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Jesus resurrection, but no UFO abductions?

Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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11/16/2013 12:19:27 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Here is a true story[1]: Five witnesses claimed to see their co-worker Travis Walter get abducted by Aliens after he went missing. The police obviously grew suspicious that these men killed off their co-worker. However, not only were all of their stories consistent with one another, but they all passed the lie detector tests with flying colors. They all genuinely believed there friend had been abducted by Aliens. Travis was missing for 5 days, and they found him naked and in shock. So, we have the facts:

Fact 1: 5 witnesses truly believed that they saw Travis Walter rise into a space-ship
Fact 2: Travis was missing for 5 days
Fact 3: When Travis was found, he was in shock; he also truly believed he was abducted by Aliens.

Since it is extremely unlikely they all suffered from delusions or hallucinations in a "group like" fashion, then the best explanation of these facts is that Travis really was raised into a space ship and held hostage for 5 days.

This is the exact same logic theists use to claim that Jesus rose from the dead. If you don"t accept that Travis rose to the space ship based on those facts, why believe Jesus rose from the dead based on the facts theists present that "best explains" it?
Mikal
Posts: 11,270
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11/16/2013 12:47:21 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/16/2013 12:19:27 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
Here is a true story[1]: Five witnesses claimed to see their co-worker Travis Walter get abducted by Aliens after he went missing. The police obviously grew suspicious that these men killed off their co-worker. However, not only were all of their stories consistent with one another, but they all passed the lie detector tests with flying colors. They all genuinely believed there friend had been abducted by Aliens. Travis was missing for 5 days, and they found him naked and in shock. So, we have the facts:

Fact 1: 5 witnesses truly believed that they saw Travis Walter rise into a space-ship
Fact 2: Travis was missing for 5 days
Fact 3: When Travis was found, he was in shock; he also truly believed he was abducted by Aliens.

Since it is extremely unlikely they all suffered from delusions or hallucinations in a "group like" fashion, then the best explanation of these facts is that Travis really was raised into a space ship and held hostage for 5 days.

This is the exact same logic theists use to claim that Jesus rose from the dead. If you don"t accept that Travis rose to the space ship based on those facts, why believe Jesus rose from the dead based on the facts theists present that "best explains" it?

He was naked so he prob was anal probed, this is quite logical and follows suit with most other accounts of people whom witness ufos.
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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11/16/2013 12:55:20 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/16/2013 12:47:21 PM, Mikal wrote:
At 11/16/2013 12:19:27 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
Here is a true story[1]: Five witnesses claimed to see their co-worker Travis Walter get abducted by Aliens after he went missing. The police obviously grew suspicious that these men killed off their co-worker. However, not only were all of their stories consistent with one another, but they all passed the lie detector tests with flying colors. They all genuinely believed there friend had been abducted by Aliens. Travis was missing for 5 days, and they found him naked and in shock. So, we have the facts:

Fact 1: 5 witnesses truly believed that they saw Travis Walter rise into a space-ship
Fact 2: Travis was missing for 5 days
Fact 3: When Travis was found, he was in shock; he also truly believed he was abducted by Aliens.

Since it is extremely unlikely they all suffered from delusions or hallucinations in a "group like" fashion, then the best explanation of these facts is that Travis really was raised into a space ship and held hostage for 5 days.

This is the exact same logic theists use to claim that Jesus rose from the dead. If you don"t accept that Travis rose to the space ship based on those facts, why believe Jesus rose from the dead based on the facts theists present that "best explains" it?

He was naked so he prob was anal probed, this is quite logical and follows suit with most other accounts of people whom witness ufos.

Haha Actually it was only in the movie "Fire in the Sky" that he was naked (the movie this true story is based upon). I did a little more research and the sources show that he was found in the same clothes he had on when he left.

