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Question to atheists:

andymcstab
Posts: 308
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3/28/2014 11:32:44 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
1: What are your subsidiary beliefs of atheism. ie, do you affirm creationism shouldn't be taught in schools?
2: What is your definition of atheism? Non belief? Withholding of belief? Or belief that there is not (a god).

Thanks

Please just answer the questions.
dwkwvss
Posts: 14
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3/28/2014 12:54:35 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 3/28/2014 11:32:44 AM, andymcstab wrote:
1: What are your subsidiary beliefs of atheism. ie, do you affirm creationism shouldn't be taught in schools?
2: What is your definition of atheism? Non belief? Withholding of belief? Or belief that there is not (a god).

Thanks

Please just answer the questions.

I know you'll naturally be guarded against personal attacks or name-calling or whatever. So I just want to make sure that I only intend to make logical arguments only, not any personal belittling, that seems rampant in such discussions as these.

1. I do affirm that creationism shouldn't be taught in schools. But just not in science classes. In a religious context, I do not find it completely off the scale.

Science deals only with the natural explanations of the natural phenomena. It is contingent upon all theories and hypotheses being testifiable and falsifiable. Creationism really is not. It therefore cannot be tested using the scientific method, and thus has no place in a science class. That is to say, I'm not saying that it is outright wrong. I respect the right for you to believe in it.

i also believe in the idea that morality does not necessarily has its root in the supernatural. This is to argue that just because atheists don't believe in god, they are not immoral in any sense. I also believe that in the event that all gods were disproven (purely hypothetical) baby-killing won't become rampant. I do mix in a little humor here, but purely to make my argument more obvious.

2. My definition of atheism is the belief that god doesn't exist. I also believe that it is also a belief that the supernatural does not exist. Necessarily, this makes science a central philosophy of atheism. Science is the strict adhesion to natural, materialistic explanation of the natural phenomena. Atheism is the extra step saying that's all the explanation needed.
monty1
Posts: 1,084
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3/28/2014 1:13:03 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Creation should not be taught in schools. It is a contradiction to science.

God does not exist. It doesn't have to be explained in any more depth than that.

Atheism means atheism. Understand the definition.
andymcstab
Posts: 308
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3/28/2014 1:32:09 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 3/28/2014 1:13:03 PM, monty1 wrote:
Creation should not be taught in schools. It is a contradiction to science.

God does not exist. It doesn't have to be explained in any more depth than that.

Atheism means atheism. Understand the definition.

So what proof do you have against Gods existence?
Your statement requires cast-iron dead-cert proof which needs (alot of) substantiation.
andymcstab
Posts: 308
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3/28/2014 1:33:28 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 3/28/2014 12:54:35 PM, dwkwvss wrote:
At 3/28/2014 11:32:44 AM, andymcstab wrote:
1: What are your subsidiary beliefs of atheism. ie, do you affirm creationism shouldn't be taught in schools?
2: What is your definition of atheism? Non belief? Withholding of belief? Or belief that there is not (a god).

Thanks

Please just answer the questions.

I know you'll naturally be guarded against personal attacks or name-calling or whatever. So I just want to make sure that I only intend to make logical arguments only, not any personal belittling, that seems rampant in such discussions as these.

1. I do affirm that creationism shouldn't be taught in schools. But just not in science classes. In a religious context, I do not find it completely off the scale.

Science deals only with the natural explanations of the natural phenomena. It is contingent upon all theories and hypotheses being testifiable and falsifiable. Creationism really is not. It therefore cannot be tested using the scientific method, and thus has no place in a science class. That is to say, I'm not saying that it is outright wrong. I respect the right for you to believe in it.

i also believe in the idea that morality does not necessarily has its root in the supernatural. This is to argue that just because atheists don't believe in god, they are not immoral in any sense. I also believe that in the event that all gods were disproven (purely hypothetical) baby-killing won't become rampant. I do mix in a little humor here, but purely to make my argument more obvious.

2. My definition of atheism is the belief that god doesn't exist. I also believe that it is also a belief that the supernatural does not exist. Necessarily, this makes science a central philosophy of atheism. Science is the strict adhesion to natural, materialistic explanation of the natural phenomena. Atheism is the extra step saying that's all the explanation needed.

Likewise to you
TheGreatAndPowerful
Posts: 3,012
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3/28/2014 1:52:28 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 3/28/2014 11:32:44 AM, andymcstab wrote:
1: What are your subsidiary beliefs of atheism. ie, do you affirm creationism shouldn't be taught in schools?

The only subsidiary beliefs are atheism involves claim of knowledge (agnostic vs. gnostic atheism) and the presence or absence of positive disbelief (strong vs. weak atheism).

Overall, I am a strong atheism. I positively belief and affirm that gods don't exist.
With respect to agnosticism, I'll concede agnosticism about the concept of a god in general, though with the specific god-concepts man has invented over the centuries, I'll stake a claim in saying that I know they don't exist.

2: What is your definition of atheism? Non belief? Withholding of belief? Or belief that there is not (a god).

I don't have my own personally definition of atheism. Seems like too much of a hassle. I'll just go with existing definitions:

"disbelief or lack of belief in the existence of God or gods."

Thanks

Please just answer the questions.
Graincruncher
Posts: 2,799
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3/28/2014 2:16:26 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 3/28/2014 11:32:44 AM, andymcstab wrote:
1: What are your subsidiary beliefs of atheism. ie, do you affirm creationism shouldn't be taught in schools?

Atheism is a consequence of my beliefs and knowledge, it is not the cause of them.

2: What is your definition of atheism? Non belief? Withholding of belief? Or belief that there is not (a god).

Mine would be that used by the entire educated world including academia:

n. disbelief or lack of belief in the existence of God or gods.

If you meet either of these criteria then you are an atheist.
Yoshi
Posts: 71
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3/28/2014 2:22:11 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 3/28/2014 11:32:44 AM, andymcstab wrote:
1: What are your subsidiary beliefs of atheism. ie, do you affirm creationism shouldn't be taught in schools?

Subsidiary beliefs, ones that are related to atheism.

Yes, creationism shouldn't be taught in schools as a form of science or anything related to science at all, I also don't think it should be taught anywhere else either in schools because if so then we might as well teach every other religious story and I'm sure that'll be difficult to do.

Creationism is not science

Science looks for patterns and trends and asks questions about them, then follow the evidence.

Creationism looks for anything that fits it's own answer.

2: What is your definition of atheism? Non belief? Withholding of belief? Or belief that there is not (a god).

To understand Atheism, it's best to define the full scope of the claim.

The Claim

A deity or multiple deities exists and are of a religion, I'm sure everyone can agree that this is the claim so what do we do about it?

We first question our ability to know with the current scientific tools we use, that is if the claim can be proven to be true or not.

As we all should agree, this claim is out of our ability to know if the claim can be proven true or false, to not know if a claim is true or not is to be Agnostic and the opposite (to know) would be Gnostic.

So if we are all Agnostic about the claim (we should as we've yet to encounter compelling evidence), we either take this claim on the on faith or we decided that we rather not take this claim on faith.

So with this definition of what atheism is, I can say it is rational to be an Atheist, I also can assume that everyone here can agree with this definition.

This means that an atheist doesn't believe in anything more or the same then a theist in regards to this claim, they just never took the claim on faith, that's all.

This is who I am however there's theists and atheists who know the claim is true or false and if so then they are "Gnostic" about the claim and because they are Gnostic they MUST accept or either reject the claim which MUST be based on valid evidence, if the evidence is invalid the they aren't really Gnostic as we (or just me) would perceive them to be.

Thanks

Please just answer the questions.

Hopefully I answered well?
el_em_en_oh
Posts: 66
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3/28/2014 2:55:55 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 3/28/2014 11:32:44 AM, andymcstab wrote:
1: What are your subsidiary beliefs of atheism. ie, do you affirm creationism shouldn't be taught in schools?
2: What is your definition of atheism? Non belief? Withholding of belief? Or belief that there is not (a god).

Thanks

Please just answer the questions.

1) Creationism should not be taught in schools (public schools in any event). Teach anything you want to teach in private schools, bible schools, catholic schools, etc. Keep religion out of public schools (creationism is a religious concept)

2) Atheist: Disbelief or lack of belief in the existence of God or gods

You sure love beating this horse and kicking this dog. I don't feel compelled and driven to force my beliefs down your throat... why do you feel it necessary to shove yours down mine?

Why is it that when someone disagrees with you, your automatic position/response is "PROVE IT". Seriously?

Why don't YOU prove to ME that there IS a god or gods? All I'm doing/saying/thinking is that there isn't a god or gods, so the burden of proof is on you to prove it's existence (not me to prove it's non-existence).

Me having to prove to you that something doesn't exist, is a little asinine, don't you think? Of course, you'll turn this around and say that it's up to the atheist to prove god or gods DON'T exist, and then you'll start another thread/debate about how silly & stupid atheists are, and we'll come full circle.
dvande28
Posts: 32
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3/28/2014 3:44:56 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 3/28/2014 11:32:44 AM, andymcstab wrote:
1: What are your subsidiary beliefs of atheism. ie, do you affirm creationism shouldn't be taught in schools?

Absolutely none. However, I also believe in secularism which is why I believe creationism should not be taught in schools.

2: What is your definition of atheism? Non belief? Withholding of belief? Or belief that there is not (a god).

I would define my version of atheism as the rejection of the God hypothesis as proposed by theists.
Sswdwm
Posts: 1,398
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3/28/2014 4:27:30 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 3/28/2014 11:32:44 AM, andymcstab wrote:
1: What are your subsidiary beliefs of atheism. ie, do you affirm creationism shouldn't be taught in schools?

Naturalism
Empiricism

I don't agree with all humanist values, as I think their philosophy is flawed on the upholding of humans.

As for creationism (Christian creationism), I don't think it should be taught (especially in science classes), but I do think the Bible & religion should be taught in perhaps English, history and religious education classes, as it is so important to understand culture, poetry and society. And I do think it should be preferentially taught over others due to its historical me current impact, Islamic and Hindu tenets should also be taught for the same reasons.

2: What is your definition of atheism? Non belief? Withholding of belief? Or belief that there is not (a god).

'I don't believe in the existence of any god' describes the definition of atheism well enough.

Thanks

Please just answer the questions.
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SNP1
Posts: 2,403
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3/28/2014 5:25:11 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 3/28/2014 11:32:44 AM, andymcstab wrote:
1: What are your subsidiary beliefs of atheism. ie, do you affirm creationism shouldn't be taught in schools?

Creationism is an unproven hypothesis. If it is taught in school it would have to be in a religion class, not science.

2: What is your definition of atheism? Non belief? Withholding of belief? Or belief that there is not (a god).

Atheism is the lack of belief or disbelief in God or Gods.
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jh1234l
Posts: 580
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3/29/2014 10:52:55 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 3/28/2014 1:32:09 PM, andymcstab wrote:
At 3/28/2014 1:13:03 PM, monty1 wrote:
Creation should not be taught in schools. It is a contradiction to science.

God does not exist. It doesn't have to be explained in any more depth than that.

Atheism means atheism. Understand the definition.

So what proof do you have against Gods existence?
Your statement requires cast-iron dead-cert proof which needs (alot of) substantiation.

The affirmative (person making the argument) has the burden of proof. It is the atheist's burden of proof to prove evolution. It is the theist's burden of proof to prove a god exists.

The concept of a god is not falsifiable. It makes no predictions, as we do not and will never know how God acts.

Think of the concept of burden of proof this way: If someone says that a invisible pink unicorn (that cannot be felt, seen, heard, smelled, or tasted) exists, then does the person denying it have to prove the pink unicorn, which cannot be proven, does not exist? No. Then, by your logic:

The russel's teapot
A huge banana floating in space
Zeus

All exist unless the nonbeliever proves it wrong.
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WaterTipper
Posts: 40
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3/29/2014 11:20:56 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 3/28/2014 11:32:44 AM, andymcstab wrote:
1: What are your subsidiary beliefs of atheism. ie, do you affirm creationism shouldn't be taught in schools?
I believe that creationism should be taught in schools. However, I strongly disagree that it should be taught in science classrooms; however, it should be taught as part of classes such as theology (how creation myths of various religions differ) or English (the Bible has some literary values and lessons to offer).

At 3/28/2014 11:32:44 AM, andymcstab wrote:
2: What is your definition of atheism? Non belief? Withholding of belief? Or belief that there is not (a god).
Atheism, in my opinion, is the lack of belief in any deities. It in itself states nothing about the existence of deities.