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Is lack of belief constituted atheism.

philochristos
Posts: 2,614
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3/30/2013 2:13:56 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/30/2013 11:09:47 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
If I do not deny existent of god or gods but neither do I worship one, is that make me an Atheist?

Words are defined by their use, and the word, "atheism" is commonly used to refer to both "lack of belief in God" and "belief in the non-existence of God." These two meaning are sometimes distinguished by calling the first "weak atheism" and the second "strong atheism."

Whether you worship God or not doesn't have anything to do with it.
"Not to know of what things one should demand demonstration, and of what one should not, argues want of education." ~Aristotle

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." ~Aristotle
qopel
Posts: 150
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3/30/2013 2:36:02 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/30/2013 11:09:47 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
If I do not deny existent of god or gods but neither do I worship one, is that make me an Atheist?

If you don't deny that a God can exist, you are agnostic. If you don't believe that a God exists (and that's why you don't worship one), then you are also an Atheist. If you claim there is a God by not denying a God exists, then you are a Theist. All Atheists don't worship God(s). But not all Theists worship God(s). Some Theists just believe without worship.
twocupcakes
Posts: 2,750
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3/30/2013 4:55:27 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Odin is not going to care how you label yourself, it is just do you give him credit for killing the ice monsters or do you refuse to give him the credit he deserves.
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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3/30/2013 5:19:48 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I think that you if you don't believe God exists, but you also don't believe God doesn't exist either, then you are an agnostic. If you don't believe God exists, and also hold the belief that God doesn't exist, then you are an Atheist.
suttichart.denpruektham
Posts: 1,115
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3/31/2013 3:15:00 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Whether you worship God or not doesn't have anything to do with it.

Doesn't really understand that. Isn't belief in god = worship god? If so, how the lack of worship cannot constituted the lack of belief?
wiploc
Posts: 1,485
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3/31/2013 10:48:55 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/30/2013 11:09:47 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
If I do not deny existent of god or gods but neither do I worship one, is that make me an Atheist?

If you believe gods exist, then you are a theist. You don't have to worship one to be a theist.

If you don't believe gods exist, then you are an atheist. You don't have to deny that god exists. The Popes, for instance, never deny that their god exists, but I assume some of them have been atheists.

If you wish to distinguish those atheists who believe gods don't exist from those who don't have a belief either way, you can call the former "strong atheists" and the latter "weak atheists."
philochristos
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3/31/2013 12:03:12 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/31/2013 3:15:00 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
Whether you worship God or not doesn't have anything to do with it.

Doesn't really understand that. Isn't belief in god = worship god? If so, how the lack of worship cannot constituted the lack of belief?

No, I don't think "belief in" is the same thing as "worship." "Belief in," when used in the context of theism and atheism means the same thing as "belief that." If a person think that God exists, but doesn't worship God, that person is still a theist.
"Not to know of what things one should demand demonstration, and of what one should not, argues want of education." ~Aristotle

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." ~Aristotle
wiploc
Posts: 1,485
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3/31/2013 3:33:03 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/31/2013 3:15:00 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
Whether you worship God or not doesn't have anything to do with it.

Doesn't really understand that. Isn't belief in god = worship god? If so, how the lack of worship cannot constituted the lack of belief?

Do you believe in Satan without worshiping him?

Christians say that god is good, but if you listen to their stories about him, you have to see that he's a nasty piece of work. Dan Barker says that if Jehovah is real, he'd rather spend eternity in Hellfire than worship him. I'm not totally with Barker. If it would save me an eternity of pain, I'd worship Satan, or even Jehovah. But I see nothing admirable, worthy of worship, in Jehovah's character.
AlbinoBunny
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3/31/2013 5:56:01 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/31/2013 3:33:03 PM, wiploc wrote:
At 3/31/2013 3:15:00 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
Whether you worship God or not doesn't have anything to do with it.

Doesn't really understand that. Isn't belief in god = worship god? If so, how the lack of worship cannot constituted the lack of belief?

Do you believe in Satan without worshiping him?

Christians say that god is good, but if you listen to their stories about him, you have to see that he's a nasty piece of work. Dan Barker says that if Jehovah is real, he'd rather spend eternity in Hellfire than worship him. I'm not totally with Barker. If it would save me an eternity of pain, I'd worship Satan, or even Jehovah. But I see nothing admirable, worthy of worship, in Jehovah's character.

I don't know if I could worship such a being.
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AlbinoBunny
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3/31/2013 5:56:23 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/30/2013 4:55:27 PM, twocupcakes wrote:
Odin is not going to care how you label yourself, it is just do you give him credit for killing the ice monsters or do you refuse to give him the credit he deserves.
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suttichart.denpruektham
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4/2/2013 1:22:21 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/31/2013 12:03:12 PM, philochristos wrote:
At 3/31/2013 3:15:00 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
Whether you worship God or not doesn't have anything to do with it.

Doesn't really understand that. Isn't belief in god = worship god? If so, how the lack of worship cannot constituted the lack of belief?

No, I don't think "belief in" is the same thing as "worship." "Belief in," when used in the context of theism and atheism means the same thing as "belief that." If a person think that God exists, but doesn't worship God, that person is still a theist.

I mean what if the individual is don't know and don't care if god really exist. For example, if you never see a prove that god exist but also is unable to prove that god is not exist, only thing in your mind is "I don't know if god existed, I should find out at the time I died". Is this individual still considered an atheist (because he don't really care about god)? or Theist (because he would probably believe in one if he met him when he's died)?
bladerunner060
Posts: 7,126
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4/2/2013 2:30:21 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/2/2013 1:22:21 PM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
At 3/31/2013 12:03:12 PM, philochristos wrote:
At 3/31/2013 3:15:00 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
Whether you worship God or not doesn't have anything to do with it.

Doesn't really understand that. Isn't belief in god = worship god? If so, how the lack of worship cannot constituted the lack of belief?

No, I don't think "belief in" is the same thing as "worship." "Belief in," when used in the context of theism and atheism means the same thing as "belief that." If a person think that God exists, but doesn't worship God, that person is still a theist.

I mean what if the individual is don't know and don't care if god really exist. For example, if you never see a prove that god exist but also is unable to prove that god is not exist, only thing in your mind is "I don't know if god existed, I should find out at the time I died". Is this individual still considered an atheist (because he don't really care about god)? or Theist (because he would probably believe in one if he met him when he's died)?

The person would be an Atheist. They would lack the affirmative belief that there is a god, which is the minimum definition.

If you wanted to go far enough, you could say the person was a Hard-Agnostic (if you're claiming it's impossible to know) Apathetic Atheist, I suppose, in order to specify.
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wiploc
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4/2/2013 9:52:27 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/2/2013 1:22:21 PM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
I mean what if the individual is don't know

Agnostic.

But, if you meant to say that the individual doesn't believe gods exist, then atheist.

and don't care if god really exist.

Ignostic.

For example, if you never see a prove that god exist but also is unable to prove that god is not exist,

Agnostic.

only thing in your mind is "I don't know if god existed, I should find out at the time I died". Is this individual still considered an atheist

If he doesn't believe a god exists, then he is an atheist.

(because he don't really care about god)?

That's not part of the definition. You can care deeply, or not at all, and still be an atheist. The only test of atheism is whether you believe a god exists.

or Theist (because he would probably believe in one if he met him when he's died)?

We'd all believe in gods if we met them. The test of whether you are an atheist is whether you believe right now.
bladerunner060
Posts: 7,126
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4/2/2013 10:36:17 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/2/2013 9:52:27 PM, wiploc wrote:

Ignostic.

That's the one I was trying to remember!
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suttichart.denpruektham
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4/3/2013 2:33:56 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/2/2013 9:52:27 PM, wiploc wrote:
At 4/2/2013 1:22:21 PM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
I mean what if the individual is don't know

Agnostic.

But, if you meant to say that the individual doesn't believe gods exist, then atheist.

and don't care if god really exist.

Ignostic.

For example, if you never see a prove that god exist but also is unable to prove that god is not exist,

Agnostic.

only thing in your mind is "I don't know if god existed, I should find out at the time I died". Is this individual still considered an atheist

If he doesn't believe a god exists, then he is an atheist.

(because he don't really care about god)?

That's not part of the definition. You can care deeply, or not at all, and still be an atheist. The only test of atheism is whether you believe a god exists.

or Theist (because he would probably believe in one if he met him when he's died)?

We'd all believe in gods if we met them. The test of whether you are an atheist is whether you believe right now.

Did prove has to play any role in this definition? Like do the person has to refuse an evident of god to be an atheist? Let's say you are born in some rural island and have never heard of god at any part of your life, would you be considered an atheist in this case (you never aware of his possible existence and so is impossible to believe )?
wiploc
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4/3/2013 8:18:12 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/3/2013 2:33:56 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
Did prove has to play any role in this definition?

No, proof has nothing to do with it.

Like do the person has to refuse an evident of god to be an atheist?

No, the only question is whether you believe a god exists. If you do, you're a theist. If you don't you're an atheist. Your reasons don't matter.

Let's say you are born in some rural island and have never heard of god at any part of your life, would you be considered an atheist in this case (you never aware of his possible existence and so is impossible to believe )?

Such a person doesn't believe gods exist. Therefore, such a person is an atheist.

More specifically, he's an implicit athiest (one who hasn't considered the issue) rather than an explicit atheist (one who has considered the issue).