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God's Morality

qopel
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3/3/2013 10:23:36 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Here's the perfect example of Theist mental gymnastics I have ever seen:
"God"s relationship to humans is not as much like a parent to a child, although it is a little analogous, but more like human to any sort of invention they create or an artist to a painting. In other words, creator to creation. So just as we could do as we like with a painting, God could do as he likes with us and it would not be evil."

A painting is not self-aware and doesn't experience pain. I can rip it up without it being immoral whether I made it or not.
If I could create something self-aware that felt pain, I'd be justified to torture and kill it, because I created it?!?? That's not evil? This is pure proof how religion poisons the mind.

Here's the twisted logic: No matter how evil God is, he's not evil because he can do anything he wants and it would not be evil.

This is why I'm an anti-theist. This is why religion needs to stay out of schools and government. This is why I have no respect for Theist who want to think like this. This is why I am an Atheist.

It's shocking, disgusting, immoral, insane, twisted and illogical....and anybody who wants to subscribe to this twisted logic needs some serious help.
phantom
Posts: 6,774
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3/3/2013 10:34:59 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
This is why I am an Atheist.

This is why your atheist?
"Music is a zen-like ecstatic state where you become the new man of the future, the Nietzschean merger of Apollo and Dionysus." Ray Manzarek (The Doors)
qopel
Posts: 150
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3/3/2013 10:41:30 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I'm Atheist because I would never subscribe to such illogical immoral nonsense.
I use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence.
Skynet
Posts: 674
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3/3/2013 10:44:11 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
What moral standard you are applying?
One perk to being a dad is you get to watch cartoons again without explaining yourself.
phantom
Posts: 6,774
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3/3/2013 10:47:51 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 10:41:30 PM, qopel wrote:
I'm Atheist because I would never subscribe to such illogical immoral nonsense.
I use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence.

Yeah...bu whadabout deism or one of many religions or Christian perspectives who don't believe in this?
"Music is a zen-like ecstatic state where you become the new man of the future, the Nietzschean merger of Apollo and Dionysus." Ray Manzarek (The Doors)
qopel
Posts: 150
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3/3/2013 10:51:44 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 10:44:11 PM, Skynet wrote:
What moral standard you are applying?

The standard is that if you yourself don't want something to happen to you, you should not do that to make it happen to somebody else. My right to swing my fist ends at your nose. Morality is about living together in peace.
popculturepooka
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3/3/2013 10:52:45 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 10:23:36 PM, qopel wrote:
Here's the perfect example of Theist mental gymnastics I have ever seen:
"God"s relationship to humans is not as much like a parent to a child, although it is a little analogous, but more like human to any sort of invention they create or an artist to a painting. In other words, creator to creation. So just as we could do as we like with a painting, God could do as he likes with us and it would not be evil."


Yeah, I don't agree with that.
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qopel
Posts: 150
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3/3/2013 10:52:48 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 10:47:51 PM, phantom wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:41:30 PM, qopel wrote:
I'm Atheist because I would never subscribe to such illogical immoral nonsense.
I use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence.

Yeah...bu whadabout deism or one of many religions or Christian perspectives who don't believe in this?

I still use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence...and there is no evidence for a God.
Skynet
Posts: 674
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3/3/2013 10:59:38 PM
Posted: 3 years ago

It's shocking, disgusting, immoral, insane, twisted and illogical....and anybody who wants to subscribe to this twisted logic needs some serious help.

Religion is immoral? What's defining morality here and what gives it the authority?
One perk to being a dad is you get to watch cartoons again without explaining yourself.
Chicken
Posts: 1,296
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3/3/2013 11:00:53 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 10:23:36 PM, qopel wrote:
Here's the perfect example of Theist mental gymnastics I have ever seen:
"God"s relationship to humans is not as much like a parent to a child, although it is a little analogous, but more like human to any sort of invention they create or an artist to a painting. In other words, creator to creation. So just as we could do as we like with a painting, God could do as he likes with us and it would not be evil."

A painting is not self-aware and doesn't experience pain. I can rip it up without it being immoral whether I made it or not.
If I could create something self-aware that felt pain, I'd be justified to torture and kill it, because I created it?!?? That's not evil? This is pure proof how religion poisons the mind.

