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11/7/2014 3:00:04 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
30 I can of myself do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is righteous; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
31 If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.
32 It is another that beareth witness of me; and I know that the witness which he witnesseth of me is true.
33 Ye have sent unto John, and he hath borne witness unto the truth.
34 But the witness which I receive is not from man: howbeit I say these things, that ye may be saved.
1 John 5
6 This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not with the water only, but with the water and with the blood.
7 And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is the truth.
8 For there are three who bear witness, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and the three agree in one.
9 If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for the witness of God is this, that he hath borne witness concerning his Son.
10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in him: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he hath not believed in the witness that God hath borne concerning his Son.
11 And the witness is this, that God gave unto us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
11 And they have conquered him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, for they loved not their lives even unto death.
"Evidence can be divided into two categories:
Testimonial - statements or the spoken word from the victim(s) or witness(es).
Physical - also referred to as real evidence, consists of tangible articles such as hairs, fibers, latent fingerprints and biological material."
"Objective evidence can be quantified and tested by a 3rd party"
A Christian can only offer a "testimonial" witness in regards to "proving" the existence of any God. Even first hand encounters or spiritual experiences fall in this category because it is merely the word of the other person but beyond that the application of the Gospel is almost entirely spiritual (even the physical gestures are for spiritual purpose and results) as it pertains to a spiritual God and a spiritual Kingdom with spiritual truths, obviously, otherwise we could just collaborate in the science forum to argue the existence of God or discuss scriptures.
Here are some examples from the link above of what is expected of a Theist to provide when asked for "physical evidence"....
Biological material - blood, semen or saliva
Soil and vegetation
Impression evidence " shoe prints, tire tracks ect.
Fracture patterns " glass fragments or adhesive tape pieces
"Physical evidence is any item or substance related to an allegation that can be
The reason the demand for this type of accountability is "ignored" or evaded by a Theist in discussion to provide is mainly due to the fact that none of the above correlates with the nature of God at all, meaning it is impossible to provide that kind of evidence for a spiritual God. A "spirit" is immaterial by nature, if one was standing in front of your face you wouldn't know it unless you saw it in spirit, and seeing in spirit is known as vision/visions.
So there is no way to provide physical evidence for a spiritual being but one can have spiritual encounter which in turn is "testimonial evidence", which is why one may get reasons and explanations rather than flat out proof handed to them, it is easy, "easy" that is to shut down any religious discussion knowing full well that providing proof can't be done even if God exists. Even if we were to see God with our own eyes we couldn't prove anything, it would just be a testimony.
If you are honestly curious about Christian beliefs or in debating christian teaching this is a good place to start from....
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again,
4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you.
Some spiritual concepts and principles are explained with parables and analogies in scripture why? they can only be observed when applied thus explained, which is testimony. If my spirit where to "bear witness" of the Spirit of God I could only tell you about it not prove it, the purpose of telling anyone is for that person to hear the testimony and prove it for themselves, God has to be fulfilled within that person no ones word can fulfill that, it is a personal accountability so you may find that Theists struggle to prove God "directly" or literally.
The point of the testimony or witness in scripture is to reinforce or indicate, not necessarily prove, the point is for the non believer to connect with God themselves, how? By applying spiritual principles and by being pliable and willing (listen), now of course the believer is only naturally gonna argue what they have come to experience as truth and therein remains the reason for debate at all, not really to prove God exists but to
Of course I'm not ruling out any arguments and theories concerning the existence of a Creator but even those provide nothing for the existence of God Himself directly, it cannot be done (and fulfilled prophecy only supports a particular notion). One good reason it can't be done is because having a spiritual relationship with God also supports its intimacy, meaning it's personal not impersonal, strictly between you and God. What is within yourself is only on display for the Spirit of God likewise your relations with God is not displayed out in the open, although it is expressed and reflected the Christian development is inward, spiritual.
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
No one has to believe a testimony but if you are interested in "arguing" or debating with Theists you should know that the spiritual concept of God is already accepted, moving forward in only material knowledge is to move backward.
Testimonial evidence is the only evidence you will get outside of yourself for the existence of God. The Bible/scriptures are like ingredients on a wrapper, you have to consume (apply) the contents to receive the taste. A Christian can't give you "taste" only the ingredients.