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bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
ethang5
Posts: 4,084
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6/20/2014 1:47:17 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

You want Christians to explain and answer your questions, but you won't answer any of their questions. Stop spamming the board.

This is a debate site, not a soapbox.
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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6/20/2014 11:07:10 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/20/2014 1:47:17 PM, ethang5 wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

You want Christians to explain and answer your questions, but you won't answer any of their questions. Stop spamming the board.

This is a debate site, not a soapbox.
Poor little thang
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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6/20/2014 11:21:13 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/20/2014 11:07:10 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 1:47:17 PM, ethang5 wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

You want Christians to explain and answer your questions, but you won't answer any of their questions. Stop spamming the board.

This is a debate site, not a soapbox.
Poor little thang

Ethan is right, you little troll. What is the point you are making. When the question is answer you find one little word or understanding to twist and straw man. Why don't you tell us what the verse means? And then we can show you have no genuine understanding of scripture or how to interpret it.

Stop spamming the board.
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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6/20/2014 11:23:55 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/20/2014 11:21:13 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:07:10 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 1:47:17 PM, ethang5 wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

You want Christians to explain and answer your questions, but you won't answer any of their questions. Stop spamming the board.

This is a debate site, not a soapbox.
Poor little thang

Ethan is right, you little troll. What is the point you are making. When the question is answer you find one little word or understanding to twist and straw man. Why don't you tell us what the verse means? And then we can show you have no genuine understanding of scripture or how to interpret it.

Stop spamming the board.
hahahahaha
It means god created the heaven and the earth.

Show me.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
otakubiscuit
Posts: 15
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6/20/2014 11:27:11 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

In the beginning (implying that this took place in the beginning) God created the heaven (implying God created heaven) and the earth. (implying that God created the earth)

I conclude that this passage implies that God created earth and heaven in the beginning.
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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6/20/2014 11:32:44 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/20/2014 11:27:11 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

In the beginning (implying that this took place in the beginning) God created the heaven (implying God created heaven) and the earth. (implying that God created the earth)

I conclude that this passage implies that God created earth and heaven in the beginning.

Where do you see implications, it seems very straightforward to me.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
otakubiscuit
Posts: 15
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6/20/2014 11:40:56 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/20/2014 11:32:44 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:27:11 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

In the beginning (implying that this took place in the beginning) God created the heaven (implying God created heaven) and the earth. (implying that God created the earth)

I conclude that this passage implies that God created earth and heaven in the beginning.

Where do you see implications, it seems very straightforward to me.

Then why did you ask the question if it's so straightforward? I was being sarcastic in my answer, by the way. It just seemed like a stupid question to me.
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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6/20/2014 11:59:14 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/20/2014 11:40:56 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:32:44 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:27:11 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

In the beginning (implying that this took place in the beginning) God created the heaven (implying God created heaven) and the earth. (implying that God created the earth)

I conclude that this passage implies that God created earth and heaven in the beginning.

Where do you see implications, it seems very straightforward to me.

Then why did you ask the question if it's so straightforward? I was being sarcastic in my answer, by the way. It just seemed like a stupid question to me.

Yes but you notice how the godbotherers sense a trap. A disturbance in the schwartz.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
otakubiscuit
Posts: 15
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6/21/2014 12:01:20 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/20/2014 11:59:14 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:40:56 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:32:44 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:27:11 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

In the beginning (implying that this took place in the beginning) God created the heaven (implying God created heaven) and the earth. (implying that God created the earth)

I conclude that this passage implies that God created earth and heaven in the beginning.

Where do you see implications, it seems very straightforward to me.

Then why did you ask the question if it's so straightforward? I was being sarcastic in my answer, by the way. It just seemed like a stupid question to me.

Yes but you notice how the godbotherers sense a trap. A disturbance in the schwartz.
otakubiscuit
Posts: 15
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6/21/2014 12:02:46 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/20/2014 11:59:14 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:40:56 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:32:44 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:27:11 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

In the beginning (implying that this took place in the beginning) God created the heaven (implying God created heaven) and the earth. (implying that God created the earth)

I conclude that this passage implies that God created earth and heaven in the beginning.

Where do you see implications, it seems very straightforward to me.

Then why did you ask the question if it's so straightforward? I was being sarcastic in my answer, by the way. It just seemed like a stupid question to me.

Yes but you notice how the godbotherers sense a trap. A disturbance in the schwartz.

wut? beacuas ur a trul? pffft, i et truls 4 brakfest.
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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6/21/2014 12:08:38 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/21/2014 12:01:20 AM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:59:14 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:40:56 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:32:44 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:27:11 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

In the beginning (implying that this took place in the beginning) God created the heaven (implying God created heaven) and the earth. (implying that God created the earth)

I conclude that this passage implies that God created earth and heaven in the beginning.

Where do you see implications, it seems very straightforward to me.

Then why did you ask the question if it's so straightforward? I was being sarcastic in my answer, by the way. It just seemed like a stupid question to me.

Yes but you notice how the godbotherers sense a trap. A disturbance in the schwartz.

A troll trap. Your asking for implications. There is no implication. The sentence is just what otakubiscuit said.

In the beginning God created the Heavens and the Earth. Means at the beginning God made the heavens and God made the earth. Just that.

is the beginning at the start of the universe? is the time between the heavens being made and the earth being made even mentioned? When did this act happen?

It happened before God made man. Done that's it move on troll.
debateuser
Posts: 1,094
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6/21/2014 12:33:14 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/21/2014 12:08:38 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:01:20 AM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:59:14 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:40:56 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:32:44 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:27:11 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

In the beginning (implying that this took place in the beginning) God created the heaven (implying God created heaven) and the earth. (implying that God created the earth)

I conclude that this passage implies that God created earth and heaven in the beginning.

Where do you see implications, it seems very straightforward to me.

Then why did you ask the question if it's so straightforward? I was being sarcastic in my answer, by the way. It just seemed like a stupid question to me.

Yes but you notice how the godbotherers sense a trap. A disturbance in the schwartz.

A troll trap. Your asking for implications. There is no implication. The sentence is just what otakubiscuit said.

In the beginning God created the Heavens and the Earth. Means at the beginning God made the heavens and God made the earth. Just that.

is the beginning at the start of the universe? is the time between the heavens being made and the earth being made even mentioned? When did this act happen?

It happened before God made man. Done that's it move on troll.

Can't be more dumb than your response. Another hypocrisy from a christian

1. In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

http://mobile.biblegateway.com...

It just says in the beginning God made heaven and earth meaning they were created together. The time is mentioned as 'in the beginning'. Since the time is mentioned and then says heaven and earth, it means they were created together. Why did you change your classic christian interpretation. That is very dishonest.
Scientific Errors In Religion : Atheists are right that religion is a myth

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http://www.debate.org...
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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6/21/2014 12:51:08 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/21/2014 12:33:14 AM, debateuser wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:08:38 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:01:20 AM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:59:14 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:40:56 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:32:44 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:27:11 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

In the beginning (implying that this took place in the beginning) God created the heaven (implying God created heaven) and the earth. (implying that God created the earth)

I conclude that this passage implies that God created earth and heaven in the beginning.

Where do you see implications, it seems very straightforward to me.

Then why did you ask the question if it's so straightforward? I was being sarcastic in my answer, by the way. It just seemed like a stupid question to me.

Yes but you notice how the godbotherers sense a trap. A disturbance in the schwartz.

A troll trap. Your asking for implications. There is no implication. The sentence is just what otakubiscuit said.

In the beginning God created the Heavens and the Earth. Means at the beginning God made the heavens and God made the earth. Just that.

is the beginning at the start of the universe? is the time between the heavens being made and the earth being made even mentioned? When did this act happen?

It happened before God made man. Done that's it move on troll.

Can't be more dumb than your response. Another hypocrisy from a christian

1. In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.


http://mobile.biblegateway.com...

It just says in the beginning God made heaven and earth meaning they were created together. The time is mentioned as 'in the beginning'. Since the time is mentioned and then says heaven and earth, it means they were created together. Why did you change your classic christian interpretation. That is very dishonest.

You are a troll as well.

You have no idea what the classic christian interpretation is. Read up on 3 different English translations of the verse http://en.wikipedia.org...

And read where it says "Heavens and the Earth" is a way of saying "Everything".

Created is the past tense and that's all it denotes is somewhere in the past the subject (God) made something. "had made" "did make"
No where does it say how long this creative act took. It says at "the beginning" or "At the start of" And usually applies to the reigns of kings. So it is YOUR interpretation this is an instant of time and at the start of the universe.

So what does all the words combined together say?

At the start, God did make everything.

This is before the 6 days and everything after this line is god allowing stuff to happen or reforming something into something else.

So guess what God's handiwork does not violate the 1st Law of Thermodynamics.
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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6/21/2014 1:03:40 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/21/2014 12:08:38 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
In the beginning God created the Heavens and the Earth. Means at the beginning God made the heavens and God made the earth. Just that.
At 6/21/2014 12:51:08 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At the start, God did make everything.

I'm waiting for your next interpretation.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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6/21/2014 1:29:53 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/21/2014 1:03:40 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:08:38 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
In the beginning God created the Heavens and the Earth. Means at the beginning God made the heavens and God made the earth. Just that.
At 6/21/2014 12:51:08 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At the start, God did make everything.

I'm waiting for your next interpretation.

They are being dishonest troll again.

The heavens and the earth was everything. And confirmed by God making Adam and Eve from other things mud and rib. The material for everything was made "At the start" or "In the beginning" the arrangement of things can change.

The connotation you would like to imply to the words is of your own creation. You are adding meaning to words that do not even match the way you use the words in your own freaking language.

When someone says they made a cake, do you take it as them making it from thin air? do you even take it as if they grew the wheat to make the flour, or the chickens for eggs!

No you imply this word "create" meant with a snap of the fingers and took an instant. But this implication does NOT even match the word in your OWN use.

Saying the words have X meaning only in this context (Genesis), and not in any others, and X meaning is not confirmed by other passages, you are creating a straw man,

And more so being a dishonest insolent troll. Because you are reading the words and adding meaning to them, instead of reading the words and taking away understanding, is why you are an ignorant of understanding scriptures from any religion from different time periods, different languages, and different cultures than your own.

If you don't understand the first part of making a proper interpretation of an ancient manuscript then you would be wiser to stay quite.

Even reading Sir Issac Newton's Principia requires the understanding of how words were used in that day.

Like reading Shakespeare's "Wherefore art thou Romeo?" Is not a question of geographical location. It is a question of Why?

This is just so BASIC. You can not interpret words from an older source with a modern colloquial understanding of their meanings.

Not Just with the Bible but with anything even as little as less than 100 years ago. Statistical Significance does not mean, Significance defined as the quality of being important : the quality of having notable worth or influence.

No it means distinguishable. Statistical Significance means distinguishable or discernible from noise or static. That term came about in 1925.

So just stop, regurgitating the same lines and arguments ad nauseum, about how a piece of scripture is so wrong when you do not even have the slightest idea what the words in the original language at the time of writing are trying to convey. It's stupid. Just utterly arrogant, to think you know English so therefore you know the 1600's English translation of a 382 AD Latin translation of Hebrew manuscripts.

Troll Crazy and it is an example of selective connotation to words, and the outright dishonest to the extremely hard intellectual endeavor of translate writings. Such people who do such work should be prayed for.
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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6/21/2014 2:05:07 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Another thing about the line from Shakespeare's "Romeo and Juliet" is if yu are going to interpret scripture, interpret it in context.

"O Romeo, Romeo! wherefore art thou Romeo?
Deny thy father and refuse thy name;"

We know it is a question of "Why are you Romeo?" because the next line is a begging to change his family name.

Even the early Jewish scholars not think God made things "ex nihilo". That was a later introduction. http://users.hal-pc.org...

The verse does not say whether "heavens and earth" were created from nothing. The Hebrew language had words to say so but it says neither way. It does not say how or from what. And the word Bara is only used with God. Some say the how is explained later,

"That you forget the LORD your Maker, who stretches out the heavens and who lays the foundations of the earth," - Isaiah 51:13

And yet what do we know of the creation of this Universe just recently? That it started with it being stretched out.

I'm not advocating the scripture is my holy scripture, and I would not advocate the Bible is without errors. But the Bible should not be what Christians put their faith in. It should not be the stone they build off of. What is written down and copied by human beings should not be the Whole of their Relationship to God.

So sorry the details for you to argue over is not present in the words. But the details are not required for the whole of the message to be understood.
debateuser
Posts: 1,094
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6/21/2014 2:11:14 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/21/2014 12:51:08 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:33:14 AM, debateuser wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:08:38 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:01:20 AM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:59:14 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:40:56 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:32:44 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:27:11 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

In the beginning (implying that this took place in the beginning) God created the heaven (implying God created heaven) and the earth. (implying that God created the earth)

I conclude that this passage implies that God created earth and heaven in the beginning.

Where do you see implications, it seems very straightforward to me.

Then why did you ask the question if it's so straightforward? I was being sarcastic in my answer, by the way. It just seemed like a stupid question to me.

Yes but you notice how the godbotherers sense a trap. A disturbance in the schwartz.

A troll trap. Your asking for implications. There is no implication. The sentence is just what otakubiscuit said.

In the beginning God created the Heavens and the Earth. Means at the beginning God made the heavens and God made the earth. Just that.

is the beginning at the start of the universe? is the time between the heavens being made and the earth being made even mentioned? When did this act happen?

It happened before God made man. Done that's it move on troll.

Can't be more dumb than your response. Another hypocrisy from a christian

1. In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.


http://mobile.biblegateway.com...

It just says in the beginning God made heaven and earth meaning they were created together. The time is mentioned as 'in the beginning'. Since the time is mentioned and then says heaven and earth, it means they were created together. Why did you change your classic christian interpretation. That is very dishonest.

You are a troll as well.

Is this an argument. Watch your dirty mouth. I want to argue only. Otherwise I would have said something you would not like. This shows you are ignorant and arrogant as well.

You have no idea what the classic christian interpretation is. Read up on 3 different English translations of the verse http://en.wikipedia.org...

6 days of creation that was the original interpretation. Now changing it just shows dishonesty.

And read where it says "Heavens and the Earth" is a way of saying "Everything".

Created is the past tense and that's all it denotes is somewhere in the past the subject (God) made something. "had made" "did make"
No where does it say how long this creative act took. It says at "the beginning" or "At the start of" And usually applies to the reigns of kings. So it is YOUR interpretation this is an instant of time and at the start of the universe.

So what does all the words combined together say?

At the start, God did make everything.

This is before the 6 days and everything after this line is god allowing stuff to happen or reforming something into something else.

Why does it say then that the sun was created after earth.

16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

Can't be more stupid.

So guess what God's handiwork does not violate the 1st Law of Thermodynamics.

Genesis 1 is still saying in the beginning God made heaven and earth. If you want to interpret it as everything. It still tells about error in the Bible. There is a difference between age of universe and earth and they were not formed together according to science.

The Hebrew words used for in the beginning in the bible
http://biblehub.com...

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.

5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day

See the above verses. Guess what the time mentioned from 'in the beginning' ( 1:1) to verse 1:5 is just one day. When you are giving a beginning and then later telling about day one. What does it mean . So a start is given and the end is also given . You can calculate time from it. Its just one day.

Genesis 1 reference
http://mobile.biblegateway.com...
Scientific Errors In Religion : Atheists are right that religion is a myth

Read this topic on below link:

http://www.debate.org...
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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6/21/2014 2:28:08 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/21/2014 2:11:14 AM, debateuser wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:51:08 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:33:14 AM, debateuser wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:08:38 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:01:20 AM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:59:14 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:40:56 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:32:44 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:27:11 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

In the beginning (implying that this took place in the beginning) God created the heaven (implying God created heaven) and the earth. (implying that God created the earth)

I conclude that this passage implies that God created earth and heaven in the beginning.

Where do you see implications, it seems very straightforward to me.

Then why did you ask the question if it's so straightforward? I was being sarcastic in my answer, by the way. It just seemed like a stupid question to me.

Yes but you notice how the godbotherers sense a trap. A disturbance in the schwartz.

A troll trap. Your asking for implications. There is no implication. The sentence is just what otakubiscuit said.

In the beginning God created the Heavens and the Earth. Means at the beginning God made the heavens and God made the earth. Just that.

is the beginning at the start of the universe? is the time between the heavens being made and the earth being made even mentioned? When did this act happen?

It happened before God made man. Done that's it move on troll.

Can't be more dumb than your response. Another hypocrisy from a christian

1. In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.


http://mobile.biblegateway.com...

It just says in the beginning God made heaven and earth meaning they were created together. The time is mentioned as 'in the beginning'. Since the time is mentioned and then says heaven and earth, it means they were created together. Why did you change your classic christian interpretation. That is very dishonest.

You are a troll as well.

Is this an argument. Watch your dirty mouth. I want to argue only. Otherwise I would have said something you would not like. This shows you are ignorant and arrogant as well.

You have no idea what the classic christian interpretation is. Read up on 3 different English translations of the verse http://en.wikipedia.org...

6 days of creation that was the original interpretation. Now changing it just shows dishonesty.

I am not changing the 6 days of creation. I am talking about line one. Lets look at the first few lines.

1: In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

"At the start of, God, Created (Bara) the heavens and the earth." PAST TENSE

2: Now the earth was without shape ... The word is "NOW" as in Present tense, it is after the first line so it is saying verse 1 happened, then NOW is verse 2.

Surely even in English you understand the phrase "earlier I bought new shoes and NOW I am at the movies with friends showing them off." When did I buy the shoes? morning, yesterday, a week ago.

5 God called the light "day" and the darkness "night." There was evening, and there was morning, marking the first day. - This is the first day. And it is after the NOW in verse 2.

Now admit you are wrong. that I was not reinterpreting the days. And admit you are combining two different periods of time because it suits you and not what the scripture says.

I won't discuss anymore with you, till I know you can be intellectually reasonable and honest.


And read where it says "Heavens and the Earth" is a way of saying "Everything".

Created is the past tense and that's all it denotes is somewhere in the past the subject (God) made something. "had made" "did make"
No where does it say how long this creative act took. It says at "the beginning" or "At the start of" And usually applies to the reigns of kings. So it is YOUR interpretation this is an instant of time and at the start of the universe.

So what does all the words combined together say?

At the start, God did make everything.

This is before the 6 days and everything after this line is god allowing stuff to happen or reforming something into something else.

Why does it say then that the sun was created after earth.

16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

Can't be more stupid.

So guess what God's handiwork does not violate the 1st Law of Thermodynamics.

Genesis 1 is still saying in the beginning God made heaven and earth. If you want to interpret it as everything. It still tells about error in the Bible. There is a difference between age of universe and earth and they were not formed together according to science.

The Hebrew words used for in the beginning in the bible
http://biblehub.com...

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.

5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day

See the above verses. Guess what the time mentioned from 'in the beginning' ( 1:1) to verse 1:5 is just one day. When you are giving a beginning and then later telling about day one. What does it mean . So a start is given and the end is also given . You can calculate time from it. Its just one day.


Genesis 1 reference
http://mobile.biblegateway.com...
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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6/21/2014 2:45:37 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Show me!

At 6/20/2014 11:23:55 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:21:13 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:07:10 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 1:47:17 PM, ethang5 wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

You want Christians to explain and answer your questions, but you won't answer any of their questions. Stop spamming the board.

This is a debate site, not a soapbox.
Poor little thang

Ethan is right, you little troll. What is the point you are making. When the question is answer you find one little word or understanding to twist and straw man. Why don't you tell us what the verse means? And then we can show you have no genuine understanding of scripture or how to interpret it.

Stop spamming the board.
hahahahaha
It means god created the heaven and the earth.

Show me.

I have no idea what your insane rants in posts #18 and #19 are about, have you gained access to some of what newt is on?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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6/21/2014 3:07:56 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/21/2014 2:45:37 AM, bulproof wrote:
Show me!

At 6/20/2014 11:23:55 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:21:13 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:07:10 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 1:47:17 PM, ethang5 wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

You want Christians to explain and answer your questions, but you won't answer any of their questions. Stop spamming the board.

This is a debate site, not a soapbox.
Poor little thang

Ethan is right, you little troll. What is the point you are making. When the question is answer you find one little word or understanding to twist and straw man. Why don't you tell us what the verse means? And then we can show you have no genuine understanding of scripture or how to interpret it.

Stop spamming the board.
hahahahaha
It means god created the heaven and the earth.

Show me.

I have no idea what your insane rants in posts #18 and #19 are about, have you gained access to some of what newt is on?

Of course you don't. They spoke of your error filled ways. That must come across to you as gibberish.

Proverbs 15:12 "Mockers resent correction, so they avoid the wise"

Proverbs 17:10 "A single rebuke does more for a person of understanding than a hundred lashes on the back of a fool"
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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6/21/2014 4:12:07 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Show ME mhyk

You claimed you would.
So man up and show me.

Show ME mhyk
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
debateuser
Posts: 1,094
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6/21/2014 7:23:01 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/21/2014 2:28:08 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/21/2014 2:11:14 AM, debateuser wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:51:08 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:33:14 AM, debateuser wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:08:38 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:01:20 AM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:59:14 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:40:56 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:32:44 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:27:11 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

In the beginning (implying that this took place in the beginning) God created the heaven (implying God created heaven) and the earth. (implying that God created the earth)

I conclude that this passage implies that God created earth and heaven in the beginning.

Where do you see implications, it seems very straightforward to me.

Then why did you ask the question if it's so straightforward? I was being sarcastic in my answer, by the way. It just seemed like a stupid question to me.

Yes but you notice how the godbotherers sense a trap. A disturbance in the schwartz.

A troll trap. Your asking for implications. There is no implication. The sentence is just what otakubiscuit said.

In the beginning God created the Heavens and the Earth. Means at the beginning God made the heavens and God made the earth. Just that.

is the beginning at the start of the universe? is the time between the heavens being made and the earth being made even mentioned? When did this act happen?

It happened before God made man. Done that's it move on troll.

Can't be more dumb than your response. Another hypocrisy from a christian

1. In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.


http://mobile.biblegateway.com...

It just says in the beginning God made heaven and earth meaning they were created together. The time is mentioned as 'in the beginning'. Since the time is mentioned and then says heaven and earth, it means they were created together. Why did you change your classic christian interpretation. That is very dishonest.

You are a troll as well.

Is this an argument. Watch your dirty mouth. I want to argue only. Otherwise I would have said something you would not like. This shows you are ignorant and arrogant as well.

You have no idea what the classic christian interpretation is. Read up on 3 different English translations of the verse http://en.wikipedia.org...

6 days of creation that was the original interpretation. Now changing it just shows dishonesty.

I am not changing the 6 days of creation. I am talking about line one. Lets look at the first few lines.

1: In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

"At the start of, God, Created (Bara) the heavens and the earth." PAST TENSE

2: Now the earth was without shape ... The word is "NOW" as in Present tense, it is after the first line so it is saying verse 1 happened, then NOW is verse 2.

Surely even in English you understand the phrase "earlier I bought new shoes and NOW I am at the movies with friends showing them off." When did I buy the shoes? morning, yesterday, a week ago.

5 God called the light "day" and the darkness "night." There was evening, and there was morning, marking the first day. - This is the first day. And it is after the NOW in verse 2.

Now admit you are wrong. that I was not reinterpreting the days. And admit you are combining two different periods of time because it suits you and not what the scripture says.

I won't discuss anymore with you, till I know you can be intellectually reasonable and honest.

You are posting the New International Version translation. This translation being roughly 40 years old and altered as Christians always do.
The translation i posted was from King James Bible and that is one of the old translations.

1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

1:4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.

1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

Geneis 1 King James Version
http://mobile.biblegateway.com...

Let us take a look at the original hebrew

genesis 1:2 hebrew english
http://biblehub.com...

And the Earth hebrew english
http://biblehub.com...

hebrew word "vehaaretz" in 1:2 means "And the earth was without form"

Even if you put the hebrew words in a translator it still gives the meaning " And the Earth"

According to your translation even it is saying "now the earth "(1:2) after "in the beginning"(1:1). It does not matter if it says "now" later because the original beginning is mentioned in (1:1) Also the was Sun created later in (1:16). So according to the Bible the earth is older than the sun which is wrong scientifically.

You are deliberately missing another point . That is Genesis 2. After Genesis 1 , it is mentioned in Genesis 2 that " thus the heaven and Earth were finished. It was started from genesis (1:1) "in the beginning". The time it took to finish is also mentioned in Genesis (2 ) by saying that God finished" heaven and earth" and rested on seventh day. . Notice the language here . So the beginning of the 6 days of creation is from verse (1:1) because the same "heaven and Earth" are finished in verse (2:1)

2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.

2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Genesis 2 King James Version
http://www.biblegateway.com...
Scientific Errors In Religion : Atheists are right that religion is a myth

Read this topic on below link:

http://www.debate.org...
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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6/21/2014 8:28:51 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/21/2014 7:23:01 AM, debateuser wrote:
At 6/21/2014 2:28:08 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/21/2014 2:11:14 AM, debateuser wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:51:08 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:33:14 AM, debateuser wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:08:38 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/21/2014 12:01:20 AM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:59:14 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:40:56 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:32:44 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/20/2014 11:27:11 PM, otakubiscuit wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
You are a troll as well.

Is this an argument. Watch your dirty mouth. I want to argue only. Otherwise I would have said something you would not like. This shows you are ignorant and arrogant as well.

You have no idea what the classic christian interpretation is. Read up on 3 different English translations of the verse http://en.wikipedia.org...

6 days of creation that was the original interpretation. Now changing it just shows dishonesty.

I am not changing the 6 days of creation. I am talking about line one. Lets look at the first few lines.

1: In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

"At the start of, God, Created (Bara) the heavens and the earth." PAST TENSE

2: Now the earth was without shape ... The word is "NOW" as in Present tense, it is after the first line so it is saying verse 1 happened, then NOW is verse 2.

Surely even in English you understand the phrase "earlier I bought new shoes and NOW I am at the movies with friends showing them off." When did I buy the shoes? morning, yesterday, a week ago.

5 God called the light "day" and the darkness "night." There was evening, and there was morning, marking the first day. - This is the first day. And it is after the NOW in verse 2.

Now admit you are wrong. that I was not reinterpreting the days. And admit you are combining two different periods of time because it suits you and not what the scripture says.

I won't discuss anymore with you, till I know you can be intellectually reasonable and honest.


You are posting the New International Version translation. This translation being roughly 40 years old and altered as Christians always do.
The translation i posted was from King James Bible and that is one of the old translations.

1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

1:4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.

1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

Geneis 1 King James Version
http://mobile.biblegateway.com...

Let us take a look at the original hebrew

genesis 1:2 hebrew english
http://biblehub.com...

And the Earth hebrew english
http://biblehub.com...

hebrew word "vehaaretz" in 1:2 means "And the earth was without form"

Even if you put the hebrew words in a translator it still gives the meaning " And the Earth"

According to your translation even it is saying "now the earth "(1:2) after "in the beginning"(1:1). It does not matter if it says "now" later because the original beginning is mentioned in (1:1) Also the was Sun created later in (1:16). So according to the Bible the earth is older than the sun which is wrong scientifically.

You are deliberately missing another point . That is Genesis 2. After Genesis 1 , it is mentioned in Genesis 2 that " thus the heaven and Earth were finished. It was started from genesis (1:1) "in the beginning". The time it took to finish is also mentioned in Genesis (2 ) by saying that God finished" heaven and earth" and rested on seventh day. . Notice the language here . So the beginning of the 6 days of creation is from verse (1:1) because the same "heaven and Earth" are finished in verse (2:1)

2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.

2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Genesis 2 King James Version
http://www.biblegateway.com...

You did not admit you were wrong. After this you go back into the troll bin.

The King James Version is older. But not better. The reason why the new versions use the word "Now" in Genesis 1:2, Genesis 2:1, Genesis 3:1 is because they are derived from the Hebrew Torah. The King James relied heavily on a Vulgate translation of the Hebrew Torah.

English translations of the Torah use the word "Now" as did the MIdrashs.

http://archive.org...
http://www.chaver.com...
http://www.chabad.org...

This is because the word "And" is not a word in Hebrew. It is a prefix, the letter vav.

Each time a new consecutive series of things starts, the first "And" is prefixed to a "Perfect" form, the following in the series are "imperfect"

Ancient Hebrew did not have a past tense or future tense. As time went on "Perfect" forms meant past tense and "imperfect" meant future tense.

A good memory aid is in the past it is perfectly known, the future not so much.

So Genesis 1:1 is the perfect case. Genesis 1:2 is the perfect case followed by Genesis 1:3-31. Then Genesis 2:1 begins a different series with a perfect tense, Which is why many translate it as "Now the heavens and the earth were completed and all their host." and this pattern continues through out Genesis.

So the words prefixed with Vav are different than the usual "And"s in English. Now some call this the Vav Conversive. that the tense changes when Vav is placed with with a perfect.

We are obviously talking about Past events. So what is the Future tense of a Past event? That would be the English word "Now"

Honestly I wrote this for those that want to hear and know. Not you and bulprof trolling mouths.

Knowledge only enters the mind through the ears. Never by the use of one's mouth.
ethang5
Posts: 4,084
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6/21/2014 10:01:00 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/21/2014 2:28:08 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/21/2014 2:11:14 AM, debateuser wrote:

Lets look at the first few lines.

1: In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

"At the start of, God, Created (Bara) the heavens and the earth." PAST TENSE

2: Now the earth was without shape ... The word is "NOW" as in Present tense, it is after the first line so it is saying verse 1 happened, then NOW is verse 2.

Surely even in English you understand the phrase "earlier I bought new shoes and NOW I am at the movies with friends showing them off." When did I buy the shoes? morning, yesterday, a week ago.

Yes, he understands, but he's here as a Troll, so it just won't do to acknowledge that you are right.

5 God called the light "day" and the darkness "night." There was evening, and there was morning, marking the first day. - This is the first day. And it is after the NOW in verse 2.

Now admit you are wrong. that I was not reinterpreting the days. And admit you are combining two different periods of time because it suits you and not what the scripture says.

I won't discuss anymore with you, till I know you can be intellectually reasonable and honest.

lol. Good luck on that with the Troll Tag Team. (T3)

(ps. It's actually just T1 as DU'h and bully are the same person, but we gotta keep things fresh, do we not?)
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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6/21/2014 10:12:09 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Show ME mhyk

You claimed you would.
So man up and show me.

Show ME mhyk
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
TN05
Posts: 4,492
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6/21/2014 10:16:42 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/20/2014 1:47:17 PM, ethang5 wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

You want Christians to explain and answer your questions, but you won't answer any of their questions. Stop spamming the board.

This is a debate site, not a soapbox.

Funny this is all he does is comment. He's never actually debated anyone.
otakubiscuit
Posts: 15
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6/21/2014 10:20:56 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/21/2014 10:16:42 AM, TN05 wrote:
At 6/20/2014 1:47:17 PM, ethang5 wrote:
At 6/20/2014 8:46:25 AM, bulproof wrote:
Can you explain what you consider this passage means?

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

You want Christians to explain and answer your questions, but you won't answer any of their questions. Stop spamming the board.

This is a debate site, not a soapbox.

Funny this is all he does is comment. He's never actually debated anyone.

You can still debate in the comments without it being an official debate.