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Atheists Vs. Christians? Why? Your thoughts?

oldman1990
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9/17/2013 9:24:15 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Is it necessary for Christians to attack Atheists and Atheists to attack Christians?
Why is it that either side cannot let the other have their own opinion or belief?
If I believe differently than you why can't CIVILITY rule us as I listen to what you believe and you I? Am I alone in believing that we can get along? Over generalizations make it so that we judge each other automatically once you state your stance. Not all Christians or Atheists are created equal. They don't have a strict belief and mindset all share.
What are your thoughts?
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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9/17/2013 9:58:52 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Your book says You should kill me. That's a pretty big problem, right from the get go.

Generally speaking, I'm all for civility. But things get heated when we're dealing with deeply held beliefs. People get very defensive, and tend to lash out. This, in turn, tends to beget aggression.
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
AeneasPhebe
Posts: 213
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9/17/2013 10:10:36 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 9:24:15 PM, oldman1990 wrote:
Is it necessary for Christians to attack Atheists and Atheists to attack Christians?

I cannot speak for atheist because I am not one but Christians should not be attacking anyone with disbelief or of another religion. They should only correct or rebuke fellow Christians.

Why is it that either side cannot let the other have their own opinion or belief?

IDK why others do not but as for me I cannot stop someone from their beliefs. You can believe anything you want and it effects me none.

If I believe differently than you why can't CIVILITY rule us as I listen to what you believe and you I?

I think it is that you believe what you want and will not change, I hope I am wrong. As for me I know I will not ever change my belief.

Am I alone in believing that we can get along?

No, sure we can get along.

Over generalizations make it so that we judge each other automatically once you state your stance. Not all Christians or Atheists are created equal. They don't have a strict belief and mindset all share.

We should not judge anyone personally but their actions they display. But judging is needed to determine right and wrong, justice verses injustice.

What are your thoughts?

Seems fairly reasonable.
AeneasPhebe
Posts: 213
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9/17/2013 10:15:16 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 9:58:52 PM, muzebreak wrote:

Your book says You should kill me.

By book I am assuming you mean the Bible. Well that is just plain nonsense. The Bible in fact suggest the opposite. Your statement displays the unknowing of what the Bible is actually saying and the storyline in it. I can help you with that.

That's a pretty big problem, right from the get go.

It would not be if you knew what it actually is saying.
Mysteryskull
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9/17/2013 10:20:07 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Atheists need to get over their unfounded sense superiority. Just because they believe in a different set of unverifiable claims about the beginning of life doesn't make them any better then religion.
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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9/17/2013 10:22:23 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 10:15:16 PM, AeneasPhebe wrote:
At 9/17/2013 9:58:52 PM, muzebreak wrote:

Your book says You should kill me.

By book I am assuming you mean the Bible. Well that is just plain nonsense. The Bible in fact suggest the opposite. Your statement displays the unknowing of what the Bible is actually saying and the storyline in it. I can help you with that.

That's a pretty big problem, right from the get go.

It would not be if you knew what it actually is saying.


"If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers; Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you ... Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him: But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die." -- Dt.13:6-10
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
oldman1990
Posts: 3
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9/17/2013 10:23:46 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I don't remember where in the Bible it says 'Thou shalt kill the non believers." Please if i've missed it show me. I'm still learning in this world of ours.
i understand that people lash out. Those are the ones i as a follower of Christ don't understand. I have deep ruted faith in something. I'll defend it, but i don't see the need to ram it down someones throat.

"
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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9/17/2013 10:29:15 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 10:23:46 PM, oldman1990 wrote:
I don't remember where in the Bible it says 'Thou shalt kill the non believers." Please if i've missed it show me. I'm still learning in this world of ours.
i understand that people lash out. Those are the ones i as a follower of Christ don't understand. I have deep ruted faith in something. I'll defend it, but i don't see the need to ram it down someones throat.

"

I posted it right above this.
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
zmikecuber
Posts: 4,093
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9/17/2013 10:29:39 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 9:58:52 PM, muzebreak wrote:
Your book says You should kill me. That's a pretty big problem, right from the get go.


Not sure where in the Bible it says that. Also, the Bible can be pretty confusing at times and isn't always that clear.

