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Is God the bad guy and Satan the good one

dalehitchy
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7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Would just like to say that a truly do not need to offend any religious people here. I am not religious myself, but I just wanted peoples opinions.

God seems like a horrible god. He orders wars in the old testament, commands people to do terrible things, demands absolute loyalty otherwise punishes them for eternity, and punishes people for eternity for being human. He creates plagues and orders the death of first borns.

God strictly forbade Adam and Eve from eating of the tree, with the warning, "You will surely die." The serpent spoke to them and said, "God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." As we all know, they didn't die, so therefore god lied.

Lastly, according to the website below, the death toll of killing which happened in the bible is estimated to be at: God 2,476,633 - Satan 10 (of which god allowed Satan. I have asked this question in a previous yahoo answer thing and I got a lot of responses saying that Satan is lier and lies all the time. If you believe this, then inst it a possibility that Satan is appearing as a good guy and forcing people to worship him otherwise damning them to an eternity of torture?

If I were Satan, and I wanted to lead as many souls astray as possible, I would claim to be a mighty, omnipotent and unconditionally loving God. I would tell my people there's only one way, and it's mine, and all other ways are false. I would tell people they needed to convert everyone to worship me so they could save their souls. I would have them torture each other in an aim of converting them all to my religion. My religion would publicly preach love and forgiveness while in practice it would cultivate hate and prejudice. The argument I have heard for this is that it is documented that Satan cannot impersonate God or the prophets. Well that is the exact same thing I would say to make them follow me!

http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.co.uk...
Beastt
Posts: 5,135
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7/5/2014 7:13:35 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:
By the standards of morality we apply in every other respect, the character of Satan is many times less objectionable than the biblical character of God. God is many times worse than Hitler.
So given just the two, God is most certainly the bad one, and Satan, the better of the two.
"If we believe absurdities we shall commit atrocities." -- Voltaire
Composer
Posts: 5,858
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7/5/2014 11:31:33 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/5/2014 7:13:35 PM, Beastt wrote:
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:
By the standards of morality we apply in every other respect, the character of Satan is many times less objectionable than the biblical character of God. God is many times worse than Hitler.
So given just the two, God is most certainly the bad one, and Satan, the better of the two.
Some Story books don't even mention a ' Satan ' e.g. YLT & E.Diaglott NT Interlinear

Those Story books that do mention a Satan the greatest Satan of them is Story book god (Col. 1:16)

xtianity is founded upon lies!
Lordgrae
Posts: 666
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7/5/2014 11:58:27 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:
Would just like to say that a truly do not need to offend any religious people here. I am not religious myself, but I just wanted peoples opinions.

God seems like a horrible god. He orders wars in the old testament, commands people to do terrible things, demands absolute loyalty otherwise punishes them for eternity, and punishes people for eternity for being human. He creates plagues and orders the death of first borns.

God strictly forbade Adam and Eve from eating of the tree, with the warning, "You will surely die." The serpent spoke to them and said, "God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." As we all know, they didn't die, so therefore god lied.

Lastly, according to the website below, the death toll of killing which happened in the bible is estimated to be at: God 2,476,633 - Satan 10 (of which god allowed Satan. I have asked this question in a previous yahoo answer thing and I got a lot of responses saying that Satan is lier and lies all the time. If you believe this, then inst it a possibility that Satan is appearing as a good guy and forcing people to worship him otherwise damning them to an eternity of torture?

If I were Satan, and I wanted to lead as many souls astray as possible, I would claim to be a mighty, omnipotent and unconditionally loving God. I would tell my people there's only one way, and it's mine, and all other ways are false. I would tell people they needed to convert everyone to worship me so they could save their souls. I would have them torture each other in an aim of converting them all to my religion. My religion would publicly preach love and forgiveness while in practice it would cultivate hate and prejudice. The argument I have heard for this is that it is documented that Satan cannot impersonate God or the prophets. Well that is the exact same thing I would say to make them follow me!


http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.co.uk...

That's a good point. And there are some inconsistencies too, which only Satan could do, assuming that any of the bible is true. (Also assuming that the definition of Satan is all bad and the definition of god is all good. Therefore, if god were to lie, than he would be satan and satan would be god.)

1. Why would God not just destroy Satan and be done with it?

The answer to this is obvious. Satan and Yahweh are close, if not equal in power. However, in order to get more followers, Satan has decided to claim that he is all powerful, and resistance is futile. This also explains the rapture too. Why would god even bother having a final battle if he could just will Satan away? The answer is, he can't. So both of them are trying to get more followers, God by spreading love through kindness of people, and Satan through the evils of theism, in order to strengthen their sons, who once one is victorious, will tip the balance of power in the victor's favor.

2. All the horrendous acts committed by god and his followers.

3. The perverse logic of 'I command you to not do this, yet I will'
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Beastt
Posts: 5,135
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7/6/2014 1:27:20 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/5/2014 11:31:33 PM, Composer wrote:
At 7/5/2014 7:13:35 PM, Beastt wrote:
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:
By the standards of morality we apply in every other respect, the character of Satan is many times less objectionable than the biblical character of God. God is many times worse than Hitler.
So given just the two, God is most certainly the bad one, and Satan, the better of the two.
Some Story books don't even mention a ' Satan ' e.g. YLT & E.Diaglott NT Interlinear

Those Story books that do mention a Satan the greatest Satan of them is Story book god (Col. 1:16)

xtianity is founded upon lies!
And maintained in the same manner. I've never run into any group of people more comfortable with blatant lying than Christians.
"If we believe absurdities we shall commit atrocities." -- Voltaire
Composer
Posts: 5,858
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7/6/2014 3:23:52 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 1:27:20 AM, Beastt wrote:
At 7/5/2014 11:31:33 PM, Composer wrote:
At 7/5/2014 7:13:35 PM, Beastt wrote:
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:
By the standards of morality we apply in every other respect, the character of Satan is many times less objectionable than the biblical character of God. God is many times worse than Hitler.
So given just the two, God is most certainly the bad one, and Satan, the better of the two.
Some Story books don't even mention a ' Satan ' e.g. YLT & E.Diaglott NT Interlinear

Those Story books that do mention a Satan the greatest Satan of them is Story book god (Col. 1:16)

xtianity is founded upon lies!
And maintained in the same manner. I've never run into any group of people more comfortable with blatant lying than Christians.
I couldn't agree more!

I have been searching for over 50 years and the next genuine so called ' christian ' to emerge outside of Story book Land will be the very first in man's entire History!

