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Burden of proof

MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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12/7/2014 6:31:39 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
I hear a lot about burden of proof on here, but in the case of God v no god, where does the burden of proof lie?

Well who is the loser if they get it wrong?

Those who either believe in no God or in the wrong God, even the wrong "Christian" God are the ones who will lose, so thiers is also the burden of proof.

God is the examiner. It is his exam, we have to prove what we have learned, iof anyhting, when the invevitable exam is sat.

God has nothing to prove, he has nothing to gain or lose.

We have.
jodybirdy
Posts: 2,089
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12/7/2014 8:34:14 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 6:31:39 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
I hear a lot about burden of proof on here, but in the case of God v no god, where does the burden of proof lie?

Well who is the loser if they get it wrong?

Those who either believe in no God or in the wrong God, even the wrong "Christian" God are the ones who will lose, so thiers is also the burden of proof.

God is the examiner. It is his exam, we have to prove what we have learned, iof anyhting, when the invevitable exam is sat.

God has nothing to prove, he has nothing to gain or lose.

We have.

With theists. No theists agree on the subject. I just read something you yourself wrote a couple of hours ago stating that you can go to hell for believing in the wrong Christian God even. The burden of proof lies on theist because they can't get their story straight and they're the ones making the absurd claims.
A rock pile ceases to be a rock pile the moment a single man contemplates it, bearing within him the image of a cathedral."
neutral
Posts: 4,478
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12/7/2014 8:37:53 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 8:34:14 AM, jodybirdy wrote:
At 12/7/2014 6:31:39 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
I hear a lot about burden of proof on here, but in the case of God v no god, where does the burden of proof lie?

Well who is the loser if they get it wrong?

Those who either believe in no God or in the wrong God, even the wrong "Christian" God are the ones who will lose, so thiers is also the burden of proof.

God is the examiner. It is his exam, we have to prove what we have learned, iof anyhting, when the invevitable exam is sat.

God has nothing to prove, he has nothing to gain or lose.

We have.

With theists. No theists agree on the subject. I just read something you yourself wrote a couple of hours ago stating that you can go to hell for believing in the wrong Christian God even. The burden of proof lies on theist because they can't get their story straight and they're the ones making the absurd claims.

Oh? No theists agree on the subject because you say so? Guess what Jody? That is a claim that requires support - you know a burden of proof.

And of course, atheists ALL agree on everything and their stories are all straight? They can't even decide whether or not they are actually declaring that there is no God ... its amazing how they are all strong atheists running around being piss heads, until they have to meet their burden of proof ... and then they are agnostics ... is as dishonest a position as there can be.

Standards atheists. At least attempt to apply the standards of judgement for other positions to your own position ... try.
jodybirdy
Posts: 2,089
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12/7/2014 8:43:40 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 8:37:53 AM, neutral wrote:
At 12/7/2014 8:34:14 AM, jodybirdy wrote:
At 12/7/2014 6:31:39 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
I hear a lot about burden of proof on here, but in the case of God v no god, where does the burden of proof lie?

Well who is the loser if they get it wrong?

Those who either believe in no God or in the wrong God, even the wrong "Christian" God are the ones who will lose, so thiers is also the burden of proof.

God is the examiner. It is his exam, we have to prove what we have learned, iof anyhting, when the invevitable exam is sat.

God has nothing to prove, he has nothing to gain or lose.

We have.

With theists. No theists agree on the subject. I just read something you yourself wrote a couple of hours ago stating that you can go to hell for believing in the wrong Christian God even. The burden of proof lies on theist because they can't get their story straight and they're the ones making the absurd claims.

Oh? No theists agree on the subject because you say so? Guess what Jody? That is a claim that requires support - you know a burden of proof.

And of course, atheists ALL agree on everything and their stories are all straight? They can't even decide whether or not they are actually declaring that there is no God ... its amazing how they are all strong atheists running around being piss heads, until they have to meet their burden of proof ... and then they are agnostics ... is as dishonest a position as there can be.

Standards atheists. At least attempt to apply the standards of judgement for other positions to your own position ... try.

For you:
http://youtu.be...
A rock pile ceases to be a rock pile the moment a single man contemplates it, bearing within him the image of a cathedral."
SNP1
Posts: 2,403
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12/7/2014 8:53:09 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 6:31:39 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
I hear a lot about burden of proof on here, but in the case of God v no god, where does the burden of proof lie?

On the theist for quite a few reasons.

Well who is the loser if they get it wrong?

That is not how the BoP works.

Those who either believe in no God or in the wrong God, even the wrong "Christian" God are the ones who will lose, so thiers is also the burden of proof.

No, the BoP lies on someone claiming something outside of the default position. The default position for anything, including a god, is non-existence. This means that the atheist does not have the BoP, the theist does.

God is the examiner. It is his exam, we have to prove what we have learned, iof anyhting, when the invevitable exam is sat.

God has nothing to prove, he has nothing to gain or lose.

We have.

You obviously do not understand the BoP.
#TheApatheticNihilistPartyofAmerica
#WarOnDDO
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,633
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12/7/2014 9:39:16 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 6:31:39 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
I hear a lot about burden of proof on here, but in the case of God v no god, where does the burden of proof lie?

The burden of proof lies in whomever makes the positive claim. In the case of YOUR God, it would be YOU who is making the positive claim, therefore the onus is on YOU to provide the evidence. You have never done so.

Well who is the loser if they get it wrong?

YOU are the loser because you never get it right.

Those who either believe in no God or in the wrong God, even the wrong "Christian" God are the ones who will lose, so thiers is also the burden of proof.

Yes, if the make positive claims just like YOU, the onus lies on them, as well. That's how it works.

God is the examiner. It is his exam, we have to prove what we have learned, iof anyhting, when the invevitable exam is sat.

That is nonsense, we are all the examiners of YOUR claims to God.

God has nothing to prove, he has nothing to gain or lose.

We have.

Then, prove your God, or shut the firetruck up.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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12/7/2014 10:45:58 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 9:39:16 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/7/2014 6:31:39 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
I hear a lot about burden of proof on here, but in the case of God v no god, where does the burden of proof lie?

The burden of proof lies in whomever makes the positive claim. In the case of YOUR God, it would be YOU who is making the positive claim, therefore the onus is on YOU to provide the evidence. You have never done so.

Well who is the loser if they get it wrong?

YOU are the loser because you never get it right.

Those who either believe in no God or in the wrong God, even the wrong "Christian" God are the ones who will lose, so thiers is also the burden of proof.

Yes, if the make positive claims just like YOU, the onus lies on them, as well. That's how it works.

God is the examiner. It is his exam, we have to prove what we have learned, iof anyhting, when the invevitable exam is sat.

That is nonsense, we are all the examiners of YOUR claims to God.

God has nothing to prove, he has nothing to gain or lose.

We have.

Then, prove your God, or shut the firetruck up.

Yes you are, and God will judge you on your reaction to what I, and the rest of his servants teach.

God has proved himself by leaving us a book whihc is histoprically, prophetically and scientifically accurate, you have been shown that, you just refuse to believe that.

The Pharisees thought that if they denied the truth of what God taught he would change it for them, and send a different Messiah. They are still waiting.

Apparently you think the same, though what you are waiting for you will not like when it comes.

Tough, God changes his word for no-one.

Oh, and I'll stop teaching truth when God tells me to, and not before.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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12/7/2014 10:51:08 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 8:53:09 AM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/7/2014 6:31:39 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
I hear a lot about burden of proof on here, but in the case of God v no god, where does the burden of proof lie?

On the theist for quite a few reasons.

Well who is the loser if they get it wrong?

That is not how the BoP works.


It is in this case.

Those who either believe in no God or in the wrong God, even the wrong "Christian" God are the ones who will lose, so thiers is also the burden of proof.

No, the BoP lies on someone claiming something outside of the default position. The default position for anything, including a god, is non-existence. This means that the atheist does not have the BoP, the theist does.


But you who refuse to believe in GVod are claiming somethign outside of teh default position

The deault position when all is said and done is truth, and you claim against it.

God is the examiner. It is his exam, we have to prove what we have learned, iof anyhting, when the invevitable exam is sat.

God has nothing to prove, he has nothing to gain or lose.

We have.

You obviously do not understand the BoP.

Well you';ll get your cahnce to tkae that up with God or his sn, if you are very fortunate.

God has given us much more than sufficient evidence of his case, it is time for your side of the case to present your proof. The burden is now definitely yours.

The prosecution always presents it's case first. God is the prosecutor, and has presented a comprehensive case. Your refusing to acknowledge it is your problem not his.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,633
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12/7/2014 11:25:16 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 10:45:58 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

Yes you are, and God will judge you on your reaction to what I, and the rest of his servants teach.

The burden of proof is on you to show that is valid, but you have not achieved that goal. So, by repeating it over and over to us, you only serve to show you have the intellectual capacity of a small child. Your threats don't work and have nothing to do with the burden of proof fallacy.

God has proved himself by leaving us a book whihc is histoprically, prophetically and scientifically accurate, you have been shown that, you just refuse to believe that.

That is because it is a lie and you know it is. The Bible was written by men, not God. Sorry, if you don't understand that fact.

Of course, the Bible is not proof of anything, just like any other book. The proof is in the evidence.

The Pharisees thought that if they denied the truth of what God taught he would change it for them, and send a different Messiah. They are still waiting.

Apparently you think the same, though what you are waiting for you will not like when it comes.

Tough, God changes his word for no-one.

Oh, and I'll stop teaching truth when God tells me to, and not before.

Notice that you have completely gone off track with the burden of proof fallacy and have reverted to childish, immature behavior. Grow up.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
intellectuallyprimitive
Posts: 1,000
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12/7/2014 11:28:50 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 6:31:39 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


We have.

Precisely. If you possess some evidence to share, then by all means present it. Atheists typically, do not subscribe to god(s)s nor deities, because of the lack of evidence. When theists posit the existence of either, the burden to validate the claim is the theists responsibility.
Double_R
Posts: 4,886
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12/7/2014 12:03:47 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
The burden of proof is always on the person who makes the claim. This is simply a rule of intellectual discussion. When you make a claim regarding reality, you are by definition presenting something that you accept is true with the expectation that others should also accept it to be true. All intellectual discussion is based on agreement. If others already accept your claim then you can proceed without the need to justify your claim. If others do not accept it, then you as the presenter of the idea are required to rationally justify it.

It always amuses me when theists don't understand this concept and resort to threats to make up for it. Telling me that God will one day punish me accomplishes nothing for you when you have yet to convince me that God exists. So unless your goal is simply to let off a little steam that other people require rational justification before taking your word for it, then you are wasting your time. Learn something about logic and reason, then recognize that people who come to their beliefs through logic and reason are not going to change their minds because of appeals to emotion.
MadCornishBiker
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12/7/2014 3:17:49 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 12:03:47 PM, Double_R wrote:
The burden of proof is always on the person who makes the claim. This is simply a rule of intellectual discussion. When you make a claim regarding reality, you are by definition presenting something that you accept is true with the expectation that others should also accept it to be true. All intellectual discussion is based on agreement. If others already accept your claim then you can proceed without the need to justify your claim. If others do not accept it, then you as the presenter of the idea are required to rationally justify it.

It always amuses me when theists don't understand this concept and resort to threats to make up for it. Telling me that God will one day punish me accomplishes nothing for you when you have yet to convince me that God exists. So unless your goal is simply to let off a little steam that other people require rational justification before taking your word for it, then you are wasting your time. Learn something about logic and reason, then recognize that people who come to their beliefs through logic and reason are not going to change their minds because of appeals to emotion.

