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banker
Posts: 1,370
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2/28/2010 7:51:56 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Before stating my rational we have to define the definition of devine and why its should effect our code of justice.? The definition of devine that we all agree on ,is the intelactual source.!! This is agreed by all muslim christian,budhist,falon gong jewish etc.Also we need to agree how the devine ,is effecting. Or should be effecting our judgment and system of justice.Just how the world synergisticly designed by rules ..! Otherwise it would be able to exist.(For example if the distamce of world from the sun ,would be changed we would not be able to exist...!) So is everything else limited to rules and bound be them to be able to exist..! Like chemistry,madical,finance,art etc.World and its system designed to be fonctioning by rules. The rules are what is making the world function and prosper,in a natrual eviroment.!That's also the case with us we are to prosper by the rules. The inteligant source designed for us to exist in and to prosper with..! This rules is natrual and desined to be fair and just..!
the most important source for muslim Arabs:

"And thereafter We [Allah] said to the Children of Israel: 'Dwell securely in the Promised Land. And when the last warning will come to pass, we will gather you together in a mingled crowd'.".

- Qur'an 17:104 -

Any sincere muslim must recognize the Land they call "Palestine" as the Jewish Homeland, according to the book considered by muslims to be the most sacred word and Allah's ultimate revelation.

Ibn Khaldun, one of the most creditable
Puck
Posts: 6,457
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2/28/2010 7:57:14 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Goldilocks =/= god. Sorry. If we didn't exist we simply wouldn't exist ... The universe doesn't care if you die, live, never lived.
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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2/28/2010 7:58:32 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Also, intellectual source of what?
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
Harlan
Posts: 1,880
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2/28/2010 8:13:48 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/28/2010 7:51:56 PM, banker wrote:
Before I state my rationale, we must define "divine" and explain why it should affect our code of justice. The definition of "divine" that we all agree on is the intellectual source. This is agreed upon by all Muslims, Christians, Buddhists, Falun-Gong-practitioners, Jews, etc. Also, we need to agree on how the divine is affecting, or should be affecting, our judgement and system of justice. Just how the world is synergistically designed by rules! Otherwise, it would [not] be able to exist (for example, if the distance of the world from the sun would be changed, we would not be able to exist!) So is every thing else limited to rules and bound by them to be able to exist. Like chemistry, medicine, finance, art, etc. The world and its system are designed to be functioning by rules. The rules are what is making the world function and prosper in a natural environment. That's also the case with us; we are to prosper by the rules. The intelligent source designed for us to exist in and to prosper with. These rules are natural and designed to be fair and just. [translated]

If this means what I think it means, you are suggesting that religious codes be implemented into our justice system. Is this right?

Your "rules of divinity" are based on superstition and have no grounding in reality. Following them on an individual level is one thing, but forcing other people to follow them is another. The moral ideas of many religions are good ones, but they should be enforced simply because they are generally accepted morals, not because god ordained it so.
banker
Posts: 1,370
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3/1/2010 12:29:03 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
negating the argument that we are not naturally bound to laws and rules and this world is coincidental..By contrast, to make an point for what is in fact a fraudulent hoax, one must use talent, and plenty of sophistication and remain beholden to unnatural protection of what is really an illogical position.then despite the efforts of those talented fraudulent individuals, the hoax could easily be refuted and nullified, by humanities natural pursuit of the truth..!!coincidence is the devine's way to stay anonymous..!!this fraudulent argument (despite it being made by the most powerful groups controlling the media and law and education,and other secular institutions) did not succeed to quench, our thirst for spiritual satisfaction humanity always clings to..!!moreover, as they themselves design anything dependent on success, they begin on the same process they deny was used to create this..!! as you go to any secular institution for example a building department, controlled by a secular government. even as they will argue that the world was created by circumstance,however they will not allow you to build a city by circumstance..!! quite the contrary..!! they will explain that a sound city , must be carefully planed and designed..!!in addition the same people who argue that the world was not created by a plan and not governed by rules would never feel secured to live in a city with no police and no justice and no rules...!!if they need a car they will understand, that its illogical to wait it should create itself. however some still argue that this is what happened to our world..!!many in our world explore areas like past life memory..!! as I am not qualified, to use this as a credible point. it proves a quest for spiritual connection..!!if you make a search on obscure subject like aura its amazing how much some build on it..!!http://www.google.com... most who fall into obscure new age, spiritual connections are the very same who fall away from their base,by those fraudulent sophisticated groups..!!all showing you: that not only is it natural and right and just, to believe and abide by the rules of Divine..!! the very ones who argue against it, cant live and even do not intent to live, by their false argument...!!
the most important source for muslim Arabs:

"And thereafter We [Allah] said to the Children of Israel: 'Dwell securely in the Promised Land. And when the last warning will come to pass, we will gather you together in a mingled crowd'.".

- Qur'an 17:104 -

Any sincere muslim must recognize the Land they call "Palestine" as the Jewish Homeland, according to the book considered by muslims to be the most sacred word and Allah's ultimate revelation.

Ibn Khaldun, one of the most creditable
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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3/1/2010 12:29:06 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
Jesus Christ man, lay off the sauce! Think of your liver! Your precious brain cell!
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
DATCMOTO
Posts: 6,160
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3/1/2010 3:20:33 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/28/2010 7:51:56 PM, banker wrote:
Before stating my rational we have to define the definition of devine and why its should effect our code of justice.? The definition of devine that we all agree on ,is the intelactual source.!! This is agreed by all muslim christian,budhist,falon gong jewish etc.Also we need to agree how the devine ,is effecting. Or should be effecting our judgment and system of justice.Just how the world synergisticly designed by rules ..! Otherwise it would be able to exist.(For example if the distamce of world from the sun ,would be changed we would not be able to exist...!) So is everything else limited to rules and bound be them to be able to exist..! Like chemistry,madical,finance,art etc.World and its system designed to be fonctioning by rules. The rules are what is making the world function and prosper,in a natrual eviroment.!That's also the case with us we are to prosper by the rules. The inteligant source designed for us to exist in and to prosper with..! This rules is natrual and desined to be fair and just..!

Use the spellcheck or leave.
The Cross.. the Cross.
banker
Posts: 1,370
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3/1/2010 5:41:40 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Dotc you sound too strict
the most important source for muslim Arabs:

"And thereafter We [Allah] said to the Children of Israel: 'Dwell securely in the Promised Land. And when the last warning will come to pass, we will gather you together in a mingled crowd'.".

- Qur'an 17:104 -

Any sincere muslim must recognize the Land they call "Palestine" as the Jewish Homeland, according to the book considered by muslims to be the most sacred word and Allah's ultimate revelation.

Ibn Khaldun, one of the most creditable
KafkianRoach
Posts: 20
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3/2/2010 1:18:27 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
You also should learn how to properly paragraph, so it's more easy to communicate what your saying Because none of that, made any sense.[/ my two cents]
DATCMOTO
Posts: 6,160
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3/2/2010 3:45:52 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/1/2010 5:41:40 PM, banker wrote:
Dotc you sound too strict

Doo Ai reeli? wel boo-who phor ewe!
The Cross.. the Cross.
tkubok
Posts: 5,044
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3/2/2010 11:37:05 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/1/2010 3:20:33 AM, DATCMOTO wrote:
At 2/28/2010 7:51:56 PM, banker wrote:
Before stating my rational we have to define the definition of devine and why its should effect our code of justice.? The definition of devine that we all agree on ,is the intelactual source.!! This is agreed by all muslim christian,budhist,falon gong jewish etc.Also we need to agree how the devine ,is effecting. Or should be effecting our judgment and system of justice.Just how the world synergisticly designed by rules ..! Otherwise it would be able to exist.(For example if the distamce of world from the sun ,would be changed we would not be able to exist...!) So is everything else limited to rules and bound be them to be able to exist..! Like chemistry,madical,finance,art etc.World and its system designed to be fonctioning by rules. The rules are what is making the world function and prosper,in a natrual eviroment.!That's also the case with us we are to prosper by the rules. The inteligant source designed for us to exist in and to prosper with..! This rules is natrual and desined to be fair and just..!

