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Jesus Crucifixtion/ Islam

Fruitytree
Posts: 2,176
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6/29/2013 8:29:05 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
I want by this topic, to show what the position of Islam exactly is regarding Jesus crucifixion and how it matches the Gospels.

Here I start by putting all the Islam scriptures that came regarding crucifixion and pre-ascension of Jesus, Islam scriptures being Both the Quran (literal word of God) and Sunna or hadiths (prophetic tradition authentically transmitted).

1- Recall what time Allah said: O Isa! verily I shall make thee die, and am lifting thee to myself and am purifying thee from those who disbelieve, and shall place those who follow thee above those who disbelieve until the Day of Resurrection; thereafter unto Me shall be the return of you all, then I shall judge between you of that wherein ye were wont to differ. (55) Quran/3

2- And for their blasphemy and for their speaking against Maryam a mighty calumny. (156) And for their saying: verily We have slain the Messiah Isa son of Maryam, an apostle of Allah, whereas they slew him not, nor they crucified him but it was made dubious unto them. And verily those who differ therein are in doubt thereof, they have no knowledge thereof; they but follow an opinion; and surely they slew him not. (157) But Allah raised him unto Himself; and Allah is ever Mighty, Wise. (158) And there is none among the people of the Book but shall surely believe in him before his death, and on the Day of Judgement he shall be a witness against them. (159) Quran/4

Those are the only passages about Jesus "death" in Quran, in the first passage the Arabic word used for "death" is " Mutawafik" from the noun "Wafat" that is used for sleep, coma, and death in Arabic.

In the second passage God is speaking about the Jews that they claimed they killed Jesus, when in the reality they did not but God made it look like they did to them.

Muslims differed a lot about how God made it appear as such to the jews, some said the jews killed Judah who was given the appearance of Jesus, some said it was Jesus, but his death was not due to the slaying, and some said other things that are way unlikely interpretations.

Now let's see what the bible says about that moment:

16 and other sheep I have that are not of this fold, these also it behoveth me to bring, and my voice they will hear, and there shall become one flock -- one shepherd.

17 `Because of this doth the Father love me, because I lay down my life, that again I may take it;

18 no one doth take it from me, but I lay it down of myself; authority I have to lay it down, and authority I have again to take it; this command I received from my Father.'
John/ YLT

Here already we have an agreement with the second passage from the Quran, that the Jews did not take Jesus life away, but He lay his life according to the command God gave him.

Now let's see what happened on the cross:

28 After this, Jesus knowing that all things now have been finished, that the Writing may be fulfilled, saith, `I thirst;'

29 a vessel, therefore, was placed full of vinegar, and they having filled a sponge with vinegar, and having put [it] around a hyssop stalk, did put [it] to his mouth;

30 when, therefore, Jesus received the vinegar, he said, `It hath been finished;' and having bowed the head, gave up the spirit.

31 The Jews, therefore, that the bodies might not remain on the cross on the sabbath, since it was the preparation, (for that sabbath day was a great one,) asked of Pilate that their legs may be broken, and they taken away.

32 The soldiers, therefore, came, and of the first indeed they did break the legs, and of the other who was crucified with him,

33 and having come to Jesus, when they saw him already having been dead, they did not break his legs;
34 but one of the soldiers with a spear did pierce his side, and immediately there came forth blood and water; John/YLT

Now Jesus did die, but was it due to the crucifixion?? No! but due to the command of God, that was a step to Jesus ascension to Heaven.

The nature of his death may not be like our death, although It seemed to be a plain death to them, but it could have been some other condition that the people of the time were not aware of.

So that was in brief to show that what the Quran is in agreement with what came in the Gospels, and only people interpretations made the gap.
makhdoom5
Posts: 202
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6/30/2013 12:43:24 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
actually u need mental check up.

- And for their blasphemy and for their speaking against Maryam a mighty calumny. (156) And for their saying: verily We have slain the Messiah Isa son of Maryam, an apostle of Allah, whereas they slew him not, nor they crucified him but it was made dubious unto them. And verily those who differ therein are in doubt thereof, they have no knowledge thereof; they but follow an opinion; and surely they slew him not. (157) But Allah raised him unto Himself; and Allah is ever Mighty, Wise. (158) And there is none among the people of the Book but shall surely believe in him before his death, and on the Day of Judgement he shall be a witness against them. (159) Quran/4
ConservativePolitico
Posts: 8,210
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6/30/2013 1:32:04 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/30/2013 12:44:47 PM, makhdoom5 wrote:
actually ur Arabic is shiiit.
out of context.

new frutyshit scholar has been born.

Chill bro. Take scrutiny with pride and mental fortitude, not poison.
Fruitytree
Posts: 2,176
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6/30/2013 2:25:25 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/30/2013 12:43:24 PM, makhdoom5 wrote:
actually u need mental check up.


- And for their blasphemy and for their speaking against Maryam a mighty calumny. (156) And for their saying: verily We have slain the Messiah Isa son of Maryam, an apostle of Allah, whereas they slew him not, nor they crucified him but it was made dubious unto them. And verily those who differ therein are in doubt thereof, they have no knowledge thereof; they but follow an opinion; and surely they slew him not. (157) But Allah raised him unto Himself; and Allah is ever Mighty, Wise. (158) And there is none among the people of the Book but shall surely believe in him before his death, and on the Day of Judgement he shall be a witness against them. (159) Quran/4

Yes, Allah is saying, about the Jews who claimed they slew Jesus, that they did not Slew him, and I've shown that this means the cause of his death isn't the slaying as it appeared to them, but God took him as He had plans for him.
Fruitytree
Posts: 2,176
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6/30/2013 2:26:56 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/30/2013 1:32:04 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
At 6/30/2013 12:44:47 PM, makhdoom5 wrote:
actually ur Arabic is shiiit.
out of context.

new frutyshit scholar has been born.

Chill bro. Take scrutiny with pride and mental fortitude, not poison.

Advise is good only for open minded people.
question4u
Posts: 492
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6/30/2013 8:54:42 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/29/2013 8:29:05 AM, Fruitytree wrote:
I want by this topic, to show what the position of Islam exactly is regarding Jesus crucifixion and how it matches the Gospels.

Here I start by putting all the Islam scriptures that came regarding crucifixion and pre-ascension of Jesus, Islam scriptures being Both the Quran (literal word of God) and Sunna or hadiths (prophetic tradition authentically transmitted).

1- Recall what time Allah said: O Isa! verily I shall make thee die, and am lifting thee to myself and am purifying thee from those who disbelieve, and shall place those who follow thee above those who disbelieve until the Day of Resurrection; thereafter unto Me shall be the return of you all, then I shall judge between you of that wherein ye were wont to differ. (55) Quran/3

2- And for their blasphemy and for their speaking against Maryam a mighty calumny. (156) And for their saying: verily We have slain the Messiah Isa son of Maryam, an apostle of Allah, whereas they slew him not, nor they crucified him but it was made dubious unto them. And verily those who differ therein are in doubt thereof, they have no knowledge thereof; they but follow an opinion; and surely they slew him not. (157) But Allah raised him unto Himself; and Allah is ever Mighty, Wise. (158) And there is none among the people of the Book but shall surely believe in him before his death, and on the Day of Judgement he shall be a witness against them. (159) Quran/4

Those are the only passages about Jesus "death" in Quran, in the first passage the Arabic word used for "death" is " Mutawafik" from the noun "Wafat" that is used for sleep, coma, and death in Arabic.

In the second passage God is speaking about the Jews that they claimed they killed Jesus, when in the reality they did not but God made it look like they did to them.

Muslims differed a lot about how God made it appear as such to the jews, some said the jews killed Judah who was given the appearance of Jesus, some said it was Jesus, but his death was not due to the slaying, and some said other things that are way unlikely interpretations.

Now let's see what the bible says about that moment:

16 and other sheep I have that are not of this fold, these also it behoveth me to bring, and my voice they will hear, and there shall become one flock -- one shepherd.

17 `Because of this doth the Father love me, because I lay down my life, that again I may take it;

18 no one doth take it from me, but I lay it down of myself; authority I have to lay it down, and authority I have again to take it; this command I received from my Father.'
John/ YLT

Here already we have an agreement with the second passage from the Quran, that the Jews did not take Jesus life away, but He lay his life according to the command God gave him.

Now let's see what happened on the cross:

28 After this, Jesus knowing that all things now have been finished, that the Writing may be fulfilled, saith, `I thirst;'

29 a vessel, therefore, was placed full of vinegar, and they having filled a sponge with vinegar, and having put [it] around a hyssop stalk, did put [it] to his mouth;

30 when, therefore, Jesus received the vinegar, he said, `It hath been finished;' and having bowed the head, gave up the spirit.

31 The Jews, therefore, that the bodies might not remain on the cross on the sabbath, since it was the preparation, (for that sabbath day was a great one,) asked of Pilate that their legs may be broken, and they taken away.

32 The soldiers, therefore, came, and of the first indeed they did break the legs, and of the other who was crucified with him,

33 and having come to Jesus, when they saw him already having been dead, they did not break his legs;
34 but one of the soldiers with a spear did pierce his side, and immediately there came forth blood and water; John/YLT

Now Jesus did die, but was it due to the crucifixion?? No! but due to the command of God, that was a step to Jesus ascension to Heaven.

The nature of his death may not be like our death, although It seemed to be a plain death to them, but it could have been some other condition that the people of the time were not aware of.

So that was in brief to show that what the Quran is in agreement with what came in the Gospels, and only people interpretations made the gap.

gnosticism at its finest...all the same to me, nothing different.
Fruitytree
Posts: 2,176
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7/1/2013 5:49:56 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/30/2013 8:54:42 PM, question4u wrote:

gnosticism at its finest...all the same to me, nothing different.

Aren't you a Gnostic yourself by being a theist ?