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How many wives does Jesus allow?

GreatestIam
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10/23/2013 10:00:21 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Part one.

How many wives does Jesus allow?

One or many?

The O.T. that Jesus often quoted allows many wives.

The N. T does not speak against polygamy from what I can see but does promote slavery and tradition says that that would be sex out of marriage. Unless you see Christian slave owners acting differently than the usual slave owner.

How many wives does you particular branch of Christianity or Catholicism and Jesus allow?

Muslims also have a great respect for Jesus and they allow many wives. Should they?

I know that most will say one wife is the ideal. That does not explain why scriptures support the notion of more than one, --- so I would like to hear your opinion as to ----- why not many wives?

If women are to be equal, should they be allowed as many husbands as the men are allowed in wives?

Just so you know, I have only the one wife and do not think I would want more than one,--- but in the Muslin sense, --- would partially accept one, as a duty to her and the tribe, so to speak, --- and would not likely have a real husband type of relation (sexual), with her.

----------------------------------------

Part two.

Along with marriage often time comes divorce.

Jesus basically had a no divorce policy. Let no man put asunder.

Even as he acknowledged that Moses had changed the law thanks to the hard hearts of men.

I see that as an anti-love policy and since more than 60% of Christians divorce, most Christians seem to agree.

Do you?

Regards
DL
1Devilsadvocate
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10/24/2013 1:06:33 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
This is funny and annoying at the same time, I think DDO's been hacked.
I cannot write in English, because of the treacherous spelling. When I am reading, I only hear it and am unable to remember what the written word looks like."
"Albert Einstein

http://www.twainquotes.com... , http://thewritecorner.wordpress.com... , http://www.onlinecollegecourses.com...
Fruitytree
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10/25/2013 4:26:49 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Women aren't equal to men, each have their function, and in religions each is treated according to their gender..

Polygyny is good as long as the man can handle more than a wife without oppressing any, it's not for everybody..

Women aren't allowed to have more than a husband at the same time because kids need to have a well known identity, one mother and one father. Also a man having more than one wife means a chance to have more progeny, which isn't the case with a woman having two men!!

For divorce, it can be necessary, but the rights of each one (including the kids) have to be taken care of, for sometimes it just doesn't work, and you can't know it until you're married..
GreatestIam
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10/25/2013 11:37:55 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/25/2013 3:52:07 AM, Composer wrote:
The bible Story book says ' . . . . husband of one wife . . . . ' (Titus 1:6) KJV Story book version

The bible Story book also says that the huge majority of the prophets and kings David and Solomon had many wives and I see nowhere where Jesus actually names a number.

Regards
DL
GreatestIam
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10/25/2013 11:41:08 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/25/2013 4:26:49 AM, Fruitytree wrote:
Women aren't equal to men

Which is why Islam is an immoral theology.

Women are not even equal before the law.

Regards
DL
Fruitytree
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10/25/2013 12:30:23 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/25/2013 11:41:08 AM, GreatestIam wrote:
At 10/25/2013 4:26:49 AM, Fruitytree wrote:
Women aren't equal to men

Which is why Islam is an immoral theology.

Women are not even equal before the law.

Regards
DL

They are equal before the Islamic law in everything that has to do with their humanity, not with their gender.

Also ;huh, what is even morality so you can judge any system of being moral or not, does it have to match your own ideals ?!
MadCornishBiker
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10/25/2013 12:35:09 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:00:21 AM, GreatestIam wrote:
Part one.

How many wives does Jesus allow?

One or many?

The O.T. that Jesus often quoted allows many wives.

The N. T does not speak against polygamy from what I can see but does promote slavery and tradition says that that would be sex out of marriage. Unless you see Christian slave owners acting differently than the usual slave owner.

How many wives does you particular branch of Christianity or Catholicism and Jesus allow?

Muslims also have a great respect for Jesus and they allow many wives. Should they?

I know that most will say one wife is the ideal. That does not explain why scriptures support the notion of more than one, --- so I would like to hear your opinion as to ----- why not many wives?

If women are to be equal, should they be allowed as many husbands as the men are allowed in wives?

Just so you know, I have only the one wife and do not think I would want more than one,--- but in the Muslin sense, --- would partially accept one, as a duty to her and the tribe, so to speak, --- and would not likely have a real husband type of relation (sexual), with her.

----------------------------------------

Part two.

Along with marriage often time comes divorce.

Jesus basically had a no divorce policy. Let no man put asunder.

Even as he acknowledged that Moses had changed the law thanks to the hard hearts of men.

I see that as an anti-love policy and since more than 60% of Christians divorce, most Christians seem to agree.

Do you?

Regards
DL

I see your understanding and knowledge of scripture has not improved any.

Part one:

Nowhere in the OT are mutiple wives allowed.or approved of

True there are stories of ones such as Solomon having more than one wife, but what was the end for such ones who went against God's one man one woman principle for marriage?

The only situation in which God tolerated it was where Jacob was tricked into Marrying Leah, when he was supposed to be marrying Rachel. Since it was done in deceit by Rachel and her father, it was they who got the ill effects of so doing.

I suppose the materialist will say Solomon prospered, but spiritually he did not, he was pulled gradually away from God.

You really should learn to understand the results of these things, and the difference between what God approves of and what happens. Just because it happens and is reported in scripture does not mean God approved of it. It simply means that the story was included for us to learn what happens to those who defy God' s standards.

Yes he did, but with the single get-out clause that anyone who committed adultery could be divorced by the injured party if that was felt to be the only way out. However the possibilities of forgiveness if the adultery was not repeated should be explored first.

No I do not see that as an anti love policy, it is an anti hasty and ill-considered marriage policy.

Many couples divorce nowadays because there is a strong tendency today to confuse love with sexual attraction where in fact they are two very different things. Sexual attraction is very much a physical thing where as real love is a thing of the head not the loins.

The one is driven purely by physical attractiveness, and the other by knowledge ot the other persons qualities and attitudes.

The one tends to flare and die, whilst the other grows and is continually nurtured like a precious flower.

True, the one can lead to another, but there are no guarantees., and many people today do not even know what true love is.

1 Corinthians 13:4-7
4 Love is long-suffering and kind. Love is not jealous, it does not brag, does not get puffed up, 5 does not behave indecently, does not look for its own interests, does not become provoked. It does not keep account of the injury. 6 It does not rejoice over unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth. 7 It bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

That is true love. Accept, and give, no substitutes. If both halves of a couple behave that way towards each other there will be no desire, or need, for divorce, ever.
MadCornishBiker
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10/25/2013 1:49:04 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/25/2013 1:42:04 PM, GreatestIam wrote:
https://www.youtube.com...

No wonder you have such a strange view of things, since you seem to get most of your information from Youtube, lol. Much of what is on there is rubbish anyway.
slo1
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10/26/2013 9:12:44 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/25/2013 1:42:04 PM, GreatestIam wrote:
https://www.youtube.com...

That video is priceless, but did they really have to use a black thug when talking about rape?

Christianity is built upon the entire assumption that God had to have different rules in OT days because mankind was not ready to hear of the "right" rules that Jesus brought forth. Therefore doing the little servant girl was acceptable because mankind was not progressed far enough to know any better. It surely makes no sense because if one could be taught that there is only one God, surely they could be taught to not do the servant girl. Although, if you get God's blessing you can do who ever you want.
slo1
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10/26/2013 9:14:13 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Oh yeah, don't forget Jesus was gay, so he was not allowed to talk about marriage. The story does not end so well if he was stoned by a mass group of people, so he kept his mouth shut.
MadCornishBiker
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10/26/2013 10:05:25 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/26/2013 9:14:13 AM, slo1 wrote:
Oh yeah, don't forget Jesus was gay, so he was not allowed to talk about marriage. The story does not end so well if he was stoned by a mass group of people, so he kept his mouth shut.

Jesus was not gay, that would have been complete anathema to any practising Jew, which he was.
GreatestIam
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10/26/2013 11:09:42 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/26/2013 9:12:44 AM, slo1 wrote:
At 10/25/2013 1:42:04 PM, GreatestIam wrote:
https://www.youtube.com...

That video is priceless, but did they really have to use a black thug when talking about rape?

Christianity is built upon the entire assumption that God had to have different rules in OT days because mankind was not ready to hear of the "right" rules that Jesus brought forth. Therefore doing the little servant girl was acceptable because mankind was not progressed far enough to know any better. It surely makes no sense because if one could be taught that there is only one God, surely they could be taught to not do the servant girl. Although, if you get God's blessing you can do who ever you want.

Well put.

I had not noticed the rapists features but you have a point on stereotyping here.

Although, and here I do not want to sound racist, but I understand that most rapes, unfortunately, are done by non-whites.

I think this is so, not because of race or color, but because in the West, crime is due to socio economic factors more than anything else. The extra crimes from the non-whites are an effect of poverty and frustration and the colored minorities will naturally be overrepresented in criminal activity. because of poverty.

If more whites were poor, their crime rate would soar.

Regards
DL
GreatestIam
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10/26/2013 11:11:01 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/26/2013 9:14:13 AM, slo1 wrote:
Oh yeah, don't forget Jesus was gay, so he was not allowed to talk about marriage. The story does not end so well if he was stoned by a mass group of people, so he kept his mouth shut.

You would need to give scripture and verse on this one my friend.

Regards
DL
GreatestIam
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10/26/2013 11:14:35 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/26/2013 10:05:25 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 10/26/2013 9:14:13 AM, slo1 wrote:
Oh yeah, don't forget Jesus was gay, so he was not allowed to talk about marriage. The story does not end so well if he was stoned by a mass group of people, so he kept his mouth shut.

Jesus was not gay, that would have been complete anathema to any practising Jew, which he was.

All nations and genetic lines will likely eventually produce a gay person. Nature has proven that.

Are you suggesting that, like Iran and it's people, Jews do not produce gays?

If so, why are they immune to that condition?

Regards
DL
MadCornishBiker
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10/26/2013 11:24:01 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/26/2013 11:14:35 AM, GreatestIam wrote:
At 10/26/2013 10:05:25 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 10/26/2013 9:14:13 AM, slo1 wrote:
Oh yeah, don't forget Jesus was gay, so he was not allowed to talk about marriage. The story does not end so well if he was stoned by a mass group of people, so he kept his mouth shut.

Jesus was not gay, that would have been complete anathema to any practising Jew, which he was.

All nations and genetic lines will likely eventually produce a gay person. Nature has proven that.

Are you suggesting that, like Iran and it's people, Jews do not produce gays?

If so, why are they immune to that condition?

Regards
DL

That's rubbish. Being gay is a choice. Always was.
MadCornishBiker
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10/26/2013 11:24:55 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/26/2013 11:11:01 AM, GreatestIam wrote:
At 10/26/2013 9:14:13 AM, slo1 wrote:
Oh yeah, don't forget Jesus was gay, so he was not allowed to talk about marriage. The story does not end so well if he was stoned by a mass group of people, so he kept his mouth shut.

You would need to give scripture and verse on this one my friend.

Regards
DL

There isn't one.
slo1
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10/27/2013 7:13:11 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/26/2013 11:24:01 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 10/26/2013 11:14:35 AM, GreatestIam wrote:
At 10/26/2013 10:05:25 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 10/26/2013 9:14:13 AM, slo1 wrote:
Oh yeah, don't forget Jesus was gay, so he was not allowed to talk about marriage. The story does not end so well if he was stoned by a mass group of people, so he kept his mouth shut.

Jesus was not gay, that would have been complete anathema to any practising Jew, which he was.

All nations and genetic lines will likely eventually produce a gay person. Nature has proven that.

Are you suggesting that, like Iran and it's people, Jews do not produce gays?

If so, why are they immune to that condition?

Regards
DL

That's rubbish. Being gay is a choice. Always was.

Even Jesus was quoted as saying some eunuch's are born. You really think he was speaking of men born without testicles? That is like 1 in 5 million odds.
MadCornishBiker
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10/28/2013 3:55:04 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/27/2013 7:13:11 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 10/26/2013 11:24:01 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 10/26/2013 11:14:35 AM, GreatestIam wrote:
At 10/26/2013 10:05:25 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 10/26/2013 9:14:13 AM, slo1 wrote:
Oh yeah, don't forget Jesus was gay, so he was not allowed to talk about marriage. The story does not end so well if he was stoned by a mass group of people, so he kept his mouth shut.

Jesus was not gay, that would have been complete anathema to any practising Jew, which he was.

All nations and genetic lines will likely eventually produce a gay person. Nature has proven that.

Are you suggesting that, like Iran and it's people, Jews do not produce gays?

If so, why are they immune to that condition?

Regards
DL

That's rubbish. Being gay is a choice. Always was.

Even Jesus was quoted as saying some eunuch's are born. You really think he was speaking of men born without testicles? That is like 1 in 5 million odds.

I wish you had quoted the scripture, but I'll see if I can find it so I can get the context.

One thing is sure, he wasn't talking about homosexuality, though all are born with the curiosity to make them think of experimenting, and that is where a trained conscience comes in, teaching us to resist such curiosity based temptations.

Matthew 19:
10 The disciples said to him: "If such is the situation of a man with his wife, it is not advisable to marry." 11 He said to them: "Not all men make room for the saying, but only those who have the gift. 12 For there are eunuchs that were born such from their mother"s womb, and there are eunuchs that were made eunuchs by men, and there are eunuchs that have made themselves eunuchs on account of the kingdom of the heavens. Let him that can make room for it make room for it."

As you can see from the context, Jesus was talking about the reasons some decide whether or not to marry.

Some are born that way, whether because of being born into some form of relationship which puts them off the idea of marriage for life, maybe a violent marriage or similar which makes them feel that marriage can never work.

Some are made that way, because of what they see around them in other people's marriages, or by the banter and complaints that they here from others, or observing the misery that comes from an injudicious marriage.

Some, and I have known a number of such ones, decline marriage because their only interest in life is to serve God, and they realise that they can do so better without the ties that marriage and a family bring. I do not, here refer to those to whom marriage is banned by their religion, which is totally unscriptural, but those who make a free choice to stay single and give up all thoughts of sexual relations in the foreseeable future , because their eternal service to God is more important to them than brief, temporary sexual gratification.

Paul echoes a similar thought in 1 Corinthians 7:25-35
25 Now concerning virgins I have no command from the Lord, but I give my opinion as one who had mercy shown him by the Lord to be faithful. 26 Therefore I think this to be well in view of the necessity here with us, that it is well for a man to continue as he is. 27 Are you bound to a wife? Stop seeking a release. Are you loosed from a wife? Stop seeking a wife. 28 But even if you did marry, you would commit no sin. And if a virgin [person] married, such one would commit no sin. However, those who do will have tribulation in their flesh. But I am sparing YOU.
29 Moreover, this I say, brothers, the time left is reduced. Henceforth let those who have wives be as though they had none, 30 and also those who weep be as those who do not weep, and those who rejoice as those who do not rejoice, and those who buy as those not possessing, 31 and those making use of the world+ as those not using it to the full; for the scene of this world is changing.+ 32 Indeed, I want YOU to be free from anxiety. The unmarried man is anxious for the things of the Lord, how he may gain the Lord"s approval. 33 But the married man is anxious for the things of the world, how he may gain the approval of his wife, 34 and he is divided. Further, the unmarried woman, and the virgin, is anxious for the things of the Lord, that she may be holy both in her body and in her spirit. However, the married woman is anxious for the things of the world, how she may gain the approval of her husband. 35 But this I am saying for YOUR personal advantage, not that I may cast a noose upon YOU, but to move YOU to that which is becoming and that which means constant attendance upon the Lord without distraction.

Here Paul is not saying a servant of God must not marry, but that is easier to do so if not. He says if you are married when you come to it, fine, stay married.

However he stresses towards the end that if the temptations of sexual immorality are too strong, then by all means find a suitable partner and marry. Better to make your service to God more difficult, that to make it unacceptable but immoral behaviour.
GreatestIam
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10/28/2013 7:10:03 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Only fools think that Gods need servicing.

Come here Gods. We have big black servicing machines here just a waiting to service your as s.

Regards
DL
MadCornishBiker
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10/29/2013 3:09:33 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/28/2013 7:10:03 PM, GreatestIam wrote:
Only fools think that Gods need servicing.

Come here Gods. We have big black servicing machines here just a waiting to service your as s.

Regards
DL

For once I actually agree with you, but suspect that you still haven't thought the question though.

My first question is do you mean servicing, or serving? Since both can have very similar meanings.

If however you mean that God does not need anyone to serve him, you are perfectly correct, however he has given men the privilege of teaching each other , which unfortunately some, such as yourself, have all too often abused.

It is a privilege, and a responsibility, and is one of the things God gave us which gives us a purpose in life, that of passing on the opportunity of everlasting life to those God chooses to listen to us.
MadCornishBiker
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10/30/2013 5:31:14 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/30/2013 1:24:22 PM, GreatestIam wrote:
Yes and thank God those are few.

None of us should listen to the garbage those of your ilk spew.

Regards
DL

Then don't listen, no-one is forcing you to, and it's your loss, or will be.
Quatermass
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10/30/2013 5:43:13 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/30/2013 5:31:14 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

Then don't listen, no-one is forcing you to, and it's your loss, or will be.

If you will allow me a personal question; how did you become a Jehovah's Witness (if that is what you are)?
GreatestIam
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10/31/2013 9:08:08 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/30/2013 5:43:13 PM, Quatermass wrote:
At 10/30/2013 5:31:14 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

Then don't listen, no-one is forcing you to, and it's your loss, or will be.

If you will allow me a personal question; how did you become a Jehovah's Witness (if that is what you are)?

All you need do my friend is do as the Protestant founder said you must do.

"Faith must trample under foot all reason, sense, and understanding."

"Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has."
Martin Luther "

Please do not do so. Your mind is too important to throw away.

