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What really is a true Christian?

MadCornishBiker
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5/27/2013 8:06:13 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Is being a Christian merely a case of calling yourself such?

Is it a belief in a set doctrine propounded by men?

Or is it, in fact, a realistic effort to stand by the teachings of Christ and the Apostles as carefully outlined i scripture?

I vote for the latter, since everything else makes Christianity into little more than a social club.
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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5/27/2013 9:14:20 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Asking 'what is a true christian', is just ridiculous. It's just a subjective term, that means a lot of things, to a lot of different people. Well, the Jehovas witness' believe they have it right, the Mormons think they got it, and the WBC thinks you're all going to hell. So, you can think whatever you like, but there is no true Christians. Just people who call themselves Christians.
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
Fruitytree
Posts: 2,176
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5/27/2013 9:23:11 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
You should have asked what is a true Jesus believer, cause it seems the term Christian now really means a man made doctrine.
MadCornishBiker
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5/27/2013 9:52:47 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/27/2013 9:23:11 AM, Fruitytree wrote:
You should have asked what is a true Jesus believer, cause it seems the term Christian now really means a man made doctrine.

Not strictly true.

The doctrine of Christianity was set millennia ago, long before Christ even came to earth in fact.

However it is true that man has tampered with and changed what has become accepted as Christian doctrine, in fulfilment of Jesus own prophecy at Matthew 7:21-23.

It remains true, however, that there is only one true Christian doctrine, all else are false. Just as there is only one true Mona Lisa and all others are fakes, imitations. What God created remains the same and always will, no matter what man does to it.
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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5/27/2013 2:59:03 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
"The doctrine of Christianity was set millennia ago, long before Christ even came to earth in fact."

I'm not sure what you mean by that statement. Quite a bit of what you said is true, but the statement above needs qualifying, or some sort of explanation.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
annanicole
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5/27/2013 3:31:59 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/27/2013 3:08:52 PM, Anti-atheist wrote:
follows jesus

lol
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
MadCornishBiker
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5/27/2013 3:47:03 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/27/2013 2:59:03 PM, annanicole wrote:
"The doctrine of Christianity was set millennia ago, long before Christ even came to earth in fact."

I'm not sure what you mean by that statement. Quite a bit of what you said is true, but the statement above needs qualifying, or some sort of explanation.

It is simple. Stop and think where Christ and the Apostles got the principles they expounded from. It was in fact the Mosaic Law. Don't forget that Jesus was a faithful Jew all his life and the Apostles were also ones who wished to worship the God of the Jews in the correct way and were taught to reject Judaism as it was in those days. They were the foundation of what became known as the Christian congregation but who thought of themselves as the "Israel of God", the true, spiritual, Israel. Christianity was never intended to be a new faith, simply a return to the true worship of the One True God, as worshipped by Jesus and the Apostles.

Christ said he came not to destroy the law but to fulfil it, so the onyl change is that now Christians should live by the principles embedded in that law, but not to stick rigidly to the letter of it.

When asked what was the greatest commandment in the law, Jesus quoted two laws from scripture on which he said "The Law and the prophets hang". (Matthew 22:36-40). The two commandments he cited were from Deuteronomy 6:5 and the other from Leviticus 19:18.

In fact the basis for Christian principle was laid down in the lives of such as Enoch, Noah and Abraham, and it is to tht life of principle that Christians are to return, not needing a law code to control them but teh control coming from within themselves.
Fruitytree
Posts: 2,176
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5/27/2013 3:55:42 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/27/2013 3:47:51 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 5/27/2013 3:08:52 PM, Anti-atheist wrote:
follows jesus

Basic, but true.

I'm following so hard that I accepted Islam !
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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5/27/2013 4:09:01 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/27/2013 3:55:42 PM, Fruitytree wrote:
At 5/27/2013 3:47:51 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 5/27/2013 3:08:52 PM, Anti-atheist wrote:
follows jesus

Basic, but true.

