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The Societal effects of Religion

I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
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1/20/2010 1:00:45 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
It has come to my attention recently that debating the societal effects of religion is pointless, one side may be better to follow, but what we're cocnerned with is which side is factually correct.

Saying "The world would be much better with Islam - 9/11, Taliban oppression, etc." is getting us nowhere, since it doesn't debunk Islam. We are concerned with whether or not God exists, which one, etc. not the effects of it.
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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1/20/2010 1:06:44 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 1:00:45 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
It has come to my attention recently that debating the societal effects of religion is pointless, one side may be better to follow, but what we're cocnerned with is which side is factually correct.

Saying "The world would be much better with Islam - 9/11, Taliban oppression, etc." is getting us nowhere, since it doesn't debunk Islam. We are concerned with whether or not God exists, which one, etc. not the effects of it.

good luck with that. Let me know when you have *proof* that god does exist or does not exist. Then people can stop believing one way or the other.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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1/20/2010 1:08:41 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
That's one of the Christians favorite arguments. They say that if religion isn't true then where do we get morals from, or that society would be chaotic without religion, etc. All of these points are irrelevant and I expect that these professional Christian debaters should know better than to commit an appeal to consequences fallacy.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Zetsubou
Posts: 4,933
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1/20/2010 1:43:57 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 1:08:13 PM, Volkov wrote:
Read: Robert Wright - The Evolution of God. - http://en.wikipedia.org...

Listen/Watch: Camille Paglia @ the ROM. - http://www.tvo.org...

Learn: Effects of religion on society

No, No, No, if you want Origins of Religion go Nietzsche, everyone loves the lonney atheist. Modern Phiosipy is rip of old philosiphers and is almost always analactic.

Friedrich Nietzsche - and Thus Spoke Zarathustra
Friedrich Nietzsche - The Gay Science

"God is dead essays" help too.
'sup DDO -- july 2013
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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1/20/2010 2:52:31 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
The issue of, does God exist, or is a specific religion correct are utterly seperate to the issue of their social effect.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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1/20/2010 2:58:44 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
There are limits to this argument in the face of uncertainty (I don't have such uncertainty, but some do.)

If someone could establish that life without God had no value, and if they are uncertain about God and can see no way to resolve the uncertainty, then it would be proper to act as though God existed because of the potential effects of belief. This would, however, be a heavy burden.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
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1/20/2010 2:59:07 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 2:52:31 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
The issue of, does God exist, or is a specific religion correct are utterly seperate to the issue of their social effect.

The social effect is irrelevant concerning Atheism vs Theism.
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.
Volkov
Posts: 9,765
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1/20/2010 3:05:36 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
I don't see the big issue with studying the effects of religion on society and culture. It is a force that can shape and influence it, like media, politics, or what have you, whether its true or not. I mean, Jesus and God and Yahweh don't exist, but Christianity has had a huge impact on the planet, one that is quantifiable and can be explored.
I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
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1/20/2010 3:08:25 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 3:05:36 PM, Volkov wrote:
I don't see the big issue with studying the effects of religion on society and culture. It is a force that can shape and influence it, like media, politics, or what have you, whether its true or not. I mean, Jesus and God and Yahweh don't exist, but Christianity has had a huge impact on the planet, one that is quantifiable and can be explored.

I meant using it as a base to choose a religion.
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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1/21/2010 10:33:15 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 2:59:07 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 1/20/2010 2:52:31 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
The issue of, does God exist, or is a specific religion correct are utterly seperate to the issue of their social effect.

The social effect is irrelevant concerning Atheism vs Theism.

If one were to argue that say that Catholicism should be encouraged or given state funds because it's presence reduces cow tipping then an atheist rebuttal might be, "it is more important to stop people following false ideologies than it is to prevent cow tipping".

It depends on the debate.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
DATCMOTO
Posts: 6,160
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1/22/2010 3:02:23 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/20/2010 1:00:45 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
It has come to my attention recently that debating the societal effects of religion is pointless, one side may be better to follow, but what we're cocnerned with is which side is factually correct.

Saying "The world would be much better with Islam - 9/11, Taliban oppression, etc." is getting us nowhere, since it doesn't debunk Islam. We are concerned with whether or not God exists, which one, etc. not the effects of it.

This is first intelligent statement I have seen you post. Ever.

Has your account been hacked?
The Cross.. the Cross.
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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1/22/2010 6:14:53 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/22/2010 3:02:23 AM, DATCMOTO wrote:
At 1/20/2010 1:00:45 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
It has come to my attention recently that debating the societal effects of religion is pointless, one side may be better to follow, but what we're cocnerned with is which side is factually correct.

Saying "The world would be much better with Islam - 9/11, Taliban oppression, etc." is getting us nowhere, since it doesn't debunk Islam. We are concerned with whether or not God exists, which one, etc. not the effects of it.

This is first intelligent statement I have seen you post. Ever.

Has your account been hacked?

I know I should not respond but for real... I mean really? The kid has twice your IQ, he is not just a bit more intelligent than you, the truth is you are not fit to be his pet. Now go find another forum to troll.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.