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Essence Of Jesus Preaching --- Real

dattaswami
Posts: 322
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1/20/2010 3:05:50 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
Merely by accepting the human incarnation (Jesus) as Saviour cannot save you. It is told in the Bible that He came to save His people. Who are His people? They are His beloved devotees. They follow His instructions. Jesus did not give attention even to see His mother, when He was with His disciples. When a woman shouted that the Mother of Jesus was blessed, Jesus did not agree and told that blessed are those who followed His instructions. He says that one should leave parents, wife or husband, children and must be prepared even to carry on his own cross for the sake of Jesus. This means that one should be prepared to sacrifice even his life. Therefore, it is a narrow path with thorns. Even to hear this statement your mind is turmoiled with chaotic disturbance. That is the reason why He says that He has not come to give peace to you and that He is holding the sword of knowledge in His hand. Therefore, you can be saved only when you reach that state.

If you say to the Judge that you accept him as your saviour, will he save you and cancel his judgement? If you say to the jailor that you will accept him as your saviour, will he relieve you from the jail? Therefore, He saves only His dearest devotees. He underwent the suffering of His people only on the Cross. He did not suffer for the sake of all the people and released all the people from their sins. If such thing is done the justice is destroyed. The administration becomes meaningless. When a devotee leaves everybody and everything for the sake of such human incarnation and participates in His service, such people are called as His people. Such devotees will never agree for the crucification of the Lord for their sake. Therefore, real saving is only at that stage.

Whether, it is Christianity or Hinduism the beginner cannot come forward if the final stage is shown. In Hinduism the saints and in Christianity, the Popes, fathers, brother and sisters who are dedicated to the Mission have left everything and everybody for the sake of God. Actually such Holy saints only can be saved since they stand according to His standards prescribed. But if this fact is revealed no common man will come forward. It is the tradition of the divine preacher to show the final result even in the first step. We say to the schoolboy that if he goes to the school regularly and studies sincerely, he will become the professor.

It is only encouragement. Does that mean that the boy will be appointed as professor as soon as he finishes the schooling? He gets encouraged and studies well in the school. Then he will go to college and university and study further and then he will join as a lecturer, become reader and then finally become the professor. Therefore, to attract the beginners such encouraging statements are made, which need not be condemned as lies. When a lie does well, such a lie cannot be the sin. Even if it is truth, if it harms it is a sin. We tell so many lies to our children to encourage them and our aim is only their welfare and not cheating them. Therefore, such statements should be accepted with reference to the level of the devotees.

at lotus feet of swami
surya
dattaswami
Posts: 322
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1/20/2010 4:03:29 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
You have taken lot of pains. Had you asked me, I would have told you. This is sharing of the knowledge preached by Shri Datta Swami only. My display photo tells the same.

at lotus feet of swami
surya

At 1/20/2010 3:34:37 AM, Puck wrote:
Hey I found you!
tkubok
Posts: 5,044
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1/20/2010 5:49:39 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 4:03:29 AM, dattaswami wrote:
You have taken lot of pains. Had you asked me, I would have told you. This is sharing of the knowledge preached by Shri Datta Swami only. My display photo tells the same.

at lotus feet of swami
surya

At 1/20/2010 3:34:37 AM, Puck wrote:
Hey I found you!

Wouldve been better if you had put it in your own words.

In any case, this is all meaningless until you can prove your assertions. There is no reason to believe that Sin exists in the first place. And until you can prove it, your argument is completely meaningless and void.
Rezzealaux
Posts: 2,251
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1/20/2010 7:55:59 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 3:05:50 AM, dattaswami wrote:
Merely by accepting the human incarnation (Jesus) as Saviour cannot save you. It is told in the Bible that He came to save His people. Who are His people? They are His beloved devotees.
So there are two conditions, 1) You have to be loved by Jesus and 2) You have to love Jesus. How can you get the former if he's no longer around? You can't. You're guaranteed a dead man. The end.
They follow His instructions. Jesus did not give attention even to see His mother,
Doesn't Christianity have "Honor Thy Mother And Thy Father" somewhere?
when He was with His disciples. When a woman shouted that the Mother of Jesus was blessed, Jesus did not agree and told that blessed are those who followed His instructions.
I will remember that one: Jesus did NOT say Honor Thy Mother And Thy Father, Jesus pretty much said FU to his mom because his mom didn't follow him. Very interesting indeed.
He says that one should leave parents, wife or husband, children and must be prepared even to carry on his own cross for the sake of Jesus. This means that one should be prepared to sacrifice even his life. Therefore, it is a narrow path with thorns.
Now that's just silly. If you want to claim that one should sacrifice everything for Jesus, that's fine. But don't go around claiming that you're some kind of hero and claim that you've went through so many difficulties for Jesus. Hell, you shouldn't claim that for everything. Claiming hardships is almost as bad as demanding respect. And by bad, I mean funny. And by funny, I mean people laugh at those who claim it.
Even to hear this statement your mind is turmoiled with chaotic disturbance.
Sure it is. It's so turmoiled I can make a coherent logical response.
That is the reason why He says that He has not come to give peace to you and that He is holding the sword of knowledge in His hand.
Knowledge is a sword?
Therefore, you can be saved only when you reach that state.
You didn't describe what this "state" is. Are you talking about the government of heaven or something?

If you say to the Judge that you accept him as your saviour, will he save you and cancel his judgement? If you say to the jailor that you will accept him as your saviour, will he relieve you from the jail? Therefore, He saves only His dearest devotees.
A jailor relieves only the inmates who s*ck his d*ck the most... Hey, that analogy actually makes sense!
He underwent the suffering of His people only on the Cross.
Jesus had a martyr complex.
He did not suffer for the sake of all the people and released all the people from their sins. If such thing is done the justice is destroyed.
I'm glad we both agree Jesus doesn't love everybody. Now you definitely lost your case.
The administration becomes meaningless.
Is this that government you were talking about?
When a devotee leaves everybody and everything for the sake of such human incarnation and participates in His service, such people are called as His people. Such devotees will never agree for the crucification of the Lord for their sake. Therefore, real saving is only at that stage.
So let's assume for the moment the Disciples were His people. You seem to have implied that. By definition, they would not have agreed to Jesus accepting his fate on the cross. They did not "agree". So, what exactly did the Disciples do? Absolutely nothing. If they actually didn't agree, they would have done everything to prevent Jesus from getting nailed onto the cross, yes? They would have done something. What did they do? Absolutely nothing. The only possible consequence of this is that either 1) The requirement of not agreeing to the crucification of the Lord in order to become His people does not exist, or 2) The Disciples were not His people. Which one is it?

Whether, it is Christianity or Hinduism the beginner cannot come forward if the final stage is shown. In Hinduism the saints and in Christianity, the Popes, fathers, brother and sisters who are dedicated to the Mission have left everything and everybody for the sake of God. Actually such Holy saints only can be saved since they stand according to His standards prescribed. But if this fact is revealed no common man will come forward.
This fact has just been revealed by you. Now no common man will come forward. Your purpose is therefore to seal off all possible entries to salvation to man. Hmm I wonder what that means. Oh wait it doesn't mean anything, Jesus doesn't care about saving the common man. My bad.
It is the tradition of the divine preacher to show the final result even in the first step. We say to the schoolboy that if he goes to the school regularly and studies sincerely, he will become the professor.
"We"? Speak for yourself. Even my parents have always included the word "chance" in their statements. They told me, "If you get good grades, you'll increase your chances of getting into college, which will increase your chances of getting a good job, which will increase your chances of getting more money."

It is only encouragement. Does that mean that the boy will be appointed as professor as soon as he finishes the schooling? He gets encouraged and studies well in the school. Then he will go to college and university and study further and then he will join as a lecturer, become reader and then finally become the professor. Therefore, to attract the beginners such encouraging statements are made, which need not be condemned as lies. When a lie does well, such a lie cannot be the sin. Even if it is truth, if it harms it is a sin. We tell so many lies to our children to encourage them and our aim is only their welfare and not cheating them. Therefore, such statements should be accepted with reference to the level of the devotees.
Yeah, I'll accept it with reference to level of the devotees: the level of sh!t.

at lotus feet of swami
surya
There's a signature system on this site, if you want to use it. Whenever you make a new post, there's an "Edit my Signature" between the box and the "Review" button. Click that, and you can type in your sig there.
: If you weren't new here, you'd know not to feed me such attention. This is like an orgasm in my brain right now. *hehe, my name is in a title, hehe* (http://www.debate.org...)

Just in case I get into some BS with FREEDO again about how he's NOT a narcissist.