Although not necessarily considered as xtians, the j.ws are also liars and easily proven so by reading the Douglas-Walsh Trial Transcript, Scotland, 1964.
NathanDuclos
Posts: 51
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7/6/2014 8:36:51 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/5/2014 11:58:27 PM, Lordgrae wrote:
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:

This is the problem with the Jewish god, who was one amongst many, going to a single god of everything. thall shall have no gods before me in exodus, and mention of other gods, implies an evolution of many to one, and OT also mentions other gods. . . While you could suggests that other gods are fake or false, there is no reason to draw that conclusion (from a biblical point of view). . .

As for Satan an Lucifer, they are generally two different individuals.
However. . . .If Lucifer was the light bringer, some traditions suggest he was the smartest and brightest creature created ever. if he was smart he wouldn't oppose god without good reason as he would be smart enough to know the consequence of his actions . . . . .
NathanDuclos
Posts: 51
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7/6/2014 8:58:16 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/5/2014 11:58:27 PM, Lordgrae wrote:
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:

This is the problem with the Jewish god, who was one amongst many, going to a single god of everything. 'thall shall have no gods before me' why would he care if every god is him, just different reflections. The other gods, implies an evolution of many to one, and OT also mentions other gods. . . While you could suggests that other gods are fake or false, there is no reason to draw that conclusion (from a biblical point of view) based on OT understanding . . . Sort of like a Godly Highlander, there can be only one.

As for Satan an Lucifer, they are generally interpretative as two different individuals.
However. . . .If Lucifer was the light bringer, some traditions suggest he was, the smartest and brightest creature created ever in the army of god. If he was the smartest and most brilliant creature created he wouldn't oppose god without good reason as he would be smart enough to know the consequence of his actions .
Toviyah
Posts: 88
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7/6/2014 9:10:34 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:
Would just like to say that a truly do not need to offend any religious people here. I am not religious myself, but I just wanted peoples opinions.

God seems like a horrible god. He orders wars in the old testament, commands people to do terrible things, demands absolute loyalty otherwise punishes them for eternity, and punishes people for eternity for being human. He creates plagues and orders the death of first borns.

God strictly forbade Adam and Eve from eating of the tree, with the warning, "You will surely die." The serpent spoke to them and said, "God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." As we all know, they didn't die, so therefore god lied.

Lastly, according to the website below, the death toll of killing which happened in the bible is estimated to be at: God 2,476,633 - Satan 10 (of which god allowed Satan. I have asked this question in a previous yahoo answer thing and I got a lot of responses saying that Satan is lier and lies all the time. If you believe this, then inst it a possibility that Satan is appearing as a good guy and forcing people to worship him otherwise damning them to an eternity of torture?

If I were Satan, and I wanted to lead as many souls astray as possible, I would claim to be a mighty, omnipotent and unconditionally loving God. I would tell my people there's only one way, and it's mine, and all other ways are false. I would tell people they needed to convert everyone to worship me so they could save their souls. I would have them torture each other in an aim of converting them all to my religion. My religion would publicly preach love and forgiveness while in practice it would cultivate hate and prejudice. The argument I have heard for this is that it is documented that Satan cannot impersonate God or the prophets. Well that is the exact same thing I would say to make them follow me!


http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.co.uk...
Umm... That's a kinda weird thing to argue, considering that goodness and morality, on a Christian sense, is simply following the commands/actions/word of God.
That's called Divine Command Theory.
neutral
Posts: 4,478
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7/6/2014 9:10:42 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:
Would just like to say that a truly do not need to offend any religious people here. I am not religious myself, but I just wanted peoples opinions.

God seems like a horrible god. He orders wars in the old testament, commands people to do terrible things, demands absolute loyalty otherwise punishes them for eternity, and punishes people for eternity for being human. He creates plagues and orders the death of first borns.

God strictly forbade Adam and Eve from eating of the tree, with the warning, "You will surely die." The serpent spoke to them and said, "God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." As we all know, they didn't die, so therefore god lied.

Lastly, according to the website below, the death toll of killing which happened in the bible is estimated to be at: God 2,476,633 - Satan 10 (of which god allowed Satan. I have asked this question in a previous yahoo answer thing and I got a lot of responses saying that Satan is lier and lies all the time. If you believe this, then inst it a possibility that Satan is appearing as a good guy and forcing people to worship him otherwise damning them to an eternity of torture?

If I were Satan, and I wanted to lead as many souls astray as possible, I would claim to be a mighty, omnipotent and unconditionally loving God. I would tell my people there's only one way, and it's mine, and all other ways are false. I would tell people they needed to convert everyone to worship me so they could save their souls. I would have them torture each other in an aim of converting them all to my religion. My religion would publicly preach love and forgiveness while in practice it would cultivate hate and prejudice. The argument I have heard for this is that it is documented that Satan cannot impersonate God or the prophets. Well that is the exact same thing I would say to make them follow me!


http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.co.uk...

The is the classic argument of Satanism.

http://www.angelfire.com...
neutral
Posts: 4,478
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7/6/2014 9:12:13 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/5/2014 11:31:33 PM, Composer wrote:


xtianity is founded upon lies!

Go ahead and prove that atheists. Please don't leap into the agnostic atheism BS, you made a claim, now back it up.

Atheists do realize that Satanists publicly identify themselves as atheists, correct? How many of the virulent anti=theists on this forum, and many others, are actually Satanists I wonder?
buddha49er
Posts: 30
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7/6/2014 9:38:12 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 9:12:13 AM, neutral wrote:
At 7/5/2014 11:31:33 PM, Composer wrote:


xtianity is founded upon lies!

Go ahead and prove that atheists. Please don't leap into the agnostic atheism BS, you made a claim, now back it up.

Atheists do realize that Satanists publicly identify themselves as atheists, correct? How many of the virulent anti=theists on this forum, and many others, are actually Satanists I wonder?

That's not how it works. One doesn't automatically equal the other. I'm an atheist, and I'm not a satanist.

With that out of the way, there is technically absolutely no way to prove Christianity was founded on lies unless we can prove every single thing in the Bible wrong. However, the burden of proof is on those who initially claimed it to be true, meaning the Christians.

So, in a technical sense, in order for us to address his claim, your claim first must be addressed, since Christianity is 2000 or so years old, thus making its first claims at least that old, and older still if we bring Judaism into the mix.

So, prove everything in the Bible true, and then we will talk.
bulproof
Posts: 25,211
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7/6/2014 9:42:09 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 9:10:34 AM, Toviyah wrote:
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:
Would just like to say that a truly do not need to offend any religious people here. I am not religious myself, but I just wanted peoples opinions.

God seems like a horrible god. He orders wars in the old testament, commands people to do terrible things, demands absolute loyalty otherwise punishes them for eternity, and punishes people for eternity for being human. He creates plagues and orders the death of first borns.

