1:12:29 PM, joneszj wrote:
At 9/27/2012 12:58:22 PM, socialpinko wrote:
At 9/27/2012 12:54:41 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 9/27/2012 12:53:19 PM, socialpinko wrote:
I'm not really sure what there's to discuss. Whether there's a hell? On that matter I suppose I agree with the liberal Christians that eternal hell is not compatible with omnibenevolence. That being said I don't think it disproves the idea of God entirely, just the idea of either eternal hell or omnibenevolence.
Omnibenevolence is not the only attribute of God. He has many characteristics, and when combined, it is not hard to argue for an eternal Hell.

I realize there are other attributes. But I don't see how they justify hell. Care to expand?

I don't think omni-benevolence is an attribute we can understand God having without first giving it a contextual definition.

This is sort of a re-formulation of what Mirza said. I was hoping for an expansion on that thought i.e., how a contextual view of God's attributes would side-step the initial problem I brought up.
: At 9/29/2014 10:55:59 AM, imabench wrote:
: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
: :
: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
:
: I disagree.
baggins
Posts: 855
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9/27/2012 3:03:30 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 12:03:30 PM, baggins wrote:
99:6 On that Day will men proceed in companies sorted out, to be shown the deeds that they (had done).
99:7 Then shall anyone who has done an atom's weight of good, see it!
99:8 And anyone who has done an atom's weight of evil, shall see it.

These verses are not about hell. These verses are about day of judgement, and the accountability of our deeds. Many people spend whole lifetime of evil in blind and futile pursuit of this world; completely forgetting that they have to answer for their actions one day...
The Holy Quran 29:19-20

See they not how Allah originates creation, then repeats it: truly that is easy for Allah.

Say: "Travel through the earth and see how Allah did originate creation; so will Allah produce a later creation: for Allah has power over all things.
baggins
Posts: 855
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9/27/2012 3:25:05 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 12:24:34 PM, joneszj wrote:
At 9/27/2012 12:03:30 PM, baggins wrote:
99:6 On that Day will men proceed in companies sorted out, to be shown the deeds that they (had done).
99:7 Then shall anyone who has done an atom's weight of good, see it!
99:8 And anyone who has done an atom's weight of evil, shall see it.

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

No doubt that those who are saved are indebted to God for grace and guidance. It is also clear that we should be humble, thankful but not boastful, for arrogance is the sign of Satan. It is not possible for any person to achieve salvation through his own efforts.

On other hand, how does God decide whom to save and whom to lead astray. Allah is just. Being just, Allah is likely to guide those who make efforts to read God. Our deeds are very important, for they are the real proof of our faith. Merely claiming to be faithful does not make us a believer. Our faith has to be a part of our life also.
The Holy Quran 29:19-20

See they not how Allah originates creation, then repeats it: truly that is easy for Allah.

Say: "Travel through the earth and see how Allah did originate creation; so will Allah produce a later creation: for Allah has power over all things.
baggins
Posts: 855
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9/27/2012 3:31:12 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
@ Blind-Faith

Here is the translation of complete Surah.

The Holy Quran:- 99:1-8

When Earth is shaken with her (final) earthquake
And Earth yieldeth up her burdens,
And man saith: What aileth her?
That day she will relate her chronicles,
Because thy Lord inspireth her.
That day mankind will issue forth in scattered groups to be shown their deeds.
And whoso doeth good an atom's weight will see it then,
And whoso doeth ill an atom's weight will see it then.


I only presented the last three verses.
The Holy Quran 29:19-20

See they not how Allah originates creation, then repeats it: truly that is easy for Allah.

Say: "Travel through the earth and see how Allah did originate creation; so will Allah produce a later creation: for Allah has power over all things.
baggins
Posts: 855
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9/27/2012 3:32:47 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 3:18:59 PM, Koopin wrote:
Is there KFC in the quran?

I haven't come across it.
The Holy Quran 29:19-20

See they not how Allah originates creation, then repeats it: truly that is easy for Allah.

Say: "Travel through the earth and see how Allah did originate creation; so will Allah produce a later creation: for Allah has power over all things.
joneszj
Posts: 1,202
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9/27/2012 3:52:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 2:59:08 PM, socialpinko wrote:
At 9/27/2012 1:12:29 PM, joneszj wrote:
At 9/27/2012 12:58:22 PM, socialpinko wrote:
At 9/27/2012 12:54:41 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 9/27/2012 12:53:19 PM, socialpinko wrote:
I'm not really sure what there's to discuss. Whether there's a hell? On that matter I suppose I agree with the liberal Christians that eternal hell is not compatible with omnibenevolence. That being said I don't think it disproves the idea of God entirely, just the idea of either eternal hell or omnibenevolence.
Omnibenevolence is not the only attribute of God. He has many characteristics, and when combined, it is not hard to argue for an eternal Hell.

I realize there are other attributes. But I don't see how they justify hell. Care to expand?

I don't think omni-benevolence is an attribute we can understand God having without first giving it a contextual definition.

This is sort of a re-formulation of what Mirza said. I was hoping for an expansion on that thought i.e., how a contextual view of God's attributes would side-step the initial problem I brought up.

I had no intention of presenting anything just that if we were going to be tossing the term around we should define it as in many cases it definition changes on the context.
Blind-Faith
Posts: 65
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9/27/2012 4:02:05 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Baggins quoted

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

Baggins
No doubt that those who are saved are indebted to God for grace and guidance. It is also clear that we should be humble, thankful but not boastful, for arrogance is the sign of Satan. It is not possible for any person to achieve salvation through his own efforts.

On other hand, how does God decide whom to save and whom to lead astray. Allah is just. Being just, Allah is likely to guide those who make efforts to read God. Our deeds are very important, for they are the real proof of our faith. Merely claiming to be faithful does not make us a believer. Our faith has to be a part of our life also.

___________________________________________________________________

{The Quran,

2:6 As for the Disbelievers, Whether thou warn them or thou warn them not it is all one for them; they believe not.
2:7 Allah hath sealed their hearing and their hearts, and on their eyes there is a covering. Theirs will be an awful doom.}

The Quran makes it clear that you were preordained for disbelief.
Does not matter what you, or anyone else around you do. Allah has chosen your destiny before you were even born.
Allah loves nothing more than burning his preordained disbelievers in the fires of hell.
What a wise and merciful god Allah is.
joneszj
Posts: 1,202
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9/27/2012 4:06:33 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 4:02:05 PM, Blind-Faith wrote:
Baggins quoted

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

Baggins
No doubt that those who are saved are indebted to God for grace and guidance. It is also clear that we should be humble, thankful but not boastful, for arrogance is the sign of Satan. It is not possible for any person to achieve salvation through his own efforts.

On other hand, how does God decide whom to save and whom to lead astray. Allah is just. Being just, Allah is likely to guide those who make efforts to read God. Our deeds are very important, for they are the real proof of our faith. Merely claiming to be faithful does not make us a believer. Our faith has to be a part of our life also.

___________________________________________________________________

{The Quran,

2:6 As for the Disbelievers, Whether thou warn them or thou warn them not it is all one for them; they believe not.
2:7 Allah hath sealed their hearing and their hearts, and on their eyes there is a covering. Theirs will be an awful doom.}

The Quran makes it clear that you were preordained for disbelief.
Does not matter what you, or anyone else around you do. Allah has chosen your destiny before you were even born.
Allah loves nothing more than burning his preordained disbelievers in the fires of hell.
What a wise and merciful god Allah is.

Finally, someone admits a form of determinism in Islam. However that verse you quoted could be interpreted similar in the manner of Calvinism vr. Hyper-Calvinism. But hey, at least its logically consistent!
socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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9/27/2012 4:30:16 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 3:03:30 PM, baggins wrote:
At 9/27/2012 12:03:30 PM, baggins wrote:
99:6 On that Day will men proceed in companies sorted out, to be shown the deeds that they (had done).
99:7 Then shall anyone who has done an atom's weight of good, see it!
99:8 And anyone who has done an atom's weight of evil, shall see it.

These verses are not about hell. These verses are about day of judgement, and the accountability of our deeds. Many people spend whole lifetime of evil in blind and futile pursuit of this world; completely forgetting that they have to answer for their actions one day...

Then I don't see much to discuss. I mean everyone knows Islam and Christianity are religions that promise cosmic justice. What are we actually supposed to discuss then?
: At 9/29/2014 10:55:59 AM, imabench wrote:
: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
: :
: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
:
: I disagree.