Total Posts:12|Showing Posts:1-12
Jump to topic:

Why i have a Jewish view on Satan

Truth_seeker
Posts: 1,811
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/28/2014 9:00:04 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I no longer see Satan the same way as most Christians present him. I guess if my beliefs could be explained, they would be leaning towards the Jewish view of him. I don't believe that he was an angel who fell and has equal status to God. The Bible actually doesn't support that.

In Judaism, there is a concept called the yetzer hara or the evil inclination. Jewish sages believe that it can be overcome with following the Torah, but Paul as a rabbi struggled with this because the evil inclination was always stronger. The only way for a Christian to overcome it is through Christ.

In Judaism, Satan is in a sense a metaphor for the evil inclination. He tempts us to sin and puts obstacles in our way to challenge our faith. This only means that God is all powerful, causing both good and evil for us to grow. Our main focus should be on learning more about the nature of God in our sufferings.

As I have taught others in our conversations, the greatest ability of man that surpasses that of the angels is free will and being able to rise above the obstacles to become something greater. Satan simply does God's will whether he plans to or not.
celestialtorahteacher
Posts: 1,369
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/28/2014 9:52:04 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
There is no "free will". It is an illusion because we can't see the future. God did. It's all pre-programmed. Creation sits as a done deal being "played" out as the method by which life evolves into intelligence then finally into humanity in the fullest sense of that word, then into God, at "the End of Days"..
matt.mcguire88
Posts: 1,137
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/29/2014 6:24:38 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/28/2014 9:00:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
I no longer see Satan the same way as most Christians present him. I guess if my beliefs could be explained, they would be leaning towards the Jewish view of him. I don't believe that he was an angel who fell and has equal status to God. The Bible actually doesn't support that.

Well this is a strange starting point to reject a "Christian" view of Satan for one, I've never in all my encounters with Christians have I ever heard any one believe that Satan has equal status to God lol. Not only have I not heard it but that's not even scripture period old or new test.
And the the "angel who fell" description is in Isaiah 14 so it was a Jewish view.

In Judaism, there is a concept called the yetzer hara or the evil inclination. Jewish sages believe that it can be overcome with following the Torah, but Paul as a rabbi struggled with this because the evil inclination was always stronger. The only way for a Christian to overcome it is through Christ.

In Judaism, Satan is in a sense a metaphor for the evil inclination. He tempts us to sin and puts obstacles in our way to challenge our faith. This only means that God is all powerful, causing both good and evil for us to grow. Our main focus should be on learning more about the nature of God in our sufferings.

As I have taught others in our conversations, the greatest ability of man that surpasses that of the angels is free will and being able to rise above the obstacles to become something greater. Satan simply does God's will whether he plans to or not.
bulproof
Posts: 25,274
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/29/2014 6:34:21 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/29/2014 6:24:38 AM, matt.mcguire88 wrote:
Isaiah 14
Can you be more specific?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
matt.mcguire88
Posts: 1,137
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/29/2014 6:37:43 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/29/2014 6:34:21 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/29/2014 6:24:38 AM, matt.mcguire88 wrote:
Isaiah 14
Can you be more specific?

11--15
bulproof
Posts: 25,274
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/29/2014 6:53:11 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/29/2014 6:37:43 AM, matt.mcguire88 wrote:
At 8/29/2014 6:34:21 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/29/2014 6:24:38 AM, matt.mcguire88 wrote:
Isaiah 14
Can you be more specific?

11--15
Ahh yes.

The king of babylon wasn't it? Or is that in to much context?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Truth_seeker
Posts: 1,811
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/29/2014 7:26:08 AM
Posted: 2 years ago

Well this is a strange starting point to reject a "Christian" view of Satan for one, I've never in all my encounters with Christians have I ever heard any one believe that Satan has equal status to God lol. Not only have I not heard it but that's not even scripture period old or new test.
And the the "angel who fell" description is in Isaiah 14 so it was a Jewish view.

Satan doesn't have equal status with God, that's what i'm saying. Isaiah 14 is speaking of the King of Babylon
matt.mcguire88
Posts: 1,137
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/29/2014 7:50:15 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/29/2014 6:53:11 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/29/2014 6:37:43 AM, matt.mcguire88 wrote:
At 8/29/2014 6:34:21 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/29/2014 6:24:38 AM, matt.mcguire88 wrote:
Isaiah 14
Can you be more specific?

11--15
Ahh yes.

The king of babylon wasn't it? Or is that in to much context?

Lol either way that's where the reference is from, I'll do my own looking further into that one.
matt.mcguire88
Posts: 1,137
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/29/2014 7:55:02 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/29/2014 7:26:08 AM, Truth_seeker wrote:

Well this is a strange starting point to reject a "Christian" view of Satan for one, I've never in all my encounters with Christians have I ever heard any one believe that Satan has equal status to God lol. Not only have I not heard it but that's not even scripture period old or new test.
And the the "angel who fell" description is in Isaiah 14 so it was a Jewish view.

Satan doesn't have equal status with God,

And that's what I've said, however you presented it as a Christian doctrine and that is something I've never heard before so where do ya get it which was my point sir lol?

that's what i'm saying. Isaiah 14 is speaking of the King of Babylon

I'm willing to discuss that and research the passage further however but that's where the reference is from.
celestialtorahteacher
Posts: 1,369
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/29/2014 8:27:14 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Until you all learn about the real roots of Judeo-Christianity in ancient Egypt, none of you will know the real story about "Satan" which is a cognate variation of "Setan" which is a cognate of the Egyptian God Set. And there is no doubt about about Set's identity as a "murderer from the beginning" as Set was famous for murdering his brother, Osiris, in the Egyptian solar god worshiping system of ancient Egypt. Even Egyptians were afraid of Set yet Set had powers that pharaohs sought. Ancient Israelites were a part of the failed Hyksos Shepherd Kings invasion and brief rulership of Egypt. Israelites worshiped Set in the Hyksos capital of Avris in Egypt. Here is Jesus in John's Gospel referring to Set as the father of the Jewish line as "Seth", the surviving son of Adam and Eve and thus default founder of the Jewish line.

"You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there's no truth in him..." Jn 8:44

Set and Jews are inseparable in the root history of Jews so there must be another side to this Set/Jewish relationship and there is. The Dragon connection where there's been a transfer of Set energy to Jewish control as Riders of Dragons instead of being dragons. This is all astrological lore I'm teaching here that was foundational to Judaism coming out of Egyptian experience and contact with Egyptian astrologically based religious beliefs. Set celestially is the constellation of Draco the Dragon that in the ancient Egyptian system was locked together with Taurowet, the Source of the Torah theology, as Protector and Defender, building a "fence around the Torah". I am part of this Jewish religious heritage and restoring the original Celestial Torah knowledge back into the root history of Christianity where it was purposely lost by the priests of Judah who couldn't compete with professional astrologers like the Magi so outlawed linking astrological knowledge with Torah/Tanakh/Talmud scriptures.
matt.mcguire88
Posts: 1,137
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/29/2014 8:59:01 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 8/29/2014 6:53:11 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/29/2014 6:37:43 AM, matt.mcguire88 wrote:
At 8/29/2014 6:34:21 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 8/29/2014 6:24:38 AM, matt.mcguire88 wrote:
Isaiah 14
Can you be more specific?

11--15
Ahh yes.

The king of babylon wasn't it? Or is that in to much context?

Hey I never thought I'd observe you say "context" lol, I'm impressed though....