"The law is there to destroy evil under the constitutional government."
So... what's there to destroy evil inside of and above the constitutional government?
DATCMOTO
Posts: 6,160
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1/20/2010 8:07:02 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 3:05:50 AM, dattaswami wrote:
Merely by accepting the human incarnation (Jesus) as Saviour cannot save you. It is told in the Bible that He came to save His people. Who are His people? They are His beloved devotees. They follow His instructions. Jesus did not give attention even to see His mother, when He was with His disciples. When a woman shouted that the Mother of Jesus was blessed, Jesus did not agree and told that blessed are those who followed His instructions. He says that one should leave parents, wife or husband, children and must be prepared even to carry on his own cross for the sake of Jesus. This means that one should be prepared to sacrifice even his life. Therefore, it is a narrow path with thorns. Even to hear this statement your mind is turmoiled with chaotic disturbance. That is the reason why He says that He has not come to give peace to you and that He is holding the sword of knowledge in His hand. Therefore, you can be saved only when you reach that state.

If you say to the Judge that you accept him as your saviour, will he save you and cancel his judgement? If you say to the jailor that you will accept him as your saviour, will he relieve you from the jail? Therefore, He saves only His dearest devotees. He underwent the suffering of His people only on the Cross. He did not suffer for the sake of all the people and released all the people from their sins. If such thing is done the justice is destroyed. The administration becomes meaningless. When a devotee leaves everybody and everything for the sake of such human incarnation and participates in His service, such people are called as His people. Such devotees will never agree for the crucification of the Lord for their sake. Therefore, real saving is only at that stage.

Whether, it is Christianity or Hinduism the beginner cannot come forward if the final stage is shown. In Hinduism the saints and in Christianity, the Popes, fathers, brother and sisters who are dedicated to the Mission have left everything and everybody for the sake of God. Actually such Holy saints only can be saved since they stand according to His standards prescribed. But if this fact is revealed no common man will come forward. It is the tradition of the divine preacher to show the final result even in the first step. We say to the schoolboy that if he goes to the school regularly and studies sincerely, he will become the professor.

It is only encouragement. Does that mean that the boy will be appointed as professor as soon as he finishes the schooling? He gets encouraged and studies well in the school. Then he will go to college and university and study further and then he will join as a lecturer, become reader and then finally become the professor. Therefore, to attract the beginners such encouraging statements are made, which need not be condemned as lies. When a lie does well, such a lie cannot be the sin. Even if it is truth, if it harms it is a sin. We tell so many lies to our children to encourage them and our aim is only their welfare and not cheating them. Therefore, such statements should be accepted with reference to the level of the devotees.

at lotus feet of swami
surya

New Age (Hinduism for rich westerners!) claptrap..

Jesus said:
" I Am the (definitive article, NOT a) way..
the Truth & the Life. "

That means that EVERYTHING else is either the WRONG way or a LIE or DEATH.
The Cross.. the Cross.
tkubok
Posts: 5,044
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1/20/2010 8:51:30 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 8:07:02 AM, DATCMOTO wrote:
At 1/20/2010 3:05:50 AM, dattaswami wrote:
Merely by accepting the human incarnation (Jesus) as Saviour cannot save you. It is told in the Bible that He came to save His people. Who are His people? They are His beloved devotees. They follow His instructions. Jesus did not give attention even to see His mother, when He was with His disciples. When a woman shouted that the Mother of Jesus was blessed, Jesus did not agree and told that blessed are those who followed His instructions. He says that one should leave parents, wife or husband, children and must be prepared even to carry on his own cross for the sake of Jesus. This means that one should be prepared to sacrifice even his life. Therefore, it is a narrow path with thorns. Even to hear this statement your mind is turmoiled with chaotic disturbance. That is the reason why He says that He has not come to give peace to you and that He is holding the sword of knowledge in His hand. Therefore, you can be saved only when you reach that state.

If you say to the Judge that you accept him as your saviour, will he save you and cancel his judgement? If you say to the jailor that you will accept him as your saviour, will he relieve you from the jail? Therefore, He saves only His dearest devotees. He underwent the suffering of His people only on the Cross. He did not suffer for the sake of all the people and released all the people from their sins. If such thing is done the justice is destroyed. The administration becomes meaningless. When a devotee leaves everybody and everything for the sake of such human incarnation and participates in His service, such people are called as His people. Such devotees will never agree for the crucification of the Lord for their sake. Therefore, real saving is only at that stage.

Whether, it is Christianity or Hinduism the beginner cannot come forward if the final stage is shown. In Hinduism the saints and in Christianity, the Popes, fathers, brother and sisters who are dedicated to the Mission have left everything and everybody for the sake of God. Actually such Holy saints only can be saved since they stand according to His standards prescribed. But if this fact is revealed no common man will come forward. It is the tradition of the divine preacher to show the final result even in the first step. We say to the schoolboy that if he goes to the school regularly and studies sincerely, he will become the professor.

It is only encouragement. Does that mean that the boy will be appointed as professor as soon as he finishes the schooling? He gets encouraged and studies well in the school. Then he will go to college and university and study further and then he will join as a lecturer, become reader and then finally become the professor. Therefore, to attract the beginners such encouraging statements are made, which need not be condemned as lies. When a lie does well, such a lie cannot be the sin. Even if it is truth, if it harms it is a sin. We tell so many lies to our children to encourage them and our aim is only their welfare and not cheating them. Therefore, such statements should be accepted with reference to the level of the devotees.

at lotus feet of swami
surya

New Age (Hinduism for rich westerners!) claptrap..

Jesus said:
" I Am the (definitive article, NOT a) way..
the Truth & the Life. "

That means that EVERYTHING else is either the WRONG way or a LIE or DEATH.

But Jesus never says "I am the ONLY way, the ONLY truth and the ONLY life."
dattaswami
Posts: 322
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1/20/2010 9:16:13 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
Saving from the troubles and misery is the general sense of the word saving.

In spiritual sense, saving means, cutting all the worldly bonds and establishing real bond with God, who alone is the truth.

At lotus feet of Datta Swami
Surya

At 1/20/2010 4:41:06 AM, Floid wrote:
Saved from what?
dattaswami
Posts: 322
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1/20/2010 9:28:33 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 7:55:59 AM, Rezzealaux wrote:
So there are two conditions, 1) You have to be loved by Jesus and 2) You have to love Jesus. How can you get the former if he's no longer around?

Reply: Nice question and to the point.

Here, Jesus represents the contemporary human incarnation (God-in-flesh), who is the only way. This contemporary human incarnation comes in every generation

So, the problem is solved. you can please the contemporary human incarnation by serving Him in His mission similar to disciples of Jesus, who participated in the mission of Jesus.

If the Lord comes in only one human generation, God becomes partial to that human generation because other human generations are not blessed with such opportunity. To see, to touch, to talk and to live with the human incarnation, He comes down as per the prayers of the devotees. The Lord comes to preach and so He will not enter the statues or animals or birds.

Some say that God loves only His devotees and thus He is partial. This is meaningless. If all people in the world loved Him equally and if He still loved only a select few, then alone can it be called partiality.
dattaswami
Posts: 322
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1/20/2010 9:32:04 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 8:07:02 AM, DATCMOTO wrote:
" I Am the (definitive article, NOT a) way..the Truth & the Life. "
That means that EVERYTHING else is either the WRONG way or a LIE or DEATH.

Reply: It means only the contemporary human incarnati is the only way. Lord Krishna also told the same.

Lord Datta means God given to the world in human form for the upliftment of humanity and hence, He is the highest as far as humanity is concerned from the point of convenience in worship. He is the only means of reaching/serving/pleasing the Lord. Lord Jesus stressed the same when He told ‘I am the only way' and Lord Krishna said it through ‘Vasudevah Sarvamiti…' in the Gita. Such, Lord in human form is called the human incarnation.

The ‘I' in the above statement of Jesus refers to the human incarnation of Lord only, who comes in every generation otherwise, He becomes partial for a generation of people, place and time. The scriptures of both Christianity & Hinduism i.e., Bible and Gita support the human incarnation concept through the statements ‘God-in-flesh and Manushim Tanumaasritam…' respectively. Even in Islam also, Mohammed is treated as a Prophet, which definitely means, He is above normal human beings because all the human beings are not treated as Prophets.

The worship of such contemporary human incarnation/Prophet gives the highest fruit as in the case of Hanuman (attained the post of future creator), who worshipped Lord Rama and Gopikas (attained Goloka), who worshipped Lord Krishna. Likewise, the disciples of Jesus, Mohammed Prophet, Buddha, Shankara, Mahavir, Rama Krishna Paramahamsa and Shirdi Sai worshipped the respective human incarnation only as Lord.

Worship means not mere words and feelings, but by participating in His mission through service, which consists of donating money & physical service. His mission is only to spread the divine knowledge and devotion in this world and to uplift everybody.
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
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1/20/2010 9:44:33 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 9:16:13 AM, dattaswami wrote:
Saving from the troubles and misery is the general sense of the word saving.
Impossible within life. Sorry. Misery is a natural feeling and trouble is inevitable.
In spiritual sense, saving means, cutting all the worldly bonds and establishing real bond with God, who alone is the truth.

Does this include the earthly bounds of hunger and thirst? If so, yes, eventually you will die and be releaved of your troubles. Victorious an hero is victorious. And yet, you believe in reincarnation, meaning that even by starving yourself, you cannot get away.
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
Puck
Posts: 6,457
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1/20/2010 12:51:44 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 4:03:29 AM, dattaswami wrote:
You have taken lot of pains. Had you asked me, I would have told you. This is sharing of the knowledge preached by Shri Datta Swami only

I see. Access to all your bank accounts please. :)
Frodobaggins
Posts: 602
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1/20/2010 1:03:35 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 8:51:30 AM, tkubok wrote:
At 1/20/2010 8:07:02 AM, DATCMOTO wrote:
At 1/20/2010 3:05:50 AM, dattaswami wrote:
Merely by accepting the human incarnation (Jesus) as Saviour cannot save you. It is told in the Bible that He came to save His people. Who are His people? They are His beloved devotees. They follow His instructions. Jesus did not give attention even to see His mother, when He was with His disciples. When a woman shouted that the Mother of Jesus was blessed, Jesus did not agree and told that blessed are those who followed His instructions. He says that one should leave parents, wife or husband, children and must be prepared even to carry on his own cross for the sake of Jesus. This means that one should be prepared to sacrifice even his life. Therefore, it is a narrow path with thorns. Even to hear this statement your mind is turmoiled with chaotic disturbance. That is the reason why He says that He has not come to give peace to you and that He is holding the sword of knowledge in His hand. Therefore, you can be saved only when you reach that state.

If you say to the Judge that you accept him as your saviour, will he save you and cancel his judgement? If you say to the jailor that you will accept him as your saviour, will he relieve you from the jail? Therefore, He saves only His dearest devotees. He underwent the suffering of His people only on the Cross. He did not suffer for the sake of all the people and released all the people from their sins. If such thing is done the justice is destroyed. The administration becomes meaningless. When a devotee leaves everybody and everything for the sake of such human incarnation and participates in His service, such people are called as His people. Such devotees will never agree for the crucification of the Lord for their sake. Therefore, real saving is only at that stage.

Whether, it is Christianity or Hinduism the beginner cannot come forward if the final stage is shown. In Hinduism the saints and in Christianity, the Popes, fathers, brother and sisters who are dedicated to the Mission have left everything and everybody for the sake of God. Actually such Holy saints only can be saved since they stand according to His standards prescribed. But if this fact is revealed no common man will come forward. It is the tradition of the divine preacher to show the final result even in the first step. We say to the schoolboy that if he goes to the school regularly and studies sincerely, he will become the professor.

It is only encouragement. Does that mean that the boy will be appointed as professor as soon as he finishes the schooling? He gets encouraged and studies well in the school. Then he will go to college and university and study further and then he will join as a lecturer, become reader and then finally become the professor. Therefore, to attract the beginners such encouraging statements are made, which need not be condemned as lies. When a lie does well, such a lie cannot be the sin. Even if it is truth, if it harms it is a sin. We tell so many lies to our children to encourage them and our aim is only their welfare and not cheating them. Therefore, such statements should be accepted with reference to the level of the devotees.

at lotus feet of swami
surya

New Age (Hinduism for rich westerners!) claptrap..

Jesus said:
" I Am the (definitive article, NOT a) way..
the Truth & the Life. "

That means that EVERYTHING else is either the WRONG way or a LIE or DEATH.

But Jesus never says "I am the ONLY way, the ONLY truth and the ONLY life."

Quoting system fail.
tkubok
Posts: 5,044
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1/20/2010 7:52:04 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 1:06:03 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Who is this guy? He almost seems like an Indian version of DATCMOTO.

Which is why i said, DatCmoto and this guy are evenly matched.