Use the spellcheck or leave.

For the first time, Datcmoto, i agree with you.
InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
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3/2/2010 11:39:38 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/2/2010 3:45:52 AM, DATCMOTO wrote:
At 3/1/2010 5:41:40 PM, banker wrote:
Dotc you sound too strict

Doo Ai reeli? wel boo-who phor ewe!

Win.
mattrodstrom
Posts: 12,028
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3/2/2010 11:50:56 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/2/2010 3:45:52 AM, DATCMOTO wrote:
At 3/1/2010 5:41:40 PM, banker wrote:
Dotc you sound too strict

Doo Ai reeli? wel boo-who phor ewe!

what would Jesus do DATCMOTO??

somehow I can't see him mocking banker quite like this...
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
Freeman
Posts: 1,239
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3/2/2010 11:51:07 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/28/2010 7:51:56 PM, banker wrote:
Before stating my rational we have to define the definition of devine and why its should effect our code of justice.? The definition of devine that we all agree on ,is the intelactual source.!! This is agreed by all muslim christian,budhist,falon gong jewish etc.Also we need to agree how the devine ,is effecting. Or should be effecting our judgment and system of justice.Just how the world synergisticly designed by rules ..! Otherwise it would be able to exist.(For example if the distamce of world from the sun ,would be changed we would not be able to exist...!) So is everything else limited to rules and bound be them to be able to exist..! Like chemistry,madical,finance,art etc.World and its system designed to be fonctioning by rules. The rules are what is making the world function and prosper,in a natrual eviroment.!That's also the case with us we are to prosper by the rules. The inteligant source designed for us to exist in and to prosper with..! This rules is natrual and desined to be fair and just..!

Please leave and come back when you can spell. :)
Chancellor of Propaganda and Foreign Relations in the Franklin administration.

"I intend to live forever. So far, so good." -- Steven Wright
mattrodstrom
Posts: 12,028
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3/2/2010 2:03:47 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/2/2010 1:55:49 PM, Mirza wrote:
?yas ot gniyrt uoy era tahw reknaB

what would mohammed do Mirza?? would he really mock Banker in such a manner?
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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3/2/2010 2:08:11 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/2/2010 2:03:47 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:
what would mohammed do Mirza?? would he really mock Banker in such a manner?
It's not mocking. It's having humor. Banker keeps mentioning Islam in a wrong way all the time, and does not care about any refutations, so I won't take him seriously until he starts paying attention to what's being said.
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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3/2/2010 2:08:32 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/2/2010 2:03:47 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 3/2/2010 1:55:49 PM, Mirza wrote:
?yas ot gniyrt uoy era tahw reknaB

what would mohammed do Mirza?? would he really mock Banker in such a manner?

He'd smite him above the neck and smite them at the fingertip, if 008.012 is to be believed
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
mattrodstrom
Posts: 12,028
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3/2/2010 2:13:09 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/2/2010 2:08:32 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
At 3/2/2010 2:03:47 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 3/2/2010 1:55:49 PM, Mirza wrote:
?yas ot gniyrt uoy era tahw reknaB

what would mohammed do Mirza?? would he really mock Banker in such a manner?

He'd smite him above the neck and smite them at the fingertip, if 008.012 is to be believed

008.012
"I am with you: give firmness to the Believers: I will instil terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them."

Good call. watchout banker Mirza might come after you.
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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3/2/2010 2:45:41 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/2/2010 2:13:09 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 3/2/2010 2:08:32 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
At 3/2/2010 2:03:47 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 3/2/2010 1:55:49 PM, Mirza wrote:
?yas ot gniyrt uoy era tahw reknaB

what would mohammed do Mirza?? would he really mock Banker in such a manner?

He'd smite him above the neck and smite them at the fingertip, if 008.012 is to be believed

008.012
"I am with you: give firmness to the Believers: I will instil terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them."

Good call. watchout banker Mirza might come after you.
I've refuted those verses over and over again. What's your point?

[Qur'an 8:13] "This because they contended against Allah and His Messenger: If any contend against Allah and His Messenger, Allah is strict in punishment."

Whoever wages war against Muslims should be brought to justice. Can you explain the slaughter of Muslims around the world since the 1990's? Do you find it justifiable? I'm so glad there are such verses in the Qur'an to give Muslims courage to defend themselves against worthless anti-Islam people who are satisfied with their political power.
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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3/2/2010 3:02:09 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/2/2010 2:45:41 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 3/2/2010 2:13:09 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 3/2/2010 2:08:32 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
At 3/2/2010 2:03:47 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 3/2/2010 1:55:49 PM, Mirza wrote:
?yas ot gniyrt uoy era tahw reknaB

what would mohammed do Mirza?? would he really mock Banker in such a manner?

He'd smite him above the neck and smite them at the fingertip, if 008.012 is to be believed

008.012
"I am with you: give firmness to the Believers: I will instil terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them."

Good call. watchout banker Mirza might come after you.
I've refuted those verses over and over again. What's your point?

[Qur'an 8:13] "This because they contended against Allah and His Messenger: If any contend against Allah and His Messenger, Allah is strict in punishment."

Whoever wages war against Muslims should be brought to justice.
Since when does "Contend" mean only "Wages war?" Let alone aggressive war:
8:14"Thus (will it be said): "Taste ye then of the (punishment): for those who resist Allah, is the penalty of the Fire"
seems to make it pretty clear that they are talking about situations where the Muslim is the aggressor, if indeed war is what they are talking about which isn't established.

Can you explain the slaughter of Muslims around the world since the 1990's?
What the hell are you talking about?
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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3/2/2010 3:10:37 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/2/2010 3:02:09 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
8:14"Thus (will it be said): "Taste ye then of the (punishment): for those who resist Allah, is the penalty of the Fire"
seems to make it pretty clear that they are talking about situations where the Muslim is the aggressor, if indeed war is what they are talking about which isn't established.
This is not true. In no Qur'anic verse do you see Allah promoting violence on non-Muslims for no reason. Try to look for another threads where I've refuted all of these claims. This verse - 14 - speaks about Hell as punishment for those who disbelieve God.

Since I'm off to bed now, I recommend that you read what I wrote on other threads before replying. It's boring to keep repeating the same.

What the hell are you talking about?
I'm talking about the Qur'an promoting defense, giving Muslims courage, and I am satisfied with it. What happens to Muslims around the world is a catastrohpe, and Qur'an giving Muslims courage to defend themselves is a positive thing.
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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3/2/2010 3:22:00 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/2/2010 3:10:37 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 3/2/2010 3:02:09 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
8:14"Thus (will it be said): "Taste ye then of the (punishment): for those who resist Allah, is the penalty of the Fire"
seems to make it pretty clear that they are talking about situations where the Muslim is the aggressor, if indeed war is what they are talking about which isn't established.
This is not true. In no Qur'anic verse do you see Allah promoting violence on non-Muslims for no reason. Try to look for another threads where I've refuted all of these claims. This verse - 14 - speaks about Hell as punishment for those who disbelieve God.
That renders the piece an incomprehensible ramble. Taste ye "then" means is a connective phrase-- i.e. rendering "resisting god" (and Islam) connected to the "contending."

And no one on earth promotes violence on non-muslims for no reason. But this was a section of the qu'ran devoted to explaining the rules for getting spoils from war, that's a reason right there. :P

Surely a god could write better than what you have him writing.


