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Is this consistent with Catholic Dogma?

CynicalDiogenes
Posts: 147
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2/1/2014 2:28:54 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
I want to know if this belief is consistent with Catholic Dogma.If it is not please tell why and direct me to the relevant teachings of the Church.

If any Protestants feel this belief is wrong, please explain you reasons for it.



Firstly,Life is not the same thing as mere existence.Many humans merely exist, but only a few manage to find out what it is to truly 'live'.This everlasting life can only be found when man unites freely with God.

When he does not do this, he is not satisfied, and to fill this emptiness, he tries other things such as sexual immorality, excessive greed, gluttony, sloth(alcohol and drug induced slumber).He also expresses his frustration in the form of Wrath and hatred against others and distracts himself with false pride and vanity.

Sin is merely any action that prevents us from seeing the face of God.

Secondly,The creation story is a Metaphor.Our minds have the same nature of God, as we were created in his image.
Adam was the first 'self-aware' human and the personification of reason, and subjective emotions are personified in Eve ,were born from him.

When Eve(Emotions) ate of the fruit of 'good and evil' she started to Judge, and this corruption biases our logic as well.This is what the doctrine of original Sin is really about.As Lao Tzu aptly says:

When people see some things as beautiful,
other things become ugly.
When people see some things as good,
other things become bad.

Being and non-being create each other.
Difficult and easy support each other.
Long and short define each other.
High and low depend on each other.
Before and after follow each other.

this illusion that makes us judges of God's creation and actions is the source of all the troubles in the world.It is the origin of shame (comparison with society's standards)and a myriad of disturbing appetites that prevent us from seeing God's Kingdom that has always been within us.(Ref Luke 17:21)

Original Sin is going to exist and be there whether you choose to believe in it or not.

God due to his infinite compassion told his own name to the Jews.It is 'I AM' or being and existence itself(YHWH).The Jews however, were too obsessed with the surface and not the root, and rather than trying to see the law that was written in their own hearts,chose to obsessively follow written laws that were meant as mere guidelines to return to the Kingdom of God.The Pharisees took this obsession to insane limits.

This knowledge about the nature of God was there with several gentile philosophers and thinkers like King Melchizedek and Balaam. Several Hindus, Buddhists and Taoists have expressed similar views that God is Existence or 'being' itself,thus they were capable of seeing him too.This is the reason why the catholic church accepts as true all that is true in these religions also.(Ref. Nostra Aetate)

http://www.vatican.va...

But for some reason, the Jews heard it first hand from his own mouth, even though they were incapable of understanding what it meant when they heard it.This is why they were supposed to be the 'Chosen' race, not because of their own merits.

This is also why Jesus had to be born to teach the fullness of the meaning of the name of God.He diverted this attention from following the Law to the letter to following the spirit of the Law."The Sabbath was made for man;Man was not made for the sabbath."

The Virgin Mary, the living personification of complete obedience to the inner voice of conscience that speaks to us through emotions, gives birth to the new knowledge and reasonable wisdom of Christ.Due to the grace of God, she was born without this illusion of original sin.

This way Mary is the New Eve, and Jesus is the new Adam, who takes us back to the innocence of the Garden of Eden.That is why she is also called the 'Seat of Wisdom' in the catholic and orthodox traditions.

This way, the death that Adam and Eve brought was not the physical death, but the spiritual death that resulted in separation from God's nature.The new Eden that Jesus brings is not actual everlasting life of the flesh, but the everlasting life of the spirit that achieves complete union with God.

Seat of Wisdom, pray for us who turn to you!

Better to illuminate than merely to shine, to deliver to others contemplated truths than merely to contemplate.-St.Thomas Aquinas
All the darkness in the world cannot extinguish the light of a single candle.~ St.Francis of Assisi
Romanii
Posts: 4,858
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2/1/2014 2:10:32 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/1/2014 2:28:54 AM, CynicalDiogenes wrote:

Firstly,Life is not the same thing as mere existence.Many humans merely exist, but only a few manage to find out what it is to truly 'live'.This everlasting life can only be found when man unites freely with God.

I have personally felt this many times. Just crawling through the mundane routine of materialistic life doesn't feel like true life. It feels like futile existence.
Only when I'm in religious practice do I truly feel like I'm alive; when I am filled with the divine essence, that is when I truly know what my existence is all about


When he does not do this, he is not satisfied, and to fill this emptiness, he tries other things such as sexual immorality, excessive greed, gluttony, sloth(alcohol and drug induced slumber).He also expresses his frustration in the form of Wrath and hatred against others and distracts himself with false pride and vanity.

Sin is merely any action that prevents us from seeing the face of God.

I couldn't have said it any better.


Secondly,The creation story is a Metaphor.Our minds have the same nature of God, as we were created in his image.
Adam was the first 'self-aware' human and the personification of reason, and subjective emotions are personified in Eve ,were born from him.

When Eve(Emotions) ate of the fruit of 'good and evil' she started to Judge, and this corruption biases our logic as well.This is what the doctrine of original Sin is really about.

I don't think the Creation story was written to be a metaphor. Much of the first part of Genesis is myths and folklore which the ancient Hebrews took with them when they followed Abraham out of Mesopotamia. They most probably actually believed that is what happened, lacking a scientific understanding of the world.

However, I definitely think that is a great way to interpret the story and actually get a meaningful message out of the otherwise fictional story.


this illusion that makes us judges of God's creation and actions is the source of all the troubles in the world.It is the origin of shame (comparison with society's standards)and a myriad of disturbing appetites that prevent us from seeing God's Kingdom that has always been within us.(Ref Luke 17:21)

Original Sin is going to exist and be there whether you choose to believe in it or not.

God due to his infinite compassion told his own name to the Jews.It is 'I AM' or being and existence itself(YHWH).The Jews however, were too obsessed with the surface and not the root, and rather than trying to see the law that was written in their own hearts,chose to obsessively follow written laws that were meant as mere guidelines to return to the Kingdom of God.The Pharisees took this obsession to insane limits.

This knowledge about the nature of God was there with several gentile philosophers and thinkers like King Melchizedek and Balaam. Several Hindus, Buddhists and Taoists have expressed similar views that God is Existence or 'being' itself,thus they were capable of seeing him too.This is the reason why the catholic church accepts as true all that is true in these religions also.(Ref. Nostra Aetate)

Well said!
People have gotten far too obsessed with the rites, rituals, norms, and forms, of various religions and as a result, have turned religion into a seemingly harmful force in society.
All the major world religions are true paths to God.
All differences between them are man-made, superficial, and ultimately trivial.


But for some reason, the Jews heard it first hand from his own mouth, even though they were incapable of understanding what it meant when they heard it.This is why they were supposed to be the 'Chosen' race, not because of their own merits.

This is also why Jesus had to be born to teach the fullness of the meaning of the name of God.He diverted this attention from following the Law to the letter to following the spirit of the Law."The Sabbath was made for man;Man was not made for the sabbath."

Yes. I respect Jesus as a divine figure.
It is unfortunate that modern day Christian fundamentalists have returned to following the letter of the law by taking the Bible literally word for word.


The Virgin Mary, the living personification of complete obedience to the inner voice of conscience that speaks to us through emotions, gives birth to the new knowledge and reasonable wisdom of Christ.Due to the grace of God, she was born without this illusion of original sin.

This way Mary is the New Eve, and Jesus is the new Adam, who takes us back to the innocence of the Garden of Eden.That is why she is also called the 'Seat of Wisdom' in the catholic and orthodox traditions.

I believe that every religion preaches the same thing.
The differences between them are meant so that each person can choose the one that best fulfills their spiritual needs.
Christianity's unique characteristic is the doctrine of love for and faith in two perfect role models: Jesus and Mary.


This way, the death that Adam and Eve brought was not the physical death, but the spiritual death that resulted in separation from God's nature.The new Eden that Jesus brings is not actual everlasting life of the flesh, but the everlasting life of the spirit that achieves complete union with God.

Definitely.
"Heaven" is not a literal place. It is not a materialistic paradise.
It is union with God, which is infinitely more blissful than any sort of literal concept of Heaven.
daley
Posts: 8
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2/4/2014 7:39:59 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
This is simply not Biblical. I would love to debate it with you. Why not post me a debate. I don't believe man's mind is essentially the same as God's just because we are made in his image, nor do I understand Adam and Eve as a figurative story. It literally happened. And the other religions like Buddhism, Taoism, and HInduism are not correct in misrepresenting the meaning of Biblical passages
rockwater
Posts: 273
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2/4/2014 8:34:47 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I won't claim to be an expert on metaphysical/ontological theology this and am ready to be corrected.

That said, I think you can think of God as the Platonic ideal of existence itself. Just remember two things (in addition to a whole lot of other Christian teachings, but these two stand out as important with relation to what you are saying):

a. God is completely transcendent from His creation, including us who are made in His image. Through Christ we can we can become like Him and even experience something that Eastern Christian mystics call "theosis" or "becoming God" - but even then we are still not God or even part of God and He is infinitely greater and more powerful than us. God is utterly beyond us but also surrounds us and is even in us - completely transcendent yet completely immanent. It's confusing but one of those beautiful mysteries like the Trinity.

b. Jesus Christ is fully God and fully human. He is like us in all things but Sin. So even if God is the perfection of all things, He is able to be God while also being fully in human flesh.