God strictly forbade Adam and Eve from eating of the tree, with the warning, "You will surely die." The serpent spoke to them and said, "God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." As we all know, they didn't die, so therefore god lied.

Lastly, according to the website below, the death toll of killing which happened in the bible is estimated to be at: God 2,476,633 - Satan 10 (of which god allowed Satan. I have asked this question in a previous yahoo answer thing and I got a lot of responses saying that Satan is lier and lies all the time. If you believe this, then inst it a possibility that Satan is appearing as a good guy and forcing people to worship him otherwise damning them to an eternity of torture?

If I were Satan, and I wanted to lead as many souls astray as possible, I would claim to be a mighty, omnipotent and unconditionally loving God. I would tell my people there's only one way, and it's mine, and all other ways are false. I would tell people they needed to convert everyone to worship me so they could save their souls. I would have them torture each other in an aim of converting them all to my religion. My religion would publicly preach love and forgiveness while in practice it would cultivate hate and prejudice. The argument I have heard for this is that it is documented that Satan cannot impersonate God or the prophets. Well that is the exact same thing I would say to make them follow me!


http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.co.uk...
Umm... That's a kinda weird thing to argue, considering that goodness and morality, on a Christian sense, is simply following the commands/actions/word of God.
That's called Divine Command Theory.

You mean genocide, slavery, child rape and infanticide.
I'll take someone else's plan, well anyone's really, thanks all the same.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
neutral
Posts: 4,478
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7/6/2014 10:37:42 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 9:38:12 AM, buddha49er wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:12:13 AM, neutral wrote:
At 7/5/2014 11:31:33 PM, Composer wrote:


xtianity is founded upon lies!

Go ahead and prove that atheists. Please don't leap into the agnostic atheism BS, you made a claim, now back it up.

Atheists do realize that Satanists publicly identify themselves as atheists, correct? How many of the virulent anti=theists on this forum, and many others, are actually Satanists I wonder?

That's not how it works. One doesn't automatically equal the other. I'm an atheist, and I'm not a satanist.

With that out of the way, there is technically absolutely no way to prove Christianity was founded on lies unless we can prove every single thing in the Bible wrong. However, the burden of proof is on those who initially claimed it to be true, meaning the Christians.

So, in a technical sense, in order for us to address his claim, your claim first must be addressed, since Christianity is 2000 or so years old, thus making its first claims at least that old, and older still if we bring Judaism into the mix.

So, prove everything in the Bible true, and then we will talk.

That has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the claims of Satanism - which apparently are just true anyway.

And no dipsh*t, within the confines of a discussion forum the burden of proof is not to prove every word of bible true. What has to be proven is the preponderance of truth, which Jesus being a historical fact, leaves the burden of the one claiming the 2,000 years of scholarship is just plain wrong.

Making up absurd standards so you can keep being a ignorant atheist (shocking, ANOTHER ONE) is your bag and no one else's.

How that keeps you from recognizing what Satanism is, in fact, what they claim with a source no less? Who the hell knows? As long as you can demand something that cannot fit inside a discussion forum, its all good - no matter how absurd or irrelevant to the actual claim at hand.

Satan, in his view, claims to be the good guy. Shocking. Satanists publicly identify as ... atheists. How that then becomes, ALL atheists are Satanists? ANOTHER atheists at it again. I'm just shocked.

The rebuttal - you guys have to prove EVERY words of the Bible true! OK, every word in the Bible is a word. A true word. There you go atheist.

Why atheists hang out in religion discussion forums, no idea.
neutral
Posts: 4,478
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7/6/2014 10:39:32 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 9:42:09 AM, bulproof wrote:

You mean genocide, slavery, child rape and infanticide.
I'll take someone else's plan, well anyone's really, thanks all the same.

Here we go again with the paranoid delusions.

What do atheists see everywhere? Genocide? Slavery? Child rape and murder (yet he's pro choice?)

Why again do atheists hang out in religion forums? To accuse perfectly innocent people of crimes? That's rational ...
bulproof
Posts: 25,211
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7/6/2014 10:50:39 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 10:39:32 AM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:42:09 AM, bulproof wrote:

You mean genocide, slavery, child rape and infanticide.
I'll take someone else's plan, well anyone's really, thanks all the same.

Here we go again with the paranoid delusions.

What do atheists see everywhere? Genocide? Slavery? Child rape and murder (yet he's pro choice?)

Why again do atheists hang out in religion forums? To accuse perfectly innocent people of crimes? That's rational ...

I just see it in the orders given by your great and godly being. Can't you christians read?
Oh wait, I'm talking to newt and he actually can't.

The reason we hang about here is because we like to point out to you just how foolish your childish beliefs are and we enjoy the fact that you lack the intelligence to even understand what we are saying and get insanely angry with the calm and very reasoned message we benefit you with.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
neutral
Posts: 4,478
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7/6/2014 10:56:13 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 10:50:39 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/6/2014 10:39:32 AM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:42:09 AM, bulproof wrote:

You mean genocide, slavery, child rape and infanticide.
I'll take someone else's plan, well anyone's really, thanks all the same.

Here we go again with the paranoid delusions.

What do atheists see everywhere? Genocide? Slavery? Child rape and murder (yet he's pro choice?)

Why again do atheists hang out in religion forums? To accuse perfectly innocent people of crimes? That's rational ...

I just see it in the orders given by your great and godly being. Can't you christians read?
Oh wait, I'm talking to newt and he actually can't.

The reason we hang about here is because we like to point out to you just how foolish your childish beliefs are and we enjoy the fact that you lack the intelligence to even understand what we are saying and get insanely angry with the calm and very reasoned message we benefit you with.

Let me amend, Slavery, Genocide, Child Rape and Murder (but he's pro-choice), and honestly believes no one but atheists can read.

This is a reasoned message for my benefit rather than his ego, narcassim, and arrogance.

Am I genocidal? Nope.

Do I own slaves? Nope.

Do I rape children? Nope.

Do I murder children? Nope.

Can I read? Yep.

Does God command me to commit genocide, own slaves, rape or kill children, or be illiterate? Nope.

Yet here is another 'reasoned' atheists claiming the opposite and smearing himself in fallacy by claiming something at odds with reality in appeal to emotion, (you don't want to be a murdering genocidal rapist do you?) and if its for anyone 'benefit' rather than just another in a long one blatant insults and smears.

Why again do atheists hang out in religion forums? To tell people they are genocidal and play three monkeys when someone states, "Er, no I am not."

Yes you are God .... I mean No God damn it!

Rational? Beneficial? Nope.

