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Lord, lend me a hand...or foot or leg

Maikuru
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3/27/2013 1:26:14 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I made a thread on this topic last year but I don't think it inspired many answers.

My question is: For those who believe in spiritual, mystical, or supernatural healing, what of amputees?
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annanicole
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3/27/2013 1:55:01 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/27/2013 1:26:14 PM, Maikuru wrote:
I made a thread on this topic last year but I don't think it inspired many answers.

My question is: For those who believe in spiritual, mystical, or supernatural healing, what of amputees?

Amputees were healed before the age of miracles ended, before the written word was confirmed.

"When they which were about him saw what would follow, they said unto him, Lord, shall we smite with the sword? And one of them smote the servant of the high priest, and cut off his right ear. And Jesus answered and said, Suffer ye thus far. And he touched his ear, and healed him." (Luke 22: 49-51)

It is futile (and absurd) to expect such to happen today in light of I Cor 13: 8-13, particularly verse 10: "But when that which is perfect (or complete) has come, that which was in part shall be done away." Of course, there are Holy Rollers and others who think the Bible was never confirmed, that divine revelation was never complete -and consequently miracles knocked right along like the Energizer bunny. They can't produce the goods, however.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
philochristos
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3/27/2013 2:09:18 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/27/2013 1:26:14 PM, Maikuru wrote:
I made a thread on this topic last year but I don't think it inspired many answers.

My question is: For those who believe in spiritual, mystical, or supernatural healing, what of amputees?

I think it's possible, but I've never seen one.
"Not to know of what things one should demand demonstration, and of what one should not, argues want of education." ~Aristotle

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." ~Aristotle
annanicole
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3/27/2013 2:29:00 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/27/2013 2:09:18 PM, philochristos wrote:
At 3/27/2013 1:26:14 PM, Maikuru wrote:
I made a thread on this topic last year but I don't think it inspired many answers.

My question is: For those who believe in spiritual, mystical, or supernatural healing, what of amputees?

I think it's possible, but I've never seen one.

... nor has anyone else ... for over 1,900 years ... for good reason
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Maikuru
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3/27/2013 3:28:40 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Anna, you lost me a little bit. Are you saying miraculous healing no longer occurs?
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Maikuru
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3/27/2013 3:32:18 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/27/2013 2:09:18 PM, philochristos wrote:
At 3/27/2013 1:26:14 PM, Maikuru wrote:
I made a thread on this topic last year but I don't think it inspired many answers.

My question is: For those who believe in spiritual, mystical, or supernatural healing, what of amputees?

I think it's possible, but I've never seen one.

Do you believe other supernatural healing occurs?
"You assume I wouldn't want to burn this whole place to the ground."
- lamerde

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Maikuru
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3/27/2013 3:48:57 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/27/2013 3:43:15 PM, Pennington wrote:
Miracles do not occur but spiritual healings do. They may seem the same but are not.

Could you elaborate?
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mattrodstrom
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3/27/2013 3:50:51 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/27/2013 3:48:57 PM, Maikuru wrote:
At 3/27/2013 3:43:15 PM, Pennington wrote:
Miracles do not occur but spiritual healings do. They may seem the same but are not.

Could you elaborate?

God jiggles your soul, but won't jiggle your body.
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
Rational_Thinker9119
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3/27/2013 4:56:22 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/27/2013 1:26:14 PM, Maikuru wrote:
I made a thread on this topic last year but I don't think it inspired many answers.

My question is: For those who believe in spiritual, mystical, or supernatural healing, what of amputees?

Dude like, you don't know God's plan. You may THINK that the most benevolent being would heal them, but how could you know God's mind man? Maybe there is some, like, mysterious moral reasons why he allows this, I don't know....There, problem solved :)
matt.mcguire88
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3/27/2013 5:34:57 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/27/2013 3:32:18 PM, Maikuru wrote:
At 3/27/2013 2:09:18 PM, philochristos wrote:
At 3/27/2013 1:26:14 PM, Maikuru wrote:
I made a thread on this topic last year but I don't think it inspired many answers.

