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What if Satanists are right?

Dan4reason
Posts: 1,168
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5/2/2013 1:31:58 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
This is a very shocking title as you can imagine but hear me out. Lets assume that the bible is written or inspired by God? Does that mean that God is everything he claims to be? No. We know that fascist regimes will write all sorts of great stuff about themselves and lie about their opponents. So I want to evaluate whether God is telling the truth. Here is my evidence that God is the bad guy.

Evidence 1: God supports sexism. This is a well known fact and sexism is found all over the bible. This shows that this being clearly is bigoted.
Evidence 2: God has ordered genocide. God ordered the genocide of the Canaanites. This is a very typical action from an evil being.
Evidence 3: God allows slavery in the bible. This is another thing many evil regimes have done.
Evidence 4: God has committed generational punishment and punishment of the innocent. This kind of punishment is obviously unjust. Ex 20:5. He also punished the Egyptians for the stubbornness of Pharaoh.
Evidence 5: God has ordered religious bigotry and punishment in the bible. Deut 17: 2-7.
Evidence 6: Heterosexism. This is bigotry in its purest form especially when God demands the death of homosexuals.
Evidence 7: He is against divorce. The bible allows divorce only in cases of adultery. There are obviously other good reasons to get divorced besides this.
Evidence 8: The law of Moses in general. Pretty much the law of Moses is incredibly messed up. For example someone can be killed for picking up sticks on the sabbath.
Evidence 9: God ordered theocracy. Good governments do not make religious laws.
Evidence 10: Demand of worship. No good being would demand worship only obedience and respect.
Evidence 11: Extreme claims of ability. Often evil beings will say exaggerated things about themselves. God claims to be all good, all knowing, all powerful, and all seeing. A little over the top.
Evidence 12: Demanding irrational belief. The God of the bible demands faith or belief with little or no evidence. He is not very supportive of questioning. This is a hall mark of evil tyrants.
Evidence 13: God uses eternal torture. It is completely immoral to torture anyone for extended periods of time when not used to save lives. Punishment must have a point that actually does some good. Torturing never does any good.
Evidence 14: Torture of people who do not believe in God, do not have irrational faith in him, and do not worship him. This sounds like a tactic to keep people in fear and to keep them from asking too many questions.
Evidence 15: God uses blood sacrifice. In the bible Jesus died for our sins. However, killing someone for the sins of another, especially when that death does nothing substantial to fix the problems of these sins is immoral.
Evidence 16:
God hides from everyone. Notice how God doesn't ever come down? Maybe he doesn't do that because then people would know the truth.
Evidence 17: Dichotomizing the conflict. Notice how God portrays the devil as completely evil and himself as completely good? In the real world this situation is rarely true.

So what if the devil is the good guy and God is the bad guy but right now God has control? What if God has been lying about what the devil really does? Some might argue that believe God did good things or has good teachings, that this means he is good. But even evil leaders have advocated good things. For example hitler said: "Tell the truth and fear noone."
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
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5/2/2013 1:40:43 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/2/2013 1:31:58 PM, Dan4reason wrote:
This is a very shocking title as you can imagine but hear me out. Lets assume that the bible is written or inspired by God? Does that mean that God is everything he claims to be? No. We know that fascist regimes will write all sorts of great stuff about themselves and lie about their opponents. So I want to evaluate whether God is telling the truth. Here is my evidence that God is the bad guy.

Evidence 1: God supports sexism. This is a well known fact and sexism is found all over the bible. This shows that this being clearly is bigoted.
Evidence 2: God has ordered genocide. God ordered the genocide of the Canaanites. This is a very typical action from an evil being.
Evidence 3: God allows slavery in the bible. This is another thing many evil regimes have done.
Evidence 4: God has committed generational punishment and punishment of the innocent. This kind of punishment is obviously unjust. Ex 20:5. He also punished the Egyptians for the stubbornness of Pharaoh.
Evidence 5: God has ordered religious bigotry and punishment in the bible. Deut 17: 2-7.
Evidence 6: Heterosexism. This is bigotry in its purest form especially when God demands the death of homosexuals.
Evidence 7: He is against divorce. The bible allows divorce only in cases of adultery. There are obviously other good reasons to get divorced besides this.
Evidence 8: The law of Moses in general. Pretty much the law of Moses is incredibly messed up. For example someone can be killed for picking up sticks on the sabbath.
Evidence 9: God ordered theocracy. Good governments do not make religious laws.
Evidence 10: Demand of worship. No good being would demand worship only obedience and respect.
Evidence 11: Extreme claims of ability. Often evil beings will say exaggerated things about themselves. God claims to be all good, all knowing, all powerful, and all seeing. A little over the top.
Evidence 12: Demanding irrational belief. The God of the bible demands faith or belief with little or no evidence. He is not very supportive of questioning. This is a hall mark of evil tyrants.
Evidence 13: God uses eternal torture. It is completely immoral to torture anyone for extended periods of time when not used to save lives. Punishment must have a point that actually does some good. Torturing never does any good.
Evidence 14: Torture of people who do not believe in God, do not have irrational faith in him, and do not worship him. This sounds like a tactic to keep people in fear and to keep them from asking too many questions.
Evidence 15: God uses blood sacrifice. In the bible Jesus died for our sins. However, killing someone for the sins of another, especially when that death does nothing substantial to fix the problems of these sins is immoral.
Evidence 16:
God hides from everyone. Notice how God doesn't ever come down? Maybe he doesn't do that because then people would know the truth.
Evidence 17: Dichotomizing the conflict. Notice how God portrays the devil as completely evil and himself as completely good? In the real world this situation is rarely true.

So what if the devil is the good guy and God is the bad guy but right now God has control? What if God has been lying about what the devil really does? Some might argue that believe God did good things or has good teachings, that this means he is good. But even evil leaders have advocated good things. For example hitler said: "Tell the truth and fear noone."

Dude do you know what evil is? you are making a pardon for the devil, without giving much thought as to what actually the devil represents....If the devil exists, believe me you will not be making a defence for him whilst giving little thought to all the absurd and attroicious evils that are occurring due to temptation and greed lust or power.
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
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5/2/2013 1:43:28 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/2/2013 1:31:58 PM, Dan4reason wrote:
This is a very shocking title as you can imagine but hear me out. Lets assume that the bible is written or inspired by God? Does that mean that God is everything he claims to be? No. We know that fascist regimes will write all sorts of great stuff about themselves and lie about their opponents. So I want to evaluate whether God is telling the truth. Here is my evidence that God is the bad guy.

Evidence 1: God supports sexism. This is a well known fact and sexism is found all over the bible. This shows that this being clearly is bigoted.
Evidence 2: God has ordered genocide. God ordered the genocide of the Canaanites. This is a very typical action from an evil being.
Evidence 3: God allows slavery in the bible. This is another thing many evil regimes have done.
Evidence 4: God has committed generational punishment and punishment of the innocent. This kind of punishment is obviously unjust. Ex 20:5. He also punished the Egyptians for the stubbornness of Pharaoh.
Evidence 5: God has ordered religious bigotry and punishment in the bible. Deut 17: 2-7.
Evidence 6: Heterosexism. This is bigotry in its purest form especially when God demands the death of homosexuals.
Evidence 7: He is against divorce. The bible allows divorce only in cases of adultery. There are obviously other good reasons to get divorced besides this.
Evidence 8: The law of Moses in general. Pretty much the law of Moses is incredibly messed up. For example someone can be killed for picking up sticks on the sabbath.
Evidence 9: God ordered theocracy. Good governments do not make religious laws.
Evidence 10: Demand of worship. No good being would demand worship only obedience and respect.
Evidence 11: Extreme claims of ability. Often evil beings will say exaggerated things about themselves. God claims to be all good, all knowing, all powerful, and all seeing. A little over the top.
Evidence 12: Demanding irrational belief. The God of the bible demands faith or belief with little or no evidence. He is not very supportive of questioning. This is a hall mark of evil tyrants.
Evidence 13: God uses eternal torture. It is completely immoral to torture anyone for extended periods of time when not used to save lives. Punishment must have a point that actually does some good. Torturing never does any good.
Evidence 14: Torture of people who do not believe in God, do not have irrational faith in him, and do not worship him. This sounds like a tactic to keep people in fear and to keep them from asking too many questions.
Evidence 15: God uses blood sacrifice. In the bible Jesus died for our sins. However, killing someone for the sins of another, especially when that death does nothing substantial to fix the problems of these sins is immoral.
Evidence 16:
God hides from everyone. Notice how God doesn't ever come down? Maybe he doesn't do that because then people would know the truth.
Evidence 17: Dichotomizing the conflict. Notice how God portrays the devil as completely evil and himself as completely good? In the real world this situation is rarely true.

So what if the devil is the good guy and God is the bad guy but right now God has control? What if God has been lying about what the devil really does? Some might argue that believe God did good things or has good teachings, that this means he is good. But even evil leaders have advocated good things. For example hitler said: "Tell the truth and fear noone."

Dude do you know what evil is? you are making a pardon for the devil, without giving much thought as to what actually the devil represents....If the devil exists, believe me you will not be making a defence for him whilst giving little thought to all the absurd and attrocious evils that are occurring due to temptation and greed lust or power.
vbaculum
Posts: 1,274
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5/2/2013 2:13:24 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Satan is the Emmanuel Goldstein of Christian Mythology.
"If you claim to value nonviolence and you consume animal products, you need to rethink your position on nonviolence." - Gary Francione

THE WORLD IS VEGAN! If you want it
Dan4reason
Posts: 1,168
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5/2/2013 2:21:32 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/2/2013 1:43:28 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 5/2/2013 1:31:58 PM, Dan4reason wrote:
This is a very shocking title as you can imagine but hear me out. Lets assume that the bible is written or inspired by God? Does that mean that God is everything he claims to be? No. We know that fascist regimes will write all sorts of great stuff about themselves and lie about their opponents. So I want to evaluate whether God is telling the truth. Here is my evidence that God is the bad guy.

Evidence 1: God supports sexism. This is a well known fact and sexism is found all over the bible. This shows that this being clearly is bigoted.
Evidence 2: God has ordered genocide. God ordered the genocide of the Canaanites. This is a very typical action from an evil being.
Evidence 3: God allows slavery in the bible. This is another thing many evil regimes have done.
Evidence 4: God has committed generational punishment and punishment of the innocent. This kind of punishment is obviously unjust. Ex 20:5. He also punished the Egyptians for the stubbornness of Pharaoh.
Evidence 5: God has ordered religious bigotry and punishment in the bible. Deut 17: 2-7.
Evidence 6: Heterosexism. This is bigotry in its purest form especially when God demands the death of homosexuals.
Evidence 7: He is against divorce. The bible allows divorce only in cases of adultery. There are obviously other good reasons to get divorced besides this.
Evidence 8: The law of Moses in general. Pretty much the law of Moses is incredibly messed up. For example someone can be killed for picking up sticks on the sabbath.
Evidence 9: God ordered theocracy. Good governments do not make religious laws.
Evidence 10: Demand of worship. No good being would demand worship only obedience and respect.
Evidence 11: Extreme claims of ability. Often evil beings will say exaggerated things about themselves. God claims to be all good, all knowing, all powerful, and all seeing. A little over the top.
Evidence 12: Demanding irrational belief. The God of the bible demands faith or belief with little or no evidence. He is not very supportive of questioning. This is a hall mark of evil tyrants.
Evidence 13: God uses eternal torture. It is completely immoral to torture anyone for extended periods of time when not used to save lives. Punishment must have a point that actually does some good. Torturing never does any good.
Evidence 14: Torture of people who do not believe in God, do not have irrational faith in him, and do not worship him. This sounds like a tactic to keep people in fear and to keep them from asking too many questions.
Evidence 15: God uses blood sacrifice. In the bible Jesus died for our sins. However, killing someone for the sins of another, especially when that death does nothing substantial to fix the problems of these sins is immoral.
Evidence 16:
God hides from everyone. Notice how God doesn't ever come down? Maybe he doesn't do that because then people would know the truth.
Evidence 17: Dichotomizing the conflict. Notice how God portrays the devil as completely evil and himself as completely good? In the real world this situation is rarely true.

So what if the devil is the good guy and God is the bad guy but right now God has control? What if God has been lying about what the devil really does? Some might argue that believe God did good things or has good teachings, that this means he is good. But even evil leaders have advocated good things. For example hitler said: "Tell the truth and fear noone."



Dude do you know what evil is? you are making a pardon for the devil, without giving much thought as to what actually the devil represents....If the devil exists, believe me you will not be making a defence for him whilst giving little thought to all the absurd and attrocious evils that are occurring due to temptation and greed lust or power.

The only reason you have for saying the devil is evil is because God said so. And God happens to be the devil's enemy conveniently enough. Given God's track record, we know that it is God who is evil so maybe God has been lying about the devil.
boss1592
Posts: 80
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5/5/2013 6:31:02 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/2/2013 1:31:58 PM, Dan4reason wrote:
This is a very shocking title as you can imagine but hear me out. Lets assume that the bible is written or inspired by God? Does that mean that God is everything he claims to be? No. We know that fascist regimes will write all sorts of great stuff about themselves and lie about their opponents. So I want to evaluate whether God is telling the truth. Here is my evidence that God is the bad guy.

Evidence 1: God supports sexism. This is a well known fact and sexism is found all over the bible. This shows that this being clearly is bigoted.
Evidence 2: God has ordered genocide. God ordered the genocide of the Canaanites. This is a very typical action from an evil being.
Evidence 3: God allows slavery in the bible. This is another thing many evil regimes have done.
Evidence 4: God has committed generational punishment and punishment of the innocent. This kind of punishment is obviously unjust. Ex 20:5. He also punished the Egyptians for the stubbornness of Pharaoh.
Evidence 5: God has ordered religious bigotry and punishment in the bible. Deut 17: 2-7.
Evidence 6: Heterosexism. This is bigotry in its purest form especially when God demands the death of homosexuals.
Evidence 7: He is against divorce. The bible allows divorce only in cases of adultery. There are obviously other good reasons to get divorced besides this.
Evidence 8: The law of Moses in general. Pretty much the law of Moses is incredibly messed up. For example someone can be killed for picking up sticks on the sabbath.
Evidence 9: God ordered theocracy. Good governments do not make religious laws.
Evidence 10: Demand of worship. No good being would demand worship only obedience and respect.
Evidence 11: Extreme claims of ability. Often evil beings will say exaggerated things about themselves. God claims to be all good, all knowing, all powerful, and all seeing. A little over the top.
Evidence 12: Demanding irrational belief. The God of the bible demands faith or belief with little or no evidence. He is not very supportive of questioning. This is a hall mark of evil tyrants.
Evidence 13: God uses eternal torture. It is completely immoral to torture anyone for extended periods of time when not used to save lives. Punishment must have a point that actually does some good. Torturing never does any good.
Evidence 14: Torture of people who do not believe in God, do not have irrational faith in him, and do not worship him. This sounds like a tactic to keep people in fear and to keep them from asking too many questions.
Evidence 15: God uses blood sacrifice. In the bible Jesus died for our sins. However, killing someone for the sins of another, especially when that death does nothing substantial to fix the problems of these sins is immoral.
Evidence 16:
God hides from everyone. Notice how God doesn't ever come down? Maybe he doesn't do that because then people would know the truth.
Evidence 17: Dichotomizing the conflict. Notice how God portrays the devil as completely evil and himself as completely good? In the real world this situation is rarely true.

So what if the devil is the good guy and God is the bad guy but right now God has control? What if God has been lying about what the devil really does? Some might argue that believe God did good things or has good teachings, that this means he is good. But even evil leaders have advocated good things. For example hitler said: "Tell the truth and fear noone."

Huh... I'd never thought of it that way, that's actually an interesting hypothesis. I still don't believe either of them exist, but it's a thought provoking idea.
AbnerGrimm
Posts: 114
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5/5/2013 8:27:27 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/2/2013 1:31:58 PM, Dan4reason wrote:
This is a very shocking title as you can imagine but hear me out. Lets assume that the bible is written or inspired by God? Does that mean that God is everything he claims to be? No. We know that fascist regimes will write all sorts of great stuff about themselves and lie about their opponents. So I want to evaluate whether God is telling the truth. Here is my evidence that God is the bad guy.

Evidence 1: God supports sexism. This is a well known fact and sexism is found all over the bible. This shows that this being clearly is bigoted.

The man represents God as the head.
Ephesians 5:23
For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.
1 Corinthians 7:3
Let the husband render unto the wife due benevolence: and likewise also the wife unto the husband.

Evidence 2: God has ordered genocide. God ordered the genocide of the Canaanites. This is a very typical action from an evil being.

Why then were the Canaanites singled out for such severe treatment? They were cut off to prevent Israel and the rest of the world from being corrupted (Deut. 20:16-18). When a people starts to burn their children in honor of their gods (Lev. 18:21), practice sodomy, bestiality, and all sorts of loathsome vice (Lev. 18:23, 24, 20:3), the land itself begins to "vomit" them out as the body heaves under the load of internal poisons (Lev. 18:25, 27-30). The wages of sin is death.

Evidence 3: God allows slavery in the bible. This is another thing many evil regimes have done.

This is a form of punishment and lesson to be a servant of God. God own people were enslaved multiple times.

Evidence 4: God has committed generational punishment and punishment of the innocent. This kind of punishment is obviously unjust. Ex 20:5. He also punished the Egyptians for the stubbornness of Pharaoh.

Obviously. So us the obviousness of it.

Evidence 5: God has ordered religious bigotry and punishment in the bible. Deut 17: 2-7.

Like sacrificing children and forcing whole nations to build monuments to the king? Wonder why?

Evidence 6: Heterosexism. This is bigotry in its purest form especially when God demands the death of homosexuals.

I have not one problem with it in the O.T. but that is not the N.T.

Evidence 7: He is against divorce. The bible allows divorce only in cases of adultery. There are obviously other good reasons to get divorced besides this.

You assert your moral compass to much. You lack in it and it is glaring. Just no reason why God made man and woman one flesh.

Evidence 8: The law of Moses in general. Pretty much the law of Moses is incredibly messed up. For example someone can be killed for picking up sticks on the sabbath.

In the O.T. you had to pay or sin, justice demands. Jess had not come therefore you cleansed sin by death or sacrifice to cleanse the sin. Really research doctrine before you say anything about it.

Evidence 9: God ordered theocracy. Good governments do not make religious laws.

How do you know? You wouldn't.

Evidence 10: Demand of worship. No good being would demand worship only obedience and respect.

Says who, you, lol. A all powerful being's nature would call for worship. A life giving being as such would be reserved for worship by the created. That is your pride messing with ya.

Evidence 11: Extreme claims of ability. Often evil beings will say exaggerated things about themselves. God claims to be all good, all knowing, all powerful, and all seeing. A little over the top.

So no argument against.

Evidence 12: Demanding irrational belief. The God of the bible demands faith or belief with little or no evidence. He is not very supportive of questioning. This is a hall mark of evil tyrants.

Whos says there is not evidence? Evidence is in the eyes of the beholder. Maybe you are just blind.

Evidence 13: God uses eternal torture. It is completely immoral to torture anyone for extended periods of time when not used to save lives. Punishment must have a point that actually does some good. Torturing never does any good.

God uses nothing. You do not understand hell. Hell is freedom from God. But, to be without God you siffer because you are no longer with the giver of life.

Evidence 14: Torture of people who do not believe in God, do not have irrational faith in him, and do not worship him. This sounds like a tactic to keep people in fear and to keep them from asking too many questions.

You should ask a God as great as described questions about His character? Nonsense. It is a tactic to keep you in line. Heed the warning at your will.

Evidence 15: God uses blood sacrifice. In the bible Jesus died for our sins. However, killing someone for the sins of another, especially when that death does nothing substantial to fix the problems of these sins is immoral.

Blood is pure. It cleanses sin. Duh. God never requested human sacrifice. Jesus is God.

Evidence 16:
God hides from everyone. Notice how God doesn't ever come down? Maybe he doesn't do that because then people would know the truth.

Inane. If God did such things what would faith be for? Nothing.

Evidence 17: Dichotomizing the conflict. Notice how God portrays the devil as completely evil and himself as completely good? In the real world this situation is rarely true.

LOL. In the real world there is sin. God has no sin and you have proved such. How bout you defend these notions in debate.

So what if the devil is the good guy and God is the bad guy but right now God has control? What if God has been lying about what the devil really does? Some might argue that believe God did good things or has good teachings, that this means he is good. But even evil leaders have advocated good things. For example hitler said: "Tell the truth and fear noone."

Why would God lie? He created us what benefit would it cause? Considering He could kill us all and the devil at any time it sees kind to allow us to live longer then necessary. Seems like gentleness to do this. Please compare Hitler and God and lets see how they stack up or otherwise debate it or tuck your tail and run.