I'm following so hard that I accepted Islam !

But is that truly following Jesus??
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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5/27/2013 4:27:45 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
"It is simple. Stop and think where Christ and the Apostles got the principles they expounded from."

Many, many of the principles of Christianity were also principles of Judaism. However, to say that "that's where they got it" might be a stretch.

***

"Don't forget that Jesus was a faithful Jew all his life and the Apostles were also ones who wished to worship the God of the Jews in the correct way and were taught to reject Judaism as it was in those days."

They were taught to reject Judaism, period - not just Judaism "as it was." The most basic error that early Christians encountered was a desire to return to certain principles or acts of the Mosaic Law.

***

"They were the foundation of what became known as the Christian congregation but who thought of themselves as the "Israel of God", the true, spiritual, Israel."

"Israel of God" is, of course, a metaphorical term meaning "the chosen people of God."

***

"Christianity was never intended to be a new faith, simply a return to the true worship of the One True God, as worshipped by Jesus and the Apostles."

Christianity was intended to be - and was - a complete break with Judaism.

***

"Christ said he came not to destroy the law but to fulfil it, so the onyl change is that now Christians should live by the principles embedded in that law, but not to stick rigidly to the letter of it."

He both fulfilled it and took it out of the way and gave us a new law with new principles. Many of the principles and teachings of Judaism were repeated in the new Law, but nonetheless the Mosaic system, Judaism, was removed ... taken away ... and a new law replaced it.

***

"When asked what was the greatest commandment in the law, Jesus quoted two laws from scripture on which he said "The Law and the prophets hang". (Matthew 22:36-40). The two commandments he cited were from Deuteronomy 6:5 and the other from Leviticus 19:18."

True

***

"In fact the basis for Christian principle was laid down in the lives of such as Enoch, Noah and Abraham, and it is to tht life of principle that Christians are to return, not needing a law code to control them but teh control coming from within themselves."

The basis for religion - the re-binding to man to God - has always been belief, trust, confidence combined with compliance, obedience. Certainly Christians have a law - the Law of Christ - just as Jews had the Law of Moses. A true Christian is thus one who believes in, trusts in, has confidence in and reliance upon God and Jesus Christ and complies with the terms of pardon as set forth by Jesus Christ and His apostles. It is a dangerous thing to attempt a return to Judaism, in whole or in part.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Sower4GS
Posts: 1,718
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5/27/2013 5:08:24 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
What does this mean to you? Anyone?
G13
Agabos
Thayer Definition:
Agabus = "locust"
1) a Christian prophet
Part of Speech: proper noun masculine
A Related Word by Thayer"s/Strong"s Number: of Hebrew origin, compare H2285

and this word in Hebrew:

H2284
ch"g"b
BDB Definition:
1) locust, grasshopper
Part of Speech: noun masculine
A Related Word by BDB/Strong"s Number: of uncertain derivation
Same Word by TWOT Number: 601a

Only times the Christians are mentioned in Scripture, in your KJV.

Act_11:26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.

Comments?
Sower4GS
Posts: 1,718
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5/27/2013 5:19:49 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Church:
Ekklsia is the proper Greek translation and translates as such:

G1577
ekklsia
Thayer Definition:
1) a gathering of citizens called out from their homes into some public place, an assembly
1a) an assembly of the people convened at the public place of the council for the purpose of deliberating
1b) the assembly of the Israelites
1c) any gathering or throng of men assembled by chance, tumultuously
HMMMMMM, interesting, no?
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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5/27/2013 5:26:02 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
What again are the words from which "called" and "Christians" are translated in Acts 11: 26? Chrematizo and Christianos?
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
annanicole
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5/27/2013 5:30:22 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
You say: "Church: Ekklsia is the proper Greek translation and translates as such."

Ekklesia would certainly be the proper Greek translation of the English church, and church would be the proper English translation of ekklesia. Both mean "called out." That's why so many on here have correctly stated that the church is simply the called out. The word ekklesia did not originally even have a religious connotation: among the Greeks, it referred to any group of people who were called out for any purpose.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Sower4GS
Posts: 1,718
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5/27/2013 5:32:27 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Jesus?
G2424
Iesous
Thayer Definition:
Jesus = "Jehovah is salvation"
There is no "J" in the Hebrew alphabet, rather a "Y".
Yehovah.
No vowel points are used.
Yhvh
The v is also known as a waw or w.
YHWH, the Father.
YHWH is SALVATION.
YAH=God.
SHUA=saves/salvation.
YAHSHUA God saves. YHWH is salvation.
His authentic and True name is Yahshua.
Yahshua the Maschiach.
Like it or not.
Yeshua is Aramaic and not the only name they used in His day, it was a multi-lingual speaking HEBREW region.
The Hebrew translation for Yeshua is Yahshua.
He was not Aramaic He was Hebrew, if you can't figure it out now at least you have been informed.

I like the "Authentic" not the "Copy/Substitute".

If you want detailed explanations please see this excellent, well put together link by Eliyah.
http://www.eliyah.com...
I come in Yahshua's name! How about you? Choose! Repent! Follow the Master!
TULIP
Posts: 398
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5/27/2013 5:32:34 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/27/2013 8:06:13 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Is being a Christian merely a case of calling yourself such?

Is it a belief in a set doctrine propounded by men?

Or is it, in fact, a realistic effort to stand by the teachings of Christ and the Apostles as carefully outlined i scripture?

I vote for the latter, since everything else makes Christianity into little more than a social club.

1. No merely calling yourself a christian doesn't make you a Christian anybody can say that but what does your life say? What does your life's how? are the questions to really ask..

2. Doctrine doesn't make a Christian.. It's good to learn doctrine and theology and to grow spiritually but that doesn't make a person a Christian..

3. Being a Christian is having a regenerated heart, being born again by Gods Spirit and demonstrating Christ by the life lived by a professed Christian. Repenting and believing the Gospel of Christ.. (Efforts to display Christ through ones life and hsinf to the apostles teachings).

My opinion don't call yourself a Christian if your true words and hearts are not changed and your life and words will prove it.. Cause then you blaspheme Gods name and drag His name in the dirt as if it's just trash. The Pharisees did a great job claiming to be something they weren't and Christ pointed them out calling them hypocrites and brood of vipers...
"We conclude that our salvation is of The Lord. He is the One who regenerates us. Those whom He regenerates come to Christ. Without regeneration no one will ever come to Christ. With regeneration no one will ever reject Him. God's saving grace effects what He intends to effect by it. ~ R. C. Sproul
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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5/27/2013 5:34:38 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
What in the world are you talking about with the word Agabos (or Agabus)? That word is .. or should be ... a proper name of an individual, i. e. "Agabos" is a person's name. It has nothing to do with Christians or the church or anything close.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Sower4GS
Posts: 1,718
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5/27/2013 5:36:29 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Ekklesia means called out? Not in the context of Scripture I read from YOUR English version!

I just accurately translated the word church for you with a Thayer's edited by Christians.

WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT ANNA??

You can't argue with facts, ask any studied scholar, Jew, Christian anyone. Ask them if my facts are wrong, then we will talk!
Sower4GS
Posts: 1,718
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5/27/2013 5:38:45 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/27/2013 5:34:38 PM, annanicole wrote:
What in the world are you talking about with the word Agabos (or Agabus)? That word is .. or should be ... a proper name of an individual, i. e. "Agabos" is a person's name. It has nothing to do with Christians or the church or anything close.

I JUST GOT THE FACTS!
In black and white, get a scholar to prove the facts wrong, then we will talk, don't try to "talk" your way out of this one, Anna!
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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5/27/2013 5:42:28 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/27/2013 5:36:29 PM, Sower4GS wrote:
Ekklesia means called out? Not in the context of Scripture I read from YOUR English version!

I just accurately translated the word church for you with a Thayer's edited by Christians.

WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT ANNA??

You can't argue with facts, ask any studied scholar, Jew, Christian anyone. Ask them if my facts are wrong, then we will talk!

I never said your facts were wrong. Ekklesia means "called out". Church means "called out." Two things equal to the same thing are equal to each other.

Ekklesia = Church = called out

That's basic. As far as I could tell, you weren't wrong on it.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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5/27/2013 5:43:46 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/27/2013 5:38:45 PM, Sower4GS wrote:
At 5/27/2013 5:34:38 PM, annanicole wrote:
What in the world are you talking about with the word Agabos (or Agabus)? That word is .. or should be ... a proper name of an individual, i. e. "Agabos" is a person's name. It has nothing to do with Christians or the church or anything close.

I JUST GOT THE FACTS!
In black and white, get a scholar to prove the facts wrong, then we will talk, don't try to "talk" your way out of this one, Anna!

What facts? The word "agabus" isn't even IN Acts 11: 26. It's in Acts 11: 28, and it's the proper name of a specific person.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Sower4GS
Posts: 1,718
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5/27/2013 5:44:06 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
IT IS RIGHT THERE FOR THE WHOLE WORLD TO SEE< FROM THE THAYER'S EDITED BY CHRISTIANS!!!

WHAT MORE DO I HAVE TO PRINT???

IF I PUT ANYMORE IT WOULD BE OPINION!

I COULD NOT MAKE IT ANY clearer!!
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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5/27/2013 5:46:00 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
What again are the words from which "called" and "Christians" are translated in Acts 11: 26? Chrematizo and Christianos?

"And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch."

Do you see anything about any "agabos" or "agabus" in that passage? If not, why cite it?
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Sower4GS
Posts: 1,718
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5/27/2013 5:47:20 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Look up the word Christian in the Thayers, it will be the first word you see G13
The word Christian was used in a derogatory way, first in Antioch.
Locust is a derogatory word that means Christian or Christian prophet!
1+1=2
Get a scholar or don't, your choice!
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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5/27/2013 5:48:40 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
"I COULD NOT MAKE IT ANY clearer!!"

Ummm ... I surmise that nobody on here knows what you are talking about.

By the way, you have a question to answer concerning Acts 11: 26 - not verse 28:

What again are the words from which "called" and "Christians" are translated in Acts 11: 26? Chrematizo and Christianos?

If so, tell us the definitions of chrematizo.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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5/27/2013 5:51:41 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
G13 is the specific name of a man, like John or Tom or Harry. It's found ONE time, in Acts 11: 28. It has nothing to do with the disciples being called Christians first at Antioch.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
annanicole
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5/27/2013 5:54:54 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
"Locust is a derogatory word that means Christian or Christian prophet!"

Hahahahaha. The definition is the NAME of a certain Christian prophet. The man's name was Agabus. That was his NAME.

"And there stood up one of them named Agabus"

He wasn't named CHRISTIAN. He WAS a Christian. His NAME was Agabus. I can't help it if his parents named him Agabus.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Sower4GS
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5/27/2013 5:55:08 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I am going to say it one more time, the word Christian is translated as G13, please get someone studied to prove this obvious fact wrong. Until then you have no argument, contact me when you get the facts, not theory's. I gave you the facts, prove the facts wrong or don't. Your translations are not from the Thayer's original Greek.

What about the rest of the FACTS that I have posted, you have work to do, and I proved Rav Sha'ul (Paul) was Torah observant and taught Torah on your other post like you requested. And Baptism/Immersion/Mikveh? Happy to oblige, accept Yahshua for who He is, the Living Torah and I will expound Immersion to you even more than I already have through PM yesterday until you are rolling with laughter on the Synagogue floor!