My question is: For those who believe in spiritual, mystical, or supernatural healing, what of amputees?

I think it's possible, but I've never seen one.

Do you believe other supernatural healing occurs?

Absolutely. There is far more than just physical problems, actually physical issues are of far less value than that of internal or spiritual needs. In other words, my spiritual condition as well as my internal composition may be of more value than a hand or even an important organ. There are all sorts of problems that occur in our everyday surroundings that God would like to repair...... Like our neighbors marriage that could be destroyed, the kid across the street who wants to start trying drugs, the best friend that wants to commit suicide, the family member that struggles with depression, the person at our job that needs some wisdom and an answer ect. the list could go on and on.
We are vessels and God wants to move through us, the question becomes...... are we available? Do we believe in the power of God to intervene in our circumstances? Do we trust God or is He just words on a page? From what I can tell, God would like to move in our lives and our circumstances, especially for other people but are WE available, are we in the right place for God to use us? Are we of "little faith", do we not believe in the power of God.....It wasn't the afflicted person who healed and cured himself, but Jesus who was willing to reach out and be used. Are WE willing to reach out and be used by God to make a difference and to impact our lives and the people around us? Well that is our responsibility, God gave us dominion over this world and His Word to abide in and I have seen God do amazing things just by being available and obedient.
How could we ever know what God wants or what we can do in God unless we are willing to be used and take the time to hear? I believe that miracles are much more than just healing some physical problem, but deep internal and personal needs and obstructions. These are the types of occurances that I have found that God uses us to intervene in when we are hearing and are willing to be used. Healings can be infinitely more than just physical and often times much more important.
Maikuru
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3/27/2013 6:38:26 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/27/2013 5:34:57 PM, matt.mcguire88 wrote:
At 3/27/2013 3:32:18 PM, Maikuru wrote:
At 3/27/2013 2:09:18 PM, philochristos wrote:
At 3/27/2013 1:26:14 PM, Maikuru wrote:
I made a thread on this topic last year but I don't think it inspired many answers.

My question is: For those who believe in spiritual, mystical, or supernatural healing, what of amputees?

I think it's possible, but I've never seen one.

Do you believe other supernatural healing occurs?

Absolutely. There is far more than just physical problems, actually physical issues are of far less value than that of internal or spiritual needs. In other words, my spiritual condition as well as my internal composition may be of more value than a hand or even an important organ. There are all sorts of problems that occur in our everyday surroundings that God would like to repair...... Like our neighbors marriage that could be destroyed, the kid across the street who wants to start trying drugs, the best friend that wants to commit suicide, the family member that struggles with depression, the person at our job that needs some wisdom and an answer ect. the list could go on and on.
We are vessels and God wants to move through us, the question becomes...... are we available? Do we believe in the power of God to intervene in our circumstances? Do we trust God or is He just words on a page? From what I can tell, God would like to move in our lives and our circumstances, especially for other people but are WE available, are we in the right place for God to use us? Are we of "little faith", do we not believe in the power of God.....It wasn't the afflicted person who healed and cured himself, but Jesus who was willing to reach out and be used. Are WE willing to reach out and be used by God to make a difference and to impact our lives and the people around us? Well that is our responsibility, God gave us dominion over this world and His Word to abide in and I have seen God do amazing things just by being available and obedient.
How could we ever know what God wants or what we can do in God unless we are willing to be used and take the time to hear? I believe that miracles are much more than just healing some physical problem, but deep internal and personal needs and obstructions. These are the types of occurances that I have found that God uses us to intervene in when we are hearing and are willing to be used. Healings can be infinitely more than just physical and often times much more important.

Thank you for your response. I see you saying that God can heal emotionally and spiritually. Does he also heal physically? If so, what of amputees?
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mattrodstrom
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3/27/2013 7:01:15 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/27/2013 5:34:57 PM, matt.mcguire88 wrote:
Healings can be infinitely more than just physical and often times much more important.

Psychological health is important.. Agreed.

But it would be nice if god would magic up the guy's arm too.
(not to mention that, unlike healing of the soul, it would provide some decent evidence for religious claims too... which would probably cause a great many people to reconsider their beliefs, and maybe give themselves to God too)
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
annanicole
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3/27/2013 7:09:20 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Maikuru : Do you believe other supernatural healing occurs?

Anna: No. Occurred ... yes. Occurs ... no.

Maikuru: Are you saying miraculous healing no longer occurs?

Anna: Absolutely. God heals today through the natural means which He has established.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
annanicole
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3/27/2013 7:12:43 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I see some denying miraculous physical healing, yet clinging to miraculous spiritual healing. Well ... there never was such a thing as "miraculous spiritual healing." God heals the spirit today through His established means: the revealed and confirmed word. Therein are found the cures for man's various spiritual ailments.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Pennington
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3/27/2013 9:29:23 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I know we all have things we regret but really would we change anything? If we did we would change who we are. Same so with people who have lost limbs. It mite seem bad but really you take who they are, will be, and can be if you give them their limbs back. It is a test and lesson that they must handle and they become who they are because of it. I bet some would rather be who they are.
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Maikuru
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3/27/2013 9:45:24 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/27/2013 9:29:23 PM, Pennington wrote:
I know we all have things we regret but really would we change anything? If we did we would change who we are. Same so with people who have lost limbs. It mite seem bad but really you take who they are, will be, and can be if you give them their limbs back. It is a test and lesson that they must handle and they become who they are because of it. I bet some would rather be who they are.

You're saying people who've lost a limb wouldn't want it back because it would change who they will become? That may be true for...I'll go so far as to say 5% of them. Generous, I know, but that's because I'm not sure what this has to do with the topic.
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My-Self
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3/27/2013 11:32:59 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I would probably be more religious if God healed amputees. It seems like a very trivial thing for an omnipotent God to do. We should have all the faith healers in the world gather and try to get an amputee's arm to grow back. Whichever religion gets it first and can do it again wins.
"Genesis could be compatible with anything. Theologians are great at mental gymnastics." ~ phantom
annanicole
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3/27/2013 11:48:40 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/27/2013 11:32:59 PM, My-Self wrote:
I would probably be more religious if God healed amputees. It seems like a very trivial thing for an omnipotent God to do. We should have all the faith healers in the world gather and try to get an amputee's arm to grow back. Whichever religion gets it first and can do it again wins.

I'd be less religious. The word has already been confirmed, but ... if it hadn't been after 2,000 years of trying, well, that wouldn't look so good. God has already healed an amputee. Even the Christian world (some of it) says, "All the previous miracles didn't do the trick. The word still isn't confirmed. We want more."

Nothing at all against your post, but you notice that ONE amputated limb replaced won't do it. "Whichever religion gets it first and can do it again wins." Trouble is: none of 'em are gonna do it. If they could, I'd think it was of the devil since I Cor 13: 8-13 depicts the end of the miraculous age, probably sometime around AD 70.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Maikuru
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3/28/2013 1:07:21 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/27/2013 11:32:59 PM, My-Self wrote:
I would probably be more religious if God healed amputees. It seems like a very trivial thing for an omnipotent God to do. We should have all the faith healers in the world gather and try to get an amputee's arm to grow back. Whichever religion gets it first and can do it again wins.

You and countless others, I'm sure.
"You assume I wouldn't want to burn this whole place to the ground."
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matt.mcguire88
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3/28/2013 4:23:18 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/27/2013 7:01:15 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 3/27/2013 5:34:57 PM, matt.mcguire88 wrote:
Healings can be infinitely more than just physical and often times much more important.

Psychological health is important.. Agreed.

But it would be nice if god would magic up the guy's arm too.
(not to mention that, unlike healing of the soul, it would provide some decent evidence for religious claims too... which would probably cause a great many people to reconsider their beliefs, and maybe give themselves to God too)

Well what are we asking for here? To see or hear of a physical healing, perhaps one caught on tape? The point is for God to use each of us in the way in which He purposes, for instance I use what God has given me and I work within those giftings as a means to bring God into my surroundings and potentially into the lives of another.
I have never known or prayed for an amputee specifically so I could only speculate but what I do know is that if WE do not believe in miracles, we aint gonna get none lol. If you see a believer claiming that God cannot do this or that then that is exactly what that person will have in their life, nothing, no sign of God anywhere except maybe a Bible next to their bed.
"WE" are the vessels in which a miracle would flow from, so the question becomes what do WE believe and what are we gonna believe of God's Word. Personally I do not think that any cured limb would cause any unbeliever to love or pusue God anymore than what they already do. Look at how fast they slaughtered Jesus and He was doing miracles everyday and that is something that I'm sure God would know more than any of us. I also think that our environment would not be ready for such public displays of supernatural power, nor do I think we would be ready for the repercussions of such, instead God moves secretly and intimately in the lives of those willing.
And like I said, to limit a miracle to simply growing a hand is quite a narrow view and should seriously be reconsidered. There are so many needs and situations that could use the hand of God in that would put limbs on the back burner, so as a vessel what are WE going to do? Are we going to commit to God and be used? If you guys want to see a miracle then allow God to use you, don't just sit by the sidelines and wait for someone else to provide something for you that you can have for yourself and in your own life. If you wait and push God off then you are destroying your own potential, maybe God will have YOU heal someone?
annanicole
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3/28/2013 8:41:30 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
"... what I do know is that if WE do not believe in miracles, we aint gonna get none lol."

The trouble with that is that if you DO believe in perpetual miraculous activity, you "ain't gonna get none", either. Also, faith was never a condition of the recipient of the miracle, especially in reference to healings.

*****

"If you see a believer claiming that God cannot do this or that then that is exactly what that person will have in their life, nothing, no sign of God anywhere except maybe a Bible next to their bed." (emphasis mine)

It's not a matter of "cannot" as in "inability". It's a matter of the fact that New Testament miracles were to confirm the word - either written or spoken - and if the word stands for all time confirmed, in the purpose of miracles was served, then God will not perform miracles. The belief in continuing miraculous activity is not a sign of faith at all: it's a symptom of the lack of it.

*****

"so the question becomes what do WE believe and what are we gonna believe of God's Word."

That's correct, and if we believe that God has given His word ... if God has confirmed His word ... if God's word now stands complete and authoritative, then "that which is complete or perfect" has come and "that which was in part" has been done away.

*****

"I do not think that any cured limb would cause any unbeliever to love or pusue God anymore than what they already do."

Correct. What did Abraham tell the rich man when the rich man asked for a miracle? "They have Moses and the prophets. Let them hear them." After a brief disputation, the conclusion was that if one would not believe before a miracle, he would not believe afterwards.

*****

"God moves secretly and intimately in the lives of those willing."

The Holy Spirit acts through the written or spoken word.

*****

"If you wait and push God off then you are destroying your own potential, maybe God will have YOU heal someone?"

If He does, He will then and there indicate that the purpose of miracles - the confirmation of the veracity of the New Testament - has not been fully served.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
matt.mcguire88
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3/28/2013 9:23:09 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/28/2013 8:41:30 AM, annanicole wrote:
"... what I do know is that if WE do not believe in miracles, we aint gonna get none lol."

The trouble with that is that if you DO believe in perpetual miraculous activity, you "ain't gonna get none", either. Also, faith was never a condition of the recipient of the miracle, especially in reference to healings.

