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Original Abrahamic Texts

YamaVonKarma
Posts: 7,570
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10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.
People who I've called as mafia DP1:
TUF, and YYW
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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10/14/2014 8:33:02 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.

If all the original writings and spoken words of the prophets and saints were put together, there wouldn't be enough libraries on this planet to contain them all.

God used false prophets and antichrists to gather the written and spoken words of the saints. Then God had them change these original works by destroying most of it and adding their religious ideas that come from the beast.

Some of the important prophecies were kept from being changed too much so that God's saints could read them for Him to interpret. Most of the prophecies are repetitive information so it didn't matter if God had most of them destroyed or drastically changed by these false prophets ( religious Jews, Christians, Muslims, etc. ).

God uses us saints to tell us everything He wanted us to know. This is where all the prophecies and scriptures came from anyway. Since I'm the last saint, I know the past, present and future that God has taught me over the past six years. He has taught me how we're created, also.
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,093
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10/15/2014 10:31:28 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

What do you mean by the altered versions? Are you referring to copy errors, additions, and subtractions made by man to the 'god inspired" originals?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Could you clarify this?

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
POPOO5560
Posts: 2,482
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10/15/2014 10:50:24 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.

Good topic today i was going to open same topic... anyway i spoke about the bible many times here about its preservation and manuscripts... i and have no doubt that the bible altered and we dont have the originals today...

now i should apply the same test to the Quran and not be a hypocrite. as you know muslims are boasting that the Quran we have today is the same 1400 years ago...but every story has 2 sides... i just bought (yesterday) the book "the cambridge companion to the quran" - Qur'anic studies at Western universities. going to buy another book on the manuscripts...

If someone here knows good a critic of the Quran it would be good to read and see the 2 opposites...nevertheless there are debates about the 3 books...

here some debates:
DEBATE: Can We Trust Today's Torah?
https://www.youtube.com...

The Big Debate: Was the Qur'an Reliably Transmitted from the Prophet Muhammad (A018;) - Adnan Rashid vs James White
https://www.youtube.com...

Bart Ehrman vs. James White Debate P1+2
https://www.youtube.com...
https://www.youtube.com...
Never fart near dog
bulproof
Posts: 25,203
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10/15/2014 11:01:57 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 10:50:24 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.

Good topic today i was going to open same topic... anyway i spoke about the bible many times here about its preservation and manuscripts... i and have no doubt that the bible altered and we dont have the originals today...

now i should apply the same test to the Quran and not be a hypocrite. as you know muslims are boasting that the Quran we have today is the same 1400 years ago...but every story has 2 sides... i just bought (yesterday) the book "the cambridge companion to the quran" - Qur'anic studies at Western universities. going to buy another book on the manuscripts...

If someone here knows good a critic of the Quran it would be good to read and see the 2 opposites...nevertheless there are debates about the 3 books...

here some debates:
DEBATE: Can We Trust Today's Torah?
https://www.youtube.com...

The Big Debate: Was the Qur'an Reliably Transmitted from the Prophet Muhammad (A018;) - Adnan Rashid vs James White
https://www.youtube.com...

Bart Ehrman vs. James White Debate P1+2
https://www.youtube.com...
https://www.youtube.com...

Is there anything equal to the quran?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
POPOO5560
Posts: 2,482
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10/15/2014 11:04:12 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 11:01:57 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 10:50:24 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.

Good topic today i was going to open same topic... anyway i spoke about the bible many times here about its preservation and manuscripts... i and have no doubt that the bible altered and we dont have the originals today...

now i should apply the same test to the Quran and not be a hypocrite. as you know muslims are boasting that the Quran we have today is the same 1400 years ago...but every story has 2 sides... i just bought (yesterday) the book "the cambridge companion to the quran" - Qur'anic studies at Western universities. going to buy another book on the manuscripts...

If someone here knows good a critic of the Quran it would be good to read and see the 2 opposites...nevertheless there are debates about the 3 books...

here some debates:
DEBATE: Can We Trust Today's Torah?
https://www.youtube.com...

The Big Debate: Was the Qur'an Reliably Transmitted from the Prophet Muhammad (A018;) - Adnan Rashid vs James White
https://www.youtube.com...

Bart Ehrman vs. James White Debate P1+2
https://www.youtube.com...
https://www.youtube.com...

Is there anything equal to the quran?

equal in what? well if you ask muslim you get the answer no because he believes its the word of God and vice versa...so you need to be specific
Never fart near dog
bulproof
Posts: 25,203
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10/15/2014 11:06:32 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 11:04:12 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:01:57 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 10:50:24 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.

