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is it true? adam and eve......

brooke_bowen
Posts: 45
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1/30/2010 5:38:00 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
i had chose this thread because i had sone confussion about the whole adam and eve topic
i have heard numorous times that the apple that eve had took from the tree was just an symbol as god had told the two not to have sex (other words eat the apple) and which they have done
however my question is could this be the truth? if so why not just the truth instead of an apple? to protect childen?
lets be honest they hear worst things then this in eveyday life/
go to my debate http://www.Debate.org...


I know it seems hard sometimes but remember one thing.
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brooke_bowen
Posts: 45
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1/30/2010 8:33:28 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/30/2010 5:39:27 PM, wonderwoman wrote:
go play Creed II it explains it all

......
go to my debate http://www.Debate.org...


I know it seems hard sometimes but remember one thing.
Through every dark night, theres a bright day after that.
So no matter how hard it get, stick your chest out, keep ya head up.... and handle it."
Tupac Shakur
Koopin
Posts: 12,090
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1/30/2010 8:38:12 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/30/2010 5:38:00 PM, brooke_bowen wrote:
i had chose this thread because i had sone confussion about the whole adam and eve topic
i have heard numorous times that the apple that eve had took from the tree was just an symbol as god had told the two not to have sex (other words eat the apple) and which they have done
however my question is could this be the truth? if so why not just the truth instead of an apple? to protect childen?
lets be honest they hear worst things then this in eveyday life/

REALLY?
Be fruitful and multiply said God. If you read the bible you will see that God talks a lot about how sex is good. AND IT WAS NOT AN APPLE..WHY DOES EVERYONE THINK IT IS AN APPLE?
kfc
brooke_bowen
Posts: 45
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1/30/2010 8:44:38 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
im confused about the whole issue.
go to my debate http://www.Debate.org...


I know it seems hard sometimes but remember one thing.
Through every dark night, theres a bright day after that.
So no matter how hard it get, stick your chest out, keep ya head up.... and handle it."
Tupac Shakur
Koopin
Posts: 12,090
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1/30/2010 8:48:11 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/30/2010 8:44:38 PM, brooke_bowen wrote:
im confused about the whole issue.

Tell me what you are confused about.
kfc
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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1/30/2010 8:57:34 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Eve was the hero. The wise, talking snake was telling eve that she will too become wise and godlike if she eats the apple, and she did. She knew that God was a tyrant, so she took action. Then the men tried to put the blame on the woman for being disobedient when she was really doing the right thing.

I don't think intercourse was the metaphor either.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Puck
Posts: 6,457
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1/30/2010 9:04:02 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/30/2010 8:57:34 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:

I don't think intercourse was the metaphor either.

Ha, Ragnar found a wiki on a snake, sex ,eden thing.
studentathletechristian8
Posts: 5,810
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1/30/2010 9:08:30 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/30/2010 8:57:34 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
Eve was the hero. The wise, talking snake was telling eve that she will too become wise and godlike if she eats the apple, and she did. She knew that God was a tyrant, so she took action. Then the men tried to put the blame on the woman for being disobedient when she was really doing the right thing.

I don't think intercourse was the metaphor either.

Don't take this as legit.
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
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1/30/2010 9:12:10 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/30/2010 8:57:34 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
Eve was the hero. The wise, talking snake was telling eve that she will too become wise and godlike if she eats the apple, and she did. She knew that God was a tyrant, so she took action. Then the men tried to put the blame on the woman for being disobedient when she was really doing the right thing.

10/10
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
nickthengineer
Posts: 251
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1/30/2010 9:56:48 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Correct Koopin, the fruit could not have been a metaphor for don't have sex, as God had already said to be fruitful and multiply. As for whether the fruit was a metaphor at all, that depends on if you want to regard the whole Creation account, Garden of Eden, and Adam and Eve themselves as metaphors and not as actual events and people. If it was all literal, then the fruit would have been actual fruit.
I evolved from stupid. (http://www.debate.org...)
honkerburger
Posts: 77
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1/31/2010 7:03:20 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
fruit = knowledge. To have knowledge is to have the ability to sin. As sin is not allowed in heaven thus why they were banished. Think about it can animals sin? Can newborns sin? No.
tkubok
Posts: 5,044
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1/31/2010 9:04:25 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/31/2010 7:03:20 AM, honkerburger wrote:
fruit = knowledge. To have knowledge is to have the ability to sin. As sin is not allowed in heaven thus why they were banished. Think about it can animals sin? Can newborns sin? No.

Curious. First off, it wasnt simply knowledge, the fruit was the knowledge of Good and Evil. How can someone know what is WRONG if they do not know what good and evil is? Should we punish newborns for commiting a sin? No. Exactly, which is why the adam/eve story is unfair.

Secondly, if animals cannot sin, and homosexuality is a sin, how are the animals capable of homosexual acts?
Rezzealaux
Posts: 2,251
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1/31/2010 9:07:01 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/31/2010 9:04:25 AM, tkubok wrote:
Secondly, if animals cannot sin, and homosexuality is a sin, how are the animals capable of homosexual acts?

QFT. I love you. No homo.
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honkerburger
Posts: 77
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1/31/2010 10:14:32 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/31/2010 9:04:25 AM, tkubok wrote:
At 1/31/2010 7:03:20 AM, honkerburger wrote:
fruit = knowledge. To have knowledge is to have the ability to sin. As sin is not allowed in heaven thus why they were banished. Think about it can animals sin? Can newborns sin? No.

Curious. First off, it wasnt simply knowledge, the fruit was the knowledge of Good and Evil. How can someone know what is WRONG if they do not know what good and evil is? Should we punish newborns for commiting a sin? No. Exactly, which is why the adam/eve story is unfair.

Logically does not follow
nickthengineer
Posts: 251
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1/31/2010 10:37:54 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/31/2010 9:04:25 AM, tkubok wrote:
At 1/31/2010 7:03:20 AM, honkerburger wrote:
fruit = knowledge. To have knowledge is to have the ability to sin. As sin is not allowed in heaven thus why they were banished. Think about it can animals sin? Can newborns sin? No.

Curious. First off, it wasnt simply knowledge, the fruit was the knowledge of Good and Evil. How can someone know what is WRONG if they do not know what good and evil is? Should we punish newborns for commiting a sin? No. Exactly, which is why the adam/eve story is unfair.

Knowledge of good and evil is a little different than obeying someone who is clearly your superior. Adam and Eve knew what God told them they were allowed to do, as well as what God told them they weren't allowed to do. They therefore knew that disobeying was wrong.
I evolved from stupid. (http://www.debate.org...)
DATCMOTO
Posts: 6,160
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2/1/2010 8:27:56 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/30/2010 5:38:00 PM, brooke_bowen wrote:
i had chose this thread because i had sone confussion about the whole adam and eve topic
i have heard numorous times that the apple that eve had took from the tree was just an symbol as god had told the two not to have sex (other words eat the apple) and which they have done
however my question is could this be the truth? if so why not just the truth instead of an apple? to protect childen?
lets be honest they hear worst things then this in eveyday life/

Nowhere in the Genesis account does it mention an apple; it mentions fruit.. the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.
The garden of Eden was a perfect marriage of the spiritual and the material; so there were physical trees with physical fruit which were also spiritual gifts.
As soon as Adam disobeyed God (sinned) the material element 'fell' away from the spiritual.
Now everything is finite.. rusting, rotting, aging, dying..
The infinite (Jesus Christ) re-entered the finite and overcame it by a perfect life, sacrificial death and resurrection..

READ the New testament with an open mind and an honest heart, save yourselves from the finite!

" and whoever comes to me I will never drive away. "
The Cross.. the Cross.
Volkov
Posts: 9,765
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2/1/2010 12:16:56 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/31/2010 10:37:54 AM, nickthengineer wrote:
Knowledge of good and evil is a little different than obeying someone who is clearly your superior. Adam and Eve knew what God told them they were allowed to do, as well as what God told them they weren't allowed to do. They therefore knew that disobeying was wrong.

No, they knew that disobeying was against what God said - but that doesn't necessarily mean they thought it was "wrong," because to imply wrongness is to imply knowledge of right and wrong, good and evil, etc. And while I may not be a biblical expert, I do know that the "fruit" granted knowledge of good and evil - which means that therefore, they must not have known about it before.
IEUkillertofu
Posts: 33
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2/1/2010 3:54:20 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Evil = Against will of God

God said don't eat that stuff

Eve and Adam ate the stuff which then gave them knowledge to understand what else pissed God off. Thus they could (and did) then sin knowing what they were doing.
tkubok
Posts: 5,044
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2/2/2010 11:35:08 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/31/2010 10:13:37 AM, honkerburger wrote:
At 1/31/2010 9:04:25 AM, tkubok wrote:
homosexuality is a sin

Who says that?

The bible?

At 1/31/2010 10:14:32 AM, honkerburger wrote:
Logically does not follow

Feel free to explain why the logic does not follow.
tkubok
Posts: 5,044
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2/2/2010 11:36:00 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 1/31/2010 10:37:54 AM, nickthengineer wrote:
Knowledge of good and evil is a little different than obeying someone who is clearly your superior. Adam and Eve knew what God told them they were allowed to do, as well as what God told them they weren't allowed to do. They therefore knew that disobeying was wrong.

No they didnt, and this is the point.

Let me ask you this. Do you think a baby knows what is right and what is wrong?
tkubok
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2/2/2010 11:36:51 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/1/2010 3:54:20 PM, IEUkillertofu wrote:
Evil = Against will of God

God said don't eat that stuff

Eve and Adam ate the stuff which then gave them knowledge to understand what else pissed God off. Thus they could (and did) then sin knowing what they were doing.

Great. So it was evil if Abraham refused to sacrifice his son to God. What great morals does this bible contain!
Koopin
Posts: 12,090
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2/2/2010 11:42:10 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/2/2010 11:36:51 AM, tkubok wrote:

Great. So it was evil if Abraham refused to sacrifice his son to God. What great morals does this bible contain!

God knew that Abraham could handle it. God says that he will not put something on someone who can not handle it. Anyway, it was a test and an example. Abraham did not have to kill his son because God provided a lamb. Just like we (Abraham's son) do not need to go to hell because God gave his own son Jesus Christ (the lamb) to die for us.
kfc
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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2/2/2010 11:42:29 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/1/2010 3:54:20 PM, IEUkillertofu wrote:
Evil = Against will of God

God said don't eat that stuff

Eve and Adam ate the stuff which then gave them knowledge to understand what else pissed God off. Thus they could (and did) then sin knowing what they were doing.

So when God commands you to slaughter entire nations, you are an evil person if you say "no"?

As Socrates said, is it moral because the gods command it, or do the gods command it because it is moral? This question completely destroys Christian "morality."
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Koopin
Posts: 12,090
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2/2/2010 11:46:52 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/2/2010 11:42:29 AM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:

So when God commands you to slaughter entire nations, you are an evil person if you say "no"?


Many Christian do not want to say this because they they want to look good in mans eyes. But Yes.

During the old testament God commanded his people to slaughter entire nations. It is better to Obey God than to obey man. But then again, God does not really ask that anymore.
kfc