Furthermore... even if it did... so what? I mean from a naturalistic atheistic point of view, how is there anything "immoral" with that? I understand you might not desire it, but I don't see how that's, objectively speaking, "a pretty big problem".
"Delete your fvcking sig" -1hard

"primal man had the habit, when he came into contact with fire, of satisfying the infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine... Putting out the fire by micturating was therefore a kind of sexual act with a male, an enjoyment of sexual potency in a homosexual competition."
zmikecuber
Posts: 4,093
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9/17/2013 10:30:54 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Oh now I see what you're quoting. Sorry, missed that. Yeah, Mosaic law was pretty strict. Not arguing with you there. Lots of crimes were answerable with death. However, Christians aren't obliged to follow Mosaic law.
"Delete your fvcking sig" -1hard

"primal man had the habit, when he came into contact with fire, of satisfying the infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine... Putting out the fire by micturating was therefore a kind of sexual act with a male, an enjoyment of sexual potency in a homosexual competition."
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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9/17/2013 10:31:03 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 10:26:59 PM, oldman1990 wrote:
Jesus said let you without sin cast the first stone.

Pointing out an inconsistency in what your bible tells you is not a valid argument....
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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9/17/2013 10:32:56 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 10:29:39 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 9/17/2013 9:58:52 PM, muzebreak wrote:
Your book says You should kill me. That's a pretty big problem, right from the get go.


Not sure where in the Bible it says that. Also, the Bible can be pretty confusing at times and isn't always that clear.

Furthermore... even if it did... so what? I mean from a naturalistic atheistic point of view, how is there anything "immoral" with that? I understand you might not desire it, but I don't see how that's, objectively speaking, "a pretty big problem".

Who said anything about objectivity? I apply my own subjective morality.
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
zmikecuber
Posts: 4,093
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9/17/2013 10:33:43 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 10:32:56 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:29:39 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 9/17/2013 9:58:52 PM, muzebreak wrote:
Your book says You should kill me. That's a pretty big problem, right from the get go.


Not sure where in the Bible it says that. Also, the Bible can be pretty confusing at times and isn't always that clear.

Furthermore... even if it did... so what? I mean from a naturalistic atheistic point of view, how is there anything "immoral" with that? I understand you might not desire it, but I don't see how that's, objectively speaking, "a pretty big problem".

Who said anything about objectivity? I apply my own subjective morality.

Well then there really is nothing wrong with it per se. You just happen to not like it.
"Delete your fvcking sig" -1hard

"primal man had the habit, when he came into contact with fire, of satisfying the infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine... Putting out the fire by micturating was therefore a kind of sexual act with a male, an enjoyment of sexual potency in a homosexual competition."
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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9/17/2013 10:35:20 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 10:30:54 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
Oh now I see what you're quoting. Sorry, missed that. Yeah, Mosaic law was pretty strict. Not arguing with you there. Lots of crimes were answerable with death. However, Christians aren't obliged to follow Mosaic law.

Why not?
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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9/17/2013 10:37:09 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 10:33:43 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:32:56 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:29:39 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 9/17/2013 9:58:52 PM, muzebreak wrote:
Your book says You should kill me. That's a pretty big problem, right from the get go.


Not sure where in the Bible it says that. Also, the Bible can be pretty confusing at times and isn't always that clear.

Furthermore... even if it did... so what? I mean from a naturalistic atheistic point of view, how is there anything "immoral" with that? I understand you might not desire it, but I don't see how that's, objectively speaking, "a pretty big problem".

Who said anything about objectivity? I apply my own subjective morality.

Well then there really is nothing wrong with it per se. You just happen to not like it.

That depends how you define wrong. If you choose the definition of wrong that means that killing me isn't wrong, then good for you. But you wont be living the main stream population for much longer with that attitude.
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
zmikecuber
Posts: 4,093
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9/17/2013 10:38:17 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 10:35:20 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:30:54 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
Oh now I see what you're quoting. Sorry, missed that. Yeah, Mosaic law was pretty strict. Not arguing with you there. Lots of crimes were answerable with death. However, Christians aren't obliged to follow Mosaic law.

Why not?

Because they don't apply nowadays. It's like for the same reason Christians don't have to get circumcised and can't eat pork. While the morality of certain things may remain from old testament to new testament, the contingent punishments or laws can change.
"Delete your fvcking sig" -1hard

"primal man had the habit, when he came into contact with fire, of satisfying the infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine... Putting out the fire by micturating was therefore a kind of sexual act with a male, an enjoyment of sexual potency in a homosexual competition."
zmikecuber
Posts: 4,093
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9/17/2013 10:39:47 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 10:37:09 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:33:43 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:32:56 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:29:39 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 9/17/2013 9:58:52 PM, muzebreak wrote:
Your book says You should kill me. That's a pretty big problem, right from the get go.


