Total Posts:118|Showing Posts:1-30|Last Page
Jump to topic:

Atheist's, explain this.

johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?
Volkov
Posts: 9,765
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 10:15:23 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Like in many situations, your friend probably fell into the crowd mentality. He saw what others were doing before him and either consciously (which I suspect given that, as you noted, he was "trying to bed" this girl, so he had a reason for doing so) or subconsciously acted the same way.

Its quite common, as I've heard. Great documentary called Marjoe showed how these charismatic preachers can work the crowd up and get people to do all sorts of crazy stuff, even though the person doing the blessing was a charlatan. You should watch it, I think its on Netflix now.
bulproof
Posts: 25,308
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 10:26:15 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

The important question is............. did he get laid?
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 10:26:44 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

Subtle Hypnotism. If I wanted to, I could make them all quack like ducks.
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 10:32:03 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:15:23 AM, Volkov wrote:
Like in many situations, your friend probably fell into the crowd mentality. He saw what others were doing before him and either consciously (which I suspect given that, as you noted, he was "trying to bed" this girl, so he had a reason for doing so) or subconsciously acted the same way.

Its quite common, as I've heard. Great documentary called Marjoe showed how these charismatic preachers can work the crowd up and get people to do all sorts of crazy stuff, even though the person doing the blessing was a charlatan. You should watch it, I think its on Netflix now.

Yeah I see your point, but it does not explain what he felt, he said he felt a sudden rush of energy transfer from the pastor to him.....
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 10:32:22 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:26:44 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

Subtle Hypnotism. If I wanted to, I could make them all quack like ducks.

Whatever.
Volkov
Posts: 9,765
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 10:35:20 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:32:03 AM, johnlubba wrote:
Yeah I see your point, but it does not explain what he felt, he said he felt a sudden rush of energy transfer from the pastor to him.....

Far be it from me to doubt your friend's sincerity, but it may be that he was a little more open to the religious fervor that was in the place. I've been to Pentecostal services before and while I can't say I was moved, there was a sense of "something" going on. But is that something God, or just me taking subconscious social cues from those around me?
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 10:39:37 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:32:22 AM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:26:44 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

Subtle Hypnotism. If I wanted to, I could make them all quack like ducks.


Whatever.

I gave you a reasonable response, people can be hypnotized without even knowing it. "Whatever" is not a reasonable response.
TrueScotsman
Posts: 515
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 10:45:40 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

I often see this kinds of arguments and honestly they frustrate me. Christians or atheists cannot make definitive statements about what happened. Could it be that this Pastor had some power "from above" that then caused this man to fall down and shake? Could it be that this man simply was experiencing a powerful mental state from being influenced by the overall crowd reaction?

Both of these questions if answered in the affirmative by a Christian or athiest will largely not reveal what happen, but rather what philosophical presuppositions they have. Instead, we should talk about plausibility... and then realize that's a futile endeavor and move on to arguments that are actually falsifiable and thus worth our time.
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 10:48:03 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:35:20 AM, Volkov wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:32:03 AM, johnlubba wrote:
Yeah I see your point, but it does not explain what he felt, he said he felt a sudden rush of energy transfer from the pastor to him.....

Far be it from me to doubt your friend's sincerity, but it may be that he was a little more open to the religious fervor that was in the place. I've been to Pentecostal services before and while I can't say I was moved, there was a sense of "something" going on. But is that something God, or just me taking subconscious social cues from those around me?

That's it, I do not doubt my friends sincerity, he is the last person to admit to this type of thing, he said he has no answer, although you could be right, I also interrogated him and he is adamant he felt a surge of energy transfer from the pastor to him and then he dropped.

I also suspected hypnotism as the cause, but that could just be wishful thinking on my behalf, and something could really be happening. he also said there is an energy in the room which he couldn't describe.....My friend is 40 years old and has lived a full life, he is not stupid and is smart enough to not be saying such things, but this is what he is saying...

So I am confused as to what happened.
Volkov
Posts: 9,765
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 10:51:03 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:48:03 AM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:35:20 AM, Volkov wrote:
I also suspected hypnotism as the cause, but that could just be wishful thinking on my behalf, and something could really be happening. he also said there is an energy in the room which he couldn't describe.....My friend is 40 years old and has lived a full life, he is not stupid and is smart enough to not be saying such things, but this is what he is saying...

So I am confused as to what happened.

Well, either way and whatever the cause, its unfortunately anecdotal evidence that no matter how hard we wished to, atheists cannot exactly explain because it is someone's personal experience, something which is impossible to refute. So its really kind of a pointless exercise, as Scotsman just pointed out.
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 10:52:35 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:39:37 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:32:22 AM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:26:44 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

Subtle Hypnotism. If I wanted to, I could make them all quack like ducks.


Whatever.

I gave you a reasonable response, people can be hypnotized without even knowing it. "Whatever" is not a reasonable response.

I studied hypnotism in-depth as a youngster, but never got as far as I wanted, I know how easy it is to hypnotize people, but I do not think my friend was hypnotized, although it is possible. maybe we are just wishfully thinking the is the best explanation....My whatever response was a bit harsh but I just think more analysis is what is needed before we just assume hypnotism.
bulproof
Posts: 25,308
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 10:53:09 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Since this was the entire motivation then the answer to this question is paramount.

At 10/23/2013 10:26:15 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

The important question is............. did he get laid?
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 10:58:42 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:52:35 AM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:39:37 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:32:22 AM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:26:44 AM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

Subtle Hypnotism. If I wanted to, I could make them all quack like ducks.


Whatever.

I gave you a reasonable response, people can be hypnotized without even knowing it. "Whatever" is not a reasonable response.

I studied hypnotism in-depth as a youngster, but never got as far as I wanted, I know how easy it is to hypnotize people, but I do not think my friend was hypnotized, although it is possible. maybe we are just wishfully thinking the is the best explanation....My whatever response was a bit harsh but I just think more analysis is what is needed before we just assume hypnotism.

What I am trying to say is that after discussing it with him, hypnotism does not explain the energy he describes feeling or the fact he was dropped just like that by a man he hadn't ever met, unless this guy is a professional hypnotist who enjoys deceiving people for the sake of religion, then it is very peculiar to me.
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 10:59:19 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:53:09 AM, bulproof wrote:
Since this was the entire motivation then the answer to this question is paramount.

At 10/23/2013 10:26:15 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

The important question is............. did he get laid?

Lol not yet, but I do not think he is going to give up.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 11:09:47 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

I don't know. I wasn't there. You weren't there. The only person that truly knows is your friend (assuming he exists). If I were to speculated, I'd offer the following possibilities:

You're lying.
He's lying.
He actually tripped but is embarrassed to tell the truth.
He only pretended to collapse as a practical joke.
He only pretended to collapse because out of fear of the response of being the only person not to collapse.
He coincidentally fainted.
He was poisoned.
As already suggested, he was subconsciously influenced to collapse in that manner.
An omnipotent, omniscient being bestowed some form of unknown energy into some random pastor to purpose of which is to cause people to fall down by touching them, because ... lulz.

Now. All of those except the last have happened in other circumstances. They are phenomenon we know to actually have existed and have confirmed to exist. However, there is no confirmed existence to the last.

Furthermore, whether intentionally or not, pastors, reverends, ministers, priests, rabbis and what have you are conmen. This is a system developed and nurtured over thousands of years whose primary purpose is to convince and sway large groups of people into a narrow mindset controlled by the speaker. Everything they do, the words they speak, the tone they inflect, the ceremonies, the rituals, is designed to influence how people think and behave in order to control them. It is known.

So, in light of all of that, I'm inclined to lean toward a mundane, natural explanation, rather than accept that God is causing random people to faint because he has nothing better to do.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 11:10:41 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
I wonder what would have happened if he was the first person to try, having not being subconsciously primed by watching hosts of other people go up and drop before him.
bulproof
Posts: 25,308
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 11:13:55 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:59:19 AM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:53:09 AM, bulproof wrote:
Since this was the entire motivation then the answer to this question is paramount.

At 10/23/2013 10:26:15 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

The important question is............. did he get laid?

Lol not yet, but I do not think he is going to give up.

So is the best a 40yr old can do these days.
Mankind must be devolving me thinks.
Bloody he's halway dead already and he can't get his wick wet? I'd suggest that not only this chick drops him but you should as well.
Just like the pastor did maybe................. LOL
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 11:18:03 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 11:09:47 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

I don't know. I wasn't there. You weren't there. The only person that truly knows is your friend (assuming he exists). If I were to speculated, I'd offer the following possibilities:

You're lying.
He's lying.
He actually tripped but is embarrassed to tell the truth.
He only pretended to collapse as a practical joke.
He only pretended to collapse because out of fear of the response of being the only person not to collapse.
He coincidentally fainted.
He was poisoned.
As already suggested, he was subconsciously influenced to collapse in that manner.
An omnipotent, omniscient being bestowed some form of unknown energy into some random pastor to purpose of which is to cause people to fall down by touching them, because ... lulz.

Now. All of those except the last have happened in other circumstances. They are phenomenon we know to actually have existed and have confirmed to exist. However, there is no confirmed existence to the last.

Furthermore, whether intentionally or not, pastors, reverends, ministers, priests, rabbis and what have you are conmen. This is a system developed and nurtured over thousands of years whose primary purpose is to convince and sway large groups of people into a narrow mindset controlled by the speaker. Everything they do, the words they speak, the tone they inflect, the ceremonies, the rituals, is designed to influence how people think and behave in order to control them. It is known.

So, in light of all of that, I'm inclined to lean toward a mundane, natural explanation, rather than accept that God is causing random people to faint because he has nothing better to do.

So you think I am fabricating all this and making up stories about friends I don't have......Ok conversation over, I have no interest in discussing this any further with you, 1 you think I am lying 2 you accuse my friend of lying without even knowing him or giving a reason why he should lie, 3 you are in denial of what actually happened and can only offer insulting accusations.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 11:20:34 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 11:18:03 AM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/23/2013 11:09:47 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

I don't know. I wasn't there. You weren't there. The only person that truly knows is your friend (assuming he exists). If I were to speculated, I'd offer the following possibilities:

You're lying.
He's lying.
He actually tripped but is embarrassed to tell the truth.
He only pretended to collapse as a practical joke.
He only pretended to collapse because out of fear of the response of being the only person not to collapse.
He coincidentally fainted.
He was poisoned.
As already suggested, he was subconsciously influenced to collapse in that manner.
An omnipotent, omniscient being bestowed some form of unknown energy into some random pastor to purpose of which is to cause people to fall down by touching them, because ... lulz.

Now. All of those except the last have happened in other circumstances. They are phenomenon we know to actually have existed and have confirmed to exist. However, there is no confirmed existence to the last.

Furthermore, whether intentionally or not, pastors, reverends, ministers, priests, rabbis and what have you are conmen. This is a system developed and nurtured over thousands of years whose primary purpose is to convince and sway large groups of people into a narrow mindset controlled by the speaker. Everything they do, the words they speak, the tone they inflect, the ceremonies, the rituals, is designed to influence how people think and behave in order to control them. It is known.

So, in light of all of that, I'm inclined to lean toward a mundane, natural explanation, rather than accept that God is causing random people to faint because he has nothing better to do.

So you think I am fabricating all this and making up stories about friends I don't have......Ok conversation over, I have no interest in discussing this any further with you, 1 you think I am lying 2 you accuse my friend of lying without even knowing him or giving a reason why he should lie, 3 you are in denial of what actually happened and can only offer insulting accusations.

LOL. I didn't say you or your friend were lying. I said it was a possibility. Honestly, from my POV have you exposed me to any reason why I should exclude those possibilities? No.

But thanks for demonstrating that you're a close-minded fool who really isn't interested in the honest answers of those who are of a different mindset.
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 11:23:10 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 11:13:55 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:59:19 AM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:53:09 AM, bulproof wrote:
Since this was the entire motivation then the answer to this question is paramount.

At 10/23/2013 10:26:15 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

The important question is............. did he get laid?

Lol not yet, but I do not think he is going to give up.

So is the best a 40yr old can do these days.
Mankind must be devolving me thinks.
Bloody he's halway dead already and he can't get his wick wet? I'd suggest that not only this chick drops him but you should as well.
Just like the pastor did maybe................. LOL

What's even more sad is your attitude to others over the internet. The only thing I can agree to what you just said is the assumption we are devolving, especially when your reply with such a vicious attack.... Congrats you just won your self a blankety blank cheque book and pen.
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 11:26:13 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 11:20:34 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/23/2013 11:18:03 AM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/23/2013 11:09:47 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

I don't know. I wasn't there. You weren't there. The only person that truly knows is your friend (assuming he exists). If I were to speculated, I'd offer the following possibilities:

You're lying.
He's lying.
He actually tripped but is embarrassed to tell the truth.
He only pretended to collapse as a practical joke.
He only pretended to collapse because out of fear of the response of being the only person not to collapse.
He coincidentally fainted.
He was poisoned.
As already suggested, he was subconsciously influenced to collapse in that manner.
An omnipotent, omniscient being bestowed some form of unknown energy into some random pastor to purpose of which is to cause people to fall down by touching them, because ... lulz.

Now. All of those except the last have happened in other circumstances. They are phenomenon we know to actually have existed and have confirmed to exist. However, there is no confirmed existence to the last.

Furthermore, whether intentionally or not, pastors, reverends, ministers, priests, rabbis and what have you are conmen. This is a system developed and nurtured over thousands of years whose primary purpose is to convince and sway large groups of people into a narrow mindset controlled by the speaker. Everything they do, the words they speak, the tone they inflect, the ceremonies, the rituals, is designed to influence how people think and behave in order to control them. It is known.

So, in light of all of that, I'm inclined to lean toward a mundane, natural explanation, rather than accept that God is causing random people to faint because he has nothing better to do.

So you think I am fabricating all this and making up stories about friends I don't have......Ok conversation over, I have no interest in discussing this any further with you, 1 you think I am lying 2 you accuse my friend of lying without even knowing him or giving a reason why he should lie, 3 you are in denial of what actually happened and can only offer insulting accusations.

LOL. I didn't say you or your friend were lying. I said it was a possibility. Honestly, from my POV have you exposed me to any reason why I should exclude those possibilities? No.

But thanks for demonstrating that you're a close-minded fool who really isn't interested in the honest answers of those who are of a different mindset.

Yeah whatever, making accusations about assuming my friend actually exists is implying I am lying, also you implying my friends, ( if he exists is lying also, you covered every possibility but that it could actualy be true, you are a sad case. I will now ignore your BS before you give me a headache.....you have offered nothing.
bulproof
Posts: 25,308
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 11:26:53 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 11:23:10 AM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/23/2013 11:13:55 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:59:19 AM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:53:09 AM, bulproof wrote:
Since this was the entire motivation then the answer to this question is paramount.

At 10/23/2013 10:26:15 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

The important question is............. did he get laid?

Lol not yet, but I do not think he is going to give up.

So is the best a 40yr old can do these days.
Mankind must be devolving me thinks.
Bloody he's halway dead already and he can't get his wick wet? I'd suggest that not only this chick drops him but you should as well.
Just like the pastor did maybe................. LOL

What's even more sad is your attitude to others over the internet. The only thing I can agree to what you just said is the assumption we are devolving, especially when your reply with such a vicious attack.... Congrats you just won your self a blankety blank cheque book and pen.
Oh you poor boy. Never mind I can still laugh at jokes, you never know maybe you might understand one some day and laugh as well or does your god only want you to get joy from genocide and infanticide like he does?
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 11:30:17 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 11:26:13 AM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/23/2013 11:20:34 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/23/2013 11:18:03 AM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/23/2013 11:09:47 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

I don't know. I wasn't there. You weren't there. The only person that truly knows is your friend (assuming he exists). If I were to speculated, I'd offer the following possibilities:

You're lying.
He's lying.
He actually tripped but is embarrassed to tell the truth.
He only pretended to collapse as a practical joke.
He only pretended to collapse because out of fear of the response of being the only person not to collapse.
He coincidentally fainted.
He was poisoned.
As already suggested, he was subconsciously influenced to collapse in that manner.
An omnipotent, omniscient being bestowed some form of unknown energy into some random pastor to purpose of which is to cause people to fall down by touching them, because ... lulz.

Now. All of those except the last have happened in other circumstances. They are phenomenon we know to actually have existed and have confirmed to exist. However, there is no confirmed existence to the last.

Furthermore, whether intentionally or not, pastors, reverends, ministers, priests, rabbis and what have you are conmen. This is a system developed and nurtured over thousands of years whose primary purpose is to convince and sway large groups of people into a narrow mindset controlled by the speaker. Everything they do, the words they speak, the tone they inflect, the ceremonies, the rituals, is designed to influence how people think and behave in order to control them. It is known.

So, in light of all of that, I'm inclined to lean toward a mundane, natural explanation, rather than accept that God is causing random people to faint because he has nothing better to do.

So you think I am fabricating all this and making up stories about friends I don't have......Ok conversation over, I have no interest in discussing this any further with you, 1 you think I am lying 2 you accuse my friend of lying without even knowing him or giving a reason why he should lie, 3 you are in denial of what actually happened and can only offer insulting accusations.

LOL. I didn't say you or your friend were lying. I said it was a possibility. Honestly, from my POV have you exposed me to any reason why I should exclude those possibilities? No.

But thanks for demonstrating that you're a close-minded fool who really isn't interested in the honest answers of those who are of a different mindset.


Yeah whatever, making accusations about assuming my friend actually exists is implying I am lying,

No it isn't. I have no evidence or facts in my possession that confirm the existence of your friend. If I am to accept that he exists, it must be an assumption.

also you implying my friends, ( if he exists is lying also, you covered every possibility but that it could actualy be true, you are a sad case. I will now ignore your BS before you give me a headache.....you have offered nothing.

Except, you know, a dozen possibilities for the question you answered.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 11:54:56 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
You know, I only listed the possibility of lying in order to be as inclusive as possible - to list all of the possibilities I could think of. The fact that you stopped reading their and went into tantrum mode smacks of unaccounted for defensiveness.

You really were lying, weren't you? It's the only explanation for this outburst of yours; it's an overreaction to being caught.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 1:17:28 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
After all, noting the possibility that the story is made up is hardly the most nefarious of my suggestions (ex: poisoning) nor is it the most instigating (ex: religion as a thousand-year-long con). So it's rather odd that you fixated on that.
Mysterious_Stranger
Posts: 1,562
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 1:43:18 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
The story is either fake or he was conforming to those around him, a phenomenon that does happen.
Turn around, go back.
MysticEgg
Posts: 524
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 2:22:54 PM
Posted: 3 years ago

Atheists, what happened?

Subtle Hypnotism. If I wanted to, I could make them all quack like ducks.

Hmm...maybe. Certainly priming (if that's what you mean), but I doubt it would be something intended. Why go for that over group mentality?
cybertron1998
Posts: 5,818
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 4:48:22 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
What i find sad is that you three could of stopped the whole argument from going downhill but you didn't
Epsilon: There are so many stories where some brave hero decides to give their life to save the day, and because of their sacrifice, the good guys win, the survivors all cheer, and everybody lives happily ever after. But the hero... never gets to see that ending. They'll never know if their sacrifice actually made a difference. They'll never know if the day was really saved. In the end, they just have to have faith.
Magic8000
Posts: 975
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/23/2013 5:06:30 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/23/2013 10:09:33 AM, johnlubba wrote:
I have a friend who has absolutely no interest in philosophy, science, or religion, I could describe him as a happy go lucky 40 year old clown. This friend became attracted to a girl who is a devout Christian, this girl invited my friend to a church meeting, my friend went along with no intention of taking the members of the church seriously, his only intention was to get closer to the girl and eventually get her knickers off, ( he is that type of guy)

Only on his third date in as many days, he went to a church meeting and he said a pastor was there and people were queuing up to be blessed by the pastor. so he joined the queue simply to please the girl he wanted to bed,

Now the pastor was causing those who were first in he queue to drop like a sack of potatoes on the floor simply by touching their hands and turning them over, one by one they began dropping, until it was my friends turn to get to the front, and as sure as their are little apples, when my friend reached the front, he claims the pastor touched his hands then turned them over and my friends legs turned to jelly and he dropped to the floor, like the rest in the queue before him....

When I asked my friend why he let it happen, he said he has no answer other than the pastor definitely had an energy that passed from him to my friend and something spiritual happened.....

Atheists, what happened?

Hypnotic trance. He wants to tap the girl plus all the peer pressure would have made it easy for him to drop. Also, by your discription, he sounds very suggestable.

Look at the videos. Same thing happens, no spiritual stuff needed.
404 coherent debate topic not found. Please restart the debate with clear resolution.

"So Magic8000 believes Einstein was a proctologist who was persuaded by the Government and Hitler to fabricate the Theory of Relativity"- GWL-CPA