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Is religion merely a language?

muslimnomore
Posts: 369
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12/6/2013 8:42:18 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Let's talk about this.

I think Reza Aslan has some great ideas. It seems to me that he views religion as a way to express feelings, emotions and hopes. It seems that he argues that the religious beliefs that some take literally were always meant to be metaphors and lessons.

He has, at times, suggested that the authors of some religious scriptures had no interest in making factual claims about the characters that they wrote about. That they made up stories about certain characters to project and propagate moral values that they held dear.

Can I call myself a Muslim whilst not believing in the Quran and ahadith literally? Can I call myself a Muslim if I don't believe in the truth of the stories of the Quran but merely espouse some of the morality highlighted by them?

Can I just use the prayers of a religion as a way to comfort myself and others and not as an actual plea to a supernatural being?

Can Islam, or Christianity, be the language I use to speak about my values, hopes and dreams? Or do these religions have to be a set of beliefs about a supernatural being?

If this is very confusing, let me know I will try to explain it in different words. If you 'kind of' see what I am talking about here, talk to me.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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12/6/2013 9:34:37 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 8:42:18 PM, muslimnomore wrote:


Let's talk about this.

I think Reza Aslan has some great ideas. It seems to me that he views religion as a way to express feelings, emotions and hopes. It seems that he argues that the religious beliefs that some take literally were always meant to be metaphors and lessons.

He has, at times, suggested that the authors of some religious scriptures had no interest in making factual claims about the characters that they wrote about. That they made up stories about certain characters to project and propagate moral values that they held dear.

Can I call myself a Muslim whilst not believing in the Quran and ahadith literally? Can I call myself a Muslim if I don't believe in the truth of the stories of the Quran but merely espouse some of the morality highlighted by them?

Can I just use the prayers of a religion as a way to comfort myself and others and not as an actual plea to a supernatural being?

Can Islam, or Christianity, be the language I use to speak about my values, hopes and dreams? Or do these religions have to be a set of beliefs about a supernatural being?

If this is very confusing, let me know I will try to explain it in different words. If you 'kind of' see what I am talking about here, talk to me.

Our invisible Creator planned a very strong delusion during this age. Lucifer, also known as the "tree of the knowledge of good and evil" are names of the delusion, which is everything we see in this world, including man's flesh.

Another part of the delusion is called the beast, which is God's plan to teach men how to build things so that He could use these things as analogies to help His saints understand our invisible created existence as energy.

The beast caused man to seek the Truth but instead, gave them religious ideas and building techniques from observing the stars and using imaginary lines to connect stars to get building shapes such as squares, rectangles, triangles and intersections. Later on, when they were mining earthen materials for their false gods ( buildings ), they found quartz and other minerals that had shapes called pentagons, hexagons, etc.

So the star constellations and some minerals in the earth became false gods that the Babylonians, Persians, Greeks, Romans, and Christians built with their human hands.

Besides putting thoughts in their minds of how to build these false gods, our Creator gave them thoughts that produced stories about their false gods. This is how the various worldly languages got started. Each architect that God used to put building ideas in his mind became the King of the people who admired his building techniques. The ideas that our Creator put in their minds to develop a story about their false god became their own language. Each new architect that split from this group would be used by our Creator to develop new building ideas and new stories so different languages resulted from these new groups.

However, the prophets and saints were used by our Creator to speak from His hidden knowledge that revealed who the true Creator was and that we came from an invisible Kingdom that we now know as energy. Those people who love their false gods in this world hate the Truth that our true Creator is invisible so they killed the prophets and saints who spoke the Truth.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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12/6/2013 9:39:14 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 8:42:18 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
Can I call myself a Muslim
Yes.

whilst not believing in the Quran and ahadith literally?
Yes, but that won't make you one. Same as calling yourself smart or intelligent - none you really are.
muslimnomore
Posts: 369
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12/6/2013 9:54:38 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
The beast caused man to seek the Truth but instead, gave them religious ideas and building techniques from observing the stars and using imaginary lines to connect stars to get building shapes such as squares, rectangles, triangles and intersections. Later on, when they were mining earthen materials for their false gods ( buildings ), they found quartz and other minerals that had shapes called pentagons, hexagons, etc.



did any of these 'minerals' resemble blue crystals such as the ones popularized by the tv show 'breaking bad'?
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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12/6/2013 10:16:23 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 9:54:38 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
The beast caused man to seek the Truth but instead, gave them religious ideas and building techniques from observing the stars and using imaginary lines to connect stars to get building shapes such as squares, rectangles, triangles and intersections. Later on, when they were mining earthen materials for their false gods ( buildings ), they found quartz and other minerals that had shapes called pentagons, hexagons, etc.



did any of these 'minerals' resemble blue crystals such as the ones popularized by the tv show 'breaking bad'?

God's stupid people ask Him stupid questions. God's chosen believers don't need to ask any questions because they hear Him speak to them.
muslimnomore
Posts: 369
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12/6/2013 10:23:37 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 10:16:23 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 12/6/2013 9:54:38 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
The beast caused man to seek the Truth but instead, gave them religious ideas and building techniques from observing the stars and using imaginary lines to connect stars to get building shapes such as squares, rectangles, triangles and intersections. Later on, when they were mining earthen materials for their false gods ( buildings ), they found quartz and other minerals that had shapes called pentagons, hexagons, etc.



did any of these 'minerals' resemble blue crystals such as the ones popularized by the tv show 'breaking bad'?

God's stupid people ask Him stupid questions. God's chosen believers don't need to ask any questions because they hear Him speak to them.

Dear saint, please cure my stupidity. I wish to be wise and high like you, without the negative effects of narcotics.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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12/6/2013 10:43:47 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 10:23:37 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
At 12/6/2013 10:16:23 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 12/6/2013 9:54:38 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
The beast caused man to seek the Truth but instead, gave them religious ideas and building techniques from observing the stars and using imaginary lines to connect stars to get building shapes such as squares, rectangles, triangles and intersections. Later on, when they were mining earthen materials for their false gods ( buildings ), they found quartz and other minerals that had shapes called pentagons, hexagons, etc.



did any of these 'minerals' resemble blue crystals such as the ones popularized by the tv show 'breaking bad'?

God's stupid people ask Him stupid questions. God's chosen believers don't need to ask any questions because they hear Him speak to them.

Dear saint, please cure my stupidity. I wish to be wise and high like you, without the negative effects of narcotics.

Wisdom begins by listening to a man with wisdom from our Creator, not by listening to the wisdom of this world that only confuses man and causes fear. So stupid questions can't be answered with God's wisdom. It's best to be patient and read my testimonies or listen to me preach the gospel, which is God's voice, and my created existence called the Word of God.
muslimnomore
Posts: 369
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12/6/2013 10:45:23 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 10:43:47 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 12/6/2013 10:23:37 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
At 12/6/2013 10:16:23 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 12/6/2013 9:54:38 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
The beast caused man to seek the Truth but instead, gave them religious ideas and building techniques from observing the stars and using imaginary lines to connect stars to get building shapes such as squares, rectangles, triangles and intersections. Later on, when they were mining earthen materials for their false gods ( buildings ), they found quartz and other minerals that had shapes called pentagons, hexagons, etc.



did any of these 'minerals' resemble blue crystals such as the ones popularized by the tv show 'breaking bad'?

God's stupid people ask Him stupid questions. God's chosen believers don't need to ask any questions because they hear Him speak to them.

Dear saint, please cure my stupidity. I wish to be wise and high like you, without the negative effects of narcotics.

Wisdom begins by listening to a man with wisdom from our Creator, not by listening to the wisdom of this world that only confuses man and causes fear. So stupid questions can't be answered with God's wisdom. It's best to be patient and read my testimonies or listen to me preach the gospel, which is God's voice, and my created existence called the Word of God.

where can i listen to you preach o great one?
muslimnomore
Posts: 369
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12/6/2013 10:47:36 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 9:39:14 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 12/6/2013 8:42:18 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
Can I call myself a Muslim
Yes.

whilst not believing in the Quran and ahadith literally?
Yes, but that won't make you one. Same as calling yourself smart or intelligent - none you really are.
What do yu think about these ahadith:
From Bukhari

Allah's Messenger said, "If a husband calls his wife to his bed (i.e. to have sexual relation) and she refuses and causes him to sleep in anger, the Angels will curse her till morning."

From Tirmidhi

Allah's Messenger said, "When a man calls his wife to satisfy his desire she must go to him even if she is occupied at the oven!"

Should a woman be cursed by the angels for refusing sex with her husband?
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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12/6/2013 11:05:59 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 10:47:36 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
Should a woman be cursed by the angels for refusing sex with her husband?
If she accepts the preconditions for marriage, then yes. Heard of a marriage contract? No?
muslimnomore
Posts: 369
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12/6/2013 11:11:09 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 11:05:59 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 12/6/2013 10:47:36 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
Should a woman be cursed by the angels for refusing sex with her husband?
If she accepts the preconditions for marriage, then yes. Heard of a marriage contract? No?

yeah, i had a nikah myself. i signed a 'nikah-namah' as they call it in urdu.
and before you say it, i feel sorry for my wife too.
neither of us knew she was signing away her ability to say no to sex for the rest of her life.
but thanks for your honest answer.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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12/6/2013 11:12:16 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 10:45:23 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
At 12/6/2013 10:43:47 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 12/6/2013 10:23:37 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
At 12/6/2013 10:16:23 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 12/6/2013 9:54:38 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
The beast caused man to seek the Truth but instead, gave them religious ideas and building techniques from observing the stars and using imaginary lines to connect stars to get building shapes such as squares, rectangles, triangles and intersections. Later on, when they were mining earthen materials for their false gods ( buildings ), they found quartz and other minerals that had shapes called pentagons, hexagons, etc.



did any of these 'minerals' resemble blue crystals such as the ones popularized by the tv show 'breaking bad'?

God's stupid people ask Him stupid questions. God's chosen believers don't need to ask any questions because they hear Him speak to them.

Dear saint, please cure my stupidity. I wish to be wise and high like you, without the negative effects of narcotics.

Wisdom begins by listening to a man with wisdom from our Creator, not by listening to the wisdom of this world that only confuses man and causes fear. So stupid questions can't be answered with God's wisdom. It's best to be patient and read my testimonies or listen to me preach the gospel, which is God's voice, and my created existence called the Word of God.

where can i listen to you preach o great one?

On Skype.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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12/6/2013 11:15:42 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 11:11:09 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
neither of us knew she was signing away her ability to say no to sex for the rest of her life.
So you and your wife are stupid. Pretty common combination.

but thanks for your honest answer.
You're welcome. Really though - look up contract.
muslimnomore
Posts: 369
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12/6/2013 11:16:17 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 11:12:16 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 12/6/2013 10:45:23 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
At 12/6/2013 10:43:47 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 12/6/2013 10:23:37 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
At 12/6/2013 10:16:23 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 12/6/2013 9:54:38 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
The beast caused man to seek the Truth but instead, gave them religious ideas and building techniques from observing the stars and using imaginary lines to connect stars to get building shapes such as squares, rectangles, triangles and intersections. Later on, when they were mining earthen materials for their false gods ( buildings ), they found quartz and other minerals that had shapes called pentagons, hexagons, etc.



did any of these 'minerals' resemble blue crystals such as the ones popularized by the tv show 'breaking bad'?

God's stupid people ask Him stupid questions. God's chosen believers don't need to ask any questions because they hear Him speak to them.

Dear saint, please cure my stupidity. I wish to be wise and high like you, without the negative effects of narcotics.

Wisdom begins by listening to a man with wisdom from our Creator, not by listening to the wisdom of this world that only confuses man and causes fear. So stupid questions can't be answered with God's wisdom. It's best to be patient and read my testimonies or listen to me preach the gospel, which is God's voice, and my created existence called the Word of God.

where can i listen to you preach o great one?

On Skype.

wow
muslimnomore
Posts: 369
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12/6/2013 11:22:49 PM
Posted: 3 years ago

So you and your wife are stupid. Pretty common combination.



yeah, because assuming islam doesn't require women to enter into sexual slavery in order to get married makes one stupid.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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12/6/2013 11:30:31 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 11:22:49 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
yeah, because assuming islam doesn't require women to enter into sexual slavery in order to get married makes one stupid.
It's not slavery if it's consensual. Again, look up contract. You obviously don't look into the good reasons for Islam encouraging both parties to stay active in terms of romance. Do some reading. I'm not handing out free lectures.
muslimnomore
Posts: 369
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12/6/2013 11:35:59 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 11:30:31 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 12/6/2013 11:22:49 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
yeah, because assuming islam doesn't require women to enter into sexual slavery in order to get married makes one stupid.
It's not slavery if it's consensual. Again, look up contract. You obviously don't look into the good reasons for Islam encouraging both parties to stay active in terms of romance. Do some reading. I'm not handing out free lectures.

i don't know if you're married yet. if not, here's what i think you should do.

tell the girl's parents that you are going to make her sign a contract whereby she consents to never refusing your requests for sex.

come back and tell me how painful the slap was.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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12/6/2013 11:41:31 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 11:35:59 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
i don't know if you're married yet. if not, here's what i think you should do.
Let's hear.

tell the girl's parents that you are going to make her sign a contract whereby she consents to never refusing your requests for sex.
No, as I think couples should agree to make it consensual at all points. Again, contract.

come back and tell me how painful the slap was.
If they tried to slap me, I'd enter their daughter's vagina like Hitler entered Poland.
muslimnomore
Posts: 369
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12/6/2013 11:42:51 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
If they tried to slap me, I'd enter their daughter's vagina like Hitler entered Poland.

o..... k..
2-D
Posts: 226
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12/7/2013 3:08:12 PM
Posted: 3 years ago

Can I call myself a Muslim whilst not believing in the Quran and ahadith literally? Can I call myself a Muslim if I don't believe in the truth of the stories of the Quran but merely espouse some of the morality highlighted by them?


Secular Judaism is now the accepted fifth branch of the religion. I have noticed that many Catholics amount to cultural Catholics and don't necessarily have a strong conviction.

I think it's fine to stay within a religious culture without believing. This can be very difficult tho if everyone expects you to have a strong faith. If you would be shunned from a community for your lack of belief this can be a difficult secret to keep. I have tried in the Christian community.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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12/7/2013 3:12:52 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/7/2013 3:08:12 PM, 2-D wrote:

Can I call myself a Muslim whilst not believing in the Quran and ahadith literally? Can I call myself a Muslim if I don't believe in the truth of the stories of the Quran but merely espouse some of the morality highlighted by them?


Secular Judaism is now the accepted fifth branch of the religion. I have noticed that many Catholics amount to cultural Catholics and don't necessarily have a strong conviction.

I think it's fine to stay within a religious culture without believing. This can be very difficult tho if everyone expects you to have a strong faith. If you would be shunned from a community for your lack of belief this can be a difficult secret to keep. I have tried in the Christian community.

Some antichrists and false prophets really believe they know our Creator and speak for Him like we saints and prophets are used for.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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12/7/2013 9:42:28 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/6/2013 11:42:51 PM, muslimnomore wrote:
If they tried to slap me, I'd enter their daughter's vagina like Hitler entered Poland.

o..... k..
Relax Ma'am, not everything is serious here.