Total Posts:49|Showing Posts:1-30|Last Page
Jump to topic:

A Christian, a true one.

GodSands
Posts: 2,843
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 1:32:21 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
What is the difference between a lost church member and a Christian, for why would Christ say, "Depart from me, you worker of inquity." to those who confessed faith in Him? There is a distinction between a lost church member and a Christian. What is it anyone?

A lost church member is somebody who attends church once a week, not only that but they might also attend house meeting every week. A lost church member does not know the biblical Christ, they might and do play roles in a church building, such as they might do the welcome or they might do the offerings for example.

But so will a Christian. The Christian will attend church every week and he or she will attend house meetings every week, they might and do play roles in the church building dito to a lost church member.

So, please anyone what is the difference from a non believers view on this matter?
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 3:10:06 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/10/2010 3:03:30 PM, GodSands wrote:
Anyone know?

There is no difference. They both believe in rubbish.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 3:10:29 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
: At 2/10/2010 3:08:02 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 2/10/2010 3:03:30 PM, GodSands wrote:
Anyone know?

What are you even asking? I don't understand.


What is the difference between a lost church member and a Christian? Bare in mine the lost church member thinks they are saved.
jharry
Posts: 4,984
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 3:10:50 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/10/2010 3:03:30 PM, GodSands wrote:
Anyone know?

John 13

34A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.

35By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

Verse 35?
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
ournamestoolong
Posts: 1,059
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 3:18:04 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
One is more faithful in something that is yet to be proven.
I'll get by with a little help from my friends.

Ournamestoolong

Secretary of Commerce

Destroy talking ads!
ournamestoolong
Posts: 1,059
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 3:18:47 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/10/2010 3:18:04 PM, ournamestoolong wrote:
One is more faithful in something that is yet to be proven.

OH! I KNOW!

One is going to a place that is a figment of the true Christian's imagination.
I'll get by with a little help from my friends.

Ournamestoolong

Secretary of Commerce

Destroy talking ads!
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 3:20:41 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
: At 2/10/2010 3:10:50 PM, jharry wrote:
At 2/10/2010 3:03:30 PM, GodSands wrote:
Anyone know?

John 13

34A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.

35By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

Verse 35?


John 13:35 says, "All people will know that you are my followers if you love each other."

But Matthew 7:22-23 reads, "On that day many people will say to me, 'Lord, Lord we spoke for you, and through you we forced out demons and did many miracls.' The I will tell them clearly, 'Get away from me, you who do evil. I never knew you."

So what is the difference between a Christian and a lost church member or someone who plainly thinks they are a Christian but are not?
mattrodstrom
Posts: 12,028
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 3:24:33 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/10/2010 3:20:41 PM, GodSands wrote:

So what is the difference between a Christian and a lost church member or someone who plainly thinks they are a Christian but are not?

One, you think isn't really a christian.

The other You think is.

But in truth Your thoughts on the matter don't matter, and are actually seemingly sinful in and of themselves.

Who are you to judge someone else's "relationship" with The Christ.

Last time I checked you didn't profess to be God you just accused others of assuming themselves to be God.
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 3:26:30 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
: At 2/10/2010 3:24:33 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 2/10/2010 3:20:41 PM, GodSands wrote:

So what is the difference between a Christian and a lost church member or someone who plainly thinks they are a Christian but are not?

One, you think isn't really a christian.

The other You think is.

But in truth Your thoughts on the matter don't matter, and are actually seemingly sinful in and of themselves.

Who are you to judge someone else's "relationship" with The Christ.

Last time I checked you didn't profess to be God you just accused others of assuming themselves to be God.


What does all this even mean? I am not understanding it.
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 3:29:03 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
: At 2/10/2010 3:18:47 PM, ournamestoolong wrote:
At 2/10/2010 3:18:04 PM, ournamestoolong wrote:
One is more faithful in something that is yet to be proven.

OH! I KNOW!

One is going to a place that is a figment of the true Christian's imagination.


No, if you were correct about the Christian, wouldn't you be correct about the lost church member? Both believe they are going to heaven.
mattrodstrom
Posts: 12,028
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 3:30:00 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/10/2010 3:26:30 PM, GodSands wrote:
: At 2/10/2010 3:24:33 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 2/10/2010 3:20:41 PM, GodSands wrote:

So what is the difference between a Christian and a lost church member or someone who plainly thinks they are a Christian but are not?

One, you think isn't really a christian.

The other You think is.

But in truth Your thoughts on the matter don't matter, and are actually seemingly sinful in and of themselves.

Who are you to judge someone else's "relationship" with The Christ.

Last time I checked you didn't profess to be God you just accused others of assuming themselves to be God.


What does all this even mean? I am not understanding it.

What do you mean by a "lost church member" who thinks they believe but really doesn't?

I think you mean someone who you don't think is a really worthy/ doesn't have a good relationship with god.

These judgments are supposed to be the domain of God, who are you to judge someone else's relationship with the big man?
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
ournamestoolong
Posts: 1,059
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 3:30:03 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/10/2010 3:29:03 PM, GodSands wrote:
: At 2/10/2010 3:18:47 PM, ournamestoolong wrote:
At 2/10/2010 3:18:04 PM, ournamestoolong wrote:
One is more faithful in something that is yet to be proven.

OH! I KNOW!

One is going to a place that is a figment of the true Christian's imagination.


No, if you were correct about the Christian, wouldn't you be correct about the lost church member? Both believe they are going to heaven.

Both are going to heaven, everyone is.
I'll get by with a little help from my friends.

Ournamestoolong

Secretary of Commerce

Destroy talking ads!
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 3:32:36 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Who are you to judge someone else's "relationship" with The Christ.

John 7:24, "Judge not by appearence, but judge with righteous judgement." - I am not judging anyone here, but making a distinction between lost church members and Christians. If a person is a lost church member, they will show that they are in how they respond to this forum post, if a person is a Christian they will show that they are by this forum post.
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 3:52:45 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
What do I mean by a lost church member?

Ok, someone who believes they are saved, yet who equally lives in sin as someone who does not confess faith in Jesus Christ. The distinction between a lost church member and a Christian is not clear at first, but you will know them by their fruits. A bad tree cannot produce good fruit and a good tree cannot produce bad fruit.

You can tell if someone is a lost church member by their testimony, if they say I was born a Christian, they are not really a Christian. If they say I go to church and I am involved in the church, they are not really a Christian. If they say, my mother and father are Christians, they are not really a Christian. If they tell you they can to the Lord because they went through a unpleasent period in their life, they are not a Christian.

A Christian who really is a Christian is a Christian because of a super natural work of the Holy Spirit in their life, which is dramatic to say the least. Their lives would be turn up side down. Their sin which they onced loved is now hated. The Lord Jesus does not convict some of His children, but all. The Holy Spirit rips out your sin from your heart, destroys your sin, while regentarating your heart and then dwells within it making it new and pure in the eyes of God.

The evidence of a Christian is that they continue to repent thoughtout their life. Lost church members have never repented nor confessed their sin. They only believe that they are Christians because they accept the aprovial of Christ to be apart of their lives, not their life entirely.

So what made a Christian continue to repent for the rest of their days?
mattrodstrom
Posts: 12,028
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 3:57:58 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/10/2010 3:32:36 PM, GodSands wrote:
Who are you to judge someone else's "relationship" with The Christ.

John 7:24, "Judge not by appearence, but judge with righteous judgement." - I am not judging anyone here, but making a distinction between lost church members and Christians. If a person is a lost church member, they will show that they are in how they respond to this forum post, if a person is a Christian they will show that they are by this forum post.

So, on the one hand an omniscient being of Infinite wisdom is to judge, on the other hand you are based off of a forum post, gotcha.
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 3:59:16 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
: At 2/10/2010 3:57:58 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 2/10/2010 3:32:36 PM, GodSands wrote:
Who are you to judge someone else's "relationship" with The Christ.

John 7:24, "Judge not by appearence, but judge with righteous judgement." - I am not judging anyone here, but making a distinction between lost church members and Christians. If a person is a lost church member, they will show that they are in how they respond to this forum post, if a person is a Christian they will show that they are by this forum post.

So, on the one hand an omniscient being of Infinite wisdom is to judge, on the other hand you are based off of a forum post, gotcha.


Again, explain further?
mattrodstrom
Posts: 12,028
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 4:01:26 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/10/2010 3:52:45 PM, GodSands wrote:

A Christian who really is a Christian is a Christian because of a super natural work of the Holy Spirit in their life, which is dramatic to say the least.

So if they've convinced themselves that they had a supernatural experience, they're a christian, and if not, then not. I understand.
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 4:06:45 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
: At 2/10/2010 3:59:16 PM, GodSands wrote:
: At 2/10/2010 3:57:58 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 2/10/2010 3:32:36 PM, GodSands wrote:
Who are you to judge someone else's "relationship" with The Christ.

John 7:24, "Judge not by appearence, but judge with righteous judgement." - I am not judging anyone here, but making a distinction between lost church members and Christians. If a person is a lost church member, they will show that they are in how they respond to this forum post, if a person is a Christian they will show that they are by this forum post.

So, on the one hand an omniscient being of Infinite wisdom is to judge, on the other hand you are based off of a forum post, gotcha.


Again, explain further?


God will judge them by their sin, I am not judging. I am distingushing the difference between a Christian and a lost church member. If someone agrees with me, they are probably Christians, if they mock me here and try to find ways around this, they are not a Christian. Saying someone is or isn't a Christian, for would it be judging if I said, 'You are a Christian if for these reasons...'? No, so why would I be judging if I said, ' You aren't a Christian if for these reasons...'?

You can also tell if somebody isn't a Christian if they say that Christ isn't the number one thing in their lives but rather their friends or family or something along those lines. However they must not realise it is a genuine question, otherwise they might lie.
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 4:22:58 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
: At 2/10/2010 4:01:26 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 2/10/2010 3:52:45 PM, GodSands wrote:

A Christian who really is a Christian is a Christian because of a super natural work of the Holy Spirit in their life, which is dramatic to say the least.

So if they've convinced themselves that they had a supernatural experience, they're a christian, and if not, then not. I understand.


No, you cannot convince yourself that something super natural happened to you, if it is the Holy Spirit it will cahnge the very way you life out your life. No one can change in such a way without the Holy Spirit, I tell you it is impossible. The Holy Spirit is not of this world, it has not physical traits about it, when a person is convicted by the Holy Spirit the last thing they would tell you about their experience is a lie. For if they lie about their experience it is not of the Holy Spirit, the Word of God is alive in them.

If I convinced myself that I was convicted by the Holy Spirit, then I would have to convince myself that my life is still the same as it was before.

If you ever get hit over my a large truck traveling at 60 mph, if you live you will be broken in many ways, but if you told your friend that you will be later, and once you arrive at his house he asks, "Why are you late?" You say, "I was hit by a large truck traveling at 60 mph." You friend will not believe you and will say your are lying clearly.

But if someone says, "I have been hit by the Holy Spirit." Yet has not changed, you would say to him, "You are a liar." But if you are hit by the Holy Spirit, like the large truck traveling at 60 mph, you will be changed completely, and which one is bigger? God or a large truck?
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 4:27:47 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Please, let me fix this here.

No, you cannot convince yourself that something super natural happened to you, if it is the Holy Spirit it will change the very way you live out your life. No one can change in such a way without the Holy Spirit, I tell you it is impossible. The Holy Spirit is not of this world, it has not physical traits about it, when a person is convicted by the Holy Spirit the last thing they would tell you about their experience is a lie. For if they lie about their experience it is not of the Holy Spirit, the Word of God is alive in them.

If I convinced myself that I was convicted by the Holy Spirit, then I would have to convince myself that my life is still the same as it was before.

If you ever get hit over my a large truck traveling at 60 mph, if you live you will be broken in many ways, but if you told your friend that you will be late, and once you arrive at his house he asks, "Why are you late?" You say, "I was hit by a large truck traveling at 60 mph." You friend will not believe you and will say your are lying clearly. Because you are just as you were if a large truck did not hit you are 60 mph.

But if someone says, "I have been hit by the Holy Spirit, by God." Yet has not changed, you would say to him, "You are a liar." But if you are hit by the Holy Spirit, you will be changed completely, in the same way you would be changed if a large truck hit you at 60 mph, but I ask which one is bigger? God or a large truck?
sherlockmethod
Posts: 317
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 4:38:29 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Godsands,
Your analogy is faulty. The truck will cause damage we can see. One can say they were run over, but the evidence is plain. As for the holy spirit, people have changed their lives because they believe they were abducted by aliens. Others have changed their lives and do so in a bad way. The holy spirit took many of Jim Jones followers. Smart people who fell for a liar's tricks. They were convinced the holy spirit spoke to them and they were the only ones doing it right. The same goes for jihad. The problem is that some people mistake their experiances. People of all faiths, many contrary to Christianity, claim similiar events.
Library cards: Stopping stupid one book at a time.
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 4:53:31 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
: At 2/10/2010 4:38:29 PM, sherlockmethod wrote:
Godsands,
Your analogy is faulty. The truck will cause damage we can see. One can say they were run over, but the evidence is plain. As for the holy spirit, people have changed their lives because they believe they were abducted by aliens. Others have changed their lives and do so in a bad way. The holy spirit took many of Jim Jones followers. Smart people who fell for a liar's tricks. They were convinced the holy spirit spoke to them and they were the only ones doing it right. The same goes for jihad. The problem is that some people mistake their experiances. People of all faiths, many contrary to Christianity, claim similiar events.


The Holy Spirit does not affect you, it changes you. Notice the difference between a lost church member and a Christian. What has caused there to be such a distiction between lost church members and Christians? Is it that someone has been changed from the inside out by something from outside of them? Someone simply does not change their love for sin to a hatred for sin over night. You grow in your hatred from sin however as a Christian. You will grow in your prayer life, you will grow in repentance, and in the Word of God.

You are saying that someone who is hit by a truck would be changed, but if somebody is hot by God they aren't. For redeption in Christ is found by giving up on your self, and leaning back on Christ to catch you. If I did not become a Christian, I did not give up on myself. If I did not give up on myself, I am still a sinner. However I hate sin, I hate getting drunk, I hate immoral sexual behavior. I hate all sin, because, why? God has totally transformed my life, by getting at it's very centre and reason of my existence. The very core of my life of who I am has been transformed within a single night.

I would ask, "Those who knew me personally before and after I was saved, where have you not seen a change?" People who have known me before and after would not lie, because they know something has happened, and they are not convinced that anything of which they know of changed me.
sherlockmethod
Posts: 317
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 5:07:00 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
I do not doubt you have changed, but would you agree that if you grew up in Iran your change would be attributed to something other than the Christian God? If not that is fine, but you must have asked yourself how much of this change was attributed to something other than yourself and the motivation of those around you.
Library cards: Stopping stupid one book at a time.
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 5:23:28 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
: At 2/10/2010 5:07:00 PM, sherlockmethod wrote:
I do not doubt you have changed, but would you agree that if you grew up in Iran your change would be attributed to something other than the Christian God? If not that is fine, but you must have asked yourself how much of this change was attributed to something other than yourself and the motivation of those around you.

I my case, I was a lost church member, typically hard to convert due to their relaxed place of living. The Christian life, get to go to heaven and I can get drunk etc...That kind of thing. However I was brought up in a Christian home. And now that I am a Christian I ponder on the unconfortable possiblity that my mother isn't a Christian? The more I progress in my walk with God the clearer it appears she her self is not saved.

However, my old life is not of my at all now, hence the born again term used in the regenaration of the heart. Sure you are the same physically but spiritually, I am born again in Jesus Christ.

Nothing other than the Holy Spirit has motivated me. People motivated me before I was a Christian, what good did it do? None. It lasted a week and the emotion ran dry, however when the Holy Spirit motivates you, you hate not but slam down your fist and say, "I will evangelise tomorrow!". Where as before you would just go and do it, as if it was an apointment to had to attend, like a visit to the doctors.

When I was younger I went to a Christian weekend type thing, I also tried to live perfect, and the emotion you get is short lived as is all emotion. A a Christian, if you go to such events like a Christian orgainised weekend away, you will be inderpendent in a way so that the Holy Spirit will work through you and teach you instead of being taught purely by man who are of fault.
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/10/2010 5:33:36 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
: At 2/10/2010 5:07:00 PM, sherlockmethod wrote:
I do not doubt you have changed, but would you agree that if you grew up in Iran your change would be attributed to something other than the Christian God? If not that is fine, but you must have asked yourself how much of this change was attributed to something other than yourself and the motivation of those around you.

If I grew up in Iran, then I would not be me, and who is me now, would be converted. God plans our lives. God knows who will go to heaven and hell, we just don't. For if the elect had yellow tape on their foreheads, preaches and evagelists would run straight to them and preach only to them. But we do not know who the elect are. Only God. But of what excuse do you have? You do not know your self, you maybe one of the elect?

And do not be fooled, when one says to you, "I am a Christian." do not believe that person, but watch how he acts, watch his life.