Here's the twisted logic: No matter how evil God is, he's not evil because he can do anything he wants and it would not be evil.

This is why I'm an anti-theist. This is why religion needs to stay out of schools and government. This is why I have no respect for Theist who want to think like this. This is why I am an Atheist.

It's shocking, disgusting, immoral, insane, twisted and illogical....and anybody who wants to subscribe to this twisted logic needs some serious help.

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qopel
Posts: 150
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3/3/2013 11:03:40 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 10:59:38 PM, Skynet wrote:

It's shocking, disgusting, immoral, insane, twisted and illogical....and anybody who wants to subscribe to this twisted logic needs some serious help.

Religion is immoral? What's defining morality here and what gives it the authority?

The standard is that if you yourself don't want something to happen to you, you should not do that to make it happen to somebody else. My right to swing my fist ends at your nose. Morality is about living together in peace. We all give it the authority because we all have a standard of how we want to be treated.
Apeiron
Posts: 2,446
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3/3/2013 11:07:42 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 10:41:30 PM, qopel wrote:
I'm Atheist because I would never subscribe to such illogical immoral nonsense.
I use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence.

Ha! you do nothing of the sort. Mind comes from mind bud. And reason bestows reason. You owe your attempts of reasoning to the first reasoning mind. Debate me on morals or forever be known as the fool who cowered under the shadow Apeiron.
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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3/3/2013 11:08:01 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 10:23:36 PM, qopel wrote:
Here's the perfect example of Theist mental gymnastics I have ever seen:
"God"s relationship to humans is not as much like a parent to a child, although it is a little analogous, but more like human to any sort of invention they create or an artist to a painting. In other words, creator to creation. So just as we could do as we like with a painting, God could do as he likes with us and it would not be evil."

A painting is not self-aware and doesn't experience pain. I can rip it up without it being immoral whether I made it or not.
If I could create something self-aware that felt pain, I'd be justified to torture and kill it, because I created it?!?? That's not evil? This is pure proof how religion poisons the mind.

Here's the twisted logic: No matter how evil God is, he's not evil because he can do anything he wants and it would not be evil.

This is why I'm an anti-theist. This is why religion needs to stay out of schools and government. This is why I have no respect for Theist who want to think like this. This is why I am an Atheist.

It's shocking, disgusting, immoral, insane, twisted and illogical....and anybody who wants to subscribe to this twisted logic needs some serious help.

Are you claiming that a God who does what you think is immoral, is doing something objectively immoral? For example, lets say God orders the death of babies of a tribe (which he clearly does in the Bible). Are you claiming that this is objectively immoral, or subjectively immoral?
phantom
Posts: 6,774
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3/3/2013 11:09:56 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 10:52:48 PM, qopel wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:47:51 PM, phantom wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:41:30 PM, qopel wrote:
I'm Atheist because I would never subscribe to such illogical immoral nonsense.
I use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence.

Yeah...bu whadabout deism or one of many religions or Christian perspectives who don't believe in this?

I still use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence...and there is no evidence for a God.

Then don't act as if you don't believing in God solely because of the people in the OP.
"Music is a zen-like ecstatic state where you become the new man of the future, the Nietzschean merger of Apollo and Dionysus." Ray Manzarek (The Doors)
qopel
Posts: 150
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3/3/2013 11:26:23 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 11:09:56 PM, phantom wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:52:48 PM, qopel wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:47:51 PM, phantom wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:41:30 PM, qopel wrote:
I'm Atheist because I would never subscribe to such illogical immoral nonsense.
I use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence.

Yeah...bu whadabout deism or one of many religions or Christian perspectives who don't believe in this?

I still use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence...and there is no evidence for a God.

Then don't act as if you don't believing in God solely because of the people in the OP.

It's not the only reason
Rusty
Posts: 2,109
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3/3/2013 11:29:35 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 11:07:42 PM, Apeiron wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:41:30 PM, qopel wrote:
I'm Atheist because I would never subscribe to such illogical immoral nonsense.
I use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence.

Ha! you do nothing of the sort. Mind comes from mind bud. And reason bestows reason. You owe your attempts of reasoning to the first reasoning mind. Debate me on morals or forever be known as the fool who cowered under the shadow Apeiron.

@qopel

Just debate him. If you lose, you can always close your account and start a new one.
qopel
Posts: 150
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3/3/2013 11:33:58 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 11:29:35 PM, Rusty wrote:
At 3/3/2013 11:07:42 PM, Apeiron wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:41:30 PM, qopel wrote:
I'm Atheist because I would never subscribe to such illogical immoral nonsense.
I use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence.

Ha! you do nothing of the sort. Mind comes from mind bud. And reason bestows reason. You owe your attempts of reasoning to the first reasoning mind. Debate me on morals or forever be known as the fool who cowered under the shadow Apeiron.

@qopel

Just debate him. If you lose, you can always close your account and start a new one.

I don't fight bullies just because they call me chicken.
Skynet
Posts: 674
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3/3/2013 11:39:38 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 11:03:40 PM, qopel wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:59:38 PM, Skynet wrote:

It's shocking, disgusting, immoral, insane, twisted and illogical....and anybody who wants to subscribe to this twisted logic needs some serious help.

Religion is immoral? What's defining morality here and what gives it the authority?

The standard is that if you yourself don't want something to happen to you, you should not do that to make it happen to somebody else. My right to swing my fist ends at your nose. Morality is about living together in peace. We all give it the authority because we all have a standard of how we want to be treated.

The Golden Rule. That only works as long as we care about what happens to other people. Some don't, unfortunately.

So your objection to God/belief in God is based on principal. But reality is the way it is regardless of any of our principals. What evidence can you present against the Bible to show it is a fabrication? That's some of the best evidence for God, and if God doesn't exist, it's a fraud, and should be debunkable.
One perk to being a dad is you get to watch cartoons again without explaining yourself.
qopel
Posts: 150
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3/3/2013 11:44:37 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 11:39:38 PM, Skynet wrote:
At 3/3/2013 11:03:40 PM, qopel wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:59:38 PM, Skynet wrote:

It's shocking, disgusting, immoral, insane, twisted and illogical....and anybody who wants to subscribe to this twisted logic needs some serious help.

Religion is immoral? What's defining morality here and what gives it the authority?

The standard is that if you yourself don't want something to happen to you, you should not do that to make it happen to somebody else. My right to swing my fist ends at your nose. Morality is about living together in peace. We all give it the authority because we all have a standard of how we want to be treated.

The Golden Rule. That only works as long as we care about what happens to other people. Some don't, unfortunately.

So your objection to God/belief in God is based on principal. But reality is the way it is regardless of any of our principals. What evidence can you present against the Bible to show it is a fabrication? That's some of the best evidence for God, and if God doesn't exist, it's a fraud, and should be debunkable.

Evolution proves Adam and Eve false.
Skynet
Posts: 674
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3/3/2013 11:49:08 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 11:44:37 PM, qopel wrote:
At 3/3/2013 11:39:38 PM, Skynet wrote:
At 3/3/2013 11:03:40 PM, qopel wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:59:38 PM, Skynet wrote:

It's shocking, disgusting, immoral, insane, twisted and illogical....and anybody who wants to subscribe to this twisted logic needs some serious help.

Religion is immoral? What's defining morality here and what gives it the authority?

The standard is that if you yourself don't want something to happen to you, you should not do that to make it happen to somebody else. My right to swing my fist ends at your nose. Morality is about living together in peace. We all give it the authority because we all have a standard of how we want to be treated.

The Golden Rule. That only works as long as we care about what happens to other people. Some don't, unfortunately.

So your objection to God/belief in God is based on principal. But reality is the way it is regardless of any of our principals. What evidence can you present against the Bible to show it is a fabrication? That's some of the best evidence for God, and if God doesn't exist, it's a fraud, and should be debunkable.

Evolution proves Adam and Eve false.

I think that argument needs a little elaboration. I am more familiar with evolutionary theory than most, so unless you want to get into senior-level molecular biology, I can probably follow your arguments.
One perk to being a dad is you get to watch cartoons again without explaining yourself.
medic0506
Posts: 13,450
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3/4/2013 10:48:02 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 11:44:37 PM, qopel wrote:
At 3/3/2013 11:39:38 PM, Skynet wrote:
At 3/3/2013 11:03:40 PM, qopel wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:59:38 PM, Skynet wrote:

It's shocking, disgusting, immoral, insane, twisted and illogical....and anybody who wants to subscribe to this twisted logic needs some serious help.

Religion is immoral? What's defining morality here and what gives it the authority?

The standard is that if you yourself don't want something to happen to you, you should not do that to make it happen to somebody else. My right to swing my fist ends at your nose. Morality is about living together in peace. We all give it the authority because we all have a standard of how we want to be treated.

The Golden Rule. That only works as long as we care about what happens to other people. Some don't, unfortunately.

So your objection to God/belief in God is based on principal. But reality is the way it is regardless of any of our principals. What evidence can you present against the Bible to show it is a fabrication? That's some of the best evidence for God, and if God doesn't exist, it's a fraud, and should be debunkable.

Evolution proves Adam and Eve false.

Oh boy, here we go...lol...when evolution can prove evolution then let me know and we'll talk about Adam and Eve.
Apeiron
Posts: 2,446
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3/4/2013 1:28:16 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 11:33:58 PM, qopel wrote:
At 3/3/2013 11:29:35 PM, Rusty wrote:
At 3/3/2013 11:07:42 PM, Apeiron wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:41:30 PM, qopel wrote:
I'm Atheist because I would never subscribe to such illogical immoral nonsense.
I use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence.

Ha! you do nothing of the sort. Mind comes from mind bud. And reason bestows reason. You owe your attempts of reasoning to the first reasoning mind. Debate me on morals or forever be known as the fool who cowered under the shadow Apeiron.

@qopel

Just debate him. If you lose, you can always close your account and start a new one.

I don't fight bullies just because they call me chicken.

Good call, because I would bully the living daylights out of your views in the arena.
SovereignDream
Posts: 1,119
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3/4/2013 2:25:10 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 10:41:30 PM, qopel wrote:
I'm Atheist because I would never subscribe to such illogical immoral nonsense.
I use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence.

My God. This is just so unbearably cringe-worthy. You internet/village atheists are just so fond of saying this. It's just so silly and hypocritical considering the fact that if you were to ask someone the likes of you what logic is, you'd be left floundering in the dust with responses like "it's like, making sense, dude" or "it's like what religions don't have haha lol you religious tard haha PRAISE DAWKINS!". So do us all a favor and quit this little "I like logic" bullshite, please.
medic0506
Posts: 13,450
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3/5/2013 10:16:20 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/4/2013 2:25:10 PM, SovereignDream wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:41:30 PM, qopel wrote:
I'm Atheist because I would never subscribe to such illogical immoral nonsense.
I use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence.

My God. This is just so unbearably cringe-worthy. You internet/village atheists are just so fond of saying this. It's just so silly and hypocritical considering the fact that if you were to ask someone the likes of you what logic is, you'd be left floundering in the dust with responses like "it's like, making sense, dude" or "it's like what religions don't have haha lol you religious tard haha PRAISE DAWKINS!". So do us all a favor and quit this little "I like logic" bullshite, please.

Some posts don't require a response, simply a bow of respect.

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GreatestIam
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3/5/2013 11:48:19 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 11:07:42 PM, Apeiron wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:41:30 PM, qopel wrote:
I'm Atheist because I would never subscribe to such illogical immoral nonsense.
I use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence.

Ha! you do nothing of the sort. Mind comes from mind bud. And reason bestows reason. You owe your attempts of reasoning to the first reasoning mind. Debate me on morals or forever be known as the fool who cowered under the shadow Apeiron.

Can I have a sample of your view on morals?

For instance. Do you see a double standard from Christians who would condemn men for doing something while giving God full moral points for doing the same?

This clip will show what I mean and a quick God did evil or not will show me you deducing skills and mind set.

Job clip.

While on moral issues, care to declare if you agree with the verdict in this Jewish clip?

Regards
DL
1Devilsadvocate
Posts: 1,518
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3/5/2013 6:03:03 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/5/2013 11:48:19 AM, GreatestIam wrote:
At 3/3/2013 11:07:42 PM, Apeiron wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:41:30 PM, qopel wrote:

While on moral issues, care to declare if you agree with the verdict in this Jewish clip?




That's not a Jewish clip, it's Christian missionary propaganda.
It's trying to convince Jews that God left the Jewish people , & now favors the Christians. "...He's made a new covenant with someone else."
Rather disturbing.

http://www.thejc.com... /wiesel yes we really did put god trial.
http://rabbidanielbouskila.blogspot.com...

There is a 18th cent. legend about a Rabbi who put God on trial.
At the end they pronounced God guilty. & then said Kaddish (A Jewish prayer which praises the greatness of God). The explanation given, is that, as far as we can see with our limited understanding, god has done wrong. But we realize that our understanding is limited."

"The things hidden are to Jehovah our God, and the things revealed are to us and to our sons..." - Deutoronomy 29:29
I cannot write in English, because of the treacherous spelling. When I am reading, I only hear it and am unable to remember what the written word looks like."
"Albert Einstein

http://www.twainquotes.com... , http://thewritecorner.wordpress.com... , http://www.onlinecollegecourses.com...
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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3/5/2013 6:21:51 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 10:23:36 PM, qopel wrote:
Here's the perfect example of Theist mental gymnastics I have ever seen:
"God"s relationship to humans is not as much like a parent to a child, although it is a little analogous, but more like human to any sort of invention they create or an artist to a painting. In other words, creator to creation. So just as we could do as we like with a painting, God could do as he likes with us and it would not be evil."

A painting is not self-aware and doesn't experience pain. I can rip it up without it being immoral whether I made it or not.
If I could create something self-aware that felt pain, I'd be justified to torture and kill it, because I created it?!?? That's not evil? This is pure proof how religion poisons the mind.

Here's the twisted logic: No matter how evil God is, he's not evil because he can do anything he wants and it would not be evil.

This is why I'm an anti-theist. This is why religion needs to stay out of schools and government. This is why I have no respect for Theist who want to think like this. This is why I am an Atheist.

It's shocking, disgusting, immoral, insane, twisted and illogical....and anybody who wants to subscribe to this twisted logic needs some serious help.

I think the main point here is how people rationalize their religious beliefs. All you can do is point out the price they have to pay to think like that.
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
Paradox_7
Posts: 1,870
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3/5/2013 6:37:08 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/3/2013 11:03:40 PM, qopel wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:59:38 PM, Skynet wrote:

It's shocking, disgusting, immoral, insane, twisted and illogical....and anybody who wants to subscribe to this twisted logic needs some serious help.

Religion is immoral? What's defining morality here and what gives it the authority?

The standard is that if you yourself don't want something to happen to you, you should not do that to make it happen to somebody else. My right to swing my fist ends at your nose. Morality is about living together in peace. We all give it the authority because we all have a standard of how we want to be treated.


So we shouldn't punish criminals, because we don't want to be punished?
: At 10/23/2012 8:06:03 PM, tvellalott wrote:
: Don't be. The Catholic Church is ran by Darth Sidius for fvck sake. As far as I'm concerned, you're a bona fide member of the Sith.
THEVIRUS
Posts: 1,321
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3/5/2013 6:40:51 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/4/2013 1:28:16 PM, Apeiron wrote:
At 3/3/2013 11:33:58 PM, qopel wrote:
At 3/3/2013 11:29:35 PM, Rusty wrote:
At 3/3/2013 11:07:42 PM, Apeiron wrote:
At 3/3/2013 10:41:30 PM, qopel wrote:
I'm Atheist because I would never subscribe to such illogical immoral nonsense.
I use reason, critical thinking and logic based on evidence.

Ha! you do nothing of the sort. Mind comes from mind bud. And reason bestows reason. You owe your attempts of reasoning to the first reasoning mind. Debate me on morals or forever be known as the fool who cowered under the shadow Apeiron.

@qopel

Just debate him. If you lose, you can always close your account and start a new one.

I don't fight bullies just because they call me chicken.

Good call, because I would bully the living daylights out of your views in the arena.

@qopel

If you are going to win, why does it matter?

*waits for excuse*
"So you want me to go to the judge with 'unit, corps, God, country'?" - A Few Good Men

"And the hits just keep on comin'." -A Few Good Men
qopel
Posts: 150
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3/5/2013 6:41:37 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
So we shouldn't punish criminals, because we don't want to be punished?

A criminal already treated somebody the way they didn't want to be punished; that's why they are a criminal.

So yeah, they deserve to be punished.