Since I'm off to bed now, I recommend that you read what I wrote on other threads before replying.
There are thousands of threads on DDO. You've contributed to a rather small fraction of them, and there is no search function.


What the hell are you talking about?
I'm talking about the Qur'an promoting defense, giving Muslims courage, and I am satisfied with it.
Considering how my question was in regards to "Can you explain the slaughter of Muslims around the world since the 1990's?," this doesn't answer the question in a way any more coherent than your interpretation turns the phrases we've been looking at into.

What happens to Muslims around the world is a catastrohpe
And what is that?

If you were talking about Jews in the past I'd know you were talking about the Holocaust, but I don't know what you're talking about here.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
mattrodstrom
Posts: 12,028
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3/2/2010 3:34:56 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/2/2010 2:45:41 PM, Mirza wrote:

I've refuted those verses over and over again. What's your point?

[Qur'an 8:13] "This because they contended against Allah and His Messenger: If any contend against Allah and His Messenger, Allah is strict in punishment."

I read the surrounding verses and I didn't see anything to suggest that Contend meant made war against.

But rather just oppose, or act against the interests of the muslim Religion as 8:13 says:

008.013
YUSUFALI: This because they contended against Allah and His Messenger: If any contend against Allah and His Messenger, Allah is strict in punishment.
PICKTHAL: That is because they opposed Allah and His messenger. Whoso opposeth Allah and His messenger, (for him) lo! Allah is severe in punishment.
SHAKIR: This is because they acted adversely to Allah and His Messenger; and whoever acts adversely to Allah and His Messenger-- then surely Allah is severe in requiting (evil).

It doesn't say the non-believers tried to kill muslims, it says they acted adversely to the religion.

Similar to your endorsement of killing those non-believers who live in the Arabian Peninsula who might spread their non-belief. That is those who act adversely to Your/Muhammed's plans of an Islamic Theocratic State full of Sheep who don't question their quite questionable beliefs.
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
banker
Posts: 1,370
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3/2/2010 9:27:26 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Mizra I did not ignore your points about islam urging to kill infidel opressors...!

I actualy admire your honesty,unlike those fake apolagists acting as if islam is a coward religion...!

I somehow admire cowards who see kids and it makes them weak..!
I admire cowards who are not able to do things right..!
If jihad is struggling against personal evil ,its bold to hang kids who are gay..! Its all truthfull to hang gay kids like iranians do..!!
If a girl is raped its personal evil we have to hang them like iranians do...!!
But mizra some are afraid at a time of mantel weakness they will do a stupid and cruel thing like burning the holy quran cuasing some woriors to burn them alive..!!
the most important source for muslim Arabs:

"And thereafter We [Allah] said to the Children of Israel: 'Dwell securely in the Promised Land. And when the last warning will come to pass, we will gather you together in a mingled crowd'.".

- Qur'an 17:104 -

Any sincere muslim must recognize the Land they call "Palestine" as the Jewish Homeland, according to the book considered by muslims to be the most sacred word and Allah's ultimate revelation.

Ibn Khaldun, one of the most creditable
Freeman
Posts: 1,239
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3/2/2010 9:58:06 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/2/2010 9:41:38 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Mirza, don't even try to argue about islam with non-believers. It's exhausting more than anything.

The debate over religion and God must go on even if it seems like no progress is being made. No one is allowed to give up the fight until they are dead or until one side finally wins.
Chancellor of Propaganda and Foreign Relations in the Franklin administration.

"I intend to live forever. So far, so good." -- Steven Wright
popculturepooka
Posts: 7,924
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3/2/2010 10:20:02 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/2/2010 9:58:06 PM, Freeman wrote:
At 3/2/2010 9:41:38 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Mirza, don't even try to argue about islam with non-believers. It's exhausting more than anything.

The debate over religion and God must go on even if it seems like no progress is being made. No one is allowed to give up the fight until they are dead or until one side finally wins.

This is one the rare times I'm going to have to agree with Freeman.
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BLACK LIVES MATTER!