Not sure where in the Bible it says that. Also, the Bible can be pretty confusing at times and isn't always that clear.

Furthermore... even if it did... so what? I mean from a naturalistic atheistic point of view, how is there anything "immoral" with that? I understand you might not desire it, but I don't see how that's, objectively speaking, "a pretty big problem".

Who said anything about objectivity? I apply my own subjective morality.

Well then there really is nothing wrong with it per se. You just happen to not like it.

That depends how you define wrong. If you choose the definition of wrong that means that killing me isn't wrong, then good for you. But you wont be living the main stream population for much longer with that attitude.

"Wrong" meaning "immoral". Actions which in their nature human beings ought to avoid.

From a naturalistic/atheistic point of view, there's no reasons to believe that murder is "immoral" or "moral". It's neither, since morality doesn't exist.
"Delete your fvcking sig" -1hard

"primal man had the habit, when he came into contact with fire, of satisfying the infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine... Putting out the fire by micturating was therefore a kind of sexual act with a male, an enjoyment of sexual potency in a homosexual competition."
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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9/17/2013 10:41:22 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 10:38:17 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:35:20 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:30:54 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
Oh now I see what you're quoting. Sorry, missed that. Yeah, Mosaic law was pretty strict. Not arguing with you there. Lots of crimes were answerable with death. However, Christians aren't obliged to follow Mosaic law.

Why not?

Because they don't apply nowadays. It's like for the same reason Christians don't have to get circumcised and can't eat pork. While the morality of certain things may remain from old testament to new testament, the contingent punishments or laws can change.

As far as I'm aware, exceptions to mosaic law were never made for any of those things. A simple 'because they don't apply nowadays' is absurd. How much more arbitrary could you get? Do the rules against eating shellfish and wearing two types of cloth still apply today? Because they're not part of mosaic law, but Christians still don't follow them.

Either give me some biblical precedence, or face the fact that you cherry pick what you follow from the bible.
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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9/17/2013 10:43:03 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 10:39:47 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:37:09 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:33:43 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:32:56 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:29:39 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 9/17/2013 9:58:52 PM, muzebreak wrote:
Your book says You should kill me. That's a pretty big problem, right from the get go.


Not sure where in the Bible it says that. Also, the Bible can be pretty confusing at times and isn't always that clear.

Furthermore... even if it did... so what? I mean from a naturalistic atheistic point of view, how is there anything "immoral" with that? I understand you might not desire it, but I don't see how that's, objectively speaking, "a pretty big problem".

Who said anything about objectivity? I apply my own subjective morality.

Well then there really is nothing wrong with it per se. You just happen to not like it.

That depends how you define wrong. If you choose the definition of wrong that means that killing me isn't wrong, then good for you. But you wont be living the main stream population for much longer with that attitude.

"Wrong" meaning "immoral". Actions which in their nature human beings ought to avoid.

From a naturalistic/atheistic point of view, there's no reasons to believe that murder is "immoral" or "moral". It's neither, since morality doesn't exist.

Under the standards and definitions of moral, immoral, and morality, that you subscribe to, maybe this is true.

Under mine, that's not so.

We have such a fundamental disagreement here, that conversation on it is moot.
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
AeneasPhebe
Posts: 213
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9/17/2013 10:52:27 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 10:22:23 PM, muzebreak wrote:

"If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers; Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you ... Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him: But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die." -- Dt.13:6-10

Are you enticing me secretly to serve another God?

First you miss that as our law of the land as people stands there is a law of God. His justice stands as we want ours too. Forsaking His law requires life. He gave the life and takes it when that life forsakes Him and His law. Now, in the Old Testament which you quoted required man to give His life or to offer a animal sacrifice to appese that broken Law or God's wrath will rain down on all people of that land. God gave the proper animal sacrifices in His commandments of Law to Moses and Joesph. As we seen God shed a animal to cloth Adam and Eve for their sin. He required life for the forsaking of Law. His Law is divine and a great price was required in breaking it. In the Old Testament you are right that people must be stoned to death for the breaking of Law or they were killed in other manners as well, EX. war. That was the reason for Christ, He paid that blood sacrifice for all men. He was perfect, He was God, and could pay that price for all. Since He did then no one need to die or sacrifice anymore because he was enough for all time. So, we do not kill or sacrifice anymore because of Him. We are now to live in love and with peace because we are saved from sin, those who believe. It is against the Law now to kill or sacrifice anymore. I hope you understand that some what.
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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9/17/2013 11:06:23 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 10:52:27 PM, AeneasPhebe wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:22:23 PM, muzebreak wrote:

"If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers; Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you ... Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him: But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die." -- Dt.13:6-10

Are you enticing me secretly to serve another God?

First you miss that as our law of the land as people stands there is a law of God. His justice stands as we want ours too. Forsaking His law requires life. He gave the life and takes it when that life forsakes Him and His law. Now, in the Old Testament which you quoted required man to give His life or to offer a animal sacrifice to appese that broken Law or God's wrath will rain down on all people of that land. God gave the proper animal sacrifices in His commandments of Law to Moses and Joesph. As we seen God shed a animal to cloth Adam and Eve for their sin. He required life for the forsaking of Law. His Law is divine and a great price was required in breaking it. In the Old Testament you are right that people must be stoned to death for the breaking of Law or they were killed in other manners as well, EX. war. That was the reason for Christ, He paid that blood sacrifice for all men. He was perfect, He was God, and could pay that price for all. Since He did then no one need to die or sacrifice anymore because he was enough for all time. So, we do not kill or sacrifice anymore because of Him. We are now to live in love and with peace because we are saved from sin, those who believe. It is against the Law now to kill or sacrifice anymore. I hope you understand that some what.

Jesus's sacrifice did away with the sacrificial law, that is true. But the sacrificial law was to do with animal sacrifices due for acts of sin. Not laws that required murder. Jesus's sacrifice did away with the old covenant, which required animal sacrifice, and brought in the new covenant, which did not.
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
AeneasPhebe
Posts: 213
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9/17/2013 11:16:01 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 11:06:23 PM, muzebreak wrote:

Jesus's sacrifice did away with the sacrificial law, that is true. But the sacrificial law was to do with animal sacrifices due for acts of sin. Not laws that required murder. Jesus's sacrifice did away with the old covenant, which required animal sacrifice, and brought in the new covenant, which did not.

Incorrect. The Law required the violater(the person) to pay with death, "the wages of sin is death." The animal waged no sin, the purpose of the animal was to offer a repreave to man for their own sin. That is why specific animals were required, ones pure to God. Therefore, the Law of God required death to the sinner and God gave the Law to Moses which gave proper sacrifices that men could do instead of themselves. Why do you think that preist who went into the alter room where the ark was died if they had not cleansed their sin by sacrifice? Because to be among God you are required to cleanse all sin. Your statement above makes no sense, why kill the animal unless it had a purpose of repreave?
DeFool
Posts: 626
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9/18/2013 12:09:54 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 9:24:15 PM, oldman1990 wrote:
Is it necessary for Christians to attack Atheists and Atheists to attack Christians?
Why is it that either side cannot let the other have their own opinion or belief?
If I believe differently than you why can't CIVILITY rule us as I listen to what you believe and you I? Am I alone in believing that we can get along? Over generalizations make it so that we judge each other automatically once you state your stance. Not all Christians or Atheists are created equal. They don't have a strict belief and mindset all share.
What are your thoughts?

The shocking evil of Christianity does not allow coexistence. Close to my mind are the horrors of Christian action: the Holocaust, the Inquisition, the Iraq War. This condition is not unique to Christian-inspired terror; it also applies to Islam and Judaism, as well.
seeu46
Posts: 578
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9/18/2013 12:28:45 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 10:22:23 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:15:16 PM, AeneasPhebe wrote:
At 9/17/2013 9:58:52 PM, muzebreak wrote:

Your book says You should kill me.

By book I am assuming you mean the Bible. Well that is just plain nonsense. The Bible in fact suggest the opposite. Your statement displays the unknowing of what the Bible is actually saying and the storyline in it. I can help you with that.

That's a pretty big problem, right from the get go.

It would not be if you knew what it actually is saying.


"If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers; Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you ... Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him: But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die." -- Dt.13:6-10

Christians go by what Jesus Christ taught and his actions as he is our Lord and Savior. Not there governing laws or there ways during war time/conquests in the OT.
bulproof
Posts: 25,303
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9/18/2013 2:25:18 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/18/2013 12:28:45 AM, seeu46 wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:22:23 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:15:16 PM, AeneasPhebe wrote:
At 9/17/2013 9:58:52 PM, muzebreak wrote:

Your book says You should kill me.

By book I am assuming you mean the Bible. Well that is just plain nonsense. The Bible in fact suggest the opposite. Your statement displays the unknowing of what the Bible is actually saying and the storyline in it. I can help you with that.

That's a pretty big problem, right from the get go.

It would not be if you knew what it actually is saying.


"If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers; Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you ... Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him: But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die." -- Dt.13:6-10

Christians go by what Jesus Christ taught and his actions as he is our Lord and Savior. Not there governing laws or there ways during war time/conquests in the OT.
I like the way they use the OT to demonize same sex marriage but then deny they have any obligation to follow the OT when it just doesn't suit them. hahahaha, Eating oysters is an abomination before god, where is that law repealed?
muzebreak
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9/18/2013 6:40:11 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 11:16:01 PM, AeneasPhebe wrote:
At 9/17/2013 11:06:23 PM, muzebreak wrote:

Jesus's sacrifice did away with the sacrificial law, that is true. But the sacrificial law was to do with animal sacrifices due for acts of sin. Not laws that required murder. Jesus's sacrifice did away with the old covenant, which required animal sacrifice, and brought in the new covenant, which did not.

Incorrect. The Law required the violater(the person) to pay with death, "the wages of sin is death." The animal waged no sin, the purpose of the animal was to offer a repreave to man for their own sin. That is why specific animals were required, ones pure to God. Therefore, the Law of God required death to the sinner and God gave the Law to Moses which gave proper sacrifices that men could do instead of themselves. Why do you think that preist who went into the alter room where the ark was died if they had not cleansed their sin by sacrifice? Because to be among God you are required to cleanse all sin. Your statement above makes no sense, why kill the animal unless it had a purpose of repreave?

I'm sorry, what?

I think there's been a misunderstanding here, because that doesn't look like a correction to me. It looks like you expounding on what I was saying.
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
muzebreak
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9/18/2013 6:42:29 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/18/2013 12:28:45 AM, seeu46 wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:22:23 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 9/17/2013 10:15:16 PM, AeneasPhebe wrote:
At 9/17/2013 9:58:52 PM, muzebreak wrote:

Your book says You should kill me.

By book I am assuming you mean the Bible. Well that is just plain nonsense. The Bible in fact suggest the opposite. Your statement displays the unknowing of what the Bible is actually saying and the storyline in it. I can help you with that.

That's a pretty big problem, right from the get go.

It would not be if you knew what it actually is saying.


"If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers; Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you ... Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him: But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die." -- Dt.13:6-10

Christians go by what Jesus Christ taught and his actions as he is our Lord and Savior. Not there governing laws or there ways during war time/conquests in the OT.

In other words "My bible has contradictory descriptions of how I should live my life, so I choose to follow the one that won't get me sent to jail, but I don't really follow that one either.".
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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9/18/2013 7:18:23 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 9:24:15 PM, oldman1990 wrote:
Is it necessary for Christians to attack Atheists and Atheists to attack Christians?

Yes.

Why is it that either side cannot let the other have their own opinion or belief?

Because one side has elimination of the other ingrained into its dogma.

If I believe differently than you why can't CIVILITY rule us as I listen to what you believe and you I? Am I alone in believing that we can get along? Over generalizations make it so that we judge each other automatically once you state your stance. Not all Christians or Atheists are created equal. They don't have a strict belief and mindset all share.
What are your thoughts?

My thoughts is that a religion group can't systematically engage in horrific acts over thousands of years and attempt to get the rest of the word to submit to its ideology and then, when it fails to do so and its influence starts to wain, all of a sudden throw up its hands and go "Let's just let bygones be bygones!"
drafterman
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9/18/2013 7:19:37 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 9/17/2013 10:30:54 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
Oh now I see what you're quoting. Sorry, missed that. Yeah, Mosaic law was pretty strict. Not arguing with you there. Lots of crimes were answerable with death. However, Christians aren't obliged to follow Mosaic law.

The irrational hatred of different sexual orientations suggests otherwise.