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Why i stopped arguing for God's existence

Truth_seeker
Posts: 1,811
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7/25/2014 1:16:12 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
I am now coming to realize that God cannot be proven, so I will no longer debate people on his existence. God taught me that we all have our own biased points of view and that we can either accept or reject the truth. God is the one who will show himself to whoever he pleases. Sorry, but I can't debate something that is technically metaphysical and beyond this world, it's outside of my knowledge. I will still debate the problem of evil and the Bible though.
sovereigngracereigns
Posts: 585
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7/25/2014 2:14:04 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/25/2014 1:16:12 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I am now coming to realize that God cannot be proven, so I will no longer debate people on his existence. God taught me that we all have our own biased points of view and that we can either accept or reject the truth. God is the one who will show himself to whoever he pleases. Sorry, but I can't debate something that is technically metaphysical and beyond this world, it's outside of my knowledge. I will still debate the problem of evil and the Bible though.

Well, the more you understand the Scriptures, the more you realize that debating any of it is futile.

Man's heart is so hardened against God, if he could, he'd climb up onto God's throne and just push him right off.

You can no more convince a natural man to believe on Jesus Christ than you can tell a dead man to get up and walk.
Yet, GOD has the power to raise the dead, and he has the power to give spiritual life and faith to lost sinners.

And it is the faithful, dogmatic declaration of the Gospel that is used of God's Spirit for the saving of sinners.

You seem very sincere, but frankly, you don't seem to understand that belief in the truth is supernatural.
And you don't seem to understand the importance of doctrine, but rather, you lean on your own understanding.

It is definitely wise to give up trying to prove God's existence, but when it comes down to it, you can't prove anything.
The best you can do is actually learn what the Scriptures say, and believe them, before telling others about them.

Based on your posts, which are certainly earnest and sincere, I don't think you really know much about the Scriptures.
It just sounds like a mish-mash of sentiment and half-truths, which, in the end, is of no use to anyone.

If you want to understand the Scriptures, ask God for discernment.
Ask it in faith, he'll give it to you.
God is faithful to all those who come in Christ's name, and he loves to give good gifts to his children.
James 1:5-8
"If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all liberally and without reproach, and it will be given to him.
But let him ask in faith, with no doubting, for he who doubts is like a wave of the sea driven and tossed by the wind.
For let not that man suppose that he will receive anything from the Lord; he is a double-minded man, unstable in all his ways."
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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7/25/2014 3:10:57 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/25/2014 1:16:12 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I am now coming to realize that God cannot be proven, so I will no longer debate people on his existence. God taught me that we all have our own biased points of view and that we can either accept or reject the truth. God is the one who will show himself to whoever he pleases. Sorry, but I can't debate something that is technically metaphysical and beyond this world, it's outside of my knowledge. I will still debate the problem of evil and the Bible though.

It's not really about "proving" anything. It's more about justified belief. When you people start making claims about the existence of "God", what is had or has not done, what it will do, and what things he will throw you into a eternal hell fire for..........yeah we are going to put that under some scrutiny if that is ok with you.

Also I would point out its common in cults to have some sort of belief system/leader that anyone who doesn't agree to it is because of some failing on their part, like they are just being evil and are lead by satan. It's a way to not have to ever admit your reasons are insufficient for what you trying to sell.
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
Envisage
Posts: 3,646
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7/25/2014 5:37:45 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/25/2014 1:16:12 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I am now coming to realize that God cannot be proven, so I will no longer debate people on his existence. God taught me that we all have our own biased points of view and that we can either accept or reject the truth. God is the one who will show himself to whoever he pleases. Sorry, but I can't debate something that is technically metaphysical and beyond this world, it's outside of my knowledge. I will still debate the problem of evil and the Bible though.

Why on earth do you believe something that is as you admit, unjustified, then?

It seems incredibly stupid to build your world & life around something you don't even have good reasons to accept even exists.
Composer
Posts: 5,858
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7/25/2014 6:00:34 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/25/2014 1:16:12 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
. . . . God taught me . . . .
Your evidence a literal Supernatural being taught you anything requires proofs, of which you also undoubtedly have none!

Your imagination or the imagination of others written in a book is speculation, not evidence!
popculturepooka
Posts: 7,926
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7/25/2014 9:10:26 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/25/2014 2:14:04 AM, sovereigngracereigns wrote:
At 7/25/2014 1:16:12 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I am now coming to realize that God cannot be proven, so I will no longer debate people on his existence. God taught me that we all have our own biased points of view and that we can either accept or reject the truth. God is the one who will show himself to whoever he pleases. Sorry, but I can't debate something that is technically metaphysical and beyond this world, it's outside of my knowledge. I will still debate the problem of evil and the Bible though.

Well, the more you understand the Scriptures, the more you realize that debating any of it is futile.


Tell that to all the apologists who debated in scripture (Paul, etc).

Man's heart is so hardened against God, if he could, he'd climb up onto God's throne and just push him right off.

You can no more convince a natural man to believe on Jesus Christ than you can tell a dead man to get up and walk.
Yet, GOD has the power to raise the dead, and he has the power to give spiritual life and faith to lost sinners.

And it is the faithful, dogmatic declaration of the Gospel that is used of God's Spirit for the saving of sinners.

You seem very sincere, but frankly, you don't seem to understand that belief in the truth is supernatural.
And you don't seem to understand the importance of doctrine, but rather, you lean on your own understanding.

It is definitely wise to give up trying to prove God's existence, but when it comes down to it, you can't prove anything.
The best you can do is actually learn what the Scriptures say, and believe them, before telling others about them.

Based on your posts, which are certainly earnest and sincere, I don't think you really know much about the Scriptures.
It just sounds like a mish-mash of sentiment and half-truths, which, in the end, is of no use to anyone.

If you want to understand the Scriptures, ask God for discernment.
Ask it in faith, he'll give it to you.
God is faithful to all those who come in Christ's name, and he loves to give good gifts to his children.
James 1:5-8
"If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all liberally and without reproach, and it will be given to him.
But let him ask in faith, with no doubting, for he who doubts is like a wave of the sea driven and tossed by the wind.
For let not that man suppose that he will receive anything from the Lord; he is a double-minded man, unstable in all his ways."
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
Truth_seeker
Posts: 1,811
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7/25/2014 9:34:35 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/25/2014 3:10:57 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 7/25/2014 1:16:12 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I am now coming to realize that God cannot be proven, so I will no longer debate people on his existence. God taught me that we all have our own biased points of view and that we can either accept or reject the truth. God is the one who will show himself to whoever he pleases. Sorry, but I can't debate something that is technically metaphysical and beyond this world, it's outside of my knowledge. I will still debate the problem of evil and the Bible though.

It's not really about "proving" anything. It's more about justified belief. When you people start making claims about the existence of "God", what is had or has not done, what it will do, and what things he will throw you into a eternal hell fire for..........yeah we are going to put that under some scrutiny if that is ok with you.

Also I would point out its common in cults to have some sort of belief system/leader that anyone who doesn't agree to it is because of some failing on their part, like they are just being evil and are lead by satan. It's a way to not have to ever admit your reasons are insufficient for what you trying to sell.

But i can't control what God does, i can only follow him.

As for cult leaders, God isn't a cult leader. He knows why you are evil.
irreverent_god
Posts: 1,378
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7/25/2014 5:21:32 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/25/2014 1:16:12 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I am now coming to realize that God cannot be proven, so I will no longer debate people on his existence. God taught me that we all have our own biased points of view and that we can either accept or reject the truth. God is the one who will show himself to whoever he pleases. Sorry, but I can't debate something that is technically metaphysical and beyond this world, it's outside of my knowledge. I will still debate the problem of evil and the Bible though.

The bible is one of the "problems of evil." All "holy" manuscripts are. All theology is man-made. All "holy" manuscripts are human writings of falsehood passed off to the ignorant as "higher truth."
Logic and Reason are the precursor to Justice.
Faith and zealotry are the precursor to Folly.
intellectuallyprimitive
Posts: 1,000
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7/25/2014 5:46:57 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/25/2014 1:16:12 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I am now coming to realize that God cannot be proven, so I will no longer debate people on his existence. God taught me that we all have our own biased points of view and that we can either accept or reject the truth. God is the one who will show himself to whoever he pleases. Sorry, but I can't debate something that is technically metaphysical and beyond this world, it's outside of my knowledge. I will still debate the problem of evil and the Bible though.

If god can't be proven, then why believe in god? What does god do for you?
sovereigngracereigns
Posts: 585
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7/25/2014 5:51:45 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/25/2014 9:10:26 AM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 7/25/2014 2:14:04 AM, sovereigngracereigns wrote:
At 7/25/2014 1:16:12 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I am now coming to realize that God cannot be proven, so I will no longer debate people on his existence. God taught me that we all have our own biased points of view and that we can either accept or reject the truth. God is the one who will show himself to whoever he pleases. Sorry, but I can't debate something that is technically metaphysical and beyond this world, it's outside of my knowledge. I will still debate the problem of evil and the Bible though.

Well, the more you understand the Scriptures, the more you realize that debating any of it is futile.


Tell that to all the apologists who debated in scripture (Paul, etc).

Man's heart is so hardened against God, if he could, he'd climb up onto God's throne and just push him right off.

You can no more convince a natural man to believe on Jesus Christ than you can tell a dead man to get up and walk.
Yet, GOD has the power to raise the dead, and he has the power to give spiritual life and faith to lost sinners.

And it is the faithful, dogmatic declaration of the Gospel that is used of God's Spirit for the saving of sinners.

You seem very sincere, but frankly, you don't seem to understand that belief in the truth is supernatural.
And you don't seem to understand the importance of doctrine, but rather, you lean on your own understanding.

It is definitely wise to give up trying to prove God's existence, but when it comes down to it, you can't prove anything.
The best you can do is actually learn what the Scriptures say, and believe them, before telling others about them.

Based on your posts, which are certainly earnest and sincere, I don't think you really know much about the Scriptures.
It just sounds like a mish-mash of sentiment and half-truths, which, in the end, is of no use to anyone.

If you want to understand the Scriptures, ask God for discernment.
Ask it in faith, he'll give it to you.
God is faithful to all those who come in Christ's name, and he loves to give good gifts to his children.
James 1:5-8
"If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all liberally and without reproach, and it will be given to him.
But let him ask in faith, with no doubting, for he who doubts is like a wave of the sea driven and tossed by the wind.
For let not that man suppose that he will receive anything from the Lord; he is a double-minded man, unstable in all his ways."


Yes, it's true that Paul "reasoned in the synagogue with both Jews and God-fearing Greeks, as well as in the marketplace day by day with those who happened to be there." (Acts 7:17)
But Paul, and the other apostles, did not debate what the Scriptures say. They dogmatically and boldly declared what the Scriptures say.

They didn't discuss or engage in friendly dialogue about these things either.
They said: "Thus saith the Lord God Almighty."

And they most certainly did not try to build a case for their faith.
They said God himself revealed it to them.

You are reading something into the text that is not there.
The apostles did not engage in debate.
Double_R
Posts: 4,886
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7/25/2014 8:30:53 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/25/2014 1:16:12 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I am now coming to realize that God cannot be proven, so I will no longer debate people on his existence. God taught me that we all have our own biased points of view and that we can either accept or reject the truth. God is the one who will show himself to whoever he pleases. Sorry, but I can't debate something that is technically metaphysical and beyond this world, it's outside of my knowledge. I will still debate the problem of evil and the Bible though.

Debating the existence of God is not about proving whether he does or does not exist, its about justifying your belief regarding the question of whether he exists. There are reasons we believe what we do. The more you understand about belief itself, logic, reason, and the overall way the human brain works, the better position you will be in to understand what you should believe. That's what you should be striving for. But it sounds like you've elected to take the lazy way out. That sounds more like an emotional decision, not one that is focused on understanding truth.
Beastt
Posts: 5,135
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7/25/2014 8:54:51 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/25/2014 9:34:35 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 7/25/2014 3:10:57 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 7/25/2014 1:16:12 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I am now coming to realize that God cannot be proven, so I will no longer debate people on his existence. God taught me that we all have our own biased points of view and that we can either accept or reject the truth. God is the one who will show himself to whoever he pleases. Sorry, but I can't debate something that is technically metaphysical and beyond this world, it's outside of my knowledge. I will still debate the problem of evil and the Bible though.

It's not really about "proving" anything. It's more about justified belief. When you people start making claims about the existence of "God", what is had or has not done, what it will do, and what things he will throw you into a eternal hell fire for..........yeah we are going to put that under some scrutiny if that is ok with you.

Also I would point out its common in cults to have some sort of belief system/leader that anyone who doesn't agree to it is because of some failing on their part, like they are just being evil and are lead by satan. It's a way to not have to ever admit your reasons are insufficient for what you trying to sell.

But i can't control what God does, i can only follow him.
You can't follow anything for which you have no evidence. You can follow a book, but there is no evidence that God is linked to any book, in any manner.

As for cult leaders, God isn't a cult leader. He knows why you are evil.
How is belief in your God and religion, different from belief in a cult?
"If we believe absurdities we shall commit atrocities." -- Voltaire
Truth_seeker
Posts: 1,811
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7/26/2014 8:58:39 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/25/2014 8:30:53 PM, Double_R wrote:
At 7/25/2014 1:16:12 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I am now coming to realize that God cannot be proven, so I will no longer debate people on his existence. God taught me that we all have our own biased points of view and that we can either accept or reject the truth. God is the one who will show himself to whoever he pleases. Sorry, but I can't debate something that is technically metaphysical and beyond this world, it's outside of my knowledge. I will still debate the problem of evil and the Bible though.

Debating the existence of God is not about proving whether he does or does not exist, its about justifying your belief regarding the question of whether he exists. There are reasons we believe what we do. The more you understand about belief itself, logic, reason, and the overall way the human brain works, the better position you will be in to understand what you should believe. That's what you should be striving for. But it sounds like you've elected to take the lazy way out. That sounds more like an emotional decision, not one that is focused on understanding truth.

God's truth is entirely distinct from our truth.
Double_R
Posts: 4,886
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7/26/2014 9:08:18 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 7/26/2014 8:58:39 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 7/25/2014 8:30:53 PM, Double_R wrote:
At 7/25/2014 1:16:12 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I am now coming to realize that God cannot be proven, so I will no longer debate people on his existence. God taught me that we all have our own biased points of view and that we can either accept or reject the truth. God is the one who will show himself to whoever he pleases. Sorry, but I can't debate something that is technically metaphysical and beyond this world, it's outside of my knowledge. I will still debate the problem of evil and the Bible though.

Debating the existence of God is not about proving whether he does or does not exist, its about justifying your belief regarding the question of whether he exists. There are reasons we believe what we do. The more you understand about belief itself, logic, reason, and the overall way the human brain works, the better position you will be in to understand what you should believe. That's what you should be striving for. But it sounds like you've elected to take the lazy way out. That sounds more like an emotional decision, not one that is focused on understanding truth.

God's truth is entirely distinct from our truth.

Then God's truth is unattainable for you, so why don't you just worry about our truth which BTW is exactly where your statement just came from.