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Atheists!

bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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1/21/2014 8:41:48 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/21/2014 8:17:53 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
If we directly evolved from apes then why are there still apes?

Atheism-0
Christians- 9001

hahahahahahahahahahaha
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Fox-McCloud
Posts: 158
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1/21/2014 8:44:08 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
This should do it:

http://rationalwiki.org...
Abortion Is Generally Morally Reprehensible: http://www.debate.org...

The instant we feel anger we have already ceased striving for the truth, and have begun striving for ourselves - Archibald Alison

Bliss was it in that dawn to be alive, but to be young was very heaven! - William Wordsworth
dadman
Posts: 272
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1/21/2014 9:02:20 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Atheism is an intellectual position .. What reasons do you atheists have for holding that position ? .. Your reasons are based upon logic and/or evidence or lack of it .. So .. is there any reason/evidence for you holding your position that you defend ? .......

If you say that atheism needs no evidence or reason .. then you are holding a position that has no evidence or rational basis ? .. If so .. then isn't that simply faith ?
And he (God) gave some apostles .. and some prophets .. and some evangelists .. and some teaching pastors .. for the perfecting of the saints .. for the work of the ministry .. for the edifying of the body of Christ .. till we all come in the unity of the faith .. and of the knowledge of the Son of God .. to a perfect (complete) man .. to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ . . . . Ephesians 4:12 .. http://dadmansabode.com... .. come and learn
GarretKadeDupre
Posts: 2,023
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1/21/2014 9:08:06 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/21/2014 9:02:20 AM, dadman wrote:
Atheism is an intellectual position .. What reasons do you atheists have for holding that position ? .. Your reasons are based upon logic and/or evidence or lack of it .. So .. is there any reason/evidence for you holding your position that you defend ? .......

If you say that atheism needs no evidence or reason .. then you are holding a position that has no evidence or rational basis ? .. If so .. then isn't that simply faith ?

I agree.
Proof that people witnessed living dinosaurs:
http://www.debate.org...
Gordontrek
Posts: 11
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1/21/2014 9:10:28 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
I am not an atheist, and I oppose much of their viewpoint.... but this question is just embarrassing. Look, the whole idea behind evolution is that apes and humans come from a "common ancestor." Both us and apes are supposed to have come from an ape-like form, not apes themselves. This is an argument that nobody should use....
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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1/21/2014 9:19:59 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/21/2014 9:02:20 AM, dadman wrote:
Atheism is an intellectual position .. What reasons do you atheists have for holding that position ? .. Your reasons are based upon logic and/or evidence or lack of it .. So .. is there any reason/evidence for you holding your position that you defend ? .......

If you say that atheism needs no evidence or reason .. then you are holding a position that has no evidence or rational basis ? .. If so .. then isn't that simply faith ?

Man claims that gods exist. I reject those claims.
What evidence do I need?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
dadman
Posts: 272
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1/21/2014 9:39:42 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
If you say that atheism is supported by the lack of evidence for God .. then it is only your opinion that there is no evidence .. You cannot know all evidence for or against God .. therefore you cannot say there is no evidence for God .. Your atheism then .. is nothing more than an opinion ..
And he (God) gave some apostles .. and some prophets .. and some evangelists .. and some teaching pastors .. for the perfecting of the saints .. for the work of the ministry .. for the edifying of the body of Christ .. till we all come in the unity of the faith .. and of the knowledge of the Son of God .. to a perfect (complete) man .. to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ . . . . Ephesians 4:12 .. http://dadmansabode.com... .. come and learn
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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1/21/2014 9:51:06 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/21/2014 9:39:42 AM, dadman wrote:
If you say that atheism is supported by the lack of evidence for God .. then it is only your opinion that there is no evidence .. You cannot know all evidence for or against God .. therefore you cannot say there is no evidence for God .. Your atheism then .. is nothing more than an opinion ..

Are you replying to me? If so where did you see me claiming either evidence or lack of evidence.

YOU claim the existence of gods and I reject YOUR claim.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
dadman
Posts: 272
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1/21/2014 9:53:05 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
YOU claim the existence of God and I reject YOUR claim .

because ......
And he (God) gave some apostles .. and some prophets .. and some evangelists .. and some teaching pastors .. for the perfecting of the saints .. for the work of the ministry .. for the edifying of the body of Christ .. till we all come in the unity of the faith .. and of the knowledge of the Son of God .. to a perfect (complete) man .. to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ . . . . Ephesians 4:12 .. http://dadmansabode.com... .. come and learn
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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1/21/2014 9:55:45 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/21/2014 9:53:05 AM, dadman wrote:
YOU claim the existence of God and I reject YOUR claim .

because ......
If I claim that leprechauns exist why would you reject my claim?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
DudeStop
Posts: 1,278
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1/21/2014 9:58:16 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/21/2014 9:02:20 AM, dadman wrote:
Atheism is an intellectual position .. What reasons do you atheists have for holding that position ? .. Your reasons are based upon logic and/or evidence or lack of it .. So .. is there any reason/evidence for you holding your position that you defend ? .......

If you say that atheism needs no evidence or reason .. then you are holding a position that has no evidence or rational basis ? .. If so .. then isn't that simply faith ?

I'm more like a de Facto atheist, I think god is probably not real. I think this because:

1. In order to prove there is a god, there has to be a need for him to explain the mechanics of our universe

2. There is no need for a god in order to explain the mechanics of our universe

3. Therefore there probably is no God.
dadman
Posts: 272
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1/21/2014 9:58:33 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
If I claim that leprechauns exist why would you reject my claim? .

Because I see no evidence for leprechauns
And he (God) gave some apostles .. and some prophets .. and some evangelists .. and some teaching pastors .. for the perfecting of the saints .. for the work of the ministry .. for the edifying of the body of Christ .. till we all come in the unity of the faith .. and of the knowledge of the Son of God .. to a perfect (complete) man .. to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ . . . . Ephesians 4:12 .. http://dadmansabode.com... .. come and learn
dadman
Posts: 272
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1/21/2014 10:05:58 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
If you say that atheism is supported by the lack of evidence for God .. then it is only your opinion that there is no evidence .. You cannot know all evidence for or against God .. therefore you cannot say there is no evidence for God .. Your atheism then .. is nothing more than an opinion ..

But .. if it is .. should you derogatorily argue against Christians and in favor of your opinion ?

If you say that atheism needs no evidence to support it because it is a position about the lack of something .. then do you have other positions you hold based upon lack of evidence...like say .. screaming blue ants ? .. Do you hold the position that they do not exist or that you lack belief in them .. too ?
And he (God) gave some apostles .. and some prophets .. and some evangelists .. and some teaching pastors .. for the perfecting of the saints .. for the work of the ministry .. for the edifying of the body of Christ .. till we all come in the unity of the faith .. and of the knowledge of the Son of God .. to a perfect (complete) man .. to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ . . . . Ephesians 4:12 .. http://dadmansabode.com... .. come and learn
Installgentoo
Posts: 1,420
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1/21/2014 10:13:24 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/21/2014 9:51:06 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 1/21/2014 9:39:42 AM, dadman wrote:
If you say that atheism is supported by the lack of evidence for God .. then it is only your opinion that there is no evidence .. You cannot know all evidence for or against God .. therefore you cannot say there is no evidence for God .. Your atheism then .. is nothing more than an opinion ..

Are you replying to me? If so where did you see me claiming either evidence or lack of evidence.

YOU claim the existence of gods and I reject YOUR claim.

You misunderstand the burden of proof. It doesn't de facto lie on the person who makes a claim. If I claim that the world exists and then an aworldist tells me it does not, HE holds the burden of proving his claim to be true.

Atheism in rejecting the existence of some material thing also has a burden of proof.
Fox-McCloud
Posts: 158
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1/21/2014 10:21:21 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/21/2014 9:02:20 AM, dadman wrote:
Atheism is an intellectual position .. What reasons do you atheists have for holding that position ? .. Your reasons are based upon logic and/or evidence or lack of it .. So .. is there any reason/evidence for you holding your position that you defend ? .......

