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How do you definite YEC?

phantom
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12/3/2012 12:14:04 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Young earth creationism.

My Dad accepts the evidence that the universe is old but rejects evolution. So would he be a YEC or not?
"Music is a zen-like ecstatic state where you become the new man of the future, the Nietzschean merger of Apollo and Dionysus." Ray Manzarek (The Doors)
DakotaKrafick
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12/3/2012 12:23:32 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:14:04 AM, phantom wrote:
Young earth creationism.

My Dad accepts the evidence that the universe is old but rejects evolution. So would he be a YEC or not?

That depends...

1) Does he believe in creationism?
2) Does he believe the Earth is young?
Oryus
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12/3/2012 12:24:02 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Nooo.... isn't the whole thing about YEC based on a calculations of "begats" in the bible made by that one guy something-or-other, I forget his name? So it is the literal interpretation of that. And when he added up all the begats, it came to be whatever few thousand years YEC believe in. If he doesn't believe in that, then I don't think he is a YEC. Pretty sure..
: : :Tulle: The fool, I purposely don't engage with you because you don't have proper command of the English language.
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: : The Fool: It's my English writing. Either way It's okay have a larger vocabulary then you, and a better grasp of language, and you're a woman.
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Wallstreetatheist
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12/3/2012 12:24:21 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Does he think that God guided evolution or does he reject the concept outright?
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Wallstreetatheist
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12/3/2012 12:25:11 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
9 minutes passes and three of us post within a minute of each other lol
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Oryus
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12/3/2012 12:26:03 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:25:11 AM, Wallstreetatheist wrote:
9 minutes passes and three of us post within a minute of each other lol

Yeah, that was weird.
: : :Tulle: The fool, I purposely don't engage with you because you don't have proper command of the English language.
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: : The Fool: It's my English writing. Either way It's okay have a larger vocabulary then you, and a better grasp of language, and you're a woman.
:
: I'm just going to leave this precious struggle nugget right here.
phantom
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12/3/2012 12:28:28 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:23:32 AM, DakotaKrafick wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:14:04 AM, phantom wrote:
Young earth creationism.

My Dad accepts the evidence that the universe is old but rejects evolution. So would he be a YEC or not?

That depends...

1) Does he believe in creationism?

He believes we were designed and created via God.

2) Does he believe the Earth is young?

No.
"Music is a zen-like ecstatic state where you become the new man of the future, the Nietzschean merger of Apollo and Dionysus." Ray Manzarek (The Doors)
phantom
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12/3/2012 12:30:13 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:24:21 AM, Wallstreetatheist wrote:
Does he think that God guided evolution or does he reject the concept outright?

He rejects macroevolution but believes the earth was created in a long period of time. He takes the seven days as seven periods of time but is still a staunch conservative Christian.
"Music is a zen-like ecstatic state where you become the new man of the future, the Nietzschean merger of Apollo and Dionysus." Ray Manzarek (The Doors)
Oryus
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12/3/2012 12:30:42 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:24:02 AM, Oryus wrote:
Nooo.... isn't the whole thing about YEC based on a calculations of "begats" in the bible made by that one guy something-or-other, I forget his name? So it is the literal interpretation of that. And when he added up all the begats, it came to be whatever few thousand years YEC believe in. If he doesn't believe in that, then I don't think he is a YEC. Pretty sure..

Archbishop James Ussher. That was his name. I believe this was the guy that gets the credit for calculating the first day of the world being on October 23rd.

http://en.wikipedia.org...
: : :Tulle: The fool, I purposely don't engage with you because you don't have proper command of the English language.
: :
: : The Fool: It's my English writing. Either way It's okay have a larger vocabulary then you, and a better grasp of language, and you're a woman.
:
: I'm just going to leave this precious struggle nugget right here.
Oryus
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12/3/2012 12:31:20 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:30:13 AM, phantom wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:24:21 AM, Wallstreetatheist wrote:
Does he think that God guided evolution or does he reject the concept outright?

He rejects macroevolution but believes the earth was created in a long period of time. He takes the seven days as seven periods of time but is still a staunch conservative Christian.

Then he's not a Young Earth Creationist.
: : :Tulle: The fool, I purposely don't engage with you because you don't have proper command of the English language.
: :
: : The Fool: It's my English writing. Either way It's okay have a larger vocabulary then you, and a better grasp of language, and you're a woman.
:
: I'm just going to leave this precious struggle nugget right here.
DakotaKrafick
Posts: 1,517
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12/3/2012 12:32:38 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:28:28 AM, phantom wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:23:32 AM, DakotaKrafick wrote:

2) Does he believe the Earth is young?

No.

Then no. YEC stands for "Young Earth Creationist".
phantom
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12/3/2012 12:34:05 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Yeah, I suppose that was obvious. It guess it just seemed like he would identify as one since he's quite conservative. I should ask him about it.
"Music is a zen-like ecstatic state where you become the new man of the future, the Nietzschean merger of Apollo and Dionysus." Ray Manzarek (The Doors)
Oryus
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12/3/2012 12:36:08 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
To say what I was attempting to say more concisely, the whole thing about YEC is that it is based on a literal interpretation of the bible. The Ussher Chronology (which is the literal interpretation to end all literal interpretations) is where the "youngness" comes from. So if he doesn't believe the bible is a literal account of history, then he is not a Young Earth Creationist. Though he may still be a creationist. So you can see how his not buying evolution doesn't really have much bearing on it.
: : :Tulle: The fool, I purposely don't engage with you because you don't have proper command of the English language.
: :
: : The Fool: It's my English writing. Either way It's okay have a larger vocabulary then you, and a better grasp of language, and you're a woman.
:
: I'm just going to leave this precious struggle nugget right here.
philochristos
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12/3/2012 12:38:49 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:14:04 AM, phantom wrote:
Young earth creationism.

My Dad accepts the evidence that the universe is old but rejects evolution. So would he be a YEC or not?

No, he's probably an OEC.
"Not to know of what things one should demand demonstration, and of what one should not, argues want of education." ~Aristotle

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." ~Aristotle
phantom
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12/3/2012 12:45:14 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:36:08 AM, Oryus wrote:
To say what I was attempting to say more concisely, the whole thing about YEC is that it is based on a literal interpretation of the bible. The Ussher Chronology (which is the literal interpretation to end all literal interpretations) is where the "youngness" comes from. So if he doesn't believe the bible is a literal account of history, then he is not a Young Earth Creationist. Though he may still be a creationist. So you can see how his not buying evolution doesn't really have much bearing on it.

Not really. He does believe in a literal interpretation of the Bible. He just believes a literal interpretation translates to seven long periods of time rather than days.
"Music is a zen-like ecstatic state where you become the new man of the future, the Nietzschean merger of Apollo and Dionysus." Ray Manzarek (The Doors)
Oryus
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12/3/2012 12:50:50 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:45:14 AM, phantom wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:36:08 AM, Oryus wrote:
To say what I was attempting to say more concisely, the whole thing about YEC is that it is based on a literal interpretation of the bible. The Ussher Chronology (which is the literal interpretation to end all literal interpretations) is where the "youngness" comes from. So if he doesn't believe the bible is a literal account of history, then he is not a Young Earth Creationist. Though he may still be a creationist. So you can see how his not buying evolution doesn't really have much bearing on it.

Not really. He does believe in a literal interpretation of the Bible. He just believes a literal interpretation translates to seven long periods of time rather than days.

I'm confused. That doesn't sound like a 100% literal translation then. It sounds like he just thinks "days" are metaphorical for some time period other than a day which then wouldn't be a literal translation.

But like I said, the Ussher chronology/YEC position is based on the math behind all the "begats" and not just the seven days aspect. It's all about the begats, baby.

But hey, since when do we expect Christians to be consistent?
Zing!
: : :Tulle: The fool, I purposely don't engage with you because you don't have proper command of the English language.
: :
: : The Fool: It's my English writing. Either way It's okay have a larger vocabulary then you, and a better grasp of language, and you're a woman.
:
: I'm just going to leave this precious struggle nugget right here.
phantom
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12/3/2012 12:53:33 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:50:50 AM, Oryus wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:45:14 AM, phantom wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:36:08 AM, Oryus wrote:
To say what I was attempting to say more concisely, the whole thing about YEC is that it is based on a literal interpretation of the bible. The Ussher Chronology (which is the literal interpretation to end all literal interpretations) is where the "youngness" comes from. So if he doesn't believe the bible is a literal account of history, then he is not a Young Earth Creationist. Though he may still be a creationist. So you can see how his not buying evolution doesn't really have much bearing on it.

Not really. He does believe in a literal interpretation of the Bible. He just believes a literal interpretation translates to seven long periods of time rather than days.

I'm confused. That doesn't sound like a 100% literal translation then. It sounds like he just thinks "days" are metaphorical for some time period other than a day which then wouldn't be a literal translation.

No, he believes the translation is wrong, so days shouldn't even be used.

But like I said, the Ussher chronology/YEC position is based on the math behind all the "begats" and not just the seven days aspect. It's all about the begats, baby.

But hey, since when do we expect Christians to be consistent?
Zing!

lol
"Music is a zen-like ecstatic state where you become the new man of the future, the Nietzschean merger of Apollo and Dionysus." Ray Manzarek (The Doors)
Oryus
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12/3/2012 12:54:27 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:53:33 AM, phantom wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:50:50 AM, Oryus wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:45:14 AM, phantom wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:36:08 AM, Oryus wrote:
To say what I was attempting to say more concisely, the whole thing about YEC is that it is based on a literal interpretation of the bible. The Ussher Chronology (which is the literal interpretation to end all literal interpretations) is where the "youngness" comes from. So if he doesn't believe the bible is a literal account of history, then he is not a Young Earth Creationist. Though he may still be a creationist. So you can see how his not buying evolution doesn't really have much bearing on it.

Not really. He does believe in a literal interpretation of the Bible. He just believes a literal interpretation translates to seven long periods of time rather than days.

I'm confused. That doesn't sound like a 100% literal translation then. It sounds like he just thinks "days" are metaphorical for some time period other than a day which then wouldn't be a literal translation.

No, he believes the translation is wrong, so days shouldn't even be used.

Ohhh, gotcha.

But like I said, the Ussher chronology/YEC position is based on the math behind all the "begats" and not just the seven days aspect. It's all about the begats, baby.

But hey, since when do we expect Christians to be consistent?
Zing!

lol
: : :Tulle: The fool, I purposely don't engage with you because you don't have proper command of the English language.
: :
: : The Fool: It's my English writing. Either way It's okay have a larger vocabulary then you, and a better grasp of language, and you're a woman.
:
: I'm just going to leave this precious struggle nugget right here.
stubs
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12/3/2012 9:30:30 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:38:49 AM, philochristos wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:14:04 AM, phantom wrote:
Young earth creationism.

My Dad accepts the evidence that the universe is old but rejects evolution. So would he be a YEC or not?

No, he's probably an OEC.

This.
DanielChristopherBlowes
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12/3/2012 11:34:10 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:14:04 AM, phantom wrote:
Young earth creationism.

My Dad accepts the evidence that the universe is old but rejects evolution. So would he be a YEC or not?

Adam didn't look 5 minutes old when he was 5 minutes old, so neither should the universe:

Philip K. Dick or Ridley Scott didn't invent the 'used future', God did..
Everyone on the side of Truth listens to Me. (Jesus Christ)
phantom
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12/3/2012 2:50:37 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I only just realized I said definite instead of define.
"Music is a zen-like ecstatic state where you become the new man of the future, the Nietzschean merger of Apollo and Dionysus." Ray Manzarek (The Doors)
Nidhogg
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12/3/2012 2:56:13 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
YEC is stupid. A all-knowing eternal being has no concept of time, especially before He created it. Honestly, the earth being old is no argument against God.
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medic0506
Posts: 13,450
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12/3/2012 3:39:18 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:45:14 AM, phantom wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:36:08 AM, Oryus wrote:
To say what I was attempting to say more concisely, the whole thing about YEC is that it is based on a literal interpretation of the bible. The Ussher Chronology (which is the literal interpretation to end all literal interpretations) is where the "youngness" comes from. So if he doesn't believe the bible is a literal account of history, then he is not a Young Earth Creationist. Though he may still be a creationist. So you can see how his not buying evolution doesn't really have much bearing on it.

Not really. He does believe in a literal interpretation of the Bible. He just believes a literal interpretation translates to seven long periods of time rather than days.

You should ask him how the trees and grass that were made on the third day survived for long periods of time before the sun and moon were created on the fourth day.
Enji
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12/3/2012 4:04:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 3:39:18 PM, medic0506 wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:45:14 AM, phantom wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:36:08 AM, Oryus wrote:
To say what I was attempting to say more concisely, the whole thing about YEC is that it is based on a literal interpretation of the bible. The Ussher Chronology (which is the literal interpretation to end all literal interpretations) is where the "youngness" comes from. So if he doesn't believe the bible is a literal account of history, then he is not a Young Earth Creationist. Though he may still be a creationist. So you can see how his not buying evolution doesn't really have much bearing on it.

Not really. He does believe in a literal interpretation of the Bible. He just believes a literal interpretation translates to seven long periods of time rather than days.

You should ask him how the trees and grass that were made on the third day survived for long periods of time before the sun and moon were created on the fourth day.

I thought light was created on the first day?
AlwaysMoreThanYou
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12/3/2012 4:08:50 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 4:04:49 PM, Enji wrote:
At 12/3/2012 3:39:18 PM, medic0506 wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:45:14 AM, phantom wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:36:08 AM, Oryus wrote:
To say what I was attempting to say more concisely, the whole thing about YEC is that it is based on a literal interpretation of the bible. The Ussher Chronology (which is the literal interpretation to end all literal interpretations) is where the "youngness" comes from. So if he doesn't believe the bible is a literal account of history, then he is not a Young Earth Creationist. Though he may still be a creationist. So you can see how his not buying evolution doesn't really have much bearing on it.

Not really. He does believe in a literal interpretation of the Bible. He just believes a literal interpretation translates to seven long periods of time rather than days.

You should ask him how the trees and grass that were made on the third day survived for long periods of time before the sun and moon were created on the fourth day.

I thought light was created on the first day?

But somehow the sun and moon were created on the fourth.
'When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.' - John 16:13
AlwaysMoreThanYou
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12/3/2012 4:10:44 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 4:08:50 PM, AlwaysMoreThanYou wrote:
At 12/3/2012 4:04:49 PM, Enji wrote:
At 12/3/2012 3:39:18 PM, medic0506 wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:45:14 AM, phantom wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:36:08 AM, Oryus wrote:
To say what I was attempting to say more concisely, the whole thing about YEC is that it is based on a literal interpretation of the bible. The Ussher Chronology (which is the literal interpretation to end all literal interpretations) is where the "youngness" comes from. So if he doesn't believe the bible is a literal account of history, then he is not a Young Earth Creationist. Though he may still be a creationist. So you can see how his not buying evolution doesn't really have much bearing on it.

Not really. He does believe in a literal interpretation of the Bible. He just believes a literal interpretation translates to seven long periods of time rather than days.

You should ask him how the trees and grass that were made on the third day survived for long periods of time before the sun and moon were created on the fourth day.

I thought light was created on the first day?

But somehow the sun and moon were created on the fourth.

Also, you have evening and morning before the sun.
'When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.' - John 16:13
emospongebob527
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12/3/2012 4:23:44 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 12:14:04 AM, phantom wrote:
Young earth creationism.

My Dad accepts the evidence that the universe is old but rejects evolution. So would he be a YEC or not?

He'd be an Old Earth Creationist.
"not to toot my own horn (it aint need no tooin if u know what im saying), but my writings on "viciousness: the one true viture (fancy spelling for virtue)" and my poem "A poem I wrote about DDO" put me in a class of my damn own. im just an UNRECONGIZED geniuse" -bananafana
medic0506
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12/3/2012 11:40:16 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 4:04:49 PM, Enji wrote:
At 12/3/2012 3:39:18 PM, medic0506 wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:45:14 AM, phantom wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:36:08 AM, Oryus wrote:
To say what I was attempting to say more concisely, the whole thing about YEC is that it is based on a literal interpretation of the bible. The Ussher Chronology (which is the literal interpretation to end all literal interpretations) is where the "youngness" comes from. So if he doesn't believe the bible is a literal account of history, then he is not a Young Earth Creationist. Though he may still be a creationist. So you can see how his not buying evolution doesn't really have much bearing on it.

Not really. He does believe in a literal interpretation of the Bible. He just believes a literal interpretation translates to seven long periods of time rather than days.

You should ask him how the trees and grass that were made on the third day survived for long periods of time before the sun and moon were created on the fourth day.

I thought light was created on the first day?

That could mean stellar light, or light that came from whatever mechanism was used to bring the universe into existence, but it sounds like the sun and moon weren't created until the fourth day.
Enji
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12/4/2012 1:27:25 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 12/3/2012 11:40:16 PM, medic0506 wrote:
At 12/3/2012 4:04:49 PM, Enji wrote:
At 12/3/2012 3:39:18 PM, medic0506 wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:45:14 AM, phantom wrote:
At 12/3/2012 12:36:08 AM, Oryus wrote:
To say what I was attempting to say more concisely, the whole thing about YEC is that it is based on a literal interpretation of the bible. The Ussher Chronology (which is the literal interpretation to end all literal interpretations) is where the "youngness" comes from. So if he doesn't believe the bible is a literal account of history, then he is not a Young Earth Creationist. Though he may still be a creationist. So you can see how his not buying evolution doesn't really have much bearing on it.

Not really. He does believe in a literal interpretation of the Bible. He just believes a literal interpretation translates to seven long periods of time rather than days.

You should ask him how the trees and grass that were made on the third day survived for long periods of time before the sun and moon were created on the fourth day.

I thought light was created on the first day?

That could mean stellar light, or light that came from whatever mechanism was used to bring the universe into existence, but it sounds like the sun and moon weren't created until the fourth day.

God created light on the first day in the third line of Genesis after creating the heavens and the earth in the first line of Genesis according to the Bible; light was brought into existence separately from the universe. Following the biblical usage of the Hebrew word for light used in Genesis, "Owr: (Strong's number 216) when used literally means light as in daylight or sunlight or dawn. The usage of light meaning daylight is further reinforced by God separating light and dark in line 4 and creating evening and morning in one day in line 5. This is all before God creates the sun and the moon in line 16.