Good topic today i was going to open same topic... anyway i spoke about the bible many times here about its preservation and manuscripts... i and have no doubt that the bible altered and we dont have the originals today...

now i should apply the same test to the Quran and not be a hypocrite. as you know muslims are boasting that the Quran we have today is the same 1400 years ago...but every story has 2 sides... i just bought (yesterday) the book "the cambridge companion to the quran" - Qur'anic studies at Western universities. going to buy another book on the manuscripts...

If someone here knows good a critic of the Quran it would be good to read and see the 2 opposites...nevertheless there are debates about the 3 books...

here some debates:
DEBATE: Can We Trust Today's Torah?
https://www.youtube.com...

The Big Debate: Was the Qur'an Reliably Transmitted from the Prophet Muhammad (A018;) - Adnan Rashid vs James White
https://www.youtube.com...

Bart Ehrman vs. James White Debate P1+2
https://www.youtube.com...
https://www.youtube.com...

Is there anything equal to the quran?

equal in what? well if you ask muslim you get the answer no because he believes its the word of God and vice versa...so you need to be specific

Well that's strange, because the quran claims that another text is equal to the quran.
Do you know what it is?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
POPOO5560
Posts: 2,482
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10/15/2014 11:09:54 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 11:06:32 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:04:12 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:01:57 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 10:50:24 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.

Good topic today i was going to open same topic... anyway i spoke about the bible many times here about its preservation and manuscripts... i and have no doubt that the bible altered and we dont have the originals today...

now i should apply the same test to the Quran and not be a hypocrite. as you know muslims are boasting that the Quran we have today is the same 1400 years ago...but every story has 2 sides... i just bought (yesterday) the book "the cambridge companion to the quran" - Qur'anic studies at Western universities. going to buy another book on the manuscripts...

If someone here knows good a critic of the Quran it would be good to read and see the 2 opposites...nevertheless there are debates about the 3 books...

here some debates:
DEBATE: Can We Trust Today's Torah?
https://www.youtube.com...

The Big Debate: Was the Qur'an Reliably Transmitted from the Prophet Muhammad (A018;) - Adnan Rashid vs James White
https://www.youtube.com...

Bart Ehrman vs. James White Debate P1+2
https://www.youtube.com...
https://www.youtube.com...

Is there anything equal to the quran?

equal in what? well if you ask muslim you get the answer no because he believes its the word of God and vice versa...so you need to be specific

Well that's strange, because the quran claims that another text is equal to the quran.
Do you know what it is?

if you talking about he Torah of Moses (the original) or the Gospel (of Jesus) which we dont have these texts today preserve... the Quran claims that these books are changes adn corrupted and we see its cleary simple to understand it when you go to learn some stuff about the bible suppose to be "Torah of moses" and of "Jesus".
Never fart near dog
LifeMeansGodIsGood
Posts: 2,744
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10/15/2014 11:28:47 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.
You started this forum to bash the Bible and bash Christians. The Word of God has always been preserved from the time He told His servants to write it down. Many attempts have been made to deny His Word, like you are doing, or change His Word, like in the modern versions or in works of people who claim to be divinely inspired but are liars. If you don't know the difference between truth and lies, that's your problem. I will from this point onward ignore this Bible bashing /anti-christian Christian bashing forum.
bulproof
Posts: 25,203
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10/15/2014 11:29:27 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 11:09:54 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:06:32 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:04:12 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:01:57 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 10:50:24 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.

Good topic today i was going to open same topic... anyway i spoke about the bible many times here about its preservation and manuscripts... i and have no doubt that the bible altered and we dont have the originals today...

now i should apply the same test to the Quran and not be a hypocrite. as you know muslims are boasting that the Quran we have today is the same 1400 years ago...but every story has 2 sides... i just bought (yesterday) the book "the cambridge companion to the quran" - Qur'anic studies at Western universities. going to buy another book on the manuscripts...

If someone here knows good a critic of the Quran it would be good to read and see the 2 opposites...nevertheless there are debates about the 3 books...

here some debates:
DEBATE: Can We Trust Today's Torah?
https://www.youtube.com...

The Big Debate: Was the Qur'an Reliably Transmitted from the Prophet Muhammad (A018;) - Adnan Rashid vs James White
https://www.youtube.com...

Bart Ehrman vs. James White Debate P1+2
https://www.youtube.com...
https://www.youtube.com...