*****

"If you see a believer claiming that God cannot do this or that then that is exactly what that person will have in their life, nothing, no sign of God anywhere except maybe a Bible next to their bed." (emphasis mine)

It's not a matter of "cannot" as in "inability". It's a matter of the fact that New Testament miracles were to confirm the word - either written or spoken - and if the word stands for all time confirmed, in the purpose of miracles was served, then God will not perform miracles. The belief in continuing miraculous activity is not a sign of faith at all: it's a symptom of the lack of it.

*****

"so the question becomes what do WE believe and what are we gonna believe of God's Word."

That's correct, and if we believe that God has given His word ... if God has confirmed His word ... if God's word now stands complete and authoritative, then "that which is complete or perfect" has come and "that which was in part" has been done away.

*****

"I do not think that any cured limb would cause any unbeliever to love or pusue God anymore than what they already do."

Correct. What did Abraham tell the rich man when the rich man asked for a miracle? "They have Moses and the prophets. Let them hear them." After a brief disputation, the conclusion was that if one would not believe before a miracle, he would not believe afterwards.

*****

"God moves secretly and intimately in the lives of those willing."

The Holy Spirit acts through the written or spoken word.

*****

"If you wait and push God off then you are destroying your own potential, maybe God will have YOU heal someone?"

If He does, He will then and there indicate that the purpose of miracles - the confirmation of the veracity of the New Testament - has not been fully served.

Anna, I already know what you believe lol now go about your Fathers business.
annanicole
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3/28/2013 10:13:48 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/28/2013 9:58:20 AM, dylancatlow wrote:
Prayer conveniently heals conditions that could have healed, anyway.

Blah
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Maikuru
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3/28/2013 10:37:24 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Alright, so is there anyone who believes that any sort of supernatural physical healing does currently occur? If so, to what extent and what is the cause?
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Pennington
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3/28/2013 11:04:23 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/27/2013 9:45:24 PM, Maikuru wrote:
At 3/27/2013 9:29:23 PM, Pennington wrote:
I know we all have things we regret but really would we change anything? If we did we would change who we are. Same so with people who have lost limbs. It mite seem bad but really you take who they are, will be, and can be if you give them their limbs back. It is a test and lesson that they must handle and they become who they are because of it. I bet some would rather be who they are.

You're saying people who've lost a limb wouldn't want it back because it would change who they will become?:
Ezactly. We all have simliar things to go through and it makes us who we are. Just because ours dont involve losing limbs make it less sincere or important? Or those who lose limbs is theirs somehow more concerning? I dont think so, I think those who lose limbs, get raped, get burned, or have any kind of wounding in both physical and pshycological areas are equally important and all make us who we are. Makes us stronger and weaker.
That may be true for...I'll go so far as to say 5% of them. Generous, I know, but that's because I'm not sure what this has to do with the topic.:
I doubt it is merely 5%. Though of it was then you have the 5% who's lifes you would change without their want too. I am also sure there is justified reasons beyond your or my understanding. You are basically begging that God allow all pain or hurt be healed because He could. Nonsense.
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Maikuru
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3/28/2013 11:11:21 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/28/2013 11:04:23 AM, Pennington wrote:
You are basically begging that God allow all pain or hurt be healed because He could. Nonsense.

Actually, no. My question was as follows: For those who believe in spiritual, mystical, or supernatural healing, what of amputees?

From what I've gathered from your responses, you do believe that spiritual physical healing can occur. Does it currently?
"You assume I wouldn't want to burn this whole place to the ground."
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annanicole
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3/28/2013 11:27:39 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
"Spiritual physical healing"? What in the world is that?

The type of healing that you are talking about in your post would constitute a miracle, no doubt. What you are wanting to find, I guess, is some heretical Christian who babbles nonsense about the perpetuation, the continuation, of miraculous signs and wonders - when the Bible plainly describes the purpose and duration of these miracles.

Why would you want to find someone who, although he may identify himself as a Christian, apparently cannot even correctly apply the numerous Biblical passages which describe the characteristics, purpose, and duration of miracles? What could you possibly learn from such a person - other than how to miss the point?
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."