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"If God told you to kill someone would you?"

dee-em
Posts: 6,443
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9/19/2014 3:19:11 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

How could you be absolutely sure it was God (and not Satan)?

Are you being told to kill someone?
LostintheEcho1498
Posts: 234
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9/19/2014 11:34:40 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 3:19:11 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

How could you be absolutely sure it was God (and not Satan)?

Are you being told to kill someone?

This actually happens in the Book of Mormon. Nephi is told to kill a man named Laban but refuses. He says he cannot end another life. God appears to him and explains to him that it is better that one wicked soul perish than a whole nation dwindle in unbelief. Nephi does end up killing him but I honestly do not know if I could do it.
kasmic
Posts: 1,302
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9/19/2014 11:41:44 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
If God told me to kill someone, of course I would! As was eluded to previously the hard part is not obedience. It is "knowing" that God told you. Personally I do not believe that I could know that God told me that with enough confidence to actually do anything like killing another. Therefore, I would not kill if God told me to. Not from a lack of obedience per se, but from doubt that God told me to.

Does that make sense?

What God has "told" me, or at least what I accept is true is "thou shalt not kill."
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Truth_seeker
Posts: 1,811
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9/19/2014 12:32:01 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 3:19:11 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

How could you be absolutely sure it was God (and not Satan)?

Are you being told to kill someone?

lol no! but people have asked me that question before. I know it's Satan because of several reasons namely the commandment "you shall not murder."
Truth_seeker
Posts: 1,811
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9/19/2014 12:50:43 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 11:34:40 AM, LostintheEcho1498 wrote:
At 9/19/2014 3:19:11 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

How could you be absolutely sure it was God (and not Satan)?

Are you being told to kill someone?

This actually happens in the Book of Mormon. Nephi is told to kill a man named Laban but refuses. He says he cannot end another life. God appears to him and explains to him that it is better that one wicked soul perish than a whole nation dwindle in unbelief. Nephi does end up killing him but I honestly do not know if I could do it.

I don't think God would ask you to kill someone. He asked Abraham to sacrifice Isaac, but he never intentionally planned to kill him. In the New Testament, there was never a case where God asked someone to kill another person.
SamStevens
Posts: 3,819
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9/19/2014 12:51:48 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

Would one be justified in saying they killed because Zeus told them to do so?
"This is the true horror of religion. It allows perfectly decent and sane people to believe by the billions, what only lunatics could believe on their own." Sam Harris
Life asked Death "Why do people love me but hate you?"
Death responded: "Because you are a beautiful lie, and I am the painful truth."
Truth_seeker
Posts: 1,811
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9/19/2014 12:53:49 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 11:41:44 AM, kasmic wrote:
If God told me to kill someone, of course I would! As was eluded to previously the hard part is not obedience. It is "knowing" that God told you. Personally I do not believe that I could know that God told me that with enough confidence to actually do anything like killing another. Therefore, I would not kill if God told me to. Not from a lack of obedience per se, but from doubt that God told me to.

Does that make sense?

What God has "told" me, or at least what I accept is true is "thou shalt not kill."

Before i do something, i make sure that i pray about it and read the Bible. I don't think killing is permitted because of Jesus Christ. God pronounced judgement on other nations, but with the coming of Jesus, judgement shall be pronounced by the Messiah himself.
Truth_seeker
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9/19/2014 12:54:25 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 12:51:48 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

Would one be justified in saying they killed because Zeus told them to do so?

Well the Greeks did kill back then for their gods, so i don't know?
SamStevens
Posts: 3,819
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9/19/2014 12:56:59 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 12:54:25 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:51:48 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

Would one be justified in saying they killed because Zeus told them to do so?

Well the Greeks did kill back then for their gods, so i don't know?

I'm talking about if someone today were to kill a family, would they be justified in saying Zeus told them to do so?
"This is the true horror of religion. It allows perfectly decent and sane people to believe by the billions, what only lunatics could believe on their own." Sam Harris
Life asked Death "Why do people love me but hate you?"
Death responded: "Because you are a beautiful lie, and I am the painful truth."
Truth_seeker
Posts: 1,811
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9/19/2014 1:05:00 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 12:56:59 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:54:25 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:51:48 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

Would one be justified in saying they killed because Zeus told them to do so?

Well the Greeks did kill back then for their gods, so i don't know?

I'm talking about if someone today were to kill a family, would they be justified in saying Zeus told them to do so?

lol i don't believe Zeus exists.
DPMartin
Posts: 1,096
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9/19/2014 1:07:12 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 12:56:59 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:54:25 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:51:48 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

Would one be justified in saying they killed because Zeus told them to do so?

Well the Greeks did kill back then for their gods, so i don't know?

I'm talking about if someone today were to kill a family, would they be justified in saying Zeus told them to do so?

What justifies the taking of the life of another? Would it be the taking of a life another who has taken a life, or is threatening to take a life? And the life of what would be valued enough for the taking of the life. Such as, someone killed your dog.

And what life is valued by God, and what life is valued by men?
SamStevens
Posts: 3,819
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9/19/2014 1:09:22 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 1:07:12 PM, DPMartin wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:56:59 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:54:25 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:51:48 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

Would one be justified in saying they killed because Zeus told them to do so?

Well the Greeks did kill back then for their gods, so i don't know?

I'm talking about if someone today were to kill a family, would they be justified in saying Zeus told them to do so?

What justifies the taking of the life of another?

I'd say if it is a life and death situation like a person trying to kill you.

Would it be the taking of a life another who has taken a life, or is threatening to take a life? And the life of what would be valued enough for the taking of the life. Such as, someone killed your dog.

And what life is valued by God, and what life is valued by men?
"This is the true horror of religion. It allows perfectly decent and sane people to believe by the billions, what only lunatics could believe on their own." Sam Harris
Life asked Death "Why do people love me but hate you?"
Death responded: "Because you are a beautiful lie, and I am the painful truth."
SamStevens
Posts: 3,819
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9/19/2014 1:11:59 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 1:05:00 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:56:59 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:54:25 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:51:48 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

Would one be justified in saying they killed because Zeus told them to do so?

Well the Greeks did kill back then for their gods, so i don't know?

I'm talking about if someone today were to kill a family, would they be justified in saying Zeus told them to do so?

lol i don't believe Zeus exists.

Is that a yes or a no? Would someone be justified by saying Zeus told them to kill?
"This is the true horror of religion. It allows perfectly decent and sane people to believe by the billions, what only lunatics could believe on their own." Sam Harris
Life asked Death "Why do people love me but hate you?"
Death responded: "Because you are a beautiful lie, and I am the painful truth."
JasperFrancisShickadance
Posts: 112
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9/19/2014 1:15:10 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

This is a really tough and good question. I would have to do a lot of research to get a right answer, but even then I probably wouldn't be so sure.

For one thing, God said "Do not murder" and it is a major Ten Commandment. Even so, if I didn't take any of the Bible literally yet believed in God my logic/common sense would just take over and I would tell myself "do not murder."

Second, how would you know it was God speaking? Or is this a scenario where you are positive God told you to do it...?
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Truth_seeker
Posts: 1,811
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9/19/2014 1:15:47 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 1:07:12 PM, DPMartin wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:56:59 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:54:25 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:51:48 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

Would one be justified in saying they killed because Zeus told them to do so?

Well the Greeks did kill back then for their gods, so i don't know?

I'm talking about if someone today were to kill a family, would they be justified in saying Zeus told them to do so?

What justifies the taking of the life of another? Would it be the taking of a life another who has taken a life, or is threatening to take a life? And the life of what would be valued enough for the taking of the life. Such as, someone killed your dog.

And what life is valued by God, and what life is valued by men?

It's very complicated, but God is justified in only taking lives that are detrimental to society. As a rational human being, i would not want to kill anyone, but if God wants me to go to war, it's going to be hard, but i would probably do it. If it's for revenge or something of that sort, killing is most certainly not justified.
The_Immortal_Emris
Posts: 474
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9/19/2014 1:16:48 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

No I would assume I had gone a bit mad, and I would call a mental health professional.
SamStevens
Posts: 3,819
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9/19/2014 1:19:22 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 1:05:00 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:56:59 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:54:25 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:51:48 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

Would one be justified in saying they killed because Zeus told them to do so?

Well the Greeks did kill back then for their gods, so i don't know?

I'm talking about if someone today were to kill a family, would they be justified in saying Zeus told them to do so?

lol i don't believe Zeus exists.

So I take it as a no, a person is not justified in killing in the name of Zeus. That means you aren't justified in killing in the name of your god.
"This is the true horror of religion. It allows perfectly decent and sane people to believe by the billions, what only lunatics could believe on their own." Sam Harris
Life asked Death "Why do people love me but hate you?"
Death responded: "Because you are a beautiful lie, and I am the painful truth."
Burzmali
Posts: 1,310
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9/19/2014 1:20:30 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
The fact that many theists have to even mull over the answer to this question, rather than simply saying "no," is a prime example of why I'm wary of religions and people who claim to be devout.
Truth_seeker
Posts: 1,811
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9/19/2014 1:21:42 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 1:15:10 PM, JasperFrancisShickadance wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

This is a really tough and good question. I would have to do a lot of research to get a right answer, but even then I probably wouldn't be so sure.

For one thing, God said "Do not murder" and it is a major Ten Commandment. Even so, if I didn't take any of the Bible literally yet believed in God my logic/common sense would just take over and I would tell myself "do not murder."

Second, how would you know it was God speaking? Or is this a scenario where you are positive God told you to do it...?

I had something like that happen to me before. Like one time, i was in middle school watching this kid play basketball and this voice suddenly said "snap that guy's neck." I was pretty bewildered and confused, so i got up but froze and decided to sit back down and pray about it then i remembered the commandment "you shall not murder" and that's how i knew it wasn't God.
popculturepooka
Posts: 7,924
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9/19/2014 1:22:50 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 1:20:30 PM, Burzmali wrote:
The fact that many theists have to even mull over the answer to this question, rather than simply saying "no," is a prime example of why I'm wary of religions and people who claim to be devout.

Would you be wary of Dietrich Bonhoeffer? He was about as devout as they come.

http://en.wikipedia.org...
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Truth_seeker
Posts: 1,811
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9/19/2014 1:25:42 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 1:19:22 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 1:05:00 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:56:59 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:54:25 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:51:48 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

Would one be justified in saying they killed because Zeus told them to do so?

Well the Greeks did kill back then for their gods, so i don't know?

I'm talking about if someone today were to kill a family, would they be justified in saying Zeus told them to do so?

lol i don't believe Zeus exists.

So I take it as a no, a person is not justified in killing in the name of Zeus. That means you aren't justified in killing in the name of your god.

Well i mean killing was justified back then according to his laws of justice and evil, but murder or taking a life without a just cause was punishable by death.
SamStevens
Posts: 3,819
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9/19/2014 1:32:14 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 1:25:42 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 1:19:22 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 1:05:00 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:56:59 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:54:25 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:51:48 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

Would one be justified in saying they killed because Zeus told them to do so?

Well the Greeks did kill back then for their gods, so i don't know?

I'm talking about if someone today were to kill a family, would they be justified in saying Zeus told them to do so?

lol i don't believe Zeus exists.

So I take it as a no, a person is not justified in killing in the name of Zeus. That means you aren't justified in killing in the name of your god.

Well i mean killing was justified back then according to his laws of justice and evil, but murder or taking a life without a just cause was punishable by death.

If God told you to kill someone would you?

Since I think you are referring to the modern era/modern day, would it be justifiable to kill in the name of Zeus in the modern day?

Back then, it was acceptable to do almost anything violent as long as you said 'god told me so.'
"This is the true horror of religion. It allows perfectly decent and sane people to believe by the billions, what only lunatics could believe on their own." Sam Harris
Life asked Death "Why do people love me but hate you?"
Death responded: "Because you are a beautiful lie, and I am the painful truth."
Burzmali
Posts: 1,310
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9/19/2014 1:33:35 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 1:22:50 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 9/19/2014 1:20:30 PM, Burzmali wrote:
The fact that many theists have to even mull over the answer to this question, rather than simply saying "no," is a prime example of why I'm wary of religions and people who claim to be devout.

Would you be wary of Dietrich Bonhoeffer? He was about as devout as they come.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

If his answer to such a question wasn't an immediate "no," then yes, I would be wary of him. In my experience, the devout believers who do immediately answer "no" are a small minority.
steffon66
Posts: 240
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9/19/2014 1:37:27 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

if god told me to kill someone id ask why he wants me to kill someone when he could do it and get away with it. why should i risk what little freedom i have to do gods work when he put me here to suffer from evil and misery while i have to watch everyone around me be happy. he brought me here. put me in a horrible place full of evil, cursed me with mental illness, and has the audacity to ask me to do him a favor? f that dude god can do his own killing like he did in the old testament.
Truth_seeker
Posts: 1,811
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9/19/2014 1:37:28 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 1:32:14 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 1:25:42 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 1:19:22 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 1:05:00 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:56:59 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:54:25 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:51:48 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

Would one be justified in saying they killed because Zeus told them to do so?

Well the Greeks did kill back then for their gods, so i don't know?

I'm talking about if someone today were to kill a family, would they be justified in saying Zeus told them to do so?

lol i don't believe Zeus exists.

So I take it as a no, a person is not justified in killing in the name of Zeus. That means you aren't justified in killing in the name of your god.

Well i mean killing was justified back then according to his laws of justice and evil, but murder or taking a life without a just cause was punishable by death.

If God told you to kill someone would you?

Since I think you are referring to the modern era/modern day, would it be justifiable to kill in the name of Zeus in the modern day?

Back then, it was acceptable to do almost anything violent as long as you said 'god told me so.'

Not necessarily, i would ask myself "does this contradict God's nature?" If so, it's not God. The 2nd question would be "What reason is there for killing this person?" If no answer then we can probably assume it's murder as murder is the unlawful killing of another human.
SamStevens
Posts: 3,819
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9/19/2014 1:40:52 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 1:37:28 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 1:32:14 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 1:25:42 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 1:19:22 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 1:05:00 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:56:59 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:54:25 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
At 9/19/2014 12:51:48 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

Would one be justified in saying they killed because Zeus told them to do so?

Well the Greeks did kill back then for their gods, so i don't know?

I'm talking about if someone today were to kill a family, would they be justified in saying Zeus told them to do so?

lol i don't believe Zeus exists.

So I take it as a no, a person is not justified in killing in the name of Zeus. That means you aren't justified in killing in the name of your god.

Well i mean killing was justified back then according to his laws of justice and evil, but murder or taking a life without a just cause was punishable by death.

If God told you to kill someone would you?

Since I think you are referring to the modern era/modern day, would it be justifiable to kill in the name of Zeus in the modern day?

Back then, it was acceptable to do almost anything violent as long as you said 'god told me so.'

Not necessarily, i would ask myself "does this contradict God's nature?" If so, it's not God.

It does not go against his nature since he told Abraham to sacrifice his son as a burnt offering on a mountain.

The 2nd question would be "What reason is there for killing this person?" If no answer then we can probably assume it's murder as murder is the unlawful killing of another human.
"This is the true horror of religion. It allows perfectly decent and sane people to believe by the billions, what only lunatics could believe on their own." Sam Harris
Life asked Death "Why do people love me but hate you?"
Death responded: "Because you are a beautiful lie, and I am the painful truth."
DPMartin
Posts: 1,096
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9/19/2014 1:42:54 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 1:09:22 PM, SamStevens wrote:
I'd say if it is a life and death situation like a person trying to kill you.


So you are saying that you are entitled your life in the world, at all cost, even if it means killing some one else to keep it, correct?
mrsatan
Posts: 417
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9/19/2014 1:45:49 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/18/2014 5:56:04 PM, Truth_seeker wrote:
Kinda struggling with that question, i see reasons from all sides. What do you think?

I wouldn't. Fairly positive God could handle his own dirty work. I doubt any request/demand of homicide would be coming from God anyways.
To say one has free will, to have chosen other than they did, is to say they have will over their will... Will over the will they have over their will... Will over the will they have over the will they have over their will, etc... It's utter nonsense.
popculturepooka
Posts: 7,924
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9/19/2014 1:46:08 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/19/2014 1:33:35 PM, Burzmali wrote:
At 9/19/2014 1:22:50 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 9/19/2014 1:20:30 PM, Burzmali wrote:
The fact that many theists have to even mull over the answer to this question, rather than simply saying "no," is a prime example of why I'm wary of religions and people who claim to be devout.

Would you be wary of Dietrich Bonhoeffer? He was about as devout as they come.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

If his answer to such a question wasn't an immediate "no," then yes, I would be wary of him. In my experience, the devout believers who do immediately answer "no" are a small minority.

No, I mean he felt that God was compelling him to attempt to kill Hitler...but he was otherwise a pacifist.
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!