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a simple test to check a christian religion.

kjw47
Posts: 1,624
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8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15
Naysayer
Posts: 746
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8/13/2013 6:20:36 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM, kjw47 wrote:
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15

I'm going to need some clarification on this. I'm having a hard time understanding what exactly you're trying to say here. What do false apostles have to do with the concept of the meek shall inherit the earth? And you're point is that if they're not meek, they're not Christians?

Are you saying if you preach heaven and hell you're preaching a different Jesus?
kjw47
Posts: 1,624
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8/13/2013 7:13:59 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/13/2013 6:20:36 PM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM, kjw47 wrote:
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15

I'm going to need some clarification on this. I'm having a hard time understanding what exactly you're trying to say here. What do false apostles have to do with the concept of the meek shall inherit the earth? And you're point is that if they're not meek, they're not Christians?

Are you saying if you preach heaven and hell you're preaching a different Jesus?

Many of the teachings of Gods son are not listened to by 99% who are told they are in a ( supposed) Christian religion They are being mislead ( 2 cor 11:12-15) their teachings contradict Jesus teachings.
Naysayer
Posts: 746
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8/14/2013 6:48:19 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/13/2013 7:13:59 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:20:36 PM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM, kjw47 wrote:
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15

I'm going to need some clarification on this. I'm having a hard time understanding what exactly you're trying to say here. What do false apostles have to do with the concept of the meek shall inherit the earth? And you're point is that if they're not meek, they're not Christians?

Are you saying if you preach heaven and hell you're preaching a different Jesus?

Many of the teachings of Gods son are not listened to by 99% who are told they are in a ( supposed) Christian religion They are being mislead ( 2 cor 11:12-15) their teachings contradict Jesus teachings.

Which teachings are those?
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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8/14/2013 2:18:57 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM, kjw47 wrote:
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15

Christians have no idea what the Truth is and never will in this age, even though I have a few believing Christians who are listening to Him.

in God is NOT the same thing as knowing our Creator like us saints do.
kjw47
Posts: 1,624
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8/15/2013 7:21:13 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 6:48:19 AM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 7:13:59 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:20:36 PM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM, kjw47 wrote:
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15

I'm going to need some clarification on this. I'm having a hard time understanding what exactly you're trying to say here. What do false apostles have to do with the concept of the meek shall inherit the earth? And you're point is that if they're not meek, they're not Christians?

Are you saying if you preach heaven and hell you're preaching a different Jesus?

Many of the teachings of Gods son are not listened to by 99% who are told they are in a ( supposed) Christian religion They are being mislead ( 2 cor 11:12-15) their teachings contradict Jesus teachings.

Which teachings are those?

Keep on seeking first the kingdom and his( Jehovah) righteousness, and all these other things will be added.

The Lords prayer--Hallowed be thy name-Father=Jehovah) Kingdom, power and glory all belong to the Father.

John 17:1-6---- while praying to his Father in heaven Jesus calls him--THE ONLY TRUE GOD( verse 3- the one who sent him-John 5:30) and one has to know him( take in knowledge) and know Jesus to get eternal life)-- verse 6 = Jehovah.

1 cor 15:24-28--After Jesus hands back the kingdom( after the millennial reign as Gods appointed king) Jesus will be in subjection to his God and Father.

Jesus teaches us that he has a God-- John 20:17, rev 3:12

Trinity religions all teach to seek Jesus righteousness first--Jesus taught to seek Jehovahs righteousness first. That's obviously the most important thing a mortal can do with their lives if Jesus said it must be first along with seeking the kingdom.
kjw47
Posts: 1,624
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8/15/2013 7:22:11 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 2:18:57 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM, kjw47 wrote:
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15

Christians have no idea what the Truth is and never will in this age, even though I have a few believing Christians who are listening to Him.

in God is NOT the same thing as knowing our Creator like us saints do.

Please teach him to us.
annanicole
Posts: 19,792
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8/15/2013 8:13:13 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
"Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15"

That is a misrepresentation of the passage in the first place - and a bad one. The passage does not mean that the "little mild-tempered, meek, Truman Capote-like people will one day own the earth."

The passage is a kingdom principle - as are all the so-called Beatitudes - in which Jesus is setting forth the characteristics of the people who will be entering His soon-to-be-established kingdom. Likewise, "they who mourn" does not mean the folks who sob and weep and wail at funerals. Jesus was talking to folks who would be among the first citizens of His new kingdom, and is setting forth kingdom principles ... all pointing to Pentecost.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Naysayer
Posts: 746
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8/16/2013 4:51:09 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/15/2013 7:21:13 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 8/14/2013 6:48:19 AM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 7:13:59 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:20:36 PM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM, kjw47 wrote:
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15

I'm going to need some clarification on this. I'm having a hard time understanding what exactly you're trying to say here. What do false apostles have to do with the concept of the meek shall inherit the earth? And you're point is that if they're not meek, they're not Christians?

