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Is Abortion Murder?

ChadIrvin
Posts: 31
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5/25/2014 10:38:06 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
According to the Bible, yes it is.

Jeremiah 1:5

"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations."

Psalm 139:13-16

"For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb. I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth. Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them."

Genesis 1:27

"So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them."

According to just these three verses, God created man and He knew us before we were even conceived. This means that once the sperm hits the egg we are a human being.

According to the Bible abortion is murder. And murder, according to the Bible is punishable by eternal death in Hell.

Fortunately, God sent His son to Earth to die on the cross for our sins so that we all can be forgiven and have eternal life in Heaven.
Hematite12
Posts: 400
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5/25/2014 11:14:14 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/25/2014 10:38:06 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
According to the Bible, yes it is.


According to the Bible, slaves owe respect to their masters.

According to the Bible, eating shellfish is immoral.

According to the Bible, homosexuals ought to be publicly executed.

According to the Bible, having sex with your wife when she's on her period is immoral.

According to the Bible, genocide and the massacre of children is a justifiable approach to war.

Jeremiah 1:5

"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations."


It said "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you...". Doesn't life start at conception?

Psalm 139:13-16

"For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb. I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth. Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them."


Obviously, babies develop while they are within the womb. What's your point? Why does this make the cancelling of a zygote (a consciousless, single cell) immoral?

Genesis 1:27

"So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them."


What does this have to do with abortion?

According to just these three verses, God created man and He knew us before we were even conceived. This means that once the sperm hits the egg we are a human being.


I'm pretty sure God's plan isn't going to be hindered by taking a pill that cancels a single, mindless, painless cell.

According to the Bible abortion is murder. And murder, according to the Bible is punishable by eternal death in Hell.

Fortunately, God sent His son to Earth to die on the cross for our sins so that we all can be forgiven and have eternal life in Heaven.

Oh yes, what a nice guy he is. He creates imperfect beings, then makes his son suffer for his own failed creations.

Also, explain this. Why, if God is the same as Christ, do we use the language "his son"? It's just him in a physical form, yes? Why as well then do we use the language "die"? And "suffer"? An omnipotent being does not suffer unless he/she wants himself/herself to.
Cygnus
Posts: 153
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5/25/2014 11:24:04 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Oh, good grief, not this again.

"Kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves." -Numbers 31:17-18

" I have seen Ephraim, like Tyre, planted in a pleasant place. But Ephraim will bring out their children to the slayer. Give them, Lord" what will you give them? Give them wombs that miscarry and breasts that are dry. Because of all their wickedness in Gilgal, I hated them there. Because of their sinful deeds, I will drive them out of my house. I will no longer love them; all their leaders are rebellious. Ephraim is blighted, their root is withered, they yield no fruit. Even if they bear children, I will slay their cherished offspring. Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up." - Hosea 13:16

"And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them." 2 Kings 2:23-24

"At midnight the Lord struck down all the firstborn in Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh, who sat on the throne, to the firstborn of the prisoner, who was in the dungeon, and the firstborn of all the livestock as well." - Exodus 12:29

"Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys." - 1 Samuel 15:3

Your God is pro-choice. Why aren't you?
ChadIrvin
Posts: 31
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5/25/2014 11:38:21 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/25/2014 11:14:14 PM, Hematite12 wrote:
At 5/25/2014 10:38:06 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
According to the Bible, yes it is.


According to the Bible, slaves owe respect to their masters.
The Bible speaks of slaves as those captured in time of war. A sinful and corrupt society is defeated by God and slaves are taken as punishment for their sins. And slavery in the Bible is the same as a servent.
According to the Bible, eating shellfish is immoral.
Speaking directly to the Jewish people of the time. They had many rules before Christ was born on this Earth.
According to the Bible, homosexuals ought to be publicly executed.
According to the Bible all sin is punishable by death, including telling a lie. In those days, public executions were the normal and Jesus, in His sermons reflected what was the norm. The Bible also says forgive those who sin against you.
According to the Bible, having sex with your wife when she's on her period is immoral.
Again, speaking to the Jewish people of the time.
According to the Bible, genocide and the massacre of children is a justifiable approach to war.
It talks about wiping out a sinful nation. Those who commit adultery and murder. A nation in complete and utter sin.

Jeremiah 1:5

"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations."


It said "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you...". Doesn't life start at conception?
Yes, it does, in the physical form. God knew every single one of us at the beginning of time. Abortion destroys a unique creation of God, therefore is murder.

Psalm 139:13-16

"For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb. I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth. Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them."


Obviously, babies develop while they are within the womb. What's your point? Why does this make the cancelling of a zygote (a consciousless, single cell) immoral?
Because, again, this "cell" is a unique creation of God and abortion destroys this creation.
Genesis 1:27

"So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them."


What does this have to do with abortion?
It is a verse that tells us we (all humans) are a creation in the image of God Himself. It tells us we are special in His favor and destroying a unique creation of God is a sin unto Him.
According to just these three verses, God created man and He knew us before we were even conceived. This means that once the sperm hits the egg we are a human being.


I'm pretty sure God's plan isn't going to be hindered by taking a pill that cancels a single, mindless, painless cell.

According to the Bible abortion is murder. And murder, according to the Bible is punishable by eternal death in Hell.

Fortunately, God sent His son to Earth to die on the cross for our sins so that we all can be forgiven and have eternal life in Heaven.