My whole point is that we can say that he really did most likely get abducted based on the same reasoning the theists use to say Jesus rose based on historical facts (which are clearly not as reliable as historical facts from the 70's). If group hallucinations and delusions are too unlikely like theists claim, and they all passed the ploygraphs with flying colors and had nothing to gain but embarrassment by claiming to see Aliens; we can say that Travis was most likely abducted.

If the theists accept Jesus resurrection on that same type of argument, they have to accept the Travis Walker abduction story as true.
Mikal
Posts: 11,270
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11/16/2013 12:58:37 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/16/2013 12:55:20 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 11/16/2013 12:47:21 PM, Mikal wrote:
At 11/16/2013 12:19:27 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
Here is a true story[1]: Five witnesses claimed to see their co-worker Travis Walter get abducted by Aliens after he went missing. The police obviously grew suspicious that these men killed off their co-worker. However, not only were all of their stories consistent with one another, but they all passed the lie detector tests with flying colors. They all genuinely believed there friend had been abducted by Aliens. Travis was missing for 5 days, and they found him naked and in shock. So, we have the facts:

Fact 1: 5 witnesses truly believed that they saw Travis Walter rise into a space-ship
Fact 2: Travis was missing for 5 days
Fact 3: When Travis was found, he was in shock; he also truly believed he was abducted by Aliens.

Since it is extremely unlikely they all suffered from delusions or hallucinations in a "group like" fashion, then the best explanation of these facts is that Travis really was raised into a space ship and held hostage for 5 days.

This is the exact same logic theists use to claim that Jesus rose from the dead. If you don"t accept that Travis rose to the space ship based on those facts, why believe Jesus rose from the dead based on the facts theists present that "best explains" it?

He was naked so he prob was anal probed, this is quite logical and follows suit with most other accounts of people whom witness ufos.

Haha Actually it was only in the movie "Fire in the Sky" that he was naked (the movie this true story is based upon). I did a little more research and the sources show that he was found in the same clothes he had on when he left.

My whole point is that we can say that he really did most likely get abducted based on the same reasoning the theists use to say Jesus rose based on historical facts (which are clearly not as reliable as historical facts from the 70's). If group hallucinations and delusions are too unlikely like theists claim, and they all passed the ploygraphs with flying colors and had nothing to gain but embarrassment by claiming to see Aliens; we can say that Travis was most likely abducted.

If the theists accept Jesus resurrection on that same type of argument, they have to accept the Travis Walker abduction story as true.

Consider in time comparisons though. We don't even know if the people existed in the bible, that saw jesus rise to heaven. We can physically interview and test the people whom saw the guy rise into a space ship. So given the evidence would it not be slighly more logical to assume ufo > jesus
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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11/16/2013 1:13:40 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/16/2013 12:58:37 PM, Mikal wrote:
At 11/16/2013 12:55:20 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 11/16/2013 12:47:21 PM, Mikal wrote:
At 11/16/2013 12:19:27 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
Here is a true story[1]: Five witnesses claimed to see their co-worker Travis Walter get abducted by Aliens after he went missing. The police obviously grew suspicious that these men killed off their co-worker. However, not only were all of their stories consistent with one another, but they all passed the lie detector tests with flying colors. They all genuinely believed there friend had been abducted by Aliens. Travis was missing for 5 days, and they found him naked and in shock. So, we have the facts:

Fact 1: 5 witnesses truly believed that they saw Travis Walter rise into a space-ship
Fact 2: Travis was missing for 5 days
Fact 3: When Travis was found, he was in shock; he also truly believed he was abducted by Aliens.

Since it is extremely unlikely they all suffered from delusions or hallucinations in a "group like" fashion, then the best explanation of these facts is that Travis really was raised into a space ship and held hostage for 5 days.

This is the exact same logic theists use to claim that Jesus rose from the dead. If you don"t accept that Travis rose to the space ship based on those facts, why believe Jesus rose from the dead based on the facts theists present that "best explains" it?

He was naked so he prob was anal probed, this is quite logical and follows suit with most other accounts of people whom witness ufos.

Haha Actually it was only in the movie "Fire in the Sky" that he was naked (the movie this true story is based upon). I did a little more research and the sources show that he was found in the same clothes he had on when he left.

My whole point is that we can say that he really did most likely get abducted based on the same reasoning the theists use to say Jesus rose based on historical facts (which are clearly not as reliable as historical facts from the 70's). If group hallucinations and delusions are too unlikely like theists claim, and they all passed the ploygraphs with flying colors and had nothing to gain but embarrassment by claiming to see Aliens; we can say that Travis was most likely abducted.

If the theists accept Jesus resurrection on that same type of argument, they have to accept the Travis Walker abduction story as true.

Consider in time comparisons though. We don't even know if the people existed in the bible, that saw jesus rise to heaven. We can physically interview and test the people whom saw the guy rise into a space ship. So given the evidence would it not be slighly more logical to assume ufo > jesus

Yes, I would say so. All 5 men who claimed to see the space ship shoot a beam at their friend and strike him down passed the polygraph tests:

"There's no doubt they're telling the truth." - Sheriff Gillespie

So, if the theists accept a resurrection story that is clearly less reliable, and less recent, why not an Aliens story? I don't believe either; I'm just making a point.
Mikal
Posts: 11,270
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11/16/2013 1:14:29 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/16/2013 1:13:40 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 11/16/2013 12:58:37 PM, Mikal wrote:
At 11/16/2013 12:55:20 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 11/16/2013 12:47:21 PM, Mikal wrote:
At 11/16/2013 12:19:27 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
Here is a true story[1]: Five witnesses claimed to see their co-worker Travis Walter get abducted by Aliens after he went missing. The police obviously grew suspicious that these men killed off their co-worker. However, not only were all of their stories consistent with one another, but they all passed the lie detector tests with flying colors. They all genuinely believed there friend had been abducted by Aliens. Travis was missing for 5 days, and they found him naked and in shock. So, we have the facts:

Fact 1: 5 witnesses truly believed that they saw Travis Walter rise into a space-ship
Fact 2: Travis was missing for 5 days
Fact 3: When Travis was found, he was in shock; he also truly believed he was abducted by Aliens.

Since it is extremely unlikely they all suffered from delusions or hallucinations in a "group like" fashion, then the best explanation of these facts is that Travis really was raised into a space ship and held hostage for 5 days.

This is the exact same logic theists use to claim that Jesus rose from the dead. If you don"t accept that Travis rose to the space ship based on those facts, why believe Jesus rose from the dead based on the facts theists present that "best explains" it?

He was naked so he prob was anal probed, this is quite logical and follows suit with most other accounts of people whom witness ufos.

Haha Actually it was only in the movie "Fire in the Sky" that he was naked (the movie this true story is based upon). I did a little more research and the sources show that he was found in the same clothes he had on when he left.

My whole point is that we can say that he really did most likely get abducted based on the same reasoning the theists use to say Jesus rose based on historical facts (which are clearly not as reliable as historical facts from the 70's). If group hallucinations and delusions are too unlikely like theists claim, and they all passed the ploygraphs with flying colors and had nothing to gain but embarrassment by claiming to see Aliens; we can say that Travis was most likely abducted.

If the theists accept Jesus resurrection on that same type of argument, they have to accept the Travis Walker abduction story as true.

Consider in time comparisons though. We don't even know if the people existed in the bible, that saw jesus rise to heaven. We can physically interview and test the people whom saw the guy rise into a space ship. So given the evidence would it not be slighly more logical to assume ufo > jesus

Yes, I would say so. All 5 men who claimed to see the space ship shoot a beam at their friend and strike him down passed the polygraph tests:

"There's no doubt they're telling the truth." - Sheriff Gillespie

So, if the theists accept a resurrection story that is clearly less reliable, and less recent, why not an Aliens story? I don't believe either; I'm just making a point.

Even the sheriff said so , it has to be true.
Chase200mph
Posts: 332
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11/17/2013 8:53:56 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/16/2013 12:19:27 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
Here is a true story[1]: Five witnesses claimed to see their co-worker Travis Walter get abducted by Aliens after he went missing. The police obviously grew suspicious that these men killed off their co-worker. However, not only were all of their stories consistent with one another, but they all passed the lie detector tests with flying colors. They all genuinely believed there friend had been abducted by Aliens. Travis was missing for 5 days, and they found him naked and in shock. So, we have the facts:

Fact 1: 5 witnesses truly believed that they saw Travis Walter rise into a space-ship
Fact 2: Travis was missing for 5 days
Fact 3: When Travis was found, he was in shock; he also truly believed he was abducted by Aliens.

Since it is extremely unlikely they all suffered from delusions or hallucinations in a "group like" fashion, then the best explanation of these facts is that Travis really was raised into a space ship and held hostage for 5 days.

This is the exact same logic theists use to claim that Jesus rose from the dead. If you don"t accept that Travis rose to the space ship based on those facts, why believe Jesus rose from the dead based on the facts theists present that "best explains" it?

Fact 1: 5 witnesses truly believed that they saw Travis Walter rise into a space-ship

Answer: Well, not really, five people had the same story, third beliefs is subjective of whether you want to believe their story or not.
Fact 2: Travis was missing for 5 days
Answer; Missing , not seen again, subjective".

Fact 3: When Travis was found, he was in shock;

Answer: Again, subjective"..

he also truly believed he was abducted by Aliens.

Answer: This was the claim, it is not a fact again, subjective on the bias whether you want to believe or not.
While an otherwise educated intelligent person may still believe in the bible, that person would have no educated or intellectual reason to do so.
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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11/17/2013 9:05:01 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 11/17/2013 8:53:56 PM, Chase200mph wrote:
At 11/16/2013 12:19:27 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
Here is a true story[1]: Five witnesses claimed to see their co-worker Travis Walter get abducted by Aliens after he went missing. The police obviously grew suspicious that these men killed off their co-worker. However, not only were all of their stories consistent with one another, but they all passed the lie detector tests with flying colors. They all genuinely believed there friend had been abducted by Aliens. Travis was missing for 5 days, and they found him naked and in shock. So, we have the facts:

Fact 1: 5 witnesses truly believed that they saw Travis Walter rise into a space-ship
Fact 2: Travis was missing for 5 days
Fact 3: When Travis was found, he was in shock; he also truly believed he was abducted by Aliens.

Since it is extremely unlikely they all suffered from delusions or hallucinations in a "group like" fashion, then the best explanation of these facts is that Travis really was raised into a space ship and held hostage for 5 days.

This is the exact same logic theists use to claim that Jesus rose from the dead. If you don"t accept that Travis rose to the space ship based on those facts, why believe Jesus rose from the dead based on the facts theists present that "best explains" it?


Fact 1: 5 witnesses truly believed that they saw Travis Walter rise into a space-ship

Answer: Well, not really, five people had the same story, third beliefs is subjective of whether you want to believe their story or not.

They all passed lie detector tests. Are you saying all 5 were hallucinating?

Fact 2: Travis was missing for 5 days
Answer; Missing , not seen again, subjective".

No, that's an objective fact. He was missing for 5 days.


Fact 3: When Travis was found, he was in shock;

Answer: Again, subjective"..


he also truly believed he was abducted by Aliens.

Answer: This was the claim, it is not a fact again, subjective on the bias whether you want to believe or not.

That was the claim. He claimed to be abducted by Aliens and passed 7 polygraphs. The 5 co-workers who said they seen the craft shoot a beam of light at him all passed the polygraphs as well.

That is way stronger evidence than anything for Jesus's resurrection!
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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11/17/2013 9:07:04 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
If we can brush this off as hallucination, then we can brush off the appearances of Jesus to the disciples as hallucinations based on the same grounds.