If you say that atheism needs no evidence or reason .. then you are holding a position that has no evidence or rational basis ? .. If so .. then isn't that simply faith ?

(Weak) atheists do not make any positive claims. It is a reactive position and is defined as such: "the lack if belief in God/gods". We simply see no persuasive reason for the existence of God/gods. If the claim that X exists is not substantiated by evidence, one is logically justified in rejecting the claim. Thus, the burden of proof lies on the side of the theists. Since it is (often) not possible to proof a negative, it is not possible to offer any evidence for the lack of God's existence. However, I do not assert that God/gods could not exist, and once the theist is able to provide any evidence, I would be obligated to change my views. Before that time, I will hold atheism as the more reasonable worldview.
Abortion Is Generally Morally Reprehensible: http://www.debate.org...

The instant we feel anger we have already ceased striving for the truth, and have begun striving for ourselves - Archibald Alison

Bliss was it in that dawn to be alive, but to be young was very heaven! - William Wordsworth
BChart2
Posts: 40
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1/21/2014 10:25:39 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Holy crap, the ignorance is painful. (Not directing this towards the original poster)
We don't need evidence to back a lack of belief; you need evidence to back your beliefs.
Atheism in of itself makes no claims whatsoever. Atheism doesn't claim there is no God, we just don't believe in a God in particular.

It makes ZERO SENSE to say we need to BACK UP a LACK of belief. Lack of belief in God is the default position, therefore the burden of proof lies on the shoulders of the one making a claim.

I don't claim there is no God; I admit the existence of a God is unknowable, so I refuse to believe in one unless substantial evidence supporting a God's existence arises.

I hold the same stance on Abiogenesis. The evidence isn't there, so I don't believe in it. This same logic extends over everything for me, not just religion.
If there's no evidence, I don't believe it. Science is no exception.
JesseR
Posts: 18
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1/21/2014 10:43:34 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/21/2014 8:17:53 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
If we directly evolved from apes then why are there still apes?

Atheism-0
Christians- 9001

Well we homosapiens are a branch off of the chimpanzee; a branch off that evolved and aquired different adaptions. Like todays cats who were domesticated and are now docile; evolved from the lion,tiger, ect. Its the same concept WHY ARE THER STILL LIONS,TIGERS ECT.
dadman
Posts: 272
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1/21/2014 11:02:42 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
You misunderstand the burden of proof. It doesn't de facto lie on the person who makes a claim .

the burden of proof would fall on me if I was commanding that you believe what I believe .. but I'm not .. so it dosen't
And he (God) gave some apostles .. and some prophets .. and some evangelists .. and some teaching pastors .. for the perfecting of the saints .. for the work of the ministry .. for the edifying of the body of Christ .. till we all come in the unity of the faith .. and of the knowledge of the Son of God .. to a perfect (complete) man .. to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ . . . . Ephesians 4:12 .. http://dadmansabode.com... .. come and learn
dadman
Posts: 272
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1/21/2014 11:08:05 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
People behave according to what they believe .. not what they lack belief in . . . So .. if you are an atheist and you work against the idea that God exists .. then aren't you not behaving in a manner inconsistent with your beliefs ?
And he (God) gave some apostles .. and some prophets .. and some evangelists .. and some teaching pastors .. for the perfecting of the saints .. for the work of the ministry .. for the edifying of the body of Christ .. till we all come in the unity of the faith .. and of the knowledge of the Son of God .. to a perfect (complete) man .. to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ . . . . Ephesians 4:12 .. http://dadmansabode.com... .. come and learn
BChart2
Posts: 40
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1/21/2014 11:43:43 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/21/2014 11:08:05 AM, dadman wrote:
People behave according to what they believe .. not what they lack belief in . . . So .. if you are an atheist and you work against the idea that God exists .. then aren't you not behaving in a manner inconsistent with your beliefs ?
Atheists work against the idea that God exists?
You're thinking of anti-Theism and Gnostic Atheism.

Not believing in something doesn't mean you're actively against it. That's like claiming that all people who aren't feminist are sexist.
dadman
Posts: 272
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1/21/2014 12:30:29 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Not believing in something doesn't mean you're actively against it .

all over this form and approx 20,000 other forums I visit .. atheists on the march . . . there WILL be no God
And he (God) gave some apostles .. and some prophets .. and some evangelists .. and some teaching pastors .. for the perfecting of the saints .. for the work of the ministry .. for the edifying of the body of Christ .. till we all come in the unity of the faith .. and of the knowledge of the Son of God .. to a perfect (complete) man .. to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ . . . . Ephesians 4:12 .. http://dadmansabode.com... .. come and learn
dadman
Posts: 272
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1/21/2014 12:34:08 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
How does an atheist account for the laws of logic ? .. Isn't logic a process of the mind ? .. Yes . . . Isn't logical thought based upon the laws of logic ? . . . . If logic is conceptual (a process of the mind) and certainly appear to be universally true .. then what are the conditions that must be in place in order for the laws of logic to be universally true so that you can cite them and use them ? . . . . or in other words .. how do the truth statements that we call the laws of logic obtain their universal nature ? .. How do you know that the laws of logic are true ? .. or Do you just assume they are true ?
And he (God) gave some apostles .. and some prophets .. and some evangelists .. and some teaching pastors .. for the perfecting of the saints .. for the work of the ministry .. for the edifying of the body of Christ .. till we all come in the unity of the faith .. and of the knowledge of the Son of God .. to a perfect (complete) man .. to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ . . . . Ephesians 4:12 .. http://dadmansabode.com... .. come and learn
BChart2
Posts: 40
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1/21/2014 1:07:52 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/21/2014 12:34:08 PM, dadman wrote:
How does an atheist account for the laws of logic ? .. Isn't logic a process of the mind ? .. Yes . . . Isn't logical thought based upon the laws of logic ? . . . . If logic is conceptual (a process of the mind) and certainly appear to be universally true .. then what are the conditions that must be in place in order for the laws of logic to be universally true so that you can cite them and use them ? . . . . or in other words .. how do the truth statements that we call the laws of logic obtain their universal nature ? .. How do you know that the laws of logic are true ? .. or Do you just assume they are true ?
What does atheism have to do with "the laws of logic"?
Atheism is a stance on a higher being.
If you're trying to argue that our inability to explain something is proof of God, then all you're proving is your own confirmation bias.
dadman
Posts: 272
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1/21/2014 1:12:09 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
If atheism is true .. then do you not believe that there should be answers for these questions ??
And he (God) gave some apostles .. and some prophets .. and some evangelists .. and some teaching pastors .. for the perfecting of the saints .. for the work of the ministry .. for the edifying of the body of Christ .. till we all come in the unity of the faith .. and of the knowledge of the Son of God .. to a perfect (complete) man .. to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ . . . . Ephesians 4:12 .. http://dadmansabode.com... .. come and learn
dadman
Posts: 272
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1/21/2014 1:14:46 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Everything that was brought into existence was caused to exist .. can you have an infinite regression of causes ? No . . . since to get to "now" you'd have to traverse an infinite amount of time to get to now .. but .. it is impossible to cross an infinite .. Furthermore .... without a first cause .. there cannot be a second or a third .. etc. .. So .. it seems that there must be a single uncaused cause . . . Why can't that be God who is always existed and was never caused to come into existence ? .....
And he (God) gave some apostles .. and some prophets .. and some evangelists .. and some teaching pastors .. for the perfecting of the saints .. for the work of the ministry .. for the edifying of the body of Christ .. till we all come in the unity of the faith .. and of the knowledge of the Son of God .. to a perfect (complete) man .. to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ . . . . Ephesians 4:12 .. http://dadmansabode.com... .. come and learn
BChart2
Posts: 40
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1/21/2014 2:00:57 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/21/2014 1:14:46 PM, dadman wrote:
Everything that was brought into existence was caused to exist .. can you have an infinite regression of causes ? No . . . since to get to "now" you'd have to traverse an infinite amount of time to get to now .. but .. it is impossible to cross an infinite .. Furthermore .... without a first cause .. there cannot be a second or a third .. etc. .. So .. it seems that there must be a single uncaused cause . . . Why can't that be God who is always existed and was never caused to come into existence ? .....

Once again, that's confirmation bias.
Disproving (And I use the term loosely) an opposing view doesn't automatically make your correct.

And if everything has to have a cause, where'd your God come from? And don't dare tell me that he doesn't need a cause, because that would make you a hypocrite.
BChart2
Posts: 40
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1/21/2014 2:01:41 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/21/2014 1:12:09 PM, dadman wrote:
If atheism is true .. then do you not believe that there should be answers for these questions ??

I'd rather find the real answers to questions instead of filling in the blanks with God.
bubbatheclown
Posts: 1,258
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1/21/2014 2:07:39 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Okay, the guy who made this forum was probably trolling. I doubt that most serious creationists ask that stupid question.

But, I do have a question for you atheists. Let's just say that you're right. Let's just say for the sake of an argument that there's no God. Where does that leave us humans?
That would me all we are is dust, here for about 60 or 70 years, then to disappear into nothing. What are we living for then? Are we living for the moment? Are we living for the future? Are we living for both? Because the moment will soon become the past, as will the future. The temporary pleasure and fulfillment means nothing whenever the moment ends. Are we going to keep stuffing ourselves with pleasure and/or purposeful work to drown out the meaningless of it all?
Because when you really think about it, none of it really matters. If you have children, the human race could eventually go extinct anyway. If you do something that has a lasting impact on humanity, the human race will still end anyway. And even if it doesn't, the founding fathers had a huge impact on history, but everything they stand for is being eroded by poor choices by the people and government of the United States.
Is eternal remembrance all that matters? Because eventually people will forget you, even if you're an Abraham Lincoln. Unless, of course you're as famous as Jesus, but it still doesn't benefit you in any way because you're dead.

So even if you found out for a fact that God was but a myth, (and I very much doubt that's going to happen), I would still believe in Him, because He means hope of a life to come, beyond this existence. Even futile and false hope is better than hopelessness and despair.
Fox-McCloud
Posts: 158
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1/21/2014 2:52:34 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/21/2014 2:07:39 PM, bubbatheclown wrote:
Okay, the guy who made this forum was probably trolling. I doubt that most serious creationists ask that stupid question.

But, I do have a question for you atheists. Let's just say that you're right. Let's just say for the sake of an argument that there's no God. Where does that leave us humans?
That would me all we are is dust, here for about 60 or 70 years, then to disappear into nothing. What are we living for then? Are we living for the moment? Are we living for the future? Are we living for both? Because the moment will soon become the past, as will the future. The temporary pleasure and fulfillment means nothing whenever the moment ends. Are we going to keep stuffing ourselves with pleasure and/or purposeful work to drown out the meaningless of it all?
Because when you really think about it, none of it really matters. If you have children, the human race could eventually go extinct anyway. If you do something that has a lasting impact on humanity, the human race will still end anyway. And even if it doesn't, the founding fathers had a huge impact on history, but everything they stand for is being eroded by poor choices by the people and government of the United States.
Is eternal remembrance all that matters? Because eventually people will forget you, even if you're an Abraham Lincoln. Unless, of course you're as famous as Jesus, but it still doesn't benefit you in any way because you're dead.

So even if you found out for a fact that God was but a myth, (and I very much doubt that's going to happen), I would still believe in Him, because He means hope of a life to come, beyond this existence. Even futile and false hope is better than hopelessness and despair.

Can you even hear yourself saying this, without some kind of embarrassment? I submit, this directly wishful thinking. I, for one, care about the pursuit of truth at all costs and at all hazards. To live and witness in truth.
Abortion Is Generally Morally Reprehensible: http://www.debate.org...

The instant we feel anger we have already ceased striving for the truth, and have begun striving for ourselves - Archibald Alison

Bliss was it in that dawn to be alive, but to be young was very heaven! - William Wordsworth