Oh yes, what a nice guy he is. He creates imperfect beings, then makes his son suffer for his own failed creations.
God does not create imperfect beings. We were created perfect, but as a species qi free will, we chose to go against His perfection and His command.
Also, explain this. Why, if God is the same as Christ, do we use the language "his son"? It's just him in a physical form, yes? Why as well then do we use the language "die"? And "suffer"? An omnipotent being does not suffer unless he/she wants himself/herself to.
God sent His son. God is one of three, but also just one. We cannot comprehend everything, because our minds are imperfect.
Martley
Posts: 126
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5/25/2014 11:43:15 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/25/2014 10:38:06 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
According to the Bible, yes it is.

Jeremiah 1:5

"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations."

Psalm 139:13-16

"For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb. I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth. Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them."

Genesis 1:27

"So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them."

According to just these three verses, God created man and He knew us before we were even conceived. This means that once the sperm hits the egg we are a human being.

According to the Bible abortion is murder. And murder, according to the Bible is punishable by eternal death in Hell.

Fortunately, God sent His son to Earth to die on the cross for our sins so that we all can be forgiven and have eternal life in Heaven.

Murder is defined as "the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another". Abortion is not illegal, therefore it is not murder. Now you could argue that abortion is immoral and a punishable sin according to your theistic bible... Some will help you paddle that canoe, and some won't.
A Black Belt is a white belt who never quit.

The best time to do something was 20 years ago.... the second best to do something is now.
Romanii
Posts: 4,851
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5/25/2014 11:44:38 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/25/2014 10:38:06 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
According to the Bible, yes it is.

Cool. An ancient book of Hebrew mythology, folklore, and history hints that the modern-day practice of abortion is immoral. Point?
ChadIrvin
Posts: 31
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5/25/2014 11:49:02 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/25/2014 11:24:04 PM, Cygnus wrote:
Oh, good grief, not this again.
Are you tired of this? You don't have to reply.

"Kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves." -Numbers 31:17-18
A godless nation is destroyed by its enemies. We have chosen sin, therefore we will be judged by God for our sins.

" I have seen Ephraim, like Tyre, planted in a pleasant place. But Ephraim will bring out their children to the slayer. Give them, Lord" what will you give them? Give them wombs that miscarry and breasts that are dry. Because of all their wickedness in Gilgal, I hated them there. Because of their sinful deeds, I will drive them out of my house. I will no longer love them; all their leaders are rebellious. Ephraim is blighted, their root is withered, they yield no fruit. Even if they bear children, I will slay their cherished offspring. Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up." - Hosea 13:16
Again, this deals with the wicked. God will punish, not human beings. We have no authority to take for ourselves, only God.

"And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them." 2 Kings 2:23-24

"At midnight the Lord struck down all the firstborn in Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh, who sat on the throne, to the firstborn of the prisoner, who was in the dungeon, and the firstborn of all the livestock as well." - Exodus 12:29
This is God sending the tenth plague of Egypt when Pharaoh refused to obey God's command by letting His people, the Jews, leave. Again, God has the authority to judge and only God.

"Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys." - 1 Samuel 15:3
Again, God will judge His creation, not us.

Your God is pro-choice. Why aren't you?
This statement is based on ignorance of the Bible bandits meanings. God is not pro choice.
ChadIrvin
Posts: 31
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5/25/2014 11:52:51 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/25/2014 11:43:15 PM, Martley wrote:
At 5/25/2014 10:38:06 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
According to the Bible, yes it is.

Jeremiah 1:5

"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations."

Psalm 139:13-16

"For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb. I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth. Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them."

Genesis 1:27

"So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them."

According to just these three verses, God created man and He knew us before we were even conceived. This means that once the sperm hits the egg we are a human being.

According to the Bible abortion is murder. And murder, according to the Bible is punishable by eternal death in Hell.

Fortunately, God sent His son to Earth to die on the cross for our sins so that we all can be forgiven and have eternal life in Heaven.

Murder is defined as "the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another". Abortion is not illegal, therefore it is not murder. Now you could argue that abortion is immoral and a punishable sin according to your theistic bible... Some will help you paddle that canoe, and some won't.
Law by man is not perfect. Law by God is perfect. If a law appointed by man goes against the Bible and its author, it is an immoral and imperfect law.
Hematite12
Posts: 400
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5/25/2014 11:53:58 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/25/2014 11:38:21 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:14:14 PM, Hematite12 wrote:
At 5/25/2014 10:38:06 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
According to the Bible, yes it is.


According to the Bible, slaves owe respect to their masters.
The Bible speaks of slaves as those captured in time of war. A sinful and corrupt society is defeated by God and slaves are taken as punishment for their sins. And slavery in the Bible is the same as a servent.
According to the Bible, eating shellfish is immoral.
Speaking directly to the Jewish people of the time. They had many rules before Christ was born on this Earth.
According to the Bible, homosexuals ought to be publicly executed.
According to the Bible all sin is punishable by death, including telling a lie. In those days, public executions were the normal and Jesus, in His sermons reflected what was the norm. The Bible also says forgive those who sin against you.
According to the Bible, having sex with your wife when she's on her period is immoral.
Again, speaking to the Jewish people of the time.
According to the Bible, genocide and the massacre of children is a justifiable approach to war.
It talks about wiping out a sinful nation. Those who commit adultery and murder. A nation in complete and utter sin.