Yes and it is those who say there is no God, against the evidence which they conveniently ignore or refuse to accept, who are making the claim.

The time is going to come when you will be required to justify why you are on Satan'sa side of teh argument.

Those on the side of God are the ones who have used reason and logicve to asses the evidence, not ignored it.

And please don't ask what evidence, you know full well it is all around you.

At least you won't be able to say your weren't told. God is making very sure of that.
MadCornishBiker
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12/7/2014 3:20:31 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 11:28:50 AM, intellectuallyprimitive wrote:
At 12/7/2014 6:31:39 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


We have.

Precisely. If you possess some evidence to share, then by all means present it. Atheists typically, do not subscribe to god(s)s nor deities, because of the lack of evidence. When theists posit the existence of either, the burden to validate the claim is the theists responsibility.

I present it continually. God presents you with all the evidence you need, howevr most refuse to read scripture using their brains to do so, or to lok at creation with unbiased eyes.
MadCornishBiker
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12/7/2014 3:24:29 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 11:25:16 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/7/2014 10:45:58 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

Yes you are, and God will judge you on your reaction to what I, and the rest of his servants teach.

The burden of proof is on you to show that is valid, but you have not achieved that goal. So, by repeating it over and over to us, you only serve to show you have the intellectual capacity of a small child. Your threats don't work and have nothing to do with the burden of proof fallacy.

God has proved himself by leaving us a book whihc is histoprically, prophetically and scientifically accurate, you have been shown that, you just refuse to believe that.

That is because it is a lie and you know it is. The Bible was written by men, not God. Sorry, if you don't understand that fact.

Of course, the Bible is not proof of anything, just like any other book. The proof is in the evidence.

The Pharisees thought that if they denied the truth of what God taught he would change it for them, and send a different Messiah. They are still waiting.

Apparently you think the same, though what you are waiting for you will not like when it comes.

Tough, God changes his word for no-one.

Oh, and I'll stop teaching truth when God tells me to, and not before.

Notice that you have completely gone off track with the burden of proof fallacy and have reverted to childish, immature behavior. Grow up.

No the burden of roof is always on the accuser, not the accused. God is the one being accused by such as you. You need to prove it.

The prosecution always has to prove it's case, and wether you like it or not that is you.

You accuse God of lying to you in his word.

Prove it.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,633
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12/7/2014 3:47:08 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 3:24:29 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
God is the one being accused by such as you.

You accuse God of lying to you in his word.

Here's a hint to the uniformed, YOU are not God.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,633
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12/7/2014 3:49:02 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 3:20:31 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
God presents you with all the evidence you need, howevr most refuse to read scripture using their brains to do so, or to lok at creation with unbiased eyes.

We can read scriptures, it is not compelling evidence.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,633
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12/7/2014 3:52:52 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 3:17:49 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

Yes and it is those who say there is no God, against the evidence which they conveniently ignore or refuse to accept, who are making the claim.

The time is going to come when you will be required to justify why you are on Satan'sa side of teh argument.

You see, we understand you have the intellect of a small child and are forced to resort to your boogeyman when you're incapable of defending your beliefs like an adult.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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12/7/2014 4:15:10 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 3:47:08 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/7/2014 3:24:29 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
God is the one being accused by such as you.

You accuse God of lying to you in his word.

Here's a hint to the uniformed, YOU are not God.

I have never claimed to be, but it is God's word you call a fantasy, not mine. I teach God's word, if you call me a liaryou call him once since I do not teach my own thoughts.

As Jesus said. If you believe me, you believe him, if you doubt me, you doubt him.

I'm only the messenger, the message is his not mine.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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12/7/2014 4:16:41 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 3:49:02 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/7/2014 3:20:31 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
God presents you with all the evidence you need, howevr most refuse to read scripture using their brains to do so, or to lok at creation with unbiased eyes.

We can read scriptures, it is not compelling evidence.

It would be if you could understand them and see how accurate they arem,scientifically, historically, and prophetically..

But do you even want to learn about them or are you scared you might find them to be true?
MadCornishBiker
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12/7/2014 4:20:08 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 3:52:52 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/7/2014 3:17:49 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

Yes and it is those who say there is no God, against the evidence which they conveniently ignore or refuse to accept, who are making the claim.

The time is going to come when you will be required to justify why you are on Satan'sa side of teh argument.

You see, we understand you have the intellect of a small child and are forced to resort to your boogeyman when you're incapable of defending your beliefs like an adult.

Which just shows that you understand neither me nor what I teach.

I don't defend my beliefs. Truth does not need defending, it is lies such as those you believe which need defending.

I do not resort to Satan, I simply point out hoew much at risk we all are from him without God's protection.
DanneJeRusse
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12/7/2014 4:33:45 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 4:20:08 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

I do not resort to Satan, I simply point out hoew much at risk we all are from him without God's protection.

Yes, your boogeyman. Better check the closet and under your bed tonight, too. Then, pull the covers over your head real tight so Satan can't get to you. Hilarious.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Double_R
Posts: 4,886
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12/7/2014 4:36:20 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 3:17:49 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 12/7/2014 12:03:47 PM, Double_R wrote:
The burden of proof is always on the person who makes the claim. This is simply a rule of intellectual discussion. When you make a claim regarding reality, you are by definition presenting something that you accept is true with the expectation that others should also accept it to be true. All intellectual discussion is based on agreement. If others already accept your claim then you can proceed without the need to justify your claim. If others do not accept it, then you as the presenter of the idea are required to rationally justify it.

It always amuses me when theists don't understand this concept and resort to threats to make up for it. Telling me that God will one day punish me accomplishes nothing for you when you have yet to convince me that God exists. So unless your goal is simply to let off a little steam that other people require rational justification before taking your word for it, then you are wasting your time. Learn something about logic and reason, then recognize that people who come to their beliefs through logic and reason are not going to change their minds because of appeals to emotion.

Yes and it is those who say there is no God, against the evidence which they conveniently ignore or refuse to accept, who are making the claim.

Those who claim there is no God do have a burden of proof, just as those who claim there is a God. So which claim are we discussing?

The time is going to come when you will be required to justify why you are on Satan'sa side of teh argument.

Thanks for proving my point. When you are unable to meet your burden of proof all you can do is resort to threats and appeals to emotion. I don't know why it is so difficult for you to figure out that threatening someone with something they don't believe is pointless.

Those on the side of God are the ones who have used reason and logicve to asses the evidence, not ignored it.

And please don't ask what evidence, you know full well it is all around you.

I know what is around me. You have yet to present any rational grounds for calling it evidence.
Double_R
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12/7/2014 4:38:18 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 4:33:45 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/7/2014 4:20:08 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

I do not resort to Satan, I simply point out hoew much at risk we all are from him without God's protection.

Yes, your boogeyman. Better check the closet and under your bed tonight, too. Then, pull the covers over your head real tight so Satan can't get to you. Hilarious.

That's right, he'd better check under his bed... But we're not resorting to threats, we're simply pointing out how much at risk he is if he doesn't do it.
MadCornishBiker
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12/7/2014 5:45:58 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 4:38:18 PM, Double_R wrote:
At 12/7/2014 4:33:45 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/7/2014 4:20:08 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

I do not resort to Satan, I simply point out hoew much at risk we all are from him without God's protection.

Yes, your boogeyman. Better check the closet and under your bed tonight, too. Then, pull the covers over your head real tight so Satan can't get to you. Hilarious.

That's right, he'd better check under his bed... But we're not resorting to threats, we're simply pointing out how much at risk he is if he doesn't do it.

I don't need to check anything. I have God's protection already. He has always looked after his own.
MadCornishBiker
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12/7/2014 5:47:26 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 4:36:20 PM, Double_R wrote:
At 12/7/2014 3:17:49 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 12/7/2014 12:03:47 PM, Double_R wrote:
The burden of proof is always on the person who makes the claim. This is simply a rule of intellectual discussion. When you make a claim regarding reality, you are by definition presenting something that you accept is true with the expectation that others should also accept it to be true. All intellectual discussion is based on agreement. If others already accept your claim then you can proceed without the need to justify your claim. If others do not accept it, then you as the presenter of the idea are required to rationally justify it.

It always amuses me when theists don't understand this concept and resort to threats to make up for it. Telling me that God will one day punish me accomplishes nothing for you when you have yet to convince me that God exists. So unless your goal is simply to let off a little steam that other people require rational justification before taking your word for it, then you are wasting your time. Learn something about logic and reason, then recognize that people who come to their beliefs through logic and reason are not going to change their minds because of appeals to emotion.

Yes and it is those who say there is no God, against the evidence which they conveniently ignore or refuse to accept, who are making the claim.

Those who claim there is no God do have a burden of proof, just as those who claim there is a God. So which claim are we discussing?

The time is going to come when you will be required to justify why you are on Satan'sa side of teh argument.

Thanks for proving my point. When you are unable to meet your burden of proof all you can do is resort to threats and appeals to emotion. I don't know why it is so difficult for you to figure out that threatening someone with something they don't believe is pointless.

Those on the side of God are the ones who have used reason and logicve to asses the evidence, not ignored it.

And please don't ask what evidence, you know full well it is all around you.

I know what is around me. You have yet to present any rational grounds for calling it evidence.

I don't discuss claims, I discuss facts.

God exists.

Fact.

Prove me wrong.
Double_R
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12/8/2014 8:05:30 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 5:47:26 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
I don't discuss claims, I discuss facts.

God exists.

Fact.

Prove me wrong.

Why start a thread on the burden of proof if you have no interest in understanding the concept?
Skepticalone
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12/8/2014 8:42:38 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/7/2014 4:16:41 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 12/7/2014 3:49:02 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/7/2014 3:20:31 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
God presents you with all the evidence you need, howevr most refuse to read scripture using their brains to do so, or to lok at creation with unbiased eyes.

We can read scriptures, it is not compelling evidence.

It would be if you could understand them and see how accurate they arem,scientifically, historically, and prophetically..

But do you even want to learn about them or are you scared you might find them to be true?

I have read and studied the Bible with an open mind. I have no confirmation bias to solidify my opinions. That being said, the Bible is not accurate scientifically or prophetically. Any book which speaks of mythical creatures and magic cannot be consider written for the purpose of history, nor should we take it as a historical text.

On the other hand, I believe anyone making such claims would do well to learn more about science, what Biblical scholars have to say about prophecy, and history.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
MadCornishBiker
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12/8/2014 8:42:48 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/8/2014 8:05:30 AM, Double_R wrote:
At 12/7/2014 5:47:26 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
I don't discuss claims, I discuss facts.

God exists.

Fact.

Prove me wrong.

Why start a thread on the burden of proof if you have no interest in understanding the concept?

I understand the concept very well. The accusers always have the burden of proving thier accusation. I appear for teh defence not the prosecution, you, and others like you appear for the prosecution therefore the burden of proof lies with you, unlessa you are unable to carry the responisbility that goes with your position as accuser.

It's called moral responsibility.
MadCornishBiker
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12/8/2014 8:50:30 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/8/2014 8:42:38 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 12/7/2014 4:16:41 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 12/7/2014 3:49:02 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/7/2014 3:20:31 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
God presents you with all the evidence you need, howevr most refuse to read scripture using their brains to do so, or to lok at creation with unbiased eyes.

We can read scriptures, it is not compelling evidence.

It would be if you could understand them and see how accurate they arem,scientifically, historically, and prophetically..

But do you even want to learn about them or are you scared you might find them to be true?

I have read and studied the Bible with an open mind. I have no confirmation bias to solidify my opinions. That being said, the Bible is not accurate scientifically or prophetically. Any book which speaks of mythical creatures and magic cannot be consider written for the purpose of history, nor should we take it as a historical text.


Then youj haven't read it proper;ly or with a truly open mind, because it is deonstrably accurate bnoth scientifically and prophetically. Every time someone tries to say that a prophecy was so accurate it must have been written after the event something like the Cyrus Cylinder turns up and proves them wrong.

The cntroversy over wether or not King David existed was just reaching it's height when, lo and bewhold, Archaeologists found his palace.

Such proof will continue to grow in number until such as yuo can no longer deny the truth of it. However it may well be too late to change sides then.

Just as it was at the flood when finally peoplke realised it was really going to happen just as Noah taught them, and found the Ark door shut.

Sorry but there it is, accept it or back up your false accusation with facts.

On the other hand, I believe anyone making such claims would do well to learn more about science, what Biblical scholars have to say about prophecy, and history.

Well maybe you should tell that to the established, and published scientists who support the bible 100%.

Want links to thier stories?

We are talking micro-biolgists, biochemists, roboticists, and even one who works, or worked, for NASA, to name but a few of the varied fields of science bible believers come from.

As I said, want links to thier stories?

Probably not becuase you are only interested in excuses not to believe.
Skepticalone
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12/8/2014 9:38:09 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/8/2014 8:50:30 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 12/8/2014 8:42:38 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 12/7/2014 4:16:41 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 12/7/2014 3:49:02 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/7/2014 3:20:31 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
God presents you with all the evidence you need, howevr most refuse to read scripture using their brains to do so, or to lok at creation with unbiased eyes.

We can read scriptures, it is not compelling evidence.

It would be if you could understand them and see how accurate they arem,scientifically, historically, and prophetically..

But do you even want to learn about them or are you scared you might find them to be true?

I have read and studied the Bible with an open mind. I have no confirmation bias to solidify my opinions. That being said, the Bible is not accurate scientifically or prophetically. Any book which speaks of mythical creatures and magic cannot be consider written for the purpose of history, nor should we take it as a historical text.


Then youj haven't read it proper;ly or with a truly open mind, because it is deonstrably accurate bnoth scientifically and prophetically.

Prove it.

Every time someone tries to say that a prophecy was so accurate it must have been written after the event something like the Cyrus Cylinder turns up and proves them wrong.

I still haven't had time to go over information on the Cyrus Cylinder, but if it describes the fairly peaceful takeover of Babylon (like I think it does), then you have already admitted prophecy is inaccurate. The Bible speaks of much bloodshed and Babylon will be desolate, and this did not happen and is not true of Babylon.

The cntroversy over wether or not King David existed was just reaching it's height when, lo and bewhold, Archaeologists found his palace.

Yes, and "Gone with the Wind" is set in the Civil war, but so long as we have other sources for that era, it will never be used as an historical device. It's the same for the Bible. There are parts which are true historically, but.....

Such proof will continue to grow in number until such as yuo can no longer deny the truth of it. However it may well be too late to change sides then.

Just as it was at the flood when finally peoplke realised it was really going to happen just as Noah taught them, and found the Ark door shut.

Good sermon, preacher! I can't wait until next Sunday!

Sorry but there it is, accept it or back up your false accusation with facts.

You have already been told many times in this thread, but, what the heck, "Play it again, Sam!" The BoP falls on the one making the claim. You have made the claim. Your claim has been questioned. You have not backed up your claim. Your claim is invalid without evidence to back it up.

On the other hand, I believe anyone making such claims would do well to learn more about science, what Biblical scholars have to say about prophecy, and history.

Well maybe you should tell that to the established, and published scientists who support the bible 100%.

Supporting the Bible and thinking it is inerrant are two different things.

Want links to thier stories?

We are talking micro-biolgists, biochemists, roboticists, and even one who works, or worked, for NASA, to name but a few of the varied fields of science bible believers come from.

As I said, want links to thier stories?

I have already seen your links.

Probably not becuase you are only interested in excuses not to believe.

Let's not confuse theists who are also scientists with those who believe the Bible is inerrant.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten