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Christian claims about God hell forgiveness

Illegalcombatant
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8/23/2014 4:10:46 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
I challenge some christian claims on hell, hell being an eternal fire torment and all that good stuff.

The claims being....

1) You deserve hell

2) Jesus being punished in your place is the only way to avoid hell
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1) You deserve hell

I think most people have things they wouldn't mind re doing if they have the chance cause they felt they failed in some moral aspect.

But to go from that to well therefore you deserved hell is a huge jump. It's not like you went from a slap on the wrist to a kick in the balls and everything in between the claim goes straight to the worst possible punishment humans could come up with.

Just saying well you sinned against God doesn't establish hell as deserve. As such it's on its own a baseless and I find dubious assertion.

2) Jesus being punished in your place is the only way to avoid hell

The thing that ticks me off here is how arbitrary this claim is within the context of other claims being made about God. People are very non restrictive when it comes to what God can or can't do.

Sure God can allow baby cancer. It requires no effort on his part to heal baby cancer but you know he chooses not to.

Sure God can allow that earthquake that causes the building to fall that breaks a few spines and crushes a few heads.

Sure he can create a better world where animals don't survive by eating each other again requires no effort on his part but he chooses not too.

Sure he can create an infinite amount of universes

But then suddenly out of no where they put God in a box, no no no, he can't just forgive sin, no he just can't. The all mighty, the all powerful, the God who can do what he wants, the sovereign the guy who answers to no one who is accountable to nobody can't just forgive because he chooses too, no that just isn't an option to him.

I am not impressed by arbitrary claims about God in order to justify a prior religious belief.

But but but, God has to punish sin, it would be unjust of God to just forgive........really you really want to try that ? Well then just bring it !!!
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
neutral
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8/23/2014 4:16:26 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
WOuldn't it be nice if EVEN once, an atheist began a critique about Christian claims by ACTUALLY CITING THE CHRISTIAN CLAIMS? You known:

http://www.vatican.va...

There is no point in rebutting a silly straw man that takes loose bits of common doctrine and spins them into an utter absurdity.

The real question, never answered by atheists?

You don't believe in God or anything that is claimed of God, indeed dismiss it as abject stupidity, and yet you turn around and are wounded by being 'threatened' by something you don't even believe in?

How is that logical? And what do you think the consequences are of spending your entire life acting like a capricious jerk? Against those who do not? The idea of consequences miffs atheists does it?
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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8/23/2014 4:24:01 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 4:16:26 AM, neutral wrote:
WOuldn't it be nice if EVEN once, an atheist began a critique about Christian claims by ACTUALLY CITING THE CHRISTIAN CLAIMS? You known:

http://www.vatican.va...

There is no point in rebutting a silly straw man that takes loose bits of common doctrine and spins them into an utter absurdity.

The real question, never answered by atheists?

You don't believe in God or anything that is claimed of God, indeed dismiss it as abject stupidity, and yet you turn around and are wounded by being 'threatened' by something you don't even believe in?

No no no, not this time netural. I know your standard tactic is to not address the issue then attack the person personally but f*ck you, I am not in the mood.


How is that logical? And what do you think the consequences are of spending your entire life acting like a capricious jerk? Against those who do not? The idea of consequences miffs atheists does it?

Again f*ck you address the issue.
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
neutral
Posts: 4,478
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8/23/2014 4:31:14 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 4:24:01 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:16:26 AM, neutral wrote:
WOuldn't it be nice if EVEN once, an atheist began a critique about Christian claims by ACTUALLY CITING THE CHRISTIAN CLAIMS? You known:

http://www.vatican.va...

There is no point in rebutting a silly straw man that takes loose bits of common doctrine and spins them into an utter absurdity.

The real question, never answered by atheists?

You don't believe in God or anything that is claimed of God, indeed dismiss it as abject stupidity, and yet you turn around and are wounded by being 'threatened' by something you don't even believe in?

No no no, not this time netural. I know your standard tactic is to not address the issue then attack the person personally but f*ck you, I am not in the mood.


How is that logical? And what do you think the consequences are of spending your entire life acting like a capricious jerk? Against those who do not? The idea of consequences miffs atheists does it?

Again f*ck you address the issue.

The issue is hell retard. Perhaps, as you - like so many of your ilk - are just using whatever pops into your head rather than our actual doctrine - perhaps, being as you are attacking our faith from a false position, you could stop the whiney sniveling of being corrected, and click on the link provided you where - you would immediately discover, in the Catholic Catechism (which is not universal, but at least COMMON) and not that it clearly states:

1037 God predestines no one to go to hell;618 for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end. In the Eucharistic liturgy and in the daily prayers of her faithful, the Church implores the mercy of God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance":619

http://www.vatican.va...

But of course, when someone notes YOU making acerbic and false claims from a position of ignorance - yet again - the thin skinned atheists is immediately a victim - yet again - by having someone point out the false narrative of his silly, straw man claims - yet again.

Here is another note, its a public forum. You do not get to choose who does and does not reply, so why are you posting false narratives about Christianity in a forum where it is near certain that your BS will be called out?

You atheists think you are so intelligent, and yet ... we see this for you guys constantly. Utterly and completely unable to concede a point that Christian theology (if not all individual Christians) is not running around saying, "BURN IN HELL ATHEISTS!"

In fact, the only people on this forum who seem be saying that are atheists.

But who cares if people notice this, this is about atheists telling everyone else they are f*cked up and not themselves. Thanks for the judgement atheist - so what if it bears no semblance to Christian theology.
bulproof
Posts: 25,227
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8/23/2014 4:40:10 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 4:31:14 AM, neutral wrote:
1037 God predestines no one to go to hell;
Not according to the doctrine that all are sinners and must come to god or go to hell. That makes hell the default. Of course there is also the little bit about you can not go to god unless god calls you. The fix is in. God predestines all for hell unless he calls them.
618 for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end. In the Eucharistic liturgy and in the daily prayers of her faithful, the Church implores the mercy of God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance":619
If that is what an omnipotent god wants then absolutely nothing can prevent it happening. What's going on with that?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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8/23/2014 4:48:44 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 4:31:14 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:24:01 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:16:26 AM, neutral wrote:
WOuldn't it be nice if EVEN once, an atheist began a critique about Christian claims by ACTUALLY CITING THE CHRISTIAN CLAIMS? You known:

http://www.vatican.va...

There is no point in rebutting a silly straw man that takes loose bits of common doctrine and spins them into an utter absurdity.

The real question, never answered by atheists?

You don't believe in God or anything that is claimed of God, indeed dismiss it as abject stupidity, and yet you turn around and are wounded by being 'threatened' by something you don't even believe in?

No no no, not this time netural. I know your standard tactic is to not address the issue then attack the person personally but f*ck you, I am not in the mood.


How is that logical? And what do you think the consequences are of spending your entire life acting like a capricious jerk? Against those who do not? The idea of consequences miffs atheists does it?

Again f*ck you address the issue.

The issue is hell retard. Perhaps, as you - like so many of your ilk - are just using whatever pops into your head rather than our actual doctrine - perhaps, being as you are attacking our faith from a false position, you could stop the whiney sniveling of being corrected, and click on the link provided you where - you would immediately discover, in the Catholic Catechism (which is not universal, but at least COMMON) and not that it clearly states:

1037 God predestines no one to go to hell;618 for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end. In the Eucharistic liturgy and in the daily prayers of her faithful, the Church implores the mercy of God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance":619

http://www.vatican.va...

But of course, when someone notes YOU making acerbic and false claims from a position of ignorance - yet again - the thin skinned atheists is immediately a victim - yet again - by having someone point out the false narrative of his silly, straw man claims - yet again.


Here is another note, its a public forum. You do not get to choose who does and does not reply, so why are you posting false narratives about Christianity in a forum where it is near certain that your BS will be called out?


You atheists think you are so intelligent, and yet ... we see this for you guys constantly. Utterly and completely unable to concede a point that Christian theology (if not all individual Christians) is not running around saying, "BURN IN HELL ATHEISTS!"


In fact, the only people on this forum who seem be saying that are atheists.

But who cares if people notice this, this is about atheists telling everyone else they are f*cked up and not themselves. Thanks for the judgement atheist - so what if it bears no semblance to Christian theology.

Once again all your attacks about atheists doesn't address the issue I presented. So okey I will agree that like atheists are like the worst people on earth you know we should just round them up and like burn them in ovens and stuff. They are stupid, fat and smelly, ok we got it atheists are bad mmmkay ?

This does not address my objections to some christian claims/reasoning in regards to God, hell, forgiveness and Jesus.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

You claim that I have created a strawman. Well sorry in my life time I have repeatedly being told by some of my fellow human beings that God can or can't do certain things I pointed out a few of those things. I also pointed out my objection.

I have numerous times encounted claims about how God needs to punish sin and thus he punished Jesus in our place, that is to say God could not of just "forgiven" cause he choose too without adding anything to it.

I don't believe I have strawman the claims here. I am happy to get every born again bible believing is the perfect word of God Jesus is my lord and savior saved by the blood of the lamb evangelical christian on this thread to confirmed or deny this is a strawman or not.

or by the way neutral..........

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
neutral
Posts: 4,478
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8/23/2014 4:55:16 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 4:48:44 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:31:14 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:24:01 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:16:26 AM, neutral wrote:
WOuldn't it be nice if EVEN once, an atheist began a critique about Christian claims by ACTUALLY CITING THE CHRISTIAN CLAIMS? You known:

http://www.vatican.va...

There is no point in rebutting a silly straw man that takes loose bits of common doctrine and spins them into an utter absurdity.

The real question, never answered by atheists?

You don't believe in God or anything that is claimed of God, indeed dismiss it as abject stupidity, and yet you turn around and are wounded by being 'threatened' by something you don't even believe in?

No no no, not this time netural. I know your standard tactic is to not address the issue then attack the person personally but f*ck you, I am not in the mood.


How is that logical? And what do you think the consequences are of spending your entire life acting like a capricious jerk? Against those who do not? The idea of consequences miffs atheists does it?

Again f*ck you address the issue.

The issue is hell retard. Perhaps, as you - like so many of your ilk - are just using whatever pops into your head rather than our actual doctrine - perhaps, being as you are attacking our faith from a false position, you could stop the whiney sniveling of being corrected, and click on the link provided you where - you would immediately discover, in the Catholic Catechism (which is not universal, but at least COMMON) and not that it clearly states:

1037 God predestines no one to go to hell;618 for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end. In the Eucharistic liturgy and in the daily prayers of her faithful, the Church implores the mercy of God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance":619

http://www.vatican.va...

But of course, when someone notes YOU making acerbic and false claims from a position of ignorance - yet again - the thin skinned atheists is immediately a victim - yet again - by having someone point out the false narrative of his silly, straw man claims - yet again.


Here is another note, its a public forum. You do not get to choose who does and does not reply, so why are you posting false narratives about Christianity in a forum where it is near certain that your BS will be called out?


You atheists think you are so intelligent, and yet ... we see this for you guys constantly. Utterly and completely unable to concede a point that Christian theology (if not all individual Christians) is not running around saying, "BURN IN HELL ATHEISTS!"


In fact, the only people on this forum who seem be saying that are atheists.

But who cares if people notice this, this is about atheists telling everyone else they are f*cked up and not themselves. Thanks for the judgement atheist - so what if it bears no semblance to Christian theology.

Once again all your attacks about atheists doesn't address the issue I presented. So okey I will agree that like atheists are like the worst people on earth you know we should just round them up and like burn them in ovens and stuff. They are stupid, fat and smelly, ok we got it atheists are bad mmmkay ?

This does not address my objections to some christian claims/reasoning in regards to God, hell, forgiveness and Jesus.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

You claim that I have created a strawman. Well sorry in my life time I have repeatedly being told by some of my fellow human beings that God can or can't do certain things I pointed out a few of those things. I also pointed out my objection.

I have numerous times encounted claims about how God needs to punish sin and thus he punished Jesus in our place, that is to say God could not of just "forgiven" cause he choose too without adding anything to it.

I don't believe I have strawman the claims here. I am happy to get every born again bible believing is the perfect word of God Jesus is my lord and savior saved by the blood of the lamb evangelical christian on this thread to confirmed or deny this is a strawman or not.

or by the way neutral..........

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

The issue has been addressed with a citation retard.

YOUR tactic are quite common, and I am free to point out the utter stupidity of not talking about Hell as you avoid the subject to attack someone who is providing source documents to address the issue.

Clearly the problem here is ... not you.

Hell is the subject. You were wrong in your initial claim and corrected. So f*ck off.
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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8/23/2014 4:58:16 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 4:55:16 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:48:44 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:31:14 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:24:01 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:16:26 AM, neutral wrote:
WOuldn't it be nice if EVEN once, an atheist began a critique about Christian claims by ACTUALLY CITING THE CHRISTIAN CLAIMS? You known:

http://www.vatican.va...

There is no point in rebutting a silly straw man that takes loose bits of common doctrine and spins them into an utter absurdity.

The real question, never answered by atheists?

You don't believe in God or anything that is claimed of God, indeed dismiss it as abject stupidity, and yet you turn around and are wounded by being 'threatened' by something you don't even believe in?

No no no, not this time netural. I know your standard tactic is to not address the issue then attack the person personally but f*ck you, I am not in the mood.


How is that logical? And what do you think the consequences are of spending your entire life acting like a capricious jerk? Against those who do not? The idea of consequences miffs atheists does it?

Again f*ck you address the issue.

The issue is hell retard. Perhaps, as you - like so many of your ilk - are just using whatever pops into your head rather than our actual doctrine - perhaps, being as you are attacking our faith from a false position, you could stop the whiney sniveling of being corrected, and click on the link provided you where - you would immediately discover, in the Catholic Catechism (which is not universal, but at least COMMON) and not that it clearly states:

1037 God predestines no one to go to hell;618 for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end. In the Eucharistic liturgy and in the daily prayers of her faithful, the Church implores the mercy of God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance":619

http://www.vatican.va...

But of course, when someone notes YOU making acerbic and false claims from a position of ignorance - yet again - the thin skinned atheists is immediately a victim - yet again - by having someone point out the false narrative of his silly, straw man claims - yet again.


Here is another note, its a public forum. You do not get to choose who does and does not reply, so why are you posting false narratives about Christianity in a forum where it is near certain that your BS will be called out?


You atheists think you are so intelligent, and yet ... we see this for you guys constantly. Utterly and completely unable to concede a point that Christian theology (if not all individual Christians) is not running around saying, "BURN IN HELL ATHEISTS!"


In fact, the only people on this forum who seem be saying that are atheists.

But who cares if people notice this, this is about atheists telling everyone else they are f*cked up and not themselves. Thanks for the judgement atheist - so what if it bears no semblance to Christian theology.

Once again all your attacks about atheists doesn't address the issue I presented. So okey I will agree that like atheists are like the worst people on earth you know we should just round them up and like burn them in ovens and stuff. They are stupid, fat and smelly, ok we got it atheists are bad mmmkay ?

This does not address my objections to some christian claims/reasoning in regards to God, hell, forgiveness and Jesus.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

You claim that I have created a strawman. Well sorry in my life time I have repeatedly being told by some of my fellow human beings that God can or can't do certain things I pointed out a few of those things. I also pointed out my objection.

I have numerous times encounted claims about how God needs to punish sin and thus he punished Jesus in our place, that is to say God could not of just "forgiven" cause he choose too without adding anything to it.

I don't believe I have strawman the claims here. I am happy to get every born again bible believing is the perfect word of God Jesus is my lord and savior saved by the blood of the lamb evangelical christian on this thread to confirmed or deny this is a strawman or not.

or by the way neutral..........

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

Not one more slur against any group, address the issue.

The issue has been addressed with a citation retard.

YOUR tactic are quite common, and I am free to point out the utter stupidity of not talking about Hell as you avoid the subject to attack someone who is providing source documents to address the issue.

Clearly the problem here is ... not you.

Hell is the subject. You were wrong in your initial claim and corrected. So f*ck off.

I'll give you one chance........

Tell me exactly how I straw maned hell, be specific.
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
neutral
Posts: 4,478
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8/23/2014 5:08:45 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 4:58:16 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:


I'll give you one chance........

Tell me exactly how I straw maned hell, be specific.

Its already cited for you douche - go back and read - it THE CITATION given twice.

Perhaps you should lower the emotion level enough to actually read - especially when charging, in a highly emotional manner, that someone is not addressing the topic.

It's been addresses, and begins with your claims of hell having not link to an actual Christian theological claim ... a link to which was provided, and after being ignored, the relevant portion directly quoted for you, and relinked so you could verify it yourself.

HELP! HELP! I AM BEING REPRESSED BY THIS ... not exactly an intellectual rebuttal .
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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8/23/2014 5:19:26 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 5:08:45 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:58:16 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:


I'll give you one chance........

Tell me exactly how I straw maned hell, be specific.

Its already cited for you douche - go back and read - it THE CITATION given twice.

Perhaps you should lower the emotion level enough to actually read - especially when charging, in a highly emotional manner, that someone is not addressing the topic.

It's been addresses, and begins with your claims of hell having not link to an actual Christian theological claim ... a link to which was provided, and after being ignored, the relevant portion directly quoted for you, and relinked so you could verify it yourself.

HELP! HELP! I AM BEING REPRESSED BY THIS ... not exactly an intellectual rebuttal .

You were given the chance. I read your catholic claims..."God predestines no one to go to hell;618 for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end. In the Eucharistic liturgy and in the daily prayers of her faithful, the Church implores the mercy of God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance"

That's nice, but I didn't argue against the position that hell is a place God predestines people to go too.

What I did argue against among other things is the claims about hell (the eternal fire torment one) being deserved and objections raised to what God can and can't do in regard to those claims.

Maybe you should actually read the objection try to understand where the other person is coming from before making your counter argument.

Don't waste my time again please........
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
neutral
Posts: 4,478
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8/23/2014 5:22:38 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 5:19:26 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:08:45 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:58:16 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:


I'll give you one chance........

Tell me exactly how I straw maned hell, be specific.

Its already cited for you douche - go back and read - it THE CITATION given twice.

Perhaps you should lower the emotion level enough to actually read - especially when charging, in a highly emotional manner, that someone is not addressing the topic.

It's been addresses, and begins with your claims of hell having not link to an actual Christian theological claim ... a link to which was provided, and after being ignored, the relevant portion directly quoted for you, and relinked so you could verify it yourself.

HELP! HELP! I AM BEING REPRESSED BY THIS ... not exactly an intellectual rebuttal .

You were given the chance. I read your catholic claims..."God predestines no one to go to hell;618 for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end. In the Eucharistic liturgy and in the daily prayers of her faithful, the Church implores the mercy of God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance"

That's nice, but I didn't argue against the position that hell is a place God predestines people to go too.

What I did argue against among other things is the claims about hell (the eternal fire torment one) being deserved and objections raised to what God can and can't do in regard to those claims.

Maybe you should actually read the objection try to understand where the other person is coming from before making your counter argument.

Don't waste my time again please........

Maybe you should read atheist:

God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance"

What was your first claim? That you 'deserve hell'?

Whoops ... lets just pretend that the last part there in three lines does not exist. Again, you want others to take you seriously, but yuou cannot even read what has ben given you ... FOUR TIMES now?

You are the problem kiddo.
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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8/23/2014 5:30:41 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 5:22:38 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:19:26 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:08:45 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:58:16 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:


I'll give you one chance........

Tell me exactly how I straw maned hell, be specific.

Its already cited for you douche - go back and read - it THE CITATION given twice.

Perhaps you should lower the emotion level enough to actually read - especially when charging, in a highly emotional manner, that someone is not addressing the topic.

It's been addresses, and begins with your claims of hell having not link to an actual Christian theological claim ... a link to which was provided, and after being ignored, the relevant portion directly quoted for you, and relinked so you could verify it yourself.

HELP! HELP! I AM BEING REPRESSED BY THIS ... not exactly an intellectual rebuttal .

You were given the chance. I read your catholic claims..."God predestines no one to go to hell;618 for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end. In the Eucharistic liturgy and in the daily prayers of her faithful, the Church implores the mercy of God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance"

That's nice, but I didn't argue against the position that hell is a place God predestines people to go too.

What I did argue against among other things is the claims about hell (the eternal fire torment one) being deserved and objections raised to what God can and can't do in regard to those claims.

Maybe you should actually read the objection try to understand where the other person is coming from before making your counter argument.

Don't waste my time again please........

Maybe you should read atheist:

God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance"

What was your first claim? That you 'deserve hell'?

Whoops ... lets just pretend that the last part there in three lines does not exist. Again, you want others to take you seriously, but yuou cannot even read what has ben given you ... FOUR TIMES now?

You are the problem kiddo.

Yes, that is a common christian claim I have encounter. Not that just I deserve hell everyone human deserves hell including you neutral.

That is a claim being made by some christians, I stand by that. I raised objections to it.

So what is your problem here exactly ?

That I am not accurately presenting that view ?

That their view on hell or deserving hell is incorrect ?

That my objection is not a good one ?

What the F*ck is your problem netural ?
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
neutral
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8/23/2014 5:34:38 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 5:30:41 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:22:38 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:19:26 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:08:45 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:58:16 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:


I'll give you one chance........

Tell me exactly how I straw maned hell, be specific.

Its already cited for you douche - go back and read - it THE CITATION given twice.

Perhaps you should lower the emotion level enough to actually read - especially when charging, in a highly emotional manner, that someone is not addressing the topic.

It's been addresses, and begins with your claims of hell having not link to an actual Christian theological claim ... a link to which was provided, and after being ignored, the relevant portion directly quoted for you, and relinked so you could verify it yourself.

HELP! HELP! I AM BEING REPRESSED BY THIS ... not exactly an intellectual rebuttal .

You were given the chance. I read your catholic claims..."God predestines no one to go to hell;618 for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end. In the Eucharistic liturgy and in the daily prayers of her faithful, the Church implores the mercy of God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance"

That's nice, but I didn't argue against the position that hell is a place God predestines people to go too.

What I did argue against among other things is the claims about hell (the eternal fire torment one) being deserved and objections raised to what God can and can't do in regard to those claims.

Maybe you should actually read the objection try to understand where the other person is coming from before making your counter argument.

Don't waste my time again please........

Maybe you should read atheist:

God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance"

What was your first claim? That you 'deserve hell'?

Whoops ... lets just pretend that the last part there in three lines does not exist. Again, you want others to take you seriously, but yuou cannot even read what has ben given you ... FOUR TIMES now?

You are the problem kiddo.

Yes, that is a common christian claim I have encounter. Not that just I deserve hell everyone human deserves hell including you neutral.


Site it as you were asked to do.

As I said earlier, this claim is made FAR more often by atheists than it is by Christians.

Again, explain why your 'common overheard' trumps the reality of our doctrine as you were asked?

What is my problem? That atheists such as yourself don;t take the time to back your ignorant claims up with simply fact checking. And when corrected, you go into emotional orbit about it.

Tell me atheist, why is pointing out that portion of our doctrine less relevant than what you believe we believe? Who are you to tell us what we think? Even as we state our doctrine for you? Which conflicts with your statement?

Again, the point has already been conceded that some Christians do this, but they are outside the doctrine, and .. to be blunt again ... the claim is repeated by atheists for some reason .. even though you don't believe in God.

Pretense of discussion would require you, as you have done since the beginning, to stop screaming at people and actually defending your position. Why does your opinion, at best based on a tiny minority of Christians, trump our doctrine as is practiced by the STRONG MAJORITY of Christians?

Please explain? If you can.
Illegalcombatant
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8/23/2014 5:54:44 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 5:34:38 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:30:41 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:22:38 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:19:26 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:08:45 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:58:16 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:


I'll give you one chance........

Tell me exactly how I straw maned hell, be specific.

Its already cited for you douche - go back and read - it THE CITATION given twice.

Perhaps you should lower the emotion level enough to actually read - especially when charging, in a highly emotional manner, that someone is not addressing the topic.

It's been addresses, and begins with your claims of hell having not link to an actual Christian theological claim ... a link to which was provided, and after being ignored, the relevant portion directly quoted for you, and relinked so you could verify it yourself.

HELP! HELP! I AM BEING REPRESSED BY THIS ... not exactly an intellectual rebuttal .

You were given the chance. I read your catholic claims..."God predestines no one to go to hell;618 for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end. In the Eucharistic liturgy and in the daily prayers of her faithful, the Church implores the mercy of God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance"

That's nice, but I didn't argue against the position that hell is a place God predestines people to go too.

What I did argue against among other things is the claims about hell (the eternal fire torment one) being deserved and objections raised to what God can and can't do in regard to those claims.

Maybe you should actually read the objection try to understand where the other person is coming from before making your counter argument.

Don't waste my time again please........

Maybe you should read atheist:

God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance"

What was your first claim? That you 'deserve hell'?

Whoops ... lets just pretend that the last part there in three lines does not exist. Again, you want others to take you seriously, but yuou cannot even read what has ben given you ... FOUR TIMES now?

You are the problem kiddo.

Yes, that is a common christian claim I have encounter. Not that just I deserve hell everyone human deserves hell including you neutral.


Site it as you were asked to do.

As I said earlier, this claim is made FAR more often by atheists than it is by Christians.

Again, explain why your 'common overheard' trumps the reality of our doctrine as you were asked?


What is my problem? That atheists such as yourself don;t take the time to back your ignorant claims up with simply fact checking. And when corrected, you go into emotional orbit about it.


Tell me atheist, why is pointing out that portion of our doctrine less relevant than what you believe we believe? Who are you to tell us what we think? Even as we state our doctrine for you? Which conflicts with your statement?


Again, the point has already been conceded that some Christians do this, but they are outside the doctrine, and .. to be blunt again ... the claim is repeated by atheists for some reason .. even though you don't believe in God.

Sorry that is the first time I have seen you grant that point.


Pretense of discussion would require you, as you have done since the beginning, to stop screaming at people and actually defending your position. Why does your opinion, at best based on a tiny minority of Christians, trump our doctrine as is practiced by the STRONG MAJORITY of Christians?


Please explain? If you can.

Yes I can explain, I am arguing against certain claims made about God, hell forgiveness.

What is clear now is that you yourself actually don't hold those beliefs yet you attack me ?

You accuse me of strawmanning then just now concede well yeah there are some who make those claims.

So in regards to them I was NOT strawmanning them, nor I was starwmanning you cause you don't hold those beliefs anyway.

You waste so much f*cking time here.

You waste so much time not actually dealing with the issue or argument but rather creating a strawman then attacking it.

Example 1) "Tell me atheist, why is pointing out that portion of our doctrine less relevant than what you believe we believe? Who are you to tell us what we think? Even as we state our doctrine for you? Which conflicts with your statement?"

What ? WTF ?

Yes Neutural that is exactly my argument. I tell you what you believe that is the very core of my argument.

There have being claims made about God hell Jesus etc. Okey netural you don't hold those views that I refered too. Well guess what numb nuts, the counter argument doesn't apply to you then does it.

But that just wasn't enough for you, you had to go on your atheists rants, pretend I was just strawmanning the views of some on God hell forgivness and God knows what else.

But I will tell you what it sounds like you are a catholic are you a catholic ? when I get some time I will look at some more specific catholic claims and then goes after that.

Then I will really give you something to b*tch and whine about.

Till then bye.
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
bulproof
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8/23/2014 5:55:47 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Little newt, lets see you ignorantly bombast your way through this. I don't expect you to actually respond but I like to read your lame attempts at insults.

At 8/23/2014 4:40:10 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:31:14 AM, neutral wrote:
1037 God predestines no one to go to hell;
Not according to the doctrine that all are sinners and must come to god or go to hell. That makes hell the default. Of course there is also the little bit about you can not go to god unless god calls you. The fix is in. God predestines all for hell unless he calls them.
618 for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end. In the Eucharistic liturgy and in the daily prayers of her faithful, the Church implores the mercy of God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance":619
If that is what an omnipotent god wants then absolutely nothing can prevent it happening. What's going on with that?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
neutral
Posts: 4,478
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8/23/2014 5:58:16 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 5:54:44 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:34:38 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:30:41 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:22:38 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:19:26 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:08:45 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:58:16 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:


I'll give you one chance........

Tell me exactly how I straw maned hell, be specific.

Its already cited for you douche - go back and read - it THE CITATION given twice.

Perhaps you should lower the emotion level enough to actually read - especially when charging, in a highly emotional manner, that someone is not addressing the topic.

It's been addresses, and begins with your claims of hell having not link to an actual Christian theological claim ... a link to which was provided, and after being ignored, the relevant portion directly quoted for you, and relinked so you could verify it yourself.

HELP! HELP! I AM BEING REPRESSED BY THIS ... not exactly an intellectual rebuttal .

You were given the chance. I read your catholic claims..."God predestines no one to go to hell;618 for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end. In the Eucharistic liturgy and in the daily prayers of her faithful, the Church implores the mercy of God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance"

That's nice, but I didn't argue against the position that hell is a place God predestines people to go too.

What I did argue against among other things is the claims about hell (the eternal fire torment one) being deserved and objections raised to what God can and can't do in regard to those claims.

Maybe you should actually read the objection try to understand where the other person is coming from before making your counter argument.

Don't waste my time again please........

Maybe you should read atheist:

God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance"

What was your first claim? That you 'deserve hell'?

Whoops ... lets just pretend that the last part there in three lines does not exist. Again, you want others to take you seriously, but yuou cannot even read what has ben given you ... FOUR TIMES now?

You are the problem kiddo.

Yes, that is a common christian claim I have encounter. Not that just I deserve hell everyone human deserves hell including you neutral.


Site it as you were asked to do.

As I said earlier, this claim is made FAR more often by atheists than it is by Christians.

Again, explain why your 'common overheard' trumps the reality of our doctrine as you were asked?


What is my problem? That atheists such as yourself don;t take the time to back your ignorant claims up with simply fact checking. And when corrected, you go into emotional orbit about it.



Tell me atheist, why is pointing out that portion of our doctrine less relevant than what you believe we believe? Who are you to tell us what we think? Even as we state our doctrine for you? Which conflicts with your statement?


Again, the point has already been conceded that some Christians do this, but they are outside the doctrine, and .. to be blunt again ... the claim is repeated by atheists for some reason .. even though you don't believe in God.

Sorry that is the first time I have seen you grant that point.


Pretense of discussion would require you, as you have done since the beginning, to stop screaming at people and actually defending your position. Why does your opinion, at best based on a tiny minority of Christians, trump our doctrine as is practiced by the STRONG MAJORITY of Christians?


Please explain? If you can.

Yes I can explain, I am arguing against certain claims made about God, hell forgiveness.

What is clear now is that you yourself actually don't hold those beliefs yet you attack me ?

You accuse me of strawmanning then just now concede well yeah there are some who make those claims.

So in regards to them I was NOT strawmanning them, nor I was starwmanning you cause you don't hold those beliefs anyway.

You waste so much f*cking time here.

You waste so much time not actually dealing with the issue or argument but rather creating a strawman then attacking it.

Example 1) "Tell me atheist, why is pointing out that portion of our doctrine less relevant than what you believe we believe? Who are you to tell us what we think? Even as we state our doctrine for you? Which conflicts with your statement?"

What ? WTF ?

Yes Neutural that is exactly my argument. I tell you what you believe that is the very core of my argument.

There have being claims made about God hell Jesus etc. Okey netural you don't hold those views that I refered too. Well guess what numb nuts, the counter argument doesn't apply to you then does it.

God what a shone fest - just defend your position - right, you have no actual desire to discuss or answer questions.

Why does your opinion trump our doctrine? Why do atheists such as yourself keep talking about Hell in the most extreme way while pointedly ignoring the doctrine and the FAR more common interpretations of Hell?

Agh, its YOUR time that is wasted when that is pointed out. The vapid emotionalism and personal animosity readily displayed by ,,, er, you, is not the problem at all.

So much for the pretense of atheism in discussion ... again.
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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8/23/2014 6:06:39 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 5:58:16 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:54:44 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:34:38 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:30:41 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:22:38 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:19:26 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 5:08:45 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:58:16 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:


I'll give you one chance........

Tell me exactly how I straw maned hell, be specific.

Its already cited for you douche - go back and read - it THE CITATION given twice.

Perhaps you should lower the emotion level enough to actually read - especially when charging, in a highly emotional manner, that someone is not addressing the topic.

It's been addresses, and begins with your claims of hell having not link to an actual Christian theological claim ... a link to which was provided, and after being ignored, the relevant portion directly quoted for you, and relinked so you could verify it yourself.

HELP! HELP! I AM BEING REPRESSED BY THIS ... not exactly an intellectual rebuttal .

You were given the chance. I read your catholic claims..."God predestines no one to go to hell;618 for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end. In the Eucharistic liturgy and in the daily prayers of her faithful, the Church implores the mercy of God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance"

That's nice, but I didn't argue against the position that hell is a place God predestines people to go too.

What I did argue against among other things is the claims about hell (the eternal fire torment one) being deserved and objections raised to what God can and can't do in regard to those claims.

Maybe you should actually read the objection try to understand where the other person is coming from before making your counter argument.

Don't waste my time again please........

Maybe you should read atheist:

God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance"

What was your first claim? That you 'deserve hell'?

Whoops ... lets just pretend that the last part there in three lines does not exist. Again, you want others to take you seriously, but yuou cannot even read what has ben given you ... FOUR TIMES now?

You are the problem kiddo.

Yes, that is a common christian claim I have encounter. Not that just I deserve hell everyone human deserves hell including you neutral.


Site it as you were asked to do.

As I said earlier, this claim is made FAR more often by atheists than it is by Christians.

Again, explain why your 'common overheard' trumps the reality of our doctrine as you were asked?


What is my problem? That atheists such as yourself don;t take the time to back your ignorant claims up with simply fact checking. And when corrected, you go into emotional orbit about it.



Tell me atheist, why is pointing out that portion of our doctrine less relevant than what you believe we believe? Who are you to tell us what we think? Even as we state our doctrine for you? Which conflicts with your statement?


Again, the point has already been conceded that some Christians do this, but they are outside the doctrine, and .. to be blunt again ... the claim is repeated by atheists for some reason .. even though you don't believe in God.

Sorry that is the first time I have seen you grant that point.


Pretense of discussion would require you, as you have done since the beginning, to stop screaming at people and actually defending your position. Why does your opinion, at best based on a tiny minority of Christians, trump our doctrine as is practiced by the STRONG MAJORITY of Christians?


Please explain? If you can.

Yes I can explain, I am arguing against certain claims made about God, hell forgiveness.

What is clear now is that you yourself actually don't hold those beliefs yet you attack me ?

You accuse me of strawmanning then just now concede well yeah there are some who make those claims.

So in regards to them I was NOT strawmanning them, nor I was starwmanning you cause you don't hold those beliefs anyway.

You waste so much f*cking time here.

You waste so much time not actually dealing with the issue or argument but rather creating a strawman then attacking it.

Example 1) "Tell me atheist, why is pointing out that portion of our doctrine less relevant than what you believe we believe? Who are you to tell us what we think? Even as we state our doctrine for you? Which conflicts with your statement?"

What ? WTF ?

Yes Neutural that is exactly my argument. I tell you what you believe that is the very core of my argument.

There have being claims made about God hell Jesus etc. Okey netural you don't hold those views that I refered too. Well guess what numb nuts, the counter argument doesn't apply to you then does it.

God what a shone fest - just defend your position - right, you have no actual desire to discuss or answer questions.

What the hell are you talking about. I tried to defend my position as to why certain claims about God and hell are dubious.


Why does your opinion trump our doctrine? Why do atheists such as yourself keep talking about Hell in the most extreme way while pointedly ignoring the doctrine and the FAR more common interpretations of Hell?


Agh, its YOUR time that is wasted when that is pointed out. The vapid emotionalism and personal animosity readily displayed by ,,, er, you, is not the problem at all.

So much for the pretense of atheism in discussion ... again.

Wasting peoples time netural wasting peoples time. You have wasted mine enough.
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
Illegalcombatant
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8/23/2014 6:07:21 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Now for those who would actually like to talk about the objections I bought up I remind you of my OP..........

I challenge some christian claims on hell, hell being an eternal fire torment and all that good stuff.

The claims being....

1) You deserve hell

2) Jesus being punished in your place is the only way to avoid hell
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1) You deserve hell

I think most people have things they wouldn't mind re doing if they have the chance cause they felt they failed in some moral aspect.

But to go from that to well therefore you deserved hell is a huge jump. It's not like you went from a slap on the wrist to a kick in the balls and everything in between the claim goes straight to the worst possible punishment humans could come up with.

Just saying well you sinned against God doesn't establish hell as deserve. As such it's on its own a baseless and I find dubious assertion.

2) Jesus being punished in your place is the only way to avoid hell

The thing that ticks me off here is how arbitrary this claim is within the context of other claims being made about God. People are very non restrictive when it comes to what God can or can't do.

Sure God can allow baby cancer. It requires no effort on his part to heal baby cancer but you know he chooses not to.

Sure God can allow that earthquake that causes the building to fall that breaks a few spines and crushes a few heads.

Sure he can create a better world where animals don't survive by eating each other again requires no effort on his part but he chooses not too.

Sure he can create an infinite amount of universes

But then suddenly out of no where they put God in a box, no no no, he can't just forgive sin, no he just can't. The all mighty, the all powerful, the God who can do what he wants, the sovereign the guy who answers to no one who is accountable to nobody can't just forgive because he chooses too, no that just isn't an option to him.

I am not impressed by arbitrary claims about God in order to justify a prior religious belief.

But but but, God has to punish sin, it would be unjust of God to just forgive........really you really want to try that ? Well then just bring it !!!
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
bulproof
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8/23/2014 6:11:18 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 5:58:16 AM, neutral wrote:
Why does your opinion trump our doctrine? Why do atheists such as yourself keep talking about Hell in the most extreme way while pointedly ignoring the doctrine and the FAR more common interpretations of Hell?

What is the more common interpretation of hell?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
neutral
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8/23/2014 6:16:50 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 6:06:39 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:

Wasting peoples time netural wasting peoples time. You have wasted mine enough.

And yet you keep coming back, pointedly avoiding observations of your factual errors or explaining your position on Hell while pretending that you are interested in discussion.

You are just another example of the atheist trolls that have infected this forum.

I think I am done wasting my time on another intransigent, irrational atheist.
bulproof
Posts: 25,227
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8/23/2014 6:21:51 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 5:55:47 AM, bulproof wrote:
Little newt, lets see you ignorantly bombast your way through this. I don't expect you to actually respond but I like to read your lame attempts at insults.

At 8/23/2014 4:40:10 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/23/2014 4:31:14 AM, neutral wrote:
1037 God predestines no one to go to hell;
Not according to the doctrine that all are sinners and must come to god or go to hell. That makes hell the default. Of course there is also the little bit about you can not go to god unless god calls you. The fix is in. God predestines all for hell unless he calls them.
618 for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end. In the Eucharistic liturgy and in the daily prayers of her faithful, the Church implores the mercy of God, who does not want "any to perish, but all to come to repentance":619
If that is what an omnipotent god wants then absolutely nothing can prevent it happening. What's going on with that?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Illegalcombatant
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8/23/2014 6:29:06 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 6:16:50 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 6:06:39 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:

Wasting peoples time netural wasting peoples time. You have wasted mine enough.

And yet you keep coming back, pointedly avoiding observations of your factual errors or explaining your position on Hell while pretending that you are interested in discussion.

I was objections to certain beliefs on God, Jesus hell. I think I am allowed to do this.


You are just another example of the atheist trolls that have infected this forum.

I think I am done wasting my time on another intransigent, irrational atheist.

Stop fooling yourself. You are a mess. You attacked arguments that were not made, your wrongly accussed me of starwmanning some Christians beliefs on hell, you go off onto anti atheists rants it just goes on and on.

And get this all this time my objections raised..........DON"T EVEN APPLY TO YOUR BELIFS !!!!

All I ask is that if I present some objection to what ever claim and you want to argue against my objections then at least try to understand the objection (that is don't just make something up to suit your purpose and attack that) oh and don't go off into anti atheist rants. Probably could lose the defend the catholic faith bit when the objections don't even apply to your catholic beliefs.

If you could do that next time that would just be super duper.
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
neutral
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8/23/2014 6:31:50 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 6:29:06 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 6:16:50 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 6:06:39 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:

Wasting peoples time netural wasting peoples time. You have wasted mine enough.

And yet you keep coming back, pointedly avoiding observations of your factual errors or explaining your position on Hell while pretending that you are interested in discussion.

I was objections to certain beliefs on God, Jesus hell. I think I am allowed to do this.


You are just another example of the atheist trolls that have infected this forum.

I think I am done wasting my time on another intransigent, irrational atheist.

Stop fooling yourself. You are a mess. You attacked arguments that were not made, your wrongly accussed me of starwmanning some Christians beliefs on hell, you go off onto anti atheists rants it just goes on and on.

And get this all this time my objections raised..........DON"T EVEN APPLY TO YOUR BELIFS !!!!

All I ask is that if I present some objection to what ever claim and you want to argue against my objections then at least try to understand the objection (that is don't just make something up to suit your purpose and attack that) oh and don't go off into anti atheist rants. Probably could lose the defend the catholic faith bit when the objections don't even apply to your catholic beliefs.

If you could do that next time that would just be super duper.

Wait ... I just can't help myself because of the irony.

STOP WSTING MY TIME!!! I HATE YOU!!!

Again, lets talk about integrity, because I specifically listed the Catholic version, with the clarification that it was not universal, because its COMMON and accurately reflects the position of churches BEYOND just the Catholic church making in a good starting point for a discussion about hell - which you clearly have no intention of actually engaging in because ...

drum roll.

You are another atheist troll who think pissing on religious people is 'discussion'.
bulproof
Posts: 25,227
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8/23/2014 6:40:02 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 6:29:06 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 6:16:50 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 6:06:39 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:

Wasting peoples time netural wasting peoples time. You have wasted mine enough.

And yet you keep coming back, pointedly avoiding observations of your factual errors or explaining your position on Hell while pretending that you are interested in discussion.

I was objections to certain beliefs on God, Jesus hell. I think I am allowed to do this.


You are just another example of the atheist trolls that have infected this forum.

I think I am done wasting my time on another intransigent, irrational atheist.

Stop fooling yourself. You are a mess. You attacked arguments that were not made, your wrongly accussed me of starwmanning some Christians beliefs on hell, you go off onto anti atheists rants it just goes on and on.

And get this all this time my objections raised..........DON"T EVEN APPLY TO YOUR BELIFS !!!!

All I ask is that if I present some objection to what ever claim and you want to argue against my objections then at least try to understand the objection (that is don't just make something up to suit your purpose and attack that) oh and don't go off into anti atheist rants. Probably could lose the defend the catholic faith bit when the objections don't even apply to your catholic beliefs.

If you could do that next time that would just be super duper.

Believe me they apply in spades to catholicism. I knew more about catholic doctrine than this fool before he was ever born. This thing can only LIE and spit hatred.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Illegalcombatant
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8/23/2014 6:43:18 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 6:31:50 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 6:29:06 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 6:16:50 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 6:06:39 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:

Wasting peoples time netural wasting peoples time. You have wasted mine enough.

And yet you keep coming back, pointedly avoiding observations of your factual errors or explaining your position on Hell while pretending that you are interested in discussion.

I was objections to certain beliefs on God, Jesus hell. I think I am allowed to do this.


You are just another example of the atheist trolls that have infected this forum.

I think I am done wasting my time on another intransigent, irrational atheist.

Stop fooling yourself. You are a mess. You attacked arguments that were not made, your wrongly accussed me of starwmanning some Christians beliefs on hell, you go off onto anti atheists rants it just goes on and on.

And get this all this time my objections raised..........DON"T EVEN APPLY TO YOUR BELIFS !!!!

All I ask is that if I present some objection to what ever claim and you want to argue against my objections then at least try to understand the objection (that is don't just make something up to suit your purpose and attack that) oh and don't go off into anti atheist rants. Probably could lose the defend the catholic faith bit when the objections don't even apply to your catholic beliefs.

If you could do that next time that would just be super duper.

Wait ... I just can't help myself because of the irony.

STOP WSTING MY TIME!!! I HATE YOU!!!

Again, lets talk about integrity, because I specifically listed the Catholic version, with the clarification that it was not universal, because its COMMON and accurately reflects the position of churches BEYOND just the Catholic church making in a good starting point for a discussion about hell - which you clearly have no intention of actually engaging in because ...

drum roll.

You are another atheist troll who think pissing on religious people is 'discussion'.

No, I think when claims are made say about heaven hell or what ever we are allowed to raise objections to those claims.

Another false accusation on your part.

Don't lecture me on intergrity after all the sh*t you pulled on this thread.
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
neutral
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8/23/2014 6:46:05 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 6:43:18 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:

Don't lecture me on intergrity after all the sh*t you pulled on this thread.

Hmm .. as if integrity were evident in your actions in this thread?

Troll.
Illegalcombatant
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8/23/2014 6:47:13 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 6:46:05 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 6:43:18 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:

Don't lecture me on intergrity after all the sh*t you pulled on this thread.

Hmm .. as if integrity were evident in your actions in this thread?

Troll.

I raised objections to beliefs you don't even personally hold. Then you well you just lost the plot.

If I am a troll your like super duper mega troll.
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
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8/23/2014 6:52:14 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 6:47:13 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 6:46:05 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 6:43:18 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:

Don't lecture me on intergrity after all the sh*t you pulled on this thread.

Hmm .. as if integrity were evident in your actions in this thread?

Troll.

I raised objections to beliefs you don't even personally hold. Then you well you just lost the plot.

If I am a troll your like super duper mega troll.

Oh, I am wounded ... and Hell is being discussed.
Illegalcombatant
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8/23/2014 6:54:40 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 6:52:14 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 6:47:13 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 8/23/2014 6:46:05 AM, neutral wrote:
At 8/23/2014 6:43:18 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:

Don't lecture me on intergrity after all the sh*t you pulled on this thread.

Hmm .. as if integrity were evident in your actions in this thread?

Troll.

I raised objections to beliefs you don't even personally hold. Then you well you just lost the plot.

If I am a troll your like super duper mega troll.

Oh, I am wounded ... and Hell is being discussed.

There isn't really anything to discuss, you don't believe in the concept of hell I bought up. I don't know whether you think my objections were good or not but either way you don't believe in THAT hell.

So, nice weather we are having today eh ?
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
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8/23/2014 6:56:51 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/23/2014 6:54:40 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:


There isn't really anything to discuss, you don't believe in the concept of hell I bought up. I don't know whether you think my objections were good or not but either way you don't believe in THAT hell.

So, nice weather we are having today eh ?

You haven't actually brought up a version of Hell whatsoever troll. Save to erroneously state that we Christians believe that you 'deserve it' - a position that conflicts with our doctrine and represents only a extremist position in our faith.

Its a bit like saying you all support pedophilia because Dawkins says it. Do you?

Well, then why do you think treating Christians that way is conducive to 'discussion' - which you are pointedly NOT doing.

Weather indeed.