1. Revisionist. Roman slaves were slaves by birth. And, they were slaves, not servants.

2. But, God condoned this rule. Why would he condone such a rule?

3. Oh, Jesus reflected what was the norm. So he wasn't actually preaching what was RIGHT, just what people were used to. Good to know God doesn't have any problem with public executions of everyone who sins if it's supported by the public.

4. Why does that matter? Why was having sex on your period immoral for the Jews and no longer for us?

5. Yes, infants are totally capable of sin. What a load of f***ing BS. See the quotes Cygnus referenced.

Jeremiah 1:5

"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations."


It said "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you...". Doesn't life start at conception?
Yes, it does, in the physical form. God knew every single one of us at the beginning of time. Abortion destroys a unique creation of God, therefore is murder.


When I swat a fly, that's murder then? Should I be punished by death? Because, I AM destroying a unique creation of God. And, according to you, all murder is punishable by death.

Psalm 139:13-16

"For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb. I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth. Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them."


Obviously, babies develop while they are within the womb. What's your point? Why does this make the cancelling of a zygote (a consciousless, single cell) immoral?
Because, again, this "cell" is a unique creation of God and abortion destroys this creation.

See above.

Genesis 1:27

"So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them."


What does this have to do with abortion?
It is a verse that tells us we (all humans) are a creation in the image of God Himself. It tells us we are special in His favor and destroying a unique creation of God is a sin unto Him.

See above.

According to just these three verses, God created man and He knew us before we were even conceived. This means that once the sperm hits the egg we are a human being.


I'm pretty sure God's plan isn't going to be hindered by taking a pill that cancels a single, mindless, painless cell.

According to the Bible abortion is murder. And murder, according to the Bible is punishable by eternal death in Hell.

Fortunately, God sent His son to Earth to die on the cross for our sins so that we all can be forgiven and have eternal life in Heaven.

Oh yes, what a nice guy he is. He creates imperfect beings, then makes his son suffer for his own failed creations.
God does not create imperfect beings. We were created perfect, but as a species qi free will, we chose to go against His perfection and His command.

https://www.youtube.com...

Also, explain this. Why, if God is the same as Christ, do we use the language "his son"? It's just him in a physical form, yes? Why as well then do we use the language "die"? And "suffer"? An omnipotent being does not suffer unless he/she wants himself/herself to.
God sent His son. God is one of three, but also just one. We cannot comprehend everything, because our minds are imperfect.

You didn't answer any of what I said.

If "we can't understand" is an acceptable argument, I'll just say you're wrong. You disagree? Your imperfect mind just can't understand. Apparently we don't need to provide reasons any more?
Hematite12
Posts: 400
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5/25/2014 11:55:20 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/25/2014 11:49:02 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:24:04 PM, Cygnus wrote:
Oh, good grief, not this again.
Are you tired of this? You don't have to reply.

"Kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves." -Numbers 31:17-18
A godless nation is destroyed by its enemies. We have chosen sin, therefore we will be judged by God for our sins.

" I have seen Ephraim, like Tyre, planted in a pleasant place. But Ephraim will bring out their children to the slayer. Give them, Lord" what will you give them? Give them wombs that miscarry and breasts that are dry. Because of all their wickedness in Gilgal, I hated them there. Because of their sinful deeds, I will drive them out of my house. I will no longer love them; all their leaders are rebellious. Ephraim is blighted, their root is withered, they yield no fruit. Even if they bear children, I will slay their cherished offspring. Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up." - Hosea 13:16
Again, this deals with the wicked. God will punish, not human beings. We have no authority to take for ourselves, only God.

"And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them." 2 Kings 2:23-24

"At midnight the Lord struck down all the firstborn in Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh, who sat on the throne, to the firstborn of the prisoner, who was in the dungeon, and the firstborn of all the livestock as well." - Exodus 12:29
This is God sending the tenth plague of Egypt when Pharaoh refused to obey God's command by letting His people, the Jews, leave. Again, God has the authority to judge and only God.

"Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys." - 1 Samuel 15:3
Again, God will judge His creation, not us.

Your God is pro-choice. Why aren't you?
This statement is based on ignorance of the Bible bandits meanings. God is not pro choice.

So, infants can be ripped to shreds, and young girls taken to be raped by old men. All for the sins of their fathers.

You are f***ing disgusting.
Cygnus
Posts: 153
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5/25/2014 11:56:46 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/25/2014 11:49:02 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:24:04 PM, Cygnus wrote:
Oh, good grief, not this again.
Are you tired of this? You don't have to reply.

"Kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves." -Numbers 31:17-18
A godless nation is destroyed by its enemies. We have chosen sin, therefore we will be judged by God for our sins.

" I have seen Ephraim, like Tyre, planted in a pleasant place. But Ephraim will bring out their children to the slayer. Give them, Lord" what will you give them? Give them wombs that miscarry and breasts that are dry. Because of all their wickedness in Gilgal, I hated them there. Because of their sinful deeds, I will drive them out of my house. I will no longer love them; all their leaders are rebellious. Ephraim is blighted, their root is withered, they yield no fruit. Even if they bear children, I will slay their cherished offspring. Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up." - Hosea 13:16
Again, this deals with the wicked. God will punish, not human beings. We have no authority to take for ourselves, only God.

"And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them." 2 Kings 2:23-24

"At midnight the Lord struck down all the firstborn in Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh, who sat on the throne, to the firstborn of the prisoner, who was in the dungeon, and the firstborn of all the livestock as well." - Exodus 12:29
This is God sending the tenth plague of Egypt when Pharaoh refused to obey God's command by letting His people, the Jews, leave. Again, God has the authority to judge and only God.

"Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys." - 1 Samuel 15:3
Again, God will judge His creation, not us.

Your God is pro-choice. Why aren't you?
This statement is based on ignorance of the Bible bandits meanings. God is not pro choice.

You mean to tell me that he destroys an entire planet, save seven people, and you have the audacity to say your god is pro-life?
Beastt
Posts: 5,135
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5/25/2014 11:58:06 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Fortunately, none of us live according to the Bible. Otherwise we'd be killing doctors, firemen, police officers and ambulance personnel for rendering aid on Sundays. We'd be slaves and slave-owners and owning a slave would mean you could legally beat them to death, just as long as they didn't die for a day or two. After all, they're your legal "property". We'd be forcing rape victims to marry their rapists assuring that women didn't speak in the church and when another country pissed us off, we'd wage unlimited war on the entire race and try to wipe them out because they were "evil".

The word "murder" is a legal term. It means to kill in violation of legislation. As long as there is no enacted statute to prevent the act of killing, then it's just "killing" and not "murder". So where abortion is legal, it's not "murder".

I personally believe that until the fetus can live independent of the womb, it's a part of the mother's body and she should be given the same rights as in any other medical case where she has a progressive growth.
"If we believe absurdities we shall commit atrocities." -- Voltaire
Cygnus
Posts: 153
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5/26/2014 12:03:23 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/25/2014 11:49:02 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:24:04 PM, Cygnus wrote:
Oh, good grief, not this again.
Are you tired of this? You don't have to reply.

"Kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves." -Numbers 31:17-18
A godless nation is destroyed by its enemies. We have chosen sin, therefore we will be judged by God for our sins.

" I have seen Ephraim, like Tyre, planted in a pleasant place. But Ephraim will bring out their children to the slayer. Give them, Lord" what will you give them? Give them wombs that miscarry and breasts that are dry. Because of all their wickedness in Gilgal, I hated them there. Because of their sinful deeds, I will drive them out of my house. I will no longer love them; all their leaders are rebellious. Ephraim is blighted, their root is withered, they yield no fruit. Even if they bear children, I will slay their cherished offspring. Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up." - Hosea 13:16
Again, this deals with the wicked. God will punish, not human beings. We have no authority to take for ourselves, only God.

"And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them." 2 Kings 2:23-24

"At midnight the Lord struck down all the firstborn in Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh, who sat on the throne, to the firstborn of the prisoner, who was in the dungeon, and the firstborn of all the livestock as well." - Exodus 12:29
This is God sending the tenth plague of Egypt when Pharaoh refused to obey God's command by letting His people, the Jews, leave. Again, God has the authority to judge and only God.

"Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys." - 1 Samuel 15:3
Again, God will judge His creation, not us.

Your God is pro-choice. Why aren't you?
This statement is based on ignorance of the Bible bandits meanings. God is not pro choice.

And did you miss the parts where your god said that it's okay to kill non-virgins and pregnant women but keep virgin girls? And this is perfectly okay with you?
ChadIrvin
Posts: 31
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5/26/2014 12:14:08 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/25/2014 11:53:58 PM, Hematite12 wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:38:21 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:14:14 PM, Hematite12 wrote:
At 5/25/2014 10:38:06 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
According to the Bible, yes it is.


According to the Bible, slaves owe respect to their masters.
The Bible speaks of slaves as those captured in time of war. A sinful and corrupt society is defeated by God and slaves are taken as punishment for their sins. And slavery in the Bible is the same as a servent.
According to the Bible, eating shellfish is immoral.
Speaking directly to the Jewish people of the time. They had many rules before Christ was born on this Earth.
According to the Bible, homosexuals ought to be publicly executed.
According to the Bible all sin is punishable by death, including telling a lie. In those days, public executions were the normal and Jesus, in His sermons reflected what was the norm. The Bible also says forgive those who sin against you.
According to the Bible, having sex with your wife when she's on her period is immoral.
Again, speaking to the Jewish people of the time.
According to the Bible, genocide and the massacre of children is a justifiable approach to war.
It talks about wiping out a sinful nation. Those who commit adultery and murder. A nation in complete and utter sin.


1. Revisionist. Roman slaves were slaves by birth. And, they were slaves, not servants.
The Romans were a very wicked and corrupt society and were being judged by God. God will use sinful people to punish the sinner.
2. But, God condoned this rule. Why would he condone such a rule?
His chosen people had many rules. He holds them to a higher standard than the rest of us, even though we are all equal.
3. Oh, Jesus reflected what was the norm. So he wasn't actually preaching what was RIGHT, just what people were used to. Good to know God doesn't have any problem with public executions of everyone who sins if it's supported by the public.
No, he was giving examples of what was the norm. Jesus also said to the high priests who were about to stone the village prostitute, "let he who is without sin, cast the first stone." God forgives us our sins and we are to simulate Him.

4. Why does that matter? Why was having sex on your period immoral for the Jews and no longer for us?
Again, His chosen people were held to a higher standard.
5. Yes, infants are totally capable of sin. What a load of f***ing BS. See the quotes Cygnus referenced.
No, we are inheireters of sin. We are born with a sinful nature.
Jeremiah 1:5

"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations."


It said "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you...". Doesn't life start at conception?
Yes, it does, in the physical form. God knew every single one of us at the beginning of time. Abortion destroys a unique creation of God, therefore is murder.


When I swat a fly, that's murder then? Should I be punished by death? Because, I AM destroying a unique creation of God. And, according to you, all murder is punishable by death.
A fly is not created in the image of God. It is a unique creation, yes, but does not have a soul and was not created in the image of God. So it is not murder to swat a fly.
Psalm 139:13-16

"For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb. I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth. Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them."


Obviously, babies develop while they are within the womb. What's your point? Why does this make the cancelling of a zygote (a consciousless, single cell) immoral?
Because, again, this "cell" is a unique creation of God and abortion destroys this creation.

See above.
I will also add "created in the image of God."
Genesis 1:27

"So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them."


What does this have to do with abortion?
It is a verse that tells us we (all humans) are a creation in the image of God Himself. It tells us we are special in His favor and destroying a unique creation of God is a sin unto Him.

See above.

According to just these three verses, God created man and He knew us before we were even conceived. This means that once the sperm hits the egg we are a human being.


I'm pretty sure God's plan isn't going to be hindered by taking a pill that cancels a single, mindless, painless cell.

According to the Bible abortion is murder. And murder, according to the Bible is punishable by eternal death in Hell.

Fortunately, God sent His son to Earth to die on the cross for our sins so that we all can be forgiven and have eternal life in Heaven.

Oh yes, what a nice guy he is. He creates imperfect beings, then makes his son suffer for his own failed creations.
God does not create imperfect beings. We were created perfect, but as a species qi free will, we chose to go against His perfection and His command.

https://www.youtube.com...

Also, explain this. Why, if God is the same as Christ, do we use the language "his son"? It's just him in a physical form, yes? Why as well then do we use the language "die"? And "suffer"? An omnipotent being does not suffer unless he/she wants himself/herself to.
God sent His son. God is one of three, but also just one. We cannot comprehend everything, because our minds are imperfect.
Jesus came to this Earth in human form. His body was human. He felt pain just as we do. Emotions just as we do. However, He was perfect. Jesus felt all the pain a human would feel while on the cross.
You didn't answer any of what I said.

If "we can't understand" is an acceptable argument, I'll just say you're wrong. You disagree? Your imperfect mind just can't understand. Apparently we don't need to provide reasons any more?
I can provide many reasons. Just not every question can be answered at this time. I don't claim to know every reason God does what He does. I am not in a perfect form until after I pass from this Earth.
ChadIrvin
Posts: 31
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5/26/2014 12:19:54 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/25/2014 11:55:20 PM, Hematite12 wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:49:02 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:24:04 PM, Cygnus wrote:
Oh, good grief, not this again.
Are you tired of this? You don't have to reply.

"Kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves." -Numbers 31:17-18
A godless nation is destroyed by its enemies. We have chosen sin, therefore we will be judged by God for our sins.

" I have seen Ephraim, like Tyre, planted in a pleasant place. But Ephraim will bring out their children to the slayer. Give them, Lord" what will you give them? Give them wombs that miscarry and breasts that are dry. Because of all their wickedness in Gilgal, I hated them there. Because of their sinful deeds, I will drive them out of my house. I will no longer love them; all their leaders are rebellious. Ephraim is blighted, their root is withered, they yield no fruit. Even if they bear children, I will slay their cherished offspring. Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up." - Hosea 13:16
Again, this deals with the wicked. God will punish, not human beings. We have no authority to take for ourselves, only God.

"And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them." 2 Kings 2:23-24

"At midnight the Lord struck down all the firstborn in Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh, who sat on the throne, to the firstborn of the prisoner, who was in the dungeon, and the firstborn of all the livestock as well." - Exodus 12:29
This is God sending the tenth plague of Egypt when Pharaoh refused to obey God's command by letting His people, the Jews, leave. Again, God has the authority to judge and only God.

"Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys." - 1 Samuel 15:3
Again, God will judge His creation, not us.

Your God is pro-choice. Why aren't you?
This statement is based on ignorance of the Bible bandits meanings. God is not pro choice.

So, infants can be ripped to shreds, and young girls taken to be raped by old men. All for the sins of their fathers.

You are f***ing disgusting.
Your misinterpritation and lack of knowledge of the Bible and its meanings are limiting your understanding of each verse as it pertains to the subject matter. The Bible does not condone rape and murder. God allows certain things to happen due to the adherent sin and total lack of obedience we have for our creator.
ChadIrvin
Posts: 31
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5/26/2014 12:22:02 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/25/2014 11:58:06 PM, Beastt wrote:
Fortunately, none of us live according to the Bible. Otherwise we'd be killing doctors, firemen, police officers and ambulance personnel for rendering aid on Sundays. We'd be slaves and slave-owners and owning a slave would mean you could legally beat them to death, just as long as they didn't die for a day or two. After all, they're your legal "property". We'd be forcing rape victims to marry their rapists assuring that women didn't speak in the church and when another country pissed us off, we'd wage unlimited war on the entire race and try to wipe them out because they were "evil".

The word "murder" is a legal term. It means to kill in violation of legislation. As long as there is no enacted statute to prevent the act of killing, then it's just "killing" and not "murder". So where abortion is legal, it's not "murder".

I personally believe that until the fetus can live independent of the womb, it's a part of the mother's body and she should be given the same rights as in any other medical case where she has a progressive growth.
In God's eyes it is murder. Man's laws do not trump God's laws.
Cygnus
Posts: 153
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5/26/2014 12:25:26 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/26/2014 12:22:02 AM, ChadIrvin wrote:

In God's eyes it is murder. Man's laws do not trump God's laws.

Unless we're talking about a bunch of heathens. The children of heathens, those little bastards had it coming, right?
Martley
Posts: 126
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5/26/2014 12:29:56 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/25/2014 11:52:51 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:43:15 PM, Martley wrote:
At 5/25/2014 10:38:06 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
According to the Bible, yes it is.

Jeremiah 1:5

"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations."

Psalm 139:13-16

"For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb. I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth. Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them."

Genesis 1:27

"So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them."

According to just these three verses, God created man and He knew us before we were even conceived. This means that once the sperm hits the egg we are a human being.

According to the Bible abortion is murder. And murder, according to the Bible is punishable by eternal death in Hell.

Fortunately, God sent His son to Earth to die on the cross for our sins so that we all can be forgiven and have eternal life in Heaven.

Murder is defined as "the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another". Abortion is not illegal, therefore it is not murder. Now you could argue that abortion is immoral and a punishable sin according to your theistic bible... Some will help you paddle that canoe, and some won't.
Law by man is not perfect. Law by God is perfect. If a law appointed by man goes against the Bible and its author, it is an immoral and imperfect law.

Reality is problematic for those clouded by theism
A Black Belt is a white belt who never quit.

The best time to do something was 20 years ago.... the second best to do something is now.
ChadIrvin
Posts: 31
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5/26/2014 12:30:09 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/26/2014 12:25:26 AM, Cygnus wrote:
At 5/26/2014 12:22:02 AM, ChadIrvin wrote:

In God's eyes it is murder. Man's laws do not trump God's laws.

Unless we're talking about a bunch of heathens. The children of heathens, those little bastards had it coming, right?
When Adam bit the forbidden fruit which God told him not to, we all paid the price for his actions. I guess we had it coming. When in life is anything fair. Everyone pays for their ancestor's mistakes. Too bad Adam couldn't just leave that darn piece of fruit alone, right?
ChadIrvin
Posts: 31
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5/26/2014 12:32:53 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/26/2014 12:29:56 AM, Martley wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:52:51 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:43:15 PM, Martley wrote:
At 5/25/2014 10:38:06 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
According to the Bible, yes it is.

Jeremiah 1:5

"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations."

Psalm 139:13-16

"For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb. I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth. Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them."

Genesis 1:27

"So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them."

According to just these three verses, God created man and He knew us before we were even conceived. This means that once the sperm hits the egg we are a human being.

According to the Bible abortion is murder. And murder, according to the Bible is punishable by eternal death in Hell.

Fortunately, God sent His son to Earth to die on the cross for our sins so that we all can be forgiven and have eternal life in Heaven.

Murder is defined as "the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another". Abortion is not illegal, therefore it is not murder. Now you could argue that abortion is immoral and a punishable sin according to your theistic bible... Some will help you paddle that canoe, and some won't.
Law by man is not perfect. Law by God is perfect. If a law appointed by man goes against the Bible and its author, it is an immoral and imperfect law.

Reality is problematic for those clouded by theism
And calling an unborn child a fetus is just a convenient way to suppress your guilt or your lack thereof for violently destroying a human life.
bulproof
Posts: 25,240
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5/26/2014 12:33:33 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/26/2014 12:30:09 AM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/26/2014 12:25:26 AM, Cygnus wrote:
At 5/26/2014 12:22:02 AM, ChadIrvin wrote:

In God's eyes it is murder. Man's laws do not trump God's laws.

Unless we're talking about a bunch of heathens. The children of heathens, those little bastards had it coming, right?
When Adam bit the forbidden fruit which God told him not to, we all paid the price for his actions. I guess we had it coming. When in life is anything fair. Everyone pays for their ancestor's mistakes. Too bad Adam couldn't just leave that darn piece of fruit alone, right?
I've got a bridge I'm trying to sell.
Are you interested?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
ChadIrvin
Posts: 31
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5/26/2014 12:35:15 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/26/2014 12:33:33 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 5/26/2014 12:30:09 AM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/26/2014 12:25:26 AM, Cygnus wrote:
At 5/26/2014 12:22:02 AM, ChadIrvin wrote:

In God's eyes it is murder. Man's laws do not trump God's laws.

Unless we're talking about a bunch of heathens. The children of heathens, those little bastards had it coming, right?
When Adam bit the forbidden fruit which God told him not to, we all paid the price for his actions. I guess we had it coming. When in life is anything fair. Everyone pays for their ancestor's mistakes. Too bad Adam couldn't just leave that darn piece of fruit alone, right?
I've got a bridge I'm trying to sell.
Are you interested?
It happens....
bulproof
Posts: 25,240
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5/26/2014 12:41:56 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/26/2014 12:35:15 AM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/26/2014 12:33:33 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 5/26/2014 12:30:09 AM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/26/2014 12:25:26 AM, Cygnus wrote:
At 5/26/2014 12:22:02 AM, ChadIrvin wrote:

In God's eyes it is murder. Man's laws do not trump God's laws.

Unless we're talking about a bunch of heathens. The children of heathens, those little bastards had it coming, right?
When Adam bit the forbidden fruit which God told him not to, we all paid the price for his actions. I guess we had it coming. When in life is anything fair. Everyone pays for their ancestor's mistakes. Too bad Adam couldn't just leave that darn piece of fruit alone, right?
I've got a bridge I'm trying to sell.
Are you interested?
It happens....
Oh so you are interested? Good.
The bridge is located in Sydney Australia, I'm sure you've seen pictures of it.
I inherited it from my great uncle Horace but I'd rather have the money.
For you I have a very special price.
Only $10million US.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
ExsurgeDomine
Posts: 176
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5/26/2014 1:03:26 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/25/2014 11:24:04 PM, Cygnus wrote:
Oh, good grief, not this again.

"Kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves." -Numbers 31:17-18

" I have seen Ephraim, like Tyre, planted in a pleasant place. But Ephraim will bring out their children to the slayer. Give them, Lord" what will you give them? Give them wombs that miscarry and breasts that are dry. Because of all their wickedness in Gilgal, I hated them there. Because of their sinful deeds, I will drive them out of my house. I will no longer love them; all their leaders are rebellious. Ephraim is blighted, their root is withered, they yield no fruit. Even if they bear children, I will slay their cherished offspring. Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up." - Hosea 13:16

"And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them." 2 Kings 2:23-24

"At midnight the Lord struck down all the firstborn in Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh, who sat on the throne, to the firstborn of the prisoner, who was in the dungeon, and the firstborn of all the livestock as well." - Exodus 12:29

"Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys." - 1 Samuel 15:3

Your God is pro-choice. Why aren't you?

That's not pro-choice in any classical interpretation of the phrase.
Cygnus
Posts: 153
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5/26/2014 1:09:09 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/26/2014 12:30:09 AM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/26/2014 12:25:26 AM, Cygnus wrote:
At 5/26/2014 12:22:02 AM, ChadIrvin wrote:

In God's eyes it is murder. Man's laws do not trump God's laws.

Unless we're talking about a bunch of heathens. The children of heathens, those little bastards had it coming, right?
When Adam bit the forbidden fruit which God told him not to, we all paid the price for his actions. I guess we had it coming. When in life is anything fair. Everyone pays for their ancestor's mistakes. Too bad Adam couldn't just leave that darn piece of fruit alone, right?

Supposing for a moment that Adam even existed, I want you to consider for a moment that fruit. The God you serve created the tree that bore that fruit. That tree is more commonly known as the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil. He creates this tree knowing that Adam would eat its fruit, but there is a catch. If he eats from that tree, he will know right from wrong. In other words, he will inherit morality.

How cruel and ironic is it to become curious, only to be punished for acting on that curiosity? But if I were that god, I would have encouraged Adam to eat from that tree until it could hear no more fruit.

Now here's the sickening thing about your twisted perception of morality. You and I would agree that enslaving virgin women after killing their families is wrong. Sexual slavery is wrong when it happens in eastern Europe, Africa, and other parts of the world today, no exceptions. But somehow, you force yourself to believe that when it is commanded by your god, then it must somehow be moral.

So, which is it? Is sexual slavery wrong, no after who is doing the enslaving, or is it okay just when the Hebrews did it?

I hope you would have the good moral sense to say that sexual slavery is wrong. Period. Let's see if you do.
Cygnus
Posts: 153
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5/26/2014 1:15:01 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/26/2014 1:03:26 AM, ExsurgeDomine wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:24:04 PM, Cygnus wrote:
Oh, good grief, not this again.

"Kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves." -Numbers 31:17-18

" I have seen Ephraim, like Tyre, planted in a pleasant place. But Ephraim will bring out their children to the slayer. Give them, Lord" what will you give them? Give them wombs that miscarry and breasts that are dry. Because of all their wickedness in Gilgal, I hated them there. Because of their sinful deeds, I will drive them out of my house. I will no longer love them; all their leaders are rebellious. Ephraim is blighted, their root is withered, they yield no fruit. Even if they bear children, I will slay their cherished offspring. Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up." - Hosea 13:16

"And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them." 2 Kings 2:23-24

"At midnight the Lord struck down all the firstborn in Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh, who sat on the throne, to the firstborn of the prisoner, who was in the dungeon, and the firstborn of all the livestock as well." - Exodus 12:29

"Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys." - 1 Samuel 15:3

Your God is pro-choice. Why aren't you?

That's not pro-choice in any classical interpretation of the phrase.

You mean wholesale slaughter of infants and pregnant women is not pro-choice?
ExsurgeDomine
Posts: 176
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5/26/2014 1:17:49 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/26/2014 1:15:01 AM, Cygnus wrote:
At 5/26/2014 1:03:26 AM, ExsurgeDomine wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:24:04 PM, Cygnus wrote:
Oh, good grief, not this again.

"Kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves." -Numbers 31:17-18

" I have seen Ephraim, like Tyre, planted in a pleasant place. But Ephraim will bring out their children to the slayer. Give them, Lord" what will you give them? Give them wombs that miscarry and breasts that are dry. Because of all their wickedness in Gilgal, I hated them there. Because of their sinful deeds, I will drive them out of my house. I will no longer love them; all their leaders are rebellious. Ephraim is blighted, their root is withered, they yield no fruit. Even if they bear children, I will slay their cherished offspring. Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up." - Hosea 13:16

"And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them." 2 Kings 2:23-24

"At midnight the Lord struck down all the firstborn in Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh, who sat on the throne, to the firstborn of the prisoner, who was in the dungeon, and the firstborn of all the livestock as well." - Exodus 12:29

"Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys." - 1 Samuel 15:3

Your God is pro-choice. Why aren't you?

That's not pro-choice in any classical interpretation of the phrase.

You mean wholesale slaughter of infants and pregnant women is not pro-choice?

I rescind my comment. It is entirely pro-choice, in the sense that God is choosing to kill people and presumably supports his freedom to make that decision. I clearly didn't think about it enough.
Cygnus
Posts: 153
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5/26/2014 1:25:12 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/26/2014 1:17:49 AM, ExsurgeDomine wrote:
At 5/26/2014 1:15:01 AM, Cygnus wrote:
At 5/26/2014 1:03:26 AM, ExsurgeDomine wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:24:04 PM, Cygnus wrote:
Oh, good grief, not this again.

"Kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves." -Numbers 31:17-18

" I have seen Ephraim, like Tyre, planted in a pleasant place. But Ephraim will bring out their children to the slayer. Give them, Lord" what will you give them? Give them wombs that miscarry and breasts that are dry. Because of all their wickedness in Gilgal, I hated them there. Because of their sinful deeds, I will drive them out of my house. I will no longer love them; all their leaders are rebellious. Ephraim is blighted, their root is withered, they yield no fruit. Even if they bear children, I will slay their cherished offspring. Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up." - Hosea 13:16

"And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them." 2 Kings 2:23-24

"At midnight the Lord struck down all the firstborn in Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh, who sat on the throne, to the firstborn of the prisoner, who was in the dungeon, and the firstborn of all the livestock as well." - Exodus 12:29

"Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys." - 1 Samuel 15:3

Your God is pro-choice. Why aren't you?

That's not pro-choice in any classical interpretation of the phrase.

You mean wholesale slaughter of infants and pregnant women is not pro-choice?

I rescind my comment. It is entirely pro-choice, in the sense that God is choosing to kill people and presumably supports his freedom to make that decision. I clearly didn't think about it enough.

But it's otherwise wrong to end a pregnancy?
Martley
Posts: 126
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5/26/2014 1:56:12 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/26/2014 12:32:53 AM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/26/2014 12:29:56 AM, Martley wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:52:51 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:43:15 PM, Martley wrote:
At 5/25/2014 10:38:06 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
According to the Bible, yes it is.

Jeremiah 1:5

"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations."

Psalm 139:13-16

"For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb. I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth. Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them."

Genesis 1:27

"So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them."

According to just these three verses, God created man and He knew us before we were even conceived. This means that once the sperm hits the egg we are a human being.

According to the Bible abortion is murder. And murder, according to the Bible is punishable by eternal death in Hell.

Fortunately, God sent His son to Earth to die on the cross for our sins so that we all can be forgiven and have eternal life in Heaven.

Murder is defined as "the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another". Abortion is not illegal, therefore it is not murder. Now you could argue that abortion is immoral and a punishable sin according to your theistic bible... Some will help you paddle that canoe, and some won't.
Law by man is not perfect. Law by God is perfect. If a law appointed by man goes against the Bible and its author, it is an immoral and imperfect law.

Reality is problematic for those clouded by theism
And calling an unborn child a fetus is just a convenient way to suppress your guilt or your lack thereof for violently destroying a human life.

Typical white male sexism... Religating the female body to a broodmare with less rights than a corpse. Your hypocritical theism doesn't force your white male body to preserve or sustain the life of anyone, only to launch your silly assumptions on those secondary to your moral vacancy.
A Black Belt is a white belt who never quit.

The best time to do something was 20 years ago.... the second best to do something is now.
bulproof
Posts: 25,240
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5/26/2014 2:06:14 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 5/26/2014 1:56:12 AM, Martley wrote:
At 5/26/2014 12:32:53 AM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/26/2014 12:29:56 AM, Martley wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:52:51 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
At 5/25/2014 11:43:15 PM, Martley wrote:
At 5/25/2014 10:38:06 PM, ChadIrvin wrote:
According to the Bible, yes it is.

Jeremiah 1:5

"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations."

Psalm 139:13-16

"For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb. I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth. Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them."

Genesis 1:27

"So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them."

According to just these three verses, God created man and He knew us before we were even conceived. This means that once the sperm hits the egg we are a human being.

According to the Bible abortion is murder. And murder, according to the Bible is punishable by eternal death in Hell.

Fortunately, God sent His son to Earth to die on the cross for our sins so that we all can be forgiven and have eternal life in Heaven.

Murder is defined as "the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another". Abortion is not illegal, therefore it is not murder. Now you could argue that abortion is immoral and a punishable sin according to your theistic bible... Some will help you paddle that canoe, and some won't.
Law by man is not perfect. Law by God is perfect. If a law appointed by man goes against the Bible and its author, it is an immoral and imperfect law.

Reality is problematic for those clouded by theism
And calling an unborn child a fetus is just a convenient way to suppress your guilt or your lack thereof for violently destroying a human life.

Typical white male sexism... Religating the female body to a broodmare with less rights than a corpse. Your hypocritical theism doesn't force your white male body to preserve or sustain the life of anyone, only to launch your silly assumptions on those secondary to your moral vacancy.

This^^^ HUZZAH !!
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin