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Jews persecuting christians

bulproof
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8/14/2014 8:54:05 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Is there any exbiblical historical mention of this claim made by Paul?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
celestialtorahteacher
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8/14/2014 9:12:13 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
They certainly persecuted the historical "Jesus", Yeishu ben Pantera. Stoned him and his five disciples to death and hung him on a tree as per Jewish law for blasphemy. But these were Jews and they didn't call themselves "Christians" then or have any ideas about "churches" either. That all came later when the Church men got their hands on probably the missing Sayings Gospel ("Q") and the Gospel of Thomas. Then it was cut-n-paste Old Testament verses to "flesh" out Jesus' Story. But the amazing part is that it didn't matter what the authors of Scriptures thought they were writing, God has THEIR hand in it as it still contains the hidden astrological Celestial Torah information to be mined out of its Judah priesthood and Pauline churchmen gross matrixes.
bulproof
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8/14/2014 9:27:35 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/14/2014 9:12:13 PM, celestialtorahteacher wrote:
They certainly persecuted the historical "Jesus", Yeishu ben Pantera. Stoned him and his five disciples to death and hung him on a tree as per Jewish law for blasphemy. But these were Jews and they didn't call themselves "Christians" then or have any ideas about "churches" either. That all came later when the Church men got their hands on probably the missing Sayings Gospel ("Q") and the Gospel of Thomas. Then it was cut-n-paste Old Testament verses to "flesh" out Jesus' Story. But the amazing part is that it didn't matter what the authors of Scriptures thought they were writing, God has THEIR hand in it as it still contains the hidden astrological Celestial Torah information to be mined out of its Judah priesthood and Pauline churchmen gross matrixes.

So your answer is no.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
celestialtorahteacher
Posts: 1,369
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8/14/2014 11:39:17 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Yes it is no to stalking trolls. Go bother another forum. You are utterly boring here as we've heard all your little boy slanders too many times to want to read any more bullsnarky idiocy on parade every day from you. Grow up, mean little boy.
annanicole
Posts: 19,788
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8/15/2014 12:08:15 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/14/2014 8:54:05 PM, bulproof wrote:
Is there any exbiblical historical mention of this claim made by Paul?

Do you mean Jews or Romans? There is actually quite a bit of evidence of Romans persecuting Christians. Tacitus says that Christianity was "checked for awhile", but doesn't say by whom. If you are actually talking about Jews, you are only talking about the period from about AD 40 or 45 up until AD 64, and the "persecution" was theological as well as occasionally physical. After AD 64, it was mostly physical.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
DPMartin
Posts: 1,096
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8/15/2014 8:31:20 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/14/2014 8:54:05 PM, bulproof wrote:
Is there any exbiblical historical mention of this claim made by Paul?

Not sure if there is any documentation outside of Paul"s writings on whether Jews were persecuting early Christians. The place to ask maybe a Catholic forum website, it"s probably the best chance to find, or at least find out about any documentation on that subject, that wasn"t written by Paul.
The_Immortal_Emris
Posts: 474
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8/15/2014 8:37:22 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/15/2014 8:31:20 AM, DPMartin wrote:
At 8/14/2014 8:54:05 PM, bulproof wrote:
Is there any exbiblical historical mention of this claim made by Paul?

Not sure if there is any documentation outside of Paul"s writings on whether Jews were persecuting early Christians. The place to ask maybe a Catholic forum website, it"s probably the best chance to find, or at least find out about any documentation on that subject, that wasn"t written by Paul.

And many biblical scholars know Paul cannot be trusted.
bulproof
Posts: 25,274
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8/15/2014 8:48:42 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/15/2014 12:08:15 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 8/14/2014 8:54:05 PM, bulproof wrote:
Is there any exbiblical historical mention of this claim made by Paul?

Do you mean Jews or Romans? There is actually quite a bit of evidence of Romans persecuting Christians. Tacitus says that Christianity was "checked for awhile", but doesn't say by whom. If you are actually talking about Jews, you are only talking about the period from about AD 40 or 45 up until AD 64, and the "persecution" was theological as well as occasionally physical. After AD 64, it was mostly physical.
How could anybody with even a modicum of intellect conflate Jews wit Romans?

Was Saul a persecutor of Christians? As a Pharisee? Show me some extrabiblical evidence that such persecution ever existed.
There doesn't appear to be any historical evidence of such persecution.

Is such persecution mentioned in any gospel?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
DPMartin
Posts: 1,096
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8/15/2014 8:55:51 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/15/2014 8:37:22 AM, The_Immortal_Emris wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:31:20 AM, DPMartin wrote:
At 8/14/2014 8:54:05 PM, bulproof wrote:
Is there any exbiblical historical mention of this claim made by Paul?

Not sure if there is any documentation outside of Paul"s writings on whether Jews were persecuting early Christians. The place to ask maybe a Catholic forum website, it"s probably the best chance to find, or at least find out about any documentation on that subject, that wasn"t written by Paul.

And many biblical scholars know Paul cannot be trusted.

What"s that got to do with the simple question of whether there is documentation other than the Bible on Jewish persecution or at least their efforts to get gentile authorities to persecute Christians.
The_Immortal_Emris
Posts: 474
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8/15/2014 8:57:53 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/15/2014 8:55:51 AM, DPMartin wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:37:22 AM, The_Immortal_Emris wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:31:20 AM, DPMartin wrote:
At 8/14/2014 8:54:05 PM, bulproof wrote:
Is there any exbiblical historical mention of this claim made by Paul?

Not sure if there is any documentation outside of Paul"s writings on whether Jews were persecuting early Christians. The place to ask maybe a Catholic forum website, it"s probably the best chance to find, or at least find out about any documentation on that subject, that wasn"t written by Paul.

And many biblical scholars know Paul cannot be trusted.

What"s that got to do with the simple question of whether there is documentation other than the Bible on Jewish persecution or at least their efforts to get gentile authorities to persecute Christians.

Because the documentation was written by Paul...as you already established.

And Paul is not a trustworthy source.

So that's what it has to do with it.
bulproof
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8/15/2014 9:03:10 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/14/2014 11:39:17 PM, celestialtorahteacher wrote:
Yes it is no to stalking trolls. Go bother another forum. You are utterly boring here as we've heard all your little boy slanders too many times to want to read any more bullsnarky idiocy on parade every day from you. Grow up, mean little boy.

MWaHHHHH, soft cok.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
bulproof
Posts: 25,274
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8/15/2014 9:06:58 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/15/2014 8:55:51 AM, DPMartin wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:37:22 AM, The_Immortal_Emris wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:31:20 AM, DPMartin wrote:
At 8/14/2014 8:54:05 PM, bulproof wrote:
Is there any exbiblical historical mention of this claim made by Paul?

Not sure if there is any documentation outside of Paul"s writings on whether Jews were persecuting early Christians. The place to ask maybe a Catholic forum website, it"s probably the best chance to find, or at least find out about any documentation on that subject, that wasn"t written by Paul.

And many biblical scholars know Paul cannot be trusted.

What"s that got to do with the simple question of whether there is documentation other than the Bible on Jewish persecution or at least their efforts to get gentile authorities to persecute Christians.

Just provide some extra biblical evidence.

There is none. Is there?

Saul's story is a LIE.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
annanicole
Posts: 19,788
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8/15/2014 9:22:42 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/15/2014 8:48:42 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/15/2014 12:08:15 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 8/14/2014 8:54:05 PM, bulproof wrote:
Is there any exbiblical historical mention of this claim made by Paul?

Do you mean Jews or Romans? There is actually quite a bit of evidence of Romans persecuting Christians. Tacitus says that Christianity was "checked for awhile", but doesn't say by whom. If you are actually talking about Jews, you are only talking about the period from about AD 40 or 45 up until AD 64, and the "persecution" was theological as well as occasionally physical. After AD 64, it was mostly physical.

How could anybody with even a modicum of intellect conflate Jews wit Romans?

I didn't. I asked you if you did.

Was Saul a persecutor of Christians? As a Pharisee? Show me some extrabiblical evidence that such persecution ever existed.

There is no extrabiblical record of Paul persecuting Christians.

There doesn't appear to be any historical evidence of such persecution.

Is such persecution mentioned in any gospel?

There were not Christians during the time-period covered by the gospels; therefore, persecution of a non-entity would be a little unlikely. WTF kinda question is that? There were no Christians until the day of Pentecost in Acts 2, and they weren't called Christians until Acts 11.

You are evidently speaking of a time-period between about AD 36-37 and AD 64, about 25 years. Josephus, of course, records the death of James, brother of Jesus, at the hands of the high priest. There is also a record of a Jewish prayer from somewhere around AD 80 or 90 invoking a curse upon Christians. How much earlier such a prayer existed, no one knows.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
bulproof
Posts: 25,274
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8/15/2014 9:31:19 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/15/2014 9:22:42 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:48:42 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/15/2014 12:08:15 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 8/14/2014 8:54:05 PM, bulproof wrote:
Is there any exbiblical historical mention of this claim made by Paul?

Do you mean Jews or Romans? There is actually quite a bit of evidence of Romans persecuting Christians. Tacitus says that Christianity was "checked for awhile", but doesn't say by whom. If you are actually talking about Jews, you are only talking about the period from about AD 40 or 45 up until AD 64, and the "persecution" was theological as well as occasionally physical. After AD 64, it was mostly physical.

How could anybody with even a modicum of intellect conflate Jews wit Romans?

I didn't. I asked you if you did.

Was Saul a persecutor of Christians? As a Pharisee? Show me some extrabiblical evidence that such persecution ever existed.

There is no extrabiblical record of Paul persecuting Christians.

There doesn't appear to be any historical evidence of such persecution.

Is such persecution mentioned in any gospel?

There were not Christians during the time-period covered by the gospels; therefore, persecution of a non-entity would be a little unlikely. WTF kinda question is that? There were no Christians until the day of Pentecost in Acts 2, and they weren't called Christians until Acts 11.

You are evidently speaking of a time-period between about AD 36-37 and AD 64, about 25 years. Josephus, of course, records the death of James, brother of Jesus, at the hands of the high priest. There is also a record of a Jewish prayer from somewhere around AD 80 or 90 invoking a curse upon Christians. How much earlier such a prayer existed, no one knows.

You don't seem to understand Annie.

Is there any recorded history of the Jews persecuting Christians from 30AD-300AD?

It is a simple question. Do you have an answer that doesn't involve your bible?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
annanicole
Posts: 19,788
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8/15/2014 9:50:07 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/15/2014 9:31:19 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/15/2014 9:22:42 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:48:42 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/15/2014 12:08:15 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 8/14/2014 8:54:05 PM, bulproof wrote:
Is there any exbiblical historical mention of this claim made by Paul?

Do you mean Jews or Romans? There is actually quite a bit of evidence of Romans persecuting Christians. Tacitus says that Christianity was "checked for awhile", but doesn't say by whom. If you are actually talking about Jews, you are only talking about the period from about AD 40 or 45 up until AD 64, and the "persecution" was theological as well as occasionally physical. After AD 64, it was mostly physical.

How could anybody with even a modicum of intellect conflate Jews wit Romans?

I didn't. I asked you if you did.

Was Saul a persecutor of Christians? As a Pharisee? Show me some extrabiblical evidence that such persecution ever existed.

There is no extrabiblical record of Paul persecuting Christians.

There doesn't appear to be any historical evidence of such persecution.

Is such persecution mentioned in any gospel?

There were not Christians during the time-period covered by the gospels; therefore, persecution of a non-entity would be a little unlikely. WTF kinda question is that? There were no Christians until the day of Pentecost in Acts 2, and they weren't called Christians until Acts 11.

You are evidently speaking of a time-period between about AD 36-37 and AD 64, about 25 years. Josephus, of course, records the death of James, brother of Jesus, at the hands of the high priest. There is also a record of a Jewish prayer from somewhere around AD 80 or 90 invoking a curse upon Christians. How much earlier such a prayer existed, no one knows.

You don't seem to understand Annie.

Is there any recorded history of the Jews persecuting Christians from 30AD-300AD?

There is no claim that Jews persecuted Christians after about AD 64, and certainly not after AD 70. And by your question about "Jewish persecutions of Christians" in the gospels, methinks the lack of understanding is more on your end.

It is a simple question. Do you have an answer that doesn't involve your bible?

Antiquities of the Jews is not a book of the Bible. I just finished telling you that the death of James at the behest of Annas the Jewish high priest is recorded. Whether you'll view this as "persecution" is sorta up for grabs.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
kbub
Posts: 1,377
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8/15/2014 9:53:15 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/15/2014 8:48:42 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/15/2014 12:08:15 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 8/14/2014 8:54:05 PM, bulproof wrote:
Is there any exbiblical historical mention of this claim made by Paul?

Do you mean Jews or Romans? There is actually quite a bit of evidence of Romans persecuting Christians. Tacitus says that Christianity was "checked for awhile", but doesn't say by whom. If you are actually talking about Jews, you are only talking about the period from about AD 40 or 45 up until AD 64, and the "persecution" was theological as well as occasionally physical. After AD 64, it was mostly physical.
How could anybody with even a modicum of intellect conflate Jews wit Romans?


It's pretty common, actually; mainly because in the bible, both (in some interpretations) had a hand in Jesus' death.
DPMartin
Posts: 1,096
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8/15/2014 10:25:27 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/15/2014 8:57:53 AM, The_Immortal_Emris wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:55:51 AM, DPMartin wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:37:22 AM, The_Immortal_Emris wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:31:20 AM, DPMartin wrote:
At 8/14/2014 8:54:05 PM, bulproof wrote:
Is there any exbiblical historical mention of this claim made by Paul?

Not sure if there is any documentation outside of Paul"s writings on whether Jews were persecuting early Christians. The place to ask maybe a Catholic forum website, it"s probably the best chance to find, or at least find out about any documentation on that subject, that wasn"t written by Paul.

And many biblical scholars know Paul cannot be trusted.

What"s that got to do with the simple question of whether there is documentation other than the Bible on Jewish persecution or at least their efforts to get gentile authorities to persecute Christians.

Because the documentation was written by Paul...as you already established.

And Paul is not a trustworthy source.

So that's what it has to do with it.

I didn"t establish anything, which makes your perception of what is true, suspect in this conversation.

Trustworthiness is something you brought up, and wasn"t mentioned by me or the OP, so it would seem you have issues in this matter. One can see what one is looking for even if it ain"t there. The OP doesn"t state it"s reason for asking, in case you didn"t notice.

Looking for more then one cooperating witness, isn"t foolishness, even if the OP"s intentions aren"t trustworthy.

The other Apostles accepted Paul into the ministry of Grace as it was given them by Christ. I don"t see where the works through the Apostle Paul would have been so effective if it wasn"t of the Lord. The survival alone of a ministry and Gospel message amide Roman hostilities as high as more then one emperor might be sufficient evidence for some that Paul"s work is true.
DPMartin
Posts: 1,096
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8/15/2014 10:35:52 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/15/2014 9:06:58 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:55:51 AM, DPMartin wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:37:22 AM, The_Immortal_Emris wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:31:20 AM, DPMartin wrote:
At 8/14/2014 8:54:05 PM, bulproof wrote:
Is there any exbiblical historical mention of this claim made by Paul?

Not sure if there is any documentation outside of Paul"s writings on whether Jews were persecuting early Christians. The place to ask maybe a Catholic forum website, it"s probably the best chance to find, or at least find out about any documentation on that subject, that wasn"t written by Paul.

And many biblical scholars know Paul cannot be trusted.

What"s that got to do with the simple question of whether there is documentation other than the Bible on Jewish persecution or at least their efforts to get gentile authorities to persecute Christians.

Just provide some extra biblical evidence.

There is none. Is there?

Saul's story is a LIE.

The answer wasn"t for your sake, its for anyone who might have an honest interest in the subject you posted. I already know you have your head so far up your back side, you don"t even pull it out long enough to get a breath of fresh air. You prove it every time you post.
The_Immortal_Emris
Posts: 474
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8/15/2014 10:37:16 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/15/2014 10:25:27 AM, DPMartin wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:57:53 AM, The_Immortal_Emris wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:55:51 AM, DPMartin wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:37:22 AM, The_Immortal_Emris wrote:
At 8/15/2014 8:31:20 AM, DPMartin wrote:
At 8/14/2014 8:54:05 PM, bulproof wrote:
Is there any exbiblical historical mention of this claim made by Paul?

Not sure if there is any documentation outside of Paul"s writings on whether Jews were persecuting early Christians. The place to ask maybe a Catholic forum website, it"s probably the best chance to find, or at least find out about any documentation on that subject, that wasn"t written by Paul.

And many biblical scholars know Paul cannot be trusted.

What"s that got to do with the simple question of whether there is documentation other than the Bible on Jewish persecution or at least their efforts to get gentile authorities to persecute Christians.

Because the documentation was written by Paul...as you already established.

And Paul is not a trustworthy source.

So that's what it has to do with it.

I didn"t establish anything, which makes your perception of what is true, suspect in this conversation.

Trustworthiness is something you brought up, and wasn"t mentioned by me or the OP, so it would seem you have issues in this matter. One can see what one is looking for even if it ain"t there. The OP doesn"t state it"s reason for asking, in case you didn"t notice.

Looking for more then one cooperating witness, isn"t foolishness, even if the OP"s intentions aren"t trustworthy.

The other Apostles accepted Paul into the ministry of Grace as it was given them by Christ. I don"t see where the works through the Apostle Paul would have been so effective if it wasn"t of the Lord. The survival alone of a ministry and Gospel message amide Roman hostilities as high as more then one emperor might be sufficient evidence for some that Paul"s work is true.

" Not sure if there is any documentation outside of Paul"s writings on whether Jews were persecuting early Christians. "

Yeah, ya did.

" The other Apostles accepted Paul into the ministry of Grace as it was given them by Christ."

Prove it. They did no such thing. Paul never even met Jesus. There is no actual proof he met any apostle aside from Peter, and even that is suspect.

" I don"t see where the works through the Apostle Paul would have been so effective if it wasn"t of the Lord."

It wasn't effective. It was a Roman cult for about a century before it actually gained ground in the west. The eastern Coptic teaching of The Way, vastly differ from the Roman corruption of it.

Paul's teachings were not "effective" until Rome imposed them at sword-point.

"The survival alone of a ministry and Gospel message amide Roman hostilities as high as more then one emperor might be sufficient evidence for some that Paul"s work is true."

Except that ignores reality. The truth of the matter is Paul was born AFTER Jesus was dead. Likely around 5 BC.
(SOURCE: White, L. Michael (2007). From Jesus to Christianity (3rd impr. ed.). San Francisco: HarperSanFrancisco)

He didn't' convert until 30 years after the estimated death of Jesus.

"The Way" was already gaining ground in the east, and as a cult following in Rome.

Paul persecuted followers of "The Way", until he realized he could use it to grow his own political influence in the "Church".

He has written over half of the books in the New Testament. He is responsible for the perversion of "The Way".

Regardless, you're the person who opened the door on this, by saying:
"Not sure if there is any documentation outside of Paul"s writings on whether Jews were persecuting early Christians."
DPMartin
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8/15/2014 7:11:04 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
The_Immortal_Emris

Not to be dismissive but your statements don"t even jive with each other, and I"m not going to try to argue with you on what has been established through out most of the past 2000 yr"s. For example how can Paul be born in 5 BC, if He was born afer Jesus died on the Cross? Sorry don"t compute, and don"t make sense. Sounds more like the smatterings of angry rants, Paul"s this Paul"s that. To bad you feel that way about it, say what you will but over 1800 years later his work is still effective, to the point where some one like you would still have a problem with his work. If you don"t trust it, don"t, it doesn"t change anything for me.
celestialtorahteacher
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8/15/2014 9:50:18 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Let's get real here. "Paul" is not a real person but a literary creation as is "Jesus Christ". "Paul" and Pauline Christianity was created to destroy Jewish religious authority by transferring the capital of Christianity from Jerusalem to Rome. The different "Paul" authors prove that Churchmen used ruses to write the New Testament letters and probably the Gospels themselves following the missing "Q" and Sayings Gospel that formed the original text the Churchmen authors used. Plus of course, the Old Testament verses to create Jesus's background and activity.

The real historical "Jesus" is Yeishu ben Pantera and he probably lived a hundred years before the New Testament Story of Jesus Christ was written. This is why Paul could discover fully functioning Christian churches established in Rome so early after Jesus Christ's supposed crucifixion date.

A 100 years for the Christ the Magician legend to grow and texts written about him that were used to create the fictional Jesus Christ of the Gospels. Does that mean its all worthless lies? No, because God uses human authors as THEY will regardless of what the authors themselves think and believe they are writing. The whole Old Testament is filled with lies palmed off as history of God's people but still, God used it to evolve Christian consciousness to the point of the Gospels which contain most excellent spiritual information. (forget Paul's Letters as anti-Christ propaganda as Paul's theology counters Jesus' on many important points.)

One of the reasons God has now given the world Celestial Torah Christianity information is precisely due to the fact both the Old Testament and the New Testament are totally untrustworthy documentation of God's will via the Messiah/
Christ Message to humankind.
bulproof
Posts: 25,274
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8/15/2014 10:11:55 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
So we have no evidence of the claim that the Jews persecuted christians.

Paul claims to have been a leading member of that team of persecutors.

What does that do for Paul's credibility?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin