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Angels and demons what are they?

seeu46
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11/7/2013 8:21:52 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
There seems to be a lot of information on them on the internet. But what really are they, by the stance of scripture.

These are some statements that I have read but our they backed by scripture?

Angels are the demons that they become, after falling from heaven.

They are the angels that rebelled against God with their leader being the devil or Lucifer.

Michael is called the Arch Angel and is the high ranking leader of the angels.

Before the Devil was thrown out he was supposedly the high ranking leader of all the angels and is now only the leader of his fallen group.

Demons seem to be portrayed of having power in tempting man with sin and even possession. Off the top of my head some of the demons names that I remember are a group refereed as Legion.

Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman. Angels seem to serve God as messengers and even battle for God.
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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11/7/2013 8:41:32 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
"Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman."

Oh, c'mon.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
seeu46
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11/7/2013 9:21:53 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/7/2013 8:41:32 AM, annanicole wrote:
"Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman."

Oh, c'mon.

The sons of God that saw the daughters of men, that they were fair.

Who were they the sons of God?
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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11/7/2013 9:58:53 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/7/2013 8:21:52 AM, seeu46 wrote:
There seems to be a lot of information on them on the internet. But what really are they, by the stance of scripture.

These are some statements that I have read but our they backed by scripture?

Angels are the demons that they become, after falling from heaven.

They are the angels that rebelled against God with their leader being the devil or Lucifer.

Michael is called the Arch Angel and is the high ranking leader of the angels.

Before the Devil was thrown out he was supposedly the high ranking leader of all the angels and is now only the leader of his fallen group.

Demons seem to be portrayed of having power in tempting man with sin and even possession. Off the top of my head some of the demons names that I remember are a group refereed as Legion.

Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman. Angels seem to serve God as messengers and even battle for God.

They describe two different kinds of energy. Energy that vibrates in harmony are angelic while energy that vibrates in disharmony is demonic.
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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11/7/2013 10:06:21 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/7/2013 9:21:53 AM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 8:41:32 AM, annanicole wrote:
"Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman."

Oh, c'mon.

The sons of God that saw the daughters of men, that they were fair.

Who were they the sons of God?

I doubt every seriously if they were angels such as Gabriel and Michael who mated with women.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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11/7/2013 10:09:08 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/7/2013 10:06:21 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 11/7/2013 9:21:53 AM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 8:41:32 AM, annanicole wrote:
"Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman."

Oh, c'mon.

The sons of God that saw the daughters of men, that they were fair.

Who were they the sons of God?

I doubt every seriously if they were angels such as Gabriel and Michael who mated with women.

Angels and demons are only symbolic terms for two different kinds of energy spoken into existence by the invisible Word of God ( God's created voice ).
seeu46
Posts: 578
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11/7/2013 12:57:42 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/7/2013 10:06:21 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 11/7/2013 9:21:53 AM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 8:41:32 AM, annanicole wrote:
"Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman."

Oh, c'mon.

The sons of God that saw the daughters of men, that they were fair.

Who were they the sons of God?

I doubt every seriously if they were angels such as Gabriel and Michael who mated with women.

If not angels then what beings were they? Genesis 6:4There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

It does not seem to say these were natural men of earth, that took the daughters of men. Is there another form of life that has intelligence like men, that the bible mentions besides angels and demons?

If not angels, then it must be demons. If not demons, then it must be angels. I'm not sure what other beings there could be that made the giants.
Fruitytree
Posts: 2,176
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11/7/2013 1:24:39 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
According to Islam Demons (Jinn) and Angels (Malaika) are two distinct creatures:

- Demons are made of fire, are accountable to God like humans , usually don't appear to humans, can be beleivers and disbelievers, the evil amongst them are called satans (shaytan) their chief that you guys call Lucifier has a proper name : Iblees.they also are male or female.

-Angels are made of light and made to obey God, there are important angels that God uses for special missions, there are no female angels, they always obey God.

About the fallen angels, some angels belittled mankind for their nature to sin, so God sent 2 of them in the form of men (or demons, not sure) and they basically committed sin after sin. their names : Harut and Marut, they also taught people sorcery.
Composer
Posts: 5,858
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11/7/2013 6:45:37 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/7/2013 10:06:21 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 11/7/2013 9:21:53 AM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 8:41:32 AM, annanicole wrote:
"Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman."

Oh, c'mon.

The sons of God that saw the daughters of men, that they were fair.

Who were they the sons of God?

I doubt every seriously if they were angels such as Gabriel and Michael who mated with women.

At 11/7/2013 12:57:42 PM, seeu46 wrote:
If not angels then what beings were they? Genesis 6:4There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
Giants & men of renown is a metaphor for ' well known / high-standing / infamous ' humans!

Modern day equivalents would be e.g. The pope, Obama & all such people in common knowledge to the masses!

Supernatural god(s) & angels are mythical characters of human design / concepts!

The Story book bible refers to humans as ' angels ' e.g. Rev. 2:1, 2:8 & 2:18 KJV Story book


At 11/7/2013 12:57:42 PM, seeu46 wrote:
It does not seem to say these were natural men of earth, that took the daughters of men. Is there another form of life that has intelligence like men, that the bible mentions besides angels and demons?
Natural men in positions of authority that became corrupted!

Take a good read of wrestedscriptures.com and although they are a religious Cult themselves, their explanations of these often difficult passages are most enlightening & informative when measured against the biblical content!


At 11/7/2013 12:57:42 PM, seeu46 wrote:
If not angels, then it must be demons. If not demons, then it must be angels. I'm not sure what other beings there could be that made the giants.

Fallen angels = Refers to Humans in positions of authority / political high places, that became corrupted and ' fell ' (metaph') from their high office!

In olden days medical terms and the causes of diseases were unknown. Most illness, especially insanity, was attributed to evil spirits or demons. . . . . Dr. George M. Lamsa (Specialist in Aramaic & Eastern Languages) New Testament Light (Philadelphia: A. J.Holman, 1945), p. 58.
Idealist
Posts: 2,520
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11/7/2013 9:21:17 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/7/2013 8:21:52 AM, seeu46 wrote:
There seems to be a lot of information on them on the internet. But what really are they, by the stance of scripture.

These are some statements that I have read but our they backed by scripture?

Angels are the demons that they become, after falling from heaven.

They are the angels that rebelled against God with their leader being the devil or Lucifer.

Michael is called the Arch Angel and is the high ranking leader of the angels.

Before the Devil was thrown out he was supposedly the high ranking leader of all the angels and is now only the leader of his fallen group.

Demons seem to be portrayed of having power in tempting man with sin and even possession. Off the top of my head some of the demons names that I remember are a group refereed as Legion.

Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman. Angels seem to serve God as messengers and even battle for God.

I've wondered about this a lot over the past few years. I'm starting to believe that demons exist as real forces in our own minds, like an addiction to explicit porn or a compulsion to murder. These things tend to grow if we feed them, and gain ever more control over our thoughts and actions. Angels would be the opposite, I suppose. Feelings of peace, fulfillment, and the desire and willpower to help other people.
bulproof
Posts: 25,171
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11/7/2013 9:30:07 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Angels and demons are an excuse to avoid taking responsibility for your actions and/or figments of fevered imaginations and/or ways for cavemen to explain the inexplicable.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
seeu46
Posts: 578
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11/7/2013 9:53:50 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/7/2013 1:24:39 PM, Fruitytree wrote:
According to Islam Demons (Jinn) and Angels (Malaika) are two distinct creatures:

- Demons are made of fire, are accountable to God like humans , usually don't appear to humans, can be beleivers and disbelievers, the evil amongst them are called satans (shaytan) their chief that you guys call Lucifier has a proper name : Iblees.they also are male or female.


Iblees. A different name, in the Bible he was also referred by the name of Beelzebul prince of the demons.

-Angels are made of light and made to obey God, there are important angels that God uses for special missions, there are no female angels, they always obey God.


I don't think they always obey God. Hence the group that is going against God.
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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11/7/2013 11:42:05 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/7/2013 12:57:42 PM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 10:06:21 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 11/7/2013 9:21:53 AM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 8:41:32 AM, annanicole wrote:
"Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman."

Oh, c'mon.

The sons of God that saw the daughters of men, that they were fair.

Who were they the sons of God?

I doubt every seriously if they were angels such as Gabriel and Michael who mated with women.

If not angels then what beings were they? Genesis 6:4There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

It does not seem to say these were natural men of earth, that took the daughters of men. Is there another form of life that has intelligence like men, that the bible mentions besides angels and demons?

If not angels, then it must be demons. If not demons, then it must be angels. I'm not sure what other beings there could be that made the giants.

I would tend to think that the passage more reasonably means that men who held to the faith in God and worshiped him acceptably married and had children with women who derived from groups or clans of people who had long-since abandoned such beliefs/practices. I find that to be much more believable than to think that angels or demons impregnated women.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
seeu46
Posts: 578
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11/8/2013 12:11:17 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/7/2013 11:42:05 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 11/7/2013 12:57:42 PM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 10:06:21 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 11/7/2013 9:21:53 AM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 8:41:32 AM, annanicole wrote:
"Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman."

Oh, c'mon.

The sons of God that saw the daughters of men, that they were fair.

Who were they the sons of God?

I doubt every seriously if they were angels such as Gabriel and Michael who mated with women.

If not angels then what beings were they? Genesis 6:4There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

It does not seem to say these were natural men of earth, that took the daughters of men. Is there another form of life that has intelligence like men, that the bible mentions besides angels and demons?

If not angels, then it must be demons. If not demons, then it must be angels. I'm not sure what other beings there could be that made the giants.

I would tend to think that the passage more reasonably means that men who held to the faith in God and worshiped him acceptably married and had children with women who derived from groups or clans of people who had long-since abandoned such beliefs/practices. I find that to be much more believable than to think that angels or demons impregnated women.

If you look at one of the other times that the phrase sons of God was used. You would see that it is used to represent a time when a humanoid is seen and not understood and seen something more then man. For example Daniel 3:25. If I recall correctly three men were sent to burn in the furnace they recognized them. But the fourth man was stated to be like the son of God.

So by this scripture they believed sons of God, to be something different then just a man. So to me thus far the angel beings for the phrase, sons of God can fit by continuity by the above phrase. The phrase son of God was also used for Adam and of course Jesus. But the context reasons for those two are not the same for this one.
stubs
Posts: 1,887
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11/8/2013 2:41:00 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/7/2013 8:41:32 AM, annanicole wrote:
"Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman."

Oh, c'mon.

I'm not sure it should be dismissed that easily
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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11/8/2013 2:52:00 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/8/2013 2:41:00 PM, stubs wrote:
At 11/7/2013 8:41:32 AM, annanicole wrote:
"Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman."

Oh, c'mon.

I'm not sure it should be dismissed that easily

Ya, and the little gremlins under my bed breed with the fairies. It's ok to have an open mind, but not so open that your brains fall out.
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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11/8/2013 4:44:22 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/8/2013 12:11:17 PM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 11:42:05 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 11/7/2013 12:57:42 PM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 10:06:21 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 11/7/2013 9:21:53 AM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 8:41:32 AM, annanicole wrote:
"Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman."

Oh, c'mon.

The sons of God that saw the daughters of men, that they were fair.

Who were they the sons of God?

I doubt every seriously if they were angels such as Gabriel and Michael who mated with women.

If not angels then what beings were they? Genesis 6:4There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

It does not seem to say these were natural men of earth, that took the daughters of men. Is there another form of life that has intelligence like men, that the bible mentions besides angels and demons?

If not angels, then it must be demons. If not demons, then it must be angels. I'm not sure what other beings there could be that made the giants.

I would tend to think that the passage more reasonably means that men who held to the faith in God and worshiped him acceptably married and had children with women who derived from groups or clans of people who had long-since abandoned such beliefs/practices. I find that to be much more believable than to think that angels or demons impregnated women.


If you look at one of the other times that the phrase sons of God was used. You would see that it is used to represent a time when a humanoid is seen and not understood and seen something more then man. For example Daniel 3:25. If I recall correctly three men were sent to burn in the furnace they recognized them. But the fourth man was stated to be like the son of God.

So by this scripture they believed sons of God, to be something different then just a man. So to me thus far the angel beings for the phrase, sons of God can fit by continuity by the above phrase. The phrase son of God was also used for Adam and of course Jesus. But the context reasons for those two are not the same for this one.

Alright, we'll take a look. The first passage that comes to mind is Gal 3: 26, 27

"For ye are all sons of God, through faith, in Christ Jesus for as many of you as were baptized into Christ did put on Christ."

I doubt very seriously if "sons of God" in that passage refers to humanoids. There is a world of difference, by the way, the "sons of God" and "the Son of God". We are all sons of God. There is but one Son of God - and that is the person who was seen in Dan 3.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
stubs
Posts: 1,887
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11/8/2013 4:56:55 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/8/2013 2:52:00 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 11/8/2013 2:41:00 PM, stubs wrote:
At 11/7/2013 8:41:32 AM, annanicole wrote:
"Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman."

Oh, c'mon.

I'm not sure it should be dismissed that easily

Ya, and the little gremlins under my bed breed with the fairies. It's ok to have an open mind, but not so open that your brains fall out.

I was looking at it from the perspective of a biblical interpretation question.
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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11/8/2013 5:48:48 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
The passage to which you refer, Dan 3: 25, says,

"He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God."

It does not say that it was the Son of God - nor does it really say that it wasn't. Also, in Dan 3: 25 many translations say "gods" - and many say "God". To me, it is arbitrary unless some other inspired writer explains it because what was seen was a resemblance anyway. Whatever that 4th being was, it resembled a divine being.

I have no idea why someone would want to speculate that "humanoid" entities were on earth mating with humans. The phrase "sons of God" always refers to people of faith, people who served God yet you say very emphatically, "Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman." No, they weren't. Such an event (actually multiple events) would surely have been noted somewhere else, and no New Testament writer ever mentions it. However, the intermingling of faithful servants of God with pagans has never produced good results; hence, God prohibited it many times.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Composer
Posts: 5,858
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11/8/2013 6:53:13 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/8/2013 5:48:48 PM, annanicole wrote:
The passage to which you refer, Dan 3: 25, says,

"He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God."

It does not say that it was the Son of God - nor does it really say that it wasn't. Also, in Dan 3: 25 many translations say "gods" - and many say "God". To me, it is arbitrary unless some other inspired writer explains it because what was seen was a resemblance anyway. Whatever that 4th being was, it resembled a divine being.

I have no idea why someone would want to speculate that "humanoid" entities were on earth mating with humans. The phrase "sons of God" always refers to people of faith, people who served God yet you say very emphatically, "Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman." No, they weren't. Such an event (actually multiple events) would surely have been noted somewhere else, and no New Testament writer ever mentions it. However, the intermingling of faithful servants of God with pagans has never produced good results; hence, God prohibited it many times.

1.All existence in Scripture is bodily existence. Nothing is known in Scripture of "materializing" and "dematerializing" "assumed" bodies. J.W.s should be pressed hard for evidence to justify such a doctrine.
2.Luke 20:35, 36 is conclusive - angels do not marry: "But they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage: Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection."

3."Sons of God" can refer to angels as it may in Job 38:7, but the expression is also used of men. (See Deut. 14:1, R.S.V.; Hosea 1:10; Luke 3:38; John 1:12; 1 John 3:1). In Genesis 6:2 the "sons of God" were the righteous line of Seth (Genesis 4:26)2 intermarrying with evil Cainites.
4.It is sometimes contended that only angel-human offspring could produce "nephilim" (mighty ones or giants, cf. Gen. 6:4). But the sons of Anak (Num. 13:33) were also giants, ("nephilim") and these were certainly not angel-human offspring, as they existed long after the flood.
5.Divine angels can not sin. They are "ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who will be heirs of salvation". (Heb. 1:14). These angels are not rebels, but do Yahweh's commandments, "hearkening unto the voice of his word . . . ministers of his, that do his pleasure." (Psa. 103:20, 21).
6.The "spirits in prison" passage in 1 Peter 3:19, 20 is considered elsewhere on this site. (Source: wrestedscriptures.com)
seeu46
Posts: 578
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11/8/2013 11:39:35 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/8/2013 4:44:22 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 11/8/2013 12:11:17 PM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 11:42:05 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 11/7/2013 12:57:42 PM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 10:06:21 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 11/7/2013 9:21:53 AM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 8:41:32 AM, annanicole wrote:
"Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman."

Oh, c'mon.

The sons of God that saw the daughters of men, that they were fair.

Who were they the sons of God?

I doubt every seriously if they were angels such as Gabriel and Michael who mated with women.

If not angels then what beings were they? Genesis 6:4There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

It does not seem to say these were natural men of earth, that took the daughters of men. Is there another form of life that has intelligence like men, that the bible mentions besides angels and demons?

If not angels, then it must be demons. If not demons, then it must be angels. I'm not sure what other beings there could be that made the giants.

I would tend to think that the passage more reasonably means that men who held to the faith in God and worshiped him acceptably married and had children with women who derived from groups or clans of people who had long-since abandoned such beliefs/practices. I find that to be much more believable than to think that angels or demons impregnated women.


If you look at one of the other times that the phrase sons of God was used. You would see that it is used to represent a time when a humanoid is seen and not understood and seen something more then man. For example Daniel 3:25. If I recall correctly three men were sent to burn in the furnace they recognized them. But the fourth man was stated to be like the son of God.

So by this scripture they believed sons of God, to be something different then just a man. So to me thus far the angel beings for the phrase, sons of God can fit by continuity by the above phrase. The phrase son of God was also used for Adam and of course Jesus. But the context reasons for those two are not the same for this one.

Alright, we'll take a look. The first passage that comes to mind is Gal 3: 26, 27

"For ye are all sons of God, through faith, in Christ Jesus for as many of you as were baptized into Christ did put on Christ."

I doubt very seriously if "sons of God" in that passage refers to humanoids. There is a world of difference, by the way, the "sons of God" and "the Son of God". We are all sons of God. There is but one Son of God - and that is the person who was seen in Dan 3.

So Dan 3 was for Jesus?
seeu46
Posts: 578
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11/8/2013 11:49:29 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/8/2013 5:48:48 PM, annanicole wrote:
The passage to which you refer, Dan 3: 25, says,

"He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God."

It does not say that it was the Son of God - nor does it really say that it wasn't. Also, in Dan 3: 25 many translations say "gods" - and many say "God". To me, it is arbitrary unless some other inspired writer explains it because what was seen was a resemblance anyway. Whatever that 4th being was, it resembled a divine being.

Resembled a divine being. I'm not sure if it was Christ back then, how would they have known that was him. But that is just more speculation. How about this verse
Job 1:6
Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them.

Would that not mean there, as angels for "sons of God".


I have no idea why someone would want to speculate that "humanoid" entities were on earth mating with humans. The phrase "sons of God" always refers to people of faith, people who served God yet you say very emphatically, "Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman." No, they weren't. Such an event (actually multiple events) would surely have been noted somewhere else, and no New Testament writer ever mentions it. However, the intermingling of faithful servants of God with pagans has never produced good results; hence, God prohibited it many times.

It was from an old understanding that I used to have but I won't mind that changing. Hence my topic of what are they. If that wasn't them, then so be it. I think the other poster brought up a good point though. These giants where before flood, but even after the flood without mentioning of the sons of God taking more woman to makes these giants. They were still shown as well.
seeu46
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11/8/2013 11:53:24 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/8/2013 6:53:13 PM, Composer wrote:
At 11/8/2013 5:48:48 PM, annanicole wrote:
The passage to which you refer, Dan 3: 25, says,

"He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God."

It does not say that it was the Son of God - nor does it really say that it wasn't. Also, in Dan 3: 25 many translations say "gods" - and many say "God". To me, it is arbitrary unless some other inspired writer explains it because what was seen was a resemblance anyway. Whatever that 4th being was, it resembled a divine being.

I have no idea why someone would want to speculate that "humanoid" entities were on earth mating with humans. The phrase "sons of God" always refers to people of faith, people who served God yet you say very emphatically, "Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman." No, they weren't. Such an event (actually multiple events) would surely have been noted somewhere else, and no New Testament writer ever mentions it. However, the intermingling of faithful servants of God with pagans has never produced good results; hence, God prohibited it many times.

1.All existence in Scripture is bodily existence. Nothing is known in Scripture of "materializing" and "dematerializing" "assumed" bodies. J.W.s should be pressed hard for evidence to justify such a doctrine.
2.Luke 20:35, 36 is conclusive - angels do not marry: "But they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage: Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection."


3."Sons of God" can refer to angels as it may in Job 38:7, but the expression is also used of men. (See Deut. 14:1, R.S.V.; Hosea 1:10; Luke 3:38; John 1:12; 1 John 3:1). In Genesis 6:2 the "sons of God" were the righteous line of Seth (Genesis 4:26)2 intermarrying with evil Cainites.
4.It is sometimes contended that only angel-human offspring could produce "nephilim" (mighty ones or giants, cf. Gen. 6:4). But the sons of Anak (Num. 13:33) were also giants, ("nephilim") and these were certainly not angel-human offspring, as they existed long after the flood.
5.Divine angels can not sin. They are "ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who will be heirs of salvation". (Heb. 1:14). These angels are not rebels, but do Yahweh's commandments, "hearkening unto the voice of his word . . . ministers of his, that do his pleasure." (Psa. 103:20, 21).
6.The "spirits in prison" passage in 1 Peter 3:19, 20 is considered elsewhere on this site. (Source: wrestedscriptures.com)

Who are the "spirits" in prison?
Composer
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11/9/2013 1:25:40 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/8/2013 11:53:24 PM, seeu46 wrote:
Who are the "spirits" in prison?

1. Story book jebus went to Hades because all men go to Hades, good or bad, rich or poor. Hades just means the same as Sheol, "the grave", "the land of silence", where "the dead know nothing", and "sleep" waiting for the resurrection. (Check it out using Youngs or e-Sword).

1 Sam 2:6 The LORD kills and brings to life; He brings down to Sheol and resurrects.
When the OT was translated into Greek by the translators of the Septuagint c300BCE Hades was used as the nearest Greek equivalent to Sheol.

2. Jesus didn't do anything there. "I was dead" Rev 1:18.

3. The idea that Story book jebus preached to dead people in Hades, is based on a misreading of "preached to the spirits in prison" (1 Peter 3:19 KJV) and "led captivity captive" (Ephesians 4:8 KJV).

What Story book Peter is alluding to is that "the spirit of jebus in/through/by means of the prophets", not jebus himself, they preached to the earlier generations of the Old Testament:

cf.

Isaiah 42:7
King James Version (KJV) Story book

7 To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.

Fortunately my eyes are clear to unambiguously detect & see jebus as a 100% Historical MYTH, hence the true ' prisoners ' outside of Story book Land are those involved in the various religious Cults, that corrupt the morally superior secular humanity! (Recent Data also confirms this!)

Cheers!
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11/9/2013 1:46:37 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/8/2013 11:49:29 PM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/8/2013 5:48:48 PM, annanicole wrote:
The passage to which you refer, Dan 3: 25, says,

"He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God."

It does not say that it was the Son of God - nor does it really say that it wasn't. Also, in Dan 3: 25 many translations say "gods" - and many say "God". To me, it is arbitrary unless some other inspired writer explains it because what was seen was a resemblance anyway. Whatever that 4th being was, it resembled a divine being.

Resembled a divine being. I'm not sure if it was Christ back then, how would they have known that was him. But that is just more speculation. How about this verse
Job 1:6
Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them.

Would that not mean there, as angels for "sons of God".



I have no idea why someone would want to speculate that "humanoid" entities were on earth mating with humans. The phrase "sons of God" always refers to people of faith, people who served God yet you say very emphatically, "Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman." No, they weren't. Such an event (actually multiple events) would surely have been noted somewhere else, and no New Testament writer ever mentions it. However, the intermingling of faithful servants of God with pagans has never produced good results; hence, God prohibited it many times.

It was from an old understanding that I used to have but I won't mind that changing. Hence my topic of what are they. If that wasn't them, then so be it. I think the other poster brought up a good point though. These giants where before flood, but even after the flood without mentioning of the sons of God taking more woman to makes these giants. They were still shown as well.

You should try using translations that NEVER use the term ' Satan ' in their narrative!

It makes many things easier to figure out what these various ' Satan ' passages actually refer too, rather than the psychological BS ' inferred claims ' those that abuse that term to mischievously ' imply ' their corrupt ideology by (ab)using Story books that do use that Hebrew Term.

Try the Young's Literal Translation & the EMPHATIC DIAGLOTT NT Interlinear narratives to achieve a far clearer understanding of that Hebrew Term ' Satan! '.
seeu46
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11/9/2013 10:09:23 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/8/2013 11:53:24 PM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/8/2013 6:53:13 PM, Composer wrote:
At 11/8/2013 5:48:48 PM, annanicole wrote:
The passage to which you refer, Dan 3: 25, says,

"He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God."

It does not say that it was the Son of God - nor does it really say that it wasn't. Also, in Dan 3: 25 many translations say "gods" - and many say "God". To me, it is arbitrary unless some other inspired writer explains it because what was seen was a resemblance anyway. Whatever that 4th being was, it resembled a divine being.

I have no idea why someone would want to speculate that "humanoid" entities were on earth mating with humans. The phrase "sons of God" always refers to people of faith, people who served God yet you say very emphatically, "Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman." No, they weren't. Such an event (actually multiple events) would surely have been noted somewhere else, and no New Testament writer ever mentions it. However, the intermingling of faithful servants of God with pagans has never produced good results; hence, God prohibited it many times.

1.All existence in Scripture is bodily existence. Nothing is known in Scripture of "materializing" and "dematerializing" "assumed" bodies. J.W.s should be pressed hard for evidence to justify such a doctrine.
2.Luke 20:35, 36 is conclusive - angels do not marry: "But they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage: Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection."


3."Sons of God" can refer to angels as it may in Job 38:7, but the expression is also used of men. (See Deut. 14:1, R.S.V.; Hosea 1:10; Luke 3:38; John 1:12; 1 John 3:1). In Genesis 6:2 the "sons of God" were the righteous line of Seth (Genesis 4:26)2 intermarrying with evil Cainites.
4.It is sometimes contended that only angel-human offspring could produce "nephilim" (mighty ones or giants, cf. Gen. 6:4). But the sons of Anak (Num. 13:33) were also giants, ("nephilim") and these were certainly not angel-human offspring, as they existed long after the flood.
5.Divine angels can not sin. They are "ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who will be heirs of salvation". (Heb. 1:14). These angels are not rebels, but do Yahweh's commandments, "hearkening unto the voice of his word . . . ministers of his, that do his pleasure." (Psa. 103:20, 21).
6.The "spirits in prison" passage in 1 Peter 3:19, 20 is considered elsewhere on this site. (Source: wrestedscriptures.com)

Who are the "spirits" in prison?

Incorrect passage that I remembered here it is.

Jude 6
And the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned heir own home--these he has kept in darkness, bound with ever lasting chains for judgment on the great day. 7 In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah

As it compares it to a sexual perversions of Sodom and Gomorrah.

I believe some believe this referring to the sons of God from the OT.
bornofgod
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11/9/2013 10:34:38 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/8/2013 4:44:22 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 11/8/2013 12:11:17 PM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 11:42:05 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 11/7/2013 12:57:42 PM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 10:06:21 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 11/7/2013 9:21:53 AM, seeu46 wrote:
At 11/7/2013 8:41:32 AM, annanicole wrote:
"Angels were noted in the old testament to breed with human woman."

Oh, c'mon.

The sons of God that saw the daughters of men, that they were fair.

Who were they the sons of God?

I doubt every seriously if they were angels such as Gabriel and Michael who mated with women.

If not angels then what beings were they? Genesis 6:4There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

It does not seem to say these were natural men of earth, that took the daughters of men. Is there another form of life that has intelligence like men, that the bible mentions besides angels and demons?

If not angels, then it must be demons. If not demons, then it must be angels. I'm not sure what other beings there could be that made the giants.

I would tend to think that the passage more reasonably means that men who held to the faith in God and worshiped him acceptably married and had children with women who derived from groups or clans of people who had long-since abandoned such beliefs/practices. I find that to be much more believable than to think that angels or demons impregnated women.


If you look at one of the other times that the phrase sons of God was used. You would see that it is used to represent a time when a humanoid is seen and not understood and seen something more then man. For example Daniel 3:25. If I recall correctly three men were sent to burn in the furnace they recognized them. But the fourth man was stated to be like the son of God.

So by this scripture they believed sons of God, to be something different then just a man. So to me thus far the angel beings for the phrase, sons of God can fit by continuity by the above phrase. The phrase son of God was also used for Adam and of course Jesus. But the context reasons for those two are not the same for this one.

Alright, we'll take a look. The first passage that comes to mind is Gal 3: 26, 27

"For ye are all sons of God, through faith, in Christ Jesus for as many of you as were baptized into Christ did put on Christ."

I doubt very seriously if "sons of God" in that passage refers to humanoids. There is a world of difference, by the way, the "sons of God" and "the Son of God". We are all sons of God. There is but one Son of God - and that is the person who was seen in Dan 3.

Us saints of God learn that we are the invisible son of God where we speak from.