Are you saying if you preach heaven and hell you're preaching a different Jesus?

Many of the teachings of Gods son are not listened to by 99% who are told they are in a ( supposed) Christian religion They are being mislead ( 2 cor 11:12-15) their teachings contradict Jesus teachings.

Which teachings are those?



Keep on seeking first the kingdom and his( Jehovah) righteousness, and all these other things will be added.

The Lords prayer--Hallowed be thy name-Father=Jehovah) Kingdom, power and glory all belong to the Father.

John 17:1-6---- while praying to his Father in heaven Jesus calls him--THE ONLY TRUE GOD( verse 3- the one who sent him-John 5:30) and one has to know him( take in knowledge) and know Jesus to get eternal life)-- verse 6 = Jehovah.

1 cor 15:24-28--After Jesus hands back the kingdom( after the millennial reign as Gods appointed king) Jesus will be in subjection to his God and Father.

Jesus teaches us that he has a God-- John 20:17, rev 3:12

Trinity religions all teach to seek Jesus righteousness first--Jesus taught to seek Jehovahs righteousness first. That's obviously the most important thing a mortal can do with their lives if Jesus said it must be first along with seeking the kingdom.

So what do you do with Isaiah 9:6?

Isaiah 9:6
For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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8/16/2013 5:36:11 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM, kjw47 wrote:
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15

I agree, since there is nothing "meek" or "mild" about any who teach eternal suffering in an attempt to frighten people into submission. It is not something which fits within the will of God, nor his personality as revealed to us.

However I would not include "heaven" in that test unless by that you mean "heaven for all who do not sin" since we know that scripture limits those who go to heaven to those who will rule with Christ.

However the most important test is John 17:3.

Just how well have they bothered to get to know God and Christ? ()Notice that knowledge of holy spirit ins not included).

Have they really taken the trouble to get to know the true nature and relationship of God and Christ, or simply accepted received doctrine? Christ points out that it is not just important that they do so, but vital to their hope of everlasting life.
MadCornishBiker
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8/16/2013 5:38:34 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/13/2013 6:20:36 PM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM, kjw47 wrote:
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15

I'm going to need some clarification on this. I'm having a hard time understanding what exactly you're trying to say here. What do false apostles have to do with the concept of the meek shall inherit the earth? And you're point is that if they're not meek, they're not Christians?

Are you saying if you preach heaven and hell you're preaching a different Jesus?

No, you are teaching a false Jesus, a counterfeit which is as dangerous to your listeners as is a counterfeit charger for your mobile phone, and even more certain to lead to the death of yourself and those who listen to you.
Naysayer
Posts: 746
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8/16/2013 5:40:42 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/16/2013 5:38:34 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:20:36 PM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM, kjw47 wrote:
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15

I'm going to need some clarification on this. I'm having a hard time understanding what exactly you're trying to say here. What do false apostles have to do with the concept of the meek shall inherit the earth? And you're point is that if they're not meek, they're not Christians?

Are you saying if you preach heaven and hell you're preaching a different Jesus?

No, you are teaching a false Jesus, a counterfeit which is as dangerous to your listeners as is a counterfeit charger for your mobile phone, and even more certain to lead to the death of yourself and those who listen to you.

You're so cute.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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8/16/2013 5:41:05 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 6:48:19 AM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 7:13:59 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:20:36 PM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM, kjw47 wrote:
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15

I'm going to need some clarification on this. I'm having a hard time understanding what exactly you're trying to say here. What do false apostles have to do with the concept of the meek shall inherit the earth? And you're point is that if they're not meek, they're not Christians?

Are you saying if you preach heaven and hell you're preaching a different Jesus?

Many of the teachings of Gods son are not listened to by 99% who are told they are in a ( supposed) Christian religion They are being mislead ( 2 cor 11:12-15) their teachings contradict Jesus teachings.

Which teachings are those?

As Jesus pointed out would be the case, the false teachings are those of the vast majority who claim to follow Christ.

The are the result of the foretold Apostasy which took hold, as forecast, at the end of the 1st century.

Please fell free to request the relevant scriptures if you actually want to know, not just argue.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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8/16/2013 5:45:45 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/15/2013 8:13:13 PM, annanicole wrote:
"Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15"

That is a misrepresentation of the passage in the first place - and a bad one. The passage does not mean that the "little mild-tempered, meek, Truman Capote-like people will one day own the earth."

The passage is a kingdom principle - as are all the so-called Beatitudes - in which Jesus is setting forth the characteristics of the people who will be entering His soon-to-be-established kingdom. Likewise, "they who mourn" does not mean the folks who sob and weep and wail at funerals. Jesus was talking to folks who would be among the first citizens of His new kingdom, and is setting forth kingdom principles ... all pointing to Pentecost.

It misrepresents nothing.

As Jesus said, the "meek shall inherit the earth".

It is also the major sign of those who are guided by holy spirit, a major "fruit ogf the spirit.

Galatians 5:22-24 "On the other hand, the fruitage of the spirit is love, joy, peace, long-suffering, kindness, goodness, faith, 23 mildness, self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Moreover, those who belong to Christ Jesus impaled the flesh together with its passions and desires.

As always it is you who misrepresents scripture.
Naysayer
Posts: 746
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8/16/2013 5:50:07 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/16/2013 5:45:45 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 8/15/2013 8:13:13 PM, annanicole wrote:
"Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15"

That is a misrepresentation of the passage in the first place - and a bad one. The passage does not mean that the "little mild-tempered, meek, Truman Capote-like people will one day own the earth."

The passage is a kingdom principle - as are all the so-called Beatitudes - in which Jesus is setting forth the characteristics of the people who will be entering His soon-to-be-established kingdom. Likewise, "they who mourn" does not mean the folks who sob and weep and wail at funerals. Jesus was talking to folks who would be among the first citizens of His new kingdom, and is setting forth kingdom principles ... all pointing to Pentecost.

It misrepresents nothing.

As Jesus said, the "meek shall inherit the earth".

It is also the major sign of those who are guided by holy spirit, a major "fruit ogf the spirit.

Galatians 5:22-24 "On the other hand, the fruitage of the spirit is love, joy, peace, long-suffering, kindness, goodness, faith, 23 mildness, self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Moreover, those who belong to Christ Jesus impaled the flesh together with its passions and desires.

As always it is you who misrepresents scripture.

I should point out to you that Jesus made a whip and drove the moneychangers out of the temple. Moses was called meek and he killed a guy in anger and lost his opportunity to go to the promised land because he struck the rock in the wilderness.

I don't think we generally quite grasp God's definition of meekness.
Naysayer
Posts: 746
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8/16/2013 5:51:44 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/16/2013 5:41:05 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 8/14/2013 6:48:19 AM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 7:13:59 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:20:36 PM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM, kjw47 wrote:
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15

I'm going to need some clarification on this. I'm having a hard time understanding what exactly you're trying to say here. What do false apostles have to do with the concept of the meek shall inherit the earth? And you're point is that if they're not meek, they're not Christians?

Are you saying if you preach heaven and hell you're preaching a different Jesus?

Many of the teachings of Gods son are not listened to by 99% who are told they are in a ( supposed) Christian religion They are being mislead ( 2 cor 11:12-15) their teachings contradict Jesus teachings.

Which teachings are those?

As Jesus pointed out would be the case, the false teachings are those of the vast majority who claim to follow Christ.

The are the result of the foretold Apostasy which took hold, as forecast, at the end of the 1st century.

Please fell free to request the relevant scriptures if you actually want to know, not just argue.

? I just did?

At 8/14/2013 6:48:19 AM, Naysayer wrote:
Which teachings are those?
Naysayer
Posts: 746
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8/16/2013 5:53:20 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/16/2013 5:41:05 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
As Jesus pointed out would be the case, the false teachings are those of the vast majority who claim to follow Christ.

The are the result of the foretold Apostasy which took hold, as forecast, at the end of the 1st century.

Please fell free to request the relevant scriptures if you actually want to know, not just argue.

I have one more question. Would the foretold Apostasy be those that worshipped down through the years or those that came up with a NEW teaching 1800 years after the church was established?
MadCornishBiker
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8/16/2013 6:07:43 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 6:48:19 AM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 7:13:59 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:20:36 PM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM, kjw47 wrote:
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15

I'm going to need some clarification on this. I'm having a hard time understanding what exactly you're trying to say here. What do false apostles have to do with the concept of the meek shall inherit the earth? And you're point is that if they're not meek, they're not Christians?

Are you saying if you preach heaven and hell you're preaching a different Jesus?

Many of the teachings of Gods son are not listened to by 99% who are told they are in a ( supposed) Christian religion They are being mislead ( 2 cor 11:12-15) their teachings contradict Jesus teachings.

Which teachings are those?

When Jesus was asked which was the most important commandment in the law he actually quoted two:

Deuteronomy 6:5 And you must love Jehovah your God with all your heart and all your soul and all your vital force.

and:

Leviticus 19:18 ""You must not take vengeance nor have a grudge against the sons of your people; and you must love your fellow as yourself. I am Jehovah.

His reply was actually:

Matthew 22:35-40 "And one of them, versed in the Law, asked, testing him: 36 "Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?" 37 He said to him: ""You must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind." 38 This is the greatest and first commandment. 39 The second, like it, is this, "You must love your neighbor as yourself." 40 On these two commandments the whole Law hangs, and the Prophets."

Notice the important that Jesus put on those two laws in his reply, I have highlighted it for you. In other words, if you comply with those two simply laws, you have in effect complied with all the laws and commandments ever passed down to man.

How many faiths do you know who highlight God's self chosen name as Jesus did?

John 17:26 And I have made your name known to them and will make it known, in order that the love with which you loved me may be in them and I in union with them."

Again notice the importance that Jesus puts on those he taught getting to know God's self -chosen name. Again I have highlighted that bit for you.

In fact how many faiths do you know who even use God's name except in its short form as part of the word "hallelujah"?

Even worse, how many faiths do you know who even practice these things let alone teach them? After all, those who teach them, but don't practice them are the worst kind of hypocrites, and are no better than the Pharisees that Jesus so roundly condemned.

I only know of one that does, and we all know which faith that is.

No, finding the true faith is easy. Having the courage to accept it is the hard part.
MadCornishBiker
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8/16/2013 6:12:31 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 2:18:57 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM, kjw47 wrote:
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15

Christians have no idea what the Truth is and never will in this age, even though I have a few believing Christians who are listening to Him.

in God is NOT the same thing as knowing our Creator like us saints do.

I would not be quite so negative, since there is one organisation dedicated to spreading that truth to all who will listen, wherever they may live on this earth.

However people like you who continually work to mislead them are doing no-one any favours, especially yourselves.
Naysayer
Posts: 746
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8/16/2013 6:14:32 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/16/2013 6:07:43 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
When Jesus was asked which was the most important commandment in the law he actually quoted two:

Deuteronomy 6:5 And you must love Jehovah your God with all your heart and all your soul and all your vital force.

and:

Leviticus 19:18 ""You must not take vengeance nor have a grudge against the sons of your people; and you must love your fellow as yourself. I am Jehovah.

His reply was actually:

Matthew 22:35-40 "And one of them, versed in the Law, asked, testing him: 36 "Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?" 37 He said to him: ""You must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind." 38 This is the greatest and first commandment. 39 The second, like it, is this, "You must love your neighbor as yourself." 40 On these two commandments the whole Law hangs, and the Prophets."

Notice the important that Jesus put on those two laws in his reply, I have highlighted it for you. In other words, if you comply with those two simply laws, you have in effect complied with all the laws and commandments ever passed down to man.

How many faiths do you know who highlight God's self chosen name as Jesus did?

John 17:26 And I have made your name known to them and will make it known, in order that the love with which you loved me may be in them and I in union with them."

Again notice the importance that Jesus puts on those he taught getting to know God's self -chosen name. Again I have highlighted that bit for you.

In fact how many faiths do you know who even use God's name except in its short form as part of the word "hallelujah"?

Even worse, how many faiths do you know who even practice these things let alone teach them? After all, those who teach them, but don't practice them are the worst kind of hypocrites, and are no better than the Pharisees that Jesus so roundly condemned.

I only know of one that does, and we all know which faith that is.

No, finding the true faith is easy. Having the courage to accept it is the hard part.

It's not an "in effect" commandment. It's an all inclusive commandment. To fulfill those two commandments would require you to fulfill every single other commandment. The context of that conversation was a young man wanting to follow Jesus. He said he had fulfilled the whole law and Jesus told him to go sell his stuff and join up. His stuff was his god, which broke the commandment to have no other gods before God.

Because he didn't love God with his whole heart, he broke the commandments of God.
MadCornishBiker
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8/16/2013 6:26:57 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/16/2013 4:51:09 AM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/15/2013 7:21:13 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 8/14/2013 6:48:19 AM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 7:13:59 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:20:36 PM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/13/2013 6:03:19 PM, kjw47 wrote:
Apply this simple teaching from Jesus and see if that's what is taught.

The meek( mild tempered) will inherit the earth.

If one is being taught-- heaven or hell as the end-- that religion threw Jesus truth away.- 2 cor 11:12-15

I'm going to need some clarification on this. I'm having a hard time understanding what exactly you're trying to say here. What do false apostles have to do with the concept of the meek shall inherit the earth? And you're point is that if they're not meek, they're not Christians?

Are you saying if you preach heaven and hell you're preaching a different Jesus?

Many of the teachings of Gods son are not listened to by 99% who are told they are in a ( supposed) Christian religion They are being mislead ( 2 cor 11:12-15) their teachings contradict Jesus teachings.

Which teachings are those?



Keep on seeking first the kingdom and his( Jehovah) righteousness, and all these other things will be added.

The Lords prayer--Hallowed be thy name-Father=Jehovah) Kingdom, power and glory all belong to the Father.

John 17:1-6---- while praying to his Father in heaven Jesus calls him--THE ONLY TRUE GOD( verse 3- the one who sent him-John 5:30) and one has to know him( take in knowledge) and know Jesus to get eternal life)-- verse 6 = Jehovah.

1 cor 15:24-28--After Jesus hands back the kingdom( after the millennial reign as Gods appointed king) Jesus will be in subjection to his God and Father.

Jesus teaches us that he has a God-- John 20:17, rev 3:12

Trinity religions all teach to seek Jesus righteousness first--Jesus taught to seek Jehovahs righteousness first. That's obviously the most important thing a mortal can do with their lives if Jesus said it must be first along with seeking the kingdom.

So what do you do with Isaiah 9:6?

Isaiah 9:6
For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

And your point is?

Actually all you have to do with it is actually think about what it is saying and how it is carefully worded, then accept what it is actually saying rather than what received doctrine tries to claim it is saying.

Lets break it down and see shall we?.

Isaiah 9:6:-

" For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: " - Yup very true.

"and the government shall be upon his shoulder:" - Yes, "shall be" you notice, with no indication of when it "shall be" .It will be indeed, but no-one can say it is at present since humans still rule the earth, with Satan as their backer. However God's word never fails so it will happen.

"and his name shall be called Wonderful Counsellor", - Well there never has been a greater teacher than the Christ, and never will be. His teachings, his counsel are perfect because they come from his Father.

"The mighty God" - Yes. however notice it is "Mighty God" not Almighty God, a term reserved for his father only.

"The everlasting Father," - No argument there, after all, God used him to create everything else and so he is and always will be a father to us.

"The Prince of Peace." Again, notice "Prince" not "king". When peace truly rules this earth, after the 1,000 year rule of Christ, and he hands over the kingdom to his Father "Revelation 20), Christ will be a "Prince" not a "King", unless you class him as a vassal king whihc is probably more accurate.

So you see that it really isn't that difficult so long as you actually think about it, and reason on it's wording. Something we all should do rather than simply accept what we are taught, whoever we are taught by.

As scripture tells us we should never simply accept anything without checking it up, and any who ask us to should be viewed as suspect from minute one.
MadCornishBiker
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8/16/2013 6:32:45 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/16/2013 6:14:32 AM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/16/2013 6:07:43 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
When Jesus was asked which was the most important commandment in the law he actually quoted two:

Deuteronomy 6:5 And you must love Jehovah your God with all your heart and all your soul and all your vital force.

and:

Leviticus 19:18 ""You must not take vengeance nor have a grudge against the sons of your people; and you must love your fellow as yourself. I am Jehovah.

His reply was actually:

Matthew 22:35-40 "And one of them, versed in the Law, asked, testing him: 36 "Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?" 37 He said to him: ""You must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind." 38 This is the greatest and first commandment. 39 The second, like it, is this, "You must love your neighbor as yourself." 40 On these two commandments the whole Law hangs, and the Prophets."

Notice the important that Jesus put on those two laws in his reply, I have highlighted it for you. In other words, if you comply with those two simply laws, you have in effect complied with all the laws and commandments ever passed down to man.

How many faiths do you know who highlight God's self chosen name as Jesus did?

John 17:26 And I have made your name known to them and will make it known, in order that the love with which you loved me may be in them and I in union with them."

Again notice the importance that Jesus puts on those he taught getting to know God's self -chosen name. Again I have highlighted that bit for you.

In fact how many faiths do you know who even use God's name except in its short form as part of the word "hallelujah"?

Even worse, how many faiths do you know who even practice these things let alone teach them? After all, those who teach them, but don't practice them are the worst kind of hypocrites, and are no better than the Pharisees that Jesus so roundly condemned.

I only know of one that does, and we all know which faith that is.

No, finding the true faith is easy. Having the courage to accept it is the hard part.

It's not an "in effect" commandment. It's an all inclusive commandment. To fulfill those two commandments would require you to fulfill every single other commandment. The context of that conversation was a young man wanting to follow Jesus. He said he had fulfilled the whole law and Jesus told him to go sell his stuff and join up. His stuff was his god, which broke the commandment to have no other gods before God.

Because he didn't love God with his whole heart, he broke the commandments of God.

You have it completely back to front., If you fulfil those two you have fulfilled them all in spirit, in principle, you do not need to fulfil the letter of them all, in order to fulfil those two.

In fact God has made absolutely sure that it is impossible to fulfil every single commandment in the law soi if you adhere to law you are automatically condemning yourself.

The law is only in force ion principle now and those two commandments fulfil the whole of the law, in principle. If you adhere to those two you have no need of a written code.

God and Christ have clearly demonstrated the futility of a rigid law code, and that is one thing the Mosaic Law code was created to teach us.

Adam and Eve only had one law to obey. We now have two, which in truth are really only one, since you cannot comply with the one without also complying with the other.
Naysayer
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8/16/2013 6:34:14 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/16/2013 6:26:57 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
And your point is?

Actually all you have to do with it is actually think about what it is saying and how it is carefully worded, then accept what it is actually saying rather than what received doctrine tries to claim it is saying.

Lets break it down and see shall we?.

Isaiah 9:6:-

" For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: " - Yup very true.

"and the government shall be upon his shoulder:" - Yes, "shall be" you notice, with no indication of when it "shall be" .It will be indeed, but no-one can say it is at present since humans still rule the earth, with Satan as their backer. However God's word never fails so it will happen.

"and his name shall be called Wonderful Counsellor", - Well there never has been a greater teacher than the Christ, and never will be. His teachings, his counsel are perfect because they come from his Father.

"The mighty God" - Yes. however notice it is "Mighty God" not Almighty God, a term reserved for his father only.

"The everlasting Father," - No argument there, after all, God used him to create everything else and so he is and always will be a father to us.

"The Prince of Peace." Again, notice "Prince" not "king". When peace truly rules this earth, after the 1,000 year rule of Christ, and he hands over the kingdom to his Father "Revelation 20), Christ will be a "Prince" not a "King", unless you class him as a vassal king whihc is probably more accurate.

So you see that it really isn't that difficult so long as you actually think about it, and reason on it's wording. Something we all should do rather than simply accept what we are taught, whoever we are taught by.

As scripture tells us we should never simply accept anything without checking it up, and any who ask us to should be viewed as suspect from minute one.

You are correct sir. Which is why I submit to you Matthew 23:9
And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

One Father. Again, we're back to a trinity.
MadCornishBiker
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8/16/2013 6:39:16 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/16/2013 5:53:20 AM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/16/2013 5:41:05 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
As Jesus pointed out would be the case, the false teachings are those of the vast majority who claim to follow Christ.

The are the result of the foretold Apostasy which took hold, as forecast, at the end of the 1st century.

Please fell free to request the relevant scriptures if you actually want to know, not just argue.

I have one more question. Would the foretold Apostasy be those that worshipped down through the years or those that came up with a NEW teaching 1800 years after the church was established?

Any "new" teaching is by definition a part of that Apostasy. Only the original teachings of Christ and God are true teachings. That is why Jehovah's Witnesses stick closely to those teachings, as closely as is humanly possible.

Even the teachings of Christ were not truly New, though they were something of a reversion to the Patriarchal times, pre Mosaic law.

True Jehovah's Witnesses have explained the teaching more clearly than they have been for 1800 years or so, but there really is not one new teaching amongst them.

Even the date 1914, which does not originate with the Jehovah's Witnesses anyway, was written in scripture centuries before Christ, it is just that it was not understood.

God releases understandings as and when He wants them understood, not before, nor after. After all he does not want Satan to understand too much too soon does He.
MadCornishBiker
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8/16/2013 6:46:34 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/16/2013 6:34:14 AM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/16/2013 6:26:57 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
And your point is?

Actually all you have to do with it is actually think about what it is saying and how it is carefully worded, then accept what it is actually saying rather than what received doctrine tries to claim it is saying.

Lets break it down and see shall we?.

Isaiah 9:6:-

" For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: " - Yup very true.

"and the government shall be upon his shoulder:" - Yes, "shall be" you notice, with no indication of when it "shall be" .It will be indeed, but no-one can say it is at present since humans still rule the earth, with Satan as their backer. However God's word never fails so it will happen.

"and his name shall be called Wonderful Counsellor", - Well there never has been a greater teacher than the Christ, and never will be. His teachings, his counsel are perfect because they come from his Father.

"The mighty God" - Yes. however notice it is "Mighty God" not Almighty God, a term reserved for his father only.

"The everlasting Father," - No argument there, after all, God used him to create everything else and so he is and always will be a father to us.

"The Prince of Peace." Again, notice "Prince" not "king". When peace truly rules this earth, after the 1,000 year rule of Christ, and he hands over the kingdom to his Father "Revelation 20), Christ will be a "Prince" not a "King", unless you class him as a vassal king whihc is probably more accurate.

So you see that it really isn't that difficult so long as you actually think about it, and reason on it's wording. Something we all should do rather than simply accept what we are taught, whoever we are taught by.

As scripture tells us we should never simply accept anything without checking it up, and any who ask us to should be viewed as suspect from minute one.

You are correct sir. Which is why I submit to you Matthew 23:9
And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

One Father. Again, we're back to a trinity.

Yes, and back to it's being a fallacy. It is easy to come up with scripture that could indicate the possibility of a trinity, however one has to understand how those scriptures were meant and that then completely removes the possibility of a trinity, as do so many other scriptures.

Again I say, we need to meditate reason on scripture, not just accept what someone tells us. once we do that any thought of a trinity slowly but surely evaporates.
Sometimes not even slowly, lol.

God is our ultimate father, even though we do have others, in other senses. However Jesus is teaching us to recognise that even our other fathers, including himself, we owe to the original Father of all.

That scripture is intended to be understood in the same light as the one where Jesus tells us we must hate our mother and father. Neither, obviously, can be literal since that would contradict so much of Jesus' teaching, so therefore they must be comparative.
Naysayer
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8/16/2013 6:53:36 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/16/2013 6:32:45 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

You have it completely back to front., If you fulfil those two you have fulfilled them all in spirit, in principle, you do not need to fulfil the letter of them all, in order to fulfil those two.

In fact God has made absolutely sure that it is impossible to fulfil every single commandment in the law soi if you adhere to law you are automatically condemning yourself.

The law is only in force ion principle now and those two commandments fulfil the whole of the law, in principle. If you adhere to those two you have no need of a written code.

God and Christ have clearly demonstrated the futility of a rigid law code, and that is one thing the Mosaic Law code was created to teach us.

Adam and Eve only had one law to obey. We now have two, which in truth are really only one, since you cannot comply with the one without also complying with the other.

It is futile because of the weakness of the flesh, not because of the law. The law is perfect. The law wasn't meant to be an approximate thing. It was meant to be absolute because it was mean to break us and bring us to Christ as in Galatians 3.

If you walk around with the idea that the law is an approximation, that God "knows our heart" then you will have no fear of God. And God does know our hearts. The heart of man is deceitful above all things and desperately wicked. God gave us the law so that we could know him and fear him.

And before you say we don't have to fear God, the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom AND knowledge. And some people need a healthy fear of their condemnation to get saved.

Jude 22-23:
22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:
23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.

That's the law.
Naysayer
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8/16/2013 6:54:54 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/16/2013 6:46:34 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

Yes, and back to it's being a fallacy. It is easy to come up with scripture that could indicate the possibility of a trinity, however one has to understand how those scriptures were meant and that then completely removes the possibility of a trinity, as do so many other scriptures.

Again I say, we need to meditate reason on scripture, not just accept what someone tells us. once we do that any thought of a trinity slowly but surely evaporates.
Sometimes not even slowly, lol.

God is our ultimate father, even though we do have others, in other senses. However Jesus is teaching us to recognise that even our other fathers, including himself, we owe to the original Father of all.

That scripture is intended to be understood in the same light as the one where Jesus tells us we must hate our mother and father. Neither, obviously, can be literal since that would contradict so much of Jesus' teaching, so therefore they must be comparative.

So the only way to get to your understanding of the Bible is to not believe the Bible.
bulproof
Posts: 25,303
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8/16/2013 7:02:23 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/16/2013 6:53:36 AM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/16/2013 6:32:45 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

You have it completely back to front., If you fulfil those two you have fulfilled them all in spirit, in principle, you do not need to fulfil the letter of them all, in order to fulfil those two.

In fact God has made absolutely sure that it is impossible to fulfil every single commandment in the law soi if you adhere to law you are automatically condemning yourself.

The law is only in force ion principle now and those two commandments fulfil the whole of the law, in principle. If you adhere to those two you have no need of a written code.

God and Christ have clearly demonstrated the futility of a rigid law code, and that is one thing the Mosaic Law code was created to teach us.

Adam and Eve only had one law to obey. We now have two, which in truth are really only one, since you cannot comply with the one without also complying with the other.

It is futile because of the weakness of the flesh, not because of the law. The law is perfect. The law wasn't meant to be an approximate thing. It was meant to be absolute because it was mean to break us and bring us to Christ as in Galatians 3.

If you walk around with the idea that the law is an approximation, that God "knows our heart" then you will have no fear of God. And God does know our hearts. The heart of man is deceitful above all things and desperately wicked. God gave us the law so that we could know him and fear him.

And before you say we don't have to fear God, the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom AND knowledge. And some people need a healthy fear of their condemnation to get saved.

Jude 22-23:
22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:
23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.

That's the law.

So I am lost, I mean I wasn't even scared of the boogieman when I was a littlun. So if I need to fear this big daddy dude so that I can live with it forever WHY THE FVCK WOULD I??????
Naysayer
Posts: 746
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8/16/2013 7:03:24 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/16/2013 7:02:23 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/16/2013 6:53:36 AM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/16/2013 6:32:45 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

You have it completely back to front., If you fulfil those two you have fulfilled them all in spirit, in principle, you do not need to fulfil the letter of them all, in order to fulfil those two.

In fact God has made absolutely sure that it is impossible to fulfil every single commandment in the law soi if you adhere to law you are automatically condemning yourself.

The law is only in force ion principle now and those two commandments fulfil the whole of the law, in principle. If you adhere to those two you have no need of a written code.

God and Christ have clearly demonstrated the futility of a rigid law code, and that is one thing the Mosaic Law code was created to teach us.

Adam and Eve only had one law to obey. We now have two, which in truth are really only one, since you cannot comply with the one without also complying with the other.

It is futile because of the weakness of the flesh, not because of the law. The law is perfect. The law wasn't meant to be an approximate thing. It was meant to be absolute because it was mean to break us and bring us to Christ as in Galatians 3.

If you walk around with the idea that the law is an approximation, that God "knows our heart" then you will have no fear of God. And God does know our hearts. The heart of man is deceitful above all things and desperately wicked. God gave us the law so that we could know him and fear him.

And before you say we don't have to fear God, the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom AND knowledge. And some people need a healthy fear of their condemnation to get saved.

Jude 22-23:
22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:
23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.

That's the law.

So I am lost, I mean I wasn't even scared of the boogieman when I was a littlun. So if I need to fear this big daddy dude so that I can live with it forever WHY THE FVCK WOULD I??????

I already told you. My job is to tell you. What you do with it is your decision. But it is a decision.
bulproof
Posts: 25,303
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8/16/2013 7:08:46 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/16/2013 7:03:24 AM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/16/2013 7:02:23 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/16/2013 6:53:36 AM, Naysayer wrote:
At 8/16/2013 6:32:45 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

You have it completely back to front., If you fulfil those two you have fulfilled them all in spirit, in principle, you do not need to fulfil the letter of them all, in order to fulfil those two.

In fact God has made absolutely sure that it is impossible to fulfil every single commandment in the law soi if you adhere to law you are automatically condemning yourself.

The law is only in force ion principle now and those two commandments fulfil the whole of the law, in principle. If you adhere to those two you have no need of a written code.

God and Christ have clearly demonstrated the futility of a rigid law code, and that is one thing the Mosaic Law code was created to teach us.

Adam and Eve only had one law to obey. We now have two, which in truth are really only one, since you cannot comply with the one without also complying with the other.

It is futile because of the weakness of the flesh, not because of the law. The law is perfect. The law wasn't meant to be an approximate thing. It was meant to be absolute because it was mean to break us and bring us to Christ as in Galatians 3.

If you walk around with the idea that the law is an approximation, that God "knows our heart" then you will have no fear of God. And God does know our hearts. The heart of man is deceitful above all things and desperately wicked. God gave us the law so that we could know him and fear him.

And before you say we don't have to fear God, the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom AND knowledge. And some people need a healthy fear of their condemnation to get saved.

Jude 22-23:
22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:
23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.

That's the law.

So I am lost, I mean I wasn't even scared of the boogieman when I was a littlun. So if I need to fear this big daddy dude so that I can live with it forever WHY THE FVCK WOULD I??????

I already told you. My job is to tell you. What you do with it is your decision. But it is a decision.
Yes my decision is to reject mans claim of god/s.