Is there anything equal to the quran?

equal in what? well if you ask muslim you get the answer no because he believes its the word of God and vice versa...so you need to be specific

Well that's strange, because the quran claims that another text is equal to the quran.
Do you know what it is?

if you talking about he Torah of Moses (the original) or the Gospel (of Jesus) which we dont have these texts today preserve... the Quran claims that these books are changes adn corrupted and we see its cleary simple to understand it when you go to learn some stuff about the bible suppose to be "Torah of moses" and of "Jesus".

You may need to read your book.
Your book claims that a specific writing is equal to the quran.
Don't you know what those writings are?
Your holy book makes the challenge that no writing could be equal to the quran and if it was that would prove that the quran wasn't the word of god.
Unfortunately the quran proves that the quran is not from god.
Isn't that a bastard?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
PotBelliedGeek
Posts: 4,298
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10/15/2014 11:42:02 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 10:45:57 AM, bulproof wrote:
No such thing.
I hope that helps.

No such thing as abrahamic text? No such thing as "original version"? Im sorry man, you have the right to be skeptical about the existence of god, but dude, these are things that I can literally pull off of a shelf and hand you. They exist.
Religion Forum Ambassador

HUFFLEPUFF FOR LIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!
PotBelliedGeek
Posts: 4,298
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10/15/2014 11:44:26 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 11:29:27 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:09:54 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:06:32 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:04:12 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:01:57 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 10:50:24 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.

Good topic today i was going to open same topic... anyway i spoke about the bible many times here about its preservation and manuscripts... i and have no doubt that the bible altered and we dont have the originals today...

now i should apply the same test to the Quran and not be a hypocrite. as you know muslims are boasting that the Quran we have today is the same 1400 years ago...but every story has 2 sides... i just bought (yesterday) the book "the cambridge companion to the quran" - Qur'anic studies at Western universities. going to buy another book on the manuscripts...

If someone here knows good a critic of the Quran it would be good to read and see the 2 opposites...nevertheless there are debates about the 3 books...

here some debates:
DEBATE: Can We Trust Today's Torah?
https://www.youtube.com...

The Big Debate: Was the Qur'an Reliably Transmitted from the Prophet Muhammad (A018;) - Adnan Rashid vs James White
https://www.youtube.com...

Bart Ehrman vs. James White Debate P1+2
https://www.youtube.com...
https://www.youtube.com...

Is there anything equal to the quran?

equal in what? well if you ask muslim you get the answer no because he believes its the word of God and vice versa...so you need to be specific

Well that's strange, because the quran claims that another text is equal to the quran.
Do you know what it is?

if you talking about he Torah of Moses (the original) or the Gospel (of Jesus) which we dont have these texts today preserve... the Quran claims that these books are changes adn corrupted and we see its cleary simple to understand it when you go to learn some stuff about the bible suppose to be "Torah of moses" and of "Jesus".

You may need to read your book.
Your book claims that a specific writing is equal to the quran.
Don't you know what those writings are?
Your holy book makes the challenge that no writing could be equal to the quran and if it was that would prove that the quran wasn't the word of god.
Unfortunately the quran proves that the quran is not from god.
Isn't that a bastard?

Can you cite the actual verse you are referring to? Because it doesn't exist.
Religion Forum Ambassador

HUFFLEPUFF FOR LIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!
bulproof
Posts: 25,203
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10/15/2014 11:47:20 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 11:42:02 AM, PotBelliedGeek wrote:
At 10/15/2014 10:45:57 AM, bulproof wrote:
No such thing.
I hope that helps.

No such thing as abrahamic text? No such thing as "original version"? Im sorry man, you have the right to be skeptical about the existence of god, but dude, these are things that I can literally pull off of a shelf and hand you. They exist.

There are no original texts extant of any of the NT, it is just a very large part of the most dominant abrahamic religion.
But you can believe whatever you like.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
PotBelliedGeek
Posts: 4,298
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10/15/2014 11:49:34 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 11:47:20 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:42:02 AM, PotBelliedGeek wrote:
At 10/15/2014 10:45:57 AM, bulproof wrote:
No such thing.
I hope that helps.

No such thing as abrahamic text? No such thing as "original version"? Im sorry man, you have the right to be skeptical about the existence of god, but dude, these are things that I can literally pull off of a shelf and hand you. They exist.

There are no original texts extant of any of the NT, it is just a very large part of the most dominant abrahamic religion.
But you can believe whatever you like.

Original text, as in the first copy of it to be written down. Their existence is historical and logical fact. On what grounds are you refusing to acknowledge this?
Religion Forum Ambassador

HUFFLEPUFF FOR LIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!
POPOO5560
Posts: 2,482
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10/15/2014 11:59:13 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 11:29:27 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:09:54 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:06:32 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:04:12 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:01:57 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 10:50:24 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.

Good topic today i was going to open same topic... anyway i spoke about the bible many times here about its preservation and manuscripts... i and have no doubt that the bible altered and we dont have the originals today...

now i should apply the same test to the Quran and not be a hypocrite. as you know muslims are boasting that the Quran we have today is the same 1400 years ago...but every story has 2 sides... i just bought (yesterday) the book "the cambridge companion to the quran" - Qur'anic studies at Western universities. going to buy another book on the manuscripts...

If someone here knows good a critic of the Quran it would be good to read and see the 2 opposites...nevertheless there are debates about the 3 books...

here some debates:
DEBATE: Can We Trust Today's Torah?
https://www.youtube.com...

The Big Debate: Was the Qur'an Reliably Transmitted from the Prophet Muhammad (A018;) - Adnan Rashid vs James White
https://www.youtube.com...

Bart Ehrman vs. James White Debate P1+2
https://www.youtube.com...
https://www.youtube.com...

Is there anything equal to the quran?

equal in what? well if you ask muslim you get the answer no because he believes its the word of God and vice versa...so you need to be specific

Well that's strange, because the quran claims that another text is equal to the quran.
Do you know what it is?

if you talking about he Torah of Moses (the original) or the Gospel (of Jesus) which we dont have these texts today preserve... the Quran claims that these books are changes adn corrupted and we see its cleary simple to understand it when you go to learn some stuff about the bible suppose to be "Torah of moses" and of "Jesus".

You may need to read your book.
Your book claims that a specific writing is equal to the quran.
Don't you know what those writings are?
Your holy book makes the challenge that no writing could be equal to the quran and if it was that would prove that the quran wasn't the word of god.
Unfortunately the quran proves that the quran is not from god.
Isn't that a bastard?

haa.. just say like that riddles is not for me dude :D anyway yeah if the author is so sure that there will be no book like the Quran probably the author should be strong enough to say that thing.. so the only one who is really can claim this is God. thank you mentioning it.
Never fart near dog
bulproof
Posts: 25,203
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10/15/2014 12:03:10 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 11:59:13 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:29:27 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:09:54 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:06:32 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:04:12 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:01:57 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 10:50:24 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.

Good topic today i was going to open same topic... anyway i spoke about the bible many times here about its preservation and manuscripts... i and have no doubt that the bible altered and we dont have the originals today...

now i should apply the same test to the Quran and not be a hypocrite. as you know muslims are boasting that the Quran we have today is the same 1400 years ago...but every story has 2 sides... i just bought (yesterday) the book "the cambridge companion to the quran" - Qur'anic studies at Western universities. going to buy another book on the manuscripts...

If someone here knows good a critic of the Quran it would be good to read and see the 2 opposites...nevertheless there are debates about the 3 books...

here some debates:
DEBATE: Can We Trust Today's Torah?
https://www.youtube.com...

The Big Debate: Was the Qur'an Reliably Transmitted from the Prophet Muhammad (A018;) - Adnan Rashid vs James White
https://www.youtube.com...

Bart Ehrman vs. James White Debate P1+2
https://www.youtube.com...
https://www.youtube.com...

Is there anything equal to the quran?

equal in what? well if you ask muslim you get the answer no because he believes its the word of God and vice versa...so you need to be specific

Well that's strange, because the quran claims that another text is equal to the quran.
Do you know what it is?

if you talking about he Torah of Moses (the original) or the Gospel (of Jesus) which we dont have these texts today preserve... the Quran claims that these books are changes adn corrupted and we see its cleary simple to understand it when you go to learn some stuff about the bible suppose to be "Torah of moses" and of "Jesus".

You may need to read your book.
Your book claims that a specific writing is equal to the quran.
Don't you know what those writings are?
Your holy book makes the challenge that no writing could be equal to the quran and if it was that would prove that the quran wasn't the word of god.
Unfortunately the quran proves that the quran is not from god.
Isn't that a bastard?

haa.. just say like that riddles is not for me dude :D anyway yeah if the author is so sure that there will be no book like the Quran probably the author should be strong enough to say that thing.. so the only one who is really can claim this is God. thank you mentioning it.

And your quran already claims that such a writing already exists.
Haven't you red your book?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
POPOO5560
Posts: 2,482
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10/15/2014 12:09:21 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 12:03:10 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:59:13 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:29:27 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:09:54 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:06:32 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:04:12 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/15/2014 11:01:57 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/15/2014 10:50:24 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.

Good topic today i was going to open same topic... anyway i spoke about the bible many times here about its preservation and manuscripts... i and have no doubt that the bible altered and we dont have the originals today...

now i should apply the same test to the Quran and not be a hypocrite. as you know muslims are boasting that the Quran we have today is the same 1400 years ago...but every story has 2 sides... i just bought (yesterday) the book "the cambridge companion to the quran" - Qur'anic studies at Western universities. going to buy another book on the manuscripts...

If someone here knows good a critic of the Quran it would be good to read and see the 2 opposites...nevertheless there are debates about the 3 books...

here some debates:
DEBATE: Can We Trust Today's Torah?
https://www.youtube.com...

The Big Debate: Was the Qur'an Reliably Transmitted from the Prophet Muhammad (A018;) - Adnan Rashid vs James White
https://www.youtube.com...

Bart Ehrman vs. James White Debate P1+2
https://www.youtube.com...
https://www.youtube.com...

Is there anything equal to the quran?

equal in what? well if you ask muslim you get the answer no because he believes its the word of God and vice versa...so you need to be specific

Well that's strange, because the quran claims that another text is equal to the quran.
Do you know what it is?

if you talking about he Torah of Moses (the original) or the Gospel (of Jesus) which we dont have these texts today preserve... the Quran claims that these books are changes adn corrupted and we see its cleary simple to understand it when you go to learn some stuff about the bible suppose to be "Torah of moses" and of "Jesus".

You may need to read your book.
Your book claims that a specific writing is equal to the quran.
Don't you know what those writings are?
Your holy book makes the challenge that no writing could be equal to the quran and if it was that would prove that the quran wasn't the word of god.
Unfortunately the quran proves that the quran is not from god.
Isn't that a bastard?

haa.. just say like that riddles is not for me dude :D anyway yeah if the author is so sure that there will be no book like the Quran probably the author should be strong enough to say that thing.. so the only one who is really can claim this is God. thank you mentioning it.

And your quran already claims that such a writing already exists.
Haven't you red your book?

everyday... you read it even once? i guess no.
Never fart near dog
bulproof
Posts: 25,203
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10/15/2014 12:12:01 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
The quran claims that the torah and the quran are equal in importance.
It's a shame that you don't know that!
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
POPOO5560
Posts: 2,482
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10/15/2014 12:54:56 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 12:12:01 PM, bulproof wrote:
The quran claims that the torah and the quran are equal in importance.
It's a shame that you don't know that!

ok bulproof but this is not the subject man if you have no importent thing on the topic dont drag people to pointless chat.
Never fart near dog
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,093
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10/15/2014 1:29:00 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 11:28:47 AM, LifeMeansGodIsGood wrote:
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.
You started this forum to bash the Bible and bash Christians. The Word of God has always been preserved from the time He told His servants to write it down. Many attempts have been made to deny His Word, like you are doing, or change His Word, like in the modern versions or in works of people who claim to be divinely inspired but are liars. If you don't know the difference between truth and lies, that's your problem. I will from this point onward ignore this Bible bashing /anti-christian Christian bashing forum.

You must know the modern Bible is not the same as the oldest manuscripts from which your Bible is derived. There was no "Woman taken in adultery" story, the Gospel of Mark ends abruptly with the women leaving the tomb of Jesus frightened, as well as others variations (I can't think of off the top of my head) not found in the oldest and best manuscripts. It is an accepted fact the Bible of today is not completely the "god inspired" version from antiquity. If god inspired the words, he did not preserve it. We don't have the original manuscripts to get back to the default. You statements in regards to the Bible are false.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
YamaVonKarma
Posts: 7,570
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10/15/2014 1:35:27 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 10:31:28 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

What do you mean by the altered versions? Are you referring to copy errors, additions, and subtractions made by man to the 'god inspired" originals?
Yes I am. Specifically, before all the saints were added in and Medieval Kings altered it.
To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Could you clarify this?
Christianity asserts that it's God is the one true God. I claimed that it may have been more lenient about the existence of more than one God.
Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.
People who I've called as mafia DP1:
TUF, and YYW
YamaVonKarma
Posts: 7,570
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10/15/2014 1:37:02 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 11:28:47 AM, LifeMeansGodIsGood wrote:
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.
You started this forum to bash the Bible and bash Christians. The Word of God has always been preserved from the time He told His servants to write it down. Many attempts have been made to deny His Word, like you are doing, or change His Word, like in the modern versions or in works of people who claim to be divinely inspired but are liars. If you don't know the difference between truth and lies, that's your problem. I will from this point onward ignore this Bible bashing /anti-christian Christian bashing forum.

You don't get what I was asking. There have been numerous saints added since the original bible was written.
People who I've called as mafia DP1:
TUF, and YYW
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,093
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10/15/2014 5:11:01 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 1:35:27 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
At 10/15/2014 10:31:28 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

What do you mean by the altered versions? Are you referring to copy errors, additions, and subtractions made by man to the 'god inspired" originals?
Yes I am. Specifically, before all the saints were added in and Medieval Kings altered it.

I am not familiar with what you mean by, "all the saints were added in".

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Could you clarify this?
Christianity asserts that it's God is the one true God. I claimed that it may have been more lenient about the existence of more than one God.

In the Ten commandments, "Thou shall have no other gods before me", definitely suggests the Christian god acknowledges there are other gods. If that is what you mean, then I would tend to agree.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
Beastt
Posts: 5,135
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10/15/2014 5:31:08 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.

In regard to the Bible, it's necessary to remember that most of the changes were made prior to collecting the texts into a canon, rather than after.
"If we believe absurdities we shall commit atrocities." -- Voltaire
YamaVonKarma
Posts: 7,570
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10/15/2014 5:32:37 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 5:11:01 PM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 10/15/2014 1:35:27 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
At 10/15/2014 10:31:28 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

What do you mean by the altered versions? Are you referring to copy errors, additions, and subtractions made by man to the 'god inspired" originals?
Yes I am. Specifically, before all the saints were added in and Medieval Kings altered it.

I am not familiar with what you mean by, "all the saints were added in".
Saints like Peter and Paul were almost certainly added prior to the original Bible being composed.
To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Could you clarify this?
Christianity asserts that it's God is the one true God. I claimed that it may have been more lenient about the existence of more than one God.

In the Ten commandments, "Thou shall have no other gods before me", definitely suggests the Christian god acknowledges there are other gods. If that is what you mean, then I would tend to agree.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.
People who I've called as mafia DP1:
TUF, and YYW
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,093
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10/15/2014 5:48:08 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 10/15/2014 5:32:37 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
At 10/15/2014 5:11:01 PM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 10/15/2014 1:35:27 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
At 10/15/2014 10:31:28 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 10/14/2014 8:15:39 PM, YamaVonKarma wrote:
How do you think they might read as compared to their altered versions? Do you imagine any significant details would have been changed?

What do you mean by the altered versions? Are you referring to copy errors, additions, and subtractions made by man to the 'god inspired" originals?
Yes I am. Specifically, before all the saints were added in and Medieval Kings altered it.

I am not familiar with what you mean by, "all the saints were added in".
Saints like Peter and Paul were almost certainly added prior to the original Bible being composed.

I am still having difficulty understanding exactly what you mean. Are you suggesting books were added after the 4th century when the NT was canonized?

To start things off, I will make an assertion. I believe that the bible would portray Christianity's dominance as less absolute.

Could you clarify this?
Christianity asserts that it's God is the one true God. I claimed that it may have been more lenient about the existence of more than one God.

In the Ten commandments, "Thou shall have no other gods before me", definitely suggests the Christian god acknowledges there are other gods. If that is what you mean, then I would tend to agree.

Abrahamic Texts:
-Bible
-Torah
-Qur'an

I welcome the debating of this. This is not a forum to start a flamewar in, bash another ideology, or harass a member. To do so will invoke a full response from me. You don't want that.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
celestialtorahteacher
Posts: 1,369
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10/16/2014 1:33:18 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
There are no "original" Abrahamic texts other than the Torah/Tanakh texts that exist or slight variations. What you are NOT debating is the fact that these texts are all completely fraudulent stories of supposed early "Hebrews" who never existed as such. Everything written about Hebrews by Hebrew authors prior to 700 B.C. is bogus myth-making, usually using preexisting pagan religious mythologies and reworking them and claiming them "original" to Jews. That you all want to debate a bunch of fables as if they were actually the "Word of God" as they claim is ridiculous. Why aren't we debating the core ideas that float through both ancient pagan and Abrahamic religions? The core ideas are what are really of God. Here's the link that completely debunks the Bible forever: