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Ironic Use of First Amendment by Fundies

royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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10/22/2012 3:28:39 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Apparently anything attached to religion should only be banned from schools if it is not Christian.

ENCINITAS, Calif. (AP) " A group of parents is bent out of shape by free yoga classes at schools in this San Diego County beachside community, fearing they are indoctrinating youngsters in eastern religion.

"There's a deep concern that the Encinitas Union School District is using taxpayer resources to promote Ashtanga yoga and Hinduism, a religion system of beliefs and practices," the parents' attorney, Dean Broyles, told the North County Times (http://bit.ly... ).

In an Oct. 12 email to district Superintendent Tim Baird, Broyles called the yoga program unconstitutional and said he may take unspecified legal action unless the classes stop.

The lessons are funded by a $533,000, three-year grant from the Jois Foundation, a nonprofit group that promotes Asthanga yoga. Some schools began classes last month and others will begin holding them in January.

The classes involve traditional eastern breathing techniques and poses. The district chooses teachers and sets the curriculum while the foundation trains the teachers.

The district has removed any religious content from the twice-weekly classes, Baird said.

"I think that they really would like to think that, but I don't think that, in actuality, it has been done," said Mary Eady, who removed her son from the classes. "There's really a lot of unease among a lot of parents."

The superintendent said only a few parents have pulled their children from the yoga classes and he did not expect district trustees to cancel the program.

"Our goal is that kids get a really healthy workout, that they get a chance to relax and reduce stress and yoga's perfect for that," Baird said.

"Yoga is a worldwide exercise regime utilized by people of many different faiths," he said. "Yoga is part of our mainstream culture."

Jois Foundation Director Eugene Ruffin denied the group is religious and said the board of directors includes people from various faiths.

"These therapies are headed toward trying to find solutions for some of the stress that these children find themselves in," he said. "We're trying to solve problems."
AlwaysMoreThanYou
Posts: 2,900
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10/22/2012 3:31:24 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
"Practising yoga is Satanic" - Father Gabriele Amorth
'When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.' - John 16:13
royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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10/22/2012 3:36:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/22/2012 3:31:24 PM, AlwaysMoreThanYou wrote:
"Practising yoga is Satanic" - Father Gabriele Amorth

LOL, yes. It's such a bad thing to do exercises.
AlwaysMoreThanYou
Posts: 2,900
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10/22/2012 3:37:50 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/22/2012 3:36:49 PM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 10/22/2012 3:31:24 PM, AlwaysMoreThanYou wrote:
"Practising yoga is Satanic" - Father Gabriele Amorth

LOL, yes. It's such a bad thing to do exercises.

According to Fr. Amorth, it is.

He's dueled many a demon is his day; I expect he knows what he's talking about.
'When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.' - John 16:13
medic0506
Posts: 13,450
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10/22/2012 4:03:08 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
This isn't something that I'd personally have a problem with, however I do understand the reasoning behind the complaint. I'd be willing to bet that if someone tried to set up a twice weekly exercise class using aerobics to Christian rock music, people would have a cow. So, frankly, if the 1st Amendment is going to be abused then it should be abused equally.
DanielChristopherBlowes
Posts: 1,066
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10/22/2012 4:07:16 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/22/2012 3:28:39 PM, royalpaladin wrote:
Apparently anything attached to religion should only be banned from schools if it is not Christian.

ENCINITAS, Calif. (AP) " A group of parents is bent out of shape by free yoga classes at schools in this San Diego County beachside community, fearing they are indoctrinating youngsters in eastern religion.

"There's a deep concern that the Encinitas Union School District is using taxpayer resources to promote Ashtanga yoga and Hinduism, a religion system of beliefs and practices," the parents' attorney, Dean Broyles, told the North County Times (http://bit.ly... ).

In an Oct. 12 email to district Superintendent Tim Baird, Broyles called the yoga program unconstitutional and said he may take unspecified legal action unless the classes stop.

The lessons are funded by a $533,000, three-year grant from the Jois Foundation, a nonprofit group that promotes Asthanga yoga. Some schools began classes last month and others will begin holding them in January.

The classes involve traditional eastern breathing techniques and poses. The district chooses teachers and sets the curriculum while the foundation trains the teachers.

The district has removed any religious content from the twice-weekly classes, Baird said.

"I think that they really would like to think that, but I don't think that, in actuality, it has been done," said Mary Eady, who removed her son from the classes. "There's really a lot of unease among a lot of parents."

The superintendent said only a few parents have pulled their children from the yoga classes and he did not expect district trustees to cancel the program.

"Our goal is that kids get a really healthy workout, that they get a chance to relax and reduce stress and yoga's perfect for that," Baird said.

"Yoga is a worldwide exercise regime utilized by people of many different faiths," he said. "Yoga is part of our mainstream culture."

Jois Foundation Director Eugene Ruffin denied the group is religious and said the board of directors includes people from various faiths.

"These therapies are headed toward trying to find solutions for some of the stress that these children find themselves in," he said. "We're trying to solve problems."


It's not just exercise, it's a spiritual discipline.

Of course if it's not Christian, then to Christians, it's demonic.
Everyone on the side of Truth listens to Me. (Jesus Christ)
royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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10/22/2012 4:37:28 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/22/2012 4:03:08 PM, medic0506 wrote:
This isn't something that I'd personally have a problem with, however I do understand the reasoning behind the complaint. I'd be willing to bet that if someone tried to set up a twice weekly exercise class using aerobics to Christian rock music, people would have a cow. So, frankly, if the 1st Amendment is going to be abused then it should be abused equally.

The situations are not equal. The program removed all references to religion from the yoga (yes, it's possible; I've done it before). The response of the parents is "We're not sure that you're not lying about removing the references". They're not even claiming that it's impossible to remove the references; they're literally saying that the teachers might be lying (even though they're not).
DanielChristopherBlowes
Posts: 1,066
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10/22/2012 4:47:18 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/22/2012 4:37:28 PM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 10/22/2012 4:03:08 PM, medic0506 wrote:
This isn't something that I'd personally have a problem with, however I do understand the reasoning behind the complaint. I'd be willing to bet that if someone tried to set up a twice weekly exercise class using aerobics to Christian rock music, people would have a cow. So, frankly, if the 1st Amendment is going to be abused then it should be abused equally.

The situations are not equal. The program removed all references to religion from the yoga (yes, it's possible; I've done it before). The response of the parents is "We're not sure that you're not lying about removing the references". They're not even claiming that it's impossible to remove the references; they're literally saying that the teachers might be lying (even though they're not).

The reason we Christians hate it is that it focuses attention on Self, and we know that freedom is found when we look away from ourselves to that which is higher, to Jesus.

So even if you take out all the Hinduism this is still true.
Everyone on the side of Truth listens to Me. (Jesus Christ)
AlwaysMoreThanYou
Posts: 2,900
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10/22/2012 4:47:52 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/22/2012 4:37:28 PM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 10/22/2012 4:03:08 PM, medic0506 wrote:
This isn't something that I'd personally have a problem with, however I do understand the reasoning behind the complaint. I'd be willing to bet that if someone tried to set up a twice weekly exercise class using aerobics to Christian rock music, people would have a cow. So, frankly, if the 1st Amendment is going to be abused then it should be abused equally.

The situations are not equal. The program removed all references to religion from the yoga (yes, it's possible; I've done it before). The response of the parents is "We're not sure that you're not lying about removing the references". They're not even claiming that it's impossible to remove the references; they're literally saying that the teachers might be lying (even though they're not).

Lies.

If the exorcist of the Dioceses of Rome says that yoga is satanic, yoga is probably satanic. No matter how much you sugarcoat satan, he's still there.

Fr. Amorth is probably one of the most knowledgeable people when it comes to satan. If he says yoga is satanic, I'm inclined to trust his expert opinion over your pagan views.
'When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.' - John 16:13
Stephen_Hawkins
Posts: 5,316
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10/22/2012 5:43:37 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
AMTY, you're not getting on the Daily Stupid.
Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. Teach him how to be Gay, he'll positively influence the GDP.

Social Contract Theory debate: http://www.debate.org...
medic0506
Posts: 13,450
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10/22/2012 5:54:26 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/22/2012 4:37:28 PM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 10/22/2012 4:03:08 PM, medic0506 wrote:
This isn't something that I'd personally have a problem with, however I do understand the reasoning behind the complaint. I'd be willing to bet that if someone tried to set up a twice weekly exercise class using aerobics to Christian rock music, people would have a cow. So, frankly, if the 1st Amendment is going to be abused then it should be abused equally.

The situations are not equal. The program removed all references to religion from the yoga (yes, it's possible; I've done it before). The response of the parents is "We're not sure that you're not lying about removing the references". They're not even claiming that it's impossible to remove the references; they're literally saying that the teachers might be lying (even though they're not).

I don't mean this in a disrespectful way toward you but you're just reading someone's account of the story. You can't really say with any certainty what has been removed and what hasn't. Even if you're right, the meditation part of the religion is there, and if people find it appealing then that would encourage them to pursue the belief system further. There's no way you can remove any semblance of, or any possibility of people converting, so in that respect it can be said that the school is favoring or advocating a specific religion.
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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10/22/2012 5:57:41 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/22/2012 5:54:26 PM, medic0506 wrote:
At 10/22/2012 4:37:28 PM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 10/22/2012 4:03:08 PM, medic0506 wrote:
This isn't something that I'd personally have a problem with, however I do understand the reasoning behind the complaint. I'd be willing to bet that if someone tried to set up a twice weekly exercise class using aerobics to Christian rock music, people would have a cow. So, frankly, if the 1st Amendment is going to be abused then it should be abused equally.

The situations are not equal. The program removed all references to religion from the yoga (yes, it's possible; I've done it before). The response of the parents is "We're not sure that you're not lying about removing the references". They're not even claiming that it's impossible to remove the references; they're literally saying that the teachers might be lying (even though they're not).

I don't mean this in a disrespectful way toward you but you're just reading someone's account of the story. You can't really say with any certainty what has been removed and what hasn't. Even if you're right, the meditation part of the religion is there, and if people find it appealing then that would encourage them to pursue the belief system further. There's no way you can remove any semblance of, or any possibility of people converting, so in that respect it can be said that the school is favoring or advocating a specific religion.

The religious implication of yoga are so nuanced in that if you take them to its logical degree when talking about other things using this way of thinking, you could eliminate teachers because the Bible gives mention of them. Elimination of yoga because of its virtually non-existent religious implications, which are incidentally a lot less fascistic and malevolent than most religions in the US, is just reductio ad absurdum.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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10/22/2012 6:33:34 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/22/2012 3:31:24 PM, AlwaysMoreThanYou wrote:
"Practising yoga is Satanic" - Father Gabriele Amorth

The man who said that is definitely loony toons.
AlwaysMoreThanYou
Posts: 2,900
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10/23/2012 3:29:40 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/22/2012 5:43:37 PM, Stephen_Hawkins wrote:
AMTY, you're not getting on the Daily Stupid.

It was worth a shot...
'When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.' - John 16:13