Simple viciousness. Nothing more.
bulproof
Posts: 25,211
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7/6/2014 11:05:41 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 10:56:13 AM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 10:50:39 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/6/2014 10:39:32 AM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:42:09 AM, bulproof wrote:

You mean genocide, slavery, child rape and infanticide.
I'll take someone else's plan, well anyone's really, thanks all the same.

Here we go again with the paranoid delusions.

What do atheists see everywhere? Genocide? Slavery? Child rape and murder (yet he's pro choice?)

Why again do atheists hang out in religion forums? To accuse perfectly innocent people of crimes? That's rational ...

I just see it in the orders given by your great and godly being. Can't you christians read?
Oh wait, I'm talking to newt and he actually can't.

The reason we hang about here is because we like to point out to you just how foolish your childish beliefs are and we enjoy the fact that you lack the intelligence to even understand what we are saying and get insanely angry with the calm and very reasoned message we benefit you with.

Let me amend, Slavery, Genocide, Child Rape and Murder (but he's pro-choice), and honestly believes no one but atheists can read.

This is a reasoned message for my benefit rather than his ego, narcassim, and arrogance.

Am I genocidal? Nope.

Do I own slaves? Nope.

Do I rape children? Nope.

Do I murder children? Nope.

Can I read? Yep.

Does God command people to commit genocide, own slaves, rape or kill children?

That would be YES
Well according to the book that can't be wrong because it came from your god.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Toviyah
Posts: 88
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7/6/2014 11:20:22 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 9:42:09 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:10:34 AM, Toviyah wrote:
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:
Would just like to say that a truly do not need to offend any religious people here. I am not religious myself, but I just wanted peoples opinions.

God seems like a horrible god. He orders wars in the old testament, commands people to do terrible things, demands absolute loyalty otherwise punishes them for eternity, and punishes people for eternity for being human. He creates plagues and orders the death of first borns.

God strictly forbade Adam and Eve from eating of the tree, with the warning, "You will surely die." The serpent spoke to them and said, "God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." As we all know, they didn't die, so therefore god lied.

Lastly, according to the website below, the death toll of killing which happened in the bible is estimated to be at: God 2,476,633 - Satan 10 (of which god allowed Satan. I have asked this question in a previous yahoo answer thing and I got a lot of responses saying that Satan is lier and lies all the time. If you believe this, then inst it a possibility that Satan is appearing as a good guy and forcing people to worship him otherwise damning them to an eternity of torture?

If I were Satan, and I wanted to lead as many souls astray as possible, I would claim to be a mighty, omnipotent and unconditionally loving God. I would tell my people there's only one way, and it's mine, and all other ways are false. I would tell people they needed to convert everyone to worship me so they could save their souls. I would have them torture each other in an aim of converting them all to my religion. My religion would publicly preach love and forgiveness while in practice it would cultivate hate and prejudice. The argument I have heard for this is that it is documented that Satan cannot impersonate God or the prophets. Well that is the exact same thing I would say to make them follow me!


http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.co.uk...
Umm... That's a kinda weird thing to argue, considering that goodness and morality, on a Christian sense, is simply following the commands/actions/word of God.
That's called Divine Command Theory.

You mean genocide, slavery, child rape and infanticide.
I'll take someone else's plan, well anyone's really, thanks all the same.
Well considering God does none of these in the Bible (even if he did, it would be a form of utilitarianism that would be morally justified)
I'm guessing that you're referring to things like the slaughter of the Canaanites? In which case, 'genocide', or whatever you want to call it, was morally justified. Think of it as more of a cleansing..
bulproof
Posts: 25,211
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7/6/2014 12:07:53 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 11:20:22 AM, Toviyah wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:42:09 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:10:34 AM, Toviyah wrote:
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:
Would just like to say that a truly do not need to offend any religious people here. I am not religious myself, but I just wanted peoples opinions.

God seems like a horrible god. He orders wars in the old testament, commands people to do terrible things, demands absolute loyalty otherwise punishes them for eternity, and punishes people for eternity for being human. He creates plagues and orders the death of first borns.

God strictly forbade Adam and Eve from eating of the tree, with the warning, "You will surely die." The serpent spoke to them and said, "God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." As we all know, they didn't die, so therefore god lied.

Lastly, according to the website below, the death toll of killing which happened in the bible is estimated to be at: God 2,476,633 - Satan 10 (of which god allowed Satan. I have asked this question in a previous yahoo answer thing and I got a lot of responses saying that Satan is lier and lies all the time. If you believe this, then inst it a possibility that Satan is appearing as a good guy and forcing people to worship him otherwise damning them to an eternity of torture?

If I were Satan, and I wanted to lead as many souls astray as possible, I would claim to be a mighty, omnipotent and unconditionally loving God. I would tell my people there's only one way, and it's mine, and all other ways are false. I would tell people they needed to convert everyone to worship me so they could save their souls. I would have them torture each other in an aim of converting them all to my religion. My religion would publicly preach love and forgiveness while in practice it would cultivate hate and prejudice. The argument I have heard for this is that it is documented that Satan cannot impersonate God or the prophets. Well that is the exact same thing I would say to make them follow me!


http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.co.uk...
Umm... That's a kinda weird thing to argue, considering that goodness and morality, on a Christian sense, is simply following the commands/actions/word of God.
That's called Divine Command Theory.

You mean genocide, slavery, child rape and infanticide.
I'll take someone else's plan, well anyone's really, thanks all the same.
Well considering God does none of these in the Bible (even if he did, it would be a form of utilitarianism that would be morally justified)
I'm guessing that you're referring to things like the slaughter of the Canaanites? In which case, 'genocide', or whatever you want to call it, was morally justified. Think of it as more of a cleansing..

Go ahead and call it ethnic cleansing if it helps you ward off the boogieman under your bed, there is no moral justification for it.
But then bible believers have no morals, so I'm wasting my time talking to the likes of you.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
neutral
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7/6/2014 12:09:02 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 11:05:41 AM, bulproof wrote:

That would be YES
Well according to the book that can't be wrong because it came from your god.

Prove it troll.
bulproof
Posts: 25,211
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7/6/2014 12:16:20 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 12:09:02 PM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 11:05:41 AM, bulproof wrote:

That would be YES
Well according to the book that can't be wrong because it came from your god.

Prove it troll.

Prove what troglodyte?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Beastt
Posts: 5,135
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7/6/2014 12:18:15 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 11:20:22 AM, Toviyah wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:42:09 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:10:34 AM, Toviyah wrote:
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:
Would just like to say that a truly do not need to offend any religious people here. I am not religious myself, but I just wanted peoples opinions.

God seems like a horrible god. He orders wars in the old testament, commands people to do terrible things, demands absolute loyalty otherwise punishes them for eternity, and punishes people for eternity for being human. He creates plagues and orders the death of first borns.

God strictly forbade Adam and Eve from eating of the tree, with the warning, "You will surely die." The serpent spoke to them and said, "God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." As we all know, they didn't die, so therefore god lied.

Lastly, according to the website below, the death toll of killing which happened in the bible is estimated to be at: God 2,476,633 - Satan 10 (of which god allowed Satan. I have asked this question in a previous yahoo answer thing and I got a lot of responses saying that Satan is lier and lies all the time. If you believe this, then inst it a possibility that Satan is appearing as a good guy and forcing people to worship him otherwise damning them to an eternity of torture?

If I were Satan, and I wanted to lead as many souls astray as possible, I would claim to be a mighty, omnipotent and unconditionally loving God. I would tell my people there's only one way, and it's mine, and all other ways are false. I would tell people they needed to convert everyone to worship me so they could save their souls. I would have them torture each other in an aim of converting them all to my religion. My religion would publicly preach love and forgiveness while in practice it would cultivate hate and prejudice. The argument I have heard for this is that it is documented that Satan cannot impersonate God or the prophets. Well that is the exact same thing I would say to make them follow me!


http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.co.uk...
Umm... That's a kinda weird thing to argue, considering that goodness and morality, on a Christian sense, is simply following the commands/actions/word of God.
That's called Divine Command Theory.

You mean genocide, slavery, child rape and infanticide.
I'll take someone else's plan, well anyone's really, thanks all the same.
Well considering God does none of these in the Bible (even if he did, it would be a form of utilitarianism that would be morally justified)
Explain to me when it's morally justified to rape women, slaughter infants or wipe out an entire race.

I'm guessing that you're referring to things like the slaughter of the Canaanites? In which case, 'genocide', or whatever you want to call it, was morally justified. Think of it as more of a cleansing..
This is why the entire world should be genuinely concerned about Christianity. It convinces people (by the billions), that the horrific atrocities of people like Hitler are "morally justified".
"If we believe absurdities we shall commit atrocities." -- Voltaire
Beastt
Posts: 5,135
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7/6/2014 12:25:55 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 10:56:13 AM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 10:50:39 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/6/2014 10:39:32 AM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:42:09 AM, bulproof wrote:

You mean genocide, slavery, child rape and infanticide.
I'll take someone else's plan, well anyone's really, thanks all the same.

Here we go again with the paranoid delusions.

What do atheists see everywhere? Genocide? Slavery? Child rape and murder (yet he's pro choice?)

Why again do atheists hang out in religion forums? To accuse perfectly innocent people of crimes? That's rational ...

I just see it in the orders given by your great and godly being. Can't you christians read?
Oh wait, I'm talking to newt and he actually can't.

The reason we hang about here is because we like to point out to you just how foolish your childish beliefs are and we enjoy the fact that you lack the intelligence to even understand what we are saying and get insanely angry with the calm and very reasoned message we benefit you with.

Let me amend, Slavery, Genocide, Child Rape and Murder (but he's pro-choice), and honestly believes no one but atheists can read.

This is a reasoned message for my benefit rather than his ego, narcassim, and arrogance.

Am I genocidal? Nope.
But you still support and defend genocide.

Do I own slaves? Nope.
But you defend a book which promotes slavery.

Do I rape children? Nope.
Yet you clearly believe that child rape is justifiable.

Do I murder children? Nope.
But you promote a book which defends murdering children.

Can I read? Yep.
But you can't differentiate between morality and barbarity.

Does God command me to commit genocide, own slaves, rape or kill children, or be illiterate? Nope.
All of those things are promoted in the book you believe God influenced men to write.

Yet here is another 'reasoned' atheists claiming the opposite and smearing himself in fallacy by claiming something at odds with reality in appeal to emotion, (you don't want to be a murdering genocidal rapist do you?) and if its for anyone 'benefit' rather than just another in a long one blatant insults and smears.
They're not insults if they're true. And you and I have been here before - you most certainly do attempt to defend a book which promotes rape, genocide, infanticide, slavery and dictatorial rule. So why do you get so bent when this is pointed out? If you don't like it, then stop supporting it.

Why again do atheists hang out in religion forums? To tell people they are genocidal and play three monkeys when someone states, "Er, no I am not."
But you are. So when you claim you're not, we're here to bring you back to reality and remind you that you do promote such behaviors and even claim them to be moral.

Yes you are God .... I mean No God damn it!
No one is God. Unfortunately, you read the barbaric atrocities of more primitive men and insist that their immorality is God's morality.

Rational? Beneficial? Nope.
Trying to get you to connect with the brutal barbarity of your beliefs is far more beneficial than letting you persist in the delusion that when you do it, or when you believe God is promoting atrocious behaviors, that they're somehow less atrocious, barbaric, brutal or immoral.

Simple viciousness. Nothing more.
Yes, that's a good way to sum up Christianity.
"If we believe absurdities we shall commit atrocities." -- Voltaire
neutral
Posts: 4,478
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7/6/2014 1:03:34 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 12:25:55 PM, Beastt wrote:
At 7/6/2014 10:56:13 AM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 10:50:39 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/6/2014 10:39:32 AM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:42:09 AM, bulproof wrote:

You mean genocide, slavery, child rape and infanticide.
I'll take someone else's plan, well anyone's really, thanks all the same.

Here we go again with the paranoid delusions.

What do atheists see everywhere? Genocide? Slavery? Child rape and murder (yet he's pro choice?)

Why again do atheists hang out in religion forums? To accuse perfectly innocent people of crimes? That's rational ...

I just see it in the orders given by your great and godly being. Can't you christians read?
Oh wait, I'm talking to newt and he actually can't.

The reason we hang about here is because we like to point out to you just how foolish your childish beliefs are and we enjoy the fact that you lack the intelligence to even understand what we are saying and get insanely angry with the calm and very reasoned message we benefit you with.

Let me amend, Slavery, Genocide, Child Rape and Murder (but he's pro-choice), and honestly believes no one but atheists can read.

This is a reasoned message for my benefit rather than his ego, narcassim, and arrogance.

Am I genocidal? Nope.
But you still support and defend genocide.

Do I own slaves? Nope.
But you defend a book which promotes slavery.

Do I rape children? Nope.
Yet you clearly believe that child rape is justifiable.

Do I murder children? Nope.
But you promote a book which defends murdering children.

Can I read? Yep.
But you can't differentiate between morality and barbarity.

Does God command me to commit genocide, own slaves, rape or kill children, or be illiterate? Nope.
All of those things are promoted in the book you believe God influenced men to write.

Yet here is another 'reasoned' atheists claiming the opposite and smearing himself in fallacy by claiming something at odds with reality in appeal to emotion, (you don't want to be a murdering genocidal rapist do you?) and if its for anyone 'benefit' rather than just another in a long one blatant insults and smears.
They're not insults if they're true. And you and I have been here before - you most certainly do attempt to defend a book which promotes rape, genocide, infanticide, slavery and dictatorial rule. So why do you get so bent when this is pointed out? If you don't like it, then stop supporting it.

Why again do atheists hang out in religion forums? To tell people they are genocidal and play three monkeys when someone states, "Er, no I am not."
But you are. So when you claim you're not, we're here to bring you back to reality and remind you that you do promote such behaviors and even claim them to be moral.

Yes you are God .... I mean No God damn it!
No one is God. Unfortunately, you read the barbaric atrocities of more primitive men and insist that their immorality is God's morality.

Rational? Beneficial? Nope.
Trying to get you to connect with the brutal barbarity of your beliefs is far more beneficial than letting you persist in the delusion that when you do it, or when you believe God is promoting atrocious behaviors, that they're somehow less atrocious, barbaric, brutal or immoral.

Simple viciousness. Nothing more.
Yes, that's a good way to sum up Christianity.

Tell me atheist, what is the difference between Patton and the Ancient Israelites? William T Sherman, who coined the term total war, and the ancient Israelites? What is the difference between Alexander the Great and the ancient Israelites (right his pillaging went WELL beyond the ME)? What is the difference between Hannibal and the Ancient Israelites? What is the difference between Genghis Khan and the Ancient Israelites? Caesar and the Ancient Israelites? The FireBombing of Dresden and the Ancient Israelites?

Right, is the Jews do what is necessary to defend themselves in an existential war ... they are guilty of genocide - because that is what self defense is when you are religious and defend yourself.

Its not like atheists EVER actually attempt to discuss the use of violence in war and make a delineation between morality and barbarity as you put it, its just about standing there 3,000 years later and calling a bunch of people who had nothing to do with the ancient battle a bunch of genocidal maniacs ... because the rest of the Bible, and indeed the context of war, is actually irrelevant to the smear.

Really, NO ONE KNEW GENOCIDE WAS BAD ... until atheists showed up.

Smack! Oh right! GENOCIDE IS BAD ... stupid us ... who are not doing that ... bt what about purges? Cultural Revolutions? Killing Fields? I thought you atheists, with your heightened superiority and naked derision would be immune to these things?

RIGHT, that was some other atheists! YOU wouldn't do that! And outside of an existential war, NO ONE would advocates war advice for everyday reality - and ONLY atheists cannot grasp that reality.

But differentiate:

In Iraq, we kicked into rape/torture rooms and when the douches resisted we shot them. The others were hauled off as prisoners of war, where they have a different set of rights than do citizens.

Yet, when we get word of a similar action taking place in say ... California:

http://www.theguardian.com...

Why do we arrest and try them as criminals?

By all means ever superior atheists, explain these dichotomy to us! Make the delineation. Demonstrate the superior ethics you deign to stand judgement over us and explain how people make they way morally in a world where war happens. By all means, EVERYONE has had it wrong until you atheists showed up.

So educate. Or admit that your position is nothing but derision. Your choice atheists. We already know which it is anyway.
Toviyah
Posts: 88
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7/6/2014 1:33:49 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 12:07:53 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/6/2014 11:20:22 AM, Toviyah wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:42:09 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:10:34 AM, Toviyah wrote:
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:
Would just like to say that a truly do not need to offend any religious people here. I am not religious myself, but I just wanted peoples opinions.

God seems like a horrible god. He orders wars in the old testament, commands people to do terrible things, demands absolute loyalty otherwise punishes them for eternity, and punishes people for eternity for being human. He creates plagues and orders the death of first borns.

God strictly forbade Adam and Eve from eating of the tree, with the warning, "You will surely die." The serpent spoke to them and said, "God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." As we all know, they didn't die, so therefore god lied.

Lastly, according to the website below, the death toll of killing which happened in the bible is estimated to be at: God 2,476,633 - Satan 10 (of which god allowed Satan. I have asked this question in a previous yahoo answer thing and I got a lot of responses saying that Satan is lier and lies all the time. If you believe this, then inst it a possibility that Satan is appearing as a good guy and forcing people to worship him otherwise damning them to an eternity of torture?

If I were Satan, and I wanted to lead as many souls astray as possible, I would claim to be a mighty, omnipotent and unconditionally loving God. I would tell my people there's only one way, and it's mine, and all other ways are false. I would tell people they needed to convert everyone to worship me so they could save their souls. I would have them torture each other in an aim of converting them all to my religion. My religion would publicly preach love and forgiveness while in practice it would cultivate hate and prejudice. The argument I have heard for this is that it is documented that Satan cannot impersonate God or the prophets. Well that is the exact same thing I would say to make them follow me!


http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.co.uk...
Umm... That's a kinda weird thing to argue, considering that goodness and morality, on a Christian sense, is simply following the commands/actions/word of God.
That's called Divine Command Theory.

You mean genocide, slavery, child rape and infanticide.
I'll take someone else's plan, well anyone's really, thanks all the same.
Well considering God does none of these in the Bible (even if he did, it would be a form of utilitarianism that would be morally justified)
I'm guessing that you're referring to things like the slaughter of the Canaanites? In which case, 'genocide', or whatever you want to call it, was morally justified. Think of it as more of a cleansing..

Go ahead and call it ethnic cleansing if it helps you ward off the boogieman under your bed, there is no moral justification for it.
But then bible believers have no morals, so I'm wasting my time talking to the likes of you.
A cleansing of *sin*
Toviyah
Posts: 88
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7/6/2014 1:39:21 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 12:18:15 PM, Beastt wrote:
At 7/6/2014 11:20:22 AM, Toviyah wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:42:09 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:10:34 AM, Toviyah wrote:
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:
Would just like to say that a truly do not need to offend any religious people here. I am not religious myself, but I just wanted peoples opinions.

God seems like a horrible god. He orders wars in the old testament, commands people to do terrible things, demands absolute loyalty otherwise punishes them for eternity, and punishes people for eternity for being human. He creates plagues and orders the death of first borns.

God strictly forbade Adam and Eve from eating of the tree, with the warning, "You will surely die." The serpent spoke to them and said, "God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." As we all know, they didn't die, so therefore god lied.

Lastly, according to the website below, the death toll of killing which happened in the bible is estimated to be at: God 2,476,633 - Satan 10 (of which god allowed Satan. I have asked this question in a previous yahoo answer thing and I got a lot of responses saying that Satan is lier and lies all the time. If you believe this, then inst it a possibility that Satan is appearing as a good guy and forcing people to worship him otherwise damning them to an eternity of torture?

If I were Satan, and I wanted to lead as many souls astray as possible, I would claim to be a mighty, omnipotent and unconditionally loving God. I would tell my people there's only one way, and it's mine, and all other ways are false. I would tell people they needed to convert everyone to worship me so they could save their souls. I would have them torture each other in an aim of converting them all to my religion. My religion would publicly preach love and forgiveness while in practice it would cultivate hate and prejudice. The argument I have heard for this is that it is documented that Satan cannot impersonate God or the prophets. Well that is the exact same thing I would say to make them follow me!


http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.co.uk...
Umm... That's a kinda weird thing to argue, considering that goodness and morality, on a Christian sense, is simply following the commands/actions/word of God.
That's called Divine Command Theory.

You mean genocide, slavery, child rape and infanticide.
I'll take someone else's plan, well anyone's really, thanks all the same.
Well considering God does none of these in the Bible (even if he did, it would be a form of utilitarianism that would be morally justified)
Explain to me when it's morally justified to rape women, slaughter infants or wipe out an entire race.
When it would be more beneficial to do those things than to not. But I could posit millions of subjunctive examples where it would be better for them to happen. Just 'cause they are prima facie objectionable, doesn't mean that they are.
Look up 'utilitarianism' and apply it to God's actions on a wide scale :)

I'm guessing that you're referring to things like the slaughter of the Canaanites? In which case, 'genocide', or whatever you want to call it, was morally justified. Think of it as more of a cleansing..
This is why the entire world should be genuinely concerned about Christianity. It convinces people (by the billions), that the horrific atrocities of people like Hitler are "morally justified".
How did you come to that conclusion?

When we pose the question, 'how could God do X', it isn't a question of 'is there a God who did this'. It is an internal question to Christianity and Christianity alone. But if Christianity is true, then it follows that God had a morally justified motive to do whatever.
12_13
Posts: 1,361
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7/6/2014 1:50:29 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/5/2014 6:44:13 PM, dalehitchy wrote:
God strictly forbade Adam and Eve from eating of the tree, with the warning, "You will surely die." The serpent spoke to them and said, "God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." As we all know, they didn't die, so therefore god lied.

They died, they lost their life with God, and Bible seems to tell that this is really death. That is why Jesus came to show us the way from death to life.

Most assuredly I tell you, he who hears my word, and believes him who sent me, has eternal life, and doesn't come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.
John 5:24

Lastly, according to the website below, the death toll of killing which happened in the bible is estimated to be at: God 2,476,633 - Satan 10 (of which god allowed Satan. I have asked this question in a previous yahoo answer thing and...

Actually most people die and God allows that. Therefore you could as well but the whole number of peoples to that count. However the difference is, God gave life, so he has every right to decide how long it lasts. No one deserves eternal life, so there shouldn"t be any complaining if you or someone else doesn"t get eternal life.
neutral
Posts: 4,478
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7/6/2014 3:31:26 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 1:03:34 PM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 12:25:55 PM, Beastt wrote:
At 7/6/2014 10:56:13 AM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 10:50:39 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/6/2014 10:39:32 AM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:42:09 AM, bulproof wrote:

You mean genocide, slavery, child rape and infanticide.
I'll take someone else's plan, well anyone's really, thanks all the same.

Here we go again with the paranoid delusions.

What do atheists see everywhere? Genocide? Slavery? Child rape and murder (yet he's pro choice?)

Why again do atheists hang out in religion forums? To accuse perfectly innocent people of crimes? That's rational ...

I just see it in the orders given by your great and godly being. Can't you christians read?
Oh wait, I'm talking to newt and he actually can't.

The reason we hang about here is because we like to point out to you just how foolish your childish beliefs are and we enjoy the fact that you lack the intelligence to even understand what we are saying and get insanely angry with the calm and very reasoned message we benefit you with.

Let me amend, Slavery, Genocide, Child Rape and Murder (but he's pro-choice), and honestly believes no one but atheists can read.

This is a reasoned message for my benefit rather than his ego, narcassim, and arrogance.

Am I genocidal? Nope.
But you still support and defend genocide.

Do I own slaves? Nope.
But you defend a book which promotes slavery.

Do I rape children? Nope.
Yet you clearly believe that child rape is justifiable.

Do I murder children? Nope.
But you promote a book which defends murdering children.

Can I read? Yep.
But you can't differentiate between morality and barbarity.

Does God command me to commit genocide, own slaves, rape or kill children, or be illiterate? Nope.
All of those things are promoted in the book you believe God influenced men to write.

Yet here is another 'reasoned' atheists claiming the opposite and smearing himself in fallacy by claiming something at odds with reality in appeal to emotion, (you don't want to be a murdering genocidal rapist do you?) and if its for anyone 'benefit' rather than just another in a long one blatant insults and smears.
They're not insults if they're true. And you and I have been here before - you most certainly do attempt to defend a book which promotes rape, genocide, infanticide, slavery and dictatorial rule. So why do you get so bent when this is pointed out? If you don't like it, then stop supporting it.

Why again do atheists hang out in religion forums? To tell people they are genocidal and play three monkeys when someone states, "Er, no I am not."
But you are. So when you claim you're not, we're here to bring you back to reality and remind you that you do promote such behaviors and even claim them to be moral.

Yes you are God .... I mean No God damn it!
No one is God. Unfortunately, you read the barbaric atrocities of more primitive men and insist that their immorality is God's morality.

Rational? Beneficial? Nope.
Trying to get you to connect with the brutal barbarity of your beliefs is far more beneficial than letting you persist in the delusion that when you do it, or when you believe God is promoting atrocious behaviors, that they're somehow less atrocious, barbaric, brutal or immoral.

Simple viciousness. Nothing more.
Yes, that's a good way to sum up Christianity.

Tell me atheist, what is the difference between Patton and the Ancient Israelites? William T Sherman, who coined the term total war, and the ancient Israelites? What is the difference between Alexander the Great and the ancient Israelites (right his pillaging went WELL beyond the ME)? What is the difference between Hannibal and the Ancient Israelites? What is the difference between Genghis Khan and the Ancient Israelites? Caesar and the Ancient Israelites? The FireBombing of Dresden and the Ancient Israelites?

Right, is the Jews do what is necessary to defend themselves in an existential war ... they are guilty of genocide - because that is what self defense is when you are religious and defend yourself.

Its not like atheists EVER actually attempt to discuss the use of violence in war and make a delineation between morality and barbarity as you put it, its just about standing there 3,000 years later and calling a bunch of people who had nothing to do with the ancient battle a bunch of genocidal maniacs ... because the rest of the Bible, and indeed the context of war, is actually irrelevant to the smear.

Really, NO ONE KNEW GENOCIDE WAS BAD ... until atheists showed up.

Smack! Oh right! GENOCIDE IS BAD ... stupid us ... who are not doing that ... bt what about purges? Cultural Revolutions? Killing Fields? I thought you atheists, with your heightened superiority and naked derision would be immune to these things?

RIGHT, that was some other atheists! YOU wouldn't do that! And outside of an existential war, NO ONE would advocates war advice for everyday reality - and ONLY atheists cannot grasp that reality.

But differentiate:

In Iraq, we kicked into rape/torture rooms and when the douches resisted we shot them. The others were hauled off as prisoners of war, where they have a different set of rights than do citizens.

Yet, when we get word of a similar action taking place in say ... California:

http://www.theguardian.com...

Why do we arrest and try them as criminals?

By all means ever superior atheists, explain these dichotomy to us! Make the delineation. Demonstrate the superior ethics you deign to stand judgement over us and explain how people make they way morally in a world where war happens. By all means, EVERYONE has had it wrong until you atheists showed up.

So educate. Or admit that your position is nothing but derision. Your choice atheists. We already know which it is anyway.

Agh ... skipped. As is usually the case when evidence is presented. When questions requiring thought are asked.
bulproof
Posts: 25,211
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7/6/2014 11:05:09 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/6/2014 3:31:26 PM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 1:03:34 PM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 12:25:55 PM, Beastt wrote:
At 7/6/2014 10:56:13 AM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 10:50:39 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/6/2014 10:39:32 AM, neutral wrote:
At 7/6/2014 9:42:09 AM, bulproof wrote:

You mean genocide, slavery, child rape and infanticide.
I'll take someone else's plan, well anyone's really, thanks all the same.

Here we go again with the paranoid delusions.

What do atheists see everywhere? Genocide? Slavery? Child rape and murder (yet he's pro choice?)

Why again do atheists hang out in religion forums? To accuse perfectly innocent people of crimes? That's rational ...

I just see it in the orders given by your great and godly being. Can't you christians read?
Oh wait, I'm talking to newt and he actually can't.

The reason we hang about here is because we like to point out to you just how foolish your childish beliefs are and we enjoy the fact that you lack the intelligence to even understand what we are saying and get insanely angry with the calm and very reasoned message we benefit you with.

Let me amend, Slavery, Genocide, Child Rape and Murder (but he's pro-choice), and honestly believes no one but atheists can read.

This is a reasoned message for my benefit rather than his ego, narcassim, and arrogance.

Am I genocidal? Nope.
But you still support and defend genocide.

Do I own slaves? Nope.
But you defend a book which promotes slavery.

Do I rape children? Nope.
Yet you clearly believe that child rape is justifiable.

Do I murder children? Nope.
But you promote a book which defends murdering children.

Can I read? Yep.
But you can't differentiate between morality and barbarity.

Does God command me to commit genocide, own slaves, rape or kill children, or be illiterate? Nope.
All of those things are promoted in the book you believe God influenced men to write.

Yet here is another 'reasoned' atheists claiming the opposite and smearing himself in fallacy by claiming something at odds with reality in appeal to emotion, (you don't want to be a murdering genocidal rapist do you?) and if its for anyone 'benefit' rather than just another in a long one blatant insults and smears.
They're not insults if they're true. And you and I have been here before - you most certainly do attempt to defend a book which promotes rape, genocide, infanticide, slavery and dictatorial rule. So why do you get so bent when this is pointed out? If you don't like it, then stop supporting it.

Why again do atheists hang out in religion forums? To tell people they are genocidal and play three monkeys when someone states, "Er, no I am not."
But you are. So when you claim you're not, we're here to bring you back to reality and remind you that you do promote such behaviors and even claim them to be moral.

Yes you are God .... I mean No God damn it!
No one is God. Unfortunately, you read the barbaric atrocities of more primitive men and insist that their immorality is God's morality.

Rational? Beneficial? Nope.
Trying to get you to connect with the brutal barbarity of your beliefs is far more beneficial than letting you persist in the delusion that when you do it, or when you believe God is promoting atrocious behaviors, that they're somehow less atrocious, barbaric, brutal or immoral.

Simple viciousness. Nothing more.
Yes, that's a good way to sum up Christianity.

Tell me atheist, what is the difference between Patton and the Ancient Israelites? William T Sherman, who coined the term total war, and the ancient Israelites? What is the difference between Alexander the Great and the ancient Israelites (right his pillaging went WELL beyond the ME)? What is the difference between Hannibal and the Ancient Israelites? What is the difference between Genghis Khan and the Ancient Israelites? Caesar and the Ancient Israelites? The FireBombing of Dresden and the Ancient Israelites?

Right, is the Jews do what is necessary to defend themselves in an existential war ... they are guilty of genocide - because that is what self defense is when you are religious and defend yourself.

Its not like atheists EVER actually attempt to discuss the use of violence in war and make a delineation between morality and barbarity as you put it, its just about standing there 3,000 years later and calling a bunch of people who had nothing to do with the ancient battle a bunch of genocidal maniacs ... because the rest of the Bible, and indeed the context of war, is actually irrelevant to the smear.

Really, NO ONE KNEW GENOCIDE WAS BAD ... until atheists showed up.

Smack! Oh right! GENOCIDE IS BAD ... stupid us ... who are not doing that ... bt what about purges? Cultural Revolutions? Killing Fields? I thought you atheists, with your heightened superiority and naked derision would be immune to these things?

RIGHT, that was some other atheists! YOU wouldn't do that! And outside of an existential war, NO ONE would advocates war advice for everyday reality - and ONLY atheists cannot grasp that reality.

But differentiate:

In Iraq, we kicked into rape/torture rooms and when the douches resisted we shot them. The others were hauled off as prisoners of war, where they have a different set of rights than do citizens.

Yet, when we get word of a similar action taking place in say ... California:

http://www.theguardian.com...

Why do we arrest and try them as criminals?

By all means ever superior atheists, explain these dichotomy to us! Make the delineation. Demonstrate the superior ethics you deign to stand judgement over us and explain how people make they way morally in a world where war happens. By all means, EVERYONE has had it wrong until you atheists showed up.

So educate. Or admit that your position is nothing but derision. Your choice atheists. We already know which it is anyway.

Agh ... skipped. As is usually the case when evidence is presented. When questions requiring thought are asked.

None of us are claiming the ancient Israelites were genocidal.

Your book claims your god is.

It's interesting who you compare your god to.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin