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Why as a Christian, I don't like church

Truth_seeker
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7/20/2014 10:03:04 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I was born and raised in church, but over the years, I stopped liking it coming from a Christian background.I used to be all loving, being involved in church, thinking that to honor God, you have to go to church, etc. but over the years, I changed. I stopped dressing up on Sundays and basically shut myself out because church has become a community, rather than a body of disciples.I realized that it's just a bunch of people in cliques, they're all the same. After a lot of arguments with my Christian friends over doctrine, I realize thatjust because we're brothers in Christ doesn't mean we're going to be friends. It's a harsh reality, but I have to accept it. Just because you say you love me and shake my hand Sunday morning it doesn't mean you're going to be my friend.it's not about being called a Christian and being associated with them, it's about what you do as a disciple in Christ. I don't want to marry a woman because she's a Christian, I want to marry a woman because she is like Christ.I don't want everyone to think I'm perfect because I'm not. I can be very bad, but I'm forgiven.I don't want to hang out with Christians only on Sundays, I want to hang around them all the timeand knows im on a personal level because how do I know what they do when they not in church? I'm unique and I don't want anyone to think that I'm average.
sovereigngracereigns
Posts: 585
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7/21/2014 1:51:40 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/20/2014 10:03:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I was born and raised in church, but over the years, I stopped liking it coming from a Christian background.I used to be all loving, being involved in church, thinking that to honor God, you have to go to church, etc. but over the years, I changed. I stopped dressing up on Sundays and basically shut myself out because church has become a community, rather than a body of disciples.I realized that it's just a bunch of people in cliques, they're all the same. After a lot of arguments with my Christian friends over doctrine, I realize thatjust because we're brothers in Christ doesn't mean we're going to be friends. It's a harsh reality, but I have to accept it. Just because you say you love me and shake my hand Sunday morning it doesn't mean you're going to be my friend.it's not about being called a Christian and being associated with them, it's about what you do as a disciple in Christ. I don't want to marry a woman because she's a Christian, I want to marry a woman because she is like Christ.I don't want everyone to think I'm perfect because I'm not. I can be very bad, but I'm forgiven.I don't want to hang out with Christians only on Sundays, I want to hang around them all the timeand knows im on a personal level because how do I know what they do when they not in church? I'm unique and I don't want anyone to think that I'm average.

With all due respect, if you are a Christian, you will want to publically worship with Christian brothers and sisters.
And you will want to be of service to them.

I'm not saying it's easy to find a sound church, far from it---it's one of the most difficult things in this world.

But if you're one of God's people, he will lead you to a sound church.

And if you want something bad enough, you won't stop til you find it.

I can help you find a sound church if you want help. Just send a PM and I'll try to assist you.
celestialtorahteacher
Posts: 1,369
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7/21/2014 8:01:12 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
ehhhh...who needs to serve Paul's ideas and this phony "Church" fellowship ideology that cannot be true of Jesus Christ the Jew living in a Jewish community with no churches but synagogues and temple? This church business is all Gentile overlay of Christ consciousness and duty which is not to fellow Christians but to all those in need. Church fellowship is just too akin to rock concert group mass mind hypnosis and hysteria to be real because take away the group and what do you have? An individual who can only confront God as an individual to be authentic spiritual consciousness. Mass mind is false as history tell us over and over again.

I am a prophesy bearer and recognized man of God who has had tea with the Archbishop of the Holy Land Dioceses and is friends with recognized religious leaders in the Holy Land and America and I tell you I rarely step foot in churches myself. No, for me God's Churches are our Libraries where the Word of God can be found in books and periodicals ranging from children's stories to the encyclopedias, even phone books as far as I'm concerned. When your religion narrows the historical Path of God through human cultures and times, you lose the holistic perspective of how God is changing us slowly but surely from animal in human form to true human beings, i.e. humane beings. Patronize your local libraries to find God's instructions and steer clear of churches is my advice.
Truth_seeker
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7/21/2014 8:14:21 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/21/2014 1:51:40 AM, sovereigngracereigns wrote:
At 7/20/2014 10:03:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I was born and raised in church, but over the years, I stopped liking it coming from a Christian background.I used to be all loving, being involved in church, thinking that to honor God, you have to go to church, etc. but over the years, I changed. I stopped dressing up on Sundays and basically shut myself out because church has become a community, rather than a body of disciples.I realized that it's just a bunch of people in cliques, they're all the same. After a lot of arguments with my Christian friends over doctrine, I realize thatjust because we're brothers in Christ doesn't mean we're going to be friends. It's a harsh reality, but I have to accept it. Just because you say you love me and shake my hand Sunday morning it doesn't mean you're going to be my friend.it's not about being called a Christian and being associated with them, it's about what you do as a disciple in Christ. I don't want to marry a woman because she's a Christian, I want to marry a woman because she is like Christ.I don't want everyone to think I'm perfect because I'm not. I can be very bad, but I'm forgiven.I don't want to hang out with Christians only on Sundays, I want to hang around them all the timeand knows im on a personal level because how do I know what they do when they not in church? I'm unique and I don't want anyone to think that I'm average.

With all due respect, if you are a Christian, you will want to publically worship with Christian brothers and sisters.
And you will want to be of service to them.

I'm not saying it's easy to find a sound church, far from it---it's one of the most difficult things in this world.

But if you're one of God's people, he will lead you to a sound church.

And if you want something bad enough, you won't stop til you find it.

I can help you find a sound church if you want help. Just send a PM and I'll try to assist you.

True, i just don't feel like i fit in. I've been oppressed alot because we don't worship the same way, dress the same, act the same, believe in the same things, study the same, etc. I mean of right now, i think i found a Christian group which might work out for me cuz the people i know in that group come from diverse backgrounds and love God.
TrueScotsman
Posts: 515
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7/21/2014 8:18:30 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/20/2014 10:03:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I was born and raised in church, but over the years, I stopped liking it coming from a Christian background.I used to be all loving, being involved in church, thinking that to honor God, you have to go to church, etc. but over the years, I changed. I stopped dressing up on Sundays and basically shut myself out because church has become a community, rather than a body of disciples.I realized that it's just a bunch of people in cliques, they're all the same. After a lot of arguments with my Christian friends over doctrine, I realize thatjust because we're brothers in Christ doesn't mean we're going to be friends. It's a harsh reality, but I have to accept it. Just because you say you love me and shake my hand Sunday morning it doesn't mean you're going to be my friend.it's not about being called a Christian and being associated with them, it's about what you do as a disciple in Christ. I don't want to marry a woman because she's a Christian, I want to marry a woman because she is like Christ.I don't want everyone to think I'm perfect because I'm not. I can be very bad, but I'm forgiven.I don't want to hang out with Christians only on Sundays, I want to hang around them all the timeand knows im on a personal level because how do I know what they do when they not in church? I'm unique and I don't want anyone to think that I'm average.

When I read the New Testament, I don't see how it can be interpreted to be some kind of personal journey. The "Church" isn't a thing you go do on Sundays, it comes from the Greek word that means assembly. In a nut shell, it is the people of God collectively and locally. It doesn't necessarily mean that you have to attend a sermon/worship service each week, but that you should be living in a community with fellow brothers and sisters in the Lord.

I have doctrinal differences when it comes to all my friends and Pastor (we've even sat down and had a discussion about it), but it is very important that you don't let those little unimportant distinctions define you.

I understand your personal experiences has driven you away, but I would say that unity and love for each other is chief among the concerns of the NT authors. I hope you read Paul's writings in particular and his emphasis on unity in the midst conflict and disagreement. I find it odd that you would seek to be a disciple of Jesus, yet ignore the command to love one another, which is spoken of specifically to those who are his disciples.

I hope that you give this some more thought.

Regards,
TS
Truth_seeker
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7/21/2014 8:19:33 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
It's hard to fellowship with people when you know that they'll get on you for your beliefs when you actually studied the Bible and the more you show it to them, the more they get offended. That's why it's hard for me to open up to my own people...
Truth_seeker
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7/21/2014 8:22:27 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/21/2014 8:18:30 AM, TrueScotsman wrote:
At 7/20/2014 10:03:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I was born and raised in church, but over the years, I stopped liking it coming from a Christian background.I used to be all loving, being involved in church, thinking that to honor God, you have to go to church, etc. but over the years, I changed. I stopped dressing up on Sundays and basically shut myself out because church has become a community, rather than a body of disciples.I realized that it's just a bunch of people in cliques, they're all the same. After a lot of arguments with my Christian friends over doctrine, I realize thatjust because we're brothers in Christ doesn't mean we're going to be friends. It's a harsh reality, but I have to accept it. Just because you say you love me and shake my hand Sunday morning it doesn't mean you're going to be my friend.it's not about being called a Christian and being associated with them, it's about what you do as a disciple in Christ. I don't want to marry a woman because she's a Christian, I want to marry a woman because she is like Christ.I don't want everyone to think I'm perfect because I'm not. I can be very bad, but I'm forgiven.I don't want to hang out with Christians only on Sundays, I want to hang around them all the timeand knows im on a personal level because how do I know what they do when they not in church? I'm unique and I don't want anyone to think that I'm average.

When I read the New Testament, I don't see how it can be interpreted to be some kind of personal journey. The "Church" isn't a thing you go do on Sundays, it comes from the Greek word that means assembly. In a nut shell, it is the people of God collectively and locally. It doesn't necessarily mean that you have to attend a sermon/worship service each week, but that you should be living in a community with fellow brothers and sisters in the Lord.

I have doctrinal differences when it comes to all my friends and Pastor (we've even sat down and had a discussion about it), but it is very important that you don't let those little unimportant distinctions define you.

I understand your personal experiences has driven you away, but I would say that unity and love for each other is chief among the concerns of the NT authors. I hope you read Paul's writings in particular and his emphasis on unity in the midst conflict and disagreement. I find it odd that you would seek to be a disciple of Jesus, yet ignore the command to love one another, which is spoken of specifically to those who are his disciples.

I hope that you give this some more thought.

Regards,
TS

Very true and I have taught that. The Greek word for church does mean assembly, not necessarily a building or an organization. Yea, i must resolve conflict biblically, kinda hard to start when you have never did it before...
TrueScotsman
Posts: 515
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7/21/2014 8:32:44 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/21/2014 8:19:33 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
It's hard to fellowship with people when you know that they'll get on you for your beliefs when you actually studied the Bible and the more you show it to them, the more they get offended. That's why it's hard for me to open up to my own people...

What kind of doctrinal differences do people normally dispute with you about?
Truth_seeker
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7/21/2014 8:55:00 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/21/2014 8:32:44 AM, TrueScotsman wrote:
At 7/21/2014 8:19:33 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
It's hard to fellowship with people when you know that they'll get on you for your beliefs when you actually studied the Bible and the more you show it to them, the more they get offended. That's why it's hard for me to open up to my own people...

What kind of doctrinal differences do people normally dispute with you about?

It varies, but it touches subjects like the Garden of Eden, tree of life, and knowledge of good and evil, and the serpent (believe it's figurative), long hair being a sin or not, Lucifer being the devil (i don't believe Lucifer is the devil), i don't believe that tithing is applicable today (unless it's out of love), divorce is not a sin, pre-marital sex is not a sin (although i do believe that waiting until marriage is the best choice), etc.
TrueScotsman
Posts: 515
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7/21/2014 9:38:02 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/21/2014 8:55:00 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 7/21/2014 8:32:44 AM, TrueScotsman wrote:
At 7/21/2014 8:19:33 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
It's hard to fellowship with people when you know that they'll get on you for your beliefs when you actually studied the Bible and the more you show it to them, the more they get offended. That's why it's hard for me to open up to my own people...

What kind of doctrinal differences do people normally dispute with you about?

It varies, but it touches subjects like the Garden of Eden, tree of life, and knowledge of good and evil, and the serpent (believe it's figurative),

Do you embrace evolution and thus an allegorical approach to Genesis? If so, then we are agreed.

long hair being a sin or not,

I have no problem with this.

Lucifer being the devil (i don't believe Lucifer is the devil),

Well Lucifer comes from the Latin and means "morning star" and is a reference to the passage in Isaiah (I think) where it talks about this morning star being "kicked out." Do you not think that is about Satan?

I don't see anything super controversial about that, a lot of people believe it and I am personally on the fence.

i don't believe that tithing is applicable today (unless it's out of love),

Agreed here, a lot of people would agree on this.

divorce is not a sin, pre-marital sex is not a sin (although i do believe that waiting until marriage is the best choice), etc.

These two I would have a hard time seeing how you can believe this. The NT is pretty clear that divorce is a sin except for sexual immorality and an unbeliever leaving. Also, sex outside of marriage is called fornication, which is repeatedly condemned.

Where do you get this belief? Personal opinion?

Just curious.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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7/21/2014 10:32:22 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/20/2014 10:03:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I was born and raised in church, but over the years, I stopped liking it coming from a Christian background.I used to be all loving, being involved in church, thinking that to honor God, you have to go to church, etc. but over the years, I changed. I stopped dressing up on Sundays and basically shut myself out because church has become a community, rather than a body of disciples.I realized that it's just a bunch of people in cliques, they're all the same. After a lot of arguments with my Christian friends over doctrine, I realize thatjust because we're brothers in Christ doesn't mean we're going to be friends. It's a harsh reality, but I have to accept it. Just because you say you love me and shake my hand Sunday morning it doesn't mean you're going to be my friend.it's not about being called a Christian and being associated with them, it's about what you do as a disciple in Christ. I don't want to marry a woman because she's a Christian, I want to marry a woman because she is like Christ.I don't want everyone to think I'm perfect because I'm not. I can be very bad, but I'm forgiven.I don't want to hang out with Christians only on Sundays, I want to hang around them all the timeand knows im on a personal level because how do I know what they do when they not in church? I'm unique and I don't want anyone to think that I'm average.

We saints will hang out with ALL of God's people but only a few are chosen believers who will actually listen to the gospel we preach and become our friends. The gospel is the Voice of the Lord, which most of God's people hate with a passion. That's the reason we saints can't hang out with them. It's not because we don't love them, it's because they hate us.

Jeremiah 6
10: To whom shall I speak and give warning, that they may hear? Behold, their ears are closed, they cannot listen; behold, the word of the LORD is to them an object of scorn, they take no pleasure in it.

1 John 4
4: Little children, you are of God, and have overcome them; for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world.
5: They are of the world, therefore what they say is of the world, and the world listens to them.
6: We are of God. Whoever knows God listens to us, and he who is not of God does not listen to us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error.

God's chosen believers listen to the gospel that we saints preach to them.

Are you a chosen believer who will listen to My Voice or are you an unbeliever who rejects Me?

2 Corinthians 3;
14: But their minds were hardened; for to this day, when they read the old covenant, that same veil remains unlifted, because only through Christ is it taken away.
15: Yes, to this day whenever Moses is read a veil lies over their minds;
16: but when a man turns to the Lord the veil is removed.
17: Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
18: And we all, with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord, are being changed into his likeness from one degree of glory to another; for this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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7/21/2014 10:34:41 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/21/2014 8:18:30 AM, TrueScotsman wrote:
At 7/20/2014 10:03:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I was born and raised in church, but over the years, I stopped liking it coming from a Christian background.I used to be all loving, being involved in church, thinking that to honor God, you have to go to church, etc. but over the years, I changed. I stopped dressing up on Sundays and basically shut myself out because church has become a community, rather than a body of disciples.I realized that it's just a bunch of people in cliques, they're all the same. After a lot of arguments with my Christian friends over doctrine, I realize thatjust because we're brothers in Christ doesn't mean we're going to be friends. It's a harsh reality, but I have to accept it. Just because you say you love me and shake my hand Sunday morning it doesn't mean you're going to be my friend.it's not about being called a Christian and being associated with them, it's about what you do as a disciple in Christ. I don't want to marry a woman because she's a Christian, I want to marry a woman because she is like Christ.I don't want everyone to think I'm perfect because I'm not. I can be very bad, but I'm forgiven.I don't want to hang out with Christians only on Sundays, I want to hang around them all the timeand knows im on a personal level because how do I know what they do when they not in church? I'm unique and I don't want anyone to think that I'm average.

When I read the New Testament, I don't see how it can be interpreted to be some kind of personal journey. The "Church" isn't a thing you go do on Sundays, it comes from the Greek word that means assembly. In a nut shell, it is the people of God collectively and locally. It doesn't necessarily mean that you have to attend a sermon/worship service each week, but that you should be living in a community with fellow brothers and sisters in the Lord.

I have doctrinal differences when it comes to all my friends and Pastor (we've even sat down and had a discussion about it), but it is very important that you don't let those little unimportant distinctions define you.

I understand your personal experiences has driven you away, but I would say that unity and love for each other is chief among the concerns of the NT authors. I hope you read Paul's writings in particular and his emphasis on unity in the midst conflict and disagreement. I find it odd that you would seek to be a disciple of Jesus, yet ignore the command to love one another, which is spoken of specifically to those who are his disciples.

I hope that you give this some more thought.

Regards,
TS

Most Christians don't know what the love of God is. They think it's some kind of emotion but that's far from the Truth. They love what they observe, not with their invisible spirit which they don't know anything about.
TrueScotsman
Posts: 515
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7/21/2014 10:41:42 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/21/2014 10:32:22 AM, bornofgod wrote:
At 7/20/2014 10:03:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I was born and raised in church, but over the years, I stopped liking it coming from a Christian background.I used to be all loving, being involved in church, thinking that to honor God, you have to go to church, etc. but over the years, I changed. I stopped dressing up on Sundays and basically shut myself out because church has become a community, rather than a body of disciples.I realized that it's just a bunch of people in cliques, they're all the same. After a lot of arguments with my Christian friends over doctrine, I realize thatjust because we're brothers in Christ doesn't mean we're going to be friends. It's a harsh reality, but I have to accept it. Just because you say you love me and shake my hand Sunday morning it doesn't mean you're going to be my friend.it's not about being called a Christian and being associated with them, it's about what you do as a disciple in Christ. I don't want to marry a woman because she's a Christian, I want to marry a woman because she is like Christ.I don't want everyone to think I'm perfect because I'm not. I can be very bad, but I'm forgiven.I don't want to hang out with Christians only on Sundays, I want to hang around them all the timeand knows im on a personal level because how do I know what they do when they not in church? I'm unique and I don't want anyone to think that I'm average.

We saints will hang out with ALL of God's people but only a few are chosen believers who will actually listen to the gospel we preach and become our friends. The gospel is the Voice of the Lord, which most of God's people hate with a passion. That's the reason we saints can't hang out with them. It's not because we don't love them, it's because they hate us.

Jeremiah 6
10: To whom shall I speak and give warning, that they may hear? Behold, their ears are closed, they cannot listen; behold, the word of the LORD is to them an object of scorn, they take no pleasure in it.

1 John 4
4: Little children, you are of God, and have overcome them; for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world.
5: They are of the world, therefore what they say is of the world, and the world listens to them.
6: We are of God. Whoever knows God listens to us, and he who is not of God does not listen to us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error.

God's chosen believers listen to the gospel that we saints preach to them.

Are you a chosen believer who will listen to My Voice or are you an unbeliever who rejects Me?


2 Corinthians 3;
14: But their minds were hardened; for to this day, when they read the old covenant, that same veil remains unlifted, because only through Christ is it taken away.
15: Yes, to this day whenever Moses is read a veil lies over their minds;
16: but when a man turns to the Lord the veil is removed.
17: Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
18: And we all, with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord, are being changed into his likeness from one degree of glory to another; for this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit.

Does anyone listen to you?
sovereigngracereigns
Posts: 585
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7/21/2014 11:50:45 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/21/2014 8:18:30 AM, TrueScotsman wrote:
At 7/20/2014 10:03:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I was born and raised in church, but over the years, I stopped liking it coming from a Christian background.I used to be all loving, being involved in church, thinking that to honor God, you have to go to church, etc. but over the years, I changed. I stopped dressing up on Sundays and basically shut myself out because church has become a community, rather than a body of disciples.I realized that it's just a bunch of people in cliques, they're all the same. After a lot of arguments with my Christian friends over doctrine, I realize thatjust because we're brothers in Christ doesn't mean we're going to be friends. It's a harsh reality, but I have to accept it. Just because you say you love me and shake my hand Sunday morning it doesn't mean you're going to be my friend.it's not about being called a Christian and being associated with them, it's about what you do as a disciple in Christ. I don't want to marry a woman because she's a Christian, I want to marry a woman because she is like Christ.I don't want everyone to think I'm perfect because I'm not. I can be very bad, but I'm forgiven.I don't want to hang out with Christians only on Sundays, I want to hang around them all the timeand knows im on a personal level because how do I know what they do when they not in church? I'm unique and I don't want anyone to think that I'm average.

When I read the New Testament, I don't see how it can be interpreted to be some kind of personal journey. The "Church" isn't a thing you go do on Sundays, it comes from the Greek word that means assembly. In a nut shell, it is the people of God collectively and locally. It doesn't necessarily mean that you have to attend a sermon/worship service each week, but that you should be living in a community with fellow brothers and sisters in the Lord.

I have doctrinal differences when it comes to all my friends and Pastor (we've even sat down and had a discussion about it), but it is very important that you don't let those little unimportant distinctions define you.

I understand your personal experiences has driven you away, but I would say that unity and love for each other is chief among the concerns of the NT authors. I hope you read Paul's writings in particular and his emphasis on unity in the midst conflict and disagreement. I find it odd that you would seek to be a disciple of Jesus, yet ignore the command to love one another, which is spoken of specifically to those who are his disciples.

I hope that you give this some more thought.

Regards,
TS

Exactly.

Excellent post.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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7/21/2014 10:02:30 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/21/2014 10:41:42 AM, TrueScotsman wrote:
At 7/21/2014 10:32:22 AM, bornofgod wrote:
At 7/20/2014 10:03:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I was born and raised in church, but over the years, I stopped liking it coming from a Christian background.I used to be all loving, being involved in church, thinking that to honor God, you have to go to church, etc. but over the years, I changed. I stopped dressing up on Sundays and basically shut myself out because church has become a community, rather than a body of disciples.I realized that it's just a bunch of people in cliques, they're all the same. After a lot of arguments with my Christian friends over doctrine, I realize thatjust because we're brothers in Christ doesn't mean we're going to be friends. It's a harsh reality, but I have to accept it. Just because you say you love me and shake my hand Sunday morning it doesn't mean you're going to be my friend.it's not about being called a Christian and being associated with them, it's about what you do as a disciple in Christ. I don't want to marry a woman because she's a Christian, I want to marry a woman because she is like Christ.I don't want everyone to think I'm perfect because I'm not. I can be very bad, but I'm forgiven.I don't want to hang out with Christians only on Sundays, I want to hang around them all the timeand knows im on a personal level because how do I know what they do when they not in church? I'm unique and I don't want anyone to think that I'm average.

We saints will hang out with ALL of God's people but only a few are chosen believers who will actually listen to the gospel we preach and become our friends. The gospel is the Voice of the Lord, which most of God's people hate with a passion. That's the reason we saints can't hang out with them. It's not because we don't love them, it's because they hate us.

Jeremiah 6
10: To whom shall I speak and give warning, that they may hear? Behold, their ears are closed, they cannot listen; behold, the word of the LORD is to them an object of scorn, they take no pleasure in it.

1 John 4
4: Little children, you are of God, and have overcome them; for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world.
5: They are of the world, therefore what they say is of the world, and the world listens to them.
6: We are of God. Whoever knows God listens to us, and he who is not of God does not listen to us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error.

God's chosen believers listen to the gospel that we saints preach to them.

Are you a chosen believer who will listen to My Voice or are you an unbeliever who rejects Me?


2 Corinthians 3;
14: But their minds were hardened; for to this day, when they read the old covenant, that same veil remains unlifted, because only through Christ is it taken away.
15: Yes, to this day whenever Moses is read a veil lies over their minds;
16: but when a man turns to the Lord the veil is removed.
17: Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
18: And we all, with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord, are being changed into his likeness from one degree of glory to another; for this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit.

Does anyone listen to you?

There are at least 1500 believers here in Campbell who have heard me preach the gospel to them and thanked me sharing with them. Many of them have become very close friends of mine who spend a lot of time listening to God's voice teach them about the future.

It's very difficult for believers to get close to me in these internet forums because they can't see the body language which is a very important part of listening to God. The body is just as attracting to a listener as the information being spoken by the body. If the body language doesn't jive with the spoken language, people don't trust the message.
TrueScotsman
Posts: 515
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7/22/2014 6:56:41 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/21/2014 10:02:30 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 7/21/2014 10:41:42 AM, TrueScotsman wrote:
At 7/21/2014 10:32:22 AM, bornofgod wrote:
At 7/20/2014 10:03:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I was born and raised in church, but over the years, I stopped liking it coming from a Christian background.I used to be all loving, being involved in church, thinking that to honor God, you have to go to church, etc. but over the years, I changed. I stopped dressing up on Sundays and basically shut myself out because church has become a community, rather than a body of disciples.I realized that it's just a bunch of people in cliques, they're all the same. After a lot of arguments with my Christian friends over doctrine, I realize thatjust because we're brothers in Christ doesn't mean we're going to be friends. It's a harsh reality, but I have to accept it. Just because you say you love me and shake my hand Sunday morning it doesn't mean you're going to be my friend.it's not about being called a Christian and being associated with them, it's about what you do as a disciple in Christ. I don't want to marry a woman because she's a Christian, I want to marry a woman because she is like Christ.I don't want everyone to think I'm perfect because I'm not. I can be very bad, but I'm forgiven.I don't want to hang out with Christians only on Sundays, I want to hang around them all the timeand knows im on a personal level because how do I know what they do when they not in church? I'm unique and I don't want anyone to think that I'm average.

We saints will hang out with ALL of God's people but only a few are chosen believers who will actually listen to the gospel we preach and become our friends. The gospel is the Voice of the Lord, which most of God's people hate with a passion. That's the reason we saints can't hang out with them. It's not because we don't love them, it's because they hate us.

Jeremiah 6
10: To whom shall I speak and give warning, that they may hear? Behold, their ears are closed, they cannot listen; behold, the word of the LORD is to them an object of scorn, they take no pleasure in it.

1 John 4
4: Little children, you are of God, and have overcome them; for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world.
5: They are of the world, therefore what they say is of the world, and the world listens to them.
6: We are of God. Whoever knows God listens to us, and he who is not of God does not listen to us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error.

God's chosen believers listen to the gospel that we saints preach to them.

Are you a chosen believer who will listen to My Voice or are you an unbeliever who rejects Me?


2 Corinthians 3;
14: But their minds were hardened; for to this day, when they read the old covenant, that same veil remains unlifted, because only through Christ is it taken away.
15: Yes, to this day whenever Moses is read a veil lies over their minds;
16: but when a man turns to the Lord the veil is removed.
17: Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
18: And we all, with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord, are being changed into his likeness from one degree of glory to another; for this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit.

Does anyone listen to you?

There are at least 1500 believers here in Campbell who have heard me preach the gospel to them and thanked me sharing with them. Many of them have become very close friends of mine who spend a lot of time listening to God's voice teach them about the future.

It's very difficult for believers to get close to me in these internet forums because they can't see the body language which is a very important part of listening to God. The body is just as attracting to a listener as the information being spoken by the body. If the body language doesn't jive with the spoken language, people don't trust the message.

Basically your suggestibility is hampered by the internet?
slo1
Posts: 4,351
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7/22/2014 8:23:19 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/21/2014 8:55:00 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 7/21/2014 8:32:44 AM, TrueScotsman wrote:
At 7/21/2014 8:19:33 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
It's hard to fellowship with people when you know that they'll get on you for your beliefs when you actually studied the Bible and the more you show it to them, the more they get offended. That's why it's hard for me to open up to my own people...

What kind of doctrinal differences do people normally dispute with you about?

It varies, but it touches subjects like the Garden of Eden, tree of life, and knowledge of good and evil, and the serpent (believe it's figurative), long hair being a sin or not, Lucifer being the devil (i don't believe Lucifer is the devil), i don't believe that tithing is applicable today (unless it's out of love), divorce is not a sin, pre-marital sex is not a sin (although i do believe that waiting until marriage is the best choice), etc.

Yous and your long hair is going to hell boy!

I think you are realizing that people place tremendous value on the most insignificant things. It sounds like to me that you have just begun your journey shedding off the irrationality of religion, not spirituality, but good ol' fashion human constructed religion.
bulproof
Posts: 25,255
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7/22/2014 8:54:17 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/21/2014 1:51:40 AM, sovereigngracereigns wrote:
I'm not saying it's easy to find a sound church, far from it---it's one of the most difficult things in this world.

Because the only being with will, the only being whose will all other beings must follow is a pratt.

Your all powerful god is not powerful enough to get all people and all churches to worship him.

I really can't understand why you people don't worship Poppa Smurf. He is capable of anything your god is.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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7/23/2014 8:43:44 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/22/2014 6:56:41 AM, TrueScotsman wrote:
At 7/21/2014 10:02:30 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 7/21/2014 10:41:42 AM, TrueScotsman wrote:
At 7/21/2014 10:32:22 AM, bornofgod wrote:
At 7/20/2014 10:03:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I was born and raised in church, but over the years, I stopped liking it coming from a Christian background.I used to be all loving, being involved in church, thinking that to honor God, you have to go to church, etc. but over the years, I changed. I stopped dressing up on Sundays and basically shut myself out because church has become a community, rather than a body of disciples.I realized that it's just a bunch of people in cliques, they're all the same. After a lot of arguments with my Christian friends over doctrine, I realize thatjust because we're brothers in Christ doesn't mean we're going to be friends. It's a harsh reality, but I have to accept it. Just because you say you love me and shake my hand Sunday morning it doesn't mean you're going to be my friend.it's not about being called a Christian and being associated with them, it's about what you do as a disciple in Christ. I don't want to marry a woman because she's a Christian, I want to marry a woman because she is like Christ.I don't want everyone to think I'm perfect because I'm not. I can be very bad, but I'm forgiven.I don't want to hang out with Christians only on Sundays, I want to hang around them all the timeand knows im on a personal level because how do I know what they do when they not in church? I'm unique and I don't want anyone to think that I'm average.

We saints will hang out with ALL of God's people but only a few are chosen believers who will actually listen to the gospel we preach and become our friends. The gospel is the Voice of the Lord, which most of God's people hate with a passion. That's the reason we saints can't hang out with them. It's not because we don't love them, it's because they hate us.

Jeremiah 6
10: To whom shall I speak and give warning, that they may hear? Behold, their ears are closed, they cannot listen; behold, the word of the LORD is to them an object of scorn, they take no pleasure in it.

1 John 4
4: Little children, you are of God, and have overcome them; for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world.
5: They are of the world, therefore what they say is of the world, and the world listens to them.
6: We are of God. Whoever knows God listens to us, and he who is not of God does not listen to us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error.

God's chosen believers listen to the gospel that we saints preach to them.

Are you a chosen believer who will listen to My Voice or are you an unbeliever who rejects Me?


2 Corinthians 3;
14: But their minds were hardened; for to this day, when they read the old covenant, that same veil remains unlifted, because only through Christ is it taken away.
15: Yes, to this day whenever Moses is read a veil lies over their minds;
16: but when a man turns to the Lord the veil is removed.
17: Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
18: And we all, with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord, are being changed into his likeness from one degree of glory to another; for this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit.

Does anyone listen to you?

There are at least 1500 believers here in Campbell who have heard me preach the gospel to them and thanked me sharing with them. Many of them have become very close friends of mine who spend a lot of time listening to God's voice teach them about the future.

It's very difficult for believers to get close to me in these internet forums because they can't see the body language which is a very important part of listening to God. The body is just as attracting to a listener as the information being spoken by the body. If the body language doesn't jive with the spoken language, people don't trust the message.

Basically your suggestibility is hampered by the internet?

God's believers are hampered by hearing the Truth through my written testimonies that I share in forums like this one. Bodily testimonies are just as important as verbal or written languages.
Truth_seeker
Posts: 1,811
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7/24/2014 7:20:21 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
yea..it's sad to see fellow Christians divided because of little things like doctrine. How can we be a witness for Christ if we're always fighting over something? How can we be united in love and share the gospel like we supposed to when drama goes on? The Bible tells us to encourage and help one another and bear each other's burdens. That's why i don't really want to go to church anymore because it's drama, but i'm still friends with the people there, i just don't go to church.
Truth_seeker
Posts: 1,811
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7/24/2014 7:31:18 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
On a personal level, i only know like 2-3 Christians who never had a problem with me, they showed me love and support despite my mistakes, they encouraged me, they are there for me to help me up, that's it. The rest either ridiculed me or left me.
annanicole
Posts: 19,787
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7/24/2014 10:45:23 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/21/2014 8:01:12 AM, celestialtorahteacher wrote:
ehhhh...who needs to serve Paul's ideas and this phony "Church" fellowship ideology that cannot be true of Jesus Christ the Jew living in a Jewish community with no churches but synagogues and temple? This church business is all Gentile overlay of Christ consciousness and duty which is not to fellow Christians but to all those in need. Church fellowship is just too akin to rock concert group mass mind hypnosis and hysteria to be real because take away the group and what do you have? An individual who can only confront God as an individual to be authentic spiritual consciousness. Mass mind is false as history tell us over and over again.

I am a prophesy bearer and recognized man of God who has had tea with the Archbishop of the Holy Land Dioceses and is friends with recognized religious leaders in the Holy Land and America and I tell you ....

Hell, I have friends who are dope dealers. "Having tea" with them hardly proves anything, and certainly is not any part of a claim of credibility.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
sovereigngracereigns
Posts: 585
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7/24/2014 2:27:51 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/24/2014 7:20:21 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
yea..it's sad to see fellow Christians divided because of little things like doctrine. How can we be a witness for Christ if we're always fighting over something? How can we be united in love and share the gospel like we supposed to when drama goes on? The Bible tells us to encourage and help one another and bear each other's burdens. That's why i don't really want to go to church anymore because it's drama, but i'm still friends with the people there, i just don't go to church.

See, that's the problem.

You think doctrine is a "little thing"!

Look at what Christ said in John 7:14-18 :

14 Now about the middle of the feast Jesus went up into the temple and taught. 15 And the Jews marveled, saying, "How does this Man know letters, having never studied?"

16 Jesus answered them and said, "My doctrine is not Mine, but His who sent Me. 17 If anyone wills to do His will, he shall know concerning the doctrine, whether it is from God or whether I speak on My own authority. 18 He who speaks from himself seeks his own glory; but He who seeks the glory of the One who sent Him is true, and no unrighteousness is in Him.


So the doctrine of Holy Scripture is of vital importance.
It's the doctrine of God! It's the doctrine of Christ himself!
You're not even a "believer" if you don't believe the doctrine of Scripture!
If you're not faithful to Christ's doctrine, then you are not faithful to Christ.

Look at 2 John 1:9-11.The Apostle says:

9 Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into your house nor greet him; 11 for he who greets him shares in his evil deeds.

Do you see how important doctrine is?

If you want to know Christ, and "abide in him", the stop making things up as you go, and start learning the doctrine of Christ.
annanicole
Posts: 19,787
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7/24/2014 2:48:52 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/24/2014 2:27:51 PM, sovereigngracereigns wrote:
At 7/24/2014 7:20:21 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
yea..it's sad to see fellow Christians divided because of little things like doctrine. How can we be a witness for Christ if we're always fighting over something? How can we be united in love and share the gospel like we supposed to when drama goes on? The Bible tells us to encourage and help one another and bear each other's burdens. That's why i don't really want to go to church anymore because it's drama, but i'm still friends with the people there, i just don't go to church.

See, that's the problem.

You think doctrine is a "little thing"!

Look at what Christ said in John 7:14-18 :

14 Now about the middle of the feast Jesus went up into the temple and taught. 15 And the Jews marveled, saying, "How does this Man know letters, having never studied?"

16 Jesus answered them and said, "My doctrine is not Mine, but His who sent Me. 17 If anyone wills to do His will, he shall know concerning the doctrine, whether it is from God or whether I speak on My own authority. 18 He who speaks from himself seeks his own glory; but He who seeks the glory of the One who sent Him is true, and no unrighteousness is in Him.


So the doctrine of Holy Scripture is of vital importance.
It's the doctrine of God! It's the doctrine of Christ himself!
You're not even a "believer" if you don't believe the doctrine of Scripture!
If you're not faithful to Christ's doctrine, then you are not faithful to Christ.

Look at 2 John 1:9-11.The Apostle says:

9 Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into your house nor greet him; 11 for he who greets him shares in his evil deeds.

Do you see how important doctrine is?

If you want to know Christ, and "abide in him", the stop making things up as you go, and start learning the doctrine of Christ.

You are correct as far as the importance of doctrine, but from most of what I've seen, your own doctrine is indefensible. Thus, when you say, "Look for a sound church", one must wonder what sort of a church that is. How is it organized? What name does it wear? When does it worship? HOW does it worship? What does it teach others?
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
annanicole
Posts: 19,787
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7/24/2014 2:52:20 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/21/2014 8:55:00 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 7/21/2014 8:32:44 AM, TrueScotsman wrote:
At 7/21/2014 8:19:33 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
It's hard to fellowship with people when you know that they'll get on you for your beliefs when you actually studied the Bible and the more you show it to them, the more they get offended. That's why it's hard for me to open up to my own people...

What kind of doctrinal differences do people normally dispute with you about?

It varies, but it touches subjects like the Garden of Eden, tree of life, and knowledge of good and evil, and the serpent (believe it's figurative), long hair being a sin or not, Lucifer being the devil (i don't believe Lucifer is the devil), i don't believe that tithing is applicable today (unless it's out of love), divorce is not a sin, pre-marital sex is not a sin (although i do believe that waiting until marriage is the best choice), etc.

Tithing is applicable today for Jews - and that's the only folks for whom it was ever applicable. As far as the NT church is concerned, tithing has nothing to do with anything.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."