Regards
DL
Quatermass
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10/31/2013 9:19:31 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/31/2013 9:08:08 AM, GreatestIam wrote:
At 10/30/2013 5:43:13 PM, Quatermass wrote:
At 10/30/2013 5:31:14 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

Then don't listen, no-one is forcing you to, and it's your loss, or will be.

If you will allow me a personal question; how did you become a Jehovah's Witness (if that is what you are)?

All you need do my friend is do as the Protestant founder said you must do.

"Faith must trample under foot all reason, sense, and understanding."

"Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has."
Martin Luther "

Please do not do so. Your mind is too important to throw away.

Regards
DL

I will never have to find faith because I have science. Therefore I do not need faith. I'm asking how he became religious.
Quatermass
Posts: 166
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10/31/2013 9:20:21 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/31/2013 9:08:08 AM, GreatestIam wrote:
At 10/30/2013 5:43:13 PM, Quatermass wrote:
At 10/30/2013 5:31:14 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

Then don't listen, no-one is forcing you to, and it's your loss, or will be.

If you will allow me a personal question; how did you become a Jehovah's Witness (if that is what you are)?

All you need do my friend is do as the Protestant founder said you must do.

"Faith must trample under foot all reason, sense, and understanding."

"Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has."
Martin Luther "

Please do not do so. Your mind is too important to throw away.

Regards
DL

Feel free to answer the question yourself, too. How did you become religious?
MadCornishBiker
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10/31/2013 12:04:25 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/31/2013 9:20:21 AM, Quatermass wrote:
At 10/31/2013 9:08:08 AM, GreatestIam wrote:
At 10/30/2013 5:43:13 PM, Quatermass wrote:
At 10/30/2013 5:31:14 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

Then don't listen, no-one is forcing you to, and it's your loss, or will be.

If you will allow me a personal question; how did you become a Jehovah's Witness (if that is what you are)?

All you need do my friend is do as the Protestant founder said you must do.

"Faith must trample under foot all reason, sense, and understanding."

"Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has."
Martin Luther "

Please do not do so. Your mind is too important to throw away.

Regards
DL

Feel free to answer the question yourself, too. How did you become religious?

Sorry I seem to have missed your question somehow.

The answer is not very straightforward I am afraid as currently I am not a Jehovah's Witness due to be disfellowshipped.

As t how I became one in the first place it all started, as a child, with my spending most evenings reading the New Testament and putting myself in the sandals of various different characters in order to get an insight into the full story.

Th deeper into it I got the more obvious it became that all I had been taught, or certainty much of it, was wrong.

The first thing that struck me was that there are many millions of people on this earth who call themselves Christian, and yet Jesus was very clear that his true followers would be a minority.

Matthew 7:13,14; Matthew 7:21-23; Luke 17:26-30; Luke 18:8:

The Apostles also made similar statements.

With that preying on my mind I decided that my only answer was to pray earnest yl God to show me the right way to serve him, after all, there as no point in serving him any other way.

Even though I only had a copy of the "NT", the more I read and re-read it, the more I realised something else vital. The idea of the Trinity simply didn't fit, it was a complete non-starter.

So at least I knew I was looking for a non-trinitarian faith.

Just over 20 years further down the line and I hadn't found a single faith that satisfied what I had learned from scripture, and I have to admit I completely ignored the JWs. Well you do don't you, no-one actually wants to be a JW with all that people say against them.

However I wasn't to be allowed to ignore them,and despite the fact that I had only had one visit at home by JWs and had given them pretty short shrift, one day someone gave me a tract of theirs and challenged me to read it and let them knew what I thought.

I took it home with me and settled down to read it. It was one of the tracts that they produced which listed their beliefs and the scriptures they were based on.

I was, to say the least, shocked. There in front of me was exactly what I had been looking for all this time. It was a while before the same thought stopped going through my mind "Oh no, please, not them".

Such was the mental turmoil it set up in my mind it was 3 years before I decided I just had to study with them and see for certain, so I did.

For a few months I haunted the second hand bookshops of Bristol, buying different translation, interlinears, a Hebrew English NT and a Hebrew English copy of the whole thing, as well as a copy of Josephus and other related work.

Try as I might I just could not fault their reasoning or their beliefs, so I was baptised after just 6 months of study.

30 years later I still can't fault them despite minor changes which seemed obvious to me once they were pointed out.

I still try to because scripture tells us we must "Keep testing what you yourself are" to make sure we really are in the faith.

I am now convinced that, despite their human frailties and errors, they truly are God's people on this earth, selected by his so to serve in spreading "This Good News of the Kingdom" as foretold in Matthew 24:14, and guided by him through holy spirit.

Hence even in my current state I defend them to the